#romantic love with Chidi/Simone

[goabstract]

In the interview with Jeff Goldsmith, Jac Schaeffer taked about how Billy’s boyfriend Eddie is not Hulkling (whose name is Teddy), the canon romantic partner of Wiccan in the comics, but it’s not yet decided if he is indeed Hulkling.

While I hope he is not Hulkling because I found the I-found-my-true-love-in-high-school trope absolutely well-worn and boring, it also made me think about how they could play with a break up scenario of Billy’s boyfriend with his power.

They could easily make a scene like in The Good Place when Chidi is practicing a way to break up with Simone in this VR that Janet made (though in this case, he’d have to make this practice reality himself, and Agatha would help and become the stand-in for Eddie).

…which brings us to my next stream of thought, which is how great is it for the next series about them to be an actual sitcom. Billy and Agatha and their shenanigans. Something Wanda could watch from whichever realm she’s in.

[otogariado]

hi hello me again. Can I please ask TGP for the series ask game??

tgp my beloved

Give me a Series & I'll tell you...

❤ Favorite Guy: chidi 💖

❤ Favorite #Girl: don't make me choose between eleanor and tahani im not gonna do it 🥺🤧

❤ Favorite Pairing: sorry ik im supposed to mention only one but im gonna just mention all the ones i like. cheleanor, elhani, the ot3 (usually with eleanor as the hinge but tahani and chidi have their momence), janet and jason are all classics <33 post-canon mikeshawn esp as how iblankedonmyname writes them makes me unwell (positive). i liked chidi and simone together and i thought eleanor being into her was funny and cute. i read a fic (post-canon? but also not yet?) with janet and eleanor as the ship and it was really sweet and cute 🥺💖

on the topic of not necessarily romantic pairs, ofc i love michael and eleanor 💖 and honestly i think michael with each of the other three humans is very underrated. here's a fic i really like that explores each of them and here's another. tbh choose any two of the main six and write about them and i'll eat it up. if i had to choose just one, i really wish we got to see more chidi and jason. also hirael

❤ Least Favorite Character: umm derek?? he's pretty funny in s4 though

❤ who’s most like me: chidi. easiest one of these to answer so far. i've started using the phrase "i'm having a chidi moment" often recently

❤ most attractive: you're probably expecting a different answer but honestly?simone. she's sooo pretty and i like that she's a bubbly nerd. she's such a delight

❤ three more characters that I like: i love all of the main cast sm they're all so enjoyable <33 i already mentioned her but i think simone deserved more spotlight esp with a better conclusion to her character arc

[katoska]

Ok, so I’m still not happy about the Chidi Simone breakup, but:

Chidi decision to break up with Simone was the most purely selfless thing we ever saw him actually go through with in this show, and he didn’t seem to need to angst about it at all.

Like, Chidi didn’t just land himself in the Bad Place because his indecision and compulsive honesty made the people around him miserable. He went to the Bad Place because he coped with that indecision and honesty by picking a set of very strict rules to follow which validated his own POV; and when following the rules happened to get the people around him hurt, he still felt justified for following them because Ethics say he was supposed to be always honest and to be doubting his decisions.  But “Kant said it’s ok” is no excuse for hurting people, especially as Chidi is not acting out of good will when he follows Kantian Ethics , but because they validate his brain-weirdness.

But after his near-death experience he finally sought help. Simone told him that his brain washealthy and able to make decisions  - which I still believe to be a lie; dude nearly fainted when asked to pick a colour. But it was a helpful lie and it worked in pretty much the same way as Eleanor’s Best Person Sash and Tiara worked for her in Attempt 2, or when Simone told her that she was acting like a toddler, stuck in an earlier stage of psychological evolution, and was really just kind of a dick: It cut through layers of bullshit defence mechanisms and self-imposed rules and made him hold himself to a higher standard. And that was a powerful experience and he loved her for it and also because she’s gorgeous and smart and likes that he is weird.

Seriously, the probability that Simone has anything but a crazy high score is extremely low (unless she’s an angel, as I still believe), and even lower is the chance that she would believe him even if Chidi did slip up about the truth of the universe. If simple belief even dooms you, that is. Plus, there’s always Michael’s backup plan of killing people before their score gets too low...

But Chidi wasn’t going to take any chances. He knows that he is a pathological truther, he knows that it’s a problem and that he had been using ethics as an excuse to not deal with it. 

Plus, Chidi has a pretty good track record of making people miserable without any supernatural stuff, so I guess that might have been another factor. That’s also why he practised that break-up on fake!Simone first, putting himself through a anxiety-inducing, awkward situation again and again and again. 

He was trying so, so hard to spare her pain. That had been his only motive.

So he gave her up.

Not because of moral duty, or so he could feel good about himself or because he made a list and the pros outweighted the cons. 

Just because he loved her.

[mintchochipkookie]

im back bc i also wanna know ur good place opinions!! :D

HI again!! Haha thank you, I love answering these things.

my favorite female character Probably Eleanor. I love love love her character development, and it was really nice to see a female character who is just a mess and kind of an asshole because we don't see that enough. Eleanor is the kind of person you generally see as a male character and hey, women can be awful too! Jk, but not really. She's SUCH a different person by the end of the show, and her progression seems so natural, and she still stays true to herself, you know? I've seen this comparison being made before, but I think it's fairly accurate...Eleanor is like the Jake Peralta of the TGP.

my favorite male character Maybe Michael? If it isn't obvious by now, I am a slut for character development and Michael clearly goes through a ton of change. He gives me a vibe of 'man is just trying his best' and he's quite selfless and he loves his friends so much, it's great. Also, I love Michael and Eleanor's friendship.

my favorite season Hmm probably either S2 or S3.

my favorite episode You know, I'm not sure, but the S1 finale will always be stuck in my brain. It was a great plot twist, very well executed. A weird thing that makes me happy, is that Eleanor is the one who (almost always) figures it out. She's not just a dumb lazy chick ya'no? She's actually really smart, if only she applied herself, and I like that she always puts it together, not Chidi or Tahani.

