#there's always room for it being either a mistake on GRRM's part or an intentional in-universe misunderstanding/invention

[myimaginationplain]

Could someone explain to me why exactly Alysanne Bulwer is referred to as the head of house Bulwer if she has a brother, especially one old enough for Megga Tyrell to be engaged to? It might've made sense if he were a baby brother (although not entirely, because even baby boys are ahead girls in the line of succession), but it doesn't at all if he's older or of a similar age.

[selkiewife]

Another perspective of the Sansa and Sweetrobin Dynamic

cw: contains mentions of rape, abuse, and sexual assault

@rhaenyra-snow I said I would tag you when I got my thoughts together. I am responding to your meta but also some of the comments and discourse I saw surrounding it. So if I get something wrong, let me know. But like I said, a large part of this is a response to the general discourse about Sansa and Sweetrobin. Obviously, you don’t have to read this, if it doesn’t interest you. It did get kind of long lol. And it’s primarily a Sansa meta. But I wanted to tag you, since you wrote the meta I am referring to. I am honestly not here to stir up any more drama, just offer another perspective of Sansa’s arc in regards to motherhood and her relationship with Sweetrobin.

First off, I completely unequivocally agree that Arya, Daenerys, and Brienne exhibit excellent maternal skills and I loved the parts of the meta that described those scenes. They were so lovely and I agree that it is a deconstruction of the typical “gnc character who isn’t maternal” trope. And I am totally here for that! For Arya specifically, as she is so compassionate and sweet and mature in the books!

And while I do think that it would be perfectly fine- and even very interesting for Sansa not to be maternal, I think it is too soon to tell that because of her age, the abusive situation she is in, and because I actually think that GRRM is doing something different in Sansa’s arc with motherhood than he is doing with Arya, Daenerys, and Brienne’s arcs. 

I think that Sansa’s situation with Sweetrobin is arguably more fucked up than the situations with Arya, Daenerys, and Pod- not their entire arcs (those are incredibly fucked up, poor children!)- just the specific “tasked with caring for a child” situation. Because even though Arya, Daenerys, and Brienne have been sexually assaulted or threatened with sexual assault, Sansa is still currently being sexually assaulted by Baelish while trying to care for her cousin, who she was almost betrothed to, who was breastfed until eight years old by Sansa’s Aunt, who Baelish murdered because she was trying to throw Sansa through the moon door... there are just a lot of fucked up levels to deal with here. There is a lot to unpack.

That being said, I am not blaming Sweetrobin at all for that. I agree that he is also dealing with PTSD. However, in real life, I would never expect a thirteen year old who is currently being sexually assaulted and groomed to be able to competently care for another child who is also dealing with PTSD, grief, etc. And I wouldn’t expect Arya, Daenerys, or Brienne to deal with it well either. If they do, that’s wonderful, but again, I wouldn’t expect it.    

The way I read it, the reason she doesn’t want Sweetrobin in her bed is because he nuzzles her breasts, trying to breastfeed- which is not his fault of course, he is seeking comfort after the death of his mother- but Sansa has a specific trigger because that is where she was groped on her forced wedding night. In the discourse, some fans were saying that Arya would let Sweetrobin sleep with her without any problems. That might be true. But whether or not Arya would allow Sweetrobin to nuzzle her in the same way isn’t really a fair measure of maternal capability because, though she is also an abuse survivor, she may have different triggers than Sansa. Recovery is different for everyone and I would never expect one abuse victim to be okay with a situation just because another abuse victim is.

That being said, I saw in a lot of the comments that people thought Sansa defenders were trying to sexualize breastfeeding. I don’t think that is true. They were saying that Sansa is being triggered. Sexual assault victims can be triggered by things that were not intended to be sexual assault. That’s what sucks about PTSD- it doesn’t care about intent. In fact, even though statistically many mothers who are survivors of molestation and sexual abuse do want to breastfeed in larger numbers than those who don’t- it still can be incredibly difficult and there are support groups and lactation therapy interventions set up specifically to offer support with this issue. That being said, she still allowed him in her room for many nights until she couldn’t take it anymore. And that is because she is compassionate to his situation. 

But even if she did not have that specific trigger, everyone has the right not to be touched if they don’t want to be- even if it is to make another person feel better. I know most people agreed with that. However, even though most fans agree with that, a lot of people were critical of the way Sansa handled getting away from her trigger- saying the way she handled the situation is proof that she is not maternal. 

