realistic-rat-breeding-and-care

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

I don't think you should be supporting self medding. That's super irresponsible and someone can easily overdose their rats.

Doxycycline has a high LD50. You're WAY more likely to underdose your rat than over dose your rat.

And because finding a vet that will even see small animals AND knows what to prescribe, in the correct amounts, and for the correct duration AND is up to date on rat care AND is within driving distance AND is affordable is extremely hard and luck based.

Do you know how often in rat groups I see...

* Vets saying a rat that clearly has a URI is fine?

* Vets giving improper antibiotics?

* Vets giving the incorrect dosage?

* Vets not open on weekends and won't take emergencies?

* Vets that won't budge when given scientific evidence that they're not treating the animal properly?

* Someone who literally does not have a vet who will see a rat within 2 or more hours of them?

* Someone who cannot afford $200+ just to get some antibiotics?

So then what? Their rat dies? Like, dying is safer!? You're so against self medication that you'll let someone's rat suffocate to death over the course of weeks because you think guided self medication is worse? Because livestock owners can apparently understand how to dose antibiotics for common conditions, but rat owners and breeders are incompetent and incapable of following directions?

Nope. Of course the vet should be your first option, but barring that? I am 100% cool with self medding respiratory infections with Doxycycline.

Sorry if I sound mad, but this issue frustrates me so much that people would rather someone's rat slowly suffer and die over guided self med.

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

Why are you breeding if you don't know basic facts about the variety you're working with? That rat is NOT a himilayan. Himilayans are born pure white and develop their points later. Siamese are born a creamy, beige or dark color with points. Check the AFRMA standards as well please. There's a very clear difference between the two. I don't even work with this variety and I know that.

Oh my God I am so fucking sick of this bullshit myth.

This baby is the result of a Siamese and Albino pairing. Unless there's some genetic fuckery I'm not aware of, it is IMPOSSIBLE for this rat to be Siamese. Why?

Siamese: c(h)c(h)

Himalayan: c(h)c

Albino: cc

Do a little punnet square in your head with the Siamese and Albino genotype. If you can't, I'll help. In every single square, it'll say "c(h)c" meaning... HIMALAYAN. Even if my doe is actually Himalayan, half the boxes would be "c(h)c" and half would be "cc". No babies would have the Siamese genotype of "c(h)c(h)".

This only way to know with 100% certainty what these rats are is by:

1) Test breeding by pairing a Siamese/Himalayan rat with an Albino. Produce even one, single albino? The rat is Himalayan. In a small litter with no albinos you may want to repeat the test breeding just in case. This is because as shown above, a Siamese x Albino pairing will have Himalayan fill 100% of the squares, but Himalayan x Albino allows for Albinos to be produced.

2) Pairing two confirmed Siamese together. The offspring will be 100% Siamese.

If you know your lines well you can also gage what they are with pretty good accuracy, but I also have seen people who were absolutely certain their rats were one thing, and then the offspring showed they actually had to be another. This can get especially complicated if you have blue point hiding in there that you weren't aware of, which can be mistaken for Himalayan. Marked Siamese and Himalayan can also throw people off. Or if you've only been breeding Siamese to Siamese, then you'll know 100% of the offspring is Siamese.

Anyway, Himalayans can start out with color, especially well bred Himalayans, but they don't HAVE to be well bred either to show color. It's just much more likely. Poor Siamese can start out white and develop points later on too!

Here, let me show you a few pics.

From left to right:

1. The Himalayan baby, where his creamy color is even more obvious. Remember, he's from a pairing of Albino and Siamese, he CANNOT be Siamese. He HAS to be Himalayan. This is not debatable.

2. Noodles, with her lone little dot on her nose being her only point. She started out white and didn't develop points until she was like 5 weeks old. I was barely able to tell she wasn't Albino when I picked her up, she just had the faintest bit of brown. Himalayan, right? Nope, she's Siamese. This is the Himalayan baby's grandmother.

3. Siamese and Himalayan, right? Nope! Seal point and Blue point Siamese. I had no idea I had this in my lines, and for a long time I assumed the lighter babies of this litter were Himalayans.

You. Cannot. Reliably. Tell. With. 100%. Certainty. Whether. They. Are. Siamese. Or. Himalayan. By. Appearance. Alone. So unless you have information about the rat's parents, it's incorrect to tell someone you know whether their rat is Siamese or Himalayan based purely on the way they look.

As far as the AFRMA standards? Those are standards, focusing on phenotype, not genotype. The ideal standard for a Himalayan according to them is being crisp white with dark contrasting points, and for Siamese to be beige with their points gradually and even shading. However, again, this is just the standard. That's the ideal. It doesn't account for things mismarks or poor examples of the variety. IIRC, it's even admitted that many rats shown as Himalayan are just poor Siamese!

