#oh swink is an actual word. Oh!

[fragonreal]

silly little ship that I secretly enjoy. Spamhaterz

[adamwatchesmovies]

Stay Alive (2006)

While I didn't enjoy this film, that doesn't mean you won't. No matter what I say, the people involved in this project did it: they actually made a movie. That's something to be applauded. With that established...

When Miller (Adam Goldberg) inherits a video game from his recently deceased friend, he thinks nothing of it… until he realizes that Loomis’ real-life death is eerily similar to the one his avatar suffered. Unfortunately for Miller, Hutch (Jon Foster), Abigail (Samaire Armstrong), October (Sophia Bush), Phineas (Jimmi Simpson) and Swink (Frankie Muniz), they discover too late that if you die in Stay Alive, it’s not just the game that’s over, it’s your life.

Oh yes, Stay Alive is as dopey as it sounds. The only truly good thing about it is that when you see the footage of the game it actually looks like a real horror video game would. Every other aspect of this film is generic or irritating.

The first bug in this game is the characters, none of which you’ll care about or find likeable. It’s bad enough they’ve been written by someone who’s never interacted with a gamer. You sit and wait for the soon-to-be victims to be killed. When it comes to Phin, right now will not be soon enough. Unfortunately, even the deaths fail to satisfy. Many times they don’t make sense or seem to contradict the previously-established rules.

There’s a lot of horror movie noise here. Once Stay Alive gets booted up, we're constantly reminded that we should be scared. Shadows in the background, creepy noises, and ominous shots are pelted at the screen over and over until you just want to scream “Enough Already! I get it! This is a horror movie!” There’s no breathing room, meaning that even if there was tension, there’s no way the film could sustain it.

Video games are too new, and not in a way that they’re cryptic, weird and/or mysterious. Slipping a CD into your Playstation 2 and then grabbing a controller doesn’t inspire terror in any way - no matter what all the creepy pastas might say. Maybe if it centered around some weird text-based game someone dug up in their attic or something you just kind of stumbled upon. The Ring made a videocassette scary so anything’s possible. This? You wonder if the people involved even tried. The most fun you'll have is with the DVD menu. If you figure out which possible character goes with which shirt and which weapon, the correct combination gives you a secret word. Input them into the official website to create your very own morbid email signature. At least in theory you can. The website is no longer up.

Can you blame me for going into this one with no faith whatsoever? The premise of Stay Alive is dumb and it doesn’t even attempt to redeem itself with cool visuals, genuine scares, likeable characters, sparkling dialogue, tension or anything that makes a horror film noteworthy. I struggled to derive any enjoyment from it. Even when not taking the picture seriously and poking fun at the ludicrous plot out loud, this was a grind. Nothing awaits those who decide to check out Stay Alive. (On DVD, February 21, 2018)

[leverage-commentary]

Leverage Season 1, Episode 10, The Juror #6 Job, Audio Commentary Transcript

Chris: I’m Chris Downey, Executive Producer.

John: I'm John Rodgers, Executive Producer.

Rebecca: I’m Becky Kirsch, Writer.

Jonathan: Jonathan Frakes, Director.

John: And welcome to The Juror Number 6 Job of Leverage which was filmed late in the season, is meant to be broadcast late in the season, and is really one of our favorite episodes for the entire series. It’s interesting--

Jonathan: Watch the homage to Rear Window!

Rebecca: [Laughs]

John: Is it a Rear Window homage?

Johnathan: Watch this!

John: I’ve noticed--you know what? We’ve done two--this is our second commentary and I’ve noticed how often you use the word ‘homage.’

John and Chris: [laugh]

Jonathan: I was--I started by saying watch the ste- watch the rip off.

John: [laughs]

Jonathan: Here’s the steam. Right?

John: Yeah. Nice.

Rebecca: “Homage’ sounds [much] better.

Jonathan: And then there’s the steaming tea--heat. He goes down.

Rebecca: Oh oh oh oh!

Jonathan: Something bad’s happened to him from taking the drug we just saw him take.

John: Yep.

Jonathan: Scream.

John: Scream. Horror. Remember the--

Jonathan: And Hitchcock cuts to what? [imitating the sound of a tea kettle steaming] Shhhhhhhhhhhh!

Chris: There it is.

John: There you go.

Rebecca: Oh beautiful.

Jonathan: Total rip off.

John: Beautiful.

Chris: Beautiful special effects there.

[Rebecca laughs]

John: It’s lovely. And then the hot in. Which we don’t often see the team coming back from something.

Jonathan: No. I was under strict orders and I used it well, I think.

John: For what?

Jonathan: “Keep them moving.” John Rogers.

John: Keep them moving. Keep them up. Keep them moving--

Jonathan: I said it - then I called the office and said, you know, any of the problem with them talking and walking during all these scenes. As much as you can keep them out of the chairs, be my guest.

John: Absolutely. You know the Walk and Talk, as it’s known in television, is your friend. It really, you know, you need to keep them moving around in this set. Cause the problem is when actors sit, they emotionally sit.

Jonathan: Boy, so true-

Chris: Well also-

Jonathan: [Unintelligible]

Chris: We spent a lot of time in this conference room. And I think, by this time in the season, we were literally, creatively, getting antsy.

John: Yes!

Chris: And that’s why we gave that ‘Keep moving! Just move the camera around--’

Jonathan: Plus the actors like it ,too.

Chris and John: Yeah..

Jonathan: And it gives you a chance at a oner which is always a plus - it helps to make your day, the energy is better.

John: Yeah, it’s always better. Alright, uh, Kirsch!

Rebecca: Sir!

John: Filthy assistant--

Rebecca: [Chuckles]

John: --How did this episode come about?

Jonathan: [Also laughing]

John: That’s her nickname!

Rebecca: You ready for this one? It is! And I, And I ta- I wear it with pride. This episode came about in the room with our seven fabulous writers and we-- I think that, Chris, was this your original idea--?

Chris: Yes, it was.

Rebecca: --In order to have a jury? In which--

John: This was one of the ones that started with an ending and rolled backwards.

Chris: This is, yeah-

Rebecca: I think you are right! It did!

Chris: We didn’t do this very often but I--yeah, I had an ending for this and we worked backwards.

John: And so how did you develop--how did you do the research?

Jonathan: There’s your name, did you see your name on the screen?

Rebecca: I did, I did, it was very exciting.

John: There we go, written by Rebecca Kirsch!

Rebecca: Actually, Chris was a really great help, because I unfortunately don’t know a great deal about the legal system. So I purchased a book called Law 101 and I did some homework over the weekend, which was a really basic way to start things. And then Chris was really good to answer a lot of my questions about the technicalities of the order--

Jonathan: Brent Spiner!

Rebecca: [Laughing]

John: Yeah, Brent Spiner, ladies and gentlemen.

Jonathan: Star Trek.

John: This is the beginning of the Star Trek reunion.

Rebecca: Exactly.

John: And might we add, by the way, that the reason he knows about this. Chris actually used to defend the bad guys on Leverage.

Chris: Yes, yes. In my previous career I was a white-collar criminal defense attorney. So this is kind of bringing it all home for me.

