#given Phoenix and Kristoph's relationship in canon and all

[astrahannah]

The two poly ships involving Phoenix, Miles and someone, that I thought of and caught my curiosity (I only ship them with Larry though)

[oodlyenough]

apollo justice: ace attorney thoughts

over the weekend I finished playing AA4 so I wanted to try to put my thoughts in order. much to think about etc

spoilers for the whole game obv, but i haven't played AA5 or AA6 yet so any mention of those are speculation lol

I had heard some pretty mixed reactions to AA4 and I had a lot of reservations going in. It's also probably the AA game I've played that I've been the most spoiled for, which is a shame but probably an unavoidable consequence of waiting for the port while engaging with the fandom. I don't usually like being spoiled but I think knowing the broad strokes of what to expect actually helped here. I can imagine an AU where I blitzed through the first trilogy and onto 4 with no idea of what was coming and being... very upset and disappointed by the direction it took. Having several months to brace for things like Phoenix's disbarment, the 7 year gap, Trucy, etc definitely softened those blows and made me more amenable to them than I would've been otherwise.

Cases

For the most part I thought the puzzle solving was good and the pacing was solid. The puzzles were mostly challenging enough to be satisfying to solve but not so challenging as to be infuriating, and I don't think I needed a walkthrough at all. 4-1 is one of the best tutorial cases in the franchise so far (though I'd give the edge to 3-1) and 4-4 was a really cool finale. The middle two cases tbh I also found fairly charming, and there's usually a least one case in the middle that seems to drag forever, so that was a pleasant surprise. I played Investigations 1 right before this, and I thought both the puzzles and pacing in that game were frankly horrible, so AA4 won a lot of points just with that.

I did think Turnabout Corner and Serenade would be more relevant in the grand scheme of things. The half-spoilers I knew had me expecting a much bigger web of conspriacy than we ended up with -- I expected it to be more than coincidence that Phoenix got hit by a car, more than coincidence that the Borginian egg coccoons are related to poison etc ... like... I fully assumed this was going to tie into the atroquinine plot. But I guess not ... ? Lol

Characters

The new main cast are all very likable, despite my initial reluctance to have a new main cast to begin with. Klavier was an interesting change of pace as prosecutor, in that he wasn't particularly antagonistic outside of the court, nor was he particularly preoccupied with winning, but he was still fun and challenging enough to face off against. Trucy was fun and delightfully bonkers as all assistants should be. Apollo's longsuffering exasperation was hilarious. Ema is the BEST I loved having her as the detective I wish she was there all the time.

I loved Beanix, for the most part. I can see why he rubs some people the wrong way, and tbh I'm glad his last canon outing isn't ... this. But I didn't find him wildly out of character, or at least, when he was feeling "out of character" vs the trilogy it made sense given the intervening events. I also thought it was fun to see him from the outside and see what a galaxybrain 5d chess master he is. I do wish we'd gotten to see more genuine moments of him with Trucy.

Kristoph was fun as a villain, though I have to say fandom led me to believe he was much more of a mastermind puppeteer than he seemed to be in reality. I was expecting a whole decade worth of conspiracies! Instead he fucked up once and struggled to fix it for seven years, lol. I also found the Kristoph/Phoenix relationship a) very fascinating, b) not really what I'd been led to believe by fandom (shocker). I like the canon more though -- I like that instead of being a retread of the Dollie betrayal-from-someone-you-love it was two guys who hate each other being forced to play nice as part of their own schemes.

Criticism

I think it's fairly obvious AA4 was meant to be a soft reboot of the series, to pivot away from the trilogy cast and set up our new heroes in Apollo, Trucy, and I guess Klavier. I think this is probably the entire explanation behind Maya and Edgeworth (and others but lbr those are the big two)'s conspicuous absence... but that doesn't make their absence any less conspicuous. I can squint and forgive neither of them being there when Phoenix is accused of murder, even though I find that insane. I can squint around Maya maybe being off in Kurain during the Enigmar trial, even though I think they could've used a line of dialogue to explain it. But then we started playing past-Phoenix for huge portions of investigation and that started to fall apart for me. Sure, maybe he's pushing his friends away because he's depressed, or maybe he wants to keep Maya out of things because he thinks it's dangerous, or whatever -- you could at least throw in a line or two saying as much. Not mentioning them at all and setting AA4 so closely after AA3, where Phoenix fell through a bridge to save Maya and Edgeworth chartered a private jet, just feels ridiculous.

