vickorydickorydock

[vickorydickorydock]

Far be it from me to tell other people how to write their fanfictions so take it with a grain of salt, but I can’t help feeling a tad puzzled at all the first series rewrites I’ve come across that remove Ravenpaw as Tigerclaw’s apprentice

I feel like it so often stems from “this is a logic error because a sensible leader would have given someone like Ravenpaw a more patient and gentle mentor”, but well. Bluestar is a cat who grew up in a society with a mentor figure who essentially told her “your emotional problems are becoming a burden you need to buck up and Just Get Over It Already if you want to be a good warrior for your clan” and taking that advice is essentially what allowed her to become Sunstar’s deputy. why WOULDN’T someone like that internalize the message of “you’ve got to just tough your way out of your struggles, this is definitely the best and healthiest way to go forward, I mean just look at me”? of course she gave Ravenpaw to Tigerclaw to “toughen him up”. Sometimes even “wise” characters have flaws in their logic, it’s not an inconsistency imo. The fact she’s internalized this mindset probably plays a role in her ultimate emotional break.

 And I think it lends itself well to showing how at this point in the story, if you are following the outline of canon at all, it’s essential that Bluestar really trusts Tigerclaw and sees him as a good warrior who is maybe a bit harsh but ultimately cares for the wellbeing of his clanmates and would be a strong mentor for any cat.

But more so, the fact that Ravenpaw is Tigerclaw’s apprentice is what makes that whole plot point between them really impactful imo. Tigerclaw is the only authority figure Ravenpaw is always around, the fact he is his mentor means he can’t escape from him without looking suspicious. There’s something uniquely scary about the cat who is supposed to be responsible for protecting you being your biggest threat. Thus he feels all the more trapped and helpless. If you give Ravenpaw to a different mentor, then that other adult becomes an easy escape from Tigerclaw. Why would Firepaw and Graypaw feel as strong a need to go behind all the adults backs to help him? How could Tigerclaw so easily spread rumors about his apprentice being a traitor if he had a different mentor who would obviously know him better then Tigerclaw? I just think it takes a lot of the punch away from Ravenpaw and Tigerclaw’s conflict.

Again there’s a million different ways you can retell a story and a million different little things that can change to make one way fit better then another so don’t take this too seriously if you have a good reason. Just something to consider. Sometimes I think people are too eager to make characters behave 100% logically to the point they risk removing the conflict from the story

[vickorydickorydock]

Hi!

I read your rewrite from start to finish a few weeks ago, and kept forgetting to give you the compliments due to such great work! You tied up so many loose ends so wonderfully (especially Shadowclan! And Tall's actions at that climax really set up his future leadership beautifully), and your depiction of abuse was so astute and raw it really stuck with me. I love how fleshed out Windclan is, from politics to relationships (platonic and not) and anything in between. I recommended this to a friend frustrated with the latest book release, I hope they enjoy it as much as I did! <3

One tiny tidbit that's stayed in mind - if I recall (can't go back and check right now oop), Talltail was given the nane Tallkit with the specific understanding he would likely be named Talltail as a Warrior, with this being an old tradition. Are any other cats named similarly, or similar traditions in other Clans? It's a really cool idea and justification for some of the weirder canon names (who names a mostly-white kitten with black toes Blackkit unless it's definitely being named Blackfoot later?), and if it's alright with you I'd love to borrow the idea for my own writing! <3

Thank you!! I'm very glad you enjoyed reading!

For starters, yes you are definitely free to take inspiration from the idea that these predetermined prefix/suffix combos come from an old tradition, but I admit I only did it with a fairly negative reasoning in mind--that being since the suffix is the part of the name a cat typically earns themselves based on their own skills/personality/merits, Sandstone choosing a name that would predetermine the suffix was just another extension of him projecting his own ideals onto his kit at the expense of Talltail’s individuality, etc... I’ve actually never been a fan of names like this where the prefix is clearly predetermining the suffix (such as with Blackfoot, like you mentioned). I always felt it was really unfair to the apprentice to take away their opportunity to earn their own name. Talltail is the only cat in the allegiances with a name like this, as in my world this style of naming has fallen out of favor for that reason. With the exception I suppose of Clawface and Brokentail, but that’s a slightly different circumstance, although it stems from the same tradition. Injury-related names are chosen by the cat themselves upon reaching warriorhood rather then chosen for them by parents, hence why those characters have normal names, Buzzardpaw and Darkpaw, while apprentices. They at least had an opportunity to earn a normal name.

