#hopefully that was clear (and non-confrontational! i love exchanging ideas!)
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''#and in-ho in particular represents the overarching idea of 'human nature/people do not change‚ no matter how ''good'' you are'''
I don't think this can be said with certainty before watching season 3, particularly as we know we're getting more in-ho backstory/a look at his character in season 3.
I could see an ending where in-ho doesn't change his belief...but I'm also not sure that's got the full meat of what they're doing with his character. and, even if he doesn't change for it, I think the part of him that does have conflict over it...that subconscious piece that does have hope that he's wrong...is very important, and compelling, and interesting, to who he is -- and what's been broken in him and what he's fallen from, how he's found himself in this darkness and whether it's encompassing or whether there still is something that could enjoy the goodness of humanity in him. and there is a beacon of light in gi-hun, that in-ho is obviously trying to quash, but I really don't think 100% of him wants it to be quashed.
I also don't know that a message of 'once this person loses any hope in humanity there's absolutely no way for him to come back from that and he wouldn't even want to' is particularly...great? as a message or commentary.
i dunno, maybe he will just be a 'I'm evil and darkness and this has been my master plan and I've never once hesitated'...but that's not really what I've taken from it so far (despite, yes, all his manipulation and calculatedness), nor something I'd find very fulfilling as a story.
Definitely agreed that there is depth to him! He's absolutely a complex character, and I think (but may not have gotten across clearly in my couple of posts about it) that the emotions he experiences while playing the games with Gi-hun are somewhat genuine. I think the showrunners actively want us to see those emotions and view them that way! I just think he's leveraging those things for the ultimate purpose of tearing Gi-hun's worldview apart (for a wide range of possible reasons). It seemed like the main read of his character in fandom spaces has been more focused on magnifying whatever inner conflict there may be (to the point of being surprised that he didn't have a change of heart at the end), so I wanted to emphasize that he is actually doing this stuff on purpose. I'm looking forward to how they develop him in Season 3!
I also don't think the show will necessarily conclude that "people don't change, no matter how good you are" (meaning human nature, not necessarily In-ho in particular), but that is the "thesis" of In-ho's character at this point. What I mean is that, narratively, his function is to argue against Gi-hun's belief in people and their ability to overcome their horrible circumstances, and to do the right thing instead of the selfish one. In-ho joins the games with the express purpose of proving that no matter how clearly Gi-hun makes his case, no matter what he tries to do, people are going to play the games anyway, because human nature won't change: "survival of the self ahead of others" is the fundamental drive of all people. And these people need the money to survive, so they will play at the cost of others' lives.
Gi-hun's character is challenged by the events of season 2 because that claim seems to be being proven right; even when many people want to leave the games, and even when the cost is clear, there is still a larger faction who want to stay. But what he doesn't know is that In-ho is orchestrating events so that that is certain to occur! Without In-ho as the final player, the games might have stopped; someone else might have voted X. And that's just the most obvious of the changes made because of his role. So in the end, it's not actually a fair fight of ideas--the system/establishment that tries to set people against their fellow man has so much more power that they can "make their case" more convincingly. That's why In-ho wins in the end: what he represents has (at least for now) come out on top, because the people he represents are already there.
Since he is a human, I think it's likely that he feels a degree of inner conflict about this. But everything we've seen from him indicates that he really does believe his perspective to be the only reasonable way of seeing things. And that's deeply tied with his own choices: if he was wrong, if there was another way, then how can he ever hope to atone for the wrong he's done? The more people do in the name of their ideas, the more desperately they become entrenched in them.
In short, I think In-ho is very complex and compelling--just maybe not as conflicted as people like to read him. He's not as sympathetic if he really believes in what he's doing, but I think the plain reading would indicate that he almost entirely does. But it's more interesting, in a way, to have a villain who doesn't want to be proven wrong! And more satisfying if, in the end, he can be--and perhaps can even change, himself.
(Also, I'm not sure if you sent another ask as well, but I tried to touch on both of them here in any case!)
#squid game 2#squid game#hwang in ho#meta#seong gi hun#my meta posts#responses aka the ramblings of my brain#kay can i just catch my breath for a second#hopefully that was clear (and non-confrontational! i love exchanging ideas!)
