#this kinda bombed on Reddit and I was really disappointed because this might be one of my favorite ideas for whisper

[bowserbowser29]

The Guardian Angel

[hopevalley]

@kvanbooven said:  I agree with you on this. I love Nathan character but from this episode until the triangle is resolved I feel like I might not. I was excited with the direction they were going that even tho she shut him down when he declared his feelings, he was still going to try to “pursue” her cuz he feels she felt the same way and if they both didn’t try, they would both be cheated. But ever since that, I was afraid with how they were going to do it. I was all for Nathan still trying be friends and civil with Elizabeth after the awkward period was over, and then his feelings would have subtly shown through during that time to show the audience and Elizabeth that he does still care for her and is there when she’s ready in stead of aggressively pursuing her when she’s with someone else, which is what he’s doing now which kinda rubs me the wrong way. Like yes I understand he needs to be more forward than he was in S6 and s7 but it’s just weird that he’s being that aggressive and directly told Lucas that he’s going to steal Elizabeth from him. He actually has been pretty laid back up until this episode and purposefully tried to move on and avoid her but looking at next episode it looks like aggressive Nathan is still there. I would be all for this if Elizabeth hasn’t been dating Lucas this whole time, but because she is, it’s weird. I was afraid this was going to happen, that to show that he’s still interested they have to make him super aggressive even tho she’s with Lucas and she told him no. I do understand it’s probably to show he has flaws and that not every character is perfect, especially in this situation, but ehh I think there might have been a better way to do this exact storyline with the same plots and character development and feelings and flaws showing with the outcome we are at now without going about it in the way they have. I’m not a writer so I don’t know how exactly, but still. Do love seeing flawed Nathan, just not the storyline I guess for me.

Thanks for the super long comment! Lots to unpack, here! :D

The biggest complaint about Nathan in the last two seasons was that he “wasn’t a real man” because he wasn’t very forward with his feelings or in pursuing Elizabeth. I didn’t see that here on Tumblr but it was a pretty big opinion on Reddit and Instagram, and sometimes Twitter. This could be in part an answer to that perceived issue, though for what it’s worth I liked Nathan’s laid-back attitude because it meant he wasn’t pressuring anyone, and that’s the kind of story I wanted to see explored with him. Elizabeth had the sweeping romance with Jack already, she was wooed with dances and candlelit dinners. I am still of the opinion that with Nathan it needs to feel different. Lucas brought the grand romantic gestures and Nathan brought the little things. So I didn’t really feel that Nathan’s behavior in S6 and S7 was to be criticized. It felt to me as if it was a deliberate choice to set him apart from Jack and from Lucas, and let him be his own person.

Also, Elizabeth REALLY needed some space, and by not being too forward with his thoughts/feelings, Nathan was giving her that. I enjoyed it.

In this season, I didn’t mind him deciding to take a chance and declare his feelings more directly. It happened once, it was done privately, we know he cares about her... Great! Elizabeth chose not to pursue it, and in fact made it clear by leaving that scene, by saying “I can’t,” and by courting Lucas...that she is not interested in a relationship with Nathan.

Like you, I expected him to fade into the background a bit and struggle with getting over her while trying to remain friendly and approachable until she was Ready (if we dare to assume that Nathan will be her choice). I’d have liked that. It’s well within his characterization as it’s been established.

But then we got beat after beat of Nathan being a jerk. He’s a pain in the ass to Bill during the whole inquiry, he tells Allie one thing and does another, and then he had a conversation with himself instead of listening to Carson (which was rude) where he determined that Elizabeth just needed to get to know him better (?????) and that he wasn’t going to give up on her!

That rubbed me the wrong way because getting to his conclusion was almost nonsensical. If his reasoning was “she has feelings for me, she’s just afraid of them because of what happened to Jack” why didn’t the conversation just...go that way? Instead it just didn’t make much sense. We were all already assuming it anyway (as indicated by her “I can’t/lose you the way I lost Jack” conversation with Nathan).

But. Then. He had to go and drop the bomb that Jack was sent on the mission that ultimately killed him because Nathan disobeyed Hargraves’ orders and acted on his own and had to be officially disciplined for it.

So... he knows she’s afraid to love him because she’s afraid of losing him LIKE SHE LOST JACK. And he knows that Jack died because he replaced him on that mission. In theory this should make a person spiral out of guilt but it’s like Nathan doesn’t feel any guilt? Except he almost has to or he wouldn’t have kept it a secret for three years? Like, he KNOWS IT’S A BIG DEAL. And despite knowing all of this he still thinks he’s a worthwhile suitor?

WHERE DOES HE GET THIS CONFIDENCE? He hasn’t had even a scrap of it for two seasons and suddenly he’s the cockiest man in town!

I don’t think it’s great writing but I can’t imagine it’s bad on purpose. They probably just wanted to make sure we knew that Nathan had flaws, too. Except they mostly just. Made him kind of gross? 

With Nathan carrying that kind of knowledge all this time, I think all of the season needs to be rewritten to fix what they’ve done to Nathan. It’s okay for him to have flaws, but for all of his flaws to be giant red flags?? No thanks. I can’t imagine what they’ll do to make the relationship palatable if they end up still going with Nathan at the end. 