I also saw people saying that Sansa was being deliberately cruel to Sweetrobin when she had his door locked. I am not going to try to defend that choice. I don’t think it was the right thing to do objectively. However, I can totally empathize with the fact that she is completely out of her depth here and does not know how to handle the situation. And like most people her age, I do not think she thought it through completely. And even then, she does let him back in her room after this incident and he sleeps with her multiple times afterwards:

He cuddled close and laid his head between her breasts. "Alayne? Are you my mother now?""I suppose I am," she said. If a lie was kindly meant, there was no harm in it.

Would Arya have made the same mistake? I agree that she would probably have been more direct. But like I said, I do think that Sweetrobin is a more difficult situation that Weasel, Missandei, or Pod. I can’t imagine any of those three children wanting to be breastfed by Arya, Daenerys, or Brienne. I also don’t remember anything described about them having horrible temper tantrums where they throw porridge bowls at people or threaten to execute people by throwing them down the moon door. I’m not saying that it is Sweetrobin’s fault- it is a result of how he was raised and how frightened and grief stricken he is- But that does make it a bit more difficult for Sansa to do the perfect motherly thing all the time in this situation. It would be hard for an adult woman to be perfect as well. Even though it is more difficult to care for Sweetrobin (through no fault of his own) Sansa is the only person that is able to do it- and people call on her to do so all the time when they can’t manage him- which I think does show that she is maternal:

"If m'lady can talk him out of bed nice," the knight said, "I won't have to drag him out." We can't have that, she told herself. 

and

"Be careful," Alayne told her. "He can hurt you, flailing. You wouldn't think so, but he can." They found a place for him, a cleft in the rock to keep him out of the cold wind. Alayne tended him until the shaking passed, whilst Mya went back to help the others cross.

This shows that she has compassion and understands that it is not his fault he has seizures. It shows that she is willing to stay and tend to him when others back off. She is also able to get him down the mountain when he is understandably terrified. 

He is afraid, she thought, and with good reason. Since his lady mother had fallen, the boy would not even stand upon a balcony, and the way from the Eyrie to the Gates of the Moon was perilous enough to daunt anyone.

"Mya will keep the mules from biting," Alayne said, "and I'll be riding just behind you. I'm only a girl, not as brave or strong as you. If I can do it, I know you can, Sweetrobin."

Alayne took Robert’s gloved hand in her own to stop his shaking.

“Sweetrobin,” she said, “I’m scared. Hold my hand, and help me get across. I know you’re not afraid.”

He looked at her, his pupils small dark pinpricks in eyes as big and white as eggs. “I’m not?”

“Not you. You’re my winged knight, Ser Sweetrobin.”

“The Winged Knight could fly,” Robert whispered. 

“Higher than the mountains.” She gave his hand a squeeze.

She makes him feel safe and she makes him feel capable. This in and of itself is an example of good mothering skills.

I said before that I think GRRM is doing something different with the maternal motifs in Arya, Daenerys, and Brienne versus Sansa. I think that in Arya, Daenerys and Brienne’s chapters the motherhood themes are there to reveal their characters- to show the readers how compassionate they are and establish them as protectors- on this we completely agree. 

I think where we disagree is that I don’t think that the motherhood theme in Sansa’s chapters are there to deconstruct her mothering skills as an individual but more to deconstruct mothering itself. Sansa is a learning character- her arc has a lot to do with unlearning the patriarchal lies she has been raised with while also learning how to survive within those constraints. She fantasized about knights and princes. So she learns the hard way that knights are not always virtuous, that handsome princes can be horrifically cruel, etc. She also fantasized about motherhood. And now she is learning that motherhood is harder than she thought. Yes mothering instinct is one thing- and Sansa’s instinct is to be compassionate to Sweetrobin. But what happens when the child is dealing with grief or has special needs, or you have no real help or you are dealing with traumatic stress yourself? Motherhood is hard as hell even for adult women who chose it, not to mention how hard it must be for girls who are Arya and Sansa’s ages. In spite of that, I do think that Sansa is rising to the occasion- not as immediately as Arya, Daenerys, or Brienne perhaps. But steadily- and I think that fits her arc since her motherhood themes are character development ones instead of character illuminating ones.