my favorite cast member Idk a whole lot about any of them tbh, but! This Hot Ones episode made me like Kristen Bell. Also, Manny Jacinto's cheekbones and face in general 💯 like congrats on being effortlessly gorgeous my guy. (He also just seems like a nice, quiet dude lol)

my favorite ship I actually don't have one. Like, there's no romantic relationship I care about that much? Idm Eleanor/Chidi, and Chidi/Simone was cute too. I'm mostly a fan of the friendships everyone has with each other.

a character I’d die defending Honestly, all the main 6 are incredible and I will defend them all. But Jason probably gets the most shit for being "the dumb one" and while I do wish we got MORE for his character, I love him.

a character I just can’t sympathize with Idk if there's anyone? Probably Derek cuz he's just...there.

a character I grew to love Probably Tahani. She's kinda snooty but I love her and her backstory! I really do empathise with her a lot. She also grows so much and is ultimately a really caring friend and does a lot of internalising and self-growth.

my anti otp Don't think there's anything in canon to really dislike?

Send me a fandom ask

[zalrb]

i’m kinda curious on why you didn’t like chidi and elenor

Well on the one hand, I did not think they had chemistry. I just did not believe them romantically, they are both great actors -- I actually really like Kristen Bell -- and they both did a good job in their roles but together, it was just really flat, I didn’t believe romantic tenderness or intimacy, I didn’t believe the heartbreak or the angst, it even felt cold to me that I would just check out because otherwise I’d get annoyed

An article actually perfectly sums up how I felt about it:

For all of Kristen Bell and William Jackson Harper’s impressive efforts, Chidi and Eleanor simply don’t have the kind of swooning chemistry necessary to make the twists in the story of their romance work. Every time Chidi and Eleanor kissed or declared their love for one another, I was left feeling nothing at all. Or worse yet, annoyed, because the lack of romance serves to highlight how marvelously their chemistry works within a friendship instead.

On the other hand, in season one, there was so much done to build Eleanor and Chidi’s friendship, there was all this development that I could believe, even though I didn’t think it was necessary, that Eleanor had fallen in love with him, the realization had me like, oh we’re going there? I can see it but eh ... and it was as if the writers felt like because they did all that work in season one, when they put Team Cockroach through various tests and trials in the later seasons, they didn’t feel the need to rebuild that and usually, that would be fine, usually that would make sense, usually that is what you do with characters but considering that the group or one person in the group has their respective and collective memories erased with each test and trial, I didn’t believe the bond as the series went on because the show didn’t work for it, it relied on what was shown in the first season especially between Chidi and Eleanor where all the show did was be like, Chidi, Eleanor look at these tapes, here are your memories, boom! love! and it just became rushed and unearned because I didn’t see these realizations of romantic love in real time, they were perfectly content as friends or acquaintances and then the plot would be like, OK love time! and then it would suddenly be like, OH I LOVE CHIDI/ELEANOR!  and I just didn’t believe it.

Especially when a character like Simone comes into the mix and she actually does have chemistry with Chidi and they feel natural and organic and they complement each other really well

and they actually do get each other until the show, in my opinion, tweaked Simone’s character:

but I'm not even talking about her boundaries, I think it's perfectly fair for her to not be open to Brent, this is mostly about how she's acting in relation to Chidi, and while she is in a new environment and confused, semblances of the old Simone should be there but the show has stripped that away because they want her to be an obstacle for Eleanor and Chidi while also not being an actual threat and I think it's changed her character.

It’s also one of the issues I had with Jason and Janet where they relied too heavily on season 1.

[bookspined]

❝ that’s all history is after all: scar tissue. ❞

{ cis-man, he/him }  huh, who’s FROY GUTIERREZ? no, you’re mistaken, that’s actually SCORPIUS MALFOY. he is a TWENTY-TWO year old PUREBLOOD wizard who is A HEALING APPRENTICE. he is known for being CAPTIOUS, RETICENT, FACETIOUS, DISMISSIVE, and DRAMATIC but also RESOURCEFUL, CONSCIENTIOUS, FERVENT, INNOVATIVE, and OBSERVANT, so that must be why he always reminds me of the song IN DREAMS BY BEN HOWARD. i hear he is aligned with THE ORDER OF THE PHOENIX, so be sure to keep an eye on him. { merry, 24, gmt, she/they }

CHARACTER PARALLELS: Amy Santiago (B99), Claire Temple (Daredevil), Chidi Anagonye (The Good Place), Giles (Buffy TVS), Michelle Jones (MCU), Simon Tam (Firefly), Elizabeth Swan (PoTC), Spock (Star Trek), Clarke Griffin (The 100), Harley Keener (MCU), Gregory House (House) suggested honorable mention Gizmo (Gremlins) 

pinterest [blood, medical imagery tw]

wanted connection ideas

Full Name: Scorpius Hyperion Malfoy Gender/Pronouns: Cis man | he/him Age: Twenty-three Birthdate: January 20th Parents: Draco Lucius Malfoy & Astoria Céline Malfoy (née Greengrass) [Not biologically Astoria’s due to her health, if you ever point this out he’ll flay your eyeballs] Siblings: N/A. Birth place: St. Mungo’s Hospital, England Height: 5’11” Weight: 56 kg Sexual/Romantic Orientation: Demiromantic Bisexual Nationality: British Body Alterations/Marks: A ragged diamond shape scar at the base of his throat.

Blood Status: Pureblood Hogwarts House: Slytherin Wand Arm: Right Pet: His pet toad, Jarvis, recently passed away. Patronus: Arctic Fox Wand: 11 2/3 inches, Willow, Supple, Dragon Heartstring.