I also think, at the end of the day, the story here was focused on and pivoting around Phoenix. The core question of the game is "what the hell happened to/is up with Phoenix Wright?" I love Phoenix, so that alone isn't a negative -- except that I think it meant Apollo, Klavier and even Trucy felt underwritten. Trucy and Klavier have such personal stakes in the unfolding events with the Gramaryes and Kristoph, but we only spend a little time and hints on how that might influence Trucy, who mostly falls into the AA weird girl pattern of brushing off major trauma instantly. (Maya got this a lot too in the original trilogy.)

Klavier ... I like Klavier, but they did not do much with him. How did he feel about Kristoph going to jail? He doesn't seem to hold it against Apollo, which is uh, noble, but perhaps not believable. He says he values honesty and truth but do we know why?

Apollo, likable as he was, felt like a passenger in his "own" game, rather than a major character. He doesn't even solve much of the stuff happening in the big overarching mystery -- he is Phoenix's avatar in court, presenting evidence and clues Phoenix left for him. Unlike Trucy and Klavier, who I am pretty sure take a back seat from now on, I guess Apollo still has two more games to try and flesh himself out ... lol but I also know fan reception of those two is not great, so my expectations there are minimal.

Overall

A really solid game that I enjoyed playing, though I can see why it's controversial and not some people's favourite, if they really loved the trilogy. I think it's debatable whether this was the best/only way to continue the series after AA3. And I am excited to read and write a billion 7 year gap fics now.

[notmoreflippingelves]

Krisnix and cykesquill?

Krisnix (I Ship it)

What made you ship it?

Projecting onto Kristoph. I first started to be curious about the ship at about the same time that I got into the fandom a few years ago. Discovering the k*nk meme was pretty groundbreaking for me in terms of introducing me to a lot of ships that I might not otherwise have considered. (As I believe I've mentioned, I'm pretty indifferent to both narumayo and narumitsu so I was definitely looking for other pairings to get into besides the obvious slash option and obvious het option). Krisnix started appealing to me pretty quickly due to the inherent tragedy and drama of such a ship. However, it took me finding fanworks that leaned more into Kristoph as a comedic and/or tragic character (as opposed to just him as the designated evil villain in endgame narumitsu) and emphasized his vulnerabilities that really got me into the pairing. I really credit the Count of Monte Cristo AU, the Frozen AU, and these two pieces of fan art for really getting me to latch onto a more nuanced, emotional Kristoph and to the ship.

2. What are your favorite things about the ship?

As a former English major, I tend to get feral over ships that utilize some of my favorite literary devices. And there is so much to work with for krisnix. The "doomed by the narrative" trope, particularly given that the fact that Kristoph's actions even before they met inevitably doomed any relationship (romantic or otherwise) that they might have had before it even began. Not to mention Phoenix's savior complex vs. the man who it is too late to save.

There's this sense of Kristoph as a dark mirror/foil of Phoenix, and given that Kristoph's influence canonically brings out a very dark side ( hidden cameras, forgeries, manipulation) of the otherwise "heroic" Phoenix, I like to contemplate that the reverse may have been true as well--that Phoenix's "light" might have penetrated Kristoph's darkness even if only a little and if it was already too late. The yin-yang potential fascinates me. I also love the fire and ice imagery motif that surrounds them.

I also love the intriguing possibilities of the 7-year gap--the opportunities for closeness, catching feelings in spite of one's self in a way that is all but inevitable when you spend so much time together, the idea of Kristoph at least somewhat co-parenting Trucy with Phoenix, wondering exactly how much of their "dinners" were genuinely for mutual surveillance and how much was because they grew to enjoy each other's company, speculating as to when Phoenix realized Kristoph was involved in his disbarment (my headcanon is less than a year) and if Kristoph ever realized Phoenix was on to him.

They're also so weird about each other in a way that's so interesting to me. The solitary cell scene is frankly bizarre in a lot of ways, but I am always taken aback by how quickly the two of them fall into their old rapport. Kristoph is literally in a jail cell because of Phoenix, and yet they are super polite and friendly to each other. Honestly, Kristoph in this scene seems far more upset about the idea that Phoenix's "friendship" might have had ulterior motives from the start than he is about the fact that said false "friendship" resulted in Kristoph's incarceration. (Phoenix's bringing up their friendship, trying to snoop in Kristoph's mail, and questioning why Kristoph killed Zak are the only times in this scene that Kristoph's facade slips. Otherwise, they're just bantering like old times. Why are they this weird? I don't get it but I love it anyway).