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I've been thinking about how many times Simon notices and mentions Baz /not/ killing things they're fighting in WS and how Simon i-killed-so-many-things-for-you Snow must have interpreted that, and wondered if you or anyone had written anything about that? I love reading all the meta posts you write and share
Thanks so much for this ask! This is such an interesting question. I haven't written anything about this myself and I don’t recall seeing any posts on this, but that doesn’t mean they’re not out there. If anyone reading this knows of a post that addresses this topic, send me the link and I’ll add it on!
As you noted, Baz does resist killing a lot of things in WS, attempting to talk his way out of confrontations with Jeff Arnold's posse, Margaret the dragon, and Lamb and his lackeys. But sun-burned, bedraggled, and starving Baz isn't the smooth talker he thinks he is and either matters do escalate into a fight, or someone else (Shepard) bails them all out. Baz does opt not to kill Jeff in their scuffle, and Simon does notice that restraint: "That should have been the end of the badger—Baz could have cracked it in half like a Kit Kat. But for some reason, he didn't."
Baz also tries to avoid killing the Renaissance Faire vampires as long as he can, despite being the one to argue in favor of attacking them in the first place. He uses spells to try to "contain" the vampires, and only resorts to fire when Simon's life is on the line.
I think what this shows Simon, and us by extension, is that even though he's a vampire, Baz is the least accustomed to violence out of the three leads. He remarks how it feels like Simon and Penny are on "their tenth tour of duty together". Even when he thinks he should act by killing the vampires at the Ren Faire, he still hesitates, he still looks for non-lethal techniques, using fire only as a last resort. When he strikes against the NowNext, he's very clear in his mind that he's consciously surrendering his hold on humanity—and the moral compass he associates with it. "There’s no saving me. Everything I am is already gone. My teeth are like knives. I use them."
(It's very interesting that the only non-food creatures Baz does kill in WS are vampires…there's a lot to unpack there about his internalized hatred.)
While Simon might have spent most of their Watford years convinced that Baz was an evil dark creature planning his demise, the idea of Baz being more merciful than Simon and Penny isn't actually a new development. The first time Simon gets a glimpse into Baz's true character is during the confrontation with the dragon on the Great Lawn. Simon and Penny charge in without a second thought. Baz is the one who intervenes with the intent, not to save the school or the students, but to save the dragon (and also Simon—from opening a portal to hell). Baz's actions in this scene serve to show Simon that fighting and killing aren't the only ways to be a hero.
I think one of my favorite exchanges between Simon and Baz in WS happens as Baz is trying to convince Simon and Penny to accept Shepard's help. Simon asks, "What if he has a gun?" Baz reponds with, "I'll sit behind him and break his neck if I have to." Which prompts Simon to ask, "Do you know how to break someone's neck? I should show you before we get in the car—" Recovering boy soldier Simon doesn't think his boyfriend knows the right way to break a neck and he wants to show him. This is a skill Simon possesses, one he has a lot of confidence in. Killing things is second nature to him by now—even when he doubts himself in everything else, this is one thing that he's sure of. But Baz is a vampire. He's strong enough to kill someone without even trying—strong enough to crack them in half like a Kit Kat. Simon's concern here, though unnecessary, and his immediate offer to help Baz is very Simon.—This is how he shows affection.
In his own words, Simon's love language is killing. That's really fucked up, but it makes perfect sense for him. Let's consider what his relationships have looked like up to now. We have the Mage, who recruited Simon into three wars when he was eleven. We have Penny, who fought by his side in every battle. We have Baz, Simon's fated enemy, destined to kill him or die by his hand. And we have Agatha, unwitting damsel in distress routinely requiring rescue. Every one of these relationships developed around violence. Simon might have misgivings about whether or not he's actually the Chosen One, but he definitely takes that role to heart. From the age of 11 until the age of 18, the greatest purpose he could conceive of was to die fighting to protect the people he loves. This is his part to play—he's the hero. He's the one who fights the battles and slays the dragons.
