#the ableism and sanism were... something in the original

[yooniesim]

“I promise to be a good boy.” ☠️🧷🖤

Simon Stark

Age: 31

Blood Type: O

Identity: Bisexual Man

Height: 5'9"

Nationality: Canadian

Rider Style: Boardercross (BX)

Alternate Sport: Mountain Biking

Motto: "Do I look like a people person?"

Favorite Music: Slayer, Napalm Death

Voice Actor: Jim Rose

Simon is a fearless but erratic snowboarder with the ability to unnerve every one of his opponents. He knows that people are uncomfortable around him, and uses this to his advantage. No matter how hard it's snowing or how cold it is on race day, Simon won't wear goggles or a jacket. He perpetuates the mythology around his accident (he jumped a huge gap on a mountain bike and landed on some power lines, blacking out the entire Okanogan Valley) with his erratic behavior on and off the SSX track. So while he comes across as a maniac, he does indeed have an agenda, though it is known only to Simon himself. - SSX Tricky

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[who-is-page]

hey, do you have any posts on the history of the kin community and the origin of the word? I just had an encounter with someone who said that fictionkin and otherkin are somehow different from just kin by itself... :P

I don't have any specific posts on that-- or rather, I'm sure I do, but they're buried in my tags and unfindable.

The standalone word "kin" meaning one's family or relations is, of course, a word that predates the otherkin and related community; but I have a feeling that in this ask, the individual you were involved with was either arguing that the shorthand of otherkin, 'kin, is somehow separate from the community (which it isn't-- it's shorthand for a reason!) or was arguing that people who inly ever use kin as a verb to mean "to stan," "to like," "to relate to," or "to take on the aesthetics of for fun," are separate from the otherkin community, which yes, they are.

For the former, "'kin as shorthand," that one seems pretty self-explanatory: sometimes, you get tired of typing out "otherkin" in a post or essay repetitively, and shorten it to just 'kin. You can even see the shorthand applied to anti-otherkin, who are often just shortened to being called "anti-kin" or "antikin." With that said, here's one older example of an excerpt by ex-Therianthrope Lupa Greenwolf from her A Field Guide to Otherkin, which uses 'kin as a shorthand: A Day in the Life of Otherkin.

For the latter, "kin for fun" or "KFF," as it's sometimes called nowadays, the history is a bit more fraught, but no: people like this are not otherkin, therian, nor fictionkin just for stanning celebrities nor for really liking specific characters. Otherkinity and identities related to it are considered to be about identifying as and on some level recognizing oneself as being something either partially or entirely nonhuman-- most typically through psychological or spiritual explanations or reasoning, but not always limited to just those two. These identities can be silly and fun in their own right, but if someone is just having silly fun in fandom spaces by picking out their annual blorbos or squeeing over the latest pop star RPF then that's a separate phenomena. It's still perfectly valid for people to do! It's just not something that makes people otherkin.

KFF evolved from anti-otherkin shenanigans in the mid-2010's: with anti-otherkin constantly insisting that otherkinity was a choice and a common experience that anyone could have but that people who called themselves otherkin were taking "too far." Some popular bloggers ended up picking up on this rhetoric, believing the anti-kin and spreading it further (usually also alongside the ableism, sanism, and bizarre antisemitism that anti-kin would push with it, which explains a lot of the rhetoric from KFF that's been aimed at otherkin in the past that I've seen).

One particular fictionkin blogger who later ended up being revealed to be a fake--a cis-woman who was revealed to have been lying about her race, her gender identity/status as a transgender person, and other things potentially besides for the sake of Internet Clout--YandereBitchClub, especially caused problems in the community and could even be argued to in some ways be the true founder of the KFF community from 2014~ish. She pushed narratives of kin as a voluntary, social justice/morality-related, fandom concept, saying things such as how queer individuals couldn't have fictotypes with characters who were straight/cis, and that "problematique" fictotypes meant you were actually an evil person IRL. Lots of harassment brigades, lots of being genuinely cruel and awful to actual fictionkin, this person and the resounding ideas that people took from them are in a lot of ways responsible for the fictionkin cultural crash of the mid-to-late 2010's. But she's not the only popular blogger who's spread misinformation, we've also seen it from people like Normal-Horoscopes and popular YouTubers like the Amazing Athiest (yuck).

So KFF aren't otherkin, and are much closer to just a subset of anti-otherkin based on everything. If they were placed on a timeline graph would look more something like...this:

Some sources below.