"Siamese are born with color, Himalayans are born white and develop points later on. Himalayans are white with contrasting points and Siamese are beige with gradual shading from their points." is a loose guideline that only sort of works under certain situations. It is not absolute fact.

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

This Himilayan baby I produced is such a sweetheart, omg. This is the first time I've held her and within 15 seconds she licked my hand and then curled up to fall asleep. I'm definitely keeping her. ❤️

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

Some dogs are working dogs, such as Livestock Guardians Dogs, and need to live outside. Some breeds and individual dogs just do better outside and prefer to be outside most or all of the time as well. For particularly heavy coated breeds in cold climates, being inside can be uncomfortable. If they have food, water, veterinary care, proper shelter, exercise, training, and mental stimulation and enrichment, it's just an individual ownership choice. They don't necessarily love or care for their dogs any less, just as how some people with indoor dogs can ignore and neglect them.

People who have “outside dogs” confuse me. My dog is currently sitting beside me on the couch. She’s never been locked outside for more than an hour or two. We have a dog door so she can go outside if she wants. But we never just leave her outside and not let her in the house at all.

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

Bin. Cages. Are. Perfectly. Acceptable.

They are an affordable and adequate means of housing rats. When constructed properly, they have adequate ventilation. Climbing space and platforms are not necessary for rats, floorspace is the most important factor, but they can easily be added. Plus, you can make deep bins that allow for tons of bedding to burrow in.

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

How long has it been since you moved? How long after moving did this start? How has he been acting towards cagemates? He may need more time to settle in with the stress of moving, the new sounds, new smells, any old smells from previous tenants/owners which may include predator species, etc.

I'd give him more space for a bit longer. Maybe put in some extra hides. Add enrichment as well, because that's good for stress relief. Scatter sunflower seeds on the cage floor and ruffle it in the bedding. Wrap high value treats in layers and layers of newspaper. Stuff paper towel tubes with high value treats and paper. Hide his food in the same kind of thing. Add clutter to his cage, even if it's just crumpled up paper, but PVC pipes and drain tubes work well for this.

Hey, does anyone know why Anubis is acting kind of aggressive (biting, movement that signals biting) after moving into our new house?

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

That sounds like a URI. I have a guide on my blog for treating these at home if you don't have access to a vet.

https://realistic-rat-breeding-and-care.tumblr.com/post/186171638042/disclaimer-it-is-always-best-practice-to-see-a

I need help! Idk if my boy has pheumonia or just a cough or what. He just started this a couple days ago. Does it warrent a vet visit or is there anything I can do at home??

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

Could you show me some pics of them, comparing their body condition? Preferably top down, but multiple angles would be helpful. Has she stabilized in weight for awhile, or does she gradually seem to be getting larger?

Also, what do you feed them? How do you feed it? Bowl, hopper, scatter feed? Do they have food available constantly, or do you feed at intervals?

Individual variation and genetics will determine their physical and influence their weight. It's not a huge deal if she's not obese, but if she is it can be a problem and raise her risks of health issues and shorten her life span.

one of my rats is a lot chunkier (Leia) than the other (Maz) and i’m kinda worried that Leia is overeating/stealing food n treats away from Maz… but could it be something else?? she’s never been as active as Maz, she prefers to just take naps, have a little walk about, eat, tidy her nest and then take more naps, so could it be that she just doesn’t do enough exercise ? Maz is the opposite in that she’s very energetic, v lithe, climbs and jumps and playfights, drinks a shitton of water, and reararanges Everything to her liking and when she comes outta the cage she loves to play and run. idk, i’m just thinkin Leia eats more and excercises less and thats why she’s fatter-looking than Maz. but could it be something else? any recommendations about what i could do? or not do, if it’s normal for female rats to differ in their size

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

Ah, I apologize. I can't see dates on posts. I'm sorry to hear they didn't work out! Hopefully no one gives you a hard time. There's nothing wrong with rehoming pets to a capable, responsible owner if if you aren't clicking with them and/or feel that's in their best interests.

In the future, if you decide to try rats again, I highly recommend getting rats from a reputable breeder. It's worth the extra cost and drive, and there's a rapidly growing number of rat breeders. They're selected for temperament so you don't have to spend weeks or months of stress, getting pooped on, them darting off, etc. Even at a young age they'll seek out human attention, whereas pet store or feeder bin rats are a huge gamble. You can get a total sweetheart who craves human attention or a rat who lunges to bite you and doesn't let go. Rats don't need human interaction to be happy though, as long as they have sufficient space, a cagemate, and plenty of other enrichment though.

