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girl you fucked up your system partition really bad. you only allocated 500mb to the nice older sister that lives in your head and keeps you safe, then gave the remaining 249.5GB to your 2 year old alter.

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note: this poll is mostly for my personal fun. i cant possibly list every single thing ever you could use for this purpose and im sorry if i forgot your favourite.

*by this i mean apps intended for writers to keep track of their characterd and worldbuilding etc. rpg notes my love

**this includes if you dont use anything. "not applicable" doesn't always mean "not plural"

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Most (if not all) of what makes an experience traumatic is a lack of autonomy. (I suspect all, but acknowledge that there may be circumstances i haven't considered.)

Choosing to fight in a ring tends not to be traumatising, getting beat up on the street typically is, and getting coerced into a fight in a ring would be.

Smacking a child on the arse, often done as punishment, is a violation of autonomy and often traumatic, especially if done often. Getting randomly smacked on the arse as an adult by a stranger is a violation of autonomy and well, probably not traumatic as a one-off but definitely not good for wellbeing. Your partner smacking you on the arse because you asked them to is not going to be traumatising. Your partner deciding to keep going when you've told them to stop is a violation of autonomy and potentially traumatising.

Would you as be scared to drive after a crash if you intentionally crashed into a power pole, compared to if a tyre blew and you hit the pole?

etc etc

(these are all obviously highly specific, discrete-event examples because that's what i've thought about more, but yeah absolutely, more abstract and systematic autonomy violations like your examples are just as relevant here.)

I don't think psychology truly values autonomy as a need. I think it genuinely is just above food, water, medicine, and shelter for importance. I think the massive discontent and mental health issues we see are largely influenced by a lack of autonomy. Wealth inequality restricts the autonomy of people at the bottom. You have to work more and feel trapped at a shitty job since leaving puts you at risk. Retail and food service restricts how you can behave at work.

A lot of examples of abuse (childhood or otherwise) involve restricting or taking away a person's autonomy. I think there needs to be more focus on this

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We distinguish between "headspace" and "innerworld"

Headspace we've done in Minetest (free equivalent of Minecraft)

Innerworld we used Tiled Map Editor (free) and free tilesets. It's possible to create your own tilesets too, we just haven't done that yet.

question 58: for systems with innerworlds, do you map it out at all? if so, how?

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Toastie! Also we have mushrooms i can put in it! We rarely bought mushrooms as a student because they're kinda spensy.

I am having an exceptionally hard time eating now that we have moved to mum's. We're just struggling so much to decide what to eat. There's plenty of food.

We've been having noodles for breakfast and whatever mum cooks for dinner, but that's not enough food & also we're cooking tomorrow night.

I think we've just gotten so used to fairly repetitive food that we're no longer used to making decisions around food

But also that was mostly dinner and i can't remember what we were eating for breakfast & lunch the past few months. I think we changed it up sometimes.

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Ok we are eating tinned peaches. Not enough food, certainly, but something is better than nothing. Maybe it'll make it easier to make a decision.

I am having an exceptionally hard time eating now that we have moved to mum's. We're just struggling so much to decide what to eat. There's plenty of food.

We've been having noodles for breakfast and whatever mum cooks for dinner, but that's not enough food & also we're cooking tomorrow night.

I think we've just gotten so used to fairly repetitive food that we're no longer used to making decisions around food

But also that was mostly dinner and i can't remember what we were eating for breakfast & lunch the past few months. I think we changed it up sometimes.

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I am having an exceptionally hard time eating now that we have moved to mum's. We're just struggling so much to decide what to eat. There's plenty of food.

We've been having noodles for breakfast and whatever mum cooks for dinner, but that's not enough food & also we're cooking tomorrow night.

I think we've just gotten so used to fairly repetitive food that we're no longer used to making decisions around food

But also that was mostly dinner and i can't remember what we were eating for breakfast & lunch the past few months. I think we changed it up sometimes.

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Also, "symptoms cause clinically significant distress or impairment" is such a painfully subjective criteria that it is almost meaningless.

