#no fandom is a bad fandom (unless we're talking about harmful media but that's a whole other can of worms)

[natasha-in-space]

Gonna rant a bit about fandoms, because I have some thoughts to share.

Kind of sad to see that fandoms are starting to be viewed as a generally bad thing even by the fans lately... It is such a strange change to see, especially if you've been participating in fandom culture since the beginnings of the internet. Nowadays, the moment something becomes fairly popular and beloved by many, you can see hundreds of people feeling genuinely frustrated or upset that 'now the fandom is going to ruin it like it always does'. I see this take mainly on Twitter, but it's prominent on Tumblr and other platforms as well. I've been a part of fandoms both big and small, and, sure, smaller fandoms are generally more cozy and easy to interact with, but what happened with curating your own experience? It's so sad to see bigger fandoms be addressed as this disgusting and gross thing (both old and new, which is even more upsetting to see), when there are thousands of wonderful creators putting so much love and time into their art, fanfics, fan-projects, and so much more. Fandom is a community, first and foremost. Sure, consuming content is a big part of it, but why are we treating fandoms like it's some big assembly line that needs to be perfectly cut out for our needs? It's more like a fun fair, and it's up to you to choose which vendors to come up to, and what do you want to interact with. And yes, you should interact with creators. By no means is that a necessity (I was a silent viewer for a long time myself), but it is still encouraged. I feel like fandom is becoming less about interacting with people and more about consuming content. And, subsequently, fanmade content is starting to get viewed as product, and treated as such. And that's sad to see.

[badedramay]

little bit of a rant but: do you ever have a piece of media you really enjoy within its own bubble but that becomes really hard to enjoy once you're exposed to the fandom for it? i feel like that's what fairy tale is becoming for me lol. i did find it a lot of fun and thought the romance was cute but the fandom's inability to even entertain the idea that the show might have flaws really frustrates me. even moreso when this attitude is used to criticize other dramas (not talking about tere bin here. people can fully have at it with that) that are arguably dealing in way more complex ideas than fairy tale ever will. like not everything is about clear cut choices and forever well presenting characters! i do understand where the hype for either mc comes from (women feeling liberated of "responsible" decision making via umeed vs. women feeling charmed by a man like farjaad who does not resort to misogyny or violence) but i also don't think the expectations that come from that can be imposed onto dramas that are discussing more complex ideas often entrenched in exploring gender biases in our society. does that make sense? like if we're going to discuss some of the harms of society on the behavior of individuals, we are inevitably going to see some of those harmful behaviors portrayed and explored. and not every show goes the right way of actually criticizing those behaviors, but plenty do! and there is a cohesive point to why the harmful behaviors are highlighted, even if we don't like them! idk. maybe it's overly judgmental but i feel like i can't take fairy tale fans seriously half the time lol and i remember you feeling the same way when you initially talked about it way back when

fandoms have a way of either amplifying one's enjoyment of a piece of media or completely ruining it, there's no in between. I have lost count of how many shows that I used to enjoy with all my might, I had to step away from its "main" fandom from to be able to continue to enjoy them. fandom especially on twitter toh is more explosive than other platforms cuz the responses are so quick and there's almost nothing private there. hashtags are open for all of the users to explore. and even if you DON'T hashtag the show, there's still a way of what you're saying coming up for users either via a simple search option or by twt's fucked up algorithm that INSISTS on showing you the posts your mutuals interact with. there's almost no privacy there unless it's a locked account. that level of being public is not available on instagram and definitely not on tumblr where the rules of engagement are completely different and it's easier to tune out the fandom noise. (more under cut)

which is why no matter how much i TRY to, I cannot escape the FT opinions. and yes with time I have become more open to the show and its fandom but I still don't have a lot of respect for either of it. what you say is right, FT is a show has only ONE thing going on for it and that's the main ship. Umeed is apparently a refreshing character and Farjaad a green flag one and somehow just this combination is enough to overpower all of the show's other flaws. somehow their few good interactions in 30 episodes is enough to hail the show as some masterpiece. ya know I find is so funny that FT fandom has so cleanly separated their ship from the rest of the show. any criticism against the show's other characters and events is valid. but any criticism against farmeed is not as if they are an unrelated entity altogether??? how does that make sense??? khair. there's something that I was told ages ago which has influenced much of my perspective about gauging the quality of something. the "good" is not the "absence" of bad but the "denial" of it.