Jonathan: Is that true?

Chris and John: Yes, yes.

Chris: It’s actually true.

John: That’s why I hate him.

Rebecca: Did you not know that?

John: That’s why my deep and abiding hatred of him-

Jonathan: Does he still have the suits?

John: [Laughing]

Rebecca: [Laughing]

Chris: Oh I got the suits.

John: Oh jeez, he got the brown shoes, he got the-

Jonathan: Are you kidding me?

Rebecca: [Laughing]

Chris: I’ve got suspenders, my friend, I’ll wear ‘em, I’m gonna wear it on the set this year.

Jonathan: That is really good information,

Jonathan: Kitty Swink, Deep Space Nine.

Chris: Kitty Swink.

John: Uh, and so, I remember we wound up actually sitting around the table and breaking down the phases of the trial so we could arc the episode -

Rebecca: I think we did, yep.

John: through the phases of the trial actually, and that’s why Aldis at one point says “All I’ve got is my cross-examination,” because at that point in the story we had locked into that.

Rebecca: Absolutely. Who goes first, and what happens first, as well as which role Parker is playing specifically.

Jonathan: The beautiful and talented Lauren Holly. Dumb and Dumber.

Chris: And also Lauren Holly, if you folks remember, acted with Timothy Hutton in Beautiful Girls. And uh-

John: Yes, that’s right.

Jonathan: Yeah, six degrees of separation. She looks great.

Rebecca: And NCIS of course.

John: And our only female bad guy, this season, I believe.

Jonathan: Picket Fences. She’s a great shark. She was great. And this poor guy!

Rebecca: Jeremy. Little Jeremy.

Jonathan: We finally put him in a show.

Rebecca: Jeremy auditioned--

Jonathan: He was in at least two shows that I worked on-

Rebecca: At least two.

Jonathan: --and finally got a role.

Rebecca: And he did a good job. [Laughing]

Chris: He was fantastic.

Jonathan: Beth can handle a close-up, can’t she?

John: [laughing] Yes. And this is one of the times again that we establish that the guys, at least, have formed this kind of proto-brother/father/brother relationship.

Jonathan: And more eating!

Rebecca: [Laughing]

John: More eating-

Chris: They do eat a lot, don’t they?

Jonathan: They do eat a lot.

John: Well, it’s one of the ways that you establish this is their home. I mean it helps bring the emotional resonance of what we do to it at the end of the season - kind of lands.

Rebecca: And how comfortable they are with each other by now,.

John: This by the way, is a nice piece of technical wizardry, because we originally had another type of footage behind Beth Riesgraf in the shot.

Jonathan: No, we were given the NFL footage, but we were not given the feed.

John: Yep.

Jonathan: And then someone wisely staged the actress in front so the actress could have an obstacle - it’s always good to have an obstacle. It’s like, if you can’t have an independant activity, give them an obstacle.

John: [Laughing] Yep.

Rebecca: [Laughing]

Jonathan: And now they have both.

John: So-

Jonathan: They can eat and try to get out of the way.

John: So, there you go, when you come into the scene and you’re like, ‘how will I force the guys to have to deal with her?’ So you put her between them and the object of their desire.

Jonathan: Exactly. And it becomes something else that helps the scene move along. Get the exposition, and the comedy.

Rebecca: And a little bit of football.

John: And snarky British comments from Gina.

Rebecca: Love it.

Jonathan: I love this line actually, about the rugby. I think it’s great. Who wrote that?

Rebecca: She did a good job.

Chris: I think it was…

John: I think that was me, yeah. I went to school in McGill in Montreal and I remember getting my ass handed to me my first rugby game

Jonathan and Rebecca: [Laughing]

John: I wanted to play rugby until I met somebody who wanted to play rugby more.

Jonathan: More, yes. That’s a good line.

John: And this is- this is great. This is one of the- Gina kinda settling into her role on this one, which is really, again, reinforcing the idea that Nate’s not a nice guy.

Chris: No.

John: He’s really very selfish, very perfectionist, very obsessive. Our lead of our show has to be reminded by the thieves he associates with to be a better man on a regular occasion.

Jonathan: Yeah. And setting up the father/son stuff here. This is where Aldis reveals a little more of his hand.

Chris: And it’s a nice dynamic we have where- I guess you kinda get a sense of what Nate’s character would be like as a father because he’s always putting Hardison in the most outrageous position he could be in. Most incredible challenge. You get the sense that he’s the guy that would throw his kid into the deep end of the water.

Rebecca: Cause it’ll teach him character.

Chris: Yeah.

Rebecca: Gotcha.

Jonathan: Do you think that’s conscious or subconscious?

Chris: Definitely subconscious, yeah, yes.

Jonathan: That’s what I think as well.

John: Absolutely. He can’t help but adopt him into that role. Yeah, and this is sort of the payoff to the fact that they’re now feeling obligated to each other. And here’s the thing, earlier in the season, Eliot wouldn’t have gone. You know, he would’ve refused to do this. And with even as much bitching and moaning, he’s still gonna do it because he understands that she’s in trouble. And she’s helped him out- she helped him out on the Two-Horse Job.

Jonathan: He’s gonna take his beer.

Chris: And more drinking.

John: And more drinking.

Rebecca: Absolutely.

John: Nate’s a drunk.

[Laughter]

Rebecca: This was actually the first shot we filmed of the episode, if I remember correctly.

Jonathan: You are so right.

Rebecca: Oh. It was a beautiful day.

Chris: And can we just say that Brent Spiner’s character was originally conceived as nefarious hippie?

Rebecca: Yes he was. Birkenstock wearing nefarious hippie. Granola.

Chris: Nefarious hippie. And uh-

Jonathan: It was supposed to be Jimmy Buffett meets Bill Gates.

[Laughter]

Chris: Yes, exactly.

John: An unholy matrimony if there ever was one.

Rebecca: Exactly.

John: Yeah, the light tables.

Chris: That’s a great- these are great shots here, establishing all the space

Jonathan: This was- we had the crane outside so we just snuck it inside and stole some stuff with it.

Rebecca: Looked good.

John: And the-

Jonathan: This was the well-produced Leverage episode that followed the orphanage, so we overlapped-

John: This is the orphanage!

Rebecca: It’s actually next to the orphanage.

John: It’s next to the orphanage. But this is the same- this orphanage- this evil warehouse. The Den of Evil, we called it.

Rebecca: Den of Evil.

Jonathan: Evil Den of Evil.

John: Evil Den of Evil is actually just over from the tragic orphanage in Belgrade.

Rebecca: Exactly, which we visited during out lunch break and were suitably depressed by the children in their filthy squalor.

John: Yeah, and then you went back and had fun high tech stuff with Frakes and everything like that.

Rebecca: Exactly.

John: And this is a beautiful little bit of set design and production design by Lauren Crasco to establish the Evil Den of Evil. I also love the fact- this kind of influenced the season finale. Seeing the stuff up on the bulletin boards here? It really- we wound up going low tech in the season finale, and there’s something about- video screens are nice, you know, but the clutter...

Jonathan: They look- exactly. Video screens keep- that’s always been the problem now that TV shows and movies use video screens. There’s no sound. There’s no tact- [sounding it out] tactility?

