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sideprince · 1 month

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Do you have any thoughts on how Snape would have acted if Harry had been sorted into Slytherin? While I can’t help but feel that there would be a part of him who would want to joyously gloat about James Potter’s son ending up in Slytherin, I can’t help but wonder if he wouldn’t still hold a mountain of resentment that would be incorrectly targeted towards Harry? Do you have any thoughts on this? Thanks!

I think one of the key aspects of Snape and Harry's relationship is that they don't really know each other and don't get a chance to. If you look at how the rest of the staff treat Snape, there seems to be respect for him and while I'm not sure how many of his colleagues actively like him, they certainly don't dislike him. We see this in how the rest of the staff treat teachers they don't like, such as Lockhart and Umbridge:

...Dumbledore announcing that, unfortunately, Professor Lockhart would be unable to return next year, owing to the fact that he needed to go away and get his memory back. Quite a few of the teachers joined in the cheering that greeted this news.

-Chamber of Secrets, Ch. 18

The upshot of it all was that Professor Umbridge spent her first afternoon as headmistress running all over the school answering the summonses of the other teachers, none of whom seemed able to rid their rooms of the fireworks without her. When the final bell rang and the students were heading back to Gryffindor Tower with their bags, Harry saw, with immense satisfaction, a disheveled and soot- blackened Umbridge tottering sweaty-faced from Professor Flitwick’s classroom. “Thank you so much, Professor!” said Professor Flitwick in his squeaky little voice. “I could have got rid of the sparklers myself, of course, but I wasn’t sure whether I had the authority...” Beaming, he closed his classroom door in her snarling face.

Order of the Phoenix, Ch. 28

This leads me to think that since the staff have had some opportunity to get to know Snape, even if it's superficially (given how guarded he is), their treatment of him indicates that he's not as terrible and repugnant as characters like Harry make him out to be. And while it's possible that they were deferential to him because he can be intimidating, I don't really see a bunch of talented, established Hogwarts professors cowering. After all, Umbridge had more authority than Dumbledore and even fired a staff member, but the rest of the teachers didn't seem to be affected by whether or not they were intimidated by her. They also literally took on Voldemort and his army to protect the school.

The reason Snape is able to project so much of James onto Harry is because they don't know each other outside of the classroom. This is the same reason why Harry is able to resent Snape so much. We see a chink in both their armors during Occlumency lessons in OoTP, as Harry shows curiosity and Snape encourages it, but before they can start to get a fuller picture of one another as people, Harry wrecks it by invading Snape's privacy when he goes into the pensieve. It's integral to the plot - and the big reveal at the end of DH - that these two characters maintain a resentful distance.

If Harry had been sorted into Slytherin, they would have had more of a chance to get to know each other. The same way Harry was told by other Gryffindors as soon as he started school that Snape was strict, mean, and played favorites, if he'd been sorted in Slytherin he would have been influenced by their bias in the other direction, ie. in favor of Snape (and potentially against McGonagall given the rivalry with Gryffindor). Whatever resentment Snape had against James would have had an opportunity to soften over time as he inevitably got to know Harry better.

By his fifth year Harry would have been sitting down with Snape, not McGonagall, to discuss his career ambitions, and as his head of house Snape would have known Harry enough to advise him. We see throughout the books that heads of house like McGonagall pay attention to students even if they don't interact with them all that much directly. Had Snape had the opportunity to do so with Harry, and had he been motivated by his role as his head of house to defend him where necessary, he would have gotten to know Harry as an individual enough that whatever of James that rested in Harry's facial features would have fallen by the wayside.

That's only one part of how Snape relates to Harry, though. He's vocal about James, his friends, and his hatred of them, but he never mentions Lily once. We know Snape is a guarded man who frowns on wearing your heart on your sleeve:

‘I told you to empty yourself of emotion!’ ‘Yeah? Well, I’m finding that hard at the moment,’ Harry snarled. ‘Then you will find yourself easy prey for the Dark Lord!’ said Snape savagely. ‘Fools who wear their hearts proudly on their sleeves, who cannot control their emotions, who wallow in sad memories and allow themselves to be provoked so easily - weak people, in other words - they stand no chance against his powers! He will penetrate your mind with absurd ease, Potter!’ ‘I am not weak,’ said Harry in a low voice, fury now pumping through him so that he thought he might attack Snape in a moment. ‘Then prove it! Master yourself!’ spat Snape.

