#i don't think people who feminize will are better than people who feminize mike or vice-versa i think it's all equally dumb

[strangeswift]

tbh there have been so many instances of ‘mike is the girl’ posts that pushes the same silly thinking you’re criticizing with that “the man” joke, that I really don’t mind what people are saying on this topic. it’s so not a way to view gay relationships, you’d think it’s obvious they’re simply guys, but at least it’s blatant that it’s wrong when it’s mike viewed that way lol. I don’t get how people get to that conclusion from the show… so if ppl romanticize will’s crush in his decision choosing a name this time im not bothered in comparison. it beats macho will dynamic by a mile. I know that you just meant that sarcasm as “it’s neither they don’t need to be in boxes like that” - which is true - but it read like you believe the flip side, which reminded me how untrue that’d be for mike when you look at it. just thinking out loud sorry. all that to say they’re keeping their names thanks everyone xo

i think they'd actually both change their last name to each other's first names, making them mr. william michaels & mr. michael williams

[gorey-gorella]

It’s a genuine shame that you think academics like Cathy Cohen aren’t worth listening to because they supposedly use too many “buzzwords” (another silly anti-academia fear mongering term) or “get to the point quickly enough”... It’s obviously important to consider the positioning/background of your sources, but Ieft-leaning ones tend to be more in line with facts than right-leaning ones, especially notorious grifters like Shoe0nhead.

You keep bringing up observable reality as if it exists in opposition to my positions when it’s not. As a fellow atheist, I also acknowledge that subatomic particles not being observable by my eye does not make them any less real or measurable. Things like systemic racism have numerical evidence and historical context.

I called your description of the left exaggerated because you clearly do not understand what “be gay, do crime” even means (i.e. associating it with gays thinking they’re above the law as a whole as opposed to it’s actual meaning of participating in civil disobedience/good trouble to create more just laws/eradicate unjust laws).

Mike is literally one of the creators, safe to say he knows what ATLA stands for better than you do.

A show can be leftist and also critique it. The video game Disco Elysium is communist but critiques communism. Also, a monarchy is still a form of government and the show doesn’t need to display a one-to-one governmental representation of its ideology to hold said ideology (After all, suggesting Mike is advocating for monarchy would be a silly lack of media literacy). Furthermore, saying that authoritarianism isn’t bad on its own is interesting, to say the least… Also, while liberalism, leftism, and libertarianism may have some overlaps, they are all distinct and you seem to keep conflating them. I think it’s similarly interesting that you think Airbenders were too pacifistic, but label the entire anti-fascist movement as too extreme (i.e. support more active forms liberation for fictional characters, but not for real oppressed people). ATLA promotes balance as a means to prevent/resist authoritarianism and fascism, not to endorse centrism.

Of course not all right-wingers are exactly the same, people across the board are individuals. Some extreme right-wingers love Trump and some hate him because they’re also not a monolith. However, at its core, the right is united by inherently harmful and dehumanizing ideologies.

I’m obviously left-leaning and I own that. Bias is impossible to avoid, being a centrist is still buying into certain forms of propaganda, so the best one can do is align themselves with whatever position is most in line with facts/has the most consistent and harm-reductive worldview. I am, however, not caught up in culture war bull like worrying about people’s gender identity. You genuinely think the left is out to “eliminate masculinity” or whatever that means when it’s all in your head and you responded in earnest to a shitpost. No one is force-feminizing men against their will and you seriously need to change your media diet if you think that.

Buzzwords aren’t a leftist thing. If a right winger is saying top many buzzwords, I tend to tune off from them, too.

I never said anything in my other post about the left holding men down and making them wear a dress.

My point was that the left hates men who are mentally dominant and have their own opinions in any way. They don't actually care for men being able to express their feminity. They just want men to submit everything. Most 'feminine' men I see on the left are either gay and act exactly like stan Twitter users or just completely submit themselves to the left, and they drink, 'respect women juice'.

They may be 'joking', but I can tell its based on their own beliefs. Especially since one of the comments was on the person's side and was all like, 'The misandry truthers' like if misandry clearly doesn't exist.

As I said, it's not like I don't use data at stuff at all, I just don't use the ones with buzzwords, half-ass data, and clearly with an extreme bias. Cathy Cohen has a clear bias of wanting to make blacks and lgbt people look like victims of everything.

I'm not rejecting data or academia. I'm rejecting studies that are clearly agenda-driven and full of emotional buzzwords. Bias exists in academia, and that's why I won't blindly accept someone like Cathy Cohen, who constantly frames minorities as helpless victims of everything.

Mike literally can be flawed. And just because years later, he quoted some dumb shit doesn't mean that ATLA meant that back then.

I never said Mike meant that we should become a monarchy, I meant that the show, in general, was anti-extremes. That's why they didn't dismantle the monarchy, he may disagree with it, but it's not an extreme in it of itself, that's why the monarchy wasn't destroyed.

Just because Mike DiMartino is the creator doesn't mean his later political takes rewrite the themes of ATLA. The show is about balance and resisting extremes, not about pushing a single political ideology. Creators don't get to dictate how we interpret their work years later.

Antifa is a garbage movement. I am anti-fascist. That doesn't mean much. That doesn't say much about my beliefs. Saying your anti-fascist does really mean anything. Antifa is a radical, dangerous movement that harms those they disagree with.

I literally agreed it was anti-fascism. It's just not completely anti-auth, or else, the Firelord and Royal system would be dismantled all together.

The right thinks the same thing of the left. They think at its core, all the left and libs are trying to destroy everything they love.

For me, centrism makes the most sense because it's not on one side. It takes in all perspectives.

Centrism isn't propaganda-it's about taking a balanced view and rejecting extremism on both sides. It allows me to evaluate issues based on logic and evidence, not just tribal loyalty to a political camp.

I call out the night's bullshit too. Where did you get me saying I'm worried about that? I'm saying the left never has cared about men(exactly why the right can easily brainwash them on being on their side).

The left ignores men's issues, which is why the right has such an easy time pulling men into their camp. The left only 'cares' about men when they fit their agenda, and that's why many men feel alienated and brainwashed by the right.

Also, Mike and many other creators can be stupid, especially in the future. He could just be following the dumb modern trends now.

I'm not sure if Mike quoted it 2016(the time of Trump) or in a later year, but ATLA was made in 2005 and ended in 2008. That's years from even 2016 and even more years from a year above 2016.

Clearly, back then, it was anti-extremes. His newer opinions don't change what ATLA, the TV series, was all about. It was about harmony.

I mean, wow, nothing says anti-auth like continuing the Firelord and Royal system, even in LOK.

[eurekavalley]

Honestly it's kind of interesting how little the show emphasizes the adversarial nature of the justice system otherwise? There is such a strong theme of consequences for your actions that even lawyers start to become karmically responsible for the foreseen and unforeseen consequences of their clients - that some of the people they successfully defend will go on to commit more crimes, and in some way the lawyers are complicit for their actions as well. I may be overreading that, because I am thinking of Kim's defense of Jimmy before the bar panel, when she was party to underhanded tactics. But 1) Jimmy deserved a vigorous defense then too, something both Howard and Chuck heavily implied to Kim that he didn't, regardless of her misconduct IIRC. And 2) the sense that lawyers are in some way responsible for their clients' actions is its own moral tangle (if a lawyer is ethically scrupulous by gilligould logic, does that mean justice is necessarily done? do lawyers only bear responsibility for the consequences of clients' actions when the lawyers have acted badly, or all the time?) But the show rarely grapples with this, does not ask the question of whether the three teenagers in the first episode deserved more from the system than a burn out public defender who was spread too thin, even if they did do something terrible. Leans into the idea that Jimmy as Saul has some kind of complicity in future crime for offering discounted defense rates. Does not weigh what kind of defense Lalo deserved, even while we know that Mike manipulated the witness and the police to orchestrate his arrest (talk about putting your thumb on the scale!), and by the rules of the system, Lalo should probably have walked free. Poor Jimmy, left to clean up Gus and Mike's mess.

Better Call Saul doesn't present this the way so many legal dramas do, with each side forming a theory of the case, searching for new information and angles to make their arguments. Instead it highlights all the moments where ethics fail defense attorneys and invites the viewer to keep a tally. On the other side we see ADA's who seem committed to the process, but we don't see much of their interiority and decision making (except for what looks like Suzanne Ericsen's carceral feminism). And while Jimmy and Kim's professional ethics are questionable, they are the only defense attorneys who are shown to have ideals about their role on behalf of the people in the system and not just the system itself, although they each become corrupt actors in their own way.

All that to say that the bus chant stands out to me because it is one of so few scenes with that theme. It follows Jimmy's confession/concession that he does not deserve a defense of his own, or that it's better for his soul not to go down that road. On another show it might all seem muddled but I think BCS is just in conversation with itself - it helps give the carceral ending more dimension than Jimmy is bad and Jimmy is guilty. As others have pointed out, his sentence is arbitrarily long after the too sweet deal he originally negotiated, refusing to land on a firm idea of what justice for Jimmy actually looks like. He's had every bad consequence of his actions chase him; at some point it is just the law of averages that the consequences for the good he did begin to follow him too. (I also think that Jimmy finding some peace and community through recognizing himself in his prisonmates is another reason to be hopeful for his future with Kim - after all, she is his unindicted co-conspirator when it comes to a few things. Even though she stands apart, she's part of it too.)

