#what's their plan when they do cd. or 06. or heroes. or ANYTHING that involves the female sonic characters
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segasonic-popcorn-shop · 18 days ago
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just saw a group of people saying the reason amy and rouge aren't in movie 3 despite being vital to sa2's plot is because. the movie. isn't an sa2 adaptation. okay first off not a valid reason for the writers they should still be there. secondly uh. girlies do u know what an adaptation is
#'yeah this movie that loosely recaps sonic adventure 2's plot and features most of its characters isn't an adaptation of sonic adventure 2'#like HUH?????#their reasoning is that the 1st and 2nd movies weren't adapting anything and like.#ok movie 1 i get. that was setting up the wolrd and status quo. wasn't an adaptation of anything. that's valid#but?? movie 2 WAS an adaptation?? it just merged sonic 2 and sonic 3&k together but it WAS an adaptation of the genesis games#like. it was the story of how sonic met tails and knuckles. it features the chaos emeralds and angel island and super sonic#that. WAS an adaptation besties. whuh#loose adaptations are still fukcing adaptations!!!! they're still telling the same story!!!#like it or not sonic movie 3 IS taking most of its plot and characters and themes from sa2.#it's the story of shadow's creation. it has eggman waking him up and gun dealing w the consequences of what happened on the ark 50 years ag#it features gerald and maria and shadow's grief over losing her and sonic being dragged into this conflict. it's just sa2 again mate#and even if it WASN'T. why aren't amy and rouge there. it's not like you couldn't tell the movie if they were.#there's no fucking reason for them to be missing. they're some of the most important and interesting characters in the franchise#they SHOULD be there. they should be in the film#idc how much you like the scu stop defending the films when people bring up the misogyny in its writing. fuck#and like. amy and rouge ARE vital to sa2's plot. and they're definitely vital to other games they'll probably adapt so.#what's their plan when they do cd. or 06. or heroes. or ANYTHING that involves the female sonic characters#they can't do cd or introduce metal and NOT do amy. they couldn't do heroes and not do rouge. they couldn't do 06 without blaze. etc#i'm gonna fucking lose my MIND i swear to god. fuck these films man#.txt files
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sonicfanj · 5 years ago
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A little while back I made a comment in regard to Sonic’s character not being understood and pointed out that he has the potential to be a “selfish hero”. Not surprisingly I was asked about what I meant so I’m going to tray and explain.
Before beginning though, I should note that I view Sonic as an adventurer first, and not a hero like most of his fans do. This creates completely different expectations out of his character and results in me seeing things very differently from others. For example, I disagree with the notion that Sonic lives to stop Eggman. To me, it’s simply something that happens and we see so much of it because those are the stories of his adventures that we are shown most commonly (I think Eggman has only missed one game that Sonic has been in so that kind of says something).
So, for my explanation I am going to try to stick to as few examples as possible, but I get a little long winded so apologies in advance.
To begin, let’s look at Sonic’s motivation to be a hero. Well, simply put he has none. That may seem a little short-sighted, especially in light of Sonic’s heroics, but the thing is, Sonic does not present himself as wanting to be a hero. If you ask Yuji Naka, Sonic’s favorite thing to do is run, and his running is spoiled if he doesn’t get a full eight hours of sleep. If you consider this Sonic’s constant lazing around makes sense as he’s trying to put himself in a mood to enjoy what he loves best. But for as hard as it seems for Sonic to get a good night’s sleep, which supposedly also makes him irritable, he still loves to adventure. When describing Amy’s character Hoshino has stated that Sonic’s mind is always on the next adventure or challenge. This is important as it tells us that Sonic is not thinking about who to help next. He is thinking about himself. In other words, he is being selfish, or he adventures to enjoy himself and his running, not to help people like most of his fans believe.
