eunuchorn

[eunuchorn]

Steve + text posts pt. 16/?

[eunuchorn]

it's a real travesty that the Steve Rogers tag has been clogged since 2012 with the worst takes from fans of literally every other character in the mcu, who are convinced Steve owes their faves something for some inexplicable reason

[eunuchorn]

All I’m gonna say is that if Steve had been the one to throw Stormbreaker and he deliberately missed so he would have time to gloat, fandom would crucify him.

All I’m gonna say is that if Steve had been the one to go behind the teams back to get Ultron up and running, he would never be forgiven.

All I’m gonna say is that Steve stayed back in Wakanda for years while Bucky went out to fight baddies, he would’ve been cancelled.

All I’m gonna say is that if Steve had been the one to bring Peter into the fight in Germany, people would be calling for his head on a platter.

All I’m gonna say is that Steve is held to an unreasonably high standard compared to literally everyone other character, and almost never given the benefit of the doubt like others.

[eunuchorn]

poooooookie

[eunuchorn]

Thing is, I would have so much more sympathy for Tony - and more understanding for his stans' position on this - if he had just been sorry about it.

Yes, it was 100% morally wrong for Tony to try to murder Bucky (and possibly Steve), but many of the Avengers have done morally reprehensible things. The difference is that they came to regret it and took steps to make amends. T'Challa, for example, also tried to kill Bucky, and he did it based on faulty information and an overwhelming rage and grief that clouded his judgement. But he overcame it. He realized that he was wrong, even decided to spare his father's actual killer, and took steps to make up for what he put Bucky through by helping him in Wakanda.

Tony, by contrast, never showed that he regretted trying to kill Bucky. He even knew from the start (unlike T'Challa) that Bucky ultimately wasn't responsible but he tried to kill him anyway. And then he spent the next two years being angry at Steve about the whole thing, refused to call him even when the world was at risk, and then threw a whole tantrum about how mean Steve was to him. He never acknowledged that what he did was wrong.

He never apologized. He never acted sorry. And that's where his true moral failing lies, in my opinion.

It is wild, as they say, that after 9 years, holding that Tony was morally wrong to try to murder Bucky in Civil War is still a controversial position.

Are Tony fans really such a morality void that they have to condone murder and revenge-killing.

[eunuchorn]

Imagine hating Steve Rogers because of his “ending”.

After everything we saw him go through—from The First Avenger to Endgame—as if he didn’t deserve to think about himself for once.

Going back in time doesn’t erase all he went through IMO. He lived that life. He got to know Bucky was still alive, he got to be an Avenger, he helped save the world several times etc.

After doing all of that, what had Steve missed out on? That dance with Peggy.

[eunuchorn]

I think it's insane that in the year of our lord 2024 we STILL have to defend steve from atrocious takes such as "he abandoned bucky... when he didn't look for him after he fell off the train".

I beg your fucking pardon? The train kept moving after Bucky fell. It could have been literal miles worth of the ravine that would have to be searched. And a fall from that height looks pretty darn deadly. It was a fucking miracle that Bucky survived it, and it's not on Steve that he assumed he was dead. But it's somehow his fault for not taking into account that Bucky MIGHT have been enhanced by Zola's experiments? Give me a break!

Moreover, better check your timeline, but after Zola spills, it jump cuts to Red Skull saying the bombing will happen TOMORROW. Immediately followed by the scene where Steve is mourning Bucky. Which means that he literally Did Not Have Time to look for Bucky AT ALL. Because on the next day he himself will DIE.

(Alternatively, the interrogation + Steve grieving takes place several days after Bucky fell, but surely it couldn't have been longer than a week, canon suggests it was literally the next day).

And I gotta ask, aren't you tired of finding new bullshit reasons to dunk on Steve? Just say you don't like him and be done with it. The only reason you even do this is to rack up more woobie points for Bucky and I'm sick of it!

[eunuchorn]

i actually love the idea of thor and steve's friendship. like they literally have so much in common hello??

they are both strong, tall, blonde, have weapons that are a greater representation of their beliefs and legacy, both distinctly are outsiders™, both very righteous and deeply protective of their nerdy brunette significant other.

marvel ROBBED us of this friendship

[eunuchorn]

thorsteve, kiss #7 (on the lips, passionate). i wasnt gonna do thorsteve today but sgtjimbarnes swayed me with talk of wall pinning ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

[eunuchorn]

Oh boy.

1) By the rules of time travel (as I understood them, anyway, feel free to correct) in the MCU, there was no way for Steve to actually stop those things from happening. He could change them, obviously, but that would just create a new timeline. The timeline where those things happened would still exist, Steve just wouldn't be part of it anymore. So regardless of whether or not I liked the ending, I can at least understand where it's coming from.

2) I never said I liked Steve's ending in Endgame. Personally I thought it was a pretty bad ending, not necessarily because it was out of character (though I do think it kinda was), but mostly because I am not a huge fan of time travel as a solution to problems. Since I see Steve's character arc and one of his main struggles as being about his inability to let go of the past, I don't think it was a very good solution for him to just... not have to. Narratively I don't find it particularly good or interesting for a character to sidestep their struggle like that. But I don't consider it character assassination, really. I mostly see it as the writers not knowing how else to give Steve a definite ending. Any solution where Steve lived and stayed in the present would be very open-ended. At this point, I'm mostly just glad that he didn't get killed off and got a bad but happy ending. I can learn to live with it.