Chris: Yes. And it’s cold. Yeah.

John: It’s very cold.

Jonathan: This also has an homage to the set design from Runaway Jury.

John: Sure.

Chris: Yes.

Rebecca: That’s true.

[All laugh]

John: No, no. I think that’s outright theft, right there.

Jonathan: That’s what I meant.

Chris: Let’s get that out on the table.

John: Let’s slap that out.

Chris: That’s the elephant in the room, here, folks.

Jonathan: If we don’t say it someone else will!

[Laughter]

John: And we’ll talk about chess bit in a minute, but Kirsch, why did we set this in a courtroom?

Rebecca: Why specifically in a courtroom?

John: Yes. Do you remember?

Jonathan: Trick question.

Rebecca: I’m not actually sure.

John: Because we had a courtroom set. This actually-

Rebecca: We did! You’re right we had this from Boston Legal, I believe.

John: Yes, exactly.

Chris: [laughing] That’s right we did.

Rebecca: We had a big, wonderful set.

John: This is the splendor of your big Hollywood life

Jonathan: Is this how those decisions are made?

Rebecca: No, you’re absolutely right I forgot about that. We had the- I think it was a New Orleans courtroom from Boston Legal?

John: Yup.

Rebecca: I think we used the walls and…?

John: We redressed it.

Rebecca: We kinda scrapped it.

John: We wallpapered it really. No we ended up keeping most of it, she just wallpapered the walls.

Rebecca: That’s Lauren Crasco.

Chris: Jonathan, what’s your strategy here? Just keeping the camera moving?

Jonathan: Yeah. This is sort of the half version of the 360s that’s used a lot in Leverage. And if you shoot it enough times you end up with your coverage.

John: Yeah. But there’s a tiny amount of room between you and those screens, how did you…?

Jonathan: Oh man, Dave Connell. He gets his props yet again.

Rebecca: And Gary Camp.

Jonathan: And Gary Camp.

John: Here’s where we establish- this is really where we’ve fallen into the pattern in this show, where we’d figured out how much information the audience needs; how to establish the bad guys very clearly, very cleanly; and to make sure the audience knows at least what agenda A is moving forward in the show.

Jonathan: And we know what they look like, and what they’ve done.

John: Yes. There are definitely times earlier in the season where we are a little too clever by half, and really we were-

Jonathan: And this is the right time in the story to tell it. Right here at the end of act one is-

Rebecca: And this one is actually rather complicated as far as who your bad guy is. The fact that you have two, but one is worse than the other, who’s your man in. I think that it- I think visually it helps show the audience, okay this is who we’re going to first, but we’re really trying to go for Lauren Holly.

Jonathan: It also had an interesting in that she, Beth’s character, was reporting to jury duty in order to continue to fool other people with her alias that was- one of her aliases that was actually given jury duty.

Chris: Yes.

Jonathan: while she went to serve jury duty reluctantly, she found out that the jury that she happened to be on, was in fact corrupt, and that there was a bigger story there that Leverage could help out.

John: Very Rockford Files.

[All laugh]

John: Rockford Files- I love- Rockford Files, season 4 or 5-

Jonathan: Steal from the best, isn’t that what they always say?

Rebecca: The very best.

John: Honestly you cannot overstate the influence Rockford Files had on this show and Chris and I as writers. By season 4- there’s an episode in season 4-

Jonathan: [laughs] by season 4 they’ll be living in a trailer by the beach.

John: In season 4 of Rockford Files, there’s an episode where Rocky- his dad is literally getting mob money in the mail by accident.

[All laugh]

John: Like, WOW, man. And so we really felt like the crossover here is not bad. This is interesting because- if you look at Homecoming Job, which was shot sixth, and wound up being shown second. It’s part-

Jonathan: These are the bad guys! [Laughs]

John: That’s sort of the technique when we really started diagramming and illustrating better, but yeah. This is where we- one of the times we use the technique of we’re not going to tell you what we’re going to do and then do it. We’re going to tell you, show it, tell you, show it, tell you, show it.

Jonathan: I like that.

Rebecca: That’s great.

John: We intercut each sequence and establish-

Jonathan: This girl we loved. Remember?

Rebecca: Lisa Schurga and Norma...

John: Lisa, we celebrated her birthday on our set.

Rebecca: We did. I remember that.

Chris: Norma Michaels who I’ve used many times on King of Queens.

Rebecca: Norma Michaels - that’s what it was.

John: And this is also the first time we realized that really, splitting the screens into threes. Instead of using a bunch of stuff on the different six screens. Set each lengthwise set of screens up as your goal and you can move him left to right through objectives and you can formulate the story through temporally left to right. It helps track it.

Chris: There are these guys. I mean, c’mon, the two of them going through garbage? What’s better than that?

John: There’s nothing better than that.

Jonathan: This is one of the classic two-handers of these two.

John: They’re really great together. And at this point, it really is just roll the camera and get out of their way. At this point in the season.

Jonathan: Make sure you’re shooting in the right direction and let them go.

John: Yeah. It’s- [laughs] bang! It’s such a great bit. ‘Heads up!’

[Laughter]

Jonathan: And you know what? Never been done before.

John: Yeah, that actually is original! The- I do want to give a shout out to-

Jonathan: You know what else is great? The length of that scene.

John: [Laughs] Yes.

Chris: Yes.

John: It’s just precisely long enough to do a bit, yup. I wanna give a shout out to my dad, the speech he gave at the beginning of this scene - how- what chess is? Is word for word my dad teaching me to play chess. And really when we were trying to find a spine for this it was, well, it’s really a chess game, it’s really moves. Apollo had been talking a lot about how each con had very distinct stages. And that came up, that’s my dad-

Chris: It came in late into the episode, too.

Rebecca: It did and it really affected the pace in a great way, I think.

Jonathan: Arguably Gina’s best roleplaying con.

Rebecca: I think she did a great job.

John: Interestingly enough the one she was most worried about. Because she’s British and Indian culture is very big in England right now, and she was very, very worried about doing this wrong and was- she researches all her stuff, but she was-

Chris: I love this scene, too.

John: I love this scene, I love the text.

Chris: The darkness here, I mean the way you use light in it, I mean really gave it such a great- I mean what- Jonathan was that-

Jonathan: I mean it’s simple- it’s a very simple scene again and to Lauren’s credit, we moved everything into the middle of the room so we could actually shoot it.

John: Yup. And this is the hardest working business- office in show business. This is every bad guy’s office in the show.

Rebecca: Yes it is. Absolutely.

John: Move out the lamps, move in the lamps.

Rebecca: Change the decor.

John: And the zen garden- it’s interesting the zen garden - the tiny zen garden on his desk, is one of the LA bugaboos that drives us insane, and so wound up in the episode and allowed us to do the writing in the sand. And she does a great bit of sort of throwing it away.

Jonathan: Yeah.

John: And it’s interesting- it’s cool too. It’s interesting watching a lot of shows- a lot of old shows we cite as references, that are bound by America’s cultural understandings at the time. Where because of globalization and everything that’s in the news, we’re able to expand the scope of our cons. To where an Indian in Mumbai- everyone knows oh outsourcing to India that’s in the news, we get that.

