#specifically the one who is Bruce's older brother and who blames his world's version of his father for Bruce's and Martha's death

[puppetmaster13u]

Mini Prompt

You know what i love

Villian not-redemption. Where they go to another world, or the timeline shifts, or whatever, and find the person or people they lost And instead of getting better

They get Worse Like they continue to be nihilistic assholes to everyone But said person/people (bonus if it's a younger sibling or something similar) And they are still an irredeemable evil person They are not redeemed, in fact they've gotten MORE unhinged because they Can't Lose this Person Again

[bigskydreaming]

Could Jason and Chris Kent have become friends? I know nothing about Chris or the comics from Jason's Robin era. I heard that Chris is the erased eldest son of Superman? I'm intrigued, but that means even the children of the biggest superheroes ever can be erased?

Ugh, I love Chris Kent and miss him (the pre-Flashpoint version of his character) a ton. And y’know, there are a couple ways you could manuever him and Jason into a friendship, though I don’t think they ever met in continuity. I don’t know how well they would have gotten along if you just went with the versions of the characters that both existed at approximately the same time, but they do actually have a decent amount in common, like with some tweaks it could work. Ironically, character wise they probably would have gotten along really well when Jason was Robin, but continuity wise, Chris didn’t even debut until after UTRH, though he rapidly aged from a young kid to a young adult after just a couple of years.

But lemme back up a bit because Chris is, umm, complicated.

SO. Christopher Kent was born Lor-Zod, the son of General Zod and Ursa, while they were held captive in the Phantom Zone. They were abusive asshats to him, and he’s not a fan. But for some reason which had to do with blah blah blah invasion plot blah blah, Zod made a spaceship from inside the Phantom Zone that he sent Chris to Earth in, because due to being born while in the Zone, Chris was actually able to take physical form, unlike the Kryptonians trapped there as a prison.

When Chris crashed on Earth, he was taken by a government agency aimed at monitoring extraterrestial ‘threats’ and treated as such. Cue Clark finding out that there was another Kryptonian on Earth, he was a kid, and he was being treated as a prisoner and it was like, See Clark Run. See Clark Mad. See Clark Raze The Department of Extraterrestial Affairs From The Earth With His Searing Hot Eyebeams Of Rage and Also Destruction.

And then Clark took Chris home to the Kent farm, and eventually he and Lois ended up adopting Chris and raising him as their own. Lois was the one who gave him his Earth name of Chris, which he’s always been shown to vastly prefer over his birth name just like he can’t stand his birth parents, as they are abusive asshats. He used to call Lois “Mama Lois.” It was adorable.

There’s a lot of back and forth about calling him Clark and Lois’ adopted son versus foster son, depending on various wikis and even issues, but its the same kinda thing that happens with all the Batkids at various points, and like, I remember issues that actually called Ma and Pa Kent Clark’s foster parents, so just do what I do and groan and sigh and accept that DC habitually employs writers and editors who just flat out don’t understand how fostering and adoption works. And its not that there’s anything wrong or lesser about fostering, and its absolutely the better way to go for some, its just foster son and adopted son are not remotely interchangeable, they are two different things, and DC has GOT to stop playing take-backsies with adoption, like just don’t do that, don’t make that a thing.

Anyway, for awhile it was Clark, Lois and Chris and they were quite happy together. Chris existed well before Jon Kent and they were never raised as Kents at the same time, unfortunately, and he did have some cute scenes with Conner, though this was mostly when Conner was characterized as seeing Clark more as an older brother and never really raised by him. (Similar to YJ-verse, but I have a lot of issues with that in YJ-verse because of HOW that played out, that I don’t have in pre-Flashpoint comics, where it felt a little more natural for Clark and Conner to have a brotherly relationship, mostly due to the fact that I don’t recall Conner ever expressing a want for the relationship to be otherwise in the comics, and having a strong bond with Ma and Pa Kent himself. I could be wrong here though as I skipped a lot of Conner’s writing when Geoff Johns is behind the wheel because I just....really miss 90s Kon-El who was practically a totally different character BUT I DIGRESS).

