certifieduruihater

[certifieduruihater]

So you noticed it too? That Raph and Leo are so similar. That’s why I find the Leo and Raph fights annoying because they are both alike they should be agreeing with each other more

honestly i kind of just want to see a version where leo and raph just...get along with little to no major issues. actually, make them best friends. why not? 2012 was so close to doing this, but imo they fumbled the bag.

i guess i just dont understand why raph and leo fighting HAS to be a staple of every tmnt iteration. these iterations often dont even do anything interesting with their conflicts. we dont see their characters explored or expanded on a deeper level. in several iterations it's hard to call their conflicts two sided as it often boils down to raph throwing a tantrum about one thing or another and leo getting caught in the crossfire, which does nothing for anyone. ill try to explain what i mean by complaining about 2012 (a series i love, but man do i get frustrated with sometimes)

i remember watching tmnt 2012 s4 ep 18 mutant gangland and being absolutely appalled at raph in this episode

the episode starts out with him being angry for no discernible reason and then taking it out on leo during training with sudden brutality and aggression against him.

first he says he's angry that no one takes training seriously, which is not true, because we've never seen leo not taking training seriously against you?? and he's not doing it right now?

then raph accuses splinter of favoritism, which...no? not once in the show have i ever seen evidence of favoritism? what is bro on?? splinter doesnt "stick up for leo" here, he ends a fight that got too aggressive, reinforces their brotherly relationship in an effort to stop raph from killing his brothers, and reiterates the purpose of training, which raph seems to have forgotten. favoritism where??

this is not the first time in the series raph has gone off at leo during training by the way.

in s2 when raph meets casey (the good the bad and casey jones), raph strikes leo from behind after leo wins their fight.

it's not like splinter stopped raph from hitting leo then. he doesnt even yell at raph here. once again, i ask, where's the favoritism?

raph takes no personal responsibility for his anger, which would be fine, only this never gets resolved by the end of the series. he STILL has this mindset by the end of the show. like was that s1 turtle temper episode in which raph supposedly learned to control his temper not enough??? what are we still doing here??

this also ties into a general issue with 2012 where instead of creating new conflicts for the characters they start to repeat old ones. actually, one could argue that s4 raph actually gets WORSE. at least in s2 raph was somewhat remorseful, even though he quickly buried it in denial soon after.

back to the s4 example. then raph out of nowhere drags donnie into the conflict? ive never claimed to be a donnie fan, but this was uncalled for. bro was literally sitting there and drinking juice. i'll admit donnie did escalate the conflict unnecessarily, but hey, raph was the one to bring up the nonexistent favoritism thing in the first place.

like am i supposed to be on raph's side here? to me it just looks like he blew up for no reason. i have no idea what this guys is thinking!

we are at SEASON 4 and practically almost at the end of the series, and raph is STILL causing issues like this. this is some season 1 behavior. frankly, this is just embarrassing. season 4 was where raph's character as a whole really just went downhill for me. his "conflict" with leo is one example.

raph's running off leads to donnie getting captured. he must be feeling guilty. maybe we'll get some insight as to what his deal is.

that's...it? nothing else? ...okay, maybe they're saving it for the end of the episode. this is an action show after all, and we've got some action to cover.

raph frees donnie...and then fights together with the mutanimals instead of fighting with his team??

but wouldnt it have been better for raph to actually fight WITH his team to...you know...solidify his loyalty to his team? (a loyalty that really shouldnt have to be questioned by now because we're at the END OF THE SERIES???)

by the end of the episode, they apologize, but no one actually talks about anything. raph doesnt explain WHY he got so intense. he doesnt talk to leo or splinter about anything. also, raph NEVER apologizes to donnie for the shuriken nonsense he pulled at the start. huh??

one could argue that raph's issues are a matter of perspective, but it's hard for me to feel any sympathy when i can see objectively that the guy is just plain wrong.

leo and raph's conflict + raph's angst is often written in an incredibly shallow manner that often makes me end up disliking raph more because they never bother to flesh out his end of it. and im sorry to be mean, but raph almost never has a point when he says anything. he's just wrong. this episode is a prime example. unfocused conflicts like this end up feeling like unnecessary drama to me. im just not interested in this sort of thing.

id be okay with conflict between raph and leo if it was interesting, but i just keep seeing the same things over and over again with little to no exploration, so at this point im honestly just tired of it and would rather it not be included.

them being alike doesnt necessarily mean they have to agree with each other, and i dont mind them fighting, but can we have a balance or something? i like the understanding 03 leo and raph seem to have for one another. the way raph silently supported leo in forging his swords when leo was down on his confidence. when leo has an outburst at the team during s4 for not taking things seriously (havent gotten there yet. i saw a clip but idk the context so i could be wrong) raph actually appears to be the first one who agrees with him. this stuff is nice.

like do people think them getting along and not hating each other takes away the fundamentals of their characters? is it really that ingrained for leo and raph to just never get along? ive mentioned this before but i think tmnt has this thing where parts of characters are references to past material, which while may have worked in the past, just doesnt work for the version their writing for and ends up feeling hastily slapped on.