The fact that Saul's name is used as a criminals chant........even though he was at his worst as Saul, EVEN AT HIS WORST, Saul was a kind of savior for people the law didn't think were worthy of defense.

People often forget that even criminals are deserving of a chance, that legality does not equal morality, and that's why we joke so derogatorily of lawyers. Because hey, why do these "scum" deserve defense? Jimmy/ Saul reminds us why.

[missielynne]

So I know you and most Ghosts fans will disagree with this but I also know you're kind enough to hear UOs without judging or mocking! Anyway, my UO is that at this point I really prefer not just the BBC version generally but Mike/Alison to Jay/Sam. On both shows I think the ghosts outshine the humans, but Mike/Alison just seem more relatably adult while Jay and Sam remind me of teens who are just pitifully eager to fit in - they're obsessed with being perceived as cool, they want to be in with the "hip" couple in town (who are of course lesbians determined to dismantle the patriarchy because the show is eager to show how "woke" it is lol), Jay is so pathetically eager to be approved of that he accidentally joins a cult, Sam is always fixated about anyone not liking her for any reason etc. I don't know, they're not that interesting and layered as is and the fact that one of the few personality traits they have is "dying to be seen as cool" just isn't endearing to me in adult characters! Mike and Alison feel like stronger and more relatable people to me.

And you have every right to feel that way! But I think...I personally can't compare the two and say I like one better than the other because they each have their own stuff that I like. Now, for me, I would say, if I had to pick, for the long haul, Jay and Sam. I know its a feature that BBC seasons are shorter, but for me, that means there isn't a lot of room to develop as much (or at least it doesn't seem like much of a priority) for Mike and Alison to be beyond "here is this couple. They live in a haunted house that is a hotel. boom!" While I do agree that they seem more adult, and that's good...I just I would like them so much more if their world was expanded. I feel I don't know them as well as Jay and Sam. I don't feel like they're as layered as you do. (Although I do like what we do get.) And yeah, I understand how the lessons about feminism and all that can come across as heavy-handed (believe me, I wish a show could just be a show sometimes and not always feel it needs to win internet approval by showing they care about this that and the other thing. Something I appreciate BBC for) however, I think it's done well enough and sometimes amusingly enough that I can stand it.

As for the "being cool" thing, as far as Jay is concerned, I feel like as irritating as it can seem (believe me, I get it...the cult episode was definitely a weak one, especially since it wasn't tied to Flower like it should have been with the story.) But I think once they get off their butts and let Jay see ghosts or give him some friends, that desperation to be liked because he feels lonely and out of place will go away.

[franki-lew-yo]

I really hate 2d purists. No, not 2d animation. Not 2d animators.

2d purists.

The sad thing is it’s gotten to the point that I really cringe hearing any pro-2D sentiment at all. I hate the arguments I agree with because how often they're misused and weaponized by idiots.

Let me make my stance here clear - 2d is NOT appreciated and 3d is used for everything! The layman Karen-mom who doesn’t have an artistic bone in her body looks at stupidsmooth 3D Grubhub ads and assumes quality cause it “looks more real” (aka ‘rendered’). I know as much is true because I literally have a member of my family who told my sister and I that she thinks 3d is better (and also that she “tolerated THOSE movies for us kids”. Touching words. My sister was taking an animation course by the way). Combined that with the studios either using 2D for cheap stuff or finding good 2d animation too “costly”, I get it and I’m not even any animator. I'm just a worm an illustrator.

but holy HELL -

There’s a backlash from the artistic community that's it's own kind of insufferable and deserve to be addressed.

“(insert2Danimatedfilm) is better BECAUSE it's 2D!”

followed by: "Animation is a visual medium and the quality of the art affects how much the story means !!!!”  

Yes. Totally. Animation is a visual medium and the look and style is important. Sadly, people use this excuse to really obnoxious ends, insisting that design being pretty is '' everything ''. When you treat a movie more as a special effects demo I get why you talk about the artistry at hand; but I’m sorry, visuals are not the only thing important and it’s why I’m also getting sick of the sameElsafacesyndrome rants too! There’s this attitude that's reads as "but it LOOKS better fromaproductionimage/teasertrailerwhichapparentlyisindicativeof all themovieactuallyis so it MUST BE better".

-“3D should only be used to make things look realistic!”

I think I know the logic this criticism is made in response to, and that’s the Sony + Illumination films which look just as good in 2D as they do in three dimensions. I know it feels like people are twisting this medium to try and make it like a classic cartoon when by all means people can and would love a classic cartoon being a classic cartoon. That I get- From the unsung 2D animator’s perspective, that’s more than valid !

But it’s a huuuuuuge slap in the face to 3d in saying it should only be used for "realistic animation" because

1: It’s not like realistic animation could age badly or look uncanny in the next few years. It's almost like technology is constantly improving, which I guess 2d animation never did and it was always the same technique and quality as every film that came after it.

2: The industry does treat 3d as a magic-moneymaker for this reason. Just listen to these people call the 2019 LION KING “live action” as if they’re embarrassed to call it animation. It IS animation! It would be impressive if you acknowledged that what it is, but like the CATS, you basically are treating it as just a neato tool to better your live action and not it's own artform - which it is!

3: By this “three-deeonly gud when real liek in da toystories” non-logic I guess 2d should ONLY be for flowyflowy SPACE JAM cartoons and maybe some Disney*. Just that though. You can’t do anything more with 2d. It’s never supposed to be realistic I guess. Good thing Richard Williams only did 'toons' and just toons that’s why we need 3d in the world I guess.

Wait no - that’s stupid.

"I HAVE to see the “Land Before Time 14″ when it comes out! I mean it’s a 2D animated film!"

Lost in the aether that is Youtube comment chains removed from kid's videos is a stream of this very VERY stupid argument supporting the buying of the 14th LAND BEFORE TIME film because it’s supporting 2D. My sister and I can be found on that chain arguing against this stupidity. All you have is my word, but trust me: it really did happen.

I’m sorry but...no.

Unless you have a friend or a family member who worked on these movies there’s no reason to see this and ESPECIALLY no reason to insist it’s a win for the 2D community if you buy up this crap - and I'm not judging if you do like it, but come on! LAND BEFORE TIME 14 isn't where your money should go if you really like this medium.

What’s so infuriating about this argument is you can tell it’s made by nonanimators. Real animators will tell you to support their movies cause they want some respect for their artform which is why there’s such a push from the PRINCESS AND THE FROGcrowd that you SEE and LOVE every 2d thing out there, regardless of how good it is because any recognition for it is k i n d o f what they're after!

Kiddy sequel schlock isn’t even in the same ballpark as KLAUS or WOLFWALKERS; these films DID have very limited theatrical runs (Klaus so it could be nominated; Wolfwalkers in places where theaters opened up after Covid) and should have been supported because they were labors of love made by people who love animation.

As other people have already pointed out, one of the reasons for the lack of interest in 2000sera2D animation is that the only films released alongside critical+financial 3D hits were cheaper 2D films that either coincided with daytime tv shows or should have been just direct-to-video. It’s not to say art couldn’t come out of these flicks, but dayum if it wasn’t abused as much as the texture software that era's CG used... Point being, should the world ever go back to normal: If you hear about an out-of-town showing an acclaimed 2D animated film, make time to trek out and see THAT!

Don’t give your money to see yet another made-for-tv movie on the big screen because all that tells the studio is: “yeah 2d IS cheap and only good for cheap stuff let’s just keep it cheap. Only 3d is important 8D 8D 8D !!!"

“I don’t understand how it works. So it sucks.”

This text is from an ANIMATOR btw.

“I don’t understand how it works” and “it’s just some computer rendering” is the exact same wave of logic the people who prefer cgi use.

The plebian Karen I mentioned earlier? She understands the basics of 2D animation as much as you did from one of those cruddy flash classes you took in middle-school. She 'understands' the basics cuz she watched how it was made on the DVD features or maybe back on the WONDERFUL WORLD OF DISNEY. To her, the illusion is broken and she’s not impressed by 'just some drawings on paper'. You, an animator, know the process is more complicated and is intrigued by knowing how it’s made - not bored or disinterested -

Neither you nor Aunt Karen have really good cg-animation software at your house and unless you ARE a 3D animator you probably DON’T know all the ins-and-outs of how these movies are modeled, rendered, and animated.

Aunt Karen is bedazzled by them cause she doesn’t know how it works and the technical aspect makes her brain hurt so it might as well be magic and she can feel like a cool kid sharing Minion-memes. Aunt Karen is the nonartistic type who just wants to feel safe. You're not. You want to feel challenged.

I get it: you’re pissed off cause you’re in a field no one, including Aunt Karen, appreciates; told to work in cg which it's an artform you didn’t devote your life to and told to learn it cause THIS style sells! 3D is everywhere and is starting to look like 'garbage' even if you don’t animate 3D models yourself you just KNOW, I guess. Besides, you know all there is to know about 2d!! You know all there is to possibly know about this artform and have to fight this 'war' against "r e a l" animation! And I mean even when 3d software is there to use, it's not like you can actually make anything worth while in it, especially not anything that transcends the medium. Right Worthikids?

