showsandstuff

[showsandstuff]

I saw the arguments you've mentioned as well, but not as often as the other ones. Maybe we were just in different bubbles? But either way, I definitely agree that those arguments do not at all reduce Mel's character, they rather point attention to specific aspects that should definitely be discussed!

I am so conflicted about the drama in the arcane fandom regarding Meljayvik because it's all just so messy.

For one, not everyone likes every ship and that is okay. You don't have to like Meljayce or Jayvik, it's okay to only like one of the two or none at all.

But then there is the disposable black gf trope that makes this whole thing tricky. I hate this trope so damn much, it isn't fair. At all.

But then also Mel is SO MUCH more than Jayces lover in the story, like her romantic relationship with Jayce was a tiny part of her character and their relationship with each other as well. So I don't like the idea of reducing her to just that. Mel's arc this season was all about her other qualities, her intelligence, her power and her relationship to her mother, not about her love for Jayce or whatever.

I absolutely love Mel as a character. She went from someone who I thought would be a cunning villain, to this caring and intelligent leader, who will do whatever she thinks is best for her people.

Yet people always reduce her to "the girl that gets in the way of the Yaoi" or "Jayce’s love interest", like no come on?! She never got in the way of anything and she isn't just Jayce’s girlfriend. She doesn't lose her purpose if people don't like her together with Jayce, because that wasn't even what her arc was about! Free my girl!

[showsandstuff]

Completely get your point. I don't think its Meljay shippers themselves who reduce Mel to being Jayces girlfriend, but rather the arguments they use.

When the claim comes that people aren't allowed to dislike or criticize a ship because it sidelines or discredits Mel, I get confused, because there is more to her character than just Jayve.

People don't have to like everything about a characters storyline to still value the character and their arc.

That was what I meant.

I am so conflicted about the drama in the arcane fandom regarding Meljayvik because it's all just so messy.

For one, not everyone likes every ship and that is okay. You don't have to like Meljayce or Jayvik, it's okay to only like one of the two or none at all.

But then there is the disposable black gf trope that makes this whole thing tricky. I hate this trope so damn much, it isn't fair. At all.

But then also Mel is SO MUCH more than Jayces lover in the story, like her romantic relationship with Jayce was a tiny part of her character and their relationship with each other as well. So I don't like the idea of reducing her to just that. Mel's arc this season was all about her other qualities, her intelligence, her power and her relationship to her mother, not about her love for Jayce or whatever.

I absolutely love Mel as a character. She went from someone who I thought would be a cunning villain, to this caring and intelligent leader, who will do whatever she thinks is best for her people.

Yet people always reduce her to "the girl that gets in the way of the Yaoi" or "Jayce’s love interest", like no come on?! She never got in the way of anything and she isn't just Jayce’s girlfriend. She doesn't lose her purpose if people don't like her together with Jayce, because that wasn't even what her arc was about! Free my girl!

[showsandstuff]

I am so conflicted about the drama in the arcane fandom regarding Meljayvik because it's all just so messy.

For one, not everyone likes every ship and that is okay. You don't have to like Meljayce or Jayvik, it's okay to only like one of the two or none at all.

But then there is the disposable black gf trope that makes this whole thing tricky. I hate this trope so damn much, it isn't fair. At all.

But then also Mel is SO MUCH more than Jayces lover in the story, like her romantic relationship with Jayce was a tiny part of her character and their relationship with each other as well. So I don't like the idea of reducing her to just that. Mel's arc this season was all about her other qualities, her intelligence, her power and her relationship to her mother, not about her love for Jayce or whatever.

I absolutely love Mel as a character. She went from someone who I thought would be a cunning villain, to this caring and intelligent leader, who will do whatever she thinks is best for her people.

Yet people always reduce her to "the girl that gets in the way of the Yaoi" or "Jayce’s love interest", like no come on?! She never got in the way of anything and she isn't just Jayce’s girlfriend. She doesn't lose her purpose if people don't like her together with Jayce, because that wasn't even what her arc was about! Free my girl!

[showsandstuff]

Am I the only one who is disappointed with Caitvi in season two? When I watched the first season I had the biggest caitvi brain rot because they actually gave me SUCH a fun dynamic with them. Buddy cop Caitvi was hilarious, I loved that so so much!

