#i cannot be bothered to tag all the ships because they're all shipped together in this fic

[peppermintstarsonamintyway]

Doing Things Fairy Tale Style

White Lily multiship not so mini fic for @pinkvaquita <3

Polyamory my beloved when you cannot choose one choose all of them

Only real warnings are non-canon-conforming and, reverse harem in a way- oh and Dark Cacao in beast-yeast because we need the whole white lily shipping squad in here (bonus points of me trying to write pv being blind)

(minus shadow milk) (sorry buddy you'll get your own version of this fic eventually)

Alright enjoy your reading below the cut!! Try not to get jumpscared by unfiltered Gingerbrave

"Have you tried kissing her?"

The question was sudden, unexpected.

Pure Vanilla, eyes wide open in shock, turned to stare in Gingerbrave's direction, the one who had asked the question in the first place.

"P-pardon?-" The vanilla kingdom's king and healer stuttered out, stunned by the far younger boy's question.

"There's no way she doesn't still have some of her own life powder left, wouldn't her body be all crumbled if she didn't?" Gingerbrave continued, crossing his arms as he raised an eyebrow. The gingerbread cookie had a slight frown to his face.

"G-Gingerbrave-"

"I'm not wrong! Dark Enchantress couldn't have all of her life powder even if she wanted to, most of it maybe, but not all of it." The young cookie's frown grew, his stance shifting as he placed his hands on his hips.

"We have her soul! We just need to put it with her body, and wake her up."

Pure Vanilla went to speak, "That isn't how that-" yet he was cut off by a hand on his shoulder.

"It's worth a try." Dark Cacao said, his voice a low rumble.

"Cacao?! You can't be-"

"It's settled then." Elder Faerie interrupted, and Pure Vanilla turned his head to the two taller men in astonishment. Were they out of their minds?!

Gingerbrave, alongside the two cookies who had chosen to ignore the healer's distress, rushed over to the glass casket, Pure Vanilla scrambling after the sound of their footsteps through confused stutters.

"T-this is insane! There's no way this is going to work! W-we're not in some fairytale!" Pure Vanilla murmured in a scattered manner, pacing back and forth as the three cookies worked to lift the lid off the casket.

"'Nilla," Dark Cacao's voice piped up, causing the healer to stop in his tracks, lifting his head in his direction.

"When was the last time we, as a group, had a normal day?" The emperor asked, tilting his head to the side. "We practically are living in a fairytale, this is at least something we can give an attempt."

Pure Vanilla narrowed his eye, before letting out soft sigh as he realized that Dark Cacao did have a point. The taller man was right, a normal day wasn't something they ever had, and it certainly wasn't something they were going to have anytime soon.

Yet this still felt wrong.

It felt selfish, in a way, to try and see if a kiss would wake White Lily. Was it really to wake her?

Or was it to finally get something out of the centuries-long pining all three of them experienced for her? To feel some closure before they went through with what they knew would work?

"Pure Vanilla." Elder Faerie's voice snapped the healer from his thoughts, his head turning to follow the sound of the fae's voice. "It is not wise to dwell."

"I know you're stuck on the morality of this, and I do understand, but we have all suffered many losses throughout these years. I believe we can allow ourselves this moment of selfishness, if only on the prospect that it may just work."

The healer could feel a soft, sleeve covered hand on his cheek, a huffy sigh falling from his lips as he allowed himself to close his eyes, leaning into the touch from the fae king.

"…Alright." His shoulders slumping as he resigned, allowing Elder Faerie to turn him to face the casket.

Cautiously, Pure Vanilla moved forward, reaching his free hand foward into the now open casket, his nimble fingers prodding hesitantly at White Lily's still body.

His fingers glided over her body, feeling the almost searing warmth still radiating off of it…Gingerbrave had been right, she still had some of her own life powder, though a very small amount.

"Place her soul jam here, please." The healer instructed, as his hand found where he could feel light thump of her heart in her chest.

Gingerbrave did as told, placing the soul jam, the pieces of White Lily's soul, under Pure Vanilla's hand, before backing away.

A soft sigh left the cookie's lips as he stood there, furrowing his brow. He was unable to shake the feeling that this was wrong, but he knew he had to push forward.

He felt Dark Cacao's hand on his own, then the shift of the larger male's fingers as he entwined them with the healer's. He could feel one of Elder Faerie's more slender, cold, hands join the connection, carefully lacing between the other two's hands.

Pure Vanilla knew they were trying to reassure him, and deep down, he appreciated it.

The fae king brought his other hand to White Lily's head, gently placing it atop her hair, to brush aside her disheveled bangs with silent care.

"…Okay, let's do this…" Pure Vanilla murmured, hesitance still lingering in his voice despite forcing himself to push past it.

The three all leaned over the edge of the casket, Pure Vanilla and Dark Cacao pressing small, light kisses to White Lily's cheeks, while Elder Faerie kissed her forehead.

They were late to notice it, but the moment their lips touched her skin, her soul jam snapped back together, pulling itself into place with strings of light.

Out of the corners of their eyes, the fae king and the emperor spotted something. As the soul jam rebuilt itself, White Lily's fingers twitched, her hand balling up into a fist the moment it was solidly back together.

The two cookies lifted their heads, looking between each other and Pure Vanilla, who had dipped his head to rest his forehead against White Lily's cheek.

The healer lifted his head only slightly, opening his mouth to speak, in a somber tone.

"…It didn't work, did i-"

Yet he was cut off, as a gasp sounded just beside him, and something firmly collided with his head as it rose.

Pure Vanilla couldn't help but yelp in surprise as he tumbled back, falling onto his ass with a loud thud. His head was throbbing, but he could hear breathing different from Elder Faerie's and Dark Cacao's.

Quicker, more panicked, like waking up from a cold sweat.

It didn't take the healer more than a second to realize, his wide sightless eyes filling with tears as he shot to his feet, quite literally jumping at the white haired cookie.

"It worked!" He shouted as he tightly wrapped his arms around White Lily, much to her surprise. His hold on her was firm, almost suffocating, but could anyone blame him?

"Wh…what?…" Her voice was quiet, as she stared in confusion. "…Pure- Pure Vanilla?…"

"Hey," White Lily's gaze snapped to her side, her eyes widening. "I'm here too." And Dark Cacao smiled at her, his usually hardened gaze softening as he moved closer.

The emperor's arms found purchase around her and Pure Vanilla, Elder Faerie joining the hug just as quickly, the fae king's face nestling into the soft white hair of the other cookie.