Uhhhhh... help?

My rats are safe, but they don’t like me and I feel like little Granite is unhappy with me 80% during this daily playtime and I fear I’ll just increase the percentage by continuing to approach him.

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

It sounds like it might be a brain tumor. They can cause seizures and changes in behavior including increased fear and aggression. Typically it starts out as fear and leads to the rat worsening to the point they can't be with other rats or handled by humans because they'll attack severely.

Seizures in general can just lead to behavioral issues in general, like increased fear and aggression, especially if they're causing to brain damage.

One option would be seeing a vet, but I'm not sure if there's much you can do. I've heard of people using CBD to reduce seizures, but I'm not sure if it'll bring back her friendliness. The damage may already be done.

I wouldn't risk introducing cagemates since her behavior is changing and unpredictable right now. It could easily go from being fine to a sudden snap when you're gone and a dead or severely injured rat.

Unfortunately, I would recommend euthanasia here. A rat that's seizing, agitated and afraid, cannot have rat companionship, and doesn't enjoy human companionship will have a very poor quality of life.

Just some questions I have for the Rat community because there’s only so much info I can find on epileptic rats…

Can rats with epilepsy suffer from memory loss? I have a girl with epilepsy and she used to be the friendliest young thing I’ve ever had, now she acts like she barely knows me, which is honestly quite sad…

What can trigger the seizures? And is there any way to try and reduce the frequency of them?

And last one - said female used to have three sisters, but they’ve passed away long before her despite there being no age gap. So she’s now widowed, over two years old, relatively happy, do I buy her some new friends? Or is that too risky? She doesn’t enjoy human company anymore, but has the time of her life in her cage and I just don’t know what to do seeing as it’s in her nature to be social…

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

Reblogging to respond to later.

Does anyone have any tips for making the introduction between old/new rats a little easier? 

Two of my older girls seem to dislike my new one (approx. 8 weeks old) and keep trying to attack her every time they’re out together. They seem to be okay on neutral ground (the bathtub in my case, since that’s pretty much the only place in my house that my other three haven’t been allowed to play in), but as soon as I put them on my bed or somewhere else for just a few minutes, they go to attack her or chase her around… 

One of my girls tries to almost sit on her and pin her against a wall, and currently, that’s the rat I’m having the most problems with. 

Granted, it has only been a few days (I think this is the 3rd day since I’ve brought Mabel home - and no, I did not quarantine her because I just do not have the space/proper set-up or proper spare cage to do so, so please don’t have a go at me for that) so I know that they’re not going to be best friends by now… But if anything, it seems to be getting worse… 

I really need some help with this though. I have their cages set up next to each other, and I do plan on letting them out in the bathtub for a few minutes later today (Mabel and Angel were just on my bed and it didn’t end well), but I’m worried that the bathtub will be disastrous as well… 

I’m pretty much open to any tips/advice at this point. I’d hate to find someone to adopt Mabel so I’d really love for this to work out… (And I don’t think the breeder I bought her from would take her back, tbh, since she seemed all too happy to get rid of her…). 

The last time I had rats and bought a new one home, I didn’t have half this much trouble… And that was 8 or so years ago now. 

@boogey56, do you have any tips??

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

How old is he? Can I see a pic?

Rat Advice Please

One of my rats has been developing a baldish patch on his back, we’ve been watching and there’s no blood, irritation or anything and he isn’t showing signs of pain so we’ve just been watching for now.

Now a small black spot has appeared on his back in this bald patch. Again there’s no signs of anything else and he’s as happy and playful as ever.  

Is this something to be concerned about? Would a vet trip be recommended?

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

I can help.

First of all, what kind of rats are they? By that I mean markings, base color, fur type, and ear type. Respond with pictures if you're unsure.

Where do you live, and where did you get them from?

For anyone who is well-versed in rat breeding, could anyone give me some advice? I’d like to get a litter with my buck, Flapjack (10m), since he’s so great and well-tempered and I’d hate to just lose him entirely in a few years and I have the ability to breed him myself, but I’ve never done such a thing before!

I’d like to know if it would be alright for me to breed him myself with my doe, Eggs Benedict, once she’s older and take as much advice as I can from online resources and such or if there’s a way for me to find a local breeder who is looking for outside bucks. I don’t have Flapjack’s linage but I’d probably be able to get it. I don’t know which rat forums are active in my area, however, so I don’t quite know how to go about looking for a breeder with a doe they’re looking to breed.

Any advice is welcome - thanks!