For where the tradition started across the clans, I hope you don't mind I'm taking this ask as an excuse to ramble a little about how I imagined the naming system origins because it's something I have fun thinking about! I never fully worked out every detail but I have had the rough shape of it floating around my head for a while

So, I don't envision the old style of names as a WindClan specific tradition, but a relic from the early early days of the clans, before they were officially clans as we know them, and were only just starting to organize themselves into small groups. I think the two-part naming style first began as nicknames, and were pretty much always referencing some literal visual aspect of the cat for a couple reasons:

1: these were rough times where no one had agreed upon codes, little medical training, and there were a lot of desperate cats with a kill-or-be-killed mindset. Ironically, many started referring to each other by blunt simplistic nicknames to avoid growing too personal with cats who you could reasonably expect to be dead any day, to spare themselves grief. You'd know a handful of cats by their scent and appearance and had short-lived tentative alliances with them. It was a courtesy then to not ask for real names. If you needed to address someone, or more likely if you needed to warn your allies about a potential dangerous cat who hunted nearby, it was better to just refer to them as “the white cat with the black tail” or “the pale cat with the dark stripes” (eventually short handed to things like “Black Tailed” and “Dark Striped” for simplicity.)

2: This reason is a little more silly but everyone is a former loner who isn't used to having to keep track of so many neighbors, and no one can remember all these new names, so it helps if their name is a literal visual part of them.

but mostly, I think the reason these names stuck around and became important is when they turned into something of a status symbol. You didn't choose the name yourself, it was made up by someone (often your enemies actually) and passed around by others, and that would only happen if you made yourself notable. like “having a visual-signifier nickname like this is a sign that you’ve become a cat that allies and rivals alike need to remember on sight, for their own sake” and you know, that's a very attractive concept to a bunch of cats who pride themselves on being tough. Battle scar nicknames were very common, as you can imagine, and were probably the most desirable as it made a cat look battle-hardened (those sorts of names are the most common way for old traditional names to carry on in modern day.) Thus what started as simple unofficial nicknames for the sake of easier communication eventually carried this...sort of romanticized sentiment with them. The better hunter/fighter you are, the more cats will have to take note of you and pass a name along to warn about you. The worst thing to be was a cat of so little consequence that nobody ever had cause to recognize you, you were effectively invisible, and that meant you probably weren't very impressive and no one would ally with you. These cats all desperately wanted to be remembered (a sentiment that persists in clan culture today what with how StarClan works, running mostly on the power of remembrance) if only so they could justify that all the suffering they were going through with trying to survive wasn’t for nothing. Thus being “named” by your peers, assuring you were recognized by appearance, was like...demanding that your face be remembered in the world, even if it wasn’t for good reasons. Eventually these simple nicknames became more important to the cats in the forest then their birth names (provided they had birth names in the first place. If they did, no one remembered them because nobody shared them)

When the clans officially formed and everyone started promising to kill each other less and value the lives of every cat in their group, the tradition was more cemented. The association of “this sort of name=importance” was firm in everyone’s mind, and so the leaders made sure that all their members had a nickname, as a symbol that they were all important and remembered already by merit of being part of a clan, and their names(/worth) shouldn’t be determined by their rivals. For a while those given nicknames may have been secondary names alongside a birth name, sort of like a last name (So, if Firestar had come into a clan in those times he probably would have been called something like "Rusty Flame-Furred"). At some point I suppose the nicknames became the only names