Willow is an uncommon wand wood with healing power, I have noted that the ideal owner for a willow wand often has some (usually unwarranted) insecurity, however well they may try and hide it. While many confident customers insist on trying a willow wand (attracted by their handsome appearance and well-founded reputation for enabling advanced, non-verbal magic) my willow wands have consistently selected those of greatest potential, rather than those who feel they have little to learn. It has always been a proverb in my family that he who has furthest to travel will go fastest with willow.

Personality Traits: Brilliance, innovative, empathetic, individuality, openness, social consciousness, inventive, logical, practical skills and self assertion; lack of attachment to people outside his circle and the “real world,” over-intellectualizing of the emotions, dismissive, anxious, crotchety tempered, facetious, rigid, prone to self-isolation, intellectual arrogance, and stubborn. Zodiac Sign: Aquarius/Capricorn Cusp Moral Alignment: Neutral Good Core values: Loyalty, Knowledge, Hope Four temperaments: Melancholic  

HOGWARTS HOUSE ANALYSIS

Slytherin Primary and a Burned Ravenclaw Secondary.

Slytherin Primaries prioritize their own selves and loved ones first. Slytherins don’t feel guilty or selfish about this– they feel righteous and moral. The most important thing is to look after your own. Abandoning or hurting one of your own is the worst thing you can do.

A Burned Ravenclaw Secondary might want to be skilled, curious, and prepared, but they feel like they are (or like people think they are) limited, clumsy, or inconstant. Gathering knowledge, hobbies, skills, or tools is the right way to achieve their goals, but Burned Ravenclaws know that’s not going to work within their capabilities. So they take other paths and use other tools– maybe a Gryffindor’s bluntness, a Slytherin’s flexibility, or a Hufflepuff’s slow and steady dedication.

You may have a Hufflepuff Secondary Model.

Hufflepuff is the House of grit, reliability, and determination, and Hufflepuffs use those values to help live, act, and succeed. If you model Hufflepuff Secondary, you also value these things and like to live by them. You like to be hardworking, dedicated, and consistent– but you wouldn’t feel guilty for abandoning those values in the service of other, higher priorities. If there’s another, easier way to get what you want– you’d take it. You think hard work provides valuable rewards– and those rewards are why you work. The work doesn’t have persuasive value in itself.

Despite his very best resistance he’s always been pretty empathetic in nature, he tries to rule his emotions as well as he can but fails more often than not. He was always one of those toddlers that if another kid started crying he’d be right along with them, not because he wanted attention but because he just couldn’t not. A bit of a crybaby, has researched how to magically seal up his tear ducts. Obviously managed to keep the family’s flair for the dramatic there as well. After a few years he leant into the sarcastic vague-snobbishness to hide the core of overwhelming anxiety.

Just managed to scrape through his schooling with nearly all top grades, this isn’t really due to him being a model student. He has always accrued information with a voracious appetite. Any knowledge he could find, even if most people would consider it entirely useless. His mind clicks into that place? You can’t keep him away. However, when there is not an immediate stir of interest on his approach to a topic he has to fight with himself tooth and nail to carry on. 

Predictably found exam season highly stressful, was never open about it but was quietly competitive and silently smug over his good grades. Could comprehend well above his reading level from an early age and would often look into experimental research and complicated magic but found himself lost in OWL level History of Magic when chapter upon chapter lay ahead of him about something that didn’t catch his interest. Some people he beat just to spite cause he hates them. It worked, whatever.

Tends toward introversion and finds himself tired sometimes quite easily by a large amount of social interaction. Witty and big-mouthed when he feels comfortable or is in the presence of those that embolden him and very likely to get flustered and snap at people when things are becoming a bit too much. Especially if he feels however unjustly that someone is blocking his escape. Has matured slightly in this since leaving school but it happens still, he’s just anxious. Quite fickle and can at the drop of a hat decide that he’s done with you for the day once his Give Me Attention Meter is maxed. Could be an absolute bloody brat when he felt like it but feels he has grown out of it, which he mostly has.

Always been very, very aware of many people’s distrust of him and his family, he used to sneer and play it up if anyone tried to bring up his dad and go on the offensive but was genuinely affected quite deeply by it all. In his early school years, despite his weakness to the cold, he constantly had his sleeves rolled up to the elbow so that his blank forearm was bared as a statement to just about everyone. I am not marked, I never will be. Now he’s older he has more of a handle on things and can be diplomatic in situations where people are clearly discomforted by his presence and his family history.

Even though the war culminated far earlier in this verse I imagine Scor would have had to have been relatively sheltered as a child if not for how emotionally sensitive and prone to periods of ill-health he was, it was definitely for his own safety. He is still the grandson of a known high-ranking Death Eater and that made him a media target and put one on his back for anyone else that might happen to be watching. 

Never produced much of a talent for offensive magic and wouldn’t resort to those methods unless he had literally no other choice, not a front line fighter by any means. His talents with strategy, potion-making, healing and his perseverance with defensive magic are what define him to the Order. While everyone kind of knows who he hung out with at school and who his friends are he is deliberately very mischievous with releasing rumours and misleading people. He deliberately keeps his cards very close to his chest so most people don’t know that he is aligned with anyone, he usually uses glamours or a scarf to conceal his identity if he has to. 

While he is knowledgeable about healing and anatomy, he is the WORST at taking care of himself. The literal embodiment of Healers make the worst patients, tends to forgo sleep and basic bodily needs if he’s locked into what he’s focusing on. Sometimes needs reminders to sleep and eat, like a child. 

Healing is the most satisfying part of his life and he would never give it up, he likes to experiment as he has a fascination with magic and muggle science and where they might intersect. A fucking nerd honestly. While he thinks he’s being fairly subtle about it a large part of his academic life has been doused in research into blood maledictions, for obvious reasons. He does his best not to flutter too obviously around his Mum. She is capable and ten times stronger than he is. 