I also love a lot of the relationship tropes that the ship plays into: uptight loves impulsive; repressed loves outspoken; contrasting visual aesthetics; fake relationship/becoming the mask; foe yay; things we left unsaid; the enemies-to-friends-to-lovers-and-not-necessarily-in that-order pipeline. It's all so good.

3. Is there an unpopular opinion you have on your ship?

The unpopularity of this opinion has fluctuated over time, but when I first started shipping krisnix, there were really strong fanon for all of the following: 1. Top and/or Dom Kristoph who liked subjecting poor poor Phoenix to times that were neither fully safe, fully sane, and/or fully consensual. 2. Helpless cinnamon roll woobie Phoenix who has NO IDEA about Kristoph's various crimes until a Savior™ (usually Miles, occasionally Apollo, Trucy, or Maya) comes and explains the plot to him even though canon implies he puts this together on his own and pretty quickly. 3. Kristoph is a generic sociopath incapable of any real feeling and diabolically clever who gets off solely on POWAH and does evil for evil's sake.

None of these headcanons/interpretations had any appeal or rang true for me, so it was hard for me to interact even with some of the people who shipped it because they shipped in in the opposite way/ for opposite reasons that I did. I even had someone tell me in no uncertain terms that I was shipping it "wrong" for headcanoning a more vulnerable, conflicted, nuanced Kristoph who wasn't a pure one-dimensional generic villain, who had real and genuine feelings (both for Phoenix and in general) , and who was overall more likely to be submissive and/or a bottom than dominant and/or a top.

As I have said, fanon de jour has fluctuated significantly overtime and more and more people who headcanon/prefer a Kristoph more similar to the version that I enjoy have come out of the woodworks and shared their fanworks/head canons/meta with the world. (*Waves affectionately to all my beloved krisnix frens and mutuals. You know who you are. *) That being said, with the release of the AA 4-6 Trilogy port, I have noticed another shift within the larger fandom towards the "Hello Naughty Phoenix, It's Murder Time" Kristoph interpretation again, which makes me rather sad/anxious. I just wanna be able to project onto and shamelessly woobify the pathetic blond blorbo without worrying about people telling me I'm not allowed in the krisnix sandbox anymore. And like I think I'm probably safe enough but there's still a little fear.

Cykesquill (I Ship It...albeit much more casually)

What made you ship it?

A combination of being somewhat indifferent about the fandom-preferred ships for them (Juniper or occasionally Apollo for Athena; Nahyuta for Blackquill) , the fact that I already actively shipped Athena in a similar-ish pairing that is just as (if not more) "problematic," and the fact that telling me I am not "allowed" to ship something/shouldn't ship is far more likely to encourage me to ship it than actively deter me. Also I project pretty heavily onto Athena so naturally I'd be drawn towards ships that are narratively and thematically interesting for her.

What are your favorite things about the ship?

I tend to be especially drawn towards ships that are (or have the potential to be) agents of narrative/character development for the characters as individuals. And this is especially the case for Athena and Simon. They were quite literally created with and for each other.

You can't really think or talk about Simon Blackquill without first talking about Athena Cykes--about the fact he was willing to risk and even give up his life to protect a sensitive, frightened child from an experience (prison and/or execution) that would've destroyed everything about her. You can't really think or talk about Athena Cykes without talking about Simon Blackquill--about the brave, kind young man who comforted and protected her when no one else would but who wouldn't let her comfort and protect him back.

Everyone always talks about the impact that narumitsu have on each other, and I'll admit that they do. But the thing is...there are other people in Phoenix's and Miles' lives that have had as greater or greater an impact on each of them than they have on each other. (Mia, Maya, Dahlia, Trucy, debatably Larry, Apollo, or Kristoph for Phoenix; Gregory, von Karma, Gant, and debatably Kay, Gumshoe, and Ziska for Miles).