When -kit and -paw later became a tradition to separate kittens apart, the prefix that the parents give carries the memory of this--a word they feel is fitting to describe their kit appearance-wise (even if in a more colorful or metaphorical way), and the suffix represents the skills/personality/etc you develop and become known for on your own terms. Of course, there aren’t any hard rules about naming so no one is forced to follow that exactly

As for why Sandstone decided to choose a name closer to a nickname a cat might have gotten in those early days, he may have wanted to make a quiet statement with it. It’s a very notable name because most cats today wouldn’t have one like that, so it draws attention. There’s probably some level of boomer-type sentiment like “back in those days cats had to prove they were tough and could survive long enough to become a threat before they were deigned worthy of any name, therefore those types of names were better.” Maybe he thinks the abstract and metaphorical suffixes that are becoming more popular in the clans now defeats the purpose of why they had these names in the first place-- so they could be easily remembered by others, and more importantly by enemies. Or perhaps he just hated the idea of Heatherstar having any say in what his sons name might be so he thought it was better for him to determine one rather then her.

[vickorydickorydock]

Violet and Laurel for the flower ask game? (I know you're already rewriting tallstar's revenge but I'm curious what other changes you'd make!)

Violet: What do you think is the worst trope in the series?

Does the way they write mothers in general count as a trope? also female love interests? Trying to read DotC recently made it that much more grating to me. It's the fact that in warriors 'mom' becomes a character personality in itself, sometimes permanently, rather then a role that a character temporarily takes.

Also the tendency for romances to only be developed from the males POV, while the female characters seem to just fall for someone they didn't like at all before just....randomly? Because it's more convenient for the guy in the relationship to get the girl by then? the guy does one (1) nice thing for them and that one grand act is the crux of their relationship, and not how their actual personalities mesh?? Pebbleshine/Hawking was an especially truly awful example of that. And bristleroot, and firesand (sorry but its true), I could probably come up with a lot more if given the time. idk if that is a trope exactly either but boy is it insufferable. The Erin's are bad at writing romance. Their best romances and subsequent parental/family dynamics that result from it are still only tolerable at their best because they never explore the characters, they just dull them down to fit them into the same 3 stock personalities for doting mates/parental figures and I dread every time a character gets into a relationship because it usually heralds the death of their individuality and notable characteristics

Laurel: If you could write the books, what changes would you make?

There is too many different answers to this to get into them all lmao, a very big one that I think most people agree with is the function of StarClan. Making them too physical and present just presents so many problems with absolutely no rules in the world building for how they work and what they can/can't do. If contacting the dead is this easy, and the answer for what happens after you die is so unquestionably obvious, it takes a LOT of the weight and meaning away from a character dying imo. It also takes all the mystery away from StarClan. If StarClan has no rules or restrictions or over-reigning deities or anything, they are just cats no different then when they were alive but now more sparkly, what stops them from coming down and ruining every mystery in the plot? Why would a recently dead cat not be desperately trying to contact their loved ones all the time? What reason do they have for being vague about prophecies? Why didn't Redtail come tell Bluestar the truth about what happened to him when she came to the moonstone? StarClan does so much meddling, there's nothing clear in place explaining why he couldn't do that, we're just supposed to buy that every cat that dies are all silently going by the honor system to be cryptic and distant for no reason. And in-world, it truly is for no reason b/c there are no stated greater powers or laws actually preventing them from doing these things. That's ridiculous and I don't buy it. It results in every StarClan cat feeling frustratingly ooc. It's a terrible way to build an afterlife.

I also just typed up a long incomprehensible rambling essay about how much I hate the concept of DotC, but it was too messy so I don't think I'll talk about it here. Long story short, I preferred the founding of the clans draped in mystery, I preferred the founders as mysterious near-mythological figures, and I preferred feeling like the clans were a rich ancient culture rather then less then a century old. I would not write a prequel series about the founding of the clans at all, I think that was a bad idea. That's the sort of thing I would only talk about in nursery stories and passed down legends.

[vickorydickorydock]

thinking about Longtail and how badly I wish that character had been like...idk, More relevant.