"D-Dark Cacao…wh-what's…what are you two doing here?…" White Lily stumbled over her words, trying desperately, and eventually managing to, get her words out, to question what two of the cookies she had known since her childhood were doing in the Faerie Kingdom, hell, beast-yeast in general.

"We're here for you." The two answered in unison, without missing a beat. She was somewhat taken aback by how quickly they answered, no hesitation in their voices.

Before she could speak again, the three men had tightened their arms around her, causing her to release a small huff as her gaze softened.

"There are things we need your help with, White Lily," Elder Faerie began, yet his gaze was gentler, not quite anything akin to a leader's gaze.

"But, I believe we all need some time, before we deal with our issues."

The fae king brought his free hand up, gently clasping one of the white haired cookie's bandaged hands. He pulled her hand up to his face, turning his head to press his nose into her palm, gently kissing the green wrappings.

White Lily's face flushed a bright red as she watched Elder Faerie, a small squeak managing it's way out of her throat.

"Elder Faerie-" White Lily tried to speak, but cut herself off with a yelp as the fae king climbed up into the casket with her and Pure Vanilla, tugging the emperor on the other side of the casket up with him.

Both White Lily and Pure Vanilla were caught off guard as they were sandwitched between the two taller, and larger (on Cacao's end), cookies.

Before Pure Vanilla knew it, Elder Faerie had begun to smother his face with kisses, causing him to squeal as his cheeks burned strawberry red.

Soft laughter filled the area, an uncharacteristically bright smile on White Lily's face as they took turns showering each other with affectionate gestures. Loud purring rumbled from Elder Faerie and Dark Cacao, both usual stoic cookies smiling just as warmly as Pure Vanilla would normally.

It was an unexpected sight, the four cookies laughing and smiling brightly. It offered some hope.

For the moment, they had all decided,

everything else could wait until later.

[chimggukchim]

https://www.tumblr.com/chimggukchim/770049627903901696/but-it-will-not-and-cannot-be-what-it-was-before?source=share

First thing first i saw another anon say this anon is a tkkr who's sneaking in jkk space when i can very well tell anon is just a jkkr who has seen difference in jikook over the chapt2 era. Just because one jkkr doesn't agree with another doesn't mean they HAVE to be from another ship. And Tkkrs don't talk about jkk the way anon talked because it's hard for Tkkrs to even address the things jkk did together Especially GCFT so anon is definitely not a tkkr.

Second idk in which spaces YOU were because the whole jikook tag was clogged with very much negativity during AYS Especially after 1st,2nd ep because everyone was Feeling the difference in the way jk talked to anon because we have never seen them bicker this much after their debut self. over these past few yrs we have seen them very much be sweet towards e/o and not really bicker atleast not to the level of AYS and it was maybe because we never had full hrs of just jkk only so we're seeing their raw self so maybe jkk have been this way towards e/o for long time but we just never got to witness it before and hence why it was kinda shocking for many jkkrs and yes there was very much negativity. talking about how jk said "Jimin is dead" and laughed when jm was sick because some jkkrs didn't like that because they haven't seen jk talk like that etc etc. If you need @ of the blogs who's seen this negativity ask me and I'll definitely provide it in next ask (I'm not doing in this one because I don't wanna disclose their @ to other anons who might attack them).

Yes the 1st ep looked awkward maybe because they haven't hangout together for some time and when they're doing they're in front of cam so they don't know how to act, It happens when you're meeting s/o after some time and haven't exactly planned things you're doing or you haven't thought it thoroughly. They Started loosening up at the end of 2nd ep. And if anyone talks about their physical closeness as why would they be close like that when they are awkward then ITS taekook is good example of that why or how.

anon didn't lie when they said that jk didn't bother showing up for jm anywhere because that's true. he was at hybe for CK most probably saw jm is practicing stopped there and went home exactly like how he showed up at one of hobi's filming during JITB because the set was in hybe. That time jm specifically asked jk to come to show support to him more and jungkook didn't come again. we saw jm's practice BB and jk wasn't there again and when jk asked when was jm's next music show jm also told him that jk has already seen his dance during practice so it's normal to assume the practice was last one. yes he might have came for another practice but given we haven't seen I'll chose not to make up that "he came to the practice again" because if everyone just start assuming things with nothing to back up there's no difference them and Tkkrs.You remembered what jm said what during serendipity recording then how did you forgot what jm said During festa 2022 when jk was whinning about jm not showing him his songs along with other members?? let me tell you jm said "Well i told you, asked you all to come and see me work" so didn't jm give open invitation here to ALL members including jk? so did he go or not? i guess not if we go by the whinning he was doing over jm not showing him his song, we have also seen jk watching jm doing filter practice so I'm sure coming again for jm's other practices or MV sets to "show support" shouldn't be so hard given jk went to dream movie premiere, and a musical of tae's frnds to show support or wtv it was. plus given how jk traveled to Hawaii when tae said he missed jk so the hybe building (hobi saw jm there working as well so the pdogg house wasn't the only place jm worked) and before you wonder how new i am it's my 5th year in the Fandom. not as old as you but old enough to have known all of their contents.

Jimin talked about him talking with jk about music for hrs and said that he'd tell jk what he learned so i think he was talking about the time AFTER they shot in NYC for AYS. jm talked about going to vocal lessons when he was working on muse(in his live) so I'm assuming he talked with jk about music after NYC trip where he also heard "Who" for the very first time. my personal assumption which I'm pretty sure of is that jk wasn't aware of what's going on with jm when he was working on FACE and the live jk did after face dropped was him just catching up with what's jm doing. I mean he didn't even know when jm was doing his music shows etc etc. my personal assumption tho.

There's no need for jkk to lie to us and say "you didn't call me when i was free and i didn't call you when u were free" because they simply could have not said anything rather than lying. I'm definitely not a tkkr who spin their words to fit my narative so I'll take things as it is said to us when I don't see any reason for them to lie to us.

Yes having e/o in military is a comfort for them but I'll ask u if u get an option of enlisting alone OR u can Enlist with ur friend whom you know for a decade now what option would u chose? won't u wanna go with ur frnd if U actually have an option? given the status they have it's obvious more comfort for them that they have their frnd with them so I believe any normal human would chose to go with their frnd than alone with given option. and jkk do have visible tattoes so they obviously have limited options that don't mean they have to go with e/o BUT why not go with ur frnd than go alone? it's very natural doens't have to be "they can't live w/o e/o".

And just like Taekook changed jikook changed as well. many have hard time beliveing it but that's what how atleast some of us see it. have some points to add for this topic as why but it's already too long so I'll stop.

Thank you, anon, for the oh so detailed read.