For Athena and Simon, there's really no contest, they are the single most important and impactful person in each other's life. Yes, Apollo, Phoenix, and Juniper also influenced Athena. Yes, Fullbright, Metis Aura, and the spoiler character also influenced Simon. But none of them did so to the level that Athena and Simon influenced each other. To quote Wicked, "Who can say if I've been changed for the better? (I do believe I have been changed for the better.) But because I knew you, I have been changed for good." That's it; that's them.

Additionally, they do have some other tropes that I enjoy: grump and sunshine (though Athena is so much more complex and complicated than just a "sunshine" and Simon can also be much more playful than the typical grump); the couple that saves each other; contrasting visual aesthetics; height difference; "we're both hella neurodivergent albeit in different ways,"

Is there an unpopular opinion you have on your ship?

The fact that it's a valid ship in the first place? I've legit seen the argument that you can't ship it because hypothetical future step-incest. Which is absurd in and of itself but especially cause it's presuming a reality that could not possibly exist. One where Metis not only lives (so we're starting off very canon-divergent) but also returns Aura's feelings, assumes that because they love each other that they would of course have to get married (which not every couple want) and therefore Simon now is hypothetically Athena's step-uncle in the future and this possible reality should be treated as such even if it doesn't exist. And just if you have to conceive of so many steps in order to justify why not to ship a pairing, maybe your case against isn't as strong as you think. Also very curious to hear what OP thinks of double-in-law marriages (ex: Person A marries Person B and then Person B's sibling marries A's sibling) because like those exist in real life???

send me a ship and I’ll answer three questions based on if I ship it or not.

[selfdestructivecat]

Do u ship krisnix? Ik they're kind of seen as the worst ship in aa and I don't think they're healthy or anything, but I'd love to delve into the tragedy of their relationship before AJ and betrayal and them becoming salty exes and all that mess.

Idk lmk what u think

I mean, I’ll be honest… I REALLY don’t like this ship. Absolutely nothing against people who ship them, of course! I guess I’m just a bit too attached to Narumitsu, and I’ve never been a fan of ships that end in tragedy (because I’m a big baby that can’t handle too much angst lol)

But you are absolutely right about the potential of this ship! LOTS of potential for angst! And I’ll admit, the two of them playing mind games with each other in between jabs referencing their past fallout is absolutely hilarious.

However, in my personal headcanon, this ship never happened, since I headcanon that Edgeworth was always by Nick’s side during the 7 year gap (whether he was there in person or was a simple phone call away), so there wouldn’t be much of an opportunity or reason for Nick to develop feelings for someone else. If Edgeworth was a bit more distant, which is very possible given how little we know about the 7 years in canon, I can see this ship being much more viable.

Kristoph was the only person who sided with Phoenix after he presented false evidence, after all. And Phoenix hadn’t yet been hardened by all those years struggling to make ends meet and to care for his daughter. So it’s possible that he may have trusted Kristoph, even if he knew someone was out to get him.

But what really causes this ship to fall apart for me is the magatama.

Actions do speak louder than words, that much is true. And Kristoph’s grand gesture of good faith towards Phoenix may be enough to get on his good side… at least at first. But how long until the facade slips? How long until Kristoph says something mid-conversation that triggers the sound of chains and locks? Kristoph may be a fantastic liar, but not even he can shield his heart from the power of the magatama.

And still… even if they didn’t have the time to develop a proper romantic relationship, even if their FRIENDSHIP had only the fledglings of a foundation…

Isn’t that still absolutely soul-crushing? To be given one small ray of light after being cast into darkness, to find someone who seems to be completely on your side, only to realize that they are just as two-faced as everyone else?

No wonder Nick changed so much.

[twinkle-art]

Please give me all the headcannons you have your perspective on the miles Phoenix Kristoph relationship I am fascinated.

alright so. welcome to my twisted mind i guess

first and foremost i think the most crucial element to this whole mess is that i don’t think all three of them were in a room together even once. like it just did not happen and it really did not help the “nobody is talking to each other or is even remotely on the same page”-ness of it all. (even phoenix and miles, who were ostensibly on the same side the whole time, were very much not in sync at this time)

regarding phoenix and miles in this era, i think they were very much marinating in the specific sort of drama that is formed when two people who are thoroughly devoted to each other just will not be normal and communicate about it. it seems right to me that phoenix would consider the whole kristoph mess to be his problem and wouldn’t want miles getting involved just for his sake, meanwhile miles “That Man saved me etc etc etc” edgeworth is obviously not going to just let it stand either (this is tangentially related to my many thoughts about how post-aai2 miles was getting up to all sorts of stuff in the name of fulfilling his legal system-altering ambitions, including playing politics that likely wouldn’t benefit from his known devotion to a certain publicly-disgraced defense attorney but let’s just put a pin in that one)