Naturally this raises the question of why does Sonic help people. That is a very easy question to answer, but it also reflects a bit on Sonic’s nature and his selfishness some more. Out of the gate, we are told that Sonic has a strong sense of judgement and a big heart. And we know how compassionate Sonic is. In case anyone has forgotten, though he bashed the poor guy in the brain a few times over, Sonic calmed a raging God of Destruction and desired to console it so it could live in peace. It takes a big heart to do that and Sonic has it. But he is also said to have a short temper (though it is rarely demonstrated) and that he can’t stand injustice and dislikes tears. At this point I would hope that a clearer picture of Sonic’s selfishness as a hero is starting to become clear, but as I’m explaining my viewpoint I’ll continue.
Making what will feel like a sudden jump, Sonic helps people on his adventures because seeing or knowing that people are in trouble ruins his adventure for him. The moment he knows people are in trouble he can’t enjoy himself no matter how much sleep he got. His big heart and distaste for injustice spur him into action. He’s acting on his own emotions to bring himself back peace of mind. This is a horribly selfish thing to do, but we see him do it quite a fair bit, sometimes even putting himself before those he is aiming to help. Obviously, I need some examples to back these claims up, so I’ll go ahead and get started with Sonic CD.
Now, a lot of people do not know this, but Sonic did not go to Little Planet to save it. It kind of happens as it stands due again to Sonic’s short temper and reaction to things he dislikes and can’t stand. The whole reason he actually goes if I remember correctly is that he already knew the legends of it and wanted to both see it and see if he could actually time travel using his speed. When he arrived Eggman being there was a total shock to him, and seeing what the good doctor had wrought spurred him into action. In other words, he was there for himself, and saves Little Planet only because his moral compass and own feelings happen to align with what appears to be heroic. But roughly, Eggman ruined his plans and Sonic responded in kind. It’s almost petty his actions at Little Planet if not for how it is painted due to Eggman being the rather destructive villain. But CD is far from the only example.
In Sonic Adventure he gets involved because he is involved by Tails and Eggman. Stopping Chaos 0 is a matter of his evening run being ruined by the clash between Chaos and the Cops. He can’t leave the cops to be slaughtered and jumps in restoring his peace of mind. A selfish action. It isn’t much better with Tails either. With his peace of mind restored we next join Sonic chilling at the pool until Tails appears and ruins his nap. Though not Tails’ intentions, Sonic’s shrug tells us a great deal about how he feels about the situation before going off to make sure the fox is alright. If Tails came first he would not have delayed or even shrugged. He simply would have taken action. He also is later on disparaging of Knuckles, dismissive of Amy when she is trying to ask for help until he actually sees the danger, and gets wrapped up in the thrill of chasing Eggman rather than making sure Tails and Amy get away alright. Most of the game he puts himself first and displays irritation when he is needed to be heroic. It doesn’t really paint him as a hero. He isn’t much better in Sonic Adventure 2 either where he really drives home his preference for doing things his way. Then in Sonic Heroes he only gets involved because it seems like fun. Despite the danger, Sonic puts himself first. It isn’t until Shadow where Sonic is really painted as heroic straight up, but that game takes place through Shadow POV, and in relation to himself Shadow does see Sonic as rather heroic.
In 06 though Sonic goes right back to his selfishness. Yet another seemingly lost detail, even though it is repeated at the end of the game, Sonic goes to Soleanna to see the Sun Festival. It is literally his only reason for being there. If not for Eggman arriving he would have never interacted with Elise and would have been gone the next day. Yet Eggman attacks and Sonic gets involved. And seeing the mess that Elise is Sonic can’t have any peace of mind until she has some and shares a lot of his philosophies with her until she finally stops being mopey and has the strength and resolve to do what she needs to. Then, sure enough, even with the subtle hints that Sonic remembers what happened, he heads right on out once he knows everything is fine, including Elise. He made himself a big part of her life and then leaves because that is who he is and he can enjoy his running again knowing that everything is resolved.
