#looking at you eöl and feanor

[that-angry-noldo]

Plan two Silm dinner parties, you can ignore timelines and choose any characters! The first dinner is supposed to be actually enjoyable the second you’re planning for maximum chaos and insanity! Who do you invite!

-@outofangband

two things: one. i never planned a party. two. the previous sentence was a lie bevause i DID plan a party when i was ten years old and everyone had to be a princess and it would include dancing while i play turkish motiffs on my electric piano and also i knew who i would ban and how everyone had to behave so i am summoning a ten yo me right now

ALRIGHT SO the first one is going to be tea party and I'm getting most pleasant characters i can think of. give me finrod because he knows how to keep up a good and lighthearted conversation. add beor because he and finrod are besties and also beor has an excellent sense of humour, i just know it. also he rarely gets invited to parties which is a Shame. next, of course, Bilbo because all parties are made better by Bilbo. And Elrond!!! Elrond and Bilbo make such a good pair. Throw in Elros for a mix, to make all of them happy. And Amarië and Celebrian for gender diversity (also because they're nice.)

So the food and tea I'll have to get before the party because baking with that many people present is a nightmare. And then I just. Hope the thing kicks in. All of them combined can make for a great and relaxed conversation. I can get some tabletop games later in the evening, or talk Bilbo into reading his poetry.

Now, the second one. (evil laugh)

First of all, screw the responsibility. Get me Feanor, Fingolfin and Finarfin. THEY are planning the party now. They can't leave until they do so.

First of all, who they're gonna call? Feanor, of course, wants to have all of his sons show up, to which Fingolfin protests and Finarfin takes a deep breath. After an hour of arguing they compromise and decide to call Finwë. Next one up is... (throws darts) Eöl. That one is MY initiative because I think that's funny. Fingolfin rebels. He NEEDS to smash Eöl's head on something. Feanor shares the sentiment, and they add Celegorm to the mix. I give the dart to Finarfin and spin the wheel. He sighs and throws the dart with his eyes closed. He misses. On purpose. He's wise like that. "If you're so smart," I say, "why don't you show up to the party." Finarfin reminds me that darts are very pointy and my neck is particularly vulnerable. To which I remind him that I am beyond the narrative and throw the dart myself. It lands on Turin Turambar, because of course. Finarfin has no idea who Turin is, while Feanor and Fingolfin have had enough of watching him suffer. They start plotting. The choice is between Turgon and Orodreth. Feanor says that technically, they already have a member each from the first two houses (cue the heated argument of whether or not should they consider eöl a member of fingolfin's house), and recommends to send Orodreth. finarfin, who, while they argued, managed to fetch a copy of narn, stares them down and writes beleg to the list. feanor and fingolfin are silent for a while because they Can't Believe they forgot about Beleg Cuthalion. Suddenly, Fingolfin grins and draws the name of Thingol of Doriath. I clap my hands and set a werewolf loose in the mansion where the party has to begin. and also get some wine for finarfin because of how diappointed in me he looks. the four of us sit in our watching room and brace for the drama. maybe the real party were the frenemies we made along the way.

[lacnunga]

Okay I deleted that rant post bc I've reconsidered the hornet's nest but I still stand by that I'm #teamdwarves

[galadhremmin]

Do you think Galadriel eventually reconciled herself to Fëanor’s memory and forgave him? Perhaps recognised how similar they were?

hello! Once again this is all so barebones in the actual books you can more or less fill in the gaps/inner life if the characters however you want! So I'm just going to share a take on it I enjoy (but who knows, might go for an entirely different one depending on the fic if I can concentrate on writing again).

I tend to take Tolkien's remarks on Elvish memory as being a genuinely different experience and affecting their acts in the present very seriously, because it makes sense. The psychology of someone who could theoretically live forever and have an exact, 'living' memory they can 'walk' in of all that time is just going to create a very different relationship to time. It never gets any further away. The horizon does not go blue and hazy. The past remains as near as it was the moment it happened, and time softens no edges.