Because of this, it kind of reminds me of when people wrongly call Daenerys a bad ruler based on her ruling of Mereen. That pisses me off so much! Because Daenerys is given the most difficult ruling arc in the series. I agree wholeheartedly with the metas I have read that she is the answer to GRRM’s original question about the knitty grittiness of ruling instead of “and he ruled wisely and well.” She is an excellent ruler but her chapters are showing that ruling is fucking hard, even when you are excellent. Just as Daenerys is the answer to “he ruled wisely and well,” I think Sansa and Sweetrobin is the answer to, “she took the child under her wing and was a perfect mother to him.” Given the incredibly difficult circumstances, she is learning to be a truly excellent caretaker of him.

And look, I am not saying that Sansa is perfect! I’m not saying she is not mean spirited or petty at times. I’m also not saying that locking Sweetrobin in his room was the correct way to deal with the situation. I’m not saying any of those things. But what is compelling to me (and what I personally love about Sansa) is that she has done mean spirited things, but also extremely kind things. She is capable of sass and meanness and also true compassion. I’m genuinely not trying to erase her flaws. I know some fans do that. But fans do that with literally all the characters. I personally love her, flaws and all. I mean, I am a Theon fan first and foremost so... it doesn’t bother me when I read about her frustrations with Sweetrobin. I think it’s a realistic reaction and understandable.

And we do see that she is frustrated as hell with Sweetrobin at times, but she never lets it show- she is always sweet and soothing to him after Lysa dies. Real mothers also get extremely frustrated with their children sometimes and they strive to keep the same kind of patience that Sansa does. 

Perhaps we should view her locking him in his room as a thirteen year old abuse victim’s way of dealing with the fact that she didn’t trust herself to be sweet while voicing her frustrations with him. It was the wrong move, but she’s thirteen. Perhaps one of the actual adults in the situation could have stepped in at that point. But they don’t. And in spite of that incident, she does let him sleep with her again. She puts her own feelings aside for his. Which means that she lets him nuzzle her, even though it triggers her. It also means she gets up at night after he has a seizure to change the bed and to clean him up. This shows me that she is striving to overcome her own feelings in order to help this defenseless child. She even says here:

Why not surround him with Winged Knights? She had thought one night, after Sweetrobin had finally drifted off to sleep. His own Kingsguard, to keep him safe and make him brave.

This shows that she is continuing to let him sleep with her and also thinking about ways to protect him and give him a sense of security after he has fallen asleep. Which is incredibly maternal. Sansa is truly rising to the occasion of being motherly to Sweetrobin in spite of her triggers and her own current traumatic stress. But what is so heartbreaking is- she shouldn’t have to! And neither should Arya. They are both abused children that desperately need their own mother. So when they make mistakes with child care, I think we can view those mistakes with compassion. 

Now, I know that all I just wrote might sound ridiculous if you believe that Sansa is knowingly poisoning Sweetrobin. I personally do not take that view. I think it is just as unfounded as people who think that Daenerys will burn Kings Landing. 

I actually think that Sansa is going to eventually break out from Baelish’s manipulation and abuse and save Sweetrobin or at least try to. I think that Little Finger constantly making her an accomplice is similar to Theon with Ramsay and how he eventually saves Jeyne- but that is another meta for another time (which I do intend to write lol) and this has gotten way too long already.

Now, I could be totally wrong about all of this. As I said, this is just my interpretation- but who knows when it comes to GRRM? My faith in him has been significantly shaken based on the end of the TV series and the way he writes the sexual scenes in the books... Perhaps he is trying to say that Sansa is not maternal because she reacts the way she does to being triggered as a thirteen year old, while living in the same household as one of her abusers. But if that is the case, it is deeply misogynistic of him. 

It’s also odd that we even have to have this discussion about children caring for other children as if they were adults. Is it really fair to judge any of these characters about their maternal instincts or how they rise to the occasion of being motherly when they are all children themselves and put in such horrible situations that would be daunting for adult women? This seems to be largely on GRRM’s writing. Also the fact that we never debate how “fatherly” Jon, Robb, Theon, or Bran are, which again, possibly has to do with the writing itself. So perhaps instead of fighting each other over whose interpretation is more misogynistic, we should take a hard look at how misogynistic the writing is in and of itself. Hopefully GRRM can tie this up so that it is not as misogynistic as I fear it might be. (I truly hope so.) But that is a larger conversation to be had.