And for also proving my point that some people on here actually believe that the only times jikook have ever interacted in their entire lives is when they film content for us.

Bravo!

I was going to just leave it at that but I've got some time so why not write more?

Anon not being a tkkr? Yeah, okay. It is true that not all jikookers have the same opinion. Some support, some simply ship and can become very insecure because they don't actually see jikook as two actual people in an actual relationship. But I actually have working braincells and can very easily spot tkkr rhetoric as opposed to insecure jikooker rhetoric. Anon was a tkkr clearly trying to gaslight. I can actually point out very specific phrases used if you'd like.

Jikook have never bickered before AYS? Really?! REALLY?! You stated you're five years into this fandom so my assumption is your consumption of content begins at 2019. Because there is NO WAY that anyone could have seen jikook interactions since 2013, and claimed they have only ever been 'lovey-dovey'.

If there was any awkwardness at the very beginning of filming (which I still have yet to see), do you know why? It's because Jimin and Jungkook DIDN'T HAVE A CLUE WHAT THEY WERE FILMING! They didn't even have a frigging name for the show! To the point that they, along with the staff said on multiple occasions that they didn't even know if this even would be released. Not because they were awkward with each other but because they were just going with the flow for the first time. And as entertainers, they needed to feel out the situation to provide content for us. Guess what? That takes a bit of time.

And your whole essay on JK not being there for Jimin? I'm not even going to go into detail because clearly the only time Jimin and Jungkook interact is when a camera is rolling.

Finally the military thing. You know what would have been more comforting than each other? Being assigned to an area that wasn't the most dangerous and active. And visible tattoos have nothing to do with anything as a lot of persons have posted about. It may have barred them from a select few, but certainly not all other avenues. And Jungkook could have just as easily chosen Taehyung to enlist with. But he didn't. And I hardly think he tossed a coin or that Jimin was the second option. The apparently indigestible fact remains that jikook actively chose each other.

You claim that jikook changed, just like Taekook, and that's just how some of 'you' see it. Fine. Everyone's entitled to their opinion. And I would actually genuinely be interested in those 'whys' you mentioned.

But please, when you do, make sure you can clearly reference from the beginning.

Because I can also do that to show how jikook's relationship has changed over the years. Only, it's not going to be the change you see.

[olderthannetfic]

https://www.tumblr.com/olderthannetfic/765221485179731968/writing-about-my-favorite-characters-as?source=share

I'm really sorry to hear you're going through this, anon. I'm even sadder that it's not an uncommon story.

As another trans writer (trans woman, in my case) that's stumbled into other people eviscerating her works for "fetishizing" and being "het in f/f's clothing" I really sympathize with you, dude. The way I look at it is that you cannot try alter who you are for these people. They will always find a way to dislike you because you are their ideological enemy. They dislike seeing trans men in what they see as their ship tags, not yours, so they will always find something they view as a flaw and flog you for it until you either conform or leave.

I've had a similar experience to yours, though not a literal thread dedicated to me. Ouch. I write f/f and sometimes that features non-op/pre-op trans characters because I am personally non-op after many years on E, and I'm always astounded by how it obviously upsets people that otherwise claim to be progressive. I also tag things extensively and I even include some terminology clarifications at the beginning of smut fics so that everyone knows what they're getting into. It doesn't matter to them. It'll never matter to them what you or I do, so why bother trying to coddle them?

There are readers that like my works, but after walking into a fandom Discord's NSFW fic channel, I saw how many people assume that my fics are written by a cis person or the fabled Dirty Fetishizer. It's one thing to intellectually know this happens and another to see your own work - something that you as a trans person created to talk about some part of yourself - ripped apart as this nasty tripe that no "real" trans person would write or read.

To make matters worse, I saw all that after I went through a rather nasty spate of transphobic anons when the fandom was very young. It was so tiring. I was exhausted. Seeing virulent hate in the real world and then having it thrown in my face for writing characters in a way that people disagreed with was just too much for me.

My way of dealing with this was disengaging from my own fandom, turning off anons on tumblr, and blocking anyone I even felt slightly annoyed by just in case it boiled over into something else. It sucks, but it's how I continue to have fun with writing for my ships. I basically never go into my ship tags on Tumblr now, I curate whose fics I read carefully, and I only hang out in one Discord server that's very small. I still read and comment on others' works when I have the mental bandwidth for it, but I avoid most other writers, especially those I don't know just in case they're part of that -phobe segment, and keep the most vocally unpleasant authors permanently muted for my own sake.

Frankly, it is what it is, as thought terminating as that phrase can be, and I gave up trying with these people/this fandom. You could keep trying to interact with the greater fandom, but you should block the assholes that disregarded your lived experience for your own mental health.

It's an isolating process for sure, but that's why I supplemented it with seeking out other fandom friends, most of whom are trans. Maybe we disagree with headcanons, and in a lot of cases we're polar opposites, but we all stick together because otherwise we're all thrown into isolation. That, and I always try to focus on the folks that do like what I write.

--

[babycharmander]

I'm curious, you, as an aromantic fanfiction writer, are probably very familiar with shipping culture. You've probably encountered many a fan analysis where people had insisted a platonic bond is actually romantic, arguing that genuine moments of care and connection between two friendly characters as proof of that interpretation. What's your stance on this?

I hhhAAAAAATE it. I hate it when people insist that two characters caring about one another means that they're romantically involved. 

It's one thing to simply use those instances as fuel for shipping and merely keep it within fanfiction or fanart. I can dislike ships all I want but ultimately someone shipping two characters I just don't see being romantically together is generally not really some Awful Thing, so I'll just block that shipping tag so I don't have to see it if it bothers me enough. I have plenty of headcanons others disagree with, after all, and I'd be annoyed if someone was like "well ur headcanon that this character (who shows no canon evidence of any particular orientation) is aro is WRONG" so I'm not gonna go up to someone and be like "uhm this fanart you drew of these two characters kissing and posted to your own blog is Wrong because I personally headcanon them as aro." I might grumble about ships I dislike in private, but I'm not gonna go after someone who simply has different tastes from me.

(Granted, I do occasionally make and reblog general posts urging people to consider exploring things outside of just shipping characters, but I can't really make folks go one way or the other in that aspect. I think it's probably healthier to do stuff in fanworks other than just shipping, but ultimately it's not the worst thing in the world if they don't.)

But when that sort of thing is taken into actual analysis of canon--that's when it bothers me the most. When, instead of being like "oh these two care for each other a lot, I like to ship them" people instead go, "oh these two care for each other a lot, so they're clearly canonically romantic partners."