Rebecca: Absolutely.

John: It gives you another tool in the toolbox. And also- there’s Dean right there on the left.

Rebecca: Dean Devlin.

John: But it also allows-

Jonathan: We tried to talk him into playing a part in this episode.

John: Yeah, he lied to me. He tricked me into doing mine in Homecoming and then refused to do his.

Rebecca: Maybe season two.

John: Yeah, maybe season two.

Jonathan: What is he, a producer?

John: Yeah.

Rebecca: He’s a very busy man.

John: He is very busy. Very busy getting people to drink the Kool Aid that you can make an independently produced TV show out of an old dog hospital.

[Laughter]

John: And stunningly occasionally pulling it off. Yeah, and this is my favorite scene in the episode.

Rebecca: It was so much fun.

Chris: It’s great, too.

John: It really is.

Jonathan: Now who’s idea was this? This is a wonderful three hander, it’s a very interesting-

Rebecca: I love the board.

John: This came out of the room, we always wanted Sophie teaching Parker. I think the-

Jonathan: Sophie teaching Parker behavioral things.

John: I think the orange bit-

Jonathan: But the add of Chris- of Christian is a great color to this. Because he can’t bear her.

John: Yeah it’s a trio you don’t usually see. He really just wants to punch her in the-

Chris: He plays irritation so well.

John: This is his attempt to be- [laughs] he is not a good dad. Eliot? Not a good dad in any way shape or form.

Chris: Not patient at all.

John: But this is- if you actually track the Parker acting ark through the series, this is the third beat. The first one is she can’t do it, the second is she can do it as long as she’s in a certain type of character, the third one is Sophie has finally taught her how to do it. She actually moves through a learning experience through the entire season.

Chris: One of the appeals of this episode was putting Parker through jury duty where being around regular people would scare her, and test her social abilities.

Jonathan: So does Parker have Asperger's syndrome?

John: It’s Asperger-y like. I mean really what we’re saying is, that the trauma of her childhood sort of froze a lot of her emotional development. As will happen. Froze a lot of her emotional development at that time. But it’s much more- she’s never lived anything approaching a normal life. And that- so she’s utterly unable to- hey I know high functioning geeks who work in the software industry who are worse off than her, as far as interacting with normal humans. So, I think as long as you’re in a specialized lifestyle, it sort of cripples your ability to act in sort of general groups. You know, hell, one of the reasons I did stand up was to find other crazy people like myself. Lovely bit here with the mustard squeeze. I remember we were trying to gimmick that like mad and were like ‘no, no just have her spray him.’

Jonathan: No just have her spray him.

Rebecca: Just have her squeeze it, yeah.

John: And this is one of those Apollo ones where we were gonna show all of the lifts, but by this point in the season, you know what she’s going.

Chris: Yeah, I mean if you’re going to do the choreography of the lift, you want to make a big show of it. And here it’s just-

John: We know what she does.

Rebecca: And she is so good at it. Beth is so good at this.

John: Yeah. She is very great. Victimizing old women. That’s our heroine. It’s a very mixed bag of moral high ground on our team here. But, actually, talking about what Chris was saying - putting Parker in this situation, one of the things, on every episode, that we try to do, and we don’t always manage to put it off but, the episode really has to have a moment- some anchor to one of the characters. That it’s not just a con that for whatever reason, either the parameters or the con, have some sort of challenge that either challenges one of the relationships on the team or a team member.

Chris: I love that shot too, I love the shot of them all raising their glasses and her framed in it.

Rebecca: They’ve accepted her.

Jonathan: Well it’s her- her character arc, for lack of a better term, is- or her character is developed by virtue of being put into the position where she has to behave in a certain way and has to deliver.

Rebecca: And she rises to the occasion.

John: And that’s the kind of-

Jonathan: That’s John Storey -

John: No it’s - that’s John Storey? Or David? Shaw?

Rebecca: No David Shatraw is in one of the-

Jonathan: No, that’s John Storey. He’s in the Dean Devlin Renaissance - rep company.

Rebecca and John: [Laughing]

John: And that’s also one of those horribly complicated bits of writing where it’s like,’OK, how do we get rid of the other lawyer? You know what? Just call him and offer him a bunch of money!’

Chris: Yep.

John: We don’t really have time for anything else.

Jonathan: Yeah, we gotta get him out of the picture.

Rebecca: We had a scene where Eliot intimidated him out of it. Remember that?

John: Yes.

Chris: Yeah.

John: It was actually taken from a different-

Jonathan: This is great, where she teases the character she’s about to go into.

John: You actually see her start to get into character a bit for a moment there which is not something we usually show. And this is- this is the hats.

Chris: Yeah here we are- this is our- on our soundstage.

John: Yup. and what’s ironic is ,of course you look at this old courtroom set that we have, cause you try to do a show that saves you a little money with an established set, and it’s like ‘oh god we have to really dress it up to sell it’-

Rebecca: Ah, there it is.

Jonathan: Great entrance.

John: -ironically- fantastic entrance. And nice coming up from the shoes, by the way.

Jonathan: Yeah, it was in the script.

[Laughter]

John: yeah, it was in the script. Jesus. Well, thanks for listening to us.

Chris: Most directors don’t! [Laughs]

John: Yeah, well I appreciate it. But, you know, it’s interesting that a bunch of us were on jury duty right after this got called.

Rebecca: That’s true, absolutely

John: We all went to LA municipal courts, and they were all far worse looking than this thing that we were worried about looking too cheesy.

Jonathan: Yeah.

John: They are basements. I also love the quick glad-hand here of just, you know ‘do you trust your government?’ Most people do, ‘all right then you buy me.’ What’s his alias in this one?

Rebecca: Oh- it was from… [Pelican Brief]

Chris: No it’s from Philadelphia-

John: No Philadelphia, Joseph Miller.

Rebecca: Yes, Philadelphia, thank you.

John: Joseph Miller, in continuing the tradition that Aldis- Hardison has an unconscious, or possibly conscious, habit of faking his ID’s to amuse himself, to give himself famous movie names. And there’s almost always, in most of the IDs, they’re linked somehow to famous people. Except that- I don’t think- they make text of it, but he tends to give Nate the names of actors that have played Doctor Who. Which amuses me to no end.

Rebecca: And the fans as well. I’ve seen a lot of people being very excited about that.

John: Yeah. Now this is interesting because I don’t know much about the law, I know a little about statute of limitations on art theft because I had to research it, but that’s it. I’m constantly amazed. And so going to Chris, and there’s so much stuff in this episode that seems insane, but you can actually do it in a court of law.

Chris: Well I- look-

Jonathan: Don’t you violate the sense of truth a little bit here?

Chris: A little bit. But, I have to say, I did speak to an old friend of mine - a colleague - who’s a litigator and who’s been doing it for 12 years, and I ran a lot of the stuff by him and he was- he was on board.

John: Yeah.

Rebecca: Absolutely, we had a great conversation with him.