Lives in a small studio flat in Diagon Alley that is mostly stacks of books and makeshift shelves.

the stillness of the world the moment you take the first step into fresh snow, cashmere and fine wool, the pearlescence of dreamless sleep draught, the scratch of a quill on parchment, faintly tremoring fingers, a shiver up your spine in a warm room, the exhilaration of a problem solved, a thunderous grey overcast sky, the bite of a stitching charm, sleeves rolled up to the elbows, petrichor, the burn in your eyes before a well of tears.

Always had somewhat fragile health tending toward sickly. Hands are never warm, his existence is an endless heat seeking mission. 

Went to one Slug Club meeting and used his time to verbally berate and or challenge most of the contacts in attendance, he was not asked to return. 

Potions Club, Charms Club, used to sometimes be willing to be dragged to Dueling Club but didn’t enjoy himself. 

Plays quite a bit of chess.

Bruises like a fucking peach and scars so easily.

Views quidditch as a good fly spoiled. 

Is a very skilled pianist almost entirely due to his Grandmother’s tutelage. 

Surprisingly great with children/toddlers/babies, no one including himself expected this, he mostly feared them beforehand. 

Bit of a mummy’s boy in that he practically GLOWS when people talk of Astoria’s achievements. 

When he has time off from healing he will have chipped black nail varnish on. 

Highly intelligent but rarely manages to match a pair of socks, chews his quills but no one else’s. 

While very eloquent and well spoken, he is markedly less posh than when he first arrived at Hogwarts.

When he isn’t prone to bouts of insomnia he can take a nap pretty much anywhere. He was once found in a tree after several frantic hours search.

[ CREDIT : CHARACTER PSD template by @karmahelper (defunct url) I tried to find a current social this week by messaging around but couldn’t find anything unfortunately. Forgot to copy this over from the google doc! ]

[jinxviolets]

7, 22, 32 !!!

7. do you prefer poems or love letters?

hmMMm i think there is something so wonderful about poetry but i also feel like love letters are, in a way, more accessible! maybe let’s say letters because i LOVE writing/receiving them and you can include so much silliness in them alongside sincerity if you’re making it a love letter 💝

22. fictional crushes?

oooo this is fun! let’s see... steve rogers, valkyrie, chidi anagonye, peeta mellark, to name a few 😂

32. favorite romcom (or any romantic movie)?

PRIDE AND PREJUDICE (2005)

honorable mentions: 10 things i hate about you, 13 going on 30, isn’t it romantic, the way he looks, enchanted, love simon (i have a soft spot for queer films & romcoms from the ‘00s 😂)

send me a number? (include a 💞 & i’ll find you a meme valentine!)

[dreamerinsilico]

Thanks to The Good Place s4 having made its way to Netflix, and me having Feelings, I’m going to take a bit to publicly chew on them now. 

TL;DR: same as basically every take I’ve seen, it was a great finale that handled each of the characters in a way that made sense and also I cried through most of the last episode.  But also I have vaguely cranky philosophical ruminations about it that don’t make me appreciate the show any less, but definitely want to yap about it.

(Details under the cut, because spoilers and also this may get long.  Also apparently it’s going to involve some spoilers for The Old Guard.  And maybe a few minor NBC Hannibal references.)

So, first I want to reiterate: the way the show ended, given everything else the show had done, made sense and was emotionally satisfying to me.  I loved it.

In a bigger-picture sense, though... I’d really like to see more media that interfaces with the concept of immortality without concluding that death is the only way to give the human (or humanoid) existence meaning.  Where we end up in the finale of The Good Place makes sense, in that it’s already been established that there’s an afterlife that doesn’t really have any inherent meaning beyond individual souls’ experiences of it and their relationships with one another.  And it’s not hard to imagine that a lot of the small dramas and conflicts that provide variation to even very peaceful lives would be invalidated without any kind of pressure from those material needs.  Given the foundations of the show, Our Heroes’ decision about how to change The Good Place for the better is... the only reasonable conclusion.  

And, you know, I don’t blame the show for not being The piece of media I’m hoping for to just come out and say outright, “you know, actually fuck this whole death thing.  Not a fan.  Don’t need it.  Let’s get rid of it.”  That’s not what this show was ever even remotely trying to be about.  It’s about coping with the reality of the human experience in the 20th/21st century, which includes death.  (Even with my transhumanist leanings, as a bioengineer and also someone who ardently pays attention to other fields, I will not even hint at denying that this is going to be a mandatory part of our reality for quite a while yet.)

The conclusion the show draws that I very much do agree with (regardless of one’s stance on death) is that we require some form of tension to inject meaning.  When I picture myself in the Final Form of the Good Place, I think most of my energy and desire would be focused on (I guess like a combo of Chidi and Tahani) asking questions of people there, and making peace with relationships that had somehow been left hanging.  There’s a finite amount of each of those.  I’d run out eventually.  My scientific passion would have a hard time finding an outlet, because the laws of physics don’t apply and I can’t interface with living people who could still make use of my expertise and stubborn propensity to problem-solve.  I’d like to think my creative leanings would still matter, but I’m not positive to what degree they would in that environment.  (It’s worth a chuckle to me now that when they offhandedly noted that Shakespeare’s thousands of posthumous plays weren’t anywhere near as good as the ones he wrote on Earth, I was initially indignant.  But with further thought it makes sense that the longer one is removed from that tension I referenced previously, the harder it would be to make meaningful art.  Or to even have that art be appreciated by the audience, since, on the audience side, successful art plucks against the tension of the strings the audience itself carries.  And when your audience is restricted to people in paradise who have already at-least-mostly self-actualized....)