TL;DR: This argument is basically just " BWAAAAH I’M NOT GONNA USE IT I HAVE STANDARDS (a chip on my shoulder cuz art should be what I deem it to be) "

“PRINCESS AND THE FROG is-”

There’s a reason I can’t say I truly like PRINCESS AND THE FROG even though it's not even a bad movie! Like, stop reading this and watch PATF if you haven't it's good. It's my 'FROZEN', in that; I see a lot of potential in it I just think it needs some serious rewriting and that bugs me. Always have felt that way, tbh.

I dislike this movie because the response from the animation community seems to be it was perfect and the Academy was just Pixar-crazy with UP ((ftr, the Academy IS Pixar’s bitch and I personally advocate a sequel be made to WAKING SLEEPING BEAUTY about Mike Eisner’s sabotage of the 2D department at Disney which is still in place now!- but that’s a story for another day)). I’m sorry but UP was just a better story. So was CORALINE. So was FANTASTIC MR. FOX. Honest to god it feels like poor PATF is brought up as just a talking point and never for it's own worth as a labor of love - which it was! I'd like to honestly know: had PRINCESS AND THE FROG come out now and been cg if it would have even half the defenders for it because now it doesn't "look" like how a Disney movie "should" look...

If you like PatF more than the currant Disney lineup because of it's culture, it's music, it's feminism, it's black representation? Awesome. Great. Those things should be appreciated and I never want that taken away from you. But if you seriously think PatF is better just for how it was animated and looks - I lowkey may hate you.

“ALL OF DISNEY’S LATEST MOVIES SHOULD HAVE BEEN 2D! THEY ALL LOOK AWFUL IN 3D!! ALL OF THEM!”

TANGLED, FROZEN, and MOANA? Yeah. Sure. But um, e x c u s e y o u- WRECK IT RALPH sooooo doesn’t work in 2d! It could have used different between the various worlds but it’s about hopping through different video games. I’m also of the opinion that ZOOTOPIA and BIG HERO 6 are fine the way they are. Their 3d is awesome.

The latest fairy tale Disney films are really big on their place alongside the 2D canon esp in marketing. They keep trying to mimic 2D to varying results though I don't think it works as well as the movie's I'd previously mentioned. Me personally, I would love a mix of 3D and 2D technology, like if the backgrounds in FROZEN still got to be 3D but the characters were handdrawn and shaded ala KLAUS ((sweet sigh)). But even then are they truly unwatchable just based on how they're animated to you?

MOANA would have been incredible in 2D but for the record - I don't think it feels out of place in it's style. It reminds me more of a Pixar movie with the heart of a Disney classic which is it's own just as good.

“2D is the oldest form of animation and it’s being replaced.”

Actually, if we’re talking animation in film, stop motion is the earliest form of animation. The stop motion animated THE ADVENTURES OF PRINCE ACHMED and TALE OF THE FOX predate Disney’s SNOW WHITE. And yes: stop-motion IS still a form of animation even if it’s a serious of pictures taken of real life things and not drawings, so don’t you dare come at me with the "but that's not animated"/"Technically it’s LIVE ACTION" crap or I’ll envoke the spirit of Sandman to get you at night.

“Every animated film would look better in 2D! Even PIXAR would look better in 2D!”

Again, Stop Motion.

No, I mean it.

Lemme ask: Would ISLE OF DOGS or FANTASTIC MR. FOX carry any of the same effect if they were generic 90s toons? I know NIGHTMARE BEFORE CHRISTMAS wouldn’t. Christ, don’t even get me started on Svankmajer!

Sometimes the problem is that a movie is envisioned with a specific artform in mind. Pixar started out with toys and bugs for a reason and that’s cuz they were always gonna be a 3d studio and they needed to first overcome the placisity of the models. Over the years they’ve gotten really good at effects and blending unrealistic proportions with real textures (and also not so much- ONWARD and THE GOOD DINOSAUR really needed some different character designs and yeah, I do think would have looked better with a 2d artstyle, but not the ones they had in their films. THE GOOD DINOSAUR needed more realistic-speculative looking dinos and ONWARD needed a grittier HEAVY METAL/BLACK CAULDRON appeal to its designs.) My point being that the problems with these movies aren’t even inherently the animation as much as it is a problem of style. As someone who runs a group speculating different styles and designs for movies and tv shows I’m all for envisioning a 2D ZOOTOPIA or Bluth-inspired FNAF. That’s amazing!

But that’s also the talk of fan artists and nerds and not the professional artists working on visualizing their stories!!

Since I ate, slept, and breathed NIGHTMARE in my youth I’ll use it as an example: All the concept art ever done for TNBC was on paper and 2D was used in the final film. However, even when Tim Burton was thinking of making it just a tv special it was always going to be stop-motion. NIGHTMARE’s puppet cast do work very well in two dimensions, believe me, but the film was made as a love letter to Rankin/Bass and the art form of stop-motion. Skipping to another Henry Selick-helmed project (haha), JAMES AND THE GIANT PEACH was also always envisioned as a multimedia film to give it a truly dream-like atmosphere. If you know anything about Henry Selick you’ll know he’s 1) a perfectionist, and 2) loves mixed media and different types of animation and puppetry at once. That’s why he was the perfect pick to direct TNBC at the time, why JAMES AND THE GIANT PEACH and CORALINE are so beautiful and why MOONGIRL, his only fully 3d film, doesn’t have the same appeal.

As for what films I couldn’t imagine NOT being 3D? Probably; 9, Padak, Next Gen, Soul, Finding Nemo, the Toy Story films, Wreck-it-Ralph (as previously mentioned), Wall.E, Waltz with Bashir, Robots, Inside Out, Arthur Christmas, The Painting, Happy Feet, Shrek, Enter the Spiderverse, Megamind… just naming a few here.

“I want a traditionally animated film [and by that I mean a 90s-Disney/Don Bluth looking movie] of ‘x'-popular live action/stage thing!”

Okay I’m cheating a bit but it’s my blog and so I’m gonna stick this one in because it’s related.

When I see musings about wanting live-action or CGI shiz to be in 2d again a lot of the time this argument actually boils down to " I want this to look like a 90s Didney movie ". Or, if it’s about animals - " I want it to look like a Don Bluth film! "

Like...there ARE other styles of animation out there...you know that right?

Frack, Disney themselves tried different styles throughout the 90s it’s just that the peak of the Disney renaissance films (LITTLE MERMAID, BEAUTY AND THE BEAST, ALADDIN, THE LION KING) and the many imitators that followed tended to have the same look to them where only film/animation nerds kept watching into the era that was TARZAN, HERCULES, and ATLANTIS along with the kids. Aunt Karen wasn't singing Part of your World in the carride with you every day.

The Don Bluth argument is especially irritating because...what exact feeling do you WANT from a movie if it looked Bluthish? Each of the four ‘quintessential’ Bluth movies (NIMH, AMERICAN TAIL, LBT, and ALL DOGS) have such a different feel to them that’s complimented by that style; SECRET OF NIMH is a drama about wild animals trying to understand humans; LAND BEFORE TIME is even more squarely about an animal’s perspective as there’s literally no humans around; AMERICAN TAIL uses animals stowing away on the ship to tell a story about refugees; and ALL DOGS GO TO HEAVEN is ALL DOGS GO TO HEAVEN.

What the frack are you even asking for with that because I think there’s a certain flavor to the Bluth-styled oeuvre as well as the 90s Disney catalogue that would clash too much stylistically with some films.

Also come on! Like some Bluthian-style 2d would really fix THE SECRET LIFE OF PETS or SCOOB!, bite me.

I think this fixation solely on these two hand drawn styles and nothing else is based on nostalgia goggles, refusing to step outside the norm and discover different films and feelings than Disney and Bluth, and just preference. Goin back to NIGHTMARE there will always be a special place in my heart for Henry Selick’s stop motion, but I couldn’t imagine CHICKEN RUN or ANOMALISA in it's unique style.

Also I’m tired of every time there’s a "lets make an animatic to ‘x’ musical theater song" it’s reliably just Disneyesque or realistic. WHY envision an animated version of the show at all if it doesn’t have A STYLE to it??!?! I’m sorry but 90s-Disney does NOT fit CABARET!

“3D is so CHEAP now! Why can’t they just do 2D again?”

I think - on the cusp of the 2020s and the Grubhub hatedom, there ARE changing times ahead for 3d and 2d. The general public are starting to get tired of the same looking 3d films and wanting some 2d back, but they don’t have the best resources or opinions on animation to know what it is they want. Meanwhile, the animation community + industry is trying to figure out what to do and you have a lot of turmoil between the monopoly that is the industry, the high standards of the artists, and the mixed wants of the animation fanbase deciding what art needs to be.

It’s a tough business. And in the spirit of that tough business - maybe DON’T act like the means of a film’s production is solely your control, that you know best, and know definitively what the artists should have done....cuz you don't. Sorry my fellow criticalfanomanalysist-folks we DON'T and in an age of standom where fans and critics think it's okay to hackle indie animation studios about not getting their pitched cartoon out fast enough - we need to reserve these discussions to our circles and not treat them as gospel.

