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Sorry it’s early but you really can’t use fanfiction terms in a non fanfiction context like if someone is trying to sell me a book to read and they tell me there’s an enemy to lovers I would be annoyed because why are you spoiling the story lol

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"You guys just hate because you want every marvel movie to be Endgame, movies cant all be that good"

Fool,

I hated Endgame too

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I have enough

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how do you rate youtuber analysis? particularly nerdrotic and disparu who seem to make the most rop videos

I’m not a big fan of these two channels — they do raise good points on occasion about RoP and the state of modern Hollywood productions, but realistically, they’re no better than the Amazon shills because they pander to and capitalize on the politics/morals/outlook of their viewer base to get clicks and are incredibly toxic. Not to mention, the thumbnails they use for their videos are rage bait to get more engagement from people who disagree with their opinions. 

While yes, I think we should absolutely call out bad adaptations, significant lore changes, bad writing, and the general slop being produced presently, accounts like this with their anti-woke and toxic outlook will inevitably work to discredit the real fans with genuine critiques and criticisms because we either get lumped into this nasty group or have our voices drowned out by these larger accounts. 

I enjoyed the videos put out by Council of the Rings. The analyses in their RoP review videos are much less political, rage-baity, and invoke the lore more than Nerdrotic and Disparu do to point out things that Amazon got wrong, so it feels more like a genuine critique instead of just preaching about things being ‘woke’. I also enjoy the videos about what they would do to improve RoP and how they would approach a series set in the Second Age. This channel puts out deep dives into the lore and character breakdowns too.

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rings of power writers: Yes we understand that by this point in the story, Galadriel had been married to Celeborn for thousands of years. But she's a strong independent woman, so she doesn't need a husband!

also rings of power writers: We're gonna ship Galadriel with Sauron and even say that she loves him. Who cares that he had her brother killed by a werewolf or that he's pure evil. Shipping the heroine with the villain is what you're supposed to do!

These people are idiots. Let me say this clearly, if you ship Galadriel with Sauron then you are disgusting and stupid. Not you have your opinion and I can respect that even if it's different from my own. No, you are simply stupid and disgusting if you ship those two. You gonna ship Ellen Ripley with the Aliens? Laurie Strode with Michael Meyers? Princess Leia with Grand Moff Tarkin?

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Not trying to be rude, but if everyone who writes Rings of Power fanfiction can make sure that's clearly marked so I can filter it out super easily when I want to read Silmarillion fics, that would be lovely.

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Just saw a post babyfying Sauron and saying shit like “Oh he’s just misunderstood, he just needs to remember who he is, he just needs a hug, bla bla bla”

This isn’t some YA, you know? This is Tolkien. Do people know why he wrote LOTR? Do people know what Sauron is supposed to represent?

This is what rings of power has done. This is the world we live in now. The way it has been able to reduce such a monumental story, universe and message to fucking crumbs, I just…

Never ending sigh……

Now we get motherfucking Sauron of all characters being treated like he was written by freaking rian johnson or jj abrams or something.

Not to mention all the Sauron/Galadriel that keeps showing up for me no matter how much I block it. I just wanna gouge out my own eyes.

I thought it couldn’t get any worse than reylo and all that disney star wars crap but the universe decided to prove me wrong.

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Me: *Sees r*ngs of power posts in the LOTR tag*

Me: Aight, time to start blocking people

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“The canons of narrative in any medium cannot be wholly different; and the failure of poor films is often precisely in exaggeration, and in the intrusion of unwarranted matter owing to not perceiving where the core of the original lies.” - J.R.R. Tolkien in Letter #210

link to full article for those interested

i think we should start beating these people with sticks

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You must feel so edgy and smart hating on Rings of Power. Loooooook at meeeee, I'm muuuuuch better than all of you dumb people who enjoy things!

Typical ugly American. Keep your hate for yourself, you halfwit.

