#tbf i gave him my work email because he said he might be interested in our volunteer nest box monitoring program

[starbuck]

dude, i met another trans guy on the bird walk today and we were chatting and lowkey flirting and it was so much fun and i wanted to give him my number, but i gave him my WORK EMAIL email instead. 🤦🏼🤦🏼🤦🏼🤦🏼

[redandfranticfeelings]

'tag things making fun of doug' because your personal enjoyment of an abuser's content should supersede the feelings of the people he abused by making them act out rape jokes? the fact that making fun of an abuser upsets you because you like him warrants some serious self-examination on your part. 'you can't make fun of an abuser around me bc i like his content and you can't criticize me bc mental illness' is some wendycorduroy shit. i'm surprised you'd do this given how critical you are of her.

and yes, people are allowed to not like you for still liking the show. ofc people can have problematic interests if they want, but content that has been directly used by its creators to abuse people is a special kind of bad. you’re allowed to like it, but guilt tripping people or implying they’re not allowed to dislike the fact that you still support it is incredibly callous to the people rob, doug, and mike abused. this is not, nor should it be, about your feelings. this is about the victims.             

you know what. upon further consideration, those asks were not kindly phrased. my intention was to emphasize that because the anniversary movies were vessels for abuse (injuries, rape jokes, etc) it was inappropriate to prioritize one’s own feelings over the feelings of the victims or block out criticism, but i phrased them in a way that was not productive and was attacking you. i’m sorry for my wording and for being a dick          

thank you for your follow up apology. i see where youre coming with this but i think there’s a few things that i can point towards me not giving up on the show altogether.

short answer: while i detest the way the company has been run and is executing public relations, and i am uncomfortable watching any video on their channel and have not done such for weeks, and i really want the harmed ex-producers to receive justice, i still believe there is a shred of hope for the show based on what recent producers have said, and that doug can reform himself by owning up to his deliberate ignorance, neglect, and egotism, though he is not the biggest abuser in this situation. i have a lot of emotional history with NC that means i need time before i’m able to drop the show altogether, if i ever can, and i just want to avoid anything that isn’t constructive and just intended to make anybody feel bad for liking the show/movies before this information was widely known.

long answer:

most of the criticism lauded against doug isnt so much being the direct abuser but being complacent and ignorant of people’s health. if i recall correctly, while it was a pretty unnecessary and terrible joke to make in my opinion, he didn’t pick up that the drill scene in TBF made anybody uncomfortable at the time? and in recent years he seems more concerned about what his cast undergoes, and a lot of them have said that he does ask about jokes that might hurt them and make sure they’re comfortable. i believe he apologized for it and acknowledged his naievity in the movie’s commentary but restating that apology would be beneficial now, yeah.

while complacency and ignorance is bad, i think he has been neglectful, not directly abusive. also, idk if you meant this, but your phrasing makes it kinda sound like his projects were intended as a means to abuse people; the abuse happened because of the movies, yeah, but it was because of doug being egotistical and ignorant, not malicious. the content of the movies reflect’s doug’s massive ego but it doesn’t reflect a desire to abuse anybody. if he did the shit that mike michaud or mike ellis did, that would be inexcusable for me and i would have lost hope for him.

if anybody is definitely abusive, it’s the CEO, who i love watching get bashed because he is indeed a sexist verbally abusive asshole who holds the power in the company and is using it for his stupid selfish needs. it’s also been stated that doug is restricted by his contract with the CEO and could just straight up not be able to make videos if he stepped out of turn, so while i wish he would use his walkout power more, he doesn’t have as much power as some people attribute to him. he’s complicit in abuse but i don’t think that’s the same as being abusive? the producers themselves seem to go back and forth about how they feel about him but a recurring theme is that he’s tragically ignorant of abuse, but not on the same level of abusive as michaud, if they call him abusive at all (most just seem to feel betrayed by him).

additionally, almost all creators who have worked with him in the past couple of years, have stated they had generally positive experiences with the network, even the ones who are now leaving. the only thing that seems to remain an issue is the awful, awful PR (that apology sucked, i criticized it myself) and the lack of communication towards anybody not chicago-based. i feel they need to ditch michaud (which probably won’t be easy, since he’s a shady capitalist fuck), formally apologize and maybe provide compensation for past producers who were abused by the higher-ups, and either improve relations or just restrict everything to NC, because at this point that’s the only show that’s going to be left if they don’t get their shit together anyway. but i do think that if they just take the easy solution of apologizing, even though it’s already way too late and they royally fucked themselves over, things can be a little better.

i’m also not against criticizing doug for not speaking out, because the least he could do is apologize at least privately and i’ve even emailed him imploring him to do at least that (i don’t expect a response though lmao). i just get hurt at people attacking the show and movies as being terrible and something no fan should like. a lot of people really attached to the series before this blew up, and for the most part the content of the show doesn’t reflect the behind-the-scenes issues.

i’m spreading relevant information on twitter regarding abuse and producers’ feelings, but so many people (obviously not the producers, but the fans/haters) involved in this are more concerned with just shitting on doug bc they don’t like him and a lot are trying to make him out as worse than he is. i want to spread what the producers say because i trust them, but i’m wary of fans who seem to just be in it for the drama or bc they never liked NC and they wanna spite people who did (yes, those people exist, they mocked me on kiwifarms).

i know this isn’t about me, but i’ve invested a lot of money and time and emotional energy in the show, it’s introduced me to new friends, and it’s been directly and indirectly responsible for some of my highest and lowest points of the past year and a half. my comfort ship has been very helpful in helping my loneliness. it gave me something to look forward to every day. not to pull the autism card, but it’s difficult for me to drop a special interest very easily and i’m jealous of people who can. i need time to grow entirely out of it if i can.

but even still, i haven’t watched a NC episode in weeks, even the new ones, due to my discomfort and shame towards the show and network (only NC thing i watched lately was the hyper q&a, which is on tamara’s channel, and i used it to fall asleep). i unsubscribed, and i really i only care about a few aspects of the show anyway.

if you want to hate me because i can’t immediately remove NC from my heart then fine, but if so, just unfollow me. i don’t want people to not post NC criticism, and i fully endorse spreading relevant information because i care about the victims and i want them to receive justice. i just want hate tagged so i, personally, do not have to be constantly reminded that a show that is/was close to my heart has so many awful things behind it, even if i’m not sure if i still love it anymore. and while i have been a bit guilt-trippy in the past i’ve been confronted on that already and i’m trying not to come across that way, and i’m sorry for having been manipulative at all. i’m paranoid about being abandoned and hated just for having watched this show but unless you’re like, a super close friend of mine, you can unfollow any time you want.