3d animation and 2d animation have to share this world. Stop acting like they’re either interchangeable in terms of budget, means of production, or artistry or that one has to be superior to the other.

The industry already says one art form is better (spoiler: it’s always live-action), we don’t need anymore of this purist garbage. Just stick to what you like while trying new things on the side. Be critical while also being compassionate. And remember:

[dcbicki]

The bullshit Max was preaching all season was the opposite of feminism and the "woke" fandom can sue me, i don't care. Like, the whole 'dump him and wait for him to crawl back to you begging for forgiveness'? So nauseatingly sexist, i can't even. I hate how smug she was acting like she's saved this poor oppressed girl from the controlling males in her life when it wasn't a fucking case, ugh

Max’s characterization was just… something that happened. And I couldn’t get on board with it. I’ve seen people use the argument that she was just being herself and teaching “El to be an independent woman like her” and…what? First off, show me where Max was independent in the second season. She was a very realistic teenager who wanted friends, didn’t like being left out of things, and had a shitty home life. Her arc wasn’t about being independent. It as about acceptance. So to go into the third season and imagine her as some sort of feminist icon just felt all kinds of off to me, so I didn’t. But most of the fandom ate it up because of course, they did.

Everyone’s all about empowerment now, so the writers lazily serving us a shoddy storyline about two girls bonding over *girl power* and boy talk was well-received… but everyone slept on Lucas and Mike’s friendship – which is a whole lot healthier and much better written – because it was boys being boys. Nah.

And, you know, El was already independent, so that one particular argument is just straight up invalid. She’s independent, but her problem is that she’s isolated. And Max kind of touched on this, but the fandom seemed to only care about getting El a girlfriend. I get it; that was important. But you can’t invalidate her other relationships because she finally has a female friend, and just because it’s a female friend. If Dustin had swapped roles with Max, nobody would be calling him a feminist, or preaching about him “helping El become her own person.” Max didn’t even do that. El was already her own person: she just learned how to accept who she was when she wasn’t Hopper’s daughter or Mike’s girlfriend. She doesn’t go through any major personal character development this season that isn’t directly tied to a relationship, imo. She’s independent, but she’s not allowed to act on this independence. There’s a difference. She goes off on the own in the second season – three times! across state lines! – and this where the Max storyline falls apart.

It should’ve been about El and Max becoming friends over time, and bonding over stupid shit. Instead, they don’t talk for six months (presumably), and suddenly El needs advice from the one person in their friend group who has beef with El’s boyfriend and who has a tendency to dump her boyfriend over, I guess, meaningless shit… It was never going to go smoothly. Max had a problem with Mike and she let her own experiences cloud her judgment. I don’t blame her for that: she’s a character with flaws, which is good. She was never going to give sage advice. But I blame the fandom for pretending she is faultless and that she did everything right by El (whether she knew it or not). I blame the fandom for thinking Max is a figure of independence when she’s just a realistic teenage girl who holds grudges and gives shitty advice. It’s there: the potential for the El/Max friendship. The writers just went about it all wrong, and the fandom just read into it the whole feminist thing more than they needed to, in my honest opinion.

[unqueenlybiscuits]

Criminently.