When we get to Unleashed, we see a slightly different side to Sonic’s selfishness as he puts himself before his charge of the game; Chip. When Sonic meets Chip he blames himself for the latter’s memory loss and offers to help him restore it. Yet when he can’t resolve it and is informed of the larger mess at hand by Tails he heads right off to solve the problem. Now yes, he brings Chip along, but he has no basis on which to base Chip regaining his memories in his company. Yet he gladly exposes him to danger while thrill riding on his own adventure, where Chips memory coming back becomes insignificant to him. Chip simply becomes a friend on the adventure and Sonic mostly enjoys himself. Again he is being selfish.
Like 06 before it, Black Knight is a game where Sonic is heavily doing things his own way and for his own enjoyment. Most of that breaks later on when facing Merlina, a friend he has to save as much as her world, and of course the Knight Trials. The Knight Trials are one of the more interesting examples of Sonic’s selfish heroism as he has been tasked with saving the world but will not refuse the child in need. Worse, the Lady of Lake knew Sonic’s abilities when she put the time limit on him and the trials which would assure that Sonic would fail should he deviate at all. But Sonic has a big heart, and he hates tears, and here is this child crying due to the dragon. There is no way Sonic can have the peace of mind to focus on his quest to save the world while this child suffers and chooses the child over the world. Kind of funny that Amy gets chewed out by the fandom for this but Sonic clears his Knight Trials with flying colors for the same thing. But I digress. While it worked out for Sonic here, it could have been disastrous, but in his selfishness, he prioritized his feelings and went against what was requested of him. I may sound heartless here, but when faced with the choice of saving the few or the many most “heroes” seek a way to accomplish both, but Sonic chooses to satisfy his feelings instead. It is a selfish action on his part regardless of the outcome.
Beyond the games though you can also find Sonic being selfish in the OVA where talking him into going to Eggmanland is to stop Tails from worrying. He has no desire to go and outright refuses. It is only when someone he cares about is expressing genuine concern that Sonic is prompted to act. Even then he is visibly irritated by the whole affair the entire time. He had to go against what he desired to do, and it frankly agitates him, which implies a very selfish nature. When he does agree, it is to address something which does bother him, which is anything but heroic.
So, I’ll admit that some of my readings may seem excessively extrapolative, but as I addressed at the beginning of this explanation, I look at Sonic in a different light than most and this paints my view of his character. That Sonic’s selfishness is never really called into question tells me that most people at SEGA also don’t understand it, or as Sonic is supposed to represent everything cool about SEGA it highlighting a negative trait would be seen as unfavorable to say the least. Regardless, Sonic’s selfishness slips in and paints the character in a very unique light, but if you don’t fall for the trap of him being a hero but rather an adventurer who lives for himself first, than it starts to not be a surprise. Or at least, that’s my view on it.
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skull001 · 8 years ago
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Sometimes when I think about the roles of characters from the Sonic franchise, I wonder if there is something that really makes Tails worthy of being considered "Sonic's best friend" that does not factor neither the favoritism the character enjoys nor that it was something born out of designation.
A lot, if not most characters hardly have any real connection with Sonic that warrants them being considered "friends", let alone close ones.Pretty much everyone at best is either an occassional ally or just a known face save for a very few exceptions: Amy, Blaze and Chip. The last two while indeed forming an actual friendship, were ultimately short-lived because of how said characters were meant only for the story arcs they co-tarred, with Blaze having her duties on her dimension while Chip returns to a sleep that will last for thousands of years. The only character left by elimination is Amy, one of the oldest characters in the franchise.
Both Tails and Amy get a different handling not just on their introductions, but also the way Sonic acts towards each of them. Tails in his debut was a character who out of gameplay convenience was already very capable and well received by Sonic, with his backstory of being a kid victim of bullying being something added to further make Sonic unable to reject him as it would come off as cruel. Amy on the other hand was an NPC that gets kidnapped as well as someone whom Sonic tries to keep a distance, acting much more like himself as there is no emotional element in Amy's character nor backstory to make Sonic feel bad nor guilty for running away at the end of CD.