 But then because comics gotta comics, eventually Zod escaped from the Phantom Zone to fuck all that up, and invaded Earth because he’s like I’m Zod and invading Earth is like, my entire personality, its the only move I’ve got in the deck, what do you want from me. And Luthor eventually cooperated with the heroes to stop the invasion by configuring some sort of cosmic vaccuum cleaner to suck all the Kryptonians with a connection to the Phantom Zone back into the Phantom Zone, but then this didn’t seal the Zone up again once all the invaders were back in and Chris realized its because even though he was just born there, he was technically connected to the Zone too and it wouldn’t close up again as long as he was outside it. So he sacrificed himself to save his father (Clark took quite a beating from Zod in this) and the world and dove into the Phantom Zone, which sealed up behind him.

BUT he was saved at the last second (and without anyone else knowing for awhile) by someone named Thara. She was the security chief of Kandor, and she took Chris to protect him from the revenge of the Phantom Zoners who would have blamed him for their re-imprisonment. And off-page, during the years between Chris getting sacrificing himself to seal the Phantom Zone before his reapparance, Chris had a comic-book style growth spurt uncannily like the one Jon Kent got when Bendis started writing him, resulting in an uncannily similar dynamic between Chris and Clark and Lois when they reunited as Bendis wrote Jon having with Clark and Lois when they reunited. Why do I emphasize this, is it because I think Bendis is overhyped and I’ll never stop complaining about how all his biggest story beats are blatantly just recycled story beats from less well-known writers and characters, no that can’t be it, must be something else.

Anyway, Chris eventually returns to Earth, now a teenager, and now going by Nightwing while Thara went by Flamebird. This was around the time Bruce was lost in time and Dick was Batman, and there was never like, any crossover. Which sucked because Dick would’ve been fine with it as Chris had more of a claim to the name than even him (it wasn’t like with the Nightwings in the Ric Grayson arc, who became Nightwing BECAUSE of Dick’s persona, but rather that Chris and Thara were basing their personas purely on their own Kryptonian myths and what they represented to the Kandorians who were now living on Earth at the time. Totally different situation). But really it was just missed opportunities, IMO, as I think Chris and Dick also would have gotten along really well and their paths just never really crossed.

Somewhere in there Chris got another random growth spurt and ended up in his early 20s, he and Thara ended up in a relationship which was not my fave cuz of all the aging shenanigans but whatevs, Chris kept having random aging growth spurts which had Lois really worried about him and she tried to get the hero version of Dr. Light (Dr. Kimiyo Hoshi) to help him thinking maybe it had something to do with light or radiation, but they never really got around to trying to fix it because Lois’ douchebag dad General Lane showed up and tried to capture Chris, and he and Thara fled. And then they ran into Supergirl, who at first tried to kill Thara because she hated her because Kandorian Backstory I honestly do not remember, but then Chris revealed himself and was like Kara, its me, we’re cousins, and then they had adventures with Kara for a time, then there was this whole thing where Thara and Chris were both briefly possessed by and then merged with the actual Kryptonian gods/entities of Nightwing and Flamebird and then the entities left them and were like okay, we’re all done with whatever that was, as you were.

Chris thwarted his evil birth parents again, blew up some stuff, there was more Phantom Zone shenanigans and then General Lane and Lex Luthor turned the sun red to try and kill all Kryptonians, Thara fixed it by sacrificing herself, Chris tried to join her but then the Nightwing entity hijacked him and was like nope, and then not long after, Chris sacrificed himself again to push Zod back into the Phantom Zone AGAIN (seriously, it was like they were on a loop at this point, ugh) and he ended up in the Zone himself, but for real this time....and for some reason that turned him back into the age he should’ve been if he’d been aging normally this whole time, and the last we saw of Chris, he was like ten years old and in the Phantom Zone and being helped by Mon-El, and then the New 52 happened and rebooted everything and wherever that was going no longer mattered.