That is a form of amatonormativity, plain and simple. If you cannot look at two characters who care about each other without thinking "they HAVE to canonically be romantic partners" then there is a problem, and you need to consider why you might think that. Why does one character strongly caring about another have to indicate romance? Why do you think these two characters cannot possibly share a platonic relationship? 

Ultimately everyone's biases are going to be different there, but I do think it's a general thing of society placing a huuuuge emphasis on romantic relationships and playing them up as the be-all-end-all of life, and it's very easy to fall into the trap of believing that, as we're surrounded by that every day. I can't entirely blame people for falling into that trap as I had fallen into the same beliefs years and years ago before breaking out of them.

Rather than getting defensive about this sort of thing, I wish folks really would take a moment to step back and think "huh, why DO I think that what canon presents indicates that two characters who care about each other HAVE to be romantic partners?" Because it's not just something that affects the way you view fiction--it's a way of thinking that can affect your whole life, and can have a detrimental impact on yourself and others.

... uhhh oops. I dunno if you were expecting a ramble about amatonormativity, anon, but there you go. I hope that helps answer your question? \o/;;

[scary-monsters]

20 Questions for Fic Writers

Tagged by @crown-of-winterthorne, thank you friend!!! 🧡🧡🫶🏻

1. How many works do you have on Ao3? 33 total! i've got 8 for jjba, 25 for haikyuu

2. What’s your total Ao3 word count? 473,497 🤯🤯🤯

3. What fandoms do you write for? currently only jjba, i don't anticipate anything else for a long time since my major interests tend to last for years

4. What are your top 5 fics by kudos? unsurprisingly they're all ushiten 😭 i won't link them but: "i'm a house with no windows" (200k friends-to-lovers), "shuffle" (fake dating/only one bed tropes), "fascinating facts about geckos" (high school teachers au), "on display" (nsfw oneshot), and "morning routine" (my very first fic ever posted :')) aw)

5. Do you respond to comments? Why or why not? i try to!!!! sometimes i get really behind (like i am right now ugh) and that's either because i'm busy or i can't properly put my gratitude into words 😔 but i think i get to most of them eventually. i don't really reply to the ushiten ones anymore, but they still mean a lot to me.

6. What is a fic you wrote with the angstiest ending? i.. don't think i have any?? i love writing angst but i really cannot handle sad endings.. i'm a sappy little romance-obsessed fool, i fear i'm incapable of anything but sweet and fulfilling endings

7. What’s the fic you wrote with the happiest ending? i mean it's gotta be "i'm a house with no windows".... they literally grew up together and got married and then visited their hometown as middle-aged men.. i don't know if i can out-do that. but if we're talking jjba then probably my most recent diego fic, "ritz to the rubble"

8. Do you get hate on fics? i have before LMAO, nothing too horrible but honestly i just shrug it off. i like my writing and i know lots of other people do too so i can't be bothered

9. Do you write smut? If so, what kind? ummmmmm yes.. i write a lot of it HFDSKLHGKLS.. i won't detail that here bc this isn't a nsfw blog but my ao3 speaks for itself.

10. Do you write crossovers? nope! the idea hasn't ever even crossed my mind

11. Have you ever had a fic stolen? i feel like.. i remember someone telling me that one of my ushiten fics was on wattpad at one point but i never saw it myself and that was years ago so ??? MAYBE?? i truly don't know

12. Have you ever had a fic translated? i couldn't find evidence of it but i remember someone requesting to translate a fic of mine to chinese?? and i had no problem with it but AGAIN LOL these things happened in like 2016 or 2017 so it's been a hot minute and my memory is garbage

13. Have you ever co-written a fic before? not really, i attempted to collab with a couple friends in the past but it really didn't work out very well.

14. What’s your all-time favorite ship? diego and me (im kidding. kind of.), i mean currently it's dinopants and dinoballs. i love diejoni as well but the other two reeeeaaally hit that sweet spot for me. i like ushiten in a way that's like... aww.. those were my boys and now they're grown up and moved out ?? they are cute but they aren't My Guys anymore

15. What’s a wip you want to finish, but doubt you ever will? UGH I HAD a dinopants university au that i started over a year ago but i ended up using one of the previously written scenes for my recent fic so i doubt i'd ever finish the original one. for the most part i finish what i start, though.

16. What are your writing strengths? DIALOGUE !!! at least to me, anyway. i think i'm really good at getting into a character's head and analyzing them and how they'd handle social situations, which is funny bc i have trash social skills. i fucking love character analysis in general

17. What are your writing weaknesses? i think i tend to overuse words sometimes... maybe lean too heavily into dialogue.. i'm always always always trying to get better, so in a way i think i look at everything as a weakness that i'm constantly working to improve

18. Thoughts on writing dialogue in another language for a fic? i've tossed in little fragments of Italian when i write gyro but other than that i don't think i'd personally do it.

19. First fandom you wrote for? realistically? naruto 💀 my original old-ass clunky desktop had several word docs of deidara fic, i'm like 99% sure. too bad limewire and heaps of viruses killed the damn thing

20. Favorite fic you’ve written? atm i think it's gotta be extra hot, well stirred, light foam :')) i was so iffy about it while writing but i think it's such a perfect balance of funny and sexy and i'm quite proud of it. it would make sense to say a fic from a while ago but i don't like my writing from back then.. i just think i've gotten so so so much better

IM TAGGINGGG @reclusiverisottonero @swallowed-teeth @hammerofspace @penny-lane-123 @phvntom-limbs but no pressure, lovingly patting y'all on the head regardless 🧡

[lastthroes]

💯 i fully agree. it's something i mentioned in the tags of another of your posts, that i always got that sense of disconnection from seeing fanart of them together, and then of course frames like that one in the anime opening where they're leaning on each other and holding hands. it doesn't feel like it really accounts for how their relationship is actually presented in the story. when you see those kind of pictures out of context, and from knowing of the initial setting, it makes you think that their dynamic is going to be one of relying on each other, especially after ai's death... and it's anything but. i admit that i am a sucker for sibling relationships and that's why i started reading oshi no ko, but i ended up 'staying' for other reasons: i would never recommend anyone to get into onk if aquaruby is their main interest, either as a ship or as reincarnated siblings, which is an interesting concept that went vastly underutilized (and that's considering how much japan loves their twin symbolisms)

i still feel disappointed that akasaka actually addresses that ruby and aqua grew apart after aqua airs that ai was their mother, with ruby lashing out and telling aqua that they just happened to be two people who were reincarnated together… and never bothered with it any further. he basically considered that revealing aqua was goro to ruby was all the 'mending' the relationship needed, which ends up in a relationship that feels like little else beyond a joke, and making the ending and aqua's motivations particularly bizarre

quoting myself from a different post that might be the one i was refering to in those previous tags, and removing the comparison with a different japanese work with a central sibling relationship that's also very flawed but i liked (and therefore the spoilers):

