#higgledy-piggledy whale statements

[probably-an-alien]

All you dickheads out there need to listen to Higgledy-Piggledy Whale Statements!

It's such a great podcast. Each episode the hosts Ben Klug and Mark Sokolov analyse one or a couple of chapters from Moby-Dick and go really in-depth on so many of the details and deeper themes in the text.

Here's a link to episode 01:

[charaznablunt]

Baffled by the Town-Ho's story? Try my podcast!

Hello again, Whale Weekly! I bring you an episode of Higgledy-Piggledy Whale Statements entirely focused on today's chapter. I think we did a pretty good job discussing what it means, so I hope people will find it helpful. Please enjoy!

[probably-an-alien]

Also consider this:

The whale isn't Satan but he's either god or sent by god and that god, whether willfully or in pure ignorance has created a world that is evil and unfair that has all of these "subtle demonisms", as the book would put it.

The whale is the veneer that this malicious or apathetic god hides behind and killing that whale is Ahab's attempt to "strike through the mask".

Is it not understandable that one would get angry at a world that allowes something as horrible as your leg getting bitten off by a whale to happen?

And Ahab is not one who can ignore this, can pretend like he doesn't know about this fundamental injustice. He must act against what drives it.

The only way he knows to attack that malicious god, the uncaring force of nature is to hunt that damned whale that personifies it.

Even if there was no god at all behind nature, I don't think Ahab would hate it any less.

He also really doesn't care whether the whale is actually the malevolent entity that acted against him or just doing the bidding of some higher force. "be the white whale agent or be the white whale principal, [he] will wreak that hate upon him"

Of course all of this might still sound like a pointless quest. After all, how could someone kill god or all the evil in the world by striking down one whale? Still, I think there's a certain tragic valor in one person trying, in refusing to just accept defeat against forces much larger than him.

Moby Dick is a novel about a lot of things. It's a novel about rampant capitalism and how it affects the common man. It's an allegorical and existential fable about one man trying to find meaning. It's about the fruitlessness of the American Dream. Simply put, it means something to everybody.

To me in particular, it's a deconstruction of the concept of revenge. Which is probably one of the most surface-level themes in the entire novel. At this point, everyone knows at least the gist of the story. Captain Ahab gathers a crew of whalers on a long voyage to track down and slay the infamous albino sperm whale Moby Dick, which bit off his leg. In the end, Ahab's quest ends in failure as the whale kills not only him but sinks the Pequod before escaping back to the watery depths. Leaving Ishmael as the only survivor to recount the tale. We all know it and a lot of revenge stories these days do owe some credence or reference to the captain's obsession with his "nemesis".

It also perfectly demonstrates how utterly pointless and self-destructive the concept of revenge is.

I'm going to be approaching this on two fronts. One is the more allegorical interpretation with reference to religious texts following the idea that Moby Dick is a stand-in for Satan or Leviathan. The other is a more literal interpretation where Moby Dick is simply an unusually violent whale.

It has been speculated numerous times over the years that Herman Melville drew a direct parallel between Satan and Moby Dick. Or at the very least, painted Moby as some sort of otherworldly entity that makes the seas eerily calm and drives men to madness. This would mean any attempt on Ahab's part to slay the whale is doomed to begin with because he's literally fighting something beyond the capabilities of any man. Yet he "solves" the problem by effectively inserting himself into this Biblical narrative as God themselves.

"There is one God that is Lord over the earth, and one Captain that is lord over the Pequod.--On deck!"

-Captain Ahab, Chapter 109

That was his response to what he viewed as a mutiny by his first mate Starbuck. Yet the point still stands; the idea he'd say this means he's willing to put himself in a higher position than any mere mortal man. And thus, he should be the one to right the wrong of Moby Dick taking his leg.

The problem is that by this interpretation, Ahab's quest for vengeance is pointless. If Moby Dick is a stand-in for Satan, then that means that God, the real God, will eventually one day strike him down during the Day of Judgement. The same goes with the references to Moby Dick being Leviathan since the latter is also fated to die in the scriptures.

In that day the Lord with his sore and great and strong sword shall punish leviathan the piercing serpent, even leviathan that crooked serpent; and he shall slay the dragon that is in the sea.

-Isaiah 27: 1

So if we're going with this allegorical interpretation, Moby Dick will be punished someday. Yet the problem is that Ahab refused to swallow his pride and tried to get vengeance on the beast by himself. Which ends with predictable results.

The other interpretation is just as pointless and self-destructive. Maybe even arguably so since Moby Dick is literally just an animal. Yes, a large and unusually aggressive animal, but not exactly the source of all evil as Ahab describes him to be. Heck, the incident where Moby Dick took Ahab's leg was likely a case of self-defense against whalers trying to kill him. So it's unlikely that there was any intended malice to begin with. This actually is supported by the text where the white whale is attempting to swim away from the Pequod and only becomes violent when he's attacked.