KAZAKHSTANMINISTRY OF INFORMATION PRESENTSA KAZAKHSTANTELEVISION PRODUCTIONIN ASSOCIATION WITHBAGATOV FILMSMy name Borat.I like you. I like sex.It's nice.This my country of Kazakhstan.It locate between Tajikistanand Kyrgyzstan......and assholes Uzbekistan.This my town of Kuzcek.This Urkin, the town rapist.Naughty, naughty.Over here, our town kindergarten.And here live Mukhtar Sakanov......town mechanic and abortionist.This my house. Entry, please.He is my neighbor,Nursultan Tulyakbay.He is pain in my assholes.I get a window from a glass,he must get a window from a glass.I get a step, he must get a step.I get a clock radio, he cannot afford.Great success.This is Natalya.She is my sister.She is number four prostitutein all of Kazakhstan.Nice.This is my mother.She oldest womanin whole of Kuzcek.She is 43. I love her.And this my wife, Oxana.She's boring.What you say about me,you skinny piece of shit?Not now, please.Why don't you do somethingusefuI and dig your mother a grave.Come in here, please. Ignore.This is where I lives. My bed.This is a VCR recorder.And this play cassettes.Now I show you outsidefrom my houses.My hobbies, Ping-Pong......sunbathe......disco dance......and on weekends,I traveI to capitaI city......and watch ladieswhile they make toilet.My profession, work as atelevision reporter for Kazakhstan.Please, you see.THE RUNNING OF THE JEW 2004Here comes the Jew.It's a big one this year.Whoaaa...He nearly got the money there.Wait, here comes Mrs. Jew.She's stopped.Is she? Is she?Here it comes.She's laid a Jew egg.Go kids! Crush thatJew chick before he hatches!Although Kazakhstan glorious country,it have problem too.Economic, sociaI and Jew.This why Ministry of Informationhave decide to send me to U.S. and A......greatest country in the world,to learn lessons for Kazakhstan.I will traveI with most venerableproducer, Azamat Bagatov.Azamat.No, not film me!Film him.Urkin, not too much raping...Humans only.Doltan, I'll get youa new arm in America.I go to America!America!Wave goodbye to yourclock radio, asshole!If you cheat on me,I will come over there......and snap off your cock.JFK INTERNATIONAL AIRPOR New York CityI arrived in America's airportwith clothings, U.S. dollars......and a jar of Gypsy tearsto protect me from AIDS.Stand clear of the closing doors,please.Hello, my name Borat.I not American. I new in town.Nice to meet you.Hello, nice meet you.Hey, what your name?My name is mind your ownfucking business.Stand clear of the closing doors,please.Oh, hello. Nice meet you.My name Borat.- What's happening?- Nice meet you.Get the fuck out of herebefore I break your jaw, bro.- Yo, step the fuck off, bro.- Okay. Okay.- You're fucking with the wrong one, man.- Okay. Sorry.Oh, shit.Okay, okay, wait.I get it. Please, relax.I'll get him! CarefuI, he bite.- Hey, man, what are you doing?- Okay, relax.Okay. Okay.Okay, okay, relax.Okay. Okay, wait.Okay, no problem. Sorry.Welcome to the Wellington HoteI.GUY BORGES,Manager, Wellington HoteIDo you want to pay for the entire stay now?- I pay for one night. How much?- Fine.One night is $ 117.13.We'll call it 85.No, we can call it 117.Let me get the door for you.Come on in.Very nice.Very nice room.We're not in the room yet, sir.Hold on.You might wanna repack.We're gonna be moving again shortly.I will not move to a smaller room.Sir, this is your floor.I'm gonna take you to your room.- This is not my room?- This is the elevator.It takes you to the floorwhere your room is.Nice. Nice.King in the castle.King in the castle.I have a chair. I have a chair.Oh, go do this. Go do this.King in the castle.Hello, nice meet you.My name Borat.I am new in town.- Get away from me.- I just- I kiss you, say hello.It arrive.Hello, my name Borat.I am new in town.- I say hello and I-- Do not touch me.- Do not get near my face.- I kiss you.Yeah, you kiss me,I'll pop you in the fucking balls.What mean, "balls"?Very nice.Very nice. How much?Hello, nice meet you. My name Borat.Get away!What are you doing?Wait, I want to say hello.What is the problem?This has beenmost happiest day of my lifes.I was very exciteto start my reportings.America is known for itssense of humor.UN survey say Kazakhstanhave 98th lowest humor.We must improve.Hurry, hurry.Just dry him, no hand relief.How is my back pussy?Not bad. Moist.So what time this interview?Soon, my friend.Gently.Enough!- Hello. My name's Pat Haggerty."PAT HAGGERTY - Humor Coach"- Nice meet you. Borat.- Nice to meet you.Should I make a jokeabout my mother-in-law?Yes. In America,that's a very popular joke.- Do you have a mother-in-law joke?- Yes.I had sexy-timewith my mother-in-law.- A what time?- Sexy-time.I made sexy-timewith my mother-in-law.- You had sex with your mother-in-law?- Yes.I don't think that Americanswould find that funny.- No, it is not a joke.- Yeah.We're talking about humor.Yes, you asked me aboutmy mother-in-law.Do you have a joke about her?No, why make a jokeon a mother-in-law?Do you ever laugh on peoplewith a retardation?Here in Americawe try not to make fun of......or be funny with thingsthat people don't choose.But perhaps you have not seensomeone with a very funny retardation.My brother, Bilo,have a very funny retardation.MentaI retardation causes a lot of painand hardship for a lot of families.Sometime my sister, she show hervagina to my brother, Bilo, and say:"You will never get this!You will never get this! "He behind his cage, crazy, crazy.Everybody laugh.She go, "You never get this! "But one time, he break cageand he get this.And then we all laugh.High five!Now...No, that would not be funnyin America, okay?What is "not" jokes?A "not" joke is when we're tryingto make fun of something......and what we do is we makea statement that we pretend is true......but, at the end, we say, "Not,"which means it's not true.So teach me how to make one.- All right, what color is your suit?- This suit is gray.Gray, I would call it blue, okay?- It's gray.- All right, it's blue-gray.But it's certainlynot black, right?- Let's say it's gray, but-- It is gray.Okay, so a "not" joke,I would say:"That suit is black. Not! "This suit is not black.- No, no, "not" has to be the end.- Oh, okay.This suit is black not.This suit is black, pause-You know what a pause is?- Yes.- This suit is black. Not!This suit is black. Pause. Not.No, you don't say "pause. "This suit is black.That's a pause. Not!This suit is black.Okay...- I don't- I'm not-- Not!Everybody say U.S.A. televisionmuch better......but this I watch for three hours,do not change.There's a remote controI here.Push these two arrowsto change the channeI.I got him, I got him, I got him!I have the urge tobury something else.Yes!- I love you.- Oh, I love you too, Jamie.I love you.- Do you believe in magic, Miss-?- Parker, C.J.It's a pleasure to meet you, C.J.Be carefuI! Be carefuI, C.J.!This C.J. was like no Kazakh womanI had ever seen.She had golden hairs,teeth as white as pearls......and the asshole of a 7-year-old.For the first time in my lifes......I was in love.Get up! Get up!Why aren't you ready!We have people to interview today.I understand.Learn what you can fromthis women's group.My hair?It's beautifuI. Don't worry.In Kazakhstan it is illegaI for more thanfive woman to be in the same place......except for in brotheI or in grave.In the U.S. and A., many womens meetin groups called Feminists.I find more."VETERAN FEMINISTS OF AMERICA"So, what means this feminism?It's the theory that womenshould be equaI to men......in matters economic, sociaI-- Now you are laughing.- Yes.That is the problem.Do you think a womanshould be educate?Definitely.But is it not a problem that a womanhave a smaller brain than a man?That is wrong.But the government scientist,Dr. Yamak,prove it's the size of squirreI.Your government's scientist?- Yes, Dr. Yamak.- He's wrong. He's wrong.Give me a smile, baby.Why angry face?Well, what you're sayingis very demeaning.- Do you know the word "demeaning"?- No.We are saying to you...I could not concentrate on whatthis old man was saying.All I could think about was thislovely woman in her red water-panties.Who was this C.J.?Last night I see in my hoteI room......a woman called C.J.on the television.- Do you know her?- No.She from a towncalled Baywatches.- She's just on television.- Her name is Pamela.- Do she live here in New York City?- She lives in California.- In the California.- He's gonna look her up.Okay, can we finish now?Listen, pussycat, smile a bit.- All right. That's it. I'm done.- We're finished. We have to leave.Although I was obsessed by this C.J.,I could not pursue her......or else my wifewould snap off my cock.Mr. Sagdiyev?- Yes?- I have a telegram for you.- You can read?- Yes, I can."Dear Borat Sagdiyev......your wife, Oxna......was walking your retarded Biloin the woods......when a bear attackedand violated and break her.She is now dead. "You say my wife is dead?This is what it's...Yes, sir. I'm sorry to inform you,but that's what the telegram says.High five! Great!What do you mean, California?I have arranged all our filmingfor New York.But we need to leave New Yorkto find the reaI America:Rodeos, cowboys...It will be better for our documentary.But why California?What's there?PearI Harbor is there...And so is Texas.Eventually, I persuade Azamatthat we would travel to California......and make our reportingsalong the way.He insists we not fly in case the Jewsrepeated their attack of 9-11.Okay, I'll find another wayfor us to get there.My name is Mike.I'm gonna be your driving instructor."MICHAEL PSENICSKA,Perry Hall Driving SchooI"Welcome to our country, okay.- My name Borat.- Okay, okay. Good, good.Well, I'm not used to that,but that's fine.Now, you do knowhow to drive a little bit?- Yes.- Yes. Put it in D.- What?- Drive.Now, wait a second. Wait a second.- Have you driven a car before?- Yes, many times.All right, let's go this way.I don't want you hitting anybody.Use two hands, now.- What?- Two hands.But then it look like I am holdinga Gypsy while he eat my chram.I don't care. You use two handswhen you drive, okay?Okay.- Okay.- Watch the children.Okay, no problem.You must not hit the children.Look, there is a woman in a car.Can we follow her?- And maybe make sexy-time with her?- No, no, no.- Let's get her. Why not?- No, no, no.Because a woman has a rightto choose who she has sex with.- What? You joke?- How about that? Isn't that amazing?There must be consent.How about that?That's good, huh?- Is not good for me.- It is good.- Steer the car.- Okay.- You want have a drink?- You can't drink that.- Why not? What?- It's against the law.Who is this car that follow us?I wish it didn't follow us.- I don't know.- Maybe we'll lose them.No, we better not lose them.Hey, don't look at me.Eat my tits!We'll make a right turn up here.Don't look at me like that.I will eat your shit.- Hey, you fuck my mother!- Hey, hey.- No, he do before. He look on me.- You can't do that.They're gonna throw us in jaiI,me with you.Why in a jaiI? He look on me.- Behind.- You can't say that.I like you, do you like me?- I do like you.- You are my friend?You're nice and I am your friend.You will be my boyfriend?- I won't be your boyfriend.- Why not? You do not like me?I could be. It depends.Well, boyfriend, yeah, I can.Great success.Now time to make purchaseof motorcars.I want to have a car that attracta woman with a shave down below.Well, that would be a Corvetteor a Hummer.JIM SELL GM Salesman Well, thatwould be a Corvette or a Hummer.JIM SELLGM SalesmanJIM SELL GM Salesman We willtry to help you out here.We will try to help you out here.A man yesterday tell meif I buy a car......I must buy onewith a pussy magnet.He means a car that women will like.Yes, but where you keepthis magnet?No, there's no magnet. That was just-He means the vehicle.Women love the Hummers.- Do this have a pussy magnet?- No.The vehicle itself will be a magnet.If I give you good price,will you please put in pussy magnet?Yeah, but there's no such thingin this country as a magnet.If this car drive intoa group of Gypsy......will there be any damage to the car?- It depends on how hard you hit them.- Hard.Yeah, hard. You might......if somebody rolls on the windshield,crack your windshield.How fast do I need to goto guarantee I kill him?Let me tell you something,with this vehicle, probably doing 35...- ... 40 miles an hour would do it.- Great.When I buy my wife......at the start,she was cook good.....her vagina work welland she strong on plow.But after three years,when she was 15......then she become weak, her voicebecome deep, "Borat, Borat. "She receive hair on chest......and her vaginahang like sleeve of wizard.How do I know thatthis will not happen with a car?Chevrolet guarantees thatwith a warranty.I like very much buy this Hummers.- How much is it?- Fifty-two thousand.I am looking for something between$600 to $650.We don't have any cars for 650that you can buy.I might be able to sell youa wholesale car.A car with a lot of miles for 700with no warranty.- Okay.- Come on.California, I coming!First stops on our journeywas Washington, D. C......home of mighty U.S. warlord,Premier Bush.Look who has an embassy here!Uzbekistan. Fuck you, motherfuckers!Look who has an embassy here!Uzbekistan.Fuck you, motherfuckers!We arrive here to learnfrom American politic.Azamat arrange interviewwith Party official from ruling regime.BOB BARR Former Georgia Congressman Azamat arrangeinterview with Party official from ruling regime.- We are good friend, Bob Barr, yes?