(...) which is not the case for aqua and ruby who, i cannot stress this enough, simply do not have an actual sibling bond the (little) praise this manga received for the finale as well as the shipping fuss and general delusions ever since ch143 feels to me like either collective amnesia or gaslighting. like, really now:

these two were twins sure, but both of them pulled away from the other for different reasons: ruby because she felt lonely and betrayed after aqua threw ai under the bus by revealing without warning that they were her children, and aqua because ai’s death broke him and he is quite literally living for revenge without allowing himself to waste time thinking about anything else, which includes both ruby and his future. ch123 actually ends with crow girl narrating that now he has told ruby about being goro, following up his plans won’t be so easy. all of this is plain text even, this manga wasn’t exactly sophisticated: most of the scenes directly spell everything out to You, The Reader … and then somehow comes the ending, and aqua starts a monologue as he drowns about how ruby’s the sole reason he’s doing what he’s doing. it’s also followed by a composite of scenes of him and ruby that falls completely short: everything happens either before ai’s death, or before aqua reveals ai’s “lie” to the whole world. there are simply no scenes that can be identified being of their present relationship, which says a lot coupled with the fact that all of these are already newly drawn panels (and there is, of course, no acknowledgment of aqua doing the same thing with ruby that he did with ai. ruby as some kind of Ideal In His Mind, rather than the actual ruby who was human and also did not want this to happen … and hey, just like ruby has a complete 180 only after aqua reveals he’s goro’s reincarnation, placing the crush she had as a twelve years old for a few months over the brother she actually grew up with for over a decade and a half)

if the manga had continued the line at the beginning of the story? then sure, i can see this ending landing better, even if i would still find it coming off as too nihilistic for my tastes… but it didn’t: aqua had started to move on from the revenge deal, and was even planning his future, such as becoming a doctor again. ruby also became an afterthought for a good bunch of the story despite being the deuteragonist, which doesn’t help the case. the same goes for putting the topic of their past lives inside a drawer and never bring it up again: hell, they basically stop interacting in any meaningful way after ch143

ship-wise, people are also quick to forget all the times that aqua|goro either rejects ruby|sarina or doesn't take her advances seriously. it goes from the very start, back when goro knew that she wouldn't live and therefore he didn't have to follow up on the promise of marriage that was just meant to make a child happy, to the moment when ruby brings up that they have to kiss in the movie and aqua actually says that it makes him uncomfortable to have to kiss his own sister

it was always obvious that this wasn't going to be that kind of manga: at no point does aqua seem to be in denial, repressed, or any other possibility that isn't uninterested or plainly weirded out. he never took sarina|ruby's romantic feelings actually seriously. aquaruby as it's presented in the actual story is the very definition of all bait and no actual substance, and even if i get it as potential i guess i am too old for it: there are much greener pastures when you like sibling relationships in japanese media, both with and without incestuous subtext - i don't need what basically amounts to the popular bait of the moment. there are enough of very obsessed and just as ignored imoutos out there

you've talked before about not liking akurubi i'm curious what it is you don't like about it? since you've said you don't mind the incest is there other things about it you don't like?

The reason I dislike AquRuby as a ship is not because it's incest but because I just think it's kind of boring but the incest is such a hot button topic relating to the ship that that I just end up fated to talk about incest every time anyway LMAO. But honestly, AquRuby being incest is like, 1% of what turns me off about it as a ship - like I've said before, what I dislike about AquRuby isn't that it's incest but that it's bad incest.

It's not that I don't see what people find appealing about it because when you break it down to the broad strokes, I think there IS something really compelling and even romantic about the building blocks of the ship and how long and how intensely Ruby holds onto her feelings of love for Gorou, not just across two decades but two lifetimes. And if you're invested in Ruby as a character, it's natural to want to see that devotion rewarded or more broadly just to see Ruby get a W and to end the series happy. But when I see people going so insanely hard for it and all the people still to this day who are like, frothing and foaming that it was Totally Canon and everything in Oshi no Ko was leading up to their Amazing And Epic Fated Romance of Destined Soulmates i just look at the material for it in the manga and i'm like... this??? this is what you guys are going crazy for???

Because like. I'm gonna be so real and true and honest about this right now: even removed from romance or whatever else, Aqua and Ruby's relationship is shockingly underbaked and underdeveloped, especially in comparison to how loadbearing it ends up being not just for the ending but the series as a whole. Honestly, for such a huge chunk of the series, the twins just barely have a relationship at all; I've said this before, but I originally got into the manga/fandom just after chapter 11 dropped and followed it to the end of Tokyo Blade before I dropped it for a bit and one of the major critiques of the series was always both that Ruby in general was kind of a side character in a series she was supposed to be a co-lead in (people used to call her 'whoby' lmao) and that as a result, Aqua and Ruby do not remotely feel like two people who have spent 16(+) years together, let alone ones who spent that time in the social role of siblings.

Like... it's really funny to me that AquRuby fandom (and tbh, to a degree, the series itself) tries to pretend that omg aqua is suuuuuch a siscon so crazy and overprotective!!! so obsessed with ruby she's all he thinks about!!! because when you pay attention to where Aqua's focus is and what motivates him for most of the series, it really comes off like Ruby is just barely in his thoughts at all LDKJFJKDNKDSM. He's mostly focused on his revenge quest and when we actually DO see him interfering in Ruby's life, this is almost always an offshoot of his Ai related trauma and thus his general flaw of being controlling and manipulative of the people in his life because he's so terrified of what could happen to them if he relaxes his hold for even a second. And even when the series does suddenly start trying to manufacture AquRuby drama, it's all just Ruby doing brocon gooner bits while Aqua just stands there like 🧍‍♂️

Obviously I'm not saying that Aqua, in-universe, does not care about Ruby but from a Doylist perspective, all the intensity and emotional weight of the relationship is massively skewed on Ruby's side of things when the series does finally bother starting to try and flesh things out. This is something @lastthroes pointed out in in the tags of one of my posts and I think they summed it up really well, so I'll just quote them here (tag formatting removed for readability's sake);

yeah i have posted before about how even if you remove the romantic angle the twins just do not have a significant bond. […] doesn't matter if it's a relationship based on familial love or on hatred or on whatever. but it does matter that the bond needs to be meaningful in some way and by the way it was written it just isn't […] aquruby got so popular esp after the kiss but it's… when i see art from jp artists and stuff i find them nice but it gives me the same impression that some of the manga covers with them together always gave me that impression of 'this is good but they just don't have this kind of relationship'. akasaka tries so hard to convince you that goro is obsessed with sarina when aqua ignores ruby's existence for most of the story. that fucking page at the end of their past moments together doesn't even address their relationship after aqua reveals ai's secret because akasaka built them up as drifting apart after the reveal and never made an effort to fix that before making that ending

(full tags are on this post & are recommended reading, iawtc)

So like... all the above is ALREADY a problem when it comes to the twins' relationship even in a purely platonic/familial context and that issue only magnifies when you try to build a romance on top of it. If the foundation of their basic dynamic is already shaky then attempting to layer romantic tension onto it just falls flat because. What bond even is there to get invested in?