After the reboot that came into effect with Sonic Adventure, Amy was finally given more focus as well as being allowed to show what her character is and can do, while Tails already had an advantage due to the Genesis/Megadrive games. Both characters see some growth, with Amy being the one who IMO gets the 2nd best story right after E-102 Gamma. I'd say Tails gets 3rd place because while some of his exploits sound impressive, such as facing Eggman alone and saving Station Square, I feel that he got the "bigger" feats more because he's Tails, the character from Sonic 2 than anything else, on top of half of his story being redundsnt as it only gets interesting once he gets separated from Sonic. With Amy, things are kept in a smaller scale but I however think that her achievements are more meaningful as she gets involved out of necessity, having for the first time to not rely on her hero, helping one of Eggman's minions turn to the good side, protecting a bird and reuniting it with it's family, standing up to her person she admires and loves to protect a friend (and viceversa depending on the character telling the events) and faces her pursuer when running away is no longer an option. This IMO is more impressive because before SA1, Amy was just the girl who gets kidnapped while Tails was already a hero, as well as taking into account that Amy never enjoyed the benefit of learning from Sonic like Tails did.
Then comes the next game, SA2. Here both Tails and Amy come to Sonic's aid when each of them hear the news of his capture by the military. Again, Tails gets plenty of benefits because of his playable role while Amy is not due to the (forced) inclusion of Knuckles, despite him hardly being connected nor contribute to the story. However, one has to consider that Amy not only was the first to arrive, infiltrating a top secret military prison, but also had the key card to Sonic's cell and achieved this without the need of fancy gadgets. Even in the end of the game, she is the one who approaches Sonic to check if he's OK.
In Heroes, while Tails spends most of his time by Sonic's side after he delivers a letter from Eggman in which he announces his plan to take over the world and challenges them to stop him, Amy is looking for him, feeling worried after a time of not having contact with him, one that increases after seeing in the newspaper what looks to be Sonic kidnapping Froggy and Chocola. Her motive is Sonic's well being and wanting to know what is going on (and if necessary to stop him from doing something bad) while for Tails it is the mission at hand. Sadly some of the game's dialogue can make it hard to tell the actual context, on top of some of the characterizations being off.
In 06, while Tails does his usual sidekick stuff, it is Amy who gets to shine a bit more since not only does she stop Silver (character who she befriends prior to this event) from killing Sonic, but again when it's time to collect the Chaos Emeralds to resurrect him, Amy's the first to step up. However what I feel that really makes Amy take the lead is how she is willing to sacrifice her happiness, the illusion of being the one who gets Sonic's first kiss to let Elise perform the ritual. While there is no doubt that both Tails and Amy would be willing to put their lives at risk for Sonic, Amy's the one who goes the extra mile, not caring if Sonic never reciprocated her feeling, nor will, as long as he is OK.
In Unleashed, while again Tails is focused on the mission, Amy is the character who is always standing outside of whetever professor Pickles installs himself, waiting for Sonic's return, welcoming him back, showing support, having casual conversations, etc (she even organizes a “welcome back” party). And even if her role is a minor one, when everything seems lost and people start losing their faith, it is Amy who reasures them that Sonic would never let things end badly for them, something that should be kept in mind if a certain rumor from Forces related to Tails turns out to be truth. Even if she does not spend as much time with Sonic as Tails does, nor receives as much attention, Amy's loyalty is probably the most outstanding between her and Tails. Sure, current games have sidelined Amy (or completely omit her presence) to focus more on Tails and "fix" what is supposed to be THE main relation of friendship in the franchise... and yet without having ever enjoyed a similar backing or privilege from Sonic Team, I think Amy is the better friend because her selfless desire to do what is best for Sonic, one that has never been conditioned to Sonic reciprocating her, comes as much more sincere. Amy might never get an "I could have never done it without you" type of thanks from Sonic like the ones he gives to Tails, nor does she needs them because she's the friend that will always be there for him no matter what, the one whose heart is strong to always remain positive and never give up on her hero and whose only reward is to see him enjoy his love for freedom and adventure.
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