now i DO think this was when they really ramped up being in cahoots in other regards, given that it feels right to me that if phoenix was gonna get the necessary sway to pull off the jurist system from anywhere, there’s a pretty obvious answer for that, AND since it’s canon that miles was involved in phoenix recovering his badge (debatably ethical collusion IS a love language) however i feel like the elephant-slash-devil in the room remained glossed over and talked around

so anyways kristoph and miles fascinate me. technically this was spun entirely from nothing and YET!! the fact that they are presumably both prominent figures in the same circles and are completely fixated on the same man in opposite ways feels too glaring to overlook. i find it very hard to believe nothing ever came of that. they had to have shown up at the same function at least once i think

i wouldn’t say miles is the type that is a natural at the art of subtle intimate manipulation like, at all, but i do think he would try his damnedest if he had reason to believe it might facilitate the downfall of the man who ruined phoenix’s life and got away with it for years. that being said kristoph would likely see through his reasons for seeking him out immediately (because again. i feel like his connection to phoenix must be common knowledge or at LEAST well-established gossip around here) BUT still play along with whatever polite little games miles offers him. this is because he’s a freak, and probably likes the thrill of it all, and his hubris will be his downfall

the level of spice this angle has is up to your personal tastes. mine is between me and god

simultaneous to all of this phoenix and kristoph are still doing whatever it is they do. going on year five or six or something of do-you-know-i-know-that-you-know-i-know type “““friendship””” (exaggerated wink) that’s digging them ever deeper into this mess. phoenix has a whole kid he’s trying to keep away from this so there’s another part of his life he’s neatly compartmentalized. kristoph is definitely losing his mind by now so i don’t think even he’s having fun anymore but he’s committed to the bit and won’t stop now.

where kristoph is concerned, i can see him being misguidedly confident in his concurrent games with phoenix and miles, probably to the tune of thinking he can use the latter against the former (the one he actually gives a shit about). he would be completely wrong about this, mind you, but that’s the miscalculation that leads to him letting miles in close enough to exacerbate (gestures to aa4) all of that from the background. i think he prosecuted him in the end because that’s sexy and lied through his teeth about conflict of interest to do it

in conclusion. love wins. even if both you and your law rival soulmate were playing dirty with the devil independant of each other to get to that point

[vickyvicarious]

Hi Vicky,

I feel like what I may ask may end up annoying BUT do you know any good metas/analyses on Phoenix Wright as a character

Since the games have his name in the title when I try to look I get every character like maya, miles, etc

- Have a Great Day and Thank you if you do have some -

Anon this is not annoying at all. I love Phoenix, and there really isn't as much meta about him as there should be! At least, not that I've seen. I didn't have a lot on hand (to be fair I don't have a lot of AA meta in general since I only started interacting with the fandom outside the kinkmeme recently, but still), so you've inspired me to go searching around a little. Several of these are just short little snippets but I think they give some good insight on Phoenix so I included them.

I would also love to read more Phoenix meta, so if anyone has some more recs, please feel free to reblog and share them!

Most of my Leverage/AA crossover convos veer into Phoenix meta a little, namely in talking about how his character would relate to those from Leverage and especially Sophie. On a more canon level there's this little bit contrasting Phoenix and Edgeworth's different kinds of intelligence, and this followup presenting evidence

Phoenix tricking Kristoph into reacting to the bloody ace

Phoenix/Iris dynamic thoughts. A little more focused on Iris but still good for Phoenix too when you consider the impact.

Phoenix has attachment issues

Depressive/seeking motivation from others Phoenix

Why didn't Phoenix prove he was set up for the false evidence?

Yanni Yogi parallels during AJ

Phoenix's anger over Edgeworth's 'death' (which I've always seen him feeling responsible for. He thought he saved Edgeworth and then just left him be, and look what happened. That could be a whole meta on its own, Phoenix feeling responsible for others)

Phoenix taking in Trucy

Ron + Desiree Delite parallels

His relationship with Apollo vs. Athena

Conflict with 'finding the truth'

Believing in vs. idealizing people, and also how emotional he is

Feenie to Phoenix to Beanix character design

this huge wrightworth essay that I keep meaning to read but haven't gotten around to yet. It looks good but I can't speak to how much of it is just about Phoenix given the ship focus overall.