A system (or anyone with any experience that is patholgised) could be considered diagnosable by one psych but not by another.

It's also assuming that the person/system recognises any distress or impairment - which can be difficult to recognise when those are one's normal, even moreso when they have other potentially-diagnosable experiences.

not a big fan of how syscourse encourages separating everyone into traumagenic and non-traumagenic with no regard to anyone who is both, neither or just doesn't know or care. systemhood regardless of how one defines it is an inherently subjective internal experience. what one person believe counts as a non-traumagenic system could be a traumagenic system for someone else. even if that wasn't the case, different members of one system can also have conflicting opinions about how the system formed, it's unreasonable to expect all systems to function as coherent units with overlapping opinions.

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We don't switch much so don't have a big sample size, but we have noticed changes in circadian rhythem - i best go to bed around 10pm and tend to start getting sleepy an hour or so before (if i wasn't already sleep-deprived) but if one of my other headmates is fronting then, they tend to start getting sleepy closer to midnight, and will struggle to fall asleep around 10 - which is a problem if we have to get up at 6am, regardless of who's fronting on waking.

I think being a system fucks up my sleep quality and schedule =_=

Very possible!

From our anecdotal experience, I think we get to sleep easier on average than my host did before the rest of us existed. The reason for this is because we tend to go into the inner world and just focus on each other and being near each other. It helps silence other thoughts and worries, and is just very peaceful.

On the other hand, if someone in the system is particularly anxious or excited or in emotional distress of some kind, these heightened emotions from anyone in the system can make the whole system have difficulty sleeping due to how the emotions affect the body.

Strong emotions can release hormones like dopamine and adrenaline, which are associated with alertness and difficulty sleeping. The problem with being a system is that you have a lot of people sharing a body, and any conscious headmates experiencing strong emotional reactions can cause these hormones to be released. Even if the current fronter feels disconnected from the emotions, it's going to be triggering these reactions in the body.

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Long, personal

I seriously want to know what the heck is actually going on here.

We picked a name (A) that we use in class and will in our future job. It's a shortened version of our system name. I (D) am the primary front.

Sometimes the person fronting that I assume is me, because I default to front, identifies with the name A more than D. This is also fine in class, I don't really care.

But class finished a week ago and until today, the front has identified with the name A more than D. In fact I believe this has been the case for many weeks.

We've also been worse at doing stuff at home for ages, which we attributed to full-time study.

We spent the first couple days off playing our computer game, which we'd planned to do and that was fun. Then we spent basically the entirety of the following week also playing our game (or watching vids related to that game) but that felt less like having fun and more like rotting / avoiding boredom.

We have plenty we could do - yesterday afternoon we finally took a walk but otherwise haven't left the house all week (and have washed Once in the past week, and skipped out thorough Sunday shower which we plan to do today (Saturday), we have chores to do, we have some computer stuff to do, we have a few hobbies we like the idea of engaging in again.

Today I actually feel like D. I feel like myself.

So is the front that's A an actual headmate (probably with mild-moderate depression)? Is A the Default Autopilot, or "shell alter" without someone behind to drive any behaviours?

I feel like If I knew what was going on I'd maybe be able to do something about it, and not have wasted a week feeling crap and unproductive (I don't mean in a "must work all the time" way, I mean in a "I am not doing anything meaningful, nor important, nor actively enjoying myself.)

It probably doesn't help that we haven't been eating enough for a few weeks, but like, I felt better today after also not eating enough yesterday, so it mightn't actually be that.

Whoops we forgot to post this before our shower, but after it we were thinking about whether to tell this to a friend. We kinda realised, it's not something I've paid attention to, but I'm pretty sure A tends to have an approach of "just act like D" when talking to people, particularly when talking to that friend who is also plural and easily triggered by personhood stuff (so we don't often like to talk to him about complexities like this because we have to be so careful about what we say and how to say it.) Even with other people, there's the need to respond, but in hindsight it does feel a lot more like "We should respond how we normally would" which is not something I feel when I am Definitely fronting.