it's like "XYZ is honest" vs "XYZ is not dishonest". both technically mean the same thing. but the second statement first confirms that there's a trait called "dishonesty" that exists and then makes it point to state that XYZ is not that. it's such an important element to be incorporated in stories where the bad/evil first has to be established and identified before its antithesis is introduced. to address your points here...it's like the FT fandom just wants a very sanitized story to indulge in because they do not have either the capacity or just the sheer willingness to indulge in a more complicated story. Farjaad for the most part is a fairly easy character to root for. he's not a bad guy..even his slightly twisted actions are not done out of malice. his selfishness is "cute". one doesn't have to compromise or defend their morals to root for a guy like him and subsequently invest in his romantic endeavors. Umeed, on the other hand, is more twisted but like you said she's a character so liberated from the conventional ties of making the "right decisions for everyone's sake" that for "hardcore feminists" (the self-proclaimed majority of the FT fandom) her flaws are more the reasons to love to her than to criticize her.

Compared to this, the other PakDramas and their stories are more complex than that. unlike FT's sanitized route, these stories HAVE to show the hard to swallow traits in either the main characters or the supporting ones to drive home the point of what's the "good" there. take Yunhi for example. if not for Dadaji's patriarchal mindset, can Dawood's character really shine? Dawood is the antithesis of Dadaji. Dadaji, Razia, Danny, the Phupha..these characters are needed in the narrative to establish why the opinions of Kim and the ones supporting Kim are the "right" one. Kim and Dawood have to "fight" their mindsets to triumph. the existence and acknowledgement of these traits should precede the denial of them.

how the FT fandom makes up for any lack of "wrong" in its narrative is that it then turns to other stories and compares characters/situations from there to fill the gap of existence and acknowledgement of "wrong" that their heroes don't have in its own canon. so the bad guys become the other MCs of other stories who don't have a sanitized enough image. chalo TB is an extreme example, let's take examples of shows that fall in the same Ramazan special light hearted genre that FT is part of. for the fans of Farjaad, even someone like Arsal (Suno Chanda s1 as S2 is a thing that just simply does not exist) is not a good enough guy because of how he occasionally treated Jiya. Arsal has done the unthinkable of raising his hand on Jiya although no strike was landed, it's an offense that's so mighty that he automatically kicks him out of the "good guys" list which Farjaad is topping solo now. never mind that Arsal fucking up and then realizing his mistake and making up for it by supporting Jiya in a way that no one in the family was WAS his entire arc. but nah..it's bordering the grey line. and heroes should only be green.

the irony of the FT fandom then proclaiming to be the sanest and wisest of them all isn't lost on me.

of COURSE i can't take this fandom seriously. contrary to what they think they are doing i.e. sticking to their side by just hyping their fav..the reality is different. they have their noses stuck up in the business of every other fandom. sure the toxicity isn't as huge as the TB fandom but again, TB fandom is humongous. for its size, FT fandom has plenty of fuckery. and I have noticed this in my few interactions with them. it's better to keep distance from them..innka koi bhi opinion itna khaas hai nahin ke usspe dhyaan diya jaye.

[sinistersinister]

The "consider that fetishes don't just spring up in a vacuum, they're contextually dependent and we live in a pretty messed up (sexist, racist, homophobic, etc) world!" crowd has no answer for what you're supposed to do after all that considering. Like, what? what's the end goal here? Feel a little bad and then simply not want to fuck? Make weird disclaimers on social media before posting horny content (as in, "I do BDSM because I'm traumatized and it's therapeutic for me"-- an excuse they use to assign you even less agency because omg how could someone so traumatized not be acting in a maladaptive way?)? Switch porn preferences? Not jerk off? I have almost no sex drive most of the time and even I know that's a ludicrous thing to ask. Especially when it's not causing DIRECT HARM TO ANOTHER SPECIFIC HUMAN BEING.

