#why indeed doesnt shiv roy simply leave her dad

[lewyn-martell]

idk if anyone caught it but after logan yelled at shiv she went over to tom and he hugged her and her eyes were definitely shiny and she was doing this kind of pursed lips frown that you do when your throat is tight and you're on the verge of tears. it was so so sad and people are insane to think that just because Logan occasionally expresses (condescending) affection for her he doesn't emotionally and verbally abuse her too. she's scared of him too. and i've also seen a lot of people saying 'men aren't allowed to express their feelings' and i'm like one, are you literally delusional kendall is extremely emotionally volatile and two, you think women are? you think women in business are 'allowed' to be outwardly emotional? like are you kidding? shiv regulates her emotions the best out of the family by far, because she's had to in her career, and still gets called over-emotional. literally makes me so mad and i know it makes shiv mad too i've felt her simmering rage all season.

Oh, for sure. I think there's a line between a) understanding Shiv is a daddy's girl and how she got a closer level of affection and emotional favoritism from her dad while growing up and b) thinking she "got it easier" and was the least abused and "because of that she is entitled and easily hurt with small things" that people sometimes cross without realizing how unfair they're being. Abusive dynamics aren't simple math. We don't measure people's hurt or the overall negative impact by putting on a scale how much damage was inflicted upon them or how many bad experiences they had, and we especially don't make comparisons between different people to see who is the winner of the Abuse Games.

Of course, none of us can speak with any authority on what the past of the Roy kids was truly like, but we see the effects bleed into their adulthood and you'd think with so many people eager to say how much of a bad person she is, how allergic to emotions or desperate or afraid/unwilling to be vulnerable she is, or "Why doesn't she just leave/snap already/kill her dad/stay true to her principles? Why is she so dependent on her dad's approval and support? Why is she so eager to do more than she is capable? Why doesn't she feel safe being left out of the big decisions and shadowing the minions who have to babysit her the same way she watched her brother being played for years? Why is she just taking the abuse? Why isn't she doing what's best for herself already?"; you'd think that they would scratch their heads and realize "huh... something is not right and whole with her... Something that being a delusional rich person alone doesn't explain it... And it gets worse the closer to Logan she is...", but unfortunately we're doing vicious judgment first, analysis posts by amazing people who get tired of seeing that later... Baby steps.

I truly feel for Shiv because I understand how having a parent that blows hot and then cold with you can be extremely exhausting and demanding of your mental/emotional/psychological energy. Especially when getting that relationship just right all alone is all that's connecting you to their love. And we all know how connected love is to this particular job on the table for the Roy kids.

Logan poked and prodded and whined for her to "come on board" and Shiv now is completely alone in her struggles, with no experience, huffing and puffing and tumbling to not get eaten alive, surrounded by people who don't take her seriously even if she has relevant knowledge about something, and a father that pinky promised he would have her back because it was her time, but actually doesn't support her and only gives praise when she does exactly what he wants in the way he wants it while being careful to never overrule him or challenge his dominance in any way.

She's completely at mercy of the whims of her father in regards to her professional capabilities and input. Ever since she accepted and started fighting for the job, she must feel like her worthiness for affection and validation is constantly on trial, with how even more twisted the father-daughter relationship became because of the 85 billion dollar baby on the table. The supposed advantages of protection (which was incomplete and a double-edged sword) and the scraps of emotional availability that came with being dad's little girl completely vanished and that hurts a lot when at some point you thought you were going to keep getting it, even if at least a little bit.

Now she can never win no matter what she does, now what she gets is "of course (you being a woman) is a fucking minus" and disdain when she shows emotion or lets anyone see if they get to her and that ties with the second part of your message. I think it's absurd to say Shiv can have emotional outbursts and men can't - and the last episode explicitly showed her paying for it. I honestly can't even say which of the kids is the better one at controlling their emotions because they all can get a bit explosive, but I would say that her inability to allow herself and others to be vulnerable is definitely a symptom of being in this environment where showing your feelings is looked down upon. And the work culture, especially Waystar's, from the very top to the lowest bottom, is extremely sexist (and I wouldn't feel the need to write this out usually but I kid you not, I saw someone say Logan isn't really a misogynist today, and wow... no comment) and Shiv exists and is molded by that environment while making her own rich white woman choices about dealing with it, just like her brothers are dealing with their "weak spots" in their privileged power hoarding way. But there seems to be something making expectations on Shiv harsher... Figures.