John: So this is the one- this is one of the ones that’s great, actually, cause you called that buddy who’s in the US Attorney's office and you gave that five second pause and went, ‘holy shit that would work’.

[All laugh]

Jonathan: You could get away with it.

Rebecca: Yeah, exactly.

John: ‘Don’t- don’t tell anyone about this!’ It’s always gratifying when you hear from somebody- like when we faked the MRI. Who was like ‘Oh yeah, that’s actually a good tumor. Nicely done.’

Rebecca: ‘You could absolutely do that.’ Yeah. [Laughs]

John: And this is the little- this little friend beat with Peggy.

Jonathan: This is the vegan meat scene. This is a very nice scene.

Rebecca: This is the tofu scene.

John: Yes. And she’s wonderful- and this is why it’s so crucial to get those daily players that are great, because-

Rebecca: She did a wonderful job.

Jonathan: Oh, we loved her.

John: -you want them to be friends.

Jonathan: Yeah you love them as friends, you buy them as friends.

John: Yeah, Peggy’s coming back.

Rebecca: Oh god, I hope so.

John: Yeah her sidekick- yeah we’re absolutely- well not just for your character payment but also.

Rebecca: Oh do I get one of those? That’s fun.

John: We’re actually thinking about- when I did Jackie Chan adventures the animated show, we eventually wound up using a bunch of the side characters in their own episodes.

Chris: Yeah.

John: And I’m thinking at some point we get all the- like Hurley, Peggy, all the side characters and do like two next year where it’s just them forming a second Leverage team.

Rebecca: Lisa earned she did a great job.

John: She did a great job.

Chris: Now Johnathan, a lot of this episode is us watching people watch other people, how did you-

Jonathan: Yeah, that was part of the prepping, to make sure I understood who-

Chris: How did you keep that all straight?

Jonathan: Who watches the watchers?

Chris: Right.

Rebecca: Exactly.

Chris: I mean it’s all very clear…

Jonathan: Well it’s clear because it was- we discussed it during prep. You know, we all- you know, it was what we talked about a few minutes ago, the idea of a tone meeting. So that you’re sure, who’s on the screen in this scene, who knows what’s being said, who hears what’s being said, and who can’t.

Chris: Right, right.

Jonathan: Probably more importantly, who can’t see or who can’t hear and get this information.

Chris: And you also made good use of using the screens as transitions. So you would go from the actual scene, then you would cut to the screen, then pull back.

Jonathan: Yeah well it begs for it a little bit. And helps avoid establishing shots like that.

[All laugh]

John: What?

Chris: Oh good establishing shot is-

John: C’mon man there’s no crime in that, that’s television, it lets you know where you are. That’s actually- talking to Dean about directing, he says that’s the big mistake young directors make, they don’t let you know where you are. You know it’s an important thing, I would rather use a shot like that-

Jonathan: Some reason that Aaron Spelling had a few shows on in the 80’s and 90’s is he made them use establishing shots and start scenes that way.

John: Yeah, exactly and you knew where the hell you were. And that’s a great transition, punch into the screen.

Chris: Yeah, that’s a great transition.

Rebecca: That’s beautiful; very nice.

John: And it’s interesting, like Kirsch said- I call her Kirsch. I always call her Kirsch.

Rebecca: And if you ever stop I’ll know something’s wrong. I know I’m being fired.

John: You’re being fired at the end of the day, yeah.

Jonathan: These two have great rhythm together. These two-

John: They do.

Jonathan: Over the week we worked together developed a great rhythm. He of course knew everything Gina had done, so he had her entire credits, and…

John: No they’re- It’s interesting because she’s doing a bad guy here, which we don’t usually have. We’re doing that in the season premiere of the second season, actually it’s a little- it’s kind of a cool con we’re working on.

Chris: Yeah.

Rebecca: We wanted her to amp up the evil. We said show Sophie, you know, how ruthless she can be.

Jonathan: She looks beautiful with her hair pulled up.

Chris: Oh boy, she looked great.

John: But that was fun being able to use just enough of what Americans know about Indian outsourcing and everything and kind of, you know-

Jonathan: It’s so nice to see Brent without gold paint on his face.

John: I know.

[All laugh]

John: I don’t- you know what he was great in? He was great in the Dorothy Dandridge story. I really liked that

Jonathan: He’s a wonderful actor.

Chris: Oh, he’s terrific.

Jonathan: You know he’s playing Don Quixote now.

John: Oh yeah, there you are.

Rebecca: I did not know that.

Jonathan: The reprise he’s playing in Man of La Mancha.

John: What’s interesting here is there’s not- the temptation to do a lot of fancy camera crap when two people are talking is overwhelming, but you just parked it on them and- the scenes great, it’s chilling, it’s creepy. That comes from two good actors talking.

Jonathan: That only comes from years of directing, is to learn that you don’t have to do too much.

John: Yeah. Sometimes just let good actors talk.

Jonathan: And it’s great. And the same thing in the editing room. You don’t have to cut around yet, I’m still interested in what they’re saying.

John: Yeah. That’s a big problem you get- when you’re moving the camera, it’s always- the kinda general rule I always use is, it’s movement or performance. If somebody’s talking- if somebody’s working it just sit on it, it’s all right. The audience is [unintelligible].

Jonathan: And also our cameras are moving even when we appear to do close-ups.

John: We do these little slides and stuff, yeah. This was also- the incredibly boring slideshow, this is sort of off of your-

Chris: Yes. I think people accept that in a court case there would be an incredibly boring presentation of evidence, and you buy that.

Rebecca: Absolutely

Jonathan: Quincy! Worked on Quincy for years!

Chris: Sure! Absolutely.

John: Quincy, exactly. 168 slides, I love Kitty- I love Kitty in that shot by the way. She’s so great.

Rebecca: Yeah, she’s so good.

John: And even that was great, because we had brought in- we got Armin first, right?

Jonathan: No I called- I asked during casting I said wouldn’t Armin be great for this corrupt juror? And I said wait a minute, ‘Armin’s married to Kitty’. And we wound up- obviously we wanted up with a female judge to mix it up a little bit, let’s offer it to Kitty too. And it was like a family package.

John: That was great.

Jonathan: Then it became the Star Trek connection. This guy was funny as hell, too.

Rebecca: Excellent job.

Chris: Yeah, he was great.

John: And speaking real Hindi there, which is-

Jonathan: And Gina pretending she understood him, which is…

[All laugh]

John: Yeah she was really great. No, yeah this is one of the few times we bring a mark back to the office.

Chris: Yeah.

John: We dressed it up a little bit, but yeah.

Chris: By the end of the season we’re getting pretty-

Jonathan: This was a good setup too, I was always wondering if the audience would understand- oh no, this isn’t- yeah we we’re gonna reveal the green screen here.

Chris: Yeah, we were gonna reveal it right after this.

John: Yeah. But yeah it was interesting because I had just gone to the CAA where they had the big new teleconferencing wall, it really was- I will believe anything that’s on the other side of that camera, you know? And we do so much set replacement on this show that it would make sense that they have that technology.

Chris: Oh I love that- I love that zoom around.

Rebecca: He did such a great job.

Jonathan: Yeah, that’s that six frames business.