The most charitable outcome I might imagine proposing is "don't talk about your upsetting fetishes around other people and expect them to be okay with it," which, fair! Fine. Okay. That's why I have a separate blog to be horny. I don't want to make anybody uncomfortable. People who lead with their kinks and then get offended when you're alienated by their overfamiliarity are so annoying. Not because they're perverts but because they're too desperate to be validated. I hate that cloying obnoxiousness for the same reason I hate when people lead with their diagnoses or their specific political affiliations. We're all starved for affection (why we're on dating apps) but you need to be more honest with yourself. Your motivations. Why list your fetishes when you could just quote tatu's "How Soon is Now?" (yes I know their version is a cover but it's better than the original version.)

However-- granted I've been too online for too long and perhaps my definition of what constitutes 'upsetting sexual stuff' is different-- almost every person, almost every site, posts warnings. Maybe we're on different parts of the internet. I'm talking about dating sites but you can reasonably expect kink stuff on there. On those sites it's a matter of my personal annoyance, not general social propriety. Maybe I'm not hanging out in hypersexualized spaces. But usually, unless you're dating, online you get told what you're going to get. You can't buy a Playboy magazine and get upset when you see tits.

I'm not talking about your fandom shit btw. I'm talking about two kinds of tedious and exhausting choice feminists duking it out in the stupidest way imaginable.

[dojae-huh]

Tbh, seeing them lack in some skills makes them more relatable lol. Doyoung and his dancing? (which btw, as a non dancer, I can see he dances better than some idols) ; Jaehyun and his sometimes scripted reactions? Surprise surprise they're the same as most of us who do their best because its our job but we can't really say we ABSOLUTELY love are jobs everyday, no? I think we're all entitled to protest against what we're supposed to do in our own subtle ways 😂 (I mean the company ok's their work so yeah the complaints sometimes are just the viewers' preference lmao)

If I'm entertained, well and good. If I'm impressed then its a bonus. But of course that's just me and people are allowed to critique what media they consume. Although its good to not forget that there's like millions of others with a different opinion of the same content I watched.

It took some time (and a lot of reflection from observing how people react, answer back) to not get annoyed with every little criticism, sometimes downright rude comments, about my bias because again I'm on social media, with a lot of ppl hiding behind their stan accounts not much I can do with policing them (unless they're crossing the line then that's a different story)

Anyway, I'm gonna take this chance to thank you 😊 through the years I've been reading your blog, you never fail to share things that are worth learning or reflecting about.

Of course it is hard to ignore negative comments, we react emotionally before we can even fully get the whole meaning behind the words or take time to contemplate what could have made the OP think this way.

I don't think it's wise to police people on the net unless the words are really harmful (like misinformation that can damage reputation). 1) The OP won't hear you and change mind, people stick to their opinions to the end, 2) if you retaliate with agression or sarcasm, it will only "justify" the OP's hate or bring entertainment (ha! I showed that stupid bitch), 3) there are passerbyes (stans of other members, new fans), who read these quarrels and decide that fans of certain idols are too problematic and won't have interest to give the bias a chance (fans' behaviour reflects on the idol).

Honestly, how many times an anti fan got attention only because the stans flocked to defend their bias and then talked about the OP with screenshots of the original twit on their own accs? The stans themselves spread the bad words and show everyone. Without them only the OP's mutes would have known.

People have eyes and can judge for themselves. Showing the good sides of your bias is much more convincing and better for his fandom image. Like take that small observations of Taeil by his stan I sometimes link to. They work much better than any "why are you not talking about Moon Taeil?!!! HE is the main vocal!!! just listen to his godly voice!!" comments on YT.

And those people that are determined to hate your bias? They won't change unless their reason for hate is gone or they themselves grow up. Waste of time and nerves.