I swear I've read a really good take on the whole "Phoenix didn't tell Apollo and Trucy they were related" thing that goes into his relationships and also him considering Thalassa, but I can't remember the details or find it again. I also feel like there was something about his childhood I read once that was interesting? Don't know where those are.

the significance of the class trial

this great conversation on distrust/wanting to trust. also control

There's other stuff I'm thinking of too that I don't have a specific meta rec for, like Phoenix's tendency to assume personal responsibility for stuff, how he clings to Mia's teachings and in general to people who have faith in him, his loyalty, how he almost never admits to his own hurt and puts on as much of a happy mask as Maya really, a look at him wanting to protect people but only so far sometimes, his relationships with Maya and Trucy and Pearl... I have thoughts on all of these too.

[three--rings]

Can you imagine any of your OTPs being in a poly or open relationship? I'd love to here your thoughts on which and why yes or not.

I’ve been sitting on this ask for a while, just, like, putting off actually answering it.

So, first off I’m a BIG fan of triads/threesomes in general.  Less so just wide open relationships, though I’m not, like AGAINST it.  Just less personally interested in it.  (I’ve seen SO MUCH poly drama in my RL that though people I love and care about are dedicated to that life, I kinda want to scream and run the opposite direction.)

But let’s get specific: Wangxian...nope.  They are both FAR too possessive to ever make that work.  Like I try to imagine it working on even a really limited, one-time kinda basis and just...nope, Lan Wangji would lose his shit.

My other MDZS OTP is 3zun, which basically already qualifies.  I could even imagine it being more open than just the three of them in the right situation.  They are already so complicated and messy with the various emotional connections between them you might as well add more.

Wenzhou, my current obsession, mmm, Wen Kexing is canonically jealous as fuck and vaguely murderous towards anyone ZZS even talks nicely to, so...probably not.  Though after a certain period of established relationship, POSSIBLY I could see them involving someone else in, like, a kinky way.  Probably not someone emotionally important, but a temporary partner perhaps.

Victuuri...that’s an interesting question.  I think they may somehow be the most emotionally mature of all my OTPs, SOMEHOW, and so...perhaps.  I could see it but probably not having equal emotional connection to each other.  More like maybe sleeping with a friend sort of thing, I could definitely see them going in that direction.  But actually DATING anyone else I can’t see.

Other OTPS:

Narumitsu aka Phoenix Wright/Miles Edgeworth (the forever OTP) - It really depends on what you headcanon as the progress of their relationship because they have what could be either a five year gap where they very well may have dated other people OR they could have been long distance during that time and I could see being open as well.  I know the people who have Wright with Kristophe Gavin in some capacity during this time would probably agree.  So...given the right circumstances, maybe.

Jupeter aka Juno Steel/Peter Nureyev (The Penumbra Podcast) - Totally.  Like, again, they have so much on again/off again to them and they’re both, like, such canonically big sluts, that 100% I could see that.  Though if they haven’t quite worked out everything between themselves then Peter’s insecurity issues might become a problem.

Oh, I thought of one that, while totally an OTP, I’ve never written but WOULD qualify.  Adoribull or The Iron Bull/Dorian.  I totally think they would be open/poly.  I mean Bull is basically canonically poly (and pan) in the game and though they are ASSUMED to make a commitment to each other in the same way both their characters do in their romances, they are separated a good amount of the time and I think they’d be flexible.  

My problem in general here is that in real life I believe in healthy communication and not being possessive and jealous of your partner/the importance of trust...in fiction I find jealousy really hot.  So a lot of my OTPs tend to be jealous and possessive types. 

