#we have cringefail vox we need some more cringefail alastor

[cupidsncheerios]

i think during one of vox's many upgrades he probably added instant voogle translate into his hearing for maximum pr capability, but alastor never found out.

so like. they're arguing during an overlord meeting and vox hears "pourquoi suis-je amoureux d'un stupide téléviseur comme toi?"

he then just stares at alastor for an hour trying to figure out if he's being pranked (al is runs away immediately when he realizes that vox is making the 'i understand french' face)

[alice-after-dark]

okay wait ive got 2:

1) when people portray vox as a cringefail loserboy whos whipped to heaven and back for either al or val

2) when people act like r*dioapple has more foundation in canon than any other alastor ship

Hello friend!!!

Okay, hard agree on both fronts.

(putting under a cut cause this got long oops)

On the first one, fucking THIS. Vox is flamboyant and theatrical and he definitely has a temper, but everyone seems to forget that he is LITERALLY introduced to us as a manipulator of the masses. Like I adore the press conference scene. This is who Vox is to the rest of Hell. People take him very seriously. When the accelerated extermination is announced, people rush to get his opinion. Fuck, they don't even do that to Charlie, the literal Princess of Hell! Vox has his moments sure, but defining him by the occasional cringe is like defining Charlie by that one instance where she was having her conspiracy board red string moment and losing her damned mind trying to figure out what to do to get her plan to work. That's not who the character is at their core. And Vox is most certainly not whipped. There may have been a time in his life where he was for Alastor, but even if that was the case, that time is long dead. Literally the moment he finds out Alastor is back, he launches an attack. That's not whipped and I don't think he really ever could be. Whatever happened between them clearly caused him a good amount of pain and even if things get better between them, I don't think they'll ever have what they once did. At least not right away. As for Valentino, it's called damage control, not being whipped.

On the second one, not gonna lie, I don't pay all that much attention to R*dioApple (censoring out of courtesy because that's how the ask was sent) so I've never seen this claim, but I totally get why that would be frustrating and kinda bs. I may be a ship-what-you-want-to-ship kind of person, but uh...yeah it's made pretty clear at every opportunity that Alastor and Lucifer don't like each other, so to claim they have the strongest foundation in canon as a ship is a little...yeah, no. Like, I get it, I'm a RadioStatic shipper and there is definitely problems between Vox and Alastor, but we know that they have some kind of history and that they, at minimum, were friends (referencing the photo and Alastor's "old pal" comment"). We know canonically that Lucifer and Alastor met for the first time canonically in episode 5 and Alastor instantly felt threatened and went on the attack. That's not a solid foundation for canon.

Again, if you like R*dioApple , THAT'S TOTALLY FINE! YOU DO YOU! It's not my cup of tea, but that doesn't matter! If you like it, go forth and enjoy! But be realistic. There is nothing wrong with liking something that doesn't have a strong canon basis and you don't need to force one to ship something. Fuck, I do it all the time! My favorite ship in this fandom also currently hate each other! And I love me some good ol' they've-never-even-met-but-fuck-they-would-be-so-interesting. Shipping something purely because you enjoy the potential dynamic is totally legit!

[gabrielsbubblegumbitch]

I just wanted to say that I am really envious of the way you write the Vees. As someone who struggles with making characters woobiefying and with characterization in general, I appreciate how you can write these characters perfectly that the show didn’t have time to portray. I didn’t have a specific request, but now I was wondering if you could give me some advice on how to analyze and write a character, even if you have a personal bias towards them?

Awww thank you so much ❤️ I don't have like any degree in literature or anything that would give me credibility in giving writing advice, usually I just go with the flow. But I'll do my best!

Imo the most fundamental thing is the way you think about characters. In fandom spaces, we very often see them as "people we like" - hence all the discourses like in Valentino's case "if you like him it means you are a bad person". I think that woobification is influenced by this cognitive dissonance caused by liking characters that should be unlikeable. For me the way out of it was giving up "characters as people" mindset and changing it for "characters as tools". Bacause that's what they are - tools you use to build your narrative. When I say I love Valentino I don't mean I would shake his hand - I mean he's my favourite toy I can do multiple things with. And it's his flaws that make him so much fun. Because outside of the comedy genre, narrative cannot exist without conflict. The more flaws a character has, the more conflict it causes. That's why villains are such a powerful driving force for stories (here are some great essays about it: 1, 2). Put any character in the room with Val and you have an interesting bit not only because of the usual character differences that could happen between eg. Vaggie and Husk but also because stakes suddenly become high. What will he do? Will he hurt them? We saw what he's capable of. Will he be nice? Man, that's even worse because it means he has his own motive to be nice. What might it be? That's what keeps the audience engaged with your writing. Extra points if you give him some human weaknesses or conflicting desires. When it comes to characterization, nuance is the key. That's why I love VoxVal so much - two characters that are absolutely awful but they are fiercely in love. How could Valentino be capable of simply caring about someone but himself? What kind of human is buried underneath all this evil? So much to unpack here. Nothing I'd like to experience but everything I'd like to see from a safe distance. Consider: would you even like the Vees so much in the beginning if they were just other guests at the hotel? In the show, neither of them has a single redeemable quality. And yet, here we are.

When it comes to writing characteristics it's also important to watch characters from different perspectives - that helps with giving them nuance. Let's take Vox. People seem to like and respect him, he's obviously an influential figure (he has a lot of social power). But from Alastor's perspective, he's just a pathetic little attention-seeking looser (he has a fragile ego and lowe self-esteem). Yet his assistant seemed to be scared shitless while talking to him (he had done things that made people from his closer look aware that he's dangerous). Angel knows he watches his abuse and hangs out with Valentino (at best he's indifferent to other's suffering, at worst he enjoys it). Carmilla doesn't respect him but they are on terms good enough, Vox wants to do business with her (he's a competent business partner). For the rest of Vees he's smart enough to listen to him but at the same time he's their cringefail naurospicy bestie. Add all of those perspectives together and you have yourself a multidimensional character that can interact with other elements of the narrative in vastly different ways. Also, from that point you can build up, asking yourself other questions "What would they think/do/say?".

Also, the last thing: every character needs a clear goal that influences all their decision. Choose it and always keep it in mind. Bonus points: a character has two main goals that are contradictory. When I write Vox he has two goal: power and adoration. He always has to choose which one is more important to him because while he has measures to achieve great power, some things that he would want to do are socially undesirable. In Valentino's case: hedonistic pleasure and immediate gratification vs love for Vox that demands sacrifices and compromises.

So anyway I hope that will be helpful to you <3 And don't be too hard on yourself when it comes to writing, not everything must be Game of Thrones. Especially in fandom spaces, sometimes we all want to indulge in some simple fluff or crack.