What this means is that Ahab's vendetta against Moby Dick has no real merit. The incident, while tragic and would've scarred Ahab, was less some evil spurning him and more an animal defending itself.

Unfortunately for Ahab, either way, he's part of an industry that's built on whale killing. Even if Ahab wanted to, there would be a societal push to get even with the whale that maimed him since killing whales like Moby Dick is what's expected of him. It's something the Captain actually reflects on before the fateful final battle, and ultimately he feels locked into the conflict. That something beyond his control is pushing him outside of his own vendetta, and he's just as much disturbed by the thought as he has a grudge against the whale.

The ultimate tragedy here though is that Ahab could've turned back. Even within the society of whaling, he didn't need to go after Moby Dick. Captain Boomer, a whaler the Pequod meets at sea, also fought the white whale and lost his arm. Thing is, he didn't go after them again for revenge. He thought about it, considered it, and decided to take his loss lest he lose his life. Ahab wasn't as wise. Instead, he gave into his quest for revenge and paid the ultimate price for it.

Which is ultimately why Ahab's revenge was pointless. Even if he killed Moby Dick, it wouldn't change what happened. He'd still be down a leg and he'd still likely be hunting whales once his quest was done. In the end, he wouldn't have gotten better. What's tragic is that there was a good chance he probably could've bounced back. He admitted in his final speech that there was something he was uneasy about with his quest and the possibility of admitting defeat was always on the table. Unfortunately, Ahab's pride got the better of him. And the rest was literary history.

[the-merry-rose]

Are the people who hosted the Higgledy Piggledy Whale Statements podcast on here? Because I would like to give them each a tender kiss on the forehead (or something of equal value).

[ghostwriterofthemachine]

ARE YOU TELLING ME that all the stupid meme posts were serious and Moby Dick literally begins with a bunch of dictionary definitions of the word “whale,” the word “whale” listed in 13 different languages, and then a truly ungodly number of random quotes from various texts that are either about, or just vaguely mention, whales as a concept?

Fantastic, this is already batshit bonkers and I haven’t even hit The Famous First Line yet, let’s fucking go.

The narrator of the “Extracts” section snarking at this sub-sub librarian and their totally inane collection of quotes speaks to me deeply. This is a genuinely hilarious sentence:

“It will be seen that this mere painstaking burrower and grub-worm of a poor devil of a Sub-Sub appears to have gone through the long Vaticans and street-stalls of the earth, picking up whatever random allusions to whales he could anyways find in any book whatsoever, sacred or profane.”      

Also, “higgledy-piggledy whale statements,” oh my fucking god

(on a Serious Academic Note, this is a for-sure an effective way to set up how important whales and whaling is to western culture, and also establish how fucking unhinged this book is going to be about A) whales, and B) everything else, I suspect.)

[appendingfic]

“Therefore you must not, in every case at least, take the higgledy-piggledy whale statements, however authentic, in these extracts, for veritable gospel cetology.”

This should be printed on Moby Dick right under the title

[pineapple-split]

It will be seen that this mere painstaking burrower and grub-worm of a poor devil of a Sub-Sub appears to have gone through the long Vaticans and street-stalls of the earth, picking up whatever random allusions to whales he could anyways find in any book whatsoever, sacred or profane. Therefore you must not, in every case at least, take the higgledy-piggledy whale statements, however authentic, in these extracts, for veritable gospel cetology.

lmaoooooooooooo I love this. Hard to see this as anything but Melville himself subtweeting “don’t @ me about the incorrect whale facts ye assholes”. Amazing.

[ashleybenlove]

“Therefore you must not, in every case at least, take the higgledy-piggledy whale statements, however authentic, in these extracts, for veritable gospel cetology.”

I love that the Sub-Sub Librarian is like “don’t assume this is true/correct” lollll.

[levlies889]

Actually I think i will be taking the higgledy-piggledy whale statements for veritable gospel cetology, thank you very much

[garden-ghoul]

AS PROMISED, PLINY, I am listening to Moby Dick. I’m SO sad I can’t tag this “dick blog” because tumblr would probably decide it’s Unsafe. Anyway I’ll be commenting on some of my favorite extracts.

It will be seen that this mere painstaking burrower and grub-worm of a poor devil of a Sub-Sub appears to have gone through the long Vaticans and street-stalls of the earth, picking up whatever random allusions to whales he could anyways find in any book whatsoever, sacred or profane. Therefore you must not, in every case at least, take the higgledy-piggledy whale statements, however authentic, in these extracts, for veritable gospel cetology.

