#hashtag good dad Ras Al Ghul

[fredricwertham]

See I personally think Ra/Dick has a lot of opportunities as a terrible bad abusive dick ship especially since he finds dick funny that would be the only redeeming aspect of their toxic codependent relationship that mirrors brudick in some sick and twisted way and if most of the Wayne's are obsessed with dick so should the Al ghuls, it's poetry it rhymes

I definitely see where you’re coming from anon but one of the things that’s so funny about their dynamic to me is the fact that Ras is typically pretty normal about Dick. Which is weird! Ras is pretty much the Ur evil dad of the Batman mythos (if not the DC universe) so while characters like Slade *are* Batman derivatives, they also share a lot of DNA with him. This seems like it SHOULD place him at high risk of developing an obsession—but in practice Ras tends to give up on bugging Dickie pretty quickly and go bother Tim instead. To me this demonstrates that it IS possible for middle aged men to outgrow their Dickie G derangement syndrome, provided they stay alive for thousands and thousands of years 🩷

IMO more writers should foil Ras + Talia with Bruce + Dick, though. I’d looove that so so much.

[dyslexicandakeyboard]

While I am anti Talia, I've read the original comics and I've read Talia stans defences/arguments, so I'll give my two cents if thats okay.

Many Talia stans will state something like:

She tended to Bruce's injuries/really cared for him so she's actually good

She actually cares for Damian so she's actually good

She's an anti heroine so all the stuff she did was for good reason

She cares for rape victims and children so she's actually good

She's not actually evil like Ra's so she's actually good

It's a character assassination for works written post 90s and if you read the original interpretation she's an anti heroine so she's actually good

She's an environmentalist so she's actually good

If you've read the original comics (Tec 411, Batman 232 and 235 are just examples) you can see the appeal of Talia. As a morally gray villain, she brushes the line between good and evil and she willing to help the people she loves. During the early 2000's (President Lex), Talia became more of an anti heroine. This makes for a complex, compelling character with growth to back her up, something which fandom is said to loves(tho judging by her stans, it's debatable).

(While this may depend on whether the Talia stan is also an Al Ghul stan) There is also the abuse aspect of Talia's story. You'll find that Talia was raised to be an assassin by her dad, Ra's, and some people will say she was indoctrinated into the League. People relate to her due to this and want to she her overcome this and live a better life.

Then there is the reason that Talia is one of the few Arab (She's actually mixed Chinese/Arab, but I'll use Arab to be more concise plus people aren't all that normal about we mixed people lol) characters that DC have. By making Talia any type of bad, people for some reason think that makes her bad representation and thus need to defend her. (There is a valid point to it but this line of thought can lead us down a bad path)

All the things you said in the tags, many stans don't see a problem with anything you listed here or they erase it. Unless you state that Talia is abusive or a rapist(Not saying she is) in big bold letters, Talia stans will not see the action as bad. This is why a lot of the shit she got up to in past comics or modern comics is taken as 'hashtag girlbossing 😝🤪 she's so mother/she's such a good mother to x (ignores the gaslighting and manipulation)'.

Talia defenders and stans are weird subset of fans, like Deathstroke defenders/fans.

If this wasn't response isn't wanted please tell me, I'll delete it.

asking in a very neutral, gen way: what talia ever did in the comics to manage to gain fans/defenders? because everything i read just paints her as a villain and a bad mother, so...