John: And finding that- this guy did a great job.

Jonathan: This guy was great!

Rebecca: He was wonderful, yeah

John: Doing the Scottish accent on the way out was really- it was really great.

Jonathan: That was shameless. Whose idea was that?

Rebecca: It was originally Irish. That was your idea, John, I think.

Jonathan: Just shameless.

John: Yeah. He’s very good, the walkaway. And what’s great is they’re also- Eliot’s running the computer there. It’s one of those little things where we’ve arced his ability to use the computer at Hardison’s- you know.

Chris: Yes.

John: We didn’t do a bit - which would’ve complicated it - which was where Hardison left a bunch of sticky notes on his computer which I loved. But at this point- it’s interesting because this episode started so clean and wound up being so complicated, you know?

Jonathan: We are moving, moving, moving.

Chris: It’s great- great movement. Picking them up on the run, and the camera finally stops right there.

Jonathan: I think- driven by the idea that we think a courtroom drama is gonna be staid, that we had to- all of us were very conscious of trying to make sure everything moved, literally and figuratively, and it paid off.

John: And this is one of the times that they’re too good at their jobs. Which we don’t use all that often.

Rebecca: Exactly

Chris: Oh yeah, I love this twist.

[All laugh]

John: And the smile, and just sign the goddamn papers.

Rebecca: Oh these two guys had so much fun.

Jonathan: ‘Sign on the line before anything changes!’

John: Really great.

Jonathan: This is the part we wanted Dean to play!

Rebecca: Yes it was, yeah.

John: Yes, exactly. But the idea, that if you use real world companies, that it will come back to bite you in the ass is infinitely amusing. And again something we’re going to use a bit more in season 2. You know the little details of the cons- you always wonder how much process does the audience want? And I think that that’s- a lot of it is what you sign up for. That’s why CSI was a big hit, people want to see people get fingerprinted and stuff.

Jonathan: I want to see the stuff, yeah.

John: And for us it’s how do we commit these crimes?

Jonathan: And I think the audience loves that.

Chris: More movement again, you panned across to the-

Jonathan: I lined them up in the order that they spoke. [Laughs] Always a good trick.

[All laugh]

Chris: Then you ended on-

Jonathan: Nate. He gets up.

Chris: Nate as he gets up and you follow him out.

Jonathan: Thank you.

[All laugh]

John: We should bring you back.

Rebecca: Honestly.

John: I was really not gonna bring you back but watching this episode again, I gotta say, yeah.

Chris: It’s a good scene.

Rebecca: We give some screen time to our infrequently used kitchen. Very well stocked with orange soda.

Jonathan: I’m a big fan of the kitchen.

Rebecca: We had a good time filming it.

Chris: Yeah we did.

John: We started using it a lot. It was- it really was- it’s not something that’s kind of in our writers heads, just cause we didn’t- it was a late addition to the set, but it’s a nice intimate-

Rebecca: There were some intimate moments, yeah.

Jonathan: It’s the office version of the water cooler. It’s where stuff can happen.

Chris: And here’s where we are challenging our two- Hardison and Parker, to really bring it home. We have our pep talks.

John: It’s a parallel scene, parallel structure, yeah. Parallel pep talks. And they’re two distinctly different relationships too, you know?

Chris: Yeah.

Jonathan: That’s a good point, the father/son relationship between Nate and Aldis is an entirely different one from the peer relationship that these two are trying to set up.

Chris: Yes.

Rebecca: Absolutely.

John: This is really- and this is something we held back for the season finale. Where the way she locks it in, in the original version of the script, is she confesses Sophie Deveraux is not her real name.

Rebecca: Yeah.

John: And then that’s sort of something we held back for the finale. Assuming you’ve watched all the episodes in a row and now are going back for the commentary, with a Guiness in hand, as you should.

[Laughter]

John: Yeah this is a- we don’t do this a lot.

Chris: No.

John: Sophie, Parker we don’t do a lot and they have a nice rhythm.

Rebecca: They have a really nice dynamic.

Jonathan: That’s the nice thing about these- this cast. There are so many formations or- what’s the word I’m looking for? Not combinations, but in that same- apples and oranges-

John: Permutations.

Jonathan: Permutations, yeah. Where Christian’s in a scene with the two girls - the chemistry’s different.

Chris: [Laughs] I love sending the kids to school. This is great.

Rebecca: The sack lunch.

John: The sack lunch. ‘You’re gonna knock it’; ‘No, no, you’re not gonna-’; ‘You - you’re gonna get hit by a car’.

[All laugh]

Rebecca: Good luck with that.

John: Big guy, you’re gonna get hit by a car. Sorry man, that’s your morning. Boom.

Jonathan: Okay end of scene.

Chris: Oh, beautiful transition.

John: Yeah, the door and then the door. It’s like you think these things through.

Jonathan: Dean’s electric car getting used, so we got a freebie.

Rebecca: One of the few remaining. Oh this was great.

John: Boom. And by the way, one of the great things about Christian Kane is he’ll do his own stunts.

Jonathan: Does his own stunts!

Rebecca: Everything.

John: The bad thing about Chris Kane is when you watch the dailies-

Jonathan: Does his own stunts!

John: And you go ‘oh my god!’

[All laugh]

John: Good fight in this one, by the way.

Rebecca: Yeah

John: Nice. Nice double take down.

Jonathan: Yeah, this is Charlie Brewer. He stages them quick and tight.

John: Which is really the only way to do it. You start doing big and slow-mo stuff and it just-

Rebecca: I just love when he throws him over his back. [Laughs]

John: Yeah.

Jonathan: Nobody sees me right? Nobody sees me with this guy on my shoulders?

Chris: In broad daylight?

John: In broad daylight.

Rebecca: Very early.

John: And we are done.

Jonathan: Okay, those guys are taken care of and I didn’t have to do my hair in the trailer this morning.

[All laugh]

Jonathan: I went for the stocking cap- went for the Jeff cap and I got to the set on time.

John: There you go. It’s actually interesting- the thing you said earlier is, when you develop TV shows, a lot of the times you’ll have a really good idea for the pilot, and you’ll write the pilot, then you’ll have a TV show and you’ll have no idea how to get to episode 100. I will say that it’s our own anal developmental process, Chris and I, is like alright, five characters any one of which can lead an episode, and how many combinations of each of these two or three characters work. If you don’t do that, you just spin your wheels, you’re just a plot machine. And, end of day, the audience really doesn’t give a crap about story. I mean they like a good story, but they’re here for this scene. You know, they’re here to see Aldis do To Kill a Mockingbird. They’re here to see Tim in the funny hats.

Chris: Yeah, yeah.

John: They’re really invested in the characters

Jonathan: Ed Begley Jr.!

John: He’s Ed Begley Jr. He’s doing Ed Begley Jr. here. Closing the internal combustion to digestive combustion.

Jonathan: This is when we couldn’t get the...

Rebecca: The smoke to work, yeah. We had many different methods-

Jonathan: Lunch was creeping up on us.

Rebecca: I was. It was a hot day outside.

Jonathan: I said, “We’ll sell it with sound.”

[Laughter]

Rebecca: I think it was an electric car, yeah.