HIGGLEDY-PIGGLEDY WHALE STATEMENTS. spurious fish documents. I do have to say, though, that “multilingual dictionary containing only the word whale + random unrelated quotations about whales” is like the worst possible way to start a book if you want anyone to read it. If I had to read this with my eyes I’d be mad, but listening to it, it’s starting to feel like... a collage. I am in fact a huge fan of collage so I support him. I want someone to make a corkboard containing all of these quotes.

That was absolutely an entire half hour of unconnected whale quotes though.

okay time for CHAPTER ONE

...whenever it is a damp, drizzly November in my soul; whenever I find myself involuntarily pausing before coffin warehouses, and bringing up the rear of every funeral I meet...

Hey this is very goth of you, Ishmael. I approve.

Oh he’s talking about how if you just set someone walking they’ll walk to water. He doesn’t seem to realize that this is because people prefer to walk downhill, and so does water. That said, this is the Only way I navigate anywhere. “I abominate ALL honorable respectable toil,” he says. Oh. This is also goth.

Hey this long section where he explains that he prefers to get money over giving other people money... is this some kind of... satire? He’s like, pretending that the reader has never considered that getting money is good?

CHAPTER TWO

Ishmael also owns some book about something that is the only extant copy. Hey, what’s that about. I know! He’s just a total weirdo! I like how utterly bizarre this person is! I hope we get some backstory on how he has educated himself.

Kay, that’s been about an hour. Chapter 3 later, maybe when I am once again too sleepy to stand or do anything.

[abzilp]

nose firmly pressed up against the sweetshop window The orc sat on the iron grill and inspected the ripples. coagulatory not slick Nameless Book

m john harrison's Viriconium book + blanchitsu + At Swim-Two-Birds + b. catling's mini egg tempera cyclopses and fantasy trilogy + higgledy-piggledy whale statements

[charaznablunt]

WHAT TUNE IS IT YE PULL TO, MEN???

A DEAD WHALE OR A STOVE BOAT!!!!!!

Whale Weekly-ers, welcome to the good shit. I mean, it's all been good, but now ... now you've met Old Thunder, and it's time for a podcast about it. Check out episode 11 of Higgledy-Piggledy Whale Statements for, among other things, a dramatic reading of some of Ahab's dialogue backed by sick metal guitars (specifically, Blood and Thunder by Mastodon). There's so much to delve into in these chapters - the religious/philosophical themes, the characterization, the language itself - it's no wonder this episode came out 40 minutes longer than any previous one. Please enjoy!

[probably-an-alien]

So yeasterday I listened to the episode where they discussed The Chase - Third Day and the epilogue and this killed me emotionally for a second time.

Honestly, this podcast has even enhanced that effect by giving me some better or more in-depth understandings.

Now I wanna cry about Starbuck on the third day of the chase abandoning all his christian or moral arguments and just begging Ahab to stay on the ship and not go after Moby Dick.

In general I have a lot of feelings about Starbuck in those last few chapters.

All you dickheads out there need to listen to Higgledy-Piggledy Whale Statements!

It's such a great podcast. Each episode the hosts Ben Klug and Mark Sokolov analyse one or a couple of chapters from Moby-Dick and go really in-depth on so many of the details and deeper themes in the text.

Here's a link to episode 01:

[charaznablunt]

Ahhh, The Whiteness of the Whale. My favorite chapter! There's so much here that undergirds the entire book, so much that communicates the incommunicable - or at least tries. Ben and I got into a lively debate this episode of Higgledy-Piggledy Whale Statements! Please enjoy my podcast, Whale Weekly!

[charaznablunt]

Higgledy-Piggledy Whale Statements returns to Whale Weekly!

Hello again, Whale Weekly! It's been a while since I said hi and Ishmael sure has been through a lot. I'm one half of a Moby Dick podcast called Higgledy-Piggledy Whale Statements! We read the entire book and discussed it chapter by chapter, and I've been posting each episode here as Whale Weekly catches up to it. … Except I forgot last time. So this time I have two episodes for you!

First of all, episode 9, our Cetology episode. Remember a month ago, when Cetology hit you like a fish to the face? Well, it hit us hard too, hard enough that we talked about it for an hour and a half straight.

And second, episode 10, which covers everything from then to now, chapters 33-35. Get our in-depth take on the hierarchy of the Pequod's officers (down to our poor butterless man) and Ishmael's mast-head philosophizing.

I hope you enjoy!

[charaznablunt]

New podcast from the Whale Statements team!

Exciting news: Ben and I have started a new podcast! It's called Starboard Vineyard Tours and it's about science fiction studies. Every month we'll be reading and discussing a piece of nonfiction writing on science fiction. Our first episode is on Samuel R. Delany's foundational essay "About 5,750 Words". If you've ever wondered: "what's actually happening when I read?" or "what makes science fiction different from other genres?" or "what does the word 'the' look like", you can listen to our first episode to find out!