Something about the finale that I’m still chewing over how I feel about was the very last scene.  The implication of some form of reincarnation.  (If that wasn’t supposed to be the takeaway from that... well, please tell me, but I *think* I remember some kind of rewards card reference with Eleanor and Michael from an earlier season?)  The incurable romantic part of me appreciates the concept of reincarnation on principle, so that’s one thing.  It’s also entirely in keeping with Chidi’s metaphor about a wave returning to the ocean - that wave is gone; it’ll never be there again, but the stuff of it is still there and ready to take form again.  But the part of me that very much sympathizes with Simone and, while not being a neurologist, is very concerned with Theory of Mind... reincarnation doesn’t do much for that part.  If I die, and my metaphysical essence eventually shows up in a different human who has no connection via memory to their past lives... well, that’s very aesthetically pleasing, I guess, but the point to me is, the information was still lost.  When I died, my subjective experiences, memories, and capacity to act upon the world as Dae the Irascible Multi-Academic was lost, because my reincarnation doesn’t have access to that (much as I did not have access to my previous selves’s experiences).  

Anyway, speaking of incurable romantics, let’s talk about The Old Guard!  When I was previously starting to complain about no media that interacts with immortality as a concept avoiding the canard of “death gives life meaning,” I stopped myself.  Because you know what, The Old Guard didn’t fucking go there, and I’m proud of everyone who worked on it for that.  Booker thinks death is the answer because he has lost hope.  But the person he appeals to, the person he thinks he’s doing a favor, is Andy.  Who has lived millennia more than he has, lost the implied-love-of-her-life, and still has the will to keep going.  Her questioning of that is intrinsic to the storyline, but at NO POINT does she ever indicate she wants to die.  And Nile’s appearance reinvigorates her, even as she knows she now actually has an expiration date.  (And the expiration date is not what invigorates her.  It is Nile and the attendant situation reminding her of why they do what they do.)  I ultimately really like The Old Guard’s take on immortality, because it gives us a spectrum of reactions to it.  Nile, generally freaked-out and not happy about any of this but trying to do best by the people she loves.  Booker, jaded and wanting to end it all.  Andy, pretty jaded but when push comes to shove wants to keep fucking trying, and doesn’t just step back and abdicate responsibility when it’s clear she isn’t going to be around much longer.  Joe and Nicky, not necessarily always happy with their circumstances, but taking strength from their relationships, not just with each other, but with the group as a whole.  (I have a whole essay brewing, which may or may not eventually see the light, about their romantic connection being important but kind of only a part of their overall attitude about the group and how that is intensely important.) 

And because apparently I’m just going to keep tacking on essay-stubs to this one post, when I thought about how to start this, I also thought about how Hannibal Lecter (in NBC Hannibal) says, “The thought that my life could end at any moment frees me to fully appreciate the beauty and art and horror of everything this world has to offer.”  And I’m just kind of marinating in that (hah) for the moment because it represents a hedonism that The Good Place, in aggregate, rejects.  But you can’t really compare those two stances, because of course, Hannibal Lecter is a human, subject to human standards of beauty and horror.  I shouldn’t go off on a big tangent about this here, because the point of NBC Hannibal is emphatically not about immortality or mortality, but I felt it worth mentioning because a) hyperfixation and b) it’s an interesting thread in the wider discussion I’m interested in, that I like placing in context.

Anyway if you’ve bothered to read all of this, thank you profusely.  I have a lot of feelings about The Good Place which mostly boil down to “I loved it,” but I can’t help but poke at the whole death thing.  That’s kind of a sore spot for me in media.

[dollsome-does-tumblr]

The Good Place!

Favorite character: Chidi

Second favorite character: Tahani

Least favorite character: I don’t think I have one? 

The character I’m most like: Chidi. ANXIETYYYYYY! BOOKS! ANXIETYYYYYY!

Favorite pairing: I’m not very shippy about this show, but I guess Chidi & Eleanor! I especially loved them in the early days. I truly love an “I ship the neurotic stressed out one with the swaggery hot mess one” situation.

Least favorite pairing: I don’t think I have one? But I am VERY indignant that Tahani/Simone didn’t become a thing. (Okay, okay, technically I can appreciate that Tahani’s happily ever after didn’t need to involve romantic love.)

Favorite moment: I haven’t rewatched most of this show so I actually don’t have a very distinct memory of its events (shame, self! shame!), so I’m just going to say any time Tahani very casually name drops famous people. It never gets old.

Rating out of 10: 7/10. I really like this show overall, and I think it’s such a valuable exploration of being human and living with other humans, but I did find that as it went on, I occasionally felt a little burned out on it just because all the resets and forgetting and stuff made it difficult to keep the emotional continuity in the characterization & relationships alive. But the early days of this show as you watch Eleanor fumble her way through being in the Good Place and Chidi help her do it are just glorious.

[manycoloureddays]

If it’s not to late for tv ask: the good place! (I was going to say leverage but I’m pretty sure I know the answers 😂😂😂)

favourite male character:

how can i choose between chidi and jason?? it should be illegal to choose between chidi and jason!! they are both my favourite.

favourite female character:

again with the making me choose... it’s very rude, you know. i think eleanor just beats out tahani here for me.

least favourite character:

even the worst characters on this show are incredibly funny/serve a purpose in a way that makes me enjoy them... and then there’s brent. brent can win least favourite hands down.

prettiest character:

oh boy, this is another tie, this time it’s between tahani and jason.

funniest character:

i mean, they’re all hilarious and i’m tempted to choose jason again, but also maya rudolph is right there!! the judge, definitely.

favourite season:

i loved all of them, but i think you’d be hard pressed to find a better final season of television. 

favourite episode:

dance dance resolution; rhonda, diana, jake, and trent; and how could i not say janet(s)!?

favourite romantic ship:

jason/janet, chidi/eleanor, chidi/eleanor/simone, chidi/jason

favourite family ship:

TEAM COCKROACH

favourite friend ship:

tahani and eleanor!!

worst ship:

idk, i guess i when i saw people shipping michael/eleanor romantically it did not appeal?

[5typesoftrash]

T and X for the fandom meme asks!