You say, going out of your way to be insulting and hateful. Lol! Also, it isn't edgy to hate the Rings of Power. I'm fairly certain it's the general concensus at this point. Just look at the viewing figures. You really just have to have eyeballs, braincells, and standards. I like to think that's more people than not. Although, more and more I am made to wonder about that. So, not cool or edgy or especially smart. Just common sense, really. If you are allowed to "like what you like" then I am allowed to hate what I hate. You know, equality and all that. You stand by your beliefs, and I'll stand my mine. And I believe this show isn't just bad. It is heatful, disrespectful, and malicious. A perversion of a beautiful mythos without which storytelling today would be totally changed and greatly diminished. They take the works of greater men and twist them into unrecognizable sludge to push agendas rooted in vanity and greed. It's the antithesis of Tolkien. I will never stop pointing that out. This is my line in the sand. I'm happy to die on the hill that is the great works of J. R.R. Tolkien and his son. It is invaluable, and it's worth fighting for.

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WHAT IN THE FUCKING FUCK DID I JUST WITNESS

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The latest bad take on Amazon's Rings of Power is, "Rings of Power doesn't contradict Tolkien's canon, because there is no such thing as canon."

I've seen more and more Rings of Power fans claiming that the show doesn't go against canon because there are different versions of canon anyway, between The Silmarillion and the History of Middle-earth, and The Silmarillion wasn't published by Tolkien, but by his son. They're basically saying, "Canon? What canon?" And I just... No. The idea that "the show doesn't go against canon because canon is so wishy-washy anyway" is SUCH a false argument to make.

Yes, Christopher Tolkien edited and published The Silmarillion after his father's death. And yes, there are multiple conflicting versions of stories in The Silmarillion and HoMe. But that doesn't mean there's no such thing as being faithful to Tolkien's stories. A lot of the choices Amazon has made in the show are completely wrong and would be wrong in any Tolkien adaptation.

The characterizations are totally off base. For heaven's sake, Hobbits wouldn't abandon their own people on a journey. Elrond wouldn't swear an oath like that. And the Númenoreans don't hate Elves because Elves are stealing their jobs, they envy them for their immortality—it's kind of the main theme of the Akallabêth. And, in the show, Galadriel—whose people were literally victims of the First Kinslaying—tries to steal a boat??? I mean, hello??????? Amazon hasn't even tried to stay faithful Tolkien's characterizations. Yes, adaptations usually take liberties with the source material, but holy shit.

And the very framing of fundamental issues is completely wrong. In the show, going to Valinor is portrayed as some sort of reward for valor in battle, which is not how it works in Tolkien's books. The show also compressed the entire Second Age into a much shorter span of time, which is absurd and completely goes against what Tolkien wrote. The show glosses over the First Kinslaying, of course (I know it's because they don't have the rights, but it's still their fault for mangling the story and themes), which makes it seem like the return of the Noldor to Middle-earth was some sort of righteous war, and it wasn't. The list goes on and on.

And they can't get basic details right, either. Obviously, the short-haired Elves are one example of this; so is the emblem that resembles a Fëanorian star on Galadriel's armor. And it's astounding how poorly the showrunners seem to understand the nuances of Tolkien's names and constructed languages.

Tolkien was a linguist, and the languages he invented were extremely important to him and to his stories. So what did Amazon do? They completely ignored the internal logic of Tolkien's secondary world. In The Silmarillion, Ar-Pharazôn banned Quenya in Númenor—but Amazon's version of the character names his son a Quenya name. In the show, characters call Galadriel "Galadriel" even in Valinor, despite it being a Sindarin name given to her by her husband, Celeborn. It is anachronistic and inaccurate to refer to her by that name before Celeborn gives it to her, especially during the Years of the Trees when she didn't even speak Sindarin. The show also gave one of the hobbits a Dwarven name, Nori, for no apparent reason. There are many more examples like this.