This isn't an expectation Simon seems to place on anyone else, though—it's his burden alone. He doesn't have faith in Baz to be able to kill someone if the need arose, even though Simon recently watched Baz kill two vampires. This is because Simon doesn't see killing things as Baz's job—vampire status notwithstanding. Killing is Simon's job. (“My job is getting up. My job going down. With a fight.”) He's the one who's supposed to protect and defend and take care of the people he loves. That's how he's been programmed. Before Watford, Simon only had himself to rely on. And then the Mage showed up and told Simon he was the Chosen One, the Greatest Mage, the Power of Powers. He had magic and a special sword and big baddies to defeat. That life made sense to him. He liked having a purpose.
Simon is still moving out of this way of thinking. This is one of many reasons that Baz is such a good match for him. Baz is a powerful magician and a vampire—and if he ever gives in fully to his vampire side and learns to make use of all of his special abilities, he'll be that much more unstoppable. Baz doesn't need anyone else to fight his battles for him. He and Simon work best when they work together, when they trust each other. Their two different approaches balance each other well. Simon does seem to be taking some of Baz's diplomacy and mercy to heart—sparing the goblin outside of his flat and avoiding violence with Smith Smith-Richards. He's trying to choose the more peaceful path, and being with Baz is a part of that.—They chose peace when the world wanted a war.
Hopefully, there won't be a lot of violent altercations in Simon and Baz's future. But trouble does have a way of finding them—or they have a way of finding trouble. They'll work out a compromise they can both live with.
I hope you got something out of these thoughts!
Questions, comments, observations? Send them in! I've been having so much fun with these asks! ❤️
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Caught By Your Past
23rd Part
Fandom: Assassin’s Creed Pairing: Altair x Malik Warnings: modern AU, mature, OOC, OFC; unbetaed Summary: Keeping the past forgotten is manageble as long as you don’t get confronted with it head on, right? After all, what eyes can’t see… But what if your past came right to your doorstep?
A/N: Big revival’s here! First things first: 22nd Part underwent a bit of a transformation (AKA So... I've made some adjustments. *chorus sigh*), therefore in this part you’ll see basically what you maybe already read (if you’ve read CBYP in its first form). That being said, almost every chapter had been tinkered with at least a bit (in some cases a lot), so I recommend re-reading the whole story in case you want the puzzle pieces to fit much better.
Altair was undeniably elated as of late. The downside?
“Don't worry your snarkhood is safe with me.”
The whole thing was a downside.
“My what.” Way to force a head up, Malik had to admit as he tore his attention away from the laundry he was pulling out of the washing machine. Propped against the doorframe and excluding jolly mood, Altair didn't hesitate to reassure Malik that he heard right.
“Your snarkh-”
“I hold no fear of endangerment of my 'snarkhood'. Or any other 'hood' for that matter.” Quipping up to par in exchange, he pointedly returned to his previous business.
“I was talking only about your true identity.” They were so not obviously done here. Shoot him dead. What was it.
“My true identity.”
“But of course, Ser Snarkhood,” here, Altair executed an extravagant bow, musketeer style. “Thus begins the unfolding of a story revered, of a recluse wreathed with gratitude of simpleminded, a recluse most know just as a hearsay. Escaping and rebelling against the laws of socialization, he hid in local woods since there's a price written on his head-”
“Snarkhood. Price on my head. Real charmer. Get lost, you perverse Nothing-ham.” Throwing a damp T-shirt at Altair's head was Malik's non-verbal free bonus to the reply; hopefully discouraging enough to make the riot rethink the idea of staying around. It must've been effective, because the enemy chose to beat a hasty retreat. With badly contained laughter, but Malik would take it.
Stopping in the middle of unloading the washing machine, he went over to where the unlucky piece of clothing landed after hitting its mark. The least he could do was to retrieve it after the job well-done.
Cue a sister lying in wait. And she didn't waste any time to pluck her prey.
“You're strangely open to the quip sessions you guys have. Usually, you'd throw the conversation to the curb right at the start of it.”
There used to be a time when the pure mention of washing room had deterred young people from getting anywhere near it. Heartwarming memories… cruel reality of today.
Lifting what he stalked over for off the floor, he took in her sparkling eyes and FBI profiling analyst remark.
“He's like a puppy. You gotta play with it or it dies.” The hero henley and the rest of its family reunited with a flop and Malik heaved the whole basketful up, clearly on his way out. Gie stepped aside to leave the doorway free; obviously, that wasn't a standard interrogation procedure, but he'd be the last person complaining.