-Order of the Phoenix, Ch. 24

So it's no surprise that he doesn't mention Lily. He protected Harry at risk to his own life for the sake of honoring Lily's sacrifice. Clearly their friendship meant the world to him and left an impact, and because it's so tied up in emotion for him, Snape never talks about it. He isn't the kind of man to show emotion willingly, as we know. He smirks, he speaks softly when angry, he hisses, and he only loses the tight grip he has on expressing his feelings when he's triggered. There's a fair bit of information on the page about his relationship with James and how he feels about it, and how much of it he projects onto Harry (though I think that diminishes significantly from OotP on, especially after Sirius' death), but nothing at all about Lily except in his very private moments with Dumbledore.

What's even less straightforward is how much of Lily he sees in Harry. I wonder whether this was intentional on the author's part, but I'm curious whether Snape might get angry when Harry sasses him and talks back because his personality is so much like his mother's. So while there isn't much to go on, I think it's interesting to consider whether if Harry had been sorted into Slytherin, Snape might not have seen more of Lily in him given the opportunity to get to know each other a bit, and whether he might not have appreciated that about him.

#asks #meta #greysleipnir

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sideprince · 2 months

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Hello hello, love your blog and all the meta! Do you have any thoughts or saved meta on Snape’s accent? I don’t remember us seeing any indications in book-canon about him having an accent that stands out in any way, but I’d imagine that a poor boy growing up in the midlands (or in the north, as we thought before Spinner’s End was revealed to be in Cokeworth), to have a strong regional accent. Since this is an obvious class marker would he have tried to tone it down or hide it as he got older in Hogwarts? Thoughts?

Hello! Thank you, I'm always surprised anyone reads my posts so that's such a nice thing to hear! I've actually been thinking about Snape's accent lately so I love this ask and also get out of my head.

The books seem to show Snape speaking the Queen's English (ie. the dialect spoken primarily in the South of England and considered by some to be "proper" English, those people being dismissive of regional dialects in ways I personally don't agree with). This can be deduced more from seeing how the dialogue of characters like Dobby and Hagrid are written than anything else. Hagrid is written as speaking with a thick West Country accent, with a lot of "yeh" instead of "you" and "ter" instead of "to" etc. You also see similar clearly denoted regional dialects with characters like Mundungus Fletcher (whose accent is Cockney):

“Blimey,” said Mundungus weakly ___ “Keep your ’airnet on!” said Mundungus

-Order of the Phoenix, Ch. 2

“Well, you’re a bunch of bleedin’ ‘eroes, then, aren’t you, but I never pretended I was up for killing meself -”

-Deathly Hallows, Ch. 11

Because we see these characters with their pronunciations clearly written into their dialogue, we're meant to assume the other characters speak the Queen's English, as no specific dialect is otherwise indicated. McGonagall is Scottish but it's never mentioned that her accent might be as well, and her dialogue doesn't indicate it is either. In fact, if you do a quick search on potter-search.com for the word "Scottish" the only instance that comes up in any of the HP books - which are set in the Scottish Highlands with McGonagall as a prominent Scottish character - is at the end of Deathly Hallows when the dragon the trio break out of Gringotts deposits them in the middle of a Scottish loch. It’s the only time the word Scottish is used in the whole series. I think that says a lot about JK Rowling as the writer and what her own biases are when it comes to writing representatively of the places her story - and its characters - inhabit.

I don't think Rowling put that much thought into Snape's accent and where he's from. The underlying message is that the Queen's English is the "default" accent and peppering her books with regional dialect in the dialogue of folksy characters like Hagrid gives them a bit of color, or that giving someone like Mundungus a Cockney accent denotes his being an untrustworthy criminal (and it's not exactly a revelation that she has unchecked internalized biases that show through her writing). But I also think that she wrote Snape with Alan Rickman in mind and that made her vision of him a bit conflicting, ie. she wrote his backstory as growing up in a Midlands slum and yet he speaks like the RADA trained actor she envisioned him as in her mind.

That won't stop me from coming up with meta about Snape's accent, though! I've been thinking about it lately, actually, because I see a lot of posts that talk about how he must have lost his accent at school to fit in with the other Slytherins, since there are, historically, many pure-bloods and Sacred 28 families in that house and he would have had a hard enough time fitting in as it was. I've always thought these theories made sense but lately I've been wondering if there could be an alternate reading of Snape's accent.

We don't really know much about Snape's mother but I've thought about how she might have come from a reasonably well-off wizarding family, or at the very least from a higher class background than she ended up raising her son in. Although most Brits grow up speaking with the accent of their region, some do grow up speaking how they're taught to at home if it diverges from other locals. The example that comes to mind is how John Lennon always had a scouse accent having grown up middle class in Liverpool, while Paul McCartney - also from Liverpool - spoke the Queen's English because his mother insisted on teaching him to speak it at home, despite their family being working class, in order to give him a leg up through the classist confines of British social classes.