And season 2 started of strong imo but then it rushed through everything. I loved the scene in the cell, obviously, but it was misplaced. Your sister is about to kill herself girl what are you doing this is not the time!! And other than romantic and sexual tension there wasn't all that much left of their previous dynamic aside from the brief scene in episode six...

Idk, I think I'm just annoyed. Usually when I see a non canon gay ship get more traction than the Canon lesbian couple, I just assume it's misogyny or lesbophobia, and move on with my life. But I can't even do that here because Caitvi was WAY more popular in season 1 (as they should).

Jayvik isn't getting somewhat more popular in season 2 because people don't like lesbians, but because their arcs are connected so strongly to each other. (Also I'm not saying that Jayvik is now more popular than Caitvi, but it's like a graph where the super high stocks caitvi are still even while Jayvik is skyrocketing rn)

Wanna know why Jayvik wasn't all that popular in season 1? Because (after act 1) their arcs were mostly separate, safe for a couple of moments. Viktor worked on his body and Jayce was doing politics.

Caitlyn and Vis arcs intertwined more, they actually did shit together and it was beautiful, funny, romantic, EVERYTHING!

Also a fun opposites attract buddy cop dynamic is also just more fun than men who do science together (in my personal opinion)

Now let's look at Caitlyn and Vis relationship in season two.

It starts of strong. I momentarily thought that Caitlyn was uncharacteristically mean to Vi when she refused to become an enforcer, but she apologized for it later and I recognized the fact that Caitlyn was grieving. Then once we get to episode two and three I could already feel their relationship being a bit more odd. The kiss (though I cheered) didn't feel right. I felt like something was missing, and that was their chemistry from season one. Also I feel like we glossed over too many decisions that Caitlyn made, and I think Vi should've put a stop to it sooner. But overall I was okay with them in act 1.

Then we had a timeskip and the two were fully separated. Act 2 literally started with Caitlyn in bed with another woman, like we can see they're not together anymore. Caitlyn has obviously changed, there is not much of the sweet cupcake left that we had come to love in season 1, and Vi is boxing and getting drunk.

Then they meet and like... Vi calls Cait cupcake, and Cait switches sides IMMEDIATELY? GIRL WTF?!

I get that Caitlyn wasn't entirely on Ambessas side the entire time, but I had hoped for more drama first. So you're telling me the very next interaction the two have after their heart wrenching falling out is them making up again? Come on.

Then we had act 3 and overall it was better I think but the timing of their hot scene in the cell was just odd, like what about your sister about to kill herself? I was very happy and hyped in the moment but then I realized how rushed this was. Why? Why make em fuck right here? And in the final act, the two weren't together because again, their arcs were not as connected. And that's actually pretty cool to have a couple who do their own things! But it doesn't help their relationship when they, in turn, aren't given enough time to develop as a pair!

I feel like season 1 did this incredible job of setting these characters up, showing us why they work so well together and why they would fall for one another. And season 2 gave us pay off for it but with very little set up, which was needed because of how Cait changed throughout the season. I don't mention Vi here because she did not change. She had her drunk boxing phase, which we got nothing but a montage off, but everything else is basically season 1 Vi aside from very few things here and there. Like her becoming an enforcer wasn't a character change for Vi, her finally letting go of powder and calling her sister Jinx, wasn't a big character moment for Vi, they were pay off for a set up we didn't get enough of.

SO TO GET TO MY POINT:

S2 was rushed. We should've AT LEAST gotten 3 seasons, like minimum, because there was a whole lot of plot and very little moments in between for characterization. Especially for Caitlyn and Vi and their relationship to each other.

I still generally prefer Caitvi to Jayvik, but only because of season 1. Season 2 gave me the two things I wanted most (a sexy scene and a kiss) but forgot to give me the things that made me fall in love with this ship in the first place.

Which was the hilarious buddy cop dynamic of rich girl cop Cait, and broke butch prisoner Vi.

[showsandstuff]

YOU KNOW WHAT?! I LIED! I AM NOT READY FOR ACT 3!

I don't want to say goodbye to Caitvi...

I don't want Jayvik to sink A THIRD TIME! Like what is is this? Once every arc?

And worst of all, I am not ready to become a league player after this...