So simply time passing would not lead to any forgiveness. New experiences that allow the person to reframe their existing ones might, as would profound personal change. I think Galadriel does change. It seems unlikely no experience in Beleriand reframed her experiences in Aman; Fëanor might seem like the worst possible person if you have never encountered Eol, or tbqh her fair share of human beings (some of us do get pretty awful sometimes yk), Sauron, or an orc. So while the memory of the kinslaying would never dull at least a slowly growing willingness to give her uncle a fair judgement (as Shibboleth she tells us she did not grant him in Valinor) might help. Combined with the fact that Fëanor's decisions and actions but not his motivations are truly evil. Most of his decisions even make a lot of sense, once you really look at context; that is probably why the character can convince himself to make them despite going against his own words before the Valar defending his decision not to break the Silmarils. He ends up breaking his own convictions instead, repeatedly, and causing immense amounts of grief. But he's just no Sauron or Morgoth, and again I'd consider someone like Eöl much worse as a person. So simply having seen more of what people can be like outside of Valinor almost unavoidable is going to reframe Fëanor for her, and maybe even cause her to if not forgive then at least understand him to a degree.

Still. I think the nature of elvish memory renders every memory close to traumatic memory (in terms of continued emotional immediacy) to start with, and she does have traumatic memories of the kinslaying. Her suffering on the Ice? Is entirely her own fault though. Fëanor's intention was for them to turn back, her father had already turned back. It is pride and ambition and a desire to work against Feanor as well as wanting to meet her kin in Beleriand that drive her onwards. It is very clear in the story however that those who crossed the Ice do blame the Feanorians for the pain and loss of their crossing, however. And I think this as well as her earlier setting up of herself in opposition to Fëanor while being inspired by his ideas are fairly fundamental for her self-image.

So her acknowledging that she is the reason for her own suffering on the Ice, for her to no longer form her self image as against-feanor-- well there needs to be a solid narrative and identity to replace it, right? People need self-stories to live. They tend to sort of collapse of you try to remove an identity forming part of that (which is very funny in stories, but we don't really see Galadriel collapse). And her relationship with memory would make it very difficult to reconcile herself with being in any way similar; there is the memory of the kinslaying, the need to assign blame for her suffering on the Ice, and of course something as mundane as Feanor being a jerk to Indis leading to her being the only sibling to si-sa. This starts early and only gets more intense.

Anyway I think her time in Doriath was probably influential. Maybe her sense of identity became more about her Telerin heritage through it. Though of course the further kinslaying would make it very easy to take an even more black/white view of Feanor and the outcome of his actions-- even though this is in fact not something Feanor was himself involved in, not likely an outcome he saw coming, and unlikely to have been a result of the Oath he was hoping for.

She'd also have been subject to the Quenya ban, which might make her more willing to judge the Noldor more kindly in some way-- of only because she herself was suddenly affected by it. And she'd have seen how power influenced Thingol, and learned from Melian.

I think she does truly change as a person the moment she refuses the ring.

This is when she personally says no to the temptation of power, of rule. Ruling was a significant part of her reason for coming to Middle Earth.

To be able to refuse that? While this is a devisive moment and solidifies the change I think she needs to have changed significantly from who she used to be already to do this. She ends up leaving her realm and returning to Valinor, something the Exiles refused in part because they did not like being at the bottom of the hierarchy. For Galadriel to willingly become (comparatively) powerless and return...well! Her priorities need to have shifted. If she truly was desperate to stay, to be above and admired in some small way I'm sure there were options. Nenya is useless now, but she has power and experience and talent of her own. But she does not try that. She accepts that it is time to leave.

So I think by the end of the third age she both has far wider experience to put Feanor into perspective, and a significant change in her uhmm ...identity construction? I don't think end of 3rd age galadriel is still in her against-feanor phase.

Uhm, anyway, Feanor. I think her gesture of the three hairs is BOTH a sweet personal gesture to Gimli and a very public demonstration of her 1. the goodwill to dwarves to whom her people were still very mistrusting and a sort of apology for his blindfolding etc 2. Gimli likely does not know who Feanor is, but the Silm is supposed to be a history book. At least some of those elves would be familiar with her refusal to give feanor a hair three times; she is saying to THEM that this dwarf is given thrice what she refused the greatest elvish craftsman 3. i like to read it as her private last petty 'fuck you uncle feanor' moment aside from the political elf-dwarf theatre of it. She and no one else gets to decide who has some of her hair.

Anyway. Do i think she forgave him? No way. Do I think she began to be able to see him more clearly, to judge him more fairly after long ages perhaps? Yes eventually, but not happily. Nostalgia is easier when your memory is not like an elf's.