[anemoi-i]

krisnix anon again, i loved your analysis on them!! it’s always interesting to hear different opinions on their relationship (from non-dead dove folks, obviously.) ive done the same with avoiding that content, how kristoph is written and just overall it really ruins something that could be so potentially beneficial to the plot of the 7yr gap. i personally view it in a different light, but i agree with a lot of your stances!! i liked how turnabout trump really showed both the effects of phoenix’s disbarment and kristoph in his actions all throughout. i personally thought it was genuine on kristoph’s part, at least subconsciously, as i think it gives a bit more reasoning to a few minor plot things, especially with how kristoph offers to take phoenix’s case after he’s accused of killing gramarye, and then is really hesitant to let apollo take the case over. i just don’t really think he’d be willing to sacrifice his own reputation just to make absolutely sure phoenix suffers even more, especially since he has apollo at his disposal. and i think getting a professional forgery made, and then attempting two murders seems a little excessive given the games canonical reasoning for kristoph’s initial actions toward phoenix. i think they’re such an interesting pair, and it’s such a shame that the fandom around it is so horrible. super cool to read your interpretation, sorry this was long!

Don't worry about it being long!! I love to talk about Kristoph's m.o. in general, and how he acts so it's not a bother to hear other people's thoughts on him or how he acts so long as it isn't weird. I think Kristoph could have been genuine in some parts, though it would be very small. I actually had a headcanon on his black psyche-locks and the reasons behind his m.o, but it is late so I'd have to talk about it tomorrow.

[jojolightningfingers]

thought i forgot to do this, eh? nope! here’s the rundown on dual destinies!

- oof. where to start? as with most things there was some good and some bad. the good things kind of start and end with the characters, while the bad things permeate... much more than that. let’s see if i can stagger them.

- bad: the soundtrack. most of the AJ music is playing on repeat in my head months after the fact; meanwhile the only track from DD i can recall really enjoying is Reminiscence ~ A Sad Memory.

- good: athena. oh my god, athena. blithely honest athena, amazingly competitive athena, athena who busted her ass to become a multilingual fully barred lawyer in less than seven years and before the age of 19. athena who can flip a full grown man over her head on reflex. god bless her.

- bad: the models for phoenix and apollo are. so fucking stiff and ugly. all the ones that were made for DD like athena’s and the witnesses, those are fine, but when you start cribbing directly off of the sprites, it really shows, and it’s awful. the exceptions are klavier’s little laughing one that ends with a hair fwip and phoenix’s front-facing ones. and if you’re gonna have models snap from position to position with no inbetweens, why even have models? just use the sprites that are cleaner and better looking anyway. plus, the breakdowns.... let’s just say that kristoph’s doesn’t look so over the top anymore.

- good: the third case! I really like turnabout academy, even though it was HILARIOUSLY obvious that means did it. the one-off characters were delightful, it was just complicated enough to be a challenge without being too easy or too frustrating. klavier was there. the ending was heartwarming. 

- bad: some of the technical writing is... really handholdy for lack of a better word. and in a game where that handholding necessarily has to be delivered by characters talking to other characters, or thinking to themselves, it comes off as the characters in question just sounding really, really dumb and lacking common sense and basic logic skills. characters who, i remind you, are not only just barred and competent lawyers, but REPUTED for winning cases by thinking outside the box and conjuring hope by grasping at the thinnest of straws. characters who, moreover, didn’t HAVE this problem in their previous appearances. it is a HORRIBLE thing to handhold a puzzle/problem solving game, i will die on that hill. it defeats the whole point.

- good: blackquill is godot, but from an angle that i like a whole lot more. oddly enough i think the localization helped this one: he’d probably come off as pretentious and annoying as i found godot if i were playing the japanese version, where ace attorney canonically takes place in japan (and so an old-fashioned samurai attitude would sound really hoity toity), but in the context of an american-based ace attorney, he just sounds adorably, passionately nerdy for japan. plus, samurai metaphors are just cooler than coffee metaphors. and he just looks cooler. and has a hawk with a little scarf. does godot have a hawk with a little scarf? i didn’t think so.

- bad: dual destinies is bad, so bafflingly bad at relationships that happened in the past. when edgeworth is first mentioned to phoenix in the first game, we get a couple subtle hints before we even meet him that phoenix already knows who he is, and it’s confirmed before the third case even starts. we go for three whole cases with blackquill, with athena being present in all of them, before suddenly being told ‘oh yeah, athena knew him when she was little’. and given that athena has literally the exact same ‘i want to save this person from himself’ motivation that phoenix does, you’d THINK that this would be made a bigger deal of. it’s ridiculous that it’s not! athena deserved better.

- good: what we DID get of athena and blackquill interacting on a personal level, i did like very much. what can i say? i’m a sucker for that kind of dynamic. athena’s bruteforce determination to save blackquill from martyring himself for her sake, using her own abilities honed by her family’s work? that’s my candy.