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Oh moood. We actually really hate the term "endo" because of it's association with syscourse, we hate how people are often like "endos are valid :)" because it's just a reminder of syscourse (if no one disagreed they wouldn't feel the need to say that! No one says "singlets are valid" because no one says they aren't.) and just the fact that plural stuff here is 90% arguments; anger & debunking.

We also came here from Masto in the hopes of finding actually-useful information & people describing & discussing their experiences (which is 90% of how we learn about ourselven, by comparing & contrasting). There's the odd decent post, which is a big part of why we stay. (we do also end up posting the odd syscourse-related thing but not often.)

Masto is decent for systems if you just want to be able to exist openly as a system, but for information & discussions on plurality, yeah, it's got nothing. And it's hard to scroll through archives.

I wish there were more posts simply discussing the wide range of experiences grouped under "plurality" in a neutral way, rather than as a rebuttal of someone else's opinion. Everything is phrased as being somehow in opposition to something else, be it overtly or implied. When you've been away from the community for a while, that's jarring to see because you haven't necessarily been exposed to the thing that is being countered.

I came back to the plural tags here on Tumblr after a few years away because I was confused and looking for help understanding my experience. I also tried Reddit, but that's dominated by overly clinical perspectives and the same questions being asked over and over. I tried the Fediverse, but barely found anything except personal intros. I tried Pillowfort, but the plural communities were extremely low on activity.

In the end, Tumblr was still the only place where I found some useful information ... but at what cost??

A little bit of syscourse here and there may be acceptable or even necessary, but where's the rest of the conversation? I'm especially looking for traumagenic/adaptive experiences that don't match the typical DID narrative and general discussions of how all of this works that aren't overly clinical.

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We're literally about to graduate into a healthcare profession and throughout our entire degree we have had drilled into us:

The patient is the expert on their own experiences.

The patient is the expert on their own circumstances.

The patient will have their own perspectives on their own experiences and you Must both understand and respect this.

We must work collaboratively with the patient as this provides the best outcomes. We need to ensure we are not deciding what the patient must do, but use our expertise to advise them and allow them to come to their own informed decision about which available option is best to take.

You in fact do not know yourself better than medical professionals. We see alof of posts saying how "i know my brain better than medical professionals" no. You don't, they are called professionals for the reason that they have studied and gotten degrees in specific fields. - Riley

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Joke: The reason we wanted to take on a "leadership" / coordination role within this group project was so that we had an excuse to type "we" instead of "i" in emails to people.

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i have now sent an email in polite-ese, to be summed up as "i'm booking these appointment times in an hour. You can let me know by then when you're free, or i'm just gonna make the appointments and you can either show up or shut up."

Also one of those appointments is with the supervisor, so if someone doesn't reply at all i'm gonna start asking 'hypothetical' questions about what happens re: grade if someone refuses to participate.

Gaaaah group projects are the worst it's been literally three days and I am suffering

(meme: yeah yeah the 'group projects are the worst,' we've all seen it)

Tuesday:

topic (community projects working with organisations) & group allocations sorted.

In a group of four total (me + 3)

We have the option of meeting with the relevant staff member on Thursday or Friday.

One of my group is, for some reason, on the other end of the country and videocalling into class.

One of my group confesses that they booked flights out of the country for a few days starting tomorrow. We just had holidays. We will have holidays in two months! They tried to minimise disruption to classes based on the Official timetable we had, which does not schedule in the SELF-DIRECTED PROJECT TIME, THAT WE KNEW WELL IN ADVANCE WAS GOING TO BE A SELF-DIRECTED GROUP PROJECT. Also sometimes those timetables change last-minute.

Of the two that are away, one agreed to video-call in to the meeting, the other "had an appointment at both meeting times"

Thursday:

I drive to the meeting time we agreed on. I check my phone before leaving the car. Staff member has said that the rain is now a "category red rain warning" and we aren't really supposed to drive if we can reasonably help it. Whoops. Me and one group member agree to postpone the meeting.

I send another email out with 4 pieces, one which was time-sensitive about the meeting, WHICH I MENTIONED IN THE SUBJECT LINE.

The two that are away don't reply.