Luckily for me I don’t watch for these characters, but I can’t say I’m not disappointed. The writing up to this point wasn’t too bad. But I feel like they mixed two chemicals that have a toxic reaction when they come into contact with one another lol. IMO pursuing Elizabeth after she made it clear she didn’t want him was a cringey enough (and believable enough!) flaw. I think they should have had him harboring a smaller secret: that he found Jack’s body. It’s still upsetting that he would keep that from her, but it’s not upsetting in nearly the same way.

[vegathelich]

rant

I just watched the bomb with a good friend of mine, been seeing some stuff so I thought I’d throw my 2 cents in. Spoilers, obviously, for Steven Universe season 5 episodes 6-10. It’s super long btw, clocking in at 945 words. Also apparently the cut doesn't work on mobile.

Since I don’t immediately watch most things multiple times in a short amount of time because I love them, I’ve only seen the bomb once. Some things may be a bit off. This has no structure, by the way. Or order, really.

To start off, I really enjoyed it. Haven’t been to the subreddit (it and the warframe sub are the only reasons I still visit reddit with any regularity) or seen much discussion on here about it, but I have seen some.

The bomb hit kinda close to home, to be honest. I saw a lot of me in Peridot during her time in the bomb, an alarming amount. I knew I was a bit like her but… damn. How she handles emotional distress, not bringing important stuff up because it might upset someone, her general “fuck this fuck you this is bullshit” view on everything, the feeling that everything is pointless.

I really liked how Amethyst did her absolute best to comfort her friend (or something more? is my ship changing?). It seems that while she’s not quite there yet, she’s well on the road to recovering from her horrible self-image issues, and is at the point where she wants to help others through that (not what peridot’s problem was, I was thinking of that more in terms of her and Steven).

Why are there are people who think CONNIE was the wrong one in this situation? The first friend she’s ever had turns himself in for crimes he didn’t commit, breaking a mutual promise they had both agreed to and once again refusing to ask for help, when he could have brought Connie along to tackle this problem together, which probably wouldn’t have ended up with Lars dying. Yes, dying, even if he came back to life that doesn’t mean he didn’t get in a situation where his life was on the line and that line got cut short.

I mean, fucking hell. Even if Steven hadn’t fucked up that bad she still has every right to take as long as she needed to recover. Sometimes people need space away from those who hurt them. Greg knows this from either just being a smart guy or past experience, I know this from experience in both ends. Connie needed space, and she took it. There is nothing wrong with that. That’s fine. Healthy, even.

Quit villianizing someone who had their feelings severely hurt and trust broken.

I get the feeling Steven and Connie, while they just had their friendship (well it a bit more than that) sort of confirmed, are not done talking about this.

Lapis, though. Mmm. She doesn’t handle her trauma all that well, or maybe she does in choosing not to put herself in a situation where it could happen again. I don’t know. I shouldn’t be all that surprised she’s not exactly the best person to be in a relationship with, either. She seems like someone who puts her needs above all else, regardless of how that makes others feel. Taking the entire barn, for instance. She did something for her own happiness at the expense of Peridot’s. I don’t think she’s a “bitch” for what she did but she isn’t all that innocent either, in my eyes. I don’t really know what to think of her.

Garnet seemed off, especially for Gemcation. Perhaps Ruby and Sapphire disagree on how they feel about the whole ordeal, and are keeping it together (no pun intended) in order to give Steven a sense of normalcy.

In a strictly story- and plot-oriented way, I like that Pearl seems to be physically incapable of revealing certain things. She obviously wants to tell him what went down five thousand years ago, and probably would have sooner if she was able to. Maybe she only tried this time because of how distraught they thought Steven was about it? She knew she probably wouldn’t be able to but she tried anyways.

Greg got to be a dad which is always great to see (we also got a figure on how much money he has left, about 9 million, disproving those who thought he spent himself dry between the night of Mr. Greg and the boat), I really like that Ex-mayor Dewey realized he wasn’t all that great of a mayor and stepped down for Mayor Nanefau (dat misleading episode title though). Kevin got character development and it put to light a lot of his behavior, and it seems his “friends” only showed up because they didn’t feel like they could say no. Good variety of people at the party.

Sadie also got some development, she misses Lars (which was expected) and hated her job. Wonder what she’ll do now that she’s not tied to the Big Donut. Move away? Find another job, maybe with her mom? Do the Working Dead full time (by god that better be their band name)?

I was a disappointed we didn’t get to see Lars or the Off-Colors, but I wasn’t expecting to; while it was for us 165 days of no Steven, the longest hiatus this show has had, it was literally hours for Beach City. Probably not even that. From what we’ve seen from the SDCC leak, it’ll happen soon, probably after Steven and Connie talk their issues out.

Hopefully this next hiatus, if it is that, isn’t going to be too long. I’d be perfectly happy with getting a bomb every month or two if it means consistency in releases.

Think that’s everything, I’ll have to watch it at least one more time so if I notice or think of anything else I’ll reblog this and add it.