It especially doesn't help that Ruby is flanderized SOOOOOO badly in relation to her feelings for Gorou/Aqua post 123. It's not that she has nothing else going on with her character, but whenever Aqua enters the picture, she immediately becomes a pancake thin version of herself propelled entirely by this brand new and poorly motivated obsession with her brother. If OnK actually used the page time spent on the AquRuby drama actually fleshing out or examining Ruby's feelings or at least taking them remotely seriously then that would at least be additive characterization to chew on, but in practice all it does is do the same "lol look at ruby cooming all over herself bc she made eye contact with aqua" joke over and over and over again.

The result is that even though the story wants us to believe the twins are now more invested in each other than ever because of the underlying emotions of Gorou and Sarina's connection bleeding into their sibling relationship, their relationship feels flatter than any other point in the story because they have so few moments together that, once again, aren't just Ruby creaming her pants while Aqua just stands there.

The fact that Ruby has this degree of obsession with Aqua (inherited from Gorou) also really falls flat for me. This is an issue that starts as early as the Private Arc and isn't so much an issue with post-123 AquRuby but this degree of fixation on Gorou that the story kind of retcons her into having kind of... doesn't really make a ton of sense for her?

Back when the manga was still ongoing and I expected us to get more out of Ruby's brocon brainworms than the nothing we got, I just kind of accepted it with a sense of "oh yeah sure, if Ruby was this fixated on Gorou of course she'd end up being a little freak about Aqua" but the more I think about it, the more I'm like... ok, well, WHY is she still so fixated on Gorou? It would be one thing if this was just Ruby continuing to love and value him as a person who made her, in turn, feel loved and valued when she had nobody else in the world but the Private arc onwards makes it seem like Gorou is basically the bedrock of Ruby's emotional and mental stability, to the point of him being more important to her than Ai, her literal mother.

Again - I totally understand Ruby still having fond memories of Gorou and maybe even being drawn back to seeing him again, just as she is with Sarina's family. But at the point in the story that Aqua reveals himself to her, Ruby has a massive support network of people, some of whom have stepped up and supported her in the worst and most turbulent moments of her life. Why have none of these people achieved a level of importance to her that she seems to exclusively afford to a man she knew for a few months max nearly 20 years ago? The story just seems to expect us to take for granted that Ruby feels this way based purely on her backstory as Sarina without actually sewing up the internal and emotional logic of why she's white knuckle gripping this obsession so deep into her new life.

in general, I feel like AquRuby as a ship relies too heavily on the context of Gorou and Sarina's relationship to give it foundation and legitimacy, rather than establishing a unique and compelling romance between Aqua and Ruby as they are now. This would be a problem regardless of how good or bad the writing supporting Gorou and Sarina's relationship was but unfortunately, GRSR is itself made similarly shallow by the narrative's failure to do much of anything with it.

This wasn't something I really became actively conscious of until I read Spica and saw the Wow It's Fucking Nothing that was done with their relationship in it, but even in the main manga there are multiple attempts to make Gorou and Sarina's relationship more meaningful and emotionally impactful to the reader that (imo) end up falling flat because the story seems deathly afraid of adding any real nuance or depth to the bond they supposedly have. I actually feel like Gorou and Sarina's relationship was at its best in chapter 1 - that little snippet of their dynamic said so much with so little and I really felt like I could see the entire relationship surrounding it between the gaps left by what isn't said.

By contrast, I feel like the rest of the series gets increasingly diminished returns every time it tries to mine your emotional investment in it because it's so uninterested in doing anything beyond banging out the same old beats of 'sarina is sad, gorou does a nice thing, yey sensei kekkon shite''. As a result, I might understand why Sarina feels so attached to Gorou, but we never get any idea of why Gorou felt so strongly about Sarina, outside of the basic presumed sympathy and righteous indignation that any good person would feel for Sarina's situation. There's no exploration of what about Sarina (and therefore Ruby) as an actual person removed from her tragedy inspires in Gorou, so the fervent attachment the story again tries to insist that he has to her is hard to invest yourself in as a reader, because the story fails to ground those emotions in anything. So again, we have a relationship where all the intensity and emotional weight of the relationship is massively skewed away from Gorou/Aqua and we thus fail to get any exploration of his interiority as a result.

[theladyofbloodshed]

I'm Indian and I feel like Illyrian culture is portrayed so similar to South Asian and Middle Eastern culture...and with all that when SJM portrays them as 'savages' it feels so....stereotypical and racist to me like-

The only POC subgroup within the NC and they are called 'savages' and all live in poverty and cannot be changed like-that just screams racism to me but sometimes I feel like I'm exaggerating or am looking too deeply into it.Like I was wondering what everyone else's opinion is on this.

I truly feel like some of SJM's portrayals are so- stereotyped.Like she pulls cultures from the actual world-puts them into her fantasy novel in such a way that it looks awfully racist.

But then it might just be me :/

Please don't feel as if your opinion is invalid; your opinion is always valued. Many people have expressed similar views. If you check the anti sjm tag, you can see a lot of people are not happy with her works, not just for the representation of POC, but LGBT representation, treatment of mentally ill characters, treatment of women - the list goes on.

Illyrians have brown skin and are savages. They're almost primitive with little magic and live in tents. The two most powerful Illyrians aren't like the rest - they're good and don't hold any of the values of the others. Mutilating a female's wings so she can't leave when wings are meant to be valued at all costs is an allegory to FGM. They won't change. They're just there to die in wars. Yeah, it's a pretty disgusting creation from SJM.

"The gift of a violent, warmongering people."

Obviously, that's all they are with no variance. The only two that are different are the most powerful two who are the good guys. There's no difference between how they celebrate Winter Solstice, any holy days, their food/culture etc.

Mor in ACOMAF says the whole place should be burnt to the ground - and then people ship her and Emerie together. I've seen a post that said Emorie would just be Pocahontas/John Smith.