“You're impossible, Malik.” Not even stopping when passing by the officer, he bestowed upon her his own parting words like a monarch.
“I try.”
Relocating into the bathroom, he pulled at the retractable washing line to get down to business.
In all fairness, he might've deserved and expected an outrageous show of madness from Altair. Granted, he toyed with the goofball a bit prior to the encounter, but it would be irresponsible and misleading to let Altair think that Malik's going to roll over and go with whatever and whenever. Malik didn't have a heart to do that. Setting limits and drawing lines was important. And so the boot camp begun. Which went along the lines of:
“Talk to me.”
“No.”
“We could-”
“Reading.”
“Come on…”
“Making a coffee.”
“That doesn't take long.”
“Feeding a cat.”
“You don't have a cat!”
As was obvious from the example – simple exercises in accepting a negative response for an answer were not only needed; they were necessary when handling an attention seeking missile. He didn't need someone permanently on his case and while Altair admittedly wasn't that bad, Malik still needed to ensure he'll have a working system present, which would send Altair a clear signal to give him a breather when Malik needs it.
He should've expected the side-effects. Due to the method chosen to pass that particular message, anyone as bullheaded as Altair was bound to turn up on his doorstep with a crazy routine after that; Malik could see it now. Therefore, as ridiculous as this attempt with snarkhood had been, it was time for a reward, so Malik'd actively joined in.
The addition of Gie in the setting threw him back into a more somber mood. While he might have not shown it on the outside, his mask didn't erase the change and the mark it left stayed with him. Malik felt entitled to continue question everything, feel off about it since looking at her input reminded him of a skipping stone. Getting to realize your crush is your brother's ex, playing into that rooftop surprise, not stabbing Malik in the gut when they got back and then ribbing him some? If nothing else, his sister was less violent than an average broken-hearted woman.
Georgie was a good girl; no angel by any means, but she was a solid human being without a question. She also had a sense of self-worth – which was probably exactly what created this 'incomprehensible' block that Malik was dealing with. He wasn't one to flog himself daily and held no desire to start with it either, however, in this case he would understand a well-aimed kick, slap or that smack upside the head that she favored so much. Instead, and quite clearly, she was okay with what the three of them evolved into. As in genuinely, for whatever reason and no matter the plans thrown out of the window, alright. Well, he was weird according to standards, there was no reason why his sister couldn't be, too. At least one answer to that. Where did that leave them, though?
Let's try to tackle the monster to the ground from a scratch. Malik wouldn't call them an extraordinary pair of siblings. In fact, they'd probably fit the norm. He was a big brother, he looked after her. Gie was a younger sister, she raised havoc. There was no science involved. You take care of your sibling, you love them and that's it. So much for the facts. There was no apparent reason for her to spare him her wrath. The only conclusion he could draw from that was that William Congreve would be either sorely disappointed or pleasantly surprised.
Staring down the freshly hanged clothes, he was loath to admit defeat.
They hadn't spoken a word about it. The facts were undeniably out there in the open, yet both of them just seemed to… go with what the other went with.
Done here in more senses than one, he retired – about to develop more senses than one as well – into his room.
Altair was absent, that was the first information that made it to his brain. Thinking back, he heard someone leaving the flat. On autopilot he sat behind his desk and switched the laptop on, blindly watching the system boot up.
He should take it at face value and stop digging into it. There were only two issues with that. First, years had ingrained into him to dig deeper and second, these 'face value' accepted things tended to blow into one's face sooner or later.
Closing his eyes, he massaged the bridge of his nose, trying to elevate the pressure building there. The action didn't result in much success, so he gave up altogether in favor of grabbing his phone to at least check the time and see how much he's got left to finish his current load of work.
An unread message. His finger went to click the appropriate button only to reveal the most wretched text message he ever had the displeasure to see:
He didn't call. Altair brought his favorite anyway.
The rest of the day saw the brunette simply sharing the same space while doing this or that.
Malik gave him a peck goodnight.
Face value it was.
Next
A/N:
William Congreve reference - he’s the author of the famous “Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.”
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