Chris: Now what exactly is around his forehead? What is that?

Jonathan: It looks like the same piece of [word that sounds like druh-fellen] that she wore in the…

[All laugh]

John: That Parker had in The Wedding Job?

Chris: That’s a special effect folks. That’s a virtual-

Jonathan: I had more people- in the interviews I did the other day, they loved that visual effect.

Chris: Isn’t that great?

Jonathan: They think it’s real.

John: Well it’s one of the few times we cheat.

Jonathan: There’s Quark, from Deep Space Nine. And… who did he play in Beauty and the Beast? One of our wonderful underused character actors.

John: Yeah? Beauty and the Beast I’m trying to remember…

Johnathan: I think he was the third [unintelligible] and that’s his wife, Kitty

John: I also love- I love this moment. I love when, even accidentally - because he gives a shit about this case =- that he’s a better lawyer, you know?

Chris: Yeah.

John: And she’s again, April Webster casting. She’s a great day player; it’s a lovely moment.

Chris: We don’t spend a lot of time with her, our victim, so it was really kind of important at this point in the show to connect with her.

John: Yeah. And to show also, cause this is late in the season, that their relationships with the victims are changing.

Chris: And also we’ve seen Hardison have doubt, that ‘I can’t do this’, and here’s a moment where he kinda realized that he can do this, you know I’ve been doing it all along.

John: Or I have to do it.

Rebecca: And her faith gave him energy to move forward with something that was pretty difficult.

Johnathan: And it was a classic case of art imitating life, too, because this was a wonderful breakthrough for Aldis, who people feel does light comedy and they feel he does this physical stuff-

John: Honestly, after this episode, I’d put him in a courtroom show in a heartbeat. He sells the hell out of this. Particularly the closing speech, by the way, you wrote this. It was great. Chris wrote the closing argument that he’s always wanted to do, like, on his big case.

[Laughter]

John: Like this! This is the one! Does every lawyer really- every lawyer’s got To Kill a Mockingbird in his head, every lawyer…

Chris: Well, yeah, uh, yeah.

John: That was my dad. My dad became a lawyer in his 60’s and he busted his ass for like 5 years to he could get a jury trial, just so he could finally do this speech.

Johnathan: God, Armin’s good value.

John: Yeah. This is great.

Johnathan: The casting is so important when you cast these day players this way.

John: And he’s funny- he’s both funny and grounding.

Johnathan: AND, he’s making the choice to hold onto his story as long as he possibly can, and then try to defend it.

John: Yes. As one would. And that’s the other lawyer freaking out. It’s amazing. It’s very important that everyone stays present in this scene; a lot of times day players will just tend to wander off when they’re not on camera, and you never know when you’re grabbing coverage and that’ll make the moment.

Rebecca: And that was kind of difficult with 12 jurors. I mean, we had to make sure they were all focused as well as

Johnathan: When we were casting the jury, I remember we gave the jurors, each of them, a backstory.

John: Yes.

Rebecca: I remember that.

Johnathan: So that when we cast our extras we would…

Rebecca: I forgot about that

John: So each one of those characters actually lines up the characters that Sophie says when she- the tells that she read.

Rebecca: Absolutely

John: And Kitty, by the way, does a really nice job there being amused and impressed at the same time. That role could’ve easily been harpy-ish. And instead was this, kind of like she was fairly pleased by what he was pulling off. This was a rare hidden fourth act. When we do stuff, we usually let the audience know what we’re doing and why we’re doing it. This is one of the few times we give them a little piece and then walk away. And this is your big speech.

Chris: Oh yeah. Well I mean, I think with any closing argument, the greatest ones in the movies - I mean I look at The Verdict or even Presumed Innocent - they’re not about the case, they’re very general.

Johnathan: Yeah, they’re about heart to heart.

Chris: They’re about heart to heart, yeah. They’re all about communicating with the jury.

Johnathan: He was spectacular in this.

Chris: I love this bit.

Johnathan: And he had the support of the cast, he got the support of the writers, it was one of those great days.

John: Look at that, that’s great.

Rebecca: I love that moment between them.

Chris: I love that he ends on ‘some of you are friends’ and you had him end on her, and they had that little moment.

John: It’s nice, pulling that moment out. No, he’s- I love the entire cast, but hiring him at 21? This is a guy with a 40 year career in him.

Johnathan: You won’t regret this, will not regret this.

John: Absolutely. I mean it’s amazing watching this again, because you’re watching without the sound when you do the commentary. And it’s amazing how much of this feels like a fast moving, energetic episode, and so much of it-

Johnathan: We were so concerned that it was going to be too much in court, it’s not too much in-

Chris: We were, yeah.

John: But at the same time in the scenes that were there, we sit for a long time. There’s big speeches in this episode, there’s big talking scenes, and they work, you feel invested in them. It’s interesting how so much of this went from, okay we’ve got a courtroom set-

Johnathan: Wait, let me guess, is Nate drinking?

[Laughter]

John: He’s drinking.

Johnathan: Father/son moment.

John: And as a matter of fact, yes, again, a scene that is parallel to when I did my first stand up that my dad saw me do and he bought me a drink afterwards. It was a big- it was the first time I drank with my father, was that moment. And so really, we’ve turned a horrible brutal addiction into a beautiful sharing moment.

[Laughter]

John: Which is nice.

Chris: Here we go, it’s all on Parker.

Rebecca: Daunting task ahead of her.

John: All on her, yup. It’s interesting how it turns from the- from kind of a constellation show where we have a set standing, and maybe we can limp through this to I think this might be one of my favorite episodes in the season. If you get the right people, and you really commit to it.

Johnathan: Doesn’t it happen like that though?

Chris: Yeah.

Johnathan: Doesn’t it always happen like that?

Rebecca: There was such great emotion in it, there really was.

Chris: Oh look at this!

John: Oh that’s lovely.

Chris: There’s a proud use of that transition where we use that to bridge and show us where we are.

John: She’s starting to tumble to it, it’s starting to feel- and it’s great because really the chess thing did come later. It came like the week before we shot.

Rebecca: It really did and it’s-

Johnathan: Oh really?

Chris: It did it came- I think it came the week we shot. [Laughs]

Rebecca: I think you may be right about that. It was definitely later.

John: I wrote it-

Johnathan: Well everybody wanted to use it too. She wanted to use it in this scene, you’ll see at the end of the show that Nate wanted to use it, it became more than it was intended to be, and as a result I think it bookended it.

John: Well it gave it a spine.

Rebecca: It did.

John: Gave it a nice little spine for the parallel. It’s always hard, because one of the challenges on this show is keeping all five actors alive at all times. And you know you can’t always find five hats.

Johnathan: But this- but you guys have done a good job with that, if you put people in different places, and have them check in, and believe that we can hear them wherever they are. As opposed to- that’s why the scenes in the court- the conference room were so tough. You gotta get out of there, you gotta send them on their mission so you can spread them out.

John: You don’t want to hang out there. You don’t want to hang out there. Yeah and that was the problem to a certain degree in the beginning of the season as we were learning to write the show. Because you’re learning to write- every show you’re learning how to write the first season. You’ve been on a lot of series - you know, the first couple episodes, no matter how clear the vision, getting the working parts up spinning is difficult.