[certifieduruihater]

so interesting how similar leo and raph are in 03

i havent really been taking notes as i go through the series, unlike with 2012, so i may have missed things/gotten details wrong, but this is one thing that struck me even without close scrutiny

like the time when they both strike out by themselves and are alone on a rooftop, so filled with anger that they can't help but scream out loud to no one about it

(from meet casey jones)

(from the shredder strikes part 1)

granted the two of them are angry at different things here, and maybe it's just a coincidence that the two of them ended up on a rooftop...but i can't help but feel that these instances are similar in a way

then that time when leo stops raph from going back down to the sewers because their enemies were on the lookout for them down there...

(both instances from the king)

...only for Leo to attempt to go down to the sewers alone literally an episode later until splinter reads him

(from the shredder strikes back part 1)

in front of everyone, leo agrees with splinter and says that the most important thing is that they're together as family. but by himself, leo thinks otherwise. plus some time must have passed, most likely contributing to leo's patience running out. and that's where splinter steps in. actually, leo's reasoning for going down there feels similar to something raph would say as well

(from the shredder strikes part 1)

when a brawl breaks out between leo and raph, mikey and donnie seem to imply that it happens quite frequently (even though i don't think they've had any major conflicts up until now so eh?) but maybe the intention was that they clash so much because of how similar they are.

in any case, ive only noticed this "similarity" between the two in the 03 series (i havent read the comics so i can't speak on those). in all of the other shows and movies ive seen, leo and raph don't feel similar like this at all...which is almost a shame because the whole tmnt mythos of "leo and raph always fight" kind of makes sense with these personalities? but it feels like some of the other iterations just take that premise without actually stopping to think about WHY they would be fighting and if it makes sense for that particular set of leo and raph. now you just have "leo and raph always fight because raph doesn't like leo's authority" which at this point just feels superficial to me

[certifieduruihater]

WHAT WAS THAT FOR 😭😭😭

game: tmnt mutant melee

[certifieduruihater]

leo and hun really got beef in this game huh

game: tmnt mutant melee

[certifieduruihater]

LEO???

this is from tmnt mutant melee, one of the "blooper" scenes

[certifieduruihater]

i think this is another nick free to play. love this concept. everything about it.

also the art for this game goes so hard and for what??

donnie. . .

will bro ever stop being embarassing?

and yet you're still wearing the costume raph. . . also i love how the dress is sleeveless. bro just has to show off his gains

raph: im never waiting last minute for a costume again!!

also raph: leans into it

also his attack is quite literally sparkles

mikey as spongebob fits somehow. also the sprites in general look so good.

oh leo. . . never change

they're so stupid 😭

also love the decision to include april. she looks so cute here!

[certifieduruihater]

i find it funny when x reader people use this gif of donnie

bc when i think about the context of the scene, who is he smiling at?

a stranger? no. april? no. casey? some of yall wish but no. you? again, some of yall wish but no.

it's leo.

THIS is who donnie gives his sweet, sincere smile for. not any potential romantic interest. not even his friends. nah, this look is reserved for his brother. his family.

[certifieduruihater]

anyone remember this game?

i mostly remember it for its inclusion of the ninja turtles dressed as princesses (?) and wondered for the longest time what the context was

turns out the entire time it was donnie dreaming that his brothers were dressed as princesses for some reason???

full context is that he was playing a video game, fell asleep while thinking of april for some reason, and then dreamt that he was a protag on a mission to rescue princess april

however, each level (which seems to be taking inspiration from different games) he saves what he thinks is princess april only for it to be one of his brothers instead, and then they send him off to another level to go find her

the reveal of raph with that turn around was so funny i laughed out loud

also, for this level, you can attack by hurling shurikens at the enemies, which were the mousers; the shurikens instantly hone in on whatever enemy is closest to you. big boss was a kraang bot.

mikey's level seems to be mario inspired with himself as peach. interestingly, this is the one level where you can't attack, you can only jump

enemies were pirahanas (with part of their flesh removed?) that would jump out of the water, if you hit one you instantly lost a life. big boss was fishface

this level felt to most "beat 'em up" to me. enemies were foot soldier esque and you had to get close to them and spam the attack button. close combat only. felt fitting for a leo level ig. big boss was shredder (also fitting), and his boss fight was so cool. like, too cool. his sprite looked so good.

leo's mask being used for leia's buns is the cherry on top

the detail on this game is insane😭this is a nick free to play 😭😭

love the implication that donnie's brothers troll him even in his dreams. their sprites have so much detail too, donnie you dream like this??

[certifieduruihater]

I kept getting an error message so I finally send the ask. I wasn’t sure if yougot it. In fact I don’t remember what it was I asked. But what iteration of Raph do you like?

you're good, i got it! just answered it!