[showsandstuff]

SURPRISE! I actually have a somewhat different take.

All these Screenshots are from episodes. 3 and 4, Viktor wasn't pissed at Jayce until he gave his speech. The 5th chapter is legitimately him expecting Jayce to bring up their projects to help the miners in the fissures, and just a minute later you see him be very disappointed that Jayce hadn't.

I think he likes Jayce but he also resents him a bit. Not for overshadowing him, Viktor isn't someone who likes the spotlight, but because he feels like Jayces priority is no longer to help people, specifically those from the undercity, but rather gaining status and pleasing the council.

Here are my receipts for my claim:

Their very first Argument was in I think episode 5, where Viktor was pissed at Jayce for not presenting their projects during his speech because people need their help NOW. Viktor basically has the same take Ekko later has when talking to Heimerdinger? I believe? About how you can't exactly wait and take things slow when people are dying all around you. Viktor knows the circumstances of the undercity and it was established that before episode 4, all Viktor and Jayce did with Hextech was stuff for Piltover because the council insisted. Jayce was also shown to be fed up with that btw so I think they were still cool here.

Other moments that show this are also

- when Viktor presents the Hexcore to Jayce and how it could be used to preserve life etc., in general. It was Jayce who immediately concluded that it could save Viktor too (this isn't a big moment just worth noting imo that Jayce wasn't ready to go against Heimerdinger when it was about the miners in the fissures, but straight up fired him to save his bro!) (though Mel's influence on him probably also played a role in that)

- Then there was also the moment Jayce considered making Hextech weapons. I don't think this one needs explanation, Viktor was legit considering to blow himself up in that moment so yeah he was pissed and made his point clear

- and ofc there is the bridge argument. Viktor was pissed for multiple reasons here. For one: the blockade, he was clearly unhappy with Jayce ordering one, and two: for Jayce telling Viktor that the people from the Undercity were dangerous.

So no, Viktor wasn't jealous of Jayce, but I am absolutely convinced he was not entirely happy with him either. Throughout the season him and Jayce get more and more distant. It's what he meant when he said "our paths diverged long ago" because they did. Because while Jayce still cared about Viktor, Viktor felt like Jayce was holding them back from helping the undercity.

In my years in this fandom I've seen a lot of posts that assume Viktor deeply resented Jayce for the time they've spent on hextech or angrily imply he's 'sick of being jayce's assistant' (that's not his job, they're Partners, people.)

so today I bring you a very relevant reel of Viktor in his natural habitat utterly happy in his zone and proud of the work they do together btw. Actual stars in his eyes, if you even care

[showsandstuff]

Chat how am I gonna defend Viktor when he gets into Eugenics??

[showsandstuff]

[showsandstuff]

The only thing that pisses me off about the fandom rn is when ppl hate Jayce and others go "yall don't have any media literacy" like yeah no shit Jayce didn't do that for no reason. People get that, they just wanna hate Jayce because regardless of his reason, the tragedy of episode six was caused by him.

Besides... People have hated Jayce for less. It's not that serious. Let ppl hate him. It doesn't matter if he deserves it or not.

[showsandstuff]

The fix it fics better be ready for me...

[showsandstuff]

Since Jayce said "I won't fail this time" my theory is that he might've been stuck in a time loop of sorts and had to kill Viktor.

Still fuck Jayce unless Viktor comes back one more time.

[showsandstuff]

This was the worst shipwreck I've seen in years

[showsandstuff]

Imma be honest here, this is not a fair take. For one, I don't get what this has to do with the ship because it's not even primarily Jayvik stans having the take that Viktor has lost his emotion, it's a bunch of people regardless of wether they like the ship, who believe that (valid) theory.

We don't know yet WHY Viktor left, we don't know what's going on with him, what "our paths diverged long ago" and "it was affection that held us together" means exactly. It's all up to interpretation and I think we should be open for multiple ways of interpreting the scene and the Characters.

Maybe Viktor left because he was upset with Jayce not keeping his promise.

Maybe Viktor left because he has lost his emotions when fusing with the Hexcore.

Maybe also Viktor left because he no longer felt he belonged in Piltover.

Maybe it's multiple things at once, or none of the reasons I mentioned.