Johnathan: And it’s just as important what works and what doesn’t work.

John: Yeah, yeah. And our whole thing was, ‘Okay, we gotta keep all five of them active so let’s keep them together.’ And it turned out like, no, you gotta split them up.

Rebecca: Split them up, yeah.

John: Two, three, two over there. It really keeps it up.

Chris: Oh here- this is what we call the date with the devil scene.

John: Lauren Holly being delightfully evil here.

Rebecca: Absolutely. She had a lot of fun with it.

John: And really is the crux of the-

Johnathan: This is a good call, Lauren Holly.

John: Yes, she did a really great job on it, she’s a good actor and-

Johnathan: I think this was Dean… yeah. She was good, she was sharp, she was fun to be on set with, and she chewed it up.

John: ‘Oooh that’s a lot of money’ yeah.

Chris: And he plays it so great, too.

John: And what Lauren’s doing here- when you have her, too, which is a little sexy, dangerous, plainly you’re gonna get your hand snapped off you.

Johnathan: That’s her calling card now. That’s her strong suit. It used to be that sort of sweet-

John: Sweet, girl next door, yeah. No, the three- and this is another thing is- constantly on the show we’re constantly struggling with, is okay we’re dealing with obscure financial decisions for a big chunk of the show, how do we visualize it?

Rebecca: How do you do it? How do you make it simple?

Chris: And also how do you make the audience understand, here-

Johnathan: When you can’t have a bucket of money or a big bag. What do you guys like to-?

John: Sack of money! But when we were struggling- I’ll admit-

Chris: And this is our sack of money, the file folders.

John: In Homecoming it’s the envelope switch. The envelope switch- it’s really tricky, I mean you know, and I’ll say we’re breaking second season now, we found out that we’re picked up for a second season, and it’s constantly like what’s our new- what’s our thing? What’s our thing we’re chasing?

Rebecca: Hatbox full of euros.

John: We can’t do a hatbox full of euros every week. We’d love to.

Rebecca: We’d like to, sure, yeah.

John: Yeah, that would be great. But euros are devalued now so they’re not quite as important.

[Laughter]

John: Now, Johnathan I can ask you did you use- did you reference any specific movies or anything? This is a courtroom drama, there’s an awful lot of stuff out there - have you shot this type of thing before?

Johnathan: I have shot- I actually stole from Judgement at Nuremberg, which is- I did a courtroom show on Star Trek and I found that the coverage, the set of moving, pushing, singles, two shots, three shots, that they did in that is the most- that and getting it high and wide. Always.

John: Well that’s the-

Johnathan: Judgement at Nuremberg is a really wonderful courtroom drama and worth stealing from.

[All laugh]

John: Well this is actually where, where the show began is, Chris had the idea to - we’ll steal a verdict.

Chris: Let’s steal a verdict.

John: And what it’s based on, is the wire gimmick from The Sting.

Chris: Right.

John: And that’s the idea that when you announce this stuff, I mean famous trials, particularly when you live in LA, you’re all waiting around the web, and you’re waiting for the verdict to come out, on the web, of what happened.

Chris: Yeah, it was all about our team controlling the early delivery of information, which is the wire scam in The Sting, and how we could use that in the context of the trial.

Jonathan: Oh, so this is what tee’d up the whole show?

Chris: This is the raison d’etre of the show.

Jonathan: Not her being on a jury, but-

Chris: But then we thought how great would it be if she was on the jury.

John: And then the next question immediately was, who would be on the jury? Well Parker would be on the jury, I mean, that’s obvious.

[Laughter]

Johnathan: Right.

Rebecca: Who is least able to work with humans?

John: To con them. Yeah exactly. To work with them.

Chris: [Laughs] His reactions- his reactions are great.

John: He’s so angry. He’s so filled with rage. And this is the ‘zhoom-zhoom’, there’s, like, varieties- we call these the zhoom-zhoom’s by the way, cause you zhoom in and you zhoom out-

Rebecca: Peter Hanson, did a great audition for Jonathan. The Jonathan Frakes song.

John: This day player actually sang a song about you, that’s right. You have to.

Johnathan: For the future. For anybody who’s listening.

[All laugh]

John: Don’t try that, that’s not gonna work.

Johnathan: It doesn’t hurt.

John: What? You’re saying you’d actually take that?

Johnathan: I- I hired the guy!

John Alright.

Johnathan: I asked all of you. I said do I hire this guy who sang a song about me? And you all said yes.

Rebecca: He was passionate.

John: He was passionate.

Rebecca: He had fervor.

Chris: Here we go, here’s our two chess players. Going at it-

Johnathan: Who never meet until this moment.

John: Nope.

Rebecca: And this was Tim’s idea, right here.

John: Boom.

Johnathan: Boom, and… he’s got it.

John: And, by the way, there’s a very subtle thing there. By giving her the white king he’s basically announcing his presence as the black king. It’s kind of one of the little things- the chess metaphors that goes through the season.

Johnathan: Pulled back for the burger.

John: There you go.

Rebecca: Eliot’s got his beer.

Johnathan: It pays off the vegan jokes from earlier.

John: Yeah, it’s like we know what we’re doing.

[Laughter]

John: Also, I like the bad attempt at parenting Nate does here. Aldis is- Hardison’s learned the entirely wrong lesson from this particular thing.

Rebecca: Exactly.

John: Although, I’ve never sure if he learns the wrong lesson or he’s just yanking-

Johnathan: But Hardison comes into this scene thinking that I really can do anything I want to do.

John: But by-

Johnathan: And then Nate’s like, ‘that’s not what I meant!’

[Laughter]

John: He means by stealing and by grifting. He doesn’t-

Johnathan: Yeah, he doesn’t mean by becoming a doctor or a lawyer, nothing honorable. This is a very good scene, actually.

John: Yes. It basically says that no matter how- it’s interesting because this is meant to be - it’s this, to rehab, to the season finale. This is meant to set that, for whatever the journey they’ve gone on, they are now a family. A broken, weird family, but a family. So that’s why we can do really really horrible things to them in the season finale and you feel like you’re tearing apart, at this point, a family that you’ve become invested in.

Johnathan: It’s nice that they held on- for instance, Christians character, holding onto this thing about how he feels about Beth is just great.

Chris: Yeah, it’s great.

Rebecca: Really has value.

John: Yeah. It’s- they- you know this is the part in the credits where you get to say whatever the hell you want so, Kirsch?

Chris: Anything you wanna add?

Johnathan: Congratulations!

John: It’s your first episode. Say hi to your parents?

Rebecca: Thank you. Hi mom and dad, and Paul and Paul [Laughs]. And thank you guys for giving me this opportunity because this is the greatest thing that’s ever happened to me.

Chris: Thank you.

Johnathan: Oh c’mon, take that one back.

[All laugh]

Rebecca: Oh, come on! I had a great time.

John: Your boyfriend just proposed to you, that’s like horrible!

Rebecca: That’s true! And the episode’s coming out tonight, so it was good timing

John: Well there you go.