So my own meta has lately been to play with the idea that Snape always spoke with the accent we see his adult self speaking with, because his mother wanted him to have a chance to do better in life than what she was able to give him (again, given how classist British society is, and was especially back in the 60s). It may also explain why he had so few friends as a child: if he was raised to speak the Queen's English in a working class slum, the other children may have ostracized him for it and he may have inadvertently alienated them.

The idea that Snape has always spoken with the accent he has as an adult is partly supported by the conversations we see between Snape and Lily as children, where Snape's accent isn't written in the regional dialects we see other characters having. There are a few minor moments where young Snape seems to have a Northern lilt, but it comes off more as something that slips into his speech than characterizes it, when compared to Mundungus or Hagrid (emphases mine):

‘We’re all right. We haven’t got wands yet. They let you off when you’re a kid and you can’t help it. But once you’re eleven,’ he nodded importantly, ‘and they start training you, then you’ve got to go careful.’ ______ ‘They wouldn’t give you to the Dementors for that! Dementors are for people who do really bad stuff. They guard the wizard prison, Azkaban. You’re not going to end up in Azkaban, you’re too -‘ He turned red again and shredded more leaves. Then a small rustling noise behind Harry made him turn: Petunia, hiding behind a tree, had lost her footing. ‘Tuney!’ said Lily, surprise and welcome in her voice, but Snape had jumped to his feet. ‘Who’s spying now?’ he shouted. ‘What d’you want?’

-Deathly Hallows, Ch. 33

There's a bit of Northern in how he says "you've got to go careful" and shortens "do you" into "d'you" but overall his speech is fairly standard Queen's English. It sounds more like a kid trying to sound cool, the way the Weasley twins and even Ron often do (Ron saying "geroff" to his mum, the twins shouting "oy" to each other or saying "blimey" even though they all grew up in Devon and their speech is generally also written following standard Queen's English).

Young Snape's accent may also have been something that caught Lily's attention or just put her at ease - seeing this skinny, twitchy kid wearing odd looking clothes and looking uncared for and poor but hearing him speak with a more familiar accent and vocabulary would have made it easier for her to connect with him. We see from Petunia's dialogue as an adult that she speaks the Queen's English, so we can assume the two girls grew up speaking it at home. There aren't really any colloquialisms in her speech, and what little (and it's really so, so little) we see of Lily seems to show the same.

Some people claim that Snape’s Northern accent comes out when he's triggered, but I can't find examples of it. At his most triggered in the Shrieking Shack in PoA, he still speaks as he always does:

'SILENCE! I WILL NOT BE SPOKEN TO LIKE THAT!’ Snape shrieked, looking madder than ever. ‘Like father, like son, Potter! I have just saved your neck, you should be thanking me on bended knee! You would have been well served if he’d killed you! You’d have died like your father, too arrogant to believe you might be mistaken in Black - now get out of the way, or I will make you. GET OUT OF THE WAY, POTTER!'

-Prisoner of Azkaban, Ch. 19

Even in HBP when he's fleeing and Harry triggers him, his speech is consistent with hiw it’s written through the rest of the series:

'No, Potter!’ screamed Snape. There was a loud BANG and Harry was soaring backwards, hitting the ground hard again, and this time his wand flew out of his hand. He could hear Hagrid yelling and Fang howling as Snape closed in and looked down on him where he lay, wandless and defenceless as Dumbledore had been. Snape’s pale face, illuminated by the flaming cabin, was suffused with hatred just as it had been before he had cursed Dumbledore. ‘You dare use my own spells against me, Potter? It was I who invented them - I, the Half-Blood Prince! And you’d turn my inventions on me, like your filthy father, would you? I don’t think so … no!’ Harry had dived for his wand; Snape shot a hex at it and it flew feet away into the darkness and out of sight. ‘Kill me, then,’ panted Harry, who felt no fear at all, but only rage and contempt. ‘Kill me like you killed him, you coward -‘ ‘DON’T -‘ screamed Snape, and his face was suddenly demented, inhuman, as though he was in as much pain as the yelping, howling dog stuck in the burning house behind them, ‘- CALL ME COWARD!'

-Half-Blood Prince, Ch. 28

There isn't really much in these moments to suggest a Northern accent coming out. So in a radical departure from the fandom, I've been mulling over the meta that Snape always had the accent we see him with. It's not as unlikely as people think, and certainly not impossible.

#Asks #meta #greysleipnir

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