T:  Do you have any hard and fast headcanons that you will die defending, about anything at all (gender identity, sexual or romantic orientation, extended family, sexual preferences like top/bottom/switch, relationship with poetry, seriously anything) - OKAY OKAY OKAY. I know that canonically Sam’s middle name is William (blech; I always go with James) but I HAVE A HEADCANON THAT DEAN’S IS MICHAEL. MICHAEL’S VESSEL’S MIDDLE NAME IS MICHAEL AND YOU SHALL NEVER CONVINCE ME OTHERWISE

X: top 5-10 characters who are yoUR PRECIOUS BABIES AND YOU WILL DIE DEFENDING THEM: Sam! Winchester! Is! Baby! Love! Him! So! Much! also Alec Lightwood, Kevin Tran, Charlie Bradbury (as well as my Charlie @writingisntahobby202), Simon Lewis, Chidi Anagonye, Finn, Poe, and do @specialagentrin and @fandomallthetime24601 count?

[bepoets]

1,15,32&34

Thank you ellie!!!

1.) Top 5 TV Shows

Wow I’m so glad you asked I’m sure this will come as a complete surprise

- The West Wing (Netflix)

- Parks and Rec (Netflix & Hulu)

- Fleabag (Amazon Prime)

- Santa Clarita Diet (Netflix)

- Brooklyn Nine-Nine (Hulu)

Honorable mentions to The Good Place which I cant list in good conscience cause I haven’t finished it and to New Girl because it is my comfort show even though she is a messy bench sometimes

15.) Top 5 Funniest Characters

I’m sticking with only tv characters for this list okay okay

- Doug Judy (Brooklyn Nine-Nine)

- Jason Mendoza (The Good Place)

- Moira Rose (Schitt’s Creek)

- Captain Raymond Holt (Brooklyn Nine-Nine)

- [first name redacted] Schmidt (New Girl)

Honorable mention to President Bartlet in The West Wing because I truly think he’s the funniest character on that show and that scene where he’s high on pain meds is *chefs kiss*

32.) Top 5 Scenes

I’m doing two seperate lists for tv shows and movies oh noooo

Top 5 Scenes (Movies)

- The final scene in Unicorn Store where Kit is talking to the Unicorn telling the Unicorn that another little kid needs them and that the unicorn is going to be that little kids best friend and the unicorn will believe in them more than anything in the world.

- The final scene in You’ve Got Mail where Kathleen Kelly and Joe Fox meet one riverside park and she cries and he says “don’t cry shopgirl” and she says “I wanted it to be you, I wanted it to be you so badly” and then the kiss and oh my god I want to cry thinking about it.

- In Love, Simon the scene where Simon talks to his Mom and she says “you get to exhale now, Simon. You get to be more you than you’ve been in a very long time.”

- The Show Yoursef scene in Frozen 2

- The Something Good scene in Sound of Music because I’m convinced that’s the most romantic scene in media history nothing will ever top that my heart grows three sizes thinking about it.

Top 5 Scenes (TV Shows)

- Leo’s “A Man Falls in a Hole” speech in S2E10 of The West Wing

- President Bartlet’s speech in the National Cathedral in S2E22 of The West Wing

- The scene in Fleabag S2 where Fleabag is talking about her mom who’s died and says “I don’t know where to put it now. All the love I have for, I don’t know where to put it.” And Boo says “I want it, give it to me.”

- The scene in Fleabag S2 where she’s talking to her dad and he says “I think you know how to love better than any of us, that’s why you find it all so painful.”

- The scene in The Good Place finale that I haven’t watched yet where Chidi talks about the wave returning to the ocean

34.) Top 5 Finales

- Parks and Rec S6 finale

- Santa Clarita Diet S2 finale

- The West Wing S2 Finale (and S1 finale and series finale)

- The Good Place Series Finale which I haven’t watched yet but I know it is

- New Girl series finale

[zalrb]

In what ways do you think tgp got worse? (I'd love gifs but thanks regardless)

I don’t really think this is something I can explain with gifs because even though I thought TGP got worse, it was still a high calibre show in the context of pretty much everything else that was on at the time.

But I think my main issue was that there was so much groundwork done in season 1 to make us care about Chidi, Eleanor, Jason, and Tahani + Janet and Michael as individual characters and then as a group, there was so much done to build Eleanor and Chidi’s friendship, there was all this development and it was as if the writers felt like because they did all that work in season one, when they put Team Cockroach through various tests and trials in the later seasons, they didn’t feel the need to rebuild that and usually, that would be fine, usually that would make sense, usually that is what you do with characters but considering that the group or one person in the group has their respective and collective memories erased with each test and trial, I didn’t believe the bond as the series went on because the show didn’t work for it, it relied on what was shown in the first season especially between Chidi and Eleanor where all the show had to do was be like, Chidi, Eleanor look at these tapes, here are your memories, boom! love! and it just became rushed and unearned. And the same thing happened with Jason and Janet. And because I didn’t care about Chidi and Eleanor as a romantic couple nor did I care about Jason and Janet, and soon their bonds with each other became the heart of the show with Michael and Elenaor’s relationship sharing the importance, I just stopped caring as much about what I was watching. I liked Team Cockroach as Team Cockroach but they lost the magic of that group as a whole when they decided to focus on either Eleanor and Chidi or the group’s respective bonds to Eleanor and not to each other, altogether.

And then the jokes just didn’t have the same cleverness to it that it once did with a few standout episodes per season. Jason was really the only character I was watching for after a while. I really liked Simone (I liked her better with Chidi) but I thought they rewrote her character when she became a semi-regular character to put Chidi and Eleanor’s relationship in a better light. And then I didn’t care about the group she was a part of because they didn’t do the work to make me care about them but the show wasn’t about Team Cockroach at that time either, it was more about Eleanor in her new position. It was just slowly flaming out and I think Schur knew that which is why he ended in season 4 when it was still an objectively good show and not terrible.

[sage-nebula]

I think my favorite thing about the final season of The Good Place so far is how, even though the characters think they’re the ones teaching and testing the four new humans, in reality, the original four humans are the ones facing their final tests with regards to their fatal flaws, to see if they can overcome them once and for all.