Friday early morning:

I make an executive decision to email the community staff member asking if they are willing to postpone the meeting until Monday. I CC in my group mates. None of them reply.

The staff member is on leave on Monday.

It's now as of posting this, forty minutes past the originally-planned Friday meeting time.

Just like.. ugh.

I get that the groupmate on holiday is well, trying to have a holiday, but it IS term time and we DO have a group project. They need to check their fucking emails.

I'm sure they'll be great to work with once they're back, they usually prefer to get on with their work and get it done quickly, but right now? They're being a Problem.

I don't know anything about what's going on with the one that's on the other end of the country, so I don't want to be too harsh, but like. It is term time. We have a group project. Check your fucking emails.

The third one has been mostly good at replying but she hadn't replied to the last email.

Like ffs, I need to know. Can they do this afternoon? Or can we just.. pick a fucking time on Monday? The person is sorta pottering at home on school holidays for leave and would be willing to have the meeting then, though I'd rather avoid it if reasonably possible.

I hate the lack of clarity. I hate messing around the staff member like this, and just to top it off, I'm the one that's been emailing the staff member It's MY name on the emails. So I feel like it's ME that's looking irresponsible, when there's nothing I can do about my groupmates NOT CHECKING THEIR EMAILS.

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Gaaaah group projects are the worst it's been literally three days and I am suffering

(meme: yeah yeah the 'group projects are the worst,' we've all seen it)

Tuesday:

topic (community projects working with organisations) & group allocations sorted.

In a group of four total (me + 3)

We have the option of meeting with the relevant staff member on Thursday or Friday.

One of my group is, for some reason, on the other end of the country and videocalling into class.

One of my group confesses that they booked flights out of the country for a few days starting tomorrow. We just had holidays. We will have holidays in two months! They tried to minimise disruption to classes based on the Official timetable we had, which does not schedule in the SELF-DIRECTED PROJECT TIME, THAT WE KNEW WELL IN ADVANCE WAS GOING TO BE A SELF-DIRECTED GROUP PROJECT. Also sometimes those timetables change last-minute.

Of the two that are away, one agreed to video-call in to the meeting, the other "had an appointment at both meeting times"

Thursday:

I drive to the meeting time we agreed on. I check my phone before leaving the car. Staff member has said that the rain is now a "category red rain warning" and we aren't really supposed to drive if we can reasonably help it. Whoops. Me and one group member agree to postpone the meeting.

I send another email out with 4 pieces, one which was time-sensitive about the meeting, WHICH I MENTIONED IN THE SUBJECT LINE.

The two that are away don't reply.

Friday early morning:

I make an executive decision to email the community staff member asking if they are willing to postpone the meeting until Monday. I CC in my group mates. None of them reply.

The staff member is on leave on Monday.

It's now as of posting this, forty minutes past the originally-planned Friday meeting time.

Just like.. ugh.

I get that the groupmate on holiday is well, trying to have a holiday, but it IS term time and we DO have a group project. They need to check their fucking emails.

I'm sure they'll be great to work with once they're back, they usually prefer to get on with their work and get it done quickly, but right now? They're being a Problem.

I don't know anything about what's going on with the one that's on the other end of the country, so I don't want to be too harsh, but like. It is term time. We have a group project. Check your fucking emails.

The third one has been mostly good at replying but she hadn't replied to the last email.

Like ffs, I need to know. Can they do this afternoon? Or can we just.. pick a fucking time on Monday? The person is sorta pottering at home on school holidays for leave and would be willing to have the meeting then, though I'd rather avoid it if reasonably possible.

I hate the lack of clarity. I hate messing around the staff member like this, and just to top it off, I'm the one that's been emailing the staff member It's MY name on the emails. So I feel like it's ME that's looking irresponsible, when there's nothing I can do about my groupmates NOT CHECKING THEIR EMAILS.

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Hello! We really enjoy your account. We like to see the many different types of plurality existing, especially endogenic ones. While we are not endo, seeing healthy and non disordered plurality is very motivating for us, as that is our goal to attain.