Amazon has also invented some things out of thin air that have no basis in Tolkien's works at all. I understand that they had to invent original characters and storylines for this show. Inventing original characters could, in theory, work alongside canon instead of contradicting it, even though those characters aren't found in Tolkien's books. But mithril containing the light of a silmaril? What? And what's with that weird bit where Amazon Elrond and Amazon Celebrimbor are talking about the silmarils and they say Morgoth cried when he looked at them and almost repented??? What the hell??? It makes no sense.

This is by no means an exhaustive list. The people who created this show have many many, many choices that completely fly in the face of Tolkien's characterizations, worldbuilding, languages, and themes. (I haven't watched Rings of Power and I don't intend to, but this information is widely available if you read reviews and episode synopses.)

The show is also poorly written and ugly to look at, but that's beside the point. The point of this post is just to say that no, just because there are multiple, conflicting versions of canon in The Silmarillion and HoMe doesn't mean Amazon gets free reign to trample all over Tolkien's stories. There is such a thing as making a faithful Tolkien adaptation, and this isn't it.

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calling an author "unprofessional" bc he hates how his precious work that he spent years on being butchered is beyond madness. the thoughts, the ideas, the hard work, the inspiration, the sleepless nights, the creativity, the emotions and feelings he has put into his work being thrown out the window not once but TWICE must be heart breaking to him. he knows he doesn't have much time left on this earth and he has the RIGHT to be upset and devastated at how his legacy is being dragged through the mud and "fixed" by a bunch of pretentious narcissists that think they could do a better job than him, bc if they're doing this while he is alive imagine what they would do when he isn't.

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The Rings of Power is by no means a perfect show, or an accurate retelling of Tolkien's work, but the due diligence and respect the show runners have shown the Tolkien family has often gone above and beyond. They don't even have the rights to all his works so can't use certain place names, characters etc but have always respectfully found a way around that or tried to adapt it in a way that is palatable for an audience. Ryan and his cohort should take notes and be thankful that the author of their show is still around to ask these questions too and that they have unlimited access to all his written work.

I could not disagree more. Rings of power is the biggest offence to Tolkien. And comes from a vanity project from a white billionaire. Tolkien is dead but there are consultants and Tolkien schoolers, and even early in S1 production Tom Shippey left/was fired and Amazon paid a lot of people to shut up and cover things up.

There is nothing creative mind behind it. And there is multiple moments in this show that goes against the lore and the nature of magic, one big example of that are the rings- the show named himself about it- having a different backstory and power. And they all hide themselves behind corporative activism to shield themselves of criticism, even though, the true they don't care, and bigger prove them that, then being made by Amazon of all companies.

Martin himself have been shading this adaption for a long time and exactly because they are taking the source material and painting the story as they want, ignoring everything Tolkien ever build up about it. Literally"Making them own".

Here is a situation where the pot calls the kettle black. Both suck, just in different degrees for different production reasons.

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Lemme guess, you probably hate rings of power too

??

Who doesn't lol

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I know that AO3 cannot ban AI generated texts, because even though all AI generated text is inherently infringing on a copyright - as all AI text engines are trained on stolen data - it is nearly impossible for any one person to satisfactorily prove that their data was stolen to train the specific engine used to create the text in question. Perhaps eventually wholly AI generated texts without any kind of human editing will eventually be banned under the copyright issue.

I know that AO3 even more cannot ban AI generated texts on a moral/philosophical basis because that would be a slippery slope to any kind of content moderation that we do not want on AO3.

But as a (fanfic) author and avid (fanfic) reader, it just saddens me to see this.

As a reader, I wonder why I should bother reading a text that nobody bothered to write. I wonder why I should read a text that isn't based on passion and creativity. I wonder how I should expect humanity in machine generated characters.

As an author, this makes me wonder why I should bother writing a text, if others just press a button to generate one. I wonder if other readers have the same opinion as I do or if I'm in a minority. I wonder whether my works will be valued the same as AI generated text when mine include so much effort and hearts blood. I wonder if readers actually value this effort.