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

It looks like they're still pretty young. When did you get them, and did you get them from a breeder or store? I find their temperaments can change as they grow up, and that they mellow out a lot around 4-6 months.

Just keep handling them. I like to put mine on my bed and lie down with a blanket over me. They'll usually hide in the blanket next to me. A few long sessions, like an hour, works better than lots of short 20 minute sessions IMO. It can take up to 20 minutes for them to calm down, and when they're stressed or scared they don't seem as quick to bond, or even end up associating you with stress.

Once they calm down you can give high value treats like baby food or granola under the cover, or out of it if they feel adventurous.

Uhhhhh... help?

My rats are safe, but they don’t like me and I feel like little Granite is unhappy with me 80% during this daily playtime and I fear I’ll just increase the percentage by continuing to approach him.

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

Hmm, makes sense she lashed out on the bed if that's the free roam area. It could have been a territorial issue. I have a few questions.

1. What cage do you have? Can you send me a pic of the set up you intend to keep all of them in?

2. How old are the new girls?

3. Have you tried the classic, just clean the cage really well and throw the rats in together method? I find sometimes that long, drawn out intros are more stressful and can cause more problems in the long run, and have the rats associate the other rats negatively. I usually suggest cleaning everything completely, all bedding, all houses, bars, cracks and crevices, etc. Sanitize it. Then add rats, usually the new ones first, then the old ones like 15 seconds later. Don't do that yet though.

So here's my suggestion for now:

1. Give your older rat a few days break. Put the girls in a different room. Basically have them "reset".

2. Start scatter feeding. Basically scatter their food and treats around the cage floor. This is enriching as it allows them to express natural foraging behaviors, which can reduce stress. Treats that they have to work to get open are good for this such as black oil sunflower seeds.

3. Add clutter to their cages. Rats don't like open spaces, they like clutter. It makes them feel safer and less stressed. Even if it's just crinkled up newspaper everywhere (this is great for enrichment btw, put high value treats in a really compressed ball of paper layered with less compressed crinkled up balls.)

Once I hear back from you on the other questions, I'll give suggestions to go from there.

While we're at it, I'm in need of some more rat advice for anyone that might be able to help. I'm trying to introduce my older girl Cherry to the new girls as her cagemate passed a month and a half ago and it's been incredibly stressful so far.

I've been following all the articles and videos as closely as possible and I'm currently in the neutral territory phase of introducing and have been putting them in the bathtub. They're all scared of the bath and mostly just hide in the corner and refuse to eat treats, but they seem fine with each other- a few scuffles but nothing bad. Because they seemed fine I tried introducing them on my bed (their play area) and Cherry quickly became territorial and attacked the girls, it wasn't horrific but Daisy had a cut on her back.

I should also add the way my room and the cages are set out means Cherry/the girls can see when the other is out, the girls are curious and want to investigate but Cherry is at the bars sniffing and getting agitated.

I feel like a terrible rat owner for not being able to give Cherry the friends she needs and stressing them all out

@realistic-rat-breeding-and-care @ratpotatoez (I hope it's okay to tag you guys, I'd just really like some advice from experienced owners)

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

Temperament is largely genetic. It can be hormonal aggression, which can be helped by neutering.

You can make a bin cage out of the tub depending on how large it is. You'll just need hardware mesh and zip ties or or pipe cleaners.

I’m gonna murder my two dumbo boys

A couple weeks ago I had to separate Neptune for being aggressive with the other rats, and today I had to take my other dumbo boy, his brother, out for attacking the babes again.

I’m running out of cages guys, I already had to put my other boy in an extra cage, but with the new hedgehogs in the other cage, I don’t have a cage to put my rat in. Right now I’ve got him in a plastic tub, but this def can’t be long term.

Is there something that is like, genetic that causes aggression? I don’t think its a coincidence that my boys from the same litter are exhibiting the same behavior within weeks of each other.

[realistic-rat-breeding-and-care]

Rats need to be kept in same sex pairs. It's not optional, it is critical to their quality of life and overall well being. I suggest making a bin cage out of a 105qt or larger tub. They're very inexpensive and can be made for under $30, highly customizable, and super easy to clean. Oxbow is agreed to be one of the best foods, but Mazuri or Harlan Teklad is good as well. Hog feed supplemented with black oil sunflower seeds or cheap dog food like Doggy Bag or Twin Pet make good cheap rat foods as well, but that's moreso used by breeders who have to feed dozens of rats affordably. Kiln dried pine or aspen are the best beddings and the former can be bought for like $5-6 in a big bale.

I want to buy a rat soon to bring back with me to college for next semester and any suggestions?