[septembersghost]

I know how much you love Dean, but I would like to say thank you for giving Sam love too and care and deep thought. I don't like much of how he's discussed in fandom either so it's made me feel a lot about the show and remember I am so fond of both of them to read you highlighting their qualities. they are the mess that we wanted ❤

mild spiciness incoming -

there are some very bad takes (interpreting media "differently" or having our faves should not equate to ERASING characterization as it exists) going around that are, bafflingly, growing in prevalence (Sam didn’t love Dean, Dean is more insane/possessive and Sam merely tolerates him, Dean wants to consume Sam and doesn't let him make choices, Sam is a soft spoken weakling, Dean...would kill innocent people Sam likes out of jealousy? or whatever tf that was about which was the antithesis of reality, Sam was biding his time to get out, Dean is a monster with abusive tendencies and only Sam keeps him in check, Sam is a dreamy flower child and Dean is a tyrant obsessed with his purity - I could go on, to which I say - where? WHERE?! when did any of this happen?! it didn't!)

they're both weirdos, to be fair, but not only do they unshakably love each other, they genuinely like each other and that gets pushed aside way too often in fanon (and even in some of the bad late stage ooc writing), but it's still true. they just express that in different ways. it doesn't mean they don't have angst and issues and moments of toxicity, they do and we could delve into it and their darker layers for days, but it's not this edgelord meta we're currently seeing.

my shift to talking more about Sam is due to how often he's mischaracterized and treated as someone else altogether, be it when he's totally ignored or when he's interpreted as some perpetual victim of his domineering brother, which is not the case. if I never again read the words "stockholm syndrome," which is not only inaccurate but also widely becoming considered a pseudo-diagnosis used to further harm victims - particularly women, it will be too soon. (unless we're talking about this, in which case, a bop! otherwise I don't want to see it.)

when he's treated as "normal" and like all he wanted was to leave the life, which also was not true. (ask me about how unfair his ending was, leaving him a failure and grieving for the rest of his life and missing half of his soul, never fully known or understood, never out of the shadow of mourning, waiting to die. I've written about this before too, but it makes me livid.)

wait, I have the perfect comment for this from a friend:

fandom has taken to stripping them down to boring superficial elements that are not them at all, Sam completely flattened, Dean twistedly unrecognizable in order to allow that flattening to happen, and it's...it feels like them being stolen, remade into something that never existed.

I didn't love them for fifteen-going-on-sixteen years to sit back and blithely watch all of their personality traits and value get robbed and broken down. I've talked about this numerous times lately and probably don't have anything new to add to it, but it's definitely a frustrating mindset. Sam's anger and nearly feral reactions in desperate moments, his arrogance/hubris, his temper, his judgmentalness, the way he can weaponize empathy, contrasting with his more measured, calculated responses, his thirst for knowledge and skills at research, his aims for diplomacy, and his true sense of caring is such an interesting dichotomy, the way he filters emotions, the way he presents an exterior that is contrasted underneath. (Dean does this too, and they do this in opposite ways! intentionally so! smoke and mirrors, armor and openness. canon gives us all these complexities, it's much more worthwhile not to erase them.

there's also a real sense of ableism - the constant use of "unwell" in trying to make Dean darker and more threatening/predatory than he is as a shame tactic for his actual depression/self-deprecation and self-harm/vulnerability...and the underlying classism of demeaning Dean for his "inferiority" as more of an outsider and someone who didn't get a formal education, etc., and it's uncomfortable to see it. especially as a poor person who deals with chronic illness, it's...not cute, fandom.

Dean is the far more vulnerable one when it comes to their dynamic, when it comes to demands of him, when it comes to self-sacrifice, because he is expected to give and provide without question. that is the role he is asked to fill, and when he doesn't, or when he voices his own anger/judgment/sorrow/boundaries, it's seen as selfish, as I discussed the other day. he is far more often the one who changes his mind. terrifyingly consuming Dean isn't real, anymore than pathetic victim Sam is).

not to be blunt, but why in the hell would you want them to not be exactly who they are in the story? those cutout silhouettes that have only the vaguest outline of the Winchesters are meaningless to me. I want nothing to do with them lol. you know who I love? Dean and Sam. for who and what they are.

tl;dr if anything gives you additional reason to give them thought and love and to remind you of that fondness, I’m happy - and hold on to that. (I want ‘em back, I want ‘em back...but the next best thing is remembering and honoring who they truly were.)

it’s gravity, keeping you with me <3