We saw your recent posts regarding tulpamancy and dissociation and had some questions! As a Traumagenic system, of course we are well versed in the feeling of dissociation, but for many who have experienced trauma and dissociate bc of this, it’s very uncomfortable to be dissociated. For my system, this is one of our biggest issues right now, and we are working to try to lower dissociation episodes and dissociative barriers (especially while triggered). How does the dissociation feel for those who train it or will it? Is it just as uncomfortable (for example does it feel as if you are depersonalized or derealized?) or something else?

We are interested as endo/tulpa practices involving dissociation (if not uncomfortable like trauma related dissociation) could be beneficial for Traumagenic systems like ourselves to possibly shift our dissociation to being more comfortable and less debilitating.

Not sure you will have an answer and of course it might not be super clear cut.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, and for all the work that you do standing up for systems and all the education you share.

We wish you all the best!

Hi! 👋

I think the dissociation that we train is going to be a bit different than a DPDR episode. Mostly because the moments when everyone is detached from the body are going to be while meditating or in a similar state, and they shouldn't last long.

There have been occasions here and there where we will experience blendiness or confusion about who we are and those can be pretty distressing. I am not sure how similar these particular states are to derealization or depersonalization though.

Generally, we try to only do the detachment thing while switching.

There have been some DID systems who reported that tulpamancy methods have helped with their dissociates of symptoms.

Which makes sense to me. Because it's not just about teaching people to dissociate. It's about teaching control over the dissociation. And it's also about teaching the association part as well. At least in regards to switching. You aren't just learning how to detach from the body but how to attach to it. How to reconnect with the senses whenever you have lost that connection.

For this reason, I could imagine it being beneficial for DID systems to study and practice at least some tulpamancy methods.

In theory, knowing how to switch in at will should also be able to help whenever you are experiencing other sorts of dissociation by grounding you to the body. I won't promise it's a perfect solution that will work for everybody, but I do think it could at least be worth a try. 🤷‍♀️

As to what it feels like, since the dissociation is in relation to somebody else fronting, it depends on whether you are present or not. If you stay present, it's a bit like being in the passenger seat of the body. Somebody else is in control and you can't really feel anything physically unless you try to focus on it. Otherwise, only the fronter is going to be feeling. And only they are moving the body. You are just there as a voice in the head of the fronter.

If you aren't present though at all, then you just aren't there. You aren't even the voice. And the next time you gain awareness, you suddenly realize all the things that happened while you weren't conscious. Because even though we don't have memory barriers per se, we also don't automatically have all the information.

A notable example of this came from one time when almond hadn't fronted for a while and then she saw a new chicken coop in our yard. She was initially surprised to see it, and then the memories of my host helping to build it came flooding in after that. She technically had free access to all of the memories, but she didn't automatically know until the sight of the coop triggered them.

Thanks for the kind words and I hope I was able to answer your questions! Wishing you the best as well! Have a wonderful day! 😁💖

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So we definitely need to give this a reread in the next few days when we can give it more proper attention, but we mostly wanted to acknowledge we've seen it and give thanks for the effort and time you put into the reply.

Some initial thoughts:

We hadn't realised until reading this, but we had trouble thinking of these parts as dissociated because i don't think there's any real dissociation of memory between the parts - and turns out i've mostly been interpreting "not well-integrated" as "has memory gaps" and dismissed the idea of focussing on integration out of hand.

We'll also have a look and a real good consideration of the mindfulness info - last times we really tried mindfulness was in the early stages of managing sensory issues, and it was mostly just unpleasant to pay attention to how bad we felt when we didn't have the skills to do much about it.

(MultiplyDifficult, is a side blog). Kia ora, i was wondering if i would be able to got a little bit of direction / guidance from you around fusion (just to be clear, we don't want a full complete solution). I think to help you give a more useful response we'll have to explain a bit our situation & where we're coming from in a reblog, which might be kinda long. We wanted to check you're happy for this before shoving a heap of info at you!

Ayo wed love to give share some insights wr might have so Imma respond to this so you can reblog with any info you wanted to add ^^