- I hope so. "BOB BARR,Former Georgia Congressman"It is a custom have cheeseat the start.Thank you.My wife, she make this cheese.Very nice.She make it from milk from her tit.After interview, I encounterstraditional American street festival.GAY PRIDE PARADEPeople here were much more friendlythan in New York.Next morning, I interview politicianwho is a genuine chocolate-face.No makeup.On Sunday,I arrive in Washington."ALAN KEYES,2x Republican PresidentiaI Candidate"On Sunday,I arrive in Washington.There was a parade.I make two friendsfrom this parade.I invite them backmy hoteI room.We drink like normalin Kazakhstan.We wrestle like normalin Kazakhstan.Then they say,"I wash you in a shower,"and he wash me in a shower.It sounds likeyou met somebody who is from......what is called in America,the gay community.- What it mean, "gay," this word?- HomosexuaI.A homosexuaI? You mean...?Are you telling me the man who tryto put a rubber fist in my anus......was a homosexuaI?Even though my anus was broken......I knew that rest of our journeywould be great success.We left Washingtonand continued towards California.Howdy, partners!Yes, minister, we're on schedule.Yes, I'm standing inthe middle of Times Square.It's time to prepare for yourTV appearance.Remember to talk of singingnationaI anthem at rodeo.Don't worry, I am a Tv professionaI.Now, building our station around you.This is 16 WAPT News This Morning......named best newscast in the stateby the Associated Press.This morning we havea speciaI guest here in the studio.This is Borhat Sagadiyev.He is traveling across America to getthe taste of life here in the United States.He spent the last few days here.- Good morning to you.- Hello, my name Borat. Hello.Hello. Thank you.Before we start, can you tell me,because I want make urines......then I come back here and...If you tell meone minute before we start-We started. We are actually liveon the air right now.- I am very excite.- Yes.Hello, U.S. and A.! Hello, U.S. and A.!I'm very excite!I'm very excite to be here.And hello!Hello to you as well.Now, reaI quickly, why are you herein the United States?Because I want to learnfrom U.S. and A......your culture, and to understandfrom how a thing happen......and to take this lessonback to my country.- All right. Would you like to have a seat?- Yes.Please sit, please sit, please sit.Now, one of the thingsthat you've enjoyed so much about-Can I have a microphoneso people can hear me?They can hear you right now.You are miked up.This right here,that's the microphone.Hello. Hello, nice meet you.Well, welcome to the United States.Thank you very much for coming on.When you come to Kazakhstan...- ... you can stay in my house.- Well, thank you so much.You can sleep my houseand you can use my sister.Meteorologist Ken Johnsonwill have the latest......on tropicaI storm Emilywhen we return.Ten seconds, stand by.This is 16 WAPT News This Morning.Traffic is flowing along smoothlyalong Interstate 55.Dry conditions.If you're heading to the north......not too far away from Attala County,there's some showers there.Check that out onthe radar this morning and-Thank you, very nice for have me.What your name?We're on air right nowdoing the weather.- What your name?- We're doing the weather right now.Go over here with Adrian.She's calling you to go over here.- It is a she?- Yes.- Very nice.- Yeah, go. Go-- Go over here with-- What is your name?I'm the weather guy.Okay...Let's go over to the weather.You can see the radar, right now......showing some showersand storms up to the north-Okay. All right, let me-Nice to meet you.Showers and storms north ofYazoo City up towards Kosciusko-Thank you, bye-bye.You're singing at a rodeo tonight!Why didn't you mention it?What can I do, they are notprofessionaI.Get a move on, we haveWe welcome you to the 38th annualKroger Valleydale Championship Rodeo.Of course, every picturethat we get back......from the terrorists or anything else,the Muslims, they look like you...- ... black hair and a black mustache.- Yes.Shave that dadgummed mustache offso you're not so conspicuous.So you look like maybe an Italianor something......as far as when peoplelooking at you.I see a lot of people and I think,"There's a dadgummed Muslim.I wonder what kind of bombhe's got strapped to him. "- Yes.- And you probably aren't a Muslim.- Maybe that's not your religion.- No, I am a Kazakh. I follow the hawk.But you look like one of them.This thing gets over withand when we win it......and kick the butts over there......and all of them son-of-a-buckshanging from the gallows......by that time,you will have proven yourself......and you'll be accepted.- Take care.- Thank you.- I ain't gonna kiss you.- Why not?The people that do the kissingare the ones that float around like that.- Are they all...?- Yeah. Stay away from them that kiss.- Okay.- You don't want nobody kissing.In my country they take them to jaiIand finish them.- Take them and hang them.- Yes.- That's what we're trying to get done.- High five.Ladies and gentlemenof Salem, Virginia......would you please give a warm,American welcome......to a gentleman who has comeall the way from Kazakhstan......and we are honoredto have singing our nationaI anthem.Ladies and gentlemen,Borat Sagdiyev.My name Borat.I come from Kazakhstan.Can I say first,we support your war of terror.May we show our supportto our boys in Iraq.May U.S. and A.kill every single terrorist.May your George Bushdrink the blood......of every single man, womanand child of Iraq.Yeah!May you destroy their countryso that for the next thousand years......not even a single lizardwill survive in their desert.To show our friendship......I now will singour Kazakh nationaI anthem......to the tune ofyour nationaI anthem.Please stand.We nearly died last night.This journey is cursed.We should have stayed in New York.I was sad.The rodeo peoplesdid not like me.What if Pamela didnot like me too?We needed somethingto change our fortunes.Look, Azamat, a Gypsy village.Let us extract some of their tearsso we can remove the curse.Do not fear me, Gypsy,all I want from you is your tears.Please give them to meor I will take them.I'm not a Gypsy.I'm a Midwestern farmer's daughter.Americana.You have many treasures.Who did you rob for this?We didn't rob them.They came from the house.I will look in your treasures, Gypsy.Is this understood?I will look on them.Please do.Who is this lady you have shrunk?Was she the owner of this housethat you camp in front of?There's a couple more child's dolls.Do not try and shrink me, Gypsy.I serious.- These are your spells?- No.There's a good one,The Millionaire Mindset.There you go.- Baywatch.- Baywatch?It means she love me.Azamat!Azamat, great success!I've got the tears.Onwards to California!Let's go.What's that you've got there?It's nothing. Don't worry about it.Are we going the right way?I don't know, this map is from 1917.Where the hell are we?Hey, stop that goddamn van!Hey, baby, wanna go out?Wanna go out, honey?I'm going to stop and ask.No, no, no, keep going. Keep going.I need the directionto California, please.- To California?- You a long way from home.Who you with, man?Who you with, who you with?I traveI with my friend, Azamat Bagatov.We traveI across the country.You can't be talking all that.You gotta be talking English right here.You look like MichaeI Jackson, "Beat It. "Man, you better-I like you peoples.Can you teach me how to dress?How can I be like you?You need to let them jeans down.Pull them down?Don't pull them down like-- Like a ho?- No, no, no.- Like a this?- Yeah.But don't showyour Huggies though, man.What the hell? Is that fishnet?No, no, no, these are my antipants.- What kind of music you listen to?- I like very much Corky Bucek.You know Corky Bucek?Can you teach me speak like you?What you trying to say?- How you say, "How do you do?"- What's up with it?- What's that with it?- Yeah.Pull over and let's seeif we can stay here.What's up with it, vanilla-face?Me and my homey, Azamat,just parked our slab outside.Please.We are looking for somewhere topost up our black asses for the night.So bang-bang, skeet-skeet, nigga.We just a couple of pimps, no ho's.- Sir, you gotta leave.- Okay.Leave now or we're gonna call the copsand we'll have you taken out.We can't stay here,they are 'player haters. '- Hi. Hello.- You have a room for tonight?Oh, yes. Yes, definitely.- Come on in.- Great.Your friend also.A beautifuI house, this.All the paintingsin the house, I did.What is this man?This is a Yemenite Jew andhe's working on a piece of jewelry.They, Yemenites,were also jewelers.Why you have a picture of a Jew?Because I'm Jewish, so Ihave lots of pictures of Jews.This is the room and...- Do you need two pillows?- Yes.Great. Thank you. Lovely place.They're Jews.I know that now.They'll kill us.We need to escape.- Wait, wait.- Okay.Hello.- How are you?- Great.You guys getting settled in?This is a speciaI sandwich for you.I not so hungry.He can eat this.He fat.No, no.- You gonna eat, because-- Take a half.- Take a half and then you'll see.- Take a half.Yeah. I not so hungry.You eat a little bit.Go ahead and eat somethingbecause you're hungry.Yes.I don't want to see you go hungry.What is this picture over here?Okay...It is 3 in the morning.I am in a nest of Jews.They have cleverly shiftedtheir shapes.One of them has taken the formof a little old woman.You can barely see her horns.She have tried topoison me already.These rats are very clever.Look, the Jews haveshifted their shapes.OK, OK. How much shallI give them?I don't know...More. Give them more.Go. Go.Let's go back to New York,at least there's no Jews there.Calm down.We'll keep heading to California.Why California?What's so speciaI about California?We are going to California!And get killed on the way?!Relax, Azamat!I will get us protection.What is the best gunto defend from a Jew?I would recommendeither a 9 millimeter or a. 45.Very nice.It like I movie star, Dirty Harold.- Yes, sir.- Come on and make my day, Jew.But he would not sell me gunsince I not American.So I look for other protection.MUNCH RANCHExotic AnimaI Dealer- What type of dog is this?- This is a tortoise.Is this a cat in a hat?No, it's a tortoise in a shell.Yes.I need animaI for protection.What you have for me?We're safe.Now we continue to California.High five!Great! Nice.Switch it off.It so annoying!Ice cream!Happy times. We were safeand well on our way to Pamela.It was time to get back to work.Kazakhstan needs to learnabout American fine dining.First, a lady willteach you southern manners.How long have I got?An hour. Then you havedinner date with high society.Hello and nice meet you."KATHIE B.MARTIN-Etiquette Coach"Hello, it's so nice to meet you.Welcome to America.Will you please teach mehow to dine like gentleman?Of course, I'll be happy to.Is it polite to greet peoplewhen I make entry?"THE MAGNOLIA MANSION-Dining Society"Yes, it is.- Let me introduce you around.- Yes.- You're gonna have to-- I'm Mike. Mike Jared.Hello, I'm Bethany Weston.- Lovely to see you.- Nice.- How you do?- How do you do? My name's Ben.Should I pay interest in peoplesaround the table-sides?Yes.And, if it is a big table,a very long table......you might want to restrictyour conversation...- Yes.- ... to people right in your vicinity.- Very nice.- So you are not yelling.What do you do?- I'm the pastor of a church.- Yes.- What do you do?- I have spent years in construction.I'm recently retired.- You are retard?- Yes.PhysicaI or mentaI?- Retired.- No, no, not retarded.- I don't work anymore.- Stopped working.It's very good you allow retard......to eat with you in the same place.That's not what we're sayingabout this man.He is not whatyou would refer to as retard.- No.- No, no. Not at all.Do you have a telephonein this village?Of course.Should I show photos of my family?You have photos of your family?WonderfuI.This my favorite son, Huey Lewis.- Okay.- Yes.- He looks happy.- Yes.He very strong.- My goodness, is that him holding you?- Yes. Very strong.He grow three centimeter.He now 17 centimeter long.I'm not sure I would show thesephotos of him without clothes on.Should I pay complimentsto the peoples?Yes, but only if you truly agreewith that compliment.You have a very gentle face...- ... and a very erotic physique.- Thank you.- You're correct.- Yes.That's a very good observation.She is your wife?Nope. That's my wife.In my country,they would go crazy for these two.Not so much.What should I say ifI need to go to the shit hole?You mean to the restroom?- To the place to make the shit.- The bathroom? Okay. What you-Not to bath. To make dirt from anus.- Not a bath, right. The toilet.- The brown-- Where you make- You understand?- Yes. Yes.- Bad? Bad thing from it.- Yes.- What you do is you say:- Brown."Excuse me,I need to go to the restroom. "Excuse me, is it possibleto go and do a, you know...- To be excused?- How you say in the, you know...Upstairs.Just say, "Excuse me a moment. "- I need to go, what you say...- That works. Thank you.- Can you go upstairs?- Yes, thank you.I think that the culturaI differencesare vast...- Exactly.- ... and I think he's a delightfuI man.....and it wouldn't take very much timefor him to really become Americanized.Thank you very much.I feeI much better.- Cindy, where shall I put this?- Just-Where should I put this?Maybe in the other restroomdown here.In the-Excuse me-Excuse me for just a moment, please.You roll off like this......and you wipe your bottomand you put the paper- Look.