[certifieduruihater]

Yeah hate is too much of a strong word my bad. I guess I should ask what iteration of Raph do you like?

i think 03 raph is one of the most solid depictions ive seen of raph so far. granted, i still havent gone through the entirety of 03 (still on season 1) so hopefully i wont be eating my words. i enjoy him because he at least knows he has issues and is trying to work on them. plus, you can tell he really cares for his family. in battle, every time one of his brothers is about to get attacked, a lot of the time it's raph who directly steps in to defend them. this raph totally lives up to the "protector" moniker a lot of people tend to give him. i also like this raph because he tends to wear his emotions on his sleeve. in tales of leo, when leo wasn't waking up, the words he was saying may have been harsh, but then they cut to him crying, so you know that this is anger born of fear/grief. it seems like he feels emotions really powerfully. there's a lot of little moments with him where he shines best.

i did really like 12 raph in season 1. granted, tmnt 2012 was my first exposure to tmnt, so maybe im biased, but still. he was the guy that called other people out when they were being stupid. when he said something harsh, most of the time, what he was saying made sense. personally his character went downhill for me past season 1, but i will forever remember his golden characterization in S1. he had a lot of potential that unfortunately i just dont think the character lived up to (to be fair, you could say this about a lot of things in 2012)

the raph from the 90s trilogies was pretty good. he had his outbursts, yes, but the movies either handled them appropriately or never lingered on them too long, which unfortunately, a lot of tmnt movies post this era seem to like doing. his friendship with yoshi in the third movie was so sweet.

raph from the 87 cartoon is interesting to me because he seems less angry and more just sarcastic and witty. i havent gone through the entirety of the show, but this raph seems all right. he yaps but it's kind of funny

[certifieduruihater]

(same anon as before) where did you find the second page? i haven’t seen that character bio before!:0

i actually found them on tumblr!

according to the post, they're from the tmnt tv source book, which seems to be a limited edition item that was only sold at toys r us. i have no way of verifying since i don't have the book myself, but eh

[certifieduruihater]

a fun fact about the first leo profile page; it’s actually unchanged from the previous entries of it that corresponded with 80s leo/90s media leo, so it also applies to those leos as well. i think you’re able to check on the way back machine? that’s how i came across that page! i think eventually they started to change details on the character bios but im unsure

thanks for telling me! when i went to the wayback machine and entered ninjaturtles.com and navigated to the t-files section, this was the earliest image i saw of leo's page from march 1st 1997 so i guess it does apply to 80s (mirage/og??)/90s leo.

there did seem to be some differences with 2003 leo if i pull up the most recent version of the 03 profile

minor, but 03 leo seems to be an inch taller and 10 pounds heavier. also, apparently 80s/90s leo has no hobbies because he has no time. is he good? then bro says he likes candles 😭 leo...

guess training and reading can't be hobbies since they're not hobbies, they're a lifestyle to him.

the personal profile section does seem to be the same?

in july of 1997, it seems the only thing that changed was bolding the "must" and the "not" in the personal profile section.

in 2003-2004ish, it looks like the website was updated with the 03 turtles. leo's physical characteristics changed to match. initially, 03 leo was also listed as having no hobbies :/ also a nickname was added, "ginsu master," which he apparently does not like instead of "fearless leader," which 80s/90s leo showed apparent distaste for. though even then, the language of "not my favorite!" is pretty mild/polite lol

in around 2010, looks like leo's hobbies were finally updated. not sure why it took so long 😭 maybe his brothers told him to change it

like even splinter had hobbies way before leo according to the wayback machine's earliest capture in january 2000, what is this😭

[certifieduruihater]

interesting...so in 2003, was leo never officially named leader? and yet the others do seem to regard him as their leader, at least to some extent?

makes him even more impressive imo

[certifieduruihater]

I hope you choke and die

[certifieduruihater]

Since you hate Raph how do you feel about Donnie and Mikey.

eh i dont think hate is accurate. i do dislike certain versions of his character, but that's not exclusive to raph. with all of the turtles, there are certain versions that i prefer over others.

that being said, what versions of donnie and mikey are you talking about? my opinions of all of these characters vary by iteration.

[certifieduruihater]

using that scene in 2012 against leo's cooking is unfair because he didn't even get to TRY making anything.

First, donnie launches toast at leo with his bo knocking him clean off his feet (honestly idk what either them expected)

Then Raph uses his sais to squeeze fresh orange juice, causing some to get into donnie's eyes. donnie starts freaking out and running all over the place.

we then see leo working the stove ABOUT to put in the eggs, but bro doesn't even get the chance before donnie crashes straight into him. their fall (which one could argue both donnie and raph caused since donnie wouldn't be running around if it weren't for raph's bright idea of using his sais to squeeze the oranges) causes the pans to be knocked over the stove and for one of them to go sailing into raph.

if anything, raph and donnie were the ones actively wrecking things during this scene. leo barely contributed.

[certifieduruihater]

PSA: there's a turtle in 2003 who burns toast, and it's not leo

episode: s1 ep17 - the shredder strikes back part 1

also just to be explicit: this toast is clearly burnt. mikey burnt the toast. MIKEY is the one who doesn't know how to work the toaster + whose cooking skills should be called into question