In order:

Eleanor’s fatal flaw was her selfishness. She prioritized her own happiness, ignored others, and lashed out at them when she felt that her own happiness / sense of self was threatened by them, either by them being better than her, or them leaving her. In this season, she has not only had to give up her relationship for Chidi for the sake of humanity, but she’s had to push him toward his ex-girlfriend and tell him that they’re soulmates, will presumably have to watch them be together, and will have to accept that. She backslid with torturing Chidi, but she realized her mistake by the end of the episode and has worked on correcting that. It’ll likely be something she’s working with / struggling with all season, because again, her selfishness was her fatal flaw, the biggest obstacle to her being a good person, and as such she has to pass a final test to prove, once and for all, that she has overcome it.

Jason’s fatal flaw was his impulsiveness. He always flew by the seat of his pants and did whatever would bring him the most desired emotional reward the quickest, whether this was by throwing a molotov cocktail into AcidCat’s boat or doing whippets in a safe. In this season, he has not only faced direct consequences related to jumping on his first emotional impulses (e.g. the fallout of rebooting Derek), but since Janet has broken up with him, he is in a situation where there isn’t a quick and easy way to get the emotional response that he wants. He wants to be with Janet, but refusing to accept the breakup would only make her angrier, which would make the situation worse. Realizing this and adhering to it---reining in those emotional impulses and not acting on them---is the final test that Jason is dealing with so far this season.

Tahani’s fatal flaw was her pride, which in her case manifested as an obsession with status. Tahani had a deep, powerful need to not only be at the top of the line for everything, but for everyone to know that she was at the top of the line for everything, and for everyone to admire her for being at the top of the line for everything. In this season, she has been faced with someone who is both fully aware that she was at the front of top of the line for everything, and who resented and, on some level, even hated her for it (which, by the by, is not too different from how she felt about Kamilah for the longest time; she’s now getting to see what it feels like to be on the other side of that velvet rope). Tahani’s challenge this season, as we’ve especially seen in the last episode, is going to be not only learning to not care about and be less obsessed with status, but also realizing once and for all that there are not only some things that can’t be solved with name-dropping and shows of status, but that at times such a thing actually makes situations worse, and that she needs to connect with people on a more personal level if she’s going ot help them.

Lastly, Chidi’s fatal flaw was his indecisiveness (and not his anxiety as so many think). No matter how trivial the situation, Chidi was never able to make a decisive choice while alive (or often in the afterlife), which not only made those around him miserable depending on the situation (e.g. wasting recess for the other kids, messing up a potential wedding for a good friend), but also made him miserable because he was never actually able to enjoy anything because he never committed to it. The interesting thing about Chidi, of course, is that he has had his memory erased, which means that he can’t be tested via the new humans like the others are. However, I believe this is because the show is setting Chidi up to have his final test at the end. Near the end of season one, Chidi was put into a position where he had at least three women who had expressed romantic interest in him: Eleanor, Tahani, and Vicky-pretending-to-be-Good-Eleanor. He never actually made a choice back then; instead, whenever the subject was brought up, he begged them not to make him choose, got a stomachache, and basically just demonstrated that the torture Michael had set up was working. While it’s not exactly the same situation, this season has also set up a love triangle for Chidi: There’s Eleanor, who is in love with him and who he was in love with before his memories were erased, and Simone, who he once had a relationship with (though neither of them remember it) and who he now believes is his soulmate. I think that the end of the season will have Chidi regain his memories, and thus have to make a choice between Eleanor and Simone, and that Chidi will pass his final test of overcoming his deepest flaw when he’s able to decisively choose one of them (whichever one that ends up being).

While these tests obviously don’t exist in-universe for the original four at this point, I absolutely think that the way their arcs are unfolding in season four is an intentional writing decision meant to show that, despite all the reboots, these characters truly have grown over the past three seasons and are finally achieving what they set out to, intentionally or otherwise. Each of them has worked hard at overcoming their fatal flaws, they’ve gotten better and stronger with it each time, and we’re going to finally see them overcome those flaws once and for all at the culmination of this season.

And I, for one, can’t wait to see how that all unfolds.

[jaggedwolf]

So, during my haze of wisdom teeth extraction recovery last week, I went on a kick of binging clips/episodes of my favorite mundane live-action television shows from this decade, old ones and currently airing ones alike: Crazy Ex Girlfriend, Brooklyn Nine Nine, Parks and Recreation. 

And it actually helped me crystallize my thoughts on what’s been lacking in the latest seasons of The Good Place and Jane The Virgin and my recent dissatisfaction with said shows.

What’s missing is really, really simple.

It's respect for the internality for the major characters that are not the main lead.

Because, let’s be real, all of these shows have a central lead that things hinge on. There’s exactly one episode of B99 where Jake isn’t in the A plot. Eleanor Shellstrop finds out she’s in the good place when she shouldn’t be. Every episode of JtV starts with the narrator telling us how old Jane was during some significant moment of her life. It’s the nature of the beast, a focus that’s more necessary for some show structures than others.

But the shows are stronger when they shine a little light on what the world looks like from those other, non-lead characters. It doesn’t have to be present in every episode, but it does, I think, have to be a conscious, consistent thread throughout.

For instance, B99 starts off as Jake’s story, as he snipes at Amy and gets annoyed at the robot captain, but within its first two episodes makes it clear that the next perspective we’re interested in is that of said captain. Parks and Rec takes a while to set up Leslie herself, let alone the rest of the cast, but it gets there in the end. No matter what you might think of the finale, it’s emblematic of the show that both it and Leslie are interested in where everyone ends up. Even jokes about Jerry are offset by his perfect personal life, late-game randos like Craig/Typhoon get flash-forwards that have nothing to do with Leslie.