3) Nothing I wrote even suggested that I was "absolutely fine" with Steve's ending or any of your points, so I don't know why you felt the need to act like it did. I specifically added "not saying I agree or disagree" because I saw that as beside the point. All I said was that I think claiming to have authority over who is a "true fan" is toxic. That claiming to have authority over which opinion is the "correct" one is toxic. Especially with a character like Steve Rogers who has been interpreted and formed by so many different writers, universes, and stories across literal decades. I dislike fandom police. I can disagree or agree with any and all takes, but I'm not going to pretend there is an objectively correct one, or that anyone who disagrees with me is a false fan or something. Everything you wrote in your post and everything else I've touched on above is beside that point. Sorry for not confirming your opinion as the one true take I guess.

just going to say that you’re not a real steve rogers stan if you think endgame made sense for his character. you prefer fanon, and that’s ok, but the real steve rogers would never go back in time rather than March forward. he would never abandon his friends. he would always choose a pickett line over a pickett fence. bc that man could retire from being captain america, but never from being steve rogers

[eunuchorn]

No one fan has the authority to decide the "correct" interpretation or opinion of a character, world, or story. "You're only a real fan if..." rhetoric is toxic af. Not saying i agree or disagree with this take on Steve Rogers' character, but it's only a take. Not an objective fact. Everyone who is a fan of Steve... is a fan of Steve.

just going to say that you’re not a real steve rogers stan if you think endgame made sense for his character. you prefer fanon, and that’s ok, but the real steve rogers would never go back in time rather than March forward. he would never abandon his friends. he would always choose a pickett line over a pickett fence. bc that man could retire from being captain america, but never from being steve rogers

[eunuchorn]

I just saw a tiktok with over 300k likes about that scene in Avengers Endgame where Tony goes off on Steve about how everything was Steve's fault and he's a liar and Tony was right about everything yada yada yada which said that Tony was 100% right and Steve deserved it and it's the best scene in the franchise.

This is why I avoid the MCU fandom. And Tony stans. And Stony shippers too, tbh, even though I used to be one.

I hate that scene so much. No matter what the Tony fans think, Steve did not deserve it. I wish Tony had apologized for it.

[eunuchorn]

Chris Evans as Steve Rogers | Avengers: Infinity War (2018)

[eunuchorn]

Even after 7 years its still kind of annoying to see certain people in MCU fandom saying "Bucky doesn't deserve to be saved or redeemed!", " Bucky deserves to die!" and acting like he's the worst, most evil person in the universe.

And the way they try and justify their idea by saying "HE KILLED PEOPLE!" like he's the only person in universe who ever did such a thing. Um no. Anyone can see that is not so.

The real truth is they're just spoiled brats who think hurting T*ny is some unforgivable sin and they're mad because he's still breathing. This is why Bucky needs to do something really great or amazingly heroic in Thunderbolts. Just to give them all the Middle finger.

Unfortunately there is probably nothing that Bucky can do to redeem himself in those people's eyes. They're not coming from a genuine place, all they care about is Tony being right and everyone else being wrong, regardless of the actual narrative. They're the same people who watched that scene in Endgame when Tony went off on Steve and thought Steve deserved it (he did not). They're the same people who will shout until they're blue in the face that Tony wasn't responsible for Ultron because Wanda gave him a nightmare, but will then turn around and say that mind control isn't an excuse for what Bucky did 🙄 The MCU fandom is overrun by these Tony stans, and there is really nothing we can do except ignore and block. And occasionally complain. The rest of us know that Bucky was a victim, not a villain, and that he became a hero in the end.

[eunuchorn]

if i was 26 and had just woken up from a 70 year suicide-induced coma with no one in the present remembering who i am and instead conflating me with the ever changing image of the role i played in ww2 that now serves as american propaganda and 2 weeks ago i was watching guys get half of their faces blown off and a week after that the love of my life fell off of a moving train with me only being able to watch and then i had to like... deal with a billionaire nepo baby war profiteer calling me an old man and saying there's nothing special about me i would have started killing people. but unfortunately it happened to steve rogers. and he has, like, morals. so

[eunuchorn]

Y’know the truth is I don’t think Tony Stark would bother me nearly as much if his fans were just even slightly normal about him. Like antis get this reputation for being crazy obsessive hateful people, but in my experience they’re just frustrated fans that want a place to vent about an otherwise very popular character. It’s the stans who will cross tag and send death threats to blogs that dare disparage their precious baby. It’s the stans that clamor for unfair amounts of screen time and encourage the co-opting of other characters to surround Tony Stark. I don’t see antis writing a thousand 10k fanfics about Team Iron Man getting tortured and groveling to Steve. Idk maybe this is an unfortunately common fandom behavior?? It just seems so unnecessary to me

[eunuchorn]