You just can't like a guy who's mean to your grandmother.

[welcometolotr]

I love your Celegorm design! It’s so rare to see him drawn with silver hair! He’s described as having fair hair and I always like the idea that he inherited Míriel’s hair, which is also silver, rather than it being randomly blond? Anyways, ITS REALLY GOOD LIKE ALL YOUR ART BUT HES MY FAVORITE CHARACTER SO I EXTRA LOVE YOUR ART OF HIM

Thank you! He’s one of my favorite characters to draw. I think I must have started the fair hair look because I needed to differentiate the sons more, lol, but I grew into it nicely. I also like to take what the text gave us and willfully misinterpret and expand. 

If I properly recall, he’s actually described simply as “fair”, much as Dior and other characters are. He’s definitely not golden blond: in Finarfin’s glossary entry, it says “Alone among the Ñoldorin princes he and his descendants had golden hair.” (The Silmarillion, 416)

Uses of ‘fair’ as a descriptor:“Celegorm the Fair.” (64) “Indis the Fair” (71, and he goes on to describe that she has golden hair). Melkor is described as having a “fair semblance” (80). To Eöl, Aredhel is “very fair” (164). // And we know Aredhel has black hair: “for she was pale though her hair was dark.“ (66)“one so royal and fair as Luthien” (232); “Luthien the fair”, (234). // We know "her hair was dark as the shadows of twilight.” (208)“Turin grew fair and strong in Doriath” (256). // We know he was “as dark-haired as his mother” (Children of Hurin, 39).“Elwing the fair” (322). “Dior the fair” (323). “Nimloth the Fair” (351, 356, 374; this one’s a hilarious example because they’re literally talking about a tree, and by the way it does happen to be white). Lastly, Sauron before Numenor is described - just like Melkor - as having “a fair semblance.”

Not to mention the innumerable amount of times that Tolkien describes Tirion and Gondolin as ‘fair cities’. He clearly uses it as a synonym for ‘beautiful,’ ‘handsome,’ and/or ‘well-formed’. ‘Pleasing to the eye’. I think only in Aredhel’s case does ‘fair’ specifically denote pale/r skin.

There IS a specific footnote relevant to us here; the glossary entry for “Vanyar” notes that the word literally means “‘the Fair,’ referring to the golden hair of the Vanyar.” (448) But again - Celegorm can’t have golden hair; least of all because none of his ancestors do. So again, ‘fair’ does not necessarily denote blondness. 

Now, if we only paid attention to the published Silm, we’d run into problems - namely, that very few characters’ hair colors are given. For example - Miriel and Finwe don’t have hair colors listed in this book. Upon Indis’ introduction, she is described as “golden-haired and tall, and in all ways unlike Miriel.“ (71) This perhaps implies that Miriel is dark-haired and short, and crabby and stays inside all the time (relatable). Some artists read this and stopped here - Jenny Dolfen of goldseven, for example, drew Miriel with dark hair.) 

But if we expand into the Histories of Middle-Earth series, which is based upon the rest of Jirt’s notes and drafts….we get quite a bit more. And listen, Gil-Galad can be the scion of both Fingon and Orodreth, you’re clearly just not thinking creatively enough.

I’ll be the first to admit that fanon and fanart often distort my own view of characters and make me forget what was actually written. (Example: Elrond & Elros and Elured & Elurín, as far as I can see, are never actually described in-text as twins - only brothers.)

So what do we have?

Finwë: “He had black hair, but brilliant grey-blue eyes.” (PoME, 357).Miriel: “Silver was her hair and dark were her eyes” (Morgoth’s Ring, 185).Fëanor: "fair of face, his eyes piercingly bright and his hair raven-dark.”(Silm, 70)Maedhros: “inherited the rare red-brown hair of Neranel’s kin…’copper-top’.” (PoME 353) A note about Mahtan says that his hair was brown “and had glints of coppery-red in it.” (366)Maglor: Nothing. (Tolkien Gateway lists his hair as ‘dark’ and provides no footnotes.)Celegorm: Nothing.Caranthir: “he was black-haired as his grandfather” (PoME 353). “he was dark (brown) haired, but had the ruddy complexion of his mother.” (353) [These contradict each other; given that brown hair is never discussed among the high Eldar, the black seems more likely. The parentheses may be Christopher Tolkien’s attempt at interpreting a weird note.]Curufin: “resembled Feanor very much in face” (PoME 352) and his name Atarinke was “referring to his physical likeness to Fëanor.” (PoME 353). No hair color is actually specified.Ambarussa: "inherited the rare red-brown hair of Neranel’s kin…” (PoME 353) “The two twins were red-haired…The twins remained alike, but the elder grew darker in hair…After childhood, they were not to be confused.” (PoME 355)Celebrimbor: Nothing. 