And then New 52 Lor-Zod showed up at one point as like, Zod’s loyal little son-minion, and DC has never shown a hint of intending to pursue an actual Chris Kent storyline in the New 52, and I hate that lots and lots because its like lol, this character was an abuse survivor in his original incarnation and you guys were like, lol no big deal, we’ll just make Zod the exact same asshat he’s always been but now this version of his son is just like him and likes it, why would that be a problem. WHATEVER.

Basically, New 52 Chris Kent doesn’t exist, that’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

Which is a fucking shame, because Chris and Jon Kent as brothers being raised together WITHOUT ANY WEIRD AGING SHENANIGANS with their cousin once removed, Kara, and their older sorta brother sorta uncle Conner could have been like. So great.

So anyway. There’s LOTS of directions you can take Chris, and he’s really a great character. If you’re aiming to make him friends with Jason specifically, my go-to there would be to just have the events that led Chris to Earth originally just....happen a lot earlier in the continuity of your story. So have Chris arrive on Earth and be adopted by Clark and Lois roughly around the same time Jason steals the tires off the Bat-mobile, and you’re pretty much in business.

(BUT if you do go this route, keep in mind that Jason died before the Death of Superman storyline, which is where Kon-El debuted, so even if Kon/Conner’s still older than Chris here, Chris would already be an established part of Clark and Lois’ family by the time Kon-El arrives on the scene, which would change dynamics there, not just between Chris and Kon/Conner, but potentially between Kon/Conner and Clark and Lois as well).

OR you can keep Chris’ arrival as happening roughly when it did in canon (2006 was the year he debuted), and just have him do a little aging up, like, as a treat, and so be his older self when Jason returns and starts interacting with the cape community again, with their first interactions being when they’re both young adults who for completely different reasons missed out on large chunks of childhood. There’s some potentially interesting angles to explore there too.

Just depends on which way you want to go with that.

(PS, I think aging up is an overused trope most of the time in comics anyway, but its not so much aging Chris rapidly to a teenager and then young adult that I had an issue with, so much as doing it largely to put him in a relationship with someone who first met him when they were already an adult and he was ten. Its the initial age gap being an established part of the overall dynamic with an eventual love interest thats the issue, not that an age gap existed before two characters ever met - if for all other intents and purposes - their dynamic treats them as if they both were effectively always around the same age).

[cdelphiki]

What long chartered fics would you recommend for either a Robin in particular, or Batman and one of the Robins, or just the Batfam in general?

Oooh, long fics are my favorite.  By rule I only recommend completed fics, so because of that I’ll leave out a bunch I love, but here are some of the longest fics on Ao3 (and one from FF.net) that I liked, sorted by main character or main relationship:

Dick:

Second Generation by lowlyingfruit

TW: Referenced Rape. Basically, due to the Blockbuster incident…. Dick is a father.  It’s a very realistic fic following him dealing with that.  With some added Jason.  

No Good Deed by Black Friar

Robin Dick gets badly injured while working with Young Justice.  Not long after, some jerkface at school (accidentally, if I remember, but while picking on him) pushes him down a flight of stairs, causing him to hit his head and require a hospital stay.  While there, they discover the injuries he had previous and just assume Bruce did it.  So he gets taken away by CPS, and this follows both Dick and Bruce during that journey.  Lots of angst.  Good Dad Bruce, too.  Chapter 18 is my favorite.  

Becoming Robin by wordsgohere95

TW: Child Abuse.  This one is a take on Dick ‘Becoming Robin.’  Ha.  Get it?  Following what would actually happen to a 8 year old when he got stuck in a largely unsupervised detention center. It’s really rough in the detention center.  A kid basically brainwashes Dick into having stockholms syndrome, and to be honest with you, I probably wouldn’t read the first half of this again because it was too much for me. (I’m a baby and the kids are really mean to Dick :[ )  BUT I really enjoyed the fic over-all.  It was well written and believable.  It definitely deserves more than 174 kudos.  