When Feyre first goes to Velaris, she's given "Night Court attire" which is then never really seen again (except Amren wears a similar style but nobody else does).

My high-waisted peach pants were loose and billowing, gathered at the ankles with velvet cuffs of bright gold. The long sleeves of the matching top were made of gossamer, also gathered at the wrists, and the top itself hung just to my navel, revealing a sliver of skin as I walked. Comfortable, easy to move in—to run. Feminine. Exotic.

Which to me is as if she just wanted the aesthetic of an "exotic" culture then forgot about it/didn't bother actually developing it.

There's lots to be said about her various characterisations - and lots has been said. For example Helion being canonically bisexual but also falling into the bisexuals want to sleep with everyone trope. Or how Tarquin, a young black man, is treated as a stepping stone for Feyre to train; she flirts with him to get what she wants and steals the Book of Breathing from his court.

Another thing, is when they're discussing Rhys being high king

Azriel stepped forward, shadows trailing from his shoulders. “Kallias, Tarquin, and Helion might be willing to kneel. Thesan will kneel if the others do.”

3 out of 4 of those names who would be willing to kneel to supreme overlord Rhys are MOC which makes me feel very icky. Tarquin and Helion are both black and Thesan's mother is from Xian (which is likely another place that she's taken snippets from other cultures to suit the aesthetic she wants then will promptly forget about) and is brown skinned with "up-tilted eyes".

It's all very, very gross and there are definitely elements of racism ingrained to it. Other people have delved into it in a lot more detail - and have explained it far more eloquently than I can. Please know that your opinion is valid. If you are made uncomfortable and upset from the portrayals, do not push them aside. There is a reason why it is making you uncomfortable and that is because they are racist stereotypes.

[umbreix]

Timw for Team Normies aka Madoka Sayaka and Hitomi for the Ship Bingo! tbh i just like reading ur mini essays in ur posts/tags in all these asks.

Awww thanks! I kind of went off a little more than usual for this one so I've had to put it under a read-more. But for right now, here's HitoMadoSaya!

Once more I state my dearly held headcanon that Hitomi falls hard for all of her friends, and while Homura is canonically her type, I think she's absolutely got it bad for Sayaka and Madoka.

Honestly their relationship is one that could develop in that kind of way where they're never really sure where it started. Sure they talk about it eventually, set boundaries and such, but there's no clear line between friendship and a more committed relationship.

I actually wrote up about their first meeting for a fic I did for a friend once, I'm going to toss it in here because I really like it:

“U-Um… Excuse me!” A voice calling out from behind them makes Sayaka jump. Their hold on Madoka's arm slips as they turn around to face the newcomer. It’s a girl their age with green hair and a wide eyed look, like a lost puppy. “Do you know where the entrance ceremony is?” “The signs point the way there.” Kyosuke explains with words that are succinct but not harsh, like always. It seems to do the trick though as she nods firmly and walks over to the nearest brightly coloured cardboard placard. Watching her trying to puzzle out the directions an idea occurs to Sayaka and they call out to her. “You know, we could show ya the way if you want? We’re all walking there together right now!” She considers this, looking between the three of them reluctantly. “I don’t wish to be a bother…” “You won’t be! We’re all happy to show you, right?” At Madoka’s shy but gentle smile and Kyosuke’s own nod, she takes Sayaka’s proffered arm. The group of three, now turned four, heads to the ceremony together.

I believe that Sayaka is kind of the glue that holds their group together. While Hitomi and Madoka do care for each other deeply, Sayaka is the one who would drag them along on into all sorts of situations. The one who throws their arms around their friends and who picks them up and who shows up with a smile and a new idea.

But HitoMado are just as important to them. Hitomi who helps the pair with their homework and gives the more rational advice alongside Madoka's gentle approach (though time and time again Hitomi finds herself running right after Sayaka with a smile). Madoka who is kind and understanding and stronger than most realise even if she doesn't believe that about herself. Who listens and comforts and understands.

Sayaka is head over heels before they know it (the wife comments become a little more honest then they'd admit- even to themself). Hitomi's stifling her own feelings behind the assertion that girls can't love girls- or perhaps just that she cannot. Madoka doesn't believe her feelings could be returned, as it is she's just happy to be friends with them both.

Once again, they don't know when it becomes something more. When did the claim that they'll be friends forever become the assertion that they'll be together forever? When did Sayaka watch Hitomi working on her flower arrangements and note how beautiful and graceful she is? When did Madoka see Sayaka be protective or swing a sword or just be their usual heroic self and feel her heart flutter? When did Hitomi watch the pair communicate as if by magic and feel an incredible jealousy in her that she didn't quite know what to do about?

The three of them are incredibly important as friends, but they could also be something more. And it could happen in so many ways and so many moments.

And Kyosuke has been there for the entire thing and simply thinks that these three are the kind of friends who are just Like This.

[polkadotpatterson]

*looks at your tags* oh hey! What about PolkaDot Patterson??

thanks for enabling my Dot Rambling lol

favorite thing about them: they are so full of love and once they finally start to admit it and let it show, it's beautiful

least favorite thing about them: they have a bad habit of trying to achieve No Thoughts Only Blaseball instead of actually dealing with their emotions. also the alting was by far the worst two hours of my blaseball experience until the Mechs stopped by to save the day with creative interpretations

favorite line: I just loved watching them pitch, it was always so fun. In particular I will never stop thinking about their 23-inning duel with August Sky in the Season 5 semifinals, I watched it all and it was glorious. On the lore side of things, nothing is more powerful to me than Dot finally having a moment of standing up and defying the gods after feeling helpless against them for so long, desperately clawing their way back into this world no matter what the consequences might be, because maybe once they would have just let themselves be taken but now they have so much worth staying for, and then they do get to stay but it's not easy, they have to deal with all kinds of interdimensional side effects and aren't allowed to play anymore and have to sit back and watch and feel the guilt that they weren't able to prevent Alto from coming here... but they got to stay, they fought for it and they'll always keep fighting no matter how hard it is because it's worth it and they know that now

brOTP: Dot and Workman as QPPs is everything to me. they love each other so much... The entire Patterson-Gloom family is so good. Dot and Workman and Beasley and eventually Alto too once they work through things… love them. Dot honestly just has so many good platonic relationships! They've grown very close to Morse despite their differences, they were a mentor for York before All That Stuff happened, Greer has that one-sided rivalry with them that's been leaning increasingly towards actual friendship, they eventually co-captained with Ziwa, at this point they've become pretty close to Eugenia as well, and I think they actually bonded a lot with Jaylen while they were in the Core together... basically they're starting to become friends with absolutely everyone and I think that's what they deserve