***I missed a deleted portion about Celegorm’s hair, available over here. Thanks for pointing it out, @cycas! 

So, overall: because of Tolkien’s precedent for using that descriptor to indicate a beautiful face rather than light hair, it’s more likely that Celegorm doesn’t have silver hair. But you know what? IT’S GORGEOUS AND I LOVE IT AND MIRIEL DESERVES TO BE REPRESENTED.

God I wish I still drew. I have the sudden urge to draw every Fëanorian previously depicted as black-haired with silver hair instead. Fëanor has it. Maglor has it. Celegorm, Caranthir, and Curufin all have it. In the end, Celebrimbor gets it too, and makes many a Sinda do a double-take.

[silverwingsandoceanthings]

Headcanon: Idril and the Manipulation of Prophecy

‘I am still going through things very slowly, but there were some bits that I sort of wanted to talk about somewhere for a while and wasn’t sure how. I may at some point tidy this up, and I may also at some point make a seperate post looking at the instances of prophetic knowledge Idril had herself, rather than this. Which is using other people’s prophecies for her own ends.

Then I saw a reference to how in Greek Tragedy the heroes - and sometimes other characters - often are prophecised to do something, or know an event will happen, and seek to circumvent it. And they always fail, because they seek to avoid the prophecy via strength of will and a force of their own. And its as beautiful as it is heartbreaking, knowing they are bound to fail.

Idril... Doesn’t. To my reading it is pretty clear that she knows Gondolin will fall. Not might, will. Once she knows it will happen, she never seems to try to stop Gondolin from falling. What she does is take the knowledge that it will, then act to minimise the effect. Gondolin will fall, but I will make means for some to escape and live on.

(I tend to think she has known it will fall since Eöl’s execution, but that is a topic for another day. there’s a tldr on it in the tags.)

And now a cut, as I got carried away and we progress into ‘textually-inspired headcanon’ instead of ‘interpretation of text’. The TLDR: Idril was making plans to save the Noldor via circumventing the Doom of Mandos, using other prophecies to find ways to get a message to the Valar and make them feel bad, but in the end they were unnecessary as she fell in love with Tuor (who she needed to marry for it to work, and had resigned herself to a duty marriage without love so unheard of for an elf, but known to men), he with her, and he named the child what the child needed to be named without her needing to use her mother-naming to give said child such.

In FoG we get the following line, which becomes relevant to the rest of this brain-dump:  ‘Know then that Idril had a great power of piercing with her thought the darkness of the hearts of Elves and Men, and the glooms of the future thereto - further even than is the common power of the kindreds of the Eldalië’ ie, not only does she have a talent for reading people, but also an understanding of how the future works, and given some of the other stuff going on in that text, actual prophetic dreams and visions and all that wonderful stuff.

She’s also 90% of the time absolutely in control of everything she possibly can be. And there’s a lot of prophecies and dooms and such floating around from other people, most of which I find it hard to imagine she would not have known about. Given her status, tendancies towards control and information gathering and knowing what is to come and all those things. Even if people did not approach her to say, she would do her best to keep herself aware of things. There’s three bits I sort of want to talk about, though there are a few more I am aware of that can contribute to this, these three sort of are enough to put it together.

Let us start, as things often should, with the Doom of Mandos. I’m not copying all of it. There’s also some other bits I now realise need to go into my braining on the execution thing, but aside. The bit I’m looking for here is: ‘the Valar will fence Valinor against you, and shut you out, so that not even the echo of your lamentation shall pass over the mountains’. Also all of the awful things it promises, but the specifics of those are unimportant.  What Idril knows from this: the Valar have blocked them from Valinor, and if they try ask for help it will not cross the mountains. If the request for help were on the other side of the mountains, it would not need to cross them, but its a moot point if they cannot. Maybe uncle Finarfin might manage to bed help from the other side of the mountains, but he hasn’t yet so its not really feasible.