- You, wipe mine?- No, I don't. You do.- This is a very private thing.- The host cleans the anus of the other?No, no, no.Nobody touches you, except you.Can I bring a guest to dinner?If you have been invitedto a home or to a party...- Yes.- ... it is acceptable to bring a guest...- ... if you ask your host in advance.- Yes.GeneraI Stonewall Jackson,Robert E. Lee.I think this my friend.- Hello?- Hi, I'm looking for Borat.- Yes, it's me.- Oh, hi, honey.- I'm Luenell. Hi, hi.- Hello, nice to meet you.- This my friend, Luenell.- Hi.Oh, okay...You all having a dinner party.Well, we were. I don't know exactlywhat all that we're doing-It is getting very, very late.Excuse me, I'm going to have to go.- Okay. Very nice.- It's getting very, very late......and it's time that, you know......we were endingour dinner party and everything.- I apologize-- But can't she come for desserts?Absolutely not,and neither can you.- The sheriff is on his way.- I hope so.I've already called them.Why you call police?Have the retard escaped?I want say I very sorryhow they treat you in this house.Thank you.I was thinkingmaybe I'd just take the night off.Why don't we just go outand have some fun?What do you think about that?You want to come with us?Up yours!Hi! My name Borat.- This my friend, Luenell.- Hi, Luenell.She is a prostitute.You were funny on that bull.Everybody almostsee your underpants.I never rode a bull before.Well, you wanna-?You wanna come in for a little while?I would like very much......but I in lovewith a woman in Malibu.It would not be nice to herfor me to...Okay, well, if you're ever in town again,this way, you know, look me up.If I ever in town again, Luenell......I would very much liketo pay you for sex.Good night, Luenells.Good night, Borat.You say my name right. Borat.People say Borakor Billy or Bob.Bye."Pamela is a fairly simple girI,she recently explained.'There's not a whole lot of logicin the way I live my life.I am very spontaneous. ' "I'm very spontaneous too.I needed a gift to give to Pamela......so that she would grant meentry into her vagina.Therefore, I convinced Azamat to let mefilm a report in an American store.Don't spend more than $3.We're low on money.This your shops?Right, this is my antique shop.Why do you have so many thingswith a flag?We're honoring our heritage.Now, what in here? What is this?These are a number of collectibles.I mean, this is a lamp that, you know,you would use in your home.This is a Chinese cloisonn bell.And this is a littledecorative duck.And do you think, you know,when they-?I'm sorry. Wait, wait, wait.- We need help, baby.- No, it's okay.I sorry.Sorry. I will repair all of this.Don't worry. My friend,he can make glue and-I don't think you're gonna be able toglue it. You're gonna have to pay for it.Okay, I have a digitaI watchfrom the future.I will give you.Is worth more than all of this.You broke $425 worth of stuff.Hundred and sixty, 170, 180.- That's not enough.- Do you want hair-?No, I don't want any damn hair.This is best hair in Kazakhstan.FeeI the quality.I don't want your damn hair.This is hair from pubis.I can get 2000 bags by next Friday.We don't use that stuffin this country.Have you offered them pubic hair?Yes!Just give me another 20.It was a mistake.You screwed up again.I didn't see the truck.I slipped on it and that was it.Only an idiot could do this.Would you have believed this if Ihad told you? All right. Go. Go. Go.You've ruined this documentaryand almost bankrupt us.So call the ministryand get more money.What?! If I did that,they would kill us!California had better be as goodas you say, or we're finished.You bastard.What's the matter with you?How dare you makehand-party over Pamela.Why do you care who Ipleasure myself to?Because I love this woman.She's the reasonwe traveI to California!What?You lied to me!You lied about California!Eat my asshole!Holy...Okay.We have a speciaI guest herethis evening. Ruth Feiner is here."MORTGAGE BROKERS - ANNUAL BANQUET"Get the fuck out of here!So bad news.Azamat have leave.I wake up, he disappear......and he take Oxana, my bear.Our bear.And he also decideto take all money......and also my passport.And he leave me......only this bag, with a hen......and ticket to Kazakhstan.But no passport.But at least he is......man enough to leave me......my beautifuI.Which I have cleanedsince last night.And I have decide to......continue making documentary.Make it without Azamat.I think it will be better......and we will have moresuccess without him.I only want 17 cents, please.I had no car, no moneyand no Azamat.The only thing keep me going......was my dream of one dayholding Pamela in my arms......and then making romance explosionon her stomach.Eventually, I managed to hike a hitchingswith group of young scholars......also traveling across country.CHI PSI FRATERNITY BROTHERUniv. of S. Carolina- How you doing? How you doing?- Where the fuck are you from, baby?I am from Kazakhstan.- Welcome to fucking America!- Hey, have a seat. Let's go.- What's your name?- Anthony.- Anthony?- Yes.- Anthony.- And Justin.- Justin.- And David.- David.- Bartender Dave.Very nice.- Can you open this, please?- Oh, sure.Thank you very much.So you like the bitches out therein the fucking old Russia, there?- What?- The bitches in old Russia.How are the women?The fucking ho's, baby!The fucking girls!- You fuck the shit out of them!- Yes!Then you never call them again.Why you don't call them? Becausethey do not have a telephone, yes?No, not because of that.They don't have my respect,you know? I mean...So, what are you doinghere in America?They film me traveIacross U.S. and A.I don't know what you'resaying, man, but that's cooI!Let's get drunk!- Yes! High five!- High five!This is America in a bottle.- Oh, baby!- Oh, baby!- Borat, let me hear it. Oh, baby!- Oh, the baby!Suck, suck, suck!Let me tell you game we play.Can I hear a game you play?We play a game called"When the snake eat the pig. "- When the snake eat the huh?- The snake eat the pig.- You get a baby mouse, very small...- Baby mouse?...and you put a bit of cheese inhole of your chram,untiI it go inside.That is too crazy for me.I'll do it. I don't give a fuck,I'll do it.Let me ask you this.Are woman-?Are women your slaves in Russia?No. Do you have slaves here?- We wish. We wish.- No slaves.- It is a shame.- Hey, Borat.Big shame. Big shame.It would be better country if...Yes, it'd be better country.We should have slaves.Our country,the minorities actually have more power.Anyone that is minorityhas the upper hand.We have the Jews. We have anybodythat's against the mainstream.- Do you want to see my new wife?- Yes!This my new wife.- Pamela!- You know her?Pamela! I know of Pamela.I will take her virginfor the first time.- I am going to put this shit on.- Put it on.Borat, Borat.We have a lot to talk about.I will take her virgin.I will uncork her.Borat, Borat.She is no virgin, Borat.- Is not true.- She is no virgin, buddy.Is not true. Liar!Liar, liar, your panties on fire.Borat, shut up.Small Jacuzzi ona fucking small yacht.What she do?- She's sucking some dick, man.- You see her sucking dick?This is not her.I guarantee you that shit'sgonna happen. Don't worry about it.- That's her, Borat. Sorry.- Borat, that's her.This is not her.It's her. I'm sorry.- I'm sure it's her.- I go.- No, no, no.- Titty bar.Come here.You're my man. You're my man.I do not know whyshe is trying to do this.- Come on, Borat. Stay with us, buddy.- We love you.We'll remember you always.Like I taught you.Wait.You're in America now.You'll make it.You- You keep going, okay?You are bigger than a woman.You are better than a woman.We will always be behind you.- Do not let a woman ever, ever...- We'll always be-...make you who you are.- Goodbye, my friends.- Goodbye.My ticket.How will I get home?I sorry, my friend.Go.Go.Run to freedom.Go! Go and live your life!Come on!CHARLES "CHIP" PICKERING U.S.CongressmanIt is good to be here.This is my 1 Oth PentecostaIcamp meeting. A decade.The bottom line is,we're a Christian nation now...JIM SMITH,Chief Justice,State Supreme CourtThe bottom line is,we're a Christian nation now......we were one in the beginning.....and we gonna always be a Christiannation untiI the good Lord returns. Amen.I didn't evolve out of a monkey.I didn't use to be a tadpole.I is what I is.Praise you, Jesus.The Bible says that Godwas manifest in the flesh......and believed on in the world.I got good news.Jesus is God in the flesh.I don't care what the deviI's doneto you or what he's trying to do.All you gotta dois step out of that aisle now......and make your waydown to this altar.Let's have a littleold-time church right now.I need somebody to pray withme right now. Come on, sir!The blood over my neighbor.I bleed the blood over my church.I want you to help me,save me, please.Ladies and gentlemen,the gentleman here......standing right next to me,his name is Bolak.Would you greet him with a great bigJesus name for just a couple of minutes?Thank you.I have no friends.I am alone in this country.Nobody like me.My only friend, Azamat......he take my money and my bearand he leave me alone.Not only this.The woman I love, the reasonI traveI across the country......she have do something terribleon a boat...- ... and now I can never forgive her.- You have to.Is there anybody who can help me?Yes. The one that can help youis who we preached about tonight.- Jesus.- Do Jesus like me?Absolutely, Jesus loves you.Do Jesus like my sons?Jesus loves your sons.Do Jesus lovemy retard brother, Bilo?He loves your brother, Bilo.Do Jesus love my neighbor,Nursultan Tulyakbay?Yes. He loves everybody.Nobody love my neighbor,Nursultan Tulyakbay.Can Jesus heaI the painthat is in my heart?Jesus can heaI your painin your heart.Make him heaI the painthat is in my heart.- Lift your hands and begin to worship.- Lift your hands.Would you lift your hands with himas we pray in the name of Jesus.- God, forgive me of my sins.- God, forgive me-- Forgive me, God. Cleanse me.- Cleanse me.Cleanse me, Lord,in the name of Jesus.Yeah, let that tongue go.Here it comes.We're gonna speak in other tongues.Let that tongue go.Yes, God. Yes, God. Yes, God.Yes! Yes!I will forgive Pamelaand I will go to California.I will go to Malibu with meand my friend, Mr. Jesus......and together we will take her!I took a bus to Los Angeles......with some friends of Mr. Jesus.Finally, I had arrived.Happy times.Marilyn.Azamat?You traitor!Look, I can explain.You attack me. My moustachestill taste of your testes!Calm down.Let me explain.What did you do with the bear?She ran off. I'm sorry,I'm sorry.Hey! Fuck off, Death!You need to calm yourself!You have to calm down!Well, that's another finemess you've gotten me into.I had not come to Hollywoodto fight a man dressed as Hitler.I had come to makePamela Andersons my wife.So I forgave Azamat.I knew you'd make it here, Borat.I felt so bad thatI prepare this for you.It's everything I couldfind on Pamela.Last Friday she appeared for a groupwho are against cruelty to animals.Against cruelty to animals?And tomorrow she'sdoing a signing.She wrote a book.What? A woman has written a book?Dr. Yamak would never believe this.I know.We will go to thishistoricaI event......and I will marry Pamela there......but in the traditionaIKazakhi way.Azamat, let's prepare thewedding sack.You forgive me, yes?Yes.Having learned many lessonsfrom U.S. and A......I will now teach America howto have a wedding Kazakhi-style.You find more.PAMELA ANDERSONAUTOGRAPH SIGNING, Orange, CAVery excite. Very excite.Hi. Hi, everyone.I love you.It is me, Borat.- Well, thanks for coming, you guys.- Thank you!I love Pamela Anderson.- Really?- Yes.Go ahead.- Hi.- Hello.Make it out to someone?My name Borat Sagdiyev.I son of Asimbala Sagdiyev......and Boltak, the rapist.I former husband of Oxana Sagdiyev......who was daughter ofMiriam Tulyakbay......and Boltak, the rapist.I make this for you, this...There are our name.My name- Your name,Pamela Anderson and Borat Sagdiyev.Here's today's date.And this say that it is today's date,our wedding......and then this inside is silk.Pamela, will you marry me?No, thanks. I'm sorry.No. Agreement not necessary.Oh, my God! Oh, my God!Get off!- Get your own wife!- Fucking shit!Come on, get her!Wait, Pamela.Don't worry, I nervous too!Pamela, wait.Pamela, I will give youyour own plow.Get out of the way!Watch out, watch out.- Get on the ground.- Hands behind your back.- Okay. Pamela...- We're gonna stand you up.- Bring your knees up.- All right.Pamela,I am not attracted to you anymore!Not!I was humiliated.It was time for meto return to New York......where a ticket was waiting for meto fly back home.While I sat on the bus, I thought ofmy journey over the past three weeks.The great times.The good times.And the shit times.Mainly, they were shit times.I had come to Americato learn lessons for Kazakhstan......but what had I learned?Suddenly, I realized.I had learned thatif you chase a dream......especially one with plastic chests......you can miss the real beautyin front of your eyes.Hi.Welcome back in my town of Kuzcek.Since I return,there have been much improvements.We no longer haveRunning of the Jew.It's crueI.We Christians now.Doltan improve too.Hey, Doltan. High five!Great.Come my house.There Nursultan Tulyakbay.He still asshole.I get iPod.He only get iPod Mini.Everybody know it for girls.Come.And this my beautifuI wife.Thank you for watch my film.I hope you like.You’re such a slug, gtfo