I think a million people have probably said something like this already but his fight scene with Rusty is so iconic morally dubious as it may be on Bluestar's part that I can't believe that character wasn't slated to become more than a background semi-supportive warrior in firestar's life...why didn't he have a deputy arc!! or just a bigger role in Fireheart's core group, y'know after his first friend group turned out to be Shit.

I think we could have used a more main-cast character with personal emotional ties to Tigerclaw-Darkstripe for when they descended into villainy. Maybe Longtail was still on the fence about them until Swiftpaw got eaten by Tigerstar's dogs. I wish for that angst and anger and betrayal more front and center

[vickorydickorydock]

Physically a Leo, spiritually a Mikey.

-> Commissions || My Kofi || Tip Jar :) <-

I want to reiterate the fact I think that Rise Leo and 2003 Mikey are eerily similar in a lot of ways. To those who write Leo as all silent and a shell of himself after krang- I respect you but here me out: he still is a flamboyant king with Issues ™️ and very much in denial/uses humor as a coping mechanism…kind of like 2003 Mikey, right?

(Sorry for the sketch lines and untidiness overall! I don’t have much time rn to do proper art 😓)

[vickorydickorydock]

The Misogyny of It All

So a lot of Della Duck Discourse is rehashed all the time, points are made again and again, but one thing that I almost never see people defend -and conversely, see people attack all the time- is The Line.

You know what I'm talking about. The Line from Glomtales.

"Your plans, your schemes, they only lead to bad things for your family. If you want to be a part of this family, you've gotta stop."

That one.

Now, what exactly Della was trying to get across with that line is a whole other can of worms that deserves its own post (basically she -and also the writers- horribly failed her Speech check).

What we're going over here is how that mimics a certain line from the last season, said by a parental figure to a child, that gets so much less flack. That, in fact, often gets paraded around as 'an interesting twist on a character.'

"You are not family!"

I have never seen people attack this line with the same amount of vitriol as they attack Della's, which is funny when they're the exact same line.

Actually, not even that- Scrooge's is worse.

It's more direct, it's literally yelled at Webby, it doesn't even attempt to address the issue Scrooge had (Webby blaming him for what happened to Della) and instead just straight-up attacks her as a person.

Now, to be fully honest- I like this line! I do genuinely think it's an interesting route for Scrooge to take, and is quite realistic to the grumpy old bastard. It's just funny that nobody ever comes to Webby's defense the same way they do for Louie.

Because the thing is- between Webby and Louie, one of these two has genuine, canonical issues with feeling like they're not a part of the family, like they're an outsider amongst those they love the most, like they don't belong.

And it's not Louie.

It is a consistent part of Webby's characterization that she feels like she doesn't belong. This gets touched on in all three seasons (and honestly, it could be argued that it gets worse after this moment).

Conversely, that just is not a part of Louie's canonical characterization. Even in the first episode of season 2, the one where Louie gets the closest to an 'I don't belong in this family' moment, it's less 'I don't belong here' and more 'fuck me I am terrible at adventuring'. And! It gets resolved in that episode!

(Of course, there is absolutely something to be said for how it's resolved- specifically by Scrooge encouraging him to be a scheming little bastard, which then thusly becomes the thing that threatens his family the most. Which would, logically, be a pretty big blow to his self-esteem. This isn't what I'm here to discuss right now but it is genuinely interesting.)

Louie never really shows an issue with feeling like he doesn't belong in his family. He shows a disconnect with his family at times, but in canon that never really evolves into a full-blown feeling of displacement. It does get close in Glomtales, but never quite reaches it.

So it's 'interesting' (read: not interesting) that Scrooge's fuckup here gets brushed away pretty easily. A lot of the time the line just straight-up isn't addressed, and when it is, often times it's about how "Oh he apologized to Webby offscreen, obviously."

Which.

Not he did not.

I mean, let me be clear: I don't mind it when that's the answer. It works for me to just brush it away if it's not meant to be the focus...

But Scrooge almost certainly didn't apologize for it.

As 'New Gods on the Block!' Showed us, Scrooge is downright awful at realizing when his actions have hurt people.