General Sources:

“Otherkin - People who identify either partially or wholly as one or more non-human beings, entities, or concepts in a psychological or spiritual manner.” (2015, Kinmunity.com, now defunct. RIP)

Otherkin timeline: The recent history of elfin, fae, and animal people, v. 2.0 (Unabridged). by Orion Scribner

Otherkin Lexicon: A multi-lingual dictionary of jargon used in the communities of otherkin, therianthropes, and other similar peoples. by Orion Scribner

Addendums to Scribner’s The Otherkin Timeline. by House of Chimeras

Examples of Otherkin defined as identifying as something nonhuman over the years:

“Otherkin, n. [Coined 1990 by Torin / Darren Stalder in the Elfinkind Digest listserve. E. other additional, or different in kind from the one implied + E. kin family, kind, race. Pl. otherkin. Based on contemporary use of the word elfinkin or elvenkin for people who identify as elves. Spelling note: some authors spell “otherkin” with a capital O, some don’t, and some use either. Syn. otherkind (obsolete).]

1. (elven comm., early otherkin comm.) [1990 in the Elfinkind Digest listserve.] (Never commonly used. Obsolete in mid-1990s.) The below definition, but limited to refer only to people who identify as mythological creatures other than elves. With such usage, a group of people who identified as elves, dragons, and satyrs would be called “elfinkin and otherkin.”

2. (otherkin comm.) [Circa 1992?] (Now commonly used.) Otherkin are real, non-fictional people who identify as other than human. Otherkin identify as creatures from myth and legend, usually elves, faeries, and dragons. This is a sincere identity, not role-play. Many otherkin identify as other than human for spiritual reasons; that is, they classify their identity as otherkin as a personal spiritual belief. Being otherkin is a very individualistic thing: each otherkin reaches his own explanation for how and why he is an otherkin. Some of their common spiritual explanations include that they are other than human in spirit, or they were other than human in past incarnations. Although spiritual belief is often involved, “otherkin” isn’t a religion. As such, each person who identifies as otherkin practices whatever religion he individually wants. It has always been the case that most of the otherkin community practices Neo-Pagan religions, and so that religious perspective shapes the common views and ideas in the otherkin community. Some otherkin don’t use spiritual explanations. Some otherkin believe that they are physically other than human, or that their ancestors were.

3. (otherkin, dragon, and therian communities) [Circa 2006] The above definition, but expanded to also include people who identify as animals (therianthropes). Less often, some people use the word “otherkin” as an even larger umbrella term to include otherkin, therianthropes, and vampires. A more appropriate umbrella term has yet to be made.

4. (fiction, outside of the otherkin comm.) [Circa 2006] Starting around 2006, several novelists later appropriated (or independently coined?) the term “otherkin” to refer to fictional, physically supernatural entities. In those novels, the term “otherkin” doesn’t refer to real kinds of people Otherkin Lexicon O. Scribner 25 who simply feel other-than-human at heart. Those authors include paranormal romance novelists Nina Bangs, Anya Bast, and Delilah Devlin.″ (2013, Orion Scribner’s Otherkin Lexicon)

“Personally I would describe Otherkin as any person who believes that they are, in some way, other than their kin (kin being humans), and kin to the other (the other being non-terrestrial/mythical/religious/etc. entities). This belief is something that can be spiritual or psychological but, at its core, it is a belief and not a physical condition.” (2013, Tumblr Otherkin FAQ from someone who has been in the community for 14+ years, since their description hasn't been updated in the last five years.)

“Otherkin: There are two main definitions of this term, and both are provided here so as to denote the prevalence of both definitions being used often.  One definition is that otherkin is a general, overarching term for those people who feel they are in part or whole [non-physically] non-human, with one or more non-human otherkin types/aspects (also known as a ‘kintype); this is a category that therians are a subsection of, but it also includes a variety of other non-human creatures, including but not limited to mythical creatures.  The other definition is the same except that it is not as generalized of a category and instead only denotes the creatures that are mythical, fantastical, or non-Earth animals.” (2013 or before, Project Shift)

“Otherkin. (uh’ther-kin) n. A person who believes her/his self to be of another species in spirit, or in some other way identifies with a particular creature, usually of myth and legend. For example, a person who accepts that she/he is human in body, but believes herself/himself to be a faery in spirit, or that she/he has elven ancestry, etc. Plural: otherkin. No adjectival form.“ (2009, Otherkin News on Livejournal)

“[…] a person who believes that, through either a nonphysical or (much more rarely) physical means, s/he is not entirely human.” (2007, Lupa’s Field Guide to Otherkin)

[bearwithmeshifting]

Damn I had a heavy misread, misinterpreted nearly your whole post because of it. Sorry about that, posting as soon as I wake up should probably be avoided. Hope you forgive my honestly irrelevant discussion piled on top of you well thought out points. I’m keeping the original word trash on just to properly document this conversation, your posts have been enlightening. This response may also be subject to the same issue, as I am tired as of writing this up.