Point is, We don't know. Your interpretation is just as valid as anyone else's. I don't see why we have to be upset that some people have other theories and claim those theories to be weird just because you personally don't like them. I mean Viktor was only active in one of the 3 episodes, there is still more of him to see and we will most likely get a clearer picture of who he has become soon.

Also, SPOILER ALERT for people who don't wanna know some League lore and worry about that...

The Viktor in game actually removes his emotions. That's his whole thing. So saying he lost them here is like a super valid take and it makes sense! I'm not saying he definitely did, but it's a valid theory.

Im usually not someone who hates on ships bc i dont like them but if Jayvik stans keep insisting that Viktor, primary disability rep, is emotionless and has no agency im going to go crazy because its getting weird

Like no Viktor didn’t leave bc hes emotionless and the hexcore made him do it. Viktor left bc Jayce betrayed him and desecrated his body with the one thing he told him to destroy

Thats the point of the whole “our paths diverged long ago” line. Because Viktor disagreed with what Jayce was doing with hextech

​idk man i just dont think thats some ultimate act of romance like some people are making it out to be. Viktor is allowed to be upset ab it

[showsandstuff]

I'm ready to see Jayce and Viktor punch each other but I need Vi and Cait to make up.

[showsandstuff]

I agree partially but I don't think those situations are comparable enough to say that Vi was being avoidant.

Cait had lost her mother and then they were attacked directly at the memorial. She also seemed to direct her statement to the specific group that attacked them in that moment and not the undercity as a whole.

Jayce on the other hand was bitching out Viktor for consulting a friend from the undercity, because "they're dangerous". He generalized everyone there despite directly talking to Viktor, who is a zaunite. Ofc Viktor got pissed and Jayce immediately understood he was out of line and apologized for it.

I think Vi was just empathizing with Cait in that moment, who was still grieving and rightfully pissed at the situation. Vi knows grief better than anyone, she understands. Viktor though wasn't in a position where he'd have to empathize with Jayce.

thinking abt that 'what kind of animals' moment from caitlyn, as a mirror of jayce's 'you didn't say they were from the undercity', and then the different way viktor and vi respond.

jayce's words were direct and viktor responds in kind - directly. 'im from the undercity'. it draws jayces attention to him to counteract the way jayce is able to dehumanise them. you cant dehumanise a group of people when one of them is someone you deeply care about and theyre sitting right in front of you forcing you to acknowledge where they came from and that theres more than whatever youve been raised to believe the people down there are like.

but vi is a lot more avoidant. she doesnt Want tension with cait so she talks around it. offers a logical argument instead of an emotional one. 'they wanted a spectacle'. it avoids reminding cait of their differences and where she came from while still trying to explain their actions as the rational moves of an enemy, yes, but a human one. but its the kind of compensating thats only going to lead to her giving up more and more ground to avoid fighting on it. and even so, it doesnt work. even when trying to avoid reminding cait where shes from and who she is, cait leaves on the note of grouping everyone, including vi, into one. this is an us and them situation, and cait exiles her from the 'us' and condemns her to 'them'.

[showsandstuff]

I think I know what stopped me from indulging Jayvik in season 1, and it's that I got the feeling that Jayce didn't do enough for Viktor. He showed he cared for him and he got Heimerdinger fired so that they could use the Hexcore since it might just save Viktors life, but most of the time we saw Jayce, he was busy doing politics while Viktor was tirelessly working on looking for a cure for himself. It felt weird to not see Jayce, who had proven that he cared for Viktor, do exactly that as well.

Then there was also the moment with the blockade on the bridge, where Jayces words (though he apologized immediately) caused Viktor to lie to him about Singed not having been able to help, despite him previously believing that Jayce would understand.

But season 2 has proven that I (and probably also Viktor) have completely underestimated how much Jayce loves him. He saw him injured in the rubble, carried him and ran to the lab. Then he broke his promise to Viktor to destroy the Hexcore because there might be a chance of it saving him and then when Viktor came out different, all Jayce cared about was the fact that Viktor was alive.

Viktor was right, Jayce understood. He understood even more so than Viktor himself. Because his life might just be more important to Jayce than it is to Viktor.

[showsandstuff]

My take on this scene is the reason Viktor was able to leave was because the affection he once held for Jayce has vanished somehow...

🤨!?