Jason:

Retrograde Motion by Lysical

Jason gets deaged while he’s on a mission with The Outlaws (Artemis and Bizarro) and ends up going back to the Manor to live there during his predicament. 

I never call (a crazy thing to do) by ohnomydear

I was torn between Tim & Jason and just Jason for this.  But basically, due to magic and stuff, everyone in the world forgets who Jason is…. except Tim.  The whole fic is them working toward fixing that, while Jason struggles with his insecurities.  

Jason Todd: The Not So Outlaw by GoAwayOlivia

I feel like I rec this every single time people ask for recs, but can you blame me???  It’s a work of art.  Jason moves back to Gotham, intending on staying just a few months.  But that rascal Tim has other plans, and slowly pulls Jason back into the family.  

Tim:

Blood in the Water by Misha Berry

Tim is Bruce’s bio-kid.  He finds this out after he’s Robin, freaks out, and is promptly kidnapped by Talia.  Because, you know, she can’t have Tim ruining her plans for Damian being the sole heir to Batman.  So Tim is at the League.  With Damian.  And Jason.  It’s great.  

Confidence Lost by C_R_Scott

This is a crossover with White Collar, which is a thing I had never heard of and is still something I’ve never watched.  I’ve read this probably 5 times, though. (More specifically, listened to the podfic).  Basically, the plot is Tim doesn’t die by Ra’s, but rather ends up without his memory (it explains how) as the main character of this White Collar show.  He’s basically a dude who steals and forges artwork, gets caught by the FBI, and now works for the FBI in NYC, instead of being in jail.  He crosses paths with the Waynes, and they quickly figure out he’s their Tim.  I love this story. 

Damian:

Innocence and Experience by redrobin1989

Damian gets dropped into the Young Justice world, and they have to deal with him being all prickly.  It’s been a long while since I’ve read this.  I think this is the one where Damian is Dick’s robin, so this is really his chance to spend time with his dad.  Dick gets all jealous.  I remember really liking this, though.  A lot.  I need to reread it.  

Falling Together by Raven_Queen

I’m behind on this.  I haven’t read the last several chapters and I need to, because I really liked it.  I’m not usually one to read F/M fics, especially not OC ship fics.  I tend to stick entirely within the Gen works.  But this was super cute.  Damian starts competing with a girl in his class academically, thinking they’re friends…. when actually he’s just being really mean.  But he fixes it and is so sweet to her.  Adorable.  

Ghosts That We Knew by fishfingersandjellybabies

Damian is dead.  But that’s okay, because he’s a ghost.  And he haunts the batfamily, kinda acting like their guardian angel.  Tim can see him, sometimes.   It’s great. I’ve read this twice.  

Jason & Dick:

View From Jade by lowlyingfruit

Jason gets thrown back in time, to the time just between Dick’s parents’ deaths and him becoming Robin.  He decides to intervene, because how dare Bruce make Dick Robin.  He learns a lot about his older brother in the process.

Tim & Damian:

Juneberries by Misha Berry

Tim gets kidnapped, and Damian feels guilty, the goes after him.  He ends up getting caught, too, and there is some great bonding between them.  Tim angst, too.

Bruce/Batfam

Foreign Object by audreycritter

Bruce has a brain tumor.  A super realistic fic following Bruce leading up to and then post-surgery.  It follows the entire batfam and looks at how it affects them all.  Very well done.  

Robins and Other Flightless Birds by ionaperidot

A Bruce from a different, nicer universe finds out that every other Batman has kids.  And he gets jealous.  And kidnaps a version of each of his canon kids from other universes.  (He doesn’t actually kidnap them. He finds kids who need help in other universes and brings them home.  Like Talon Dick, Catatonic Jason, Assassin Damian, etc). This is fantastic. I was sad when it ended.

There.  That’s a combined total of 1,666,066 words.  Thats… uh… a lot of 6s.  Enjoy!! :D