Your claim of ableism makes a lot more sense with proper context, my original post was referencing the perceived friction between Endels and similar people that was consistently thrown my direction whenever I would post about things deemed as unreality. I’ve never directly seen a conflict between a p shifter and a person with delusions, at least in the context that the people with this claim it happens. I may have internalized the dynamic, and thought that even working in good faith with an Endel or other delusional people was to put them at risk. Perhaps the friction really does come from the history of pshifters starting packs which were deemed universally harmful, and being conflated with one another.

I understand the aversion to conflation, most of the issues in our communities arise from individuals being conflated with identification in the other. Hell, with my own internalized sanism I basically refused to believe that I had even shifted, despite spoken and experienced evidence to the contrary. I don’t speak about this facet of myself besides on this blog and to a select few for fear of being considered mentally ill (in this regard). You’ve spoken of the issue of being treated as physical shifters in this online space, which carries heavy social penalties, and I imagine the usual sanist responses to your identity occur to you as well.

Packs being generally insular is something that could be its own post, but packs are still a fairly common way to gather for physical shifters. They’re not common in physical spaces, such as city wide packs, but are relatively common in online organization. While physical packs tend towards lax organization, online packs tend towards hierarchy, which opens up the possibility for exploitation. People in power in the pack can behave responsibly, though there is an issue with organizing people who feel isolated in their experiences being shown authority figures who claim to have answers. Like you said, they rarely have well sourced answers, which is a whole other post, but the tendency for self selection does open up a few potential issues. I know of packs which members haven’t physically shifted before, but consider themselves physical shifters. These people tend to be younger and claim that dysphoria explains their physical shifter status, and I can’t help but think that they may be misreading their experiences.

Skeptic here. Much of the explained process for pshifting also lines up with conditions for forced hallucination, hypnosis, and other issues.

You say you were a skeptic in the past, wouldn't the logical first thing to do be rule out other possible causes and provide video proof?

I'm worried cause many have used pshifting as a weapon for abuse, esspecially targeting those prone to delusions and issues with unreality. How do we know that you're safe?

True, it’s a common enough phenomena that I had to rule it out from my experiences. Luckily, I was able to ask one of my shifter friends to help spectate my shift, and I was weird enough to claw into the bark of a log. This is enough for me to be generally confident that my experiences were that of a physical shift. I didn’t get any of myself recorded during the shift, as I didn’t have hands and was tripping the fuck out, and its general rule to not record shifting unless given express permission where I am. I didn’t take a picture of the log, and its not proof enough to convince others.

At this point, I don’t have any evidences besides my perceptions and the perceptions of one other person. I’m ambivalent on shifting again to record it and posting it here, as it would be the last evidence I need to be totally undoubtable to myself, but to prove it to others without shifting in front of them physically is difficult. The simplest explanation for seeing a person shift into a bear on video is to assume it’s edited, and it would require evidence to prove it isn’t, or a leap which is ultimately as unreasoned as taking me at my word. It could also lead to unwanted attention from people who aren’t shifters, and feeding into unhealthy delusions. It’s too doubtable but could harm those who believe it and aren’t shifters, so unless given other reason, I’m likely to not release video.

I’m not malignant when it comes to using my status as a shifter to control those with delusions and issues with unreality. I’m uninterested in making others believe something that is false, and I morally dislike the idea of worsening someone’s mental health. It’s possible that people with delusions and unreality issues find themselves in my vicinity, and I hope to establish that they ought to disbelieve me if they can’t physically shift. If they believe they can physically shift, I have written in the past that they should get evidence of their shift. I generally think that physical shifters should be aware of how delusions occur, so we can check ourselves.

Despite the issues physical shifters (and people who claim to be shifters) have caused to people with delusions, I believe that the physical shifting community benefits from their insights. I’m not sure how they could benefit from our community, but I hope its not a one sided gain. Still, at some point, I hope to collaborate with someone who experiences delusions and unreality to make a guide on how to discern if someone has really shifted. I have yet to do so because its difficult for someone like me to interact with someone with shapeshifting delusions without triggering something.