[akria23]

The black characters were over back shadowed....even though the writers and the show admitted this...they didn't exactly change it. They were often written as angered and hateful just for the sake of being or out of plain jealous instead of character. Tina's Asian heritage was played upon as a joke...and then they threw her character aside only to give her dashes of ridiculousness. Mike....wasn't much better but at least they didn't push him down the rabbit hole of wtf ville.

Making Santana the angry hateful lesbian (who later was supposedly man hating as well 😒) while Kurt was the misunderstood think white gay is just so wrong on so many levels when white male gays known are more problematic in matters of hating the opposite sex, being rude just for the sake of, and elitism than lesbians of color.

The bi phobia that was present through the writers themselves...in which they tried to blame the audience for (it was first presented with Blaine and Kurt and never dealt with on screen as though it was okay and then again with Demi's character and Brittany's character but they blamed fans for the bi phobia that happened with Brittany). They had the whole slut perspective on women and it wasn't for the good of women. Def after playing Rachel as the pure wholesome - and never dealing with the specialization of the male characters these same girls were sleeping with. Santana a Latina queer woman was hypersexualized and fetishized like most Latina women are in the entertainment world. The actress had to fight for her character's sexuality and relationship with her female counterpart. And like the other women of color she was thrown behind Rachel always chasing her coat tails even when her real competition should've been none other than Mercedes. The feminism wasn't so femenist...

The plethora of lgbqt is not that diverse - one black one Latina - idk if would should count Blaine the actor is actually half Asian but I don't think the show ever even mentioned that so he's seen as white by the majority of the audience - written as so. Two bisexuals if you count Demi's character...but both women. Gay....gay....gay...gay...gay...gay...whites. Because the story world is so few of those. And they even used the he has internalized hate so that's why he's a bully which is actually a dangerous trope to our community. One of the other one is just an asshole (which is okay cause we got assholes in the community) but the other is just plain terribly written to uphold their favorite gay. They gave Blaine no real play at all.

Disabilities I would say they did okay here...but didn't they make her the school shooter? Cause I might be remembering it wrong but if they do the addition to mental characters being violent and or dangerous - def when school shootings are prominently healthy white males is kinda....problematic.

Stereotypes:

Mercedes was your sassy black girl, Alex transitioned into your sassy black girl, Santana was the hypersexual Latina, Brittany was the dumb blonde, Kurt was the autonomy of white gay think, Quinn was the same girl they always write as the preachers daughter (the son of a heavily religious family tends to be written as a saint while the female is written as a secret slut/troubled soul). They only did the transgender story with the coach because people kept saying she looked like a man 😒.

This is just to name a few. I mean Glee got us more representation (wouldn't say some of that stuff is 'good' either) but the representation it gave us was damaging.

BOY AM I GLAD TO HAVE BEEN ALIVE DURING THE GLEE ERA

I’m currently binging clips of Glee on YouTube and I’m so glad to have watched it. What a beautiful fucking show tho. Not only was it incredibly hilarious but the amount of representation it had is pretty much nothing like I’ve seen before.

1. The plethora of LGBTQ characters - 

AND MANY, MANY MORE

2. Representation of almost all communities (Black, Asian, Jew etc)

3. Representation of characters with disabilities

4. It also dealt with so many important issues

Bullying, eating disorders and body positivity, teen pregnancy, coming out, feminism, stereotypes and toxic masculinity, transitioning, faith/atheism are just to name a FEW

The show came out in 2009 when this extent of representation was scarce on television. Glee broke so many barriers and I’m so thankful for that.