OTP: I would die on the hill of Aroace Dot but I think there are enough people up here with me that we may actually live. I have built a fortress here and I cannot be stopped

nOTP: It honestly makes me uncomfortable to see any shippy content of Dot considering that they’re widely seen as aroace by MT fans. There really isn't enough aroace rep in the world and I don't like that some people just look at a character and go “ok who should I ship them with” when platonic relationships are equally important and meaningful and Enough

random headcanon: okay I've been thinking a lot about coffee lately. Kit has a great headcanon that Dot took over the job of getting coffee for the team after Morse left, as a way of starting to bond with them all more. I think eventually this becomes Dot also getting all kinds of stuff to make coffee at the apartment just the way their friends like it when they come over to visit... and Workman's coffee preference is “anything” so I think Dot is always trying to come up with new and exciting fancy coffees for them

unpopular opinion: I'm extremely fortunate to have been a part of creating a lot of the popular Dot Lore, so I don't actually think I can answer this question the way it's intended to be? One trend that seems unfortunately a bit popular outside the Talkers, though, is people seeing Dot as just That Squiddish Star Pitcher and never bothering to look behind the illusion to the actual person underneath. They're one of the most iconic players of all time and I feel like not a lot of people actually care to find out what they're really like. Every time I see someone say “Dot doesn't have lore” I die more inside

song i associate with them: you may think I have a bunch of Dot songs in my head and though I wish I did, alas, I do not

favorite picture of them: there is so much wonderful Dot art and different designs out there and I love them all so very dearly. special shoutout to every Dot that both Joe and Wires have ever drawn, Kosmo’s art of them pitching, Bells’ art of them in the shell with York looking on from the outside, Aves’ art of little squid Dot in the sweater from the moist zine, and the art that Ang just posted of them and PDZ. but genuinely I could go on forever, I love every Dot I have ever seen

[orphicdawn]

you just vague posted saying you don't vague do vague posts; wouldn't it be more effective to go directly to whomever you're talking about when you posted that? because if they're vagueing they're probably too chicken to come to you anyway. just a thought!

i’m not going to go to a person and potentially bother them over a possibility that a vague post is about me ; which is why i don’t consider my post vague blogging because i don’t know if this person is meaning me or someone else (despite how obvs it is). i am giving a psa about how i feel about vague posting and how confront others respectfully gets more done. 

i am here to have fun and create memories with friends. it is not my job to go to other when i might be the one someone has the issue. i cannot monitor other’s comfort. i can only monitor my own. if something i do has made you uncomfortable, it says in my rules that my askbox, and ims are open to all mutuals. i’ve had close friends tell me my anti-ship posts have upset them and together we reached a way to filter their blogs and i was even willing to up my tagging to include a new one they could block. i have given no one any reason to be afraid of me as i’ve never been rude to anyone. 

so in conclusion, if you have an issue with me, come talk to me like an adult and we can figure out the best path to a solution. i don’t do vague blogging or call out posts. there are many reasons a person may be interacting with someone toxic or using a piece of source material wrong (i.e. not knowing a fc’s background if they canonly play a very white character). 

[snow-barryrules-blog]

Why Snowbarry Fans Still Believe Barry and Caitlin Can Make a Great Couple (Part 1)

I hate seeing anti-Snowbarry posts in the Snowbarry tag but I always do coz Tumblr's always bitchin'. I always try to scroll past most of them and try not to read them but one of them caught my eye a while ago. This particular post was not written by a WA fan, it was written by a person that just recently joined the Flash fandom and really didn't understand why Snowbarry fans still ship this pairing even though the show had been propping up WA as the main couple for years. Reading that post gave me a lot to think about and I finally feel it's time to set the record straight.

Tbh, I cannot speak for the whole Fandom but I want to try and speak for a vast majority of Snowbarry fans based on what I've read online and the kind of post many Snowbarry shippers like and reblog.

This post is for all Snowbarry fans and members of the Flash fandom who really don't understand why Snowbarry fans won't give up on this pairing even with the upcoming WA wedding. I will be relying on all the things Barry and Caitlin have done for each other from s01-s04. There will be no use of manips and imagination in this post. I will only present raw facts based on what has been happening in the show.

1. The Way They Notice Stuff About Each Other

Barry can tell when something is bothering Caitlin without being told and vice versa. Their ability to observe and understand each other's feelings without being told is impressive and fascinating. This ability shows how much of a great couple they would make.

2. Mental Synchronization

In many episodes of the Flash, Barry and Caitlin are either talking in sync, finishing each other's sentences or even moving at the same time. Even though a lot of this happens out of mere coincidence, the fact that it can even happen at all says a lot. Seriously, some couples have to go to couples' therapy to learn to achieve even a little bit of the mental synchronization Barry and Caitlin exhibit naturally and that's just one of the many reasons Snowbarry fans still believe this pairing can make a great couple.

3. They Make Quite a Pair

When Barry and Caitlin openly admitted to each other that they make quite the pair, a lot of Flash fans started shipping them. The fact that even the evil versions of them made a hell of a team encouraged their shippers to keep believing they should become a couple since most people believed Caitlin/Killer Frost's loyalty to Savitar was born from her deep connection to Barry.

4. They Help Each Other Face Their Fears

"Fear cuts deeper than swords ..."

I once heard that quote in Game of Thrones and it is so true. Barry and Caitlin have been through many horrifying situations some of which they have overcome on their own and others which they have helped each other overcome. A great couple always helps each other face their fears just as Barry and Caitlin routinely help each other through their darkest times.

5. They Have Fun Together

Great couples always have fun together and spend a lot of time with each other. Many Snowbarry shippers still believe Barry and Caitlin can make a great couple because they spend a lot of time together at STAR labs and since they have a lot of common interests, they usually have a lot of fun together whether they're playing laser tag with Cisco or doing karaoke.

6. Sacrifice

Fact: even though it is not easy to give up your comfort or safety in order to ensure the comfort or safety of another person, if you are doing it for someone you truly care about you won't hesitate. Barry and Caitlin's eagerness to make sacrifices for each other shows how much they truly care about each other and this makes their shippers believe they will make a great couple.

7. They Take Care of Each Other

Both Barry and Caitlin possess a caring nature. Since Barry is a superhero and Caitlin is a doctor, they can frequently showcase how caring they are. Caitlin takes care of Barry a lot, it is even part of her job description to take care of him coz she's his personal physician. Barry and Caitlin have become very close and he is always willing to take care of her, whether he's watching over her as she falls asleep or helping her nurse a hang over.