Second we leave the silm proper for a while, heading over to the Statute of Finwë and Miriel as found in Morgoth’s Ring. I’m never quite certain if it is part of Laws and Customs or not, but in it if Finwë can remarry is the point of the debate. With other bits involved. The section in question comes near the end, and involves the fact that ‘but Indis’ descendants will be amazing and she won’t have kids with anyone but Finwë so we she totes let her marry him’ (very tldr and absolutely not a direct quote). It mentions at a point that both elves and men will have a part to play in her descendants and also great deeds. Then we get this gem: ‘When he that shall be called Eärendil setteth foot upon the shores of Aman, ye shall remember my words’ (I have a whole other ramble about the rest of this section, but that’s not for here or now).  Idril brain remembers this - there’s no way I can concieve of her not having been exposed to this report of great importance to both her family and legal history - connects it to the previous bit and goes ‘there is a pre-existing prophecy that a descendant of Indis, who is my great-grandmother, named Eärendil, will set foot on the shores of Aman. Not just be in Aman - setteth foot upon. That’s a pre-existing prophecy specifying someone who can break the fence. This person does not exist yet. But should I ever marry, I can make it so, then they can go beg the Valar for help. Given even Mandos seems to think this relative will be a good thing.

Third, and finally though there’s a lot more that could be used but I have things to do today, is the prophecy Huor makes as he tells Turgon to go and willingly faces down his own death: 'Yet if it stands but a little while, then out of your house shall come the hope of Elves and Men. This I say to you, lord, with the eyes of death: though we part here for ever, and I shall not look on your white walls again, from you and from me a new star shall arise.’ (I like to think that death prophecies from mortals are just a thing that happens sometimes, like pregancy prophecies for elves. Something about Mandos being both the guardian of the dead and also a prophet, but anyway this is one that exists canonically. Silmarillion-as-published canon even.) Well, that’s interesting. The Hope of Elves and Men comes from Gondolin, but is not there yet. I do not think at the point people get back from the Nirnareth and Idril would have heard this she would have the context for the new star, but a prophecy is a prophecy, and the prophecy speaks of unifying Huor’s line with Turgon’s. Well she is all of Turgon’s line left, and unifying is easiest via marriage. Luthien happened, so children of elves and men can occur. Presumably Huor has children (well his wife was pregnant at the time of the fighting but Idril wouldn’t have had the specifics there and already have a child seems like a logical conclusion). Which basically means, she has to marry Huor’s son. If she ever tracks him down. And have a kid. May as well make that kid the Eärendil from earlier - hope of Elves and Men is a little more than hope for the Noldor, but hey Noldor are elves and men are also affected by Morgoth. The plan just expanded to include more people. 

They low and behold Voronwë shows up with him at the city gates not too long later. At which point the plan goes something like: get Tuor to marry me (hmmm might take work), have a child (hopefully easy enough once married), name the child Eärendil (mother names are a thing so that’s very easy to control), escape the inevitable fall of Gondolin (a lot of work, but we also have much more notice on that one), get the child from here to Aman (Ulmo will probably help out), make sure child is loud enough to convince the Valar to do something (that’ll be a problem but with good enough tutors...), congrats your people are now significantly less damned than previously.

Of course none of her manipulating the sitatution bar the tunnel in the end proved necessary in my headcannon as well. She spent the time between hearing about Tuor and meeting him going ‘right this is the man I will have to marry for the sake of the Noldor I must prepare myself mentally for the duty I have taken upon myself to fulfil the prophecy to save my people’ only to meet him and go ‘oh no he’s hot’ followed by  ‘oh no he’s also sweet and adorable and I want to see him happy’ followed by ‘well I guess this isn’t so much duty afterall’. Then most of her pregancy going ‘why the fuck did I have a dream about seeing my baby with a silmaril of all things and beyond Arda of all places’ (See: the names of Finwë’s descendants in the Shibboleth of Feanor, Peoples of Middle Earth), and so forgetting to discuss with Tuor the fact the child needed naming Eärendil for prophecy reasons, only for Tuor to name him Eärendil while she was recovering from giving birth anyway. Due to something Ulmo said about a son who was good at boats. So in the end most of this was completely irrelevant anyway, and more than a little exasperating on the ‘I put in all this thought and effort then it just *happened* like this was the actual plan and I’m not trying to manipulate the situation’, but that doesn’t change the fact my Idril did it anyway.