CXG is an interesting case because, I’d argue, it has the tightest point of view of any of those five shows. We’re mostly in Rebecca’s head, and the other characters often gain complexity when Rebecca realizes they have it - see Paula’s progression from helpful best friend to someone with her own dreams. Yet even Season 1 manages to shed some light on those characters’ internal worlds. “I’m So Good At Yoga” is how Rebecca sees Valencia, but “Women Gotta Stick Together” is how Valencia sees herself, y’know?

And so I was musing on why I felt underwhelmed by the latest TGP season, and this framework has helped me figure out why. The latter half of the season fails to be invested in the internality of characters other than Eleanor and Michael.

Take the culmination of Eleanor/Chidi getting together, the latest in the many iterations that have happened in canon, but the first that the viewers get to witness. This iteration of Chidi’s sudden reciprocated interest was unconvincing to me, even though I was fine with the idea of them well enough in the first two seasons. Then the finale happened and the machinations behind said resolution of the romance became so transparent I found myself rolling my eyes.  They needed Chidi/Eleanor to be together, so that Eleanor could feel bad about the mindwipe, so Chidi needs to quickly like her back already.

To get to the point of Eleanor realising she likes Chidi at all, we have Michael give her all her memories back. But no one else gets or is interested in having all their memories back, and the show seems utterly uninterested in that question.

Despite their small moments to shine, it kinda felt like there wasn’t really much for Chidi or Tahani or Jason to do or contribute to the plot momentum in the last few episodes, beyond saying some wacky thing that’s in-character for them. That might be where I’m not a fan of the 13 episode season. As much as people praise the tightness that structure gives to the story, I think if writers are used to the space of 22 episodes, that shorter season can unexpectedly leave the cast feeling empty. You can’t afford episodes focused on a character, you can’t afford a status quo, you’re too busy keeping the plot going.

Now, Jane The Virgin. To be honest, this show overwhelmingly did and does a great job with the internality of non-Jane characters. Even if the narrator has his favorites, we get a far more expansive view of the world than what Jane sees. Think of how we had an entire detective mystery plot around Sin Rostro in Season 1 that doesn’t even touch Jane until the season finale.

All of that makes how it handled Michael’s return majorly disappointing, and I say this as someone who never cared much about Mr Cordero. 

Even after he gets his memory back, and we’re dealing with the awkward hybrid of Michael-Jason, he is only ever presented in the context of Jane, and it feels very...artificial? He gets his memories back and heads to Montana because he can’t be with Jane, never mind all the other people he knows and loves in Miami, like his mom and his friends.

No other pre-existing character talks to Michael after he gets his memories back other than Jane. Rogelio goes on and on about whether Jason might remember him, but once Michael’s around, we hear nothing about him meeting him. Nope, this version of Michael serves no purpose other than as a possible romantic prospect for Jane. 

And it stands out because of how the show is normally very decent at peering into the worlds of the non-Jane characters and their lives outside of Jane. We get to see Xo reach out to Rafael about how he’s doing, we get to see Petra/JR rebuild their relationship, but with Michael, none of that. 

Culminating in everyone’s very weird assumption that of course he’s just going to stay in Montana if he doesn’t get with Jane, that he has no attachment to Miami on his own. He lived there before he ever met her! He has family there, and clearly getting back to detective work sparked something in him! Apparently the answer to “Who is Michael-Jason outside of Jane?” is just “Jason”!?

It feels super off. Maybe they’ll surprise me and he’ll pop back up later to deal with Rose, but I think its still a major misstep for the show’s initial presentation of his return to be so laser-focused on Michael/Jane.

Anyway, it was nice to be able to boil down this feature as something that apparently matters to me in television. Because I'm fond of plenty of self-centered book protagonists, but when you have the framing device of television? A lot harder to convince me the myopic view is that of the starring character, and not of the writers themselves.

[supersexybisexual]

mmm The Good Place for the ask game?

Sorry it took so long for me to answer this! School and work are terrible.

my all-time ultimate fave character: This is really hard to choose. I love all of team cockroach and my favorite character just kind of depends on the episode. I think if I had to choose I’d go with Eleanor cause I just latch onto bisexual characters.

a character I didn’t used to like but now do: Hmm maybe Kamilah. I still drives me crazy how badly she treated Tahani throughout their life but the last season did give help show us that Kamilah was also a victim of their terrible parents abuse. 

a character I used to like but now don’t: I don’t think there are any characters that fit into his category. Considering this show is all about change and progress my opinion about characters has either improved or not changed. No ones really gone backwards for me.

a character I’m indifferent about: I feel pretty indifferent John. He had like one episode about him this season and just generally hasn’t been prominent enough for me to really care about him much. 

a character who deserved better: Tahani! Deserves! Better!

a ship I’ve never been able to get into: I guess I was never really sold on Tahani and Jason. I love them platoniclly I just don’t see it romantically.

a ship I’ve never been able to get over: Chidi and Eleanor hurt so me so much I just want them to be happy.

a cute, low-key ship: Janet and Jason are amazing together. There’s just something beautiful about a Floridan dumb ass being with an all knowing being. 

an unpopular ship but I still enjoyed it: This ship isn’t nesscarly unpopular but I would like to see more love for Simone and Chidi they go really great together. 

a ship that was totally wrong and never should have happened: Idk i guess Mindy and Derek is pretty fucked up. 

my favourite storyline/moment: I love so much from this show it’s so hard to choose. One moment that comes to mind is when Eleanor, Tahani, Jason, Chidi, and Janet all hid under the train to escape from the demons and when Micheal sees them safe he starts crying. It was just a really sweet moment and was the first time we really saw that they were all in it together.

a storyline that never should have been written: I honestly can’t think of anything. I like most everything that the show does. 

my first thoughts on the show: What a funny and creative show. I’m always looking for a new sitcom. 

my thoughts now: An unbelievably beautiful and powerful show. The philosophy of working hard everyday to become a better person then you were the day before and helping others to improve with you is something I try to live by. Very few pieces of media change the way I look at life and how I try to live and this is one of them.