#ppl are jumping the gun by applying where they want her arc to go to where it is currently

[pinkeoni]

Let’s examine the effect NINA actually had on El

This is branch off of this post I made about El’s superhero/monster dichotomy. tl;dr El’s internal conflict boils down to her belief that she is either a monster or a superhero, she can’t accept herself as being neither.

I feel like it’s a misconception that NINA has resolved El of this internal conflict, that she has now independence and realized that she is neither a hero nor a monster, just herself.

But I beg the question— did she really?

It was actually Brenner, the man of the hour, who gave El the speech about there being no such thing as superheroes and monsters.

(I feel like this joke has been made before, but it’s just so easy 😂)

Papa is telling El to confront the demons of her past, that she is more complex than she gives herself credit for.

But El does not take this lesson to heart, instead we have this confrontation between here in Papa in 4x08—

I do think that El realizing that she isn’t a monster and that she is a victim of her environment is a good thing. El has used violence in the past because it is what she was taught and what she was pushed to do. So, this is at least a step in the right direction.

But the problem is, El has not resolved her core issue, which is her dualistic way of thinking.

El doesn’t take the lesson that there are no heroes and monsters, but rather takes the monster label from herself and sticks it onto Papa. And don’t get me wrong, Papa has done terrible and unforgivable things. But the fact that El continues to have this hero and monster mindset means that there is still a conflict that needs to be resolved going forward.

When El went into NINA, she went in with the mindset that it was going to make her a superhero.

So El’s personal goal isn’t really to remedy her way of thinking, but actually to become a superhero and and erase this monster label that she has on herself, influenced partially by these visions of the massacre that she keeps recieving. She believed that she killed all those kids herself. After her talk with Papa it seems like she’s going to confront these demons head on, but what NINA actually ends up telling her is that she didn’t kill all of those kids and that she was the one who actually punished the killer by unlocking a new power and sending him to a different dimension.

Papa tries to tell her that she was the one who released him from his prison, but El combats by saying that Papa’s actions are what pushed One to do so in the first place. Now El is correct in her assessment of Papa’s abuse and the effect it had on both her and One, but again this isn’t El facing her inner conflict and rather deflecting it.

And the one who calls her out on this is another antagonist—

So El went into her fight with Vecna thinking she can win, because she is the superhero and she’s done it before and thinks she can do it again (See: “If you touch her again, I will kill you again”) and when she loses she blames herself, which Byler calls out—

El isn’t able to see her successes, the small sliver of hope she was able to offer in the darkness because she is too caught up in her way of thinking. But another thing is, El doesn’t really have something to fall back on— this is all she knows. She was raised to use violence and be a weapon, and she can either use that to be a monster, or use it to be a hero. If she can’t be the hero or the monster, then who is she?

[saotome-michi]

i'm mad because i thought yoi was going to end well. but i'm a little conflicted about the 'queerbaiting'/'fujobait'. i mean, yes, S1 ends with nothing concrete (i really hate that) but i think is part of the narrative to make victuuri canon. so, for the potential S2, the character's arcs are now longer so the resolution of the relationship needs to wait too (sadly). what do you think? (it's not my place to say anything about representation of gay couples, but the characters are clearly queer.)

same anon about yoi. i identify as queer. sorry if ‘queer’ is not a term you use, i know is not really acceptable to some people.

Hello anon,

No worries, I use “queer” to identify myself sometimes, but thanks for being considerate about it.

“Queerbaiting” as I’ve mentioned before is a term I believe to be specific to western media and its industry, and imo does not apply to YOI. “Queerbaiting” would imply that the creators were trying to draw in LGBT viewers- that’s not what YOI staff did. They tapped into a certain market- female viewers who enjoy pretty men and fanservice, all tied together in a pseudo relationship. While some of these women may be lgbt that’s not what defines them as a market demographic.

I’ve delved into the subject in other asks such as this one (http://saotome-michi.tumblr.com/post/155322617959/i-dont-mind-fans-calling-yoi-revolutionary-since#notes). LGBT fans such as yourself are mainly from the international fandom and though YOI staff are glad that you’re watching it they probably weren’t expecting you to for the reasons that you do. The portrayal of YOI as game-changing lgbt representation has come mainly from international fandom and has not been taken seriously by most Japanese anime viewers and has yet to receive any support from LGBT Japanese people, websites, etc (that I’m aware of at least. You’re welcome to search for yourself). Again this is probably due to YOI clearly being an anime for women and following in the footsteps of similar anime/manga with men in pseudo relationships.

Here is my prediction for season 2: Viktor and Yuuri will still not enter an explicit romantic relationship and they will still not get married. They will have domestic and flirty interactions, but they won’t be in a clearly established romantic relationship. They might learn more about each other and become closer (if kubo does her job right) but a concrete conclusion you will not get.

What do I base this on? Two things:

1. Kubo’s tweet (https://mobile.twitter.com/kubo_3260/status/768887667597520896)

This tweet has been shared far and wide across tumblr as YOI fans have generally interpreted this tweet as confirmation that Kubo wanted to write about a homosexual relationship.

Allow me to explain to you why such an interpretation is… jumping the gun to say the least.

Kubo’s tweet translates to: I have no interest in “I want a lover” stories or “I want to get married” stories and if there’s already so many man-woman romances than there’s no need for me to write them… I just want to write a wholesome, deep relationship… In which case I don’t feel it’s necessary to choose a man and a woman, well you’ll know it when you see it so that’s all I’ll say for now

This tweet establishes that Kubo wants to write about a deep relationship, which are notably different from romantic relationships. Kubo says she felt it wasn’t necessary to choose a man and a woman, implying that she could’ve. If she had chosen a man and woman to depict her deep relationship… Would they date? Would they get married? No - because that isn’t what Kubo is interested in… So why would she have Yuuri and Viktor be in an explicitly romantic relationship? Why would they date? Why would they get married?

2. The ending to Season 1 was what they had planned all along

This is based on what Kubo says in the fan-translated 2di interview. Basically, they didn’t change the ending for season 2, as many fans claimed or thought, indicating that Kubo never had an explicit relationship in mind. So she’ll probably do the same for season 2.

The only scenario I can see where Kubo would go the explicit, concrete route is if she somehow got influenced by international fandom and did it in order to keep her fans or something, but I doubt that happening.

I believe that as a queer person you absolutely do have a say in the representation of queer people, at least in how you relate to it. You just have to be mindful that other lgbt people have this right and that lgbt ppl living in different countries and cultures have different circumstances that you’re probably not familiar with. Personally for me it’s less about if they’re clearly queer or not and more if I should take any sign of queerness seriously…