[cyrefinn]

On passion and calculation

Headcanon time! I was thinking earlier about how I wrote Curufin four years ago and how to hit my stride with him again. At my peak activity level, it felt natural to write in his voice. I felt I knew him well. I’ve been revising the canon and revisiting also my old threads and headcanons, and I came up with this as a corollary to a few of my previous headcanon posts in which I speak of Curufin’s as being crafty (outside of the forge), thoughtful, deliberate, manipulative, etc. (e.g. here) And yet, this is not entirely accurate.

This is only part of the picture. For is not Curufin his father’s son, most like him in temper, as well as look and appearance? And is Fëanor not known to be passionate?

Curufin consciously tries to come off as always in control, and often he does act in a cold and calculating way. He certainly spends a good deal of thought and energy on thinking what roads to take, how to optimize his choices to most efficiently achieve his goals, how to influence the things and people around him that he can to help himself. He is crafty...

But he has many strong passions, as well. His interest is easily diverted, and he loves to learn and to experiment. He will often do things out of curiosity. He will do things just because they feel good. Because he wants to. It’s the centuries-old Noldorin equivalent of considering something and then just being like, “Fuck it,” and going for it, just for the hell of it. Sometimes these things will set him back, and he will acknowledge that, and he’ll do them anyway. If asked to explain something like that, Curufin would probably say some version of that the utility he derives from the activity offsets, or even outweighs, the disutility of the strategic setback. (There’s always a logical explanation.)

And he can be moved to anger, hate, and malice much more easily than he lets on, and himself believes. Again, take Fëanor, the one who cursed and insulted Morgoth and slammed the door in his face (ref. the immortal quote, “Get thee gone from my gate, thou jail-crow of Mandos!”), the one who swore that infamous Oath, the one who burned the ships, who (to his downfall) was so eager “to come at Morgoth himself” that in battle he pressed beyond his vanguard alone and fought a bunch of Balrogs like it was his day job (“long he fought on, and undismayed, though he was wrapped in fire and wounded”).

A note in particular about the burning of the ships at Losgar. There’s a quote from The Shibboleth of Fëanor I’ve always found interesting for a number of reasons but here the only relevant part is the detail about the relationship between Fëanor and Curufin: “In the night Feanor, filled with malice, aroused Curufin, and with him and a few of those most close to Feanor in obedience he went to the ships and set them all aflame; and the dark sky was red as with a terrible dawn.” Here Curufin is the only son of Fëanor mentioned by name to participate in the burning of the ships. That’s no accident. Although in my RP I subscribe to the Silmarillion version (in which all the sons but Maedhros participate), I do draw upon the Shibboleth’s version for inspiration and information about who Curufin is.

Curufin is his father’s son. In Fëanor’s place, Curufin would likely have felt the same malice and done the same thing; in helping his father burn the ships, he probably felt some version of that malice because he loved his father and sympathized and was affine with him.

I like to think of Curufin’s conversation with Eöl as well, in which he is said to be “of perilous mood.” I always read this as “of perilous mood at the time” but it’s still interesting. Curufin is somewhat rude to Eöl in this interaction, laughing at him and giving him to understand in no unclear terms how much he dislikes and distrusts him. (Yet I note that, despite his dislike of Eöl and disapproval of his choice in spouse, Curufin nonetheless grants Eöl his life (when he might have taken it easily with impunity), his leave, and a warning: “This counsel I add: return now to your dwelling in the darkness of Nan El-moth; for my heart warns me that if you now pursue those who love you no more, never will you return thither.”) This is sloppier work than I would normally ascribe to Curufin, and it serves to underline that, when he’s in a mood, Curufin can be careless and say/do things that might be better left unsaid/undone. 

All this is to say I wonder sometimes if I focus too much on the “crafty” aspect and not enough on the fact that he is like Fëanor and, like his father, has a fire in his spirit that often masters him. I do love me some complicated characters (the more complicated, the better!), so I may start exploring this aspect of Curufin a bit more going forward.