More likely than not, Scrooge would just assume that everything is fine and would avoid bringing it up at all costs because he'd feel awkward about it. Because he is, very importantly, not good at talking about things he doesn't want to talk about.

So why is it that Louie is always the one feeling like he doesn't belong? Why is it Della who is always a terrible parent for what she's said? Why are Webby's feelings of disconnect never really given the same gravity as Louie's? Why is Scrooge's blunder let off the hook super easily?

It just feels silly to me.

And, well.

Kinda like the fact that, since Scrooge is a guy and Webby's a girl, and Della is a woman and Louie's a boy, has something to do with it.

I'll happily give the benefit of the doubt and assume it's not deliberate, but quite frankly it is a double standard.

I think that people would be less upset with the Della Duck Discourse if Scrooge was held in a similarly critical position over what he's said and done. If it was acknowledged that Della isn't uniquely awful in what she says and does, and that a lot of the others have fucked up in extremely similar ways.

(I mean for fuck's sake, everybody goes on and on about how Della left her kids for ten years -which, for the record, wasn't what she wanted to do- but nobody ever criticizes Donald for taking the kids away from their family and never talking to them about Della- which is something he actively and deliberately chose to do)

TL;DR: The fact that Della gets intensely criticized for what she's said and done, but Donald and Scrooge are conversely celebrated as 'interesting' and 'complex' for what they've said and done, even when it brings harm to the kids, is a blatant double-standard. And if you don't think that this double-standard is bad or wrong for existing (or even that it Doesn't Actually Exist), instead of immediately claiming that it's a non-issue, maybe try to look inward and figure out why you really think that is.

[vickorydickorydock]

practicing drawing the actual turtles, here's ExtendedStayAU Don while still in the SAINW universe :D

[vickorydickorydock]

The most hedonistic turtle snacking

[vickorydickorydock]

I’m actually glad that that idea for Future Don’s death being revealed never made it into Sainw. It’s horrifying of course, but his disappearance is so much more unsettling, scary, and sad for them to just never know what happened to him. 

[vickorydickorydock]

Keeping company for the bedridden.

I imagine in the first couple weeks or so when Leo is too tired to do anything more than sleep, he welcomes the safety and comfort. Once he becomes more coherent, the moping and self-isolation start >_>

[vickorydickorydock]

Bad Future 2012 Don! And what happened to Bad Future 03Don… yikes

The last image is of a SAINW draft that never made it to the episode.

[vickorydickorydock]

Drew this for a friend so here's an '03 Raph for your dash

[vickorydickorydock]

Husbands

[vickorydickorydock]

So are we not gonna acknowledge that there's a deleted scene where the turtles break into Bishop's base seemingly just to steal his vanilla egg creams?

[vickorydickorydock]

2003 tmnt stuff 🩷

[vickorydickorydock]

How to handle seeing things you don't like on ao3:

Have you come across something too disturbing for you to handle on ao3? Like maybe somebody having sex in a position that isnt missionary? 😱 shocking, I know. Did someone maybe engage in mild bdsm? The absolute horror! Did two aged up characters do more than a kiss on the cheek??? The utter depravity. Well do I have a solution for you! It's an easy two step process. Step one is to find the back button. If you find yourself in a mildly uncomfortable position while reading a fanfic, you have the power to stop ❌ press the back button 🔙 and find a new fic that doesnt have such scary concepts 🔞. If you arent sure how to find it, here's what the back button looks like on my mobile browser:

It may be difficult for you to find, but I believe in you!

Step 2 is a little harder because I know you're nosy and think you know what's best for every person on the planet. But I still believe in you! You can do it! You can learn to mind your own damn business and walk away! If you see something you don't like, it's literally not your problem. Let me give you a personal example: there are people out there who still like the show breaking bad, which I found completely unwatchable. But you know what? It's none of my damn business, it's literally not my problem! I have learned that not every piece if media is made for every person, and that's not only ok, but a good thing! You too can learn to mind your own damn business and move on with your life. I promise it's not as hard as it sounds

[vickorydickorydock]

mikey doodles the silly also im obsessed with bows rn