- bad: i could say lots of things about the climax of the final case but it’d basically just be a retread of this post so i’ll let you look at that one instead.

- good: the dlc case was well thought out and interesting, and more importantly, long and involved enough to be worth the extra money spent. good story too!

- bad: this one’s the really big bugbear for me. do you know what would have been better for the cosmic turnabout than what actually happened? switch the roles that clay and starbuck had in the case. it would have immediately improved the whole thing. there is literally no point other than cheap, easy-bake drama to retconning a childhood friend for apollo and then killing him before he says a word. it has no impact. if starbuck were killed instead of clay? clay could still be devastated and upset that his beloved mentor is gone, which in turn would upset and unsettle apollo. drama would still come about with clay being suspected of the murder, it would only exacerbate the whole situation! hell, it might even be a good starting point for hinting at athena’s black psyche-locks, i’m sure apollo losing his cool and shouting that clay didn’t do it would be similar enough to her shouting that simon didn’t murder her mother to pry open some nasty repressed memories. instead, the way apollo reacted to clay’s death was.... just really weird. this is a guy who broke down in tears (AJ literally lists three different sound effects for it, one of them being *bawl*) when he saw trucy alive and well after apparently having been kidnapped, and he didn’t even know her all that well yet! and dual destinies would have me believe that this same person’s reaction to his BEST FRIEND dying in a senseless murder is one frustrated angry anime scream and going off batman style? like hell.

- overall, i was fine with the game while i was playing it, but i think it’s really telling that it took me two months to get through the whole thing. not because it was hard, but because i just didn’t really WANT to. definitely a big step down after AJ and AAI2.

[hotel-japanifornia]

If Phoenix or Maya died instead of Mia, that would be a very sad AU to the entire series as a whole. Who knows what that would have done to her.

Well, I did write an AU where Maya got murdered by Redd White. I’m not going to act like my fic is the definitive of how Turnabout Sisters would have gone if Maya was the victim but I do think that it isn’t out of the realm of possibility that things would have gone that way. Mia for sure would have figured out that Redd White was the murderer and would have gone after him, and do anything in her power to take him down. 

As for what happens to Mia after The Reversal of Sisters, well, here’s how the rest of the franchise would have gone at least in my view:

Mia finds out that Will Powers, the actor of the Steel Samurai was arrested for murder. Recognizing that name as the show that Maya loved so much, she takes the case because she knows that’s what Maya would want her to do.

Phoenix insists on tackling Turnabout Goodbyes on his own as he desperately wants to help his friend out. He loses because Maya isn’t around to call Lotta out on the validity of her testimony, and Edgeworth is found “Guilty” of murder. As a side note, Von Karma disappears and is never heard from again. Afterwards, Phoenix slips into a deep depression and Mia consoles him, the two comforting each other due to them both losing someone they care about deeply.

Mia ends up defending Lana at the request of Ema Skye. Lana is much more open to the idea of having Mia as her lawyer but still acts similarly cold and distant towards her as she did Phoenix. Mia, with Ema’s help, manages to defend Lana successfully, though she still goes to jail. At the end, Lana and Mia promise to stay in touch during the former’s prison sentence through writing letters.

The Kurain case never happens as there’s no Maya for Morgan to plot to get rid of. Instead, Dr. Grey goes nuts and tries to murder Mimi Miney who is disguised as Ini. He is arrested for attempted murder. The reason I think Grey would go after “Ini” is because he would want to take vengeance upon the sister of the woman who had in a sense, ruined his business. I also don’t think Mimi would have gone after Grey had he not suggested the channeling honestly.

The Lost Turnabout and Turnabout Big Top would have been taken by Mia. She offers both cases to Phoenix, but he’s still depressed after losing Edgeworth. She does manage to convince him to stand in with her during trial.

Mia would have no reason to take Farewell, My Turnabout. In actuality, I think that Matt Engarde’s case would have been taken by a public defender as everyone else is convinced of his guilt. The public defender loses the case and Engarde is found “Guilty. And as an added bonus, the public defender’s body is found the next day but nobody knows if their death was a murder or a suicide. You could argue that maybe Mia would have taken Matt’s case, but I’m not so sure. Engarde looked rather “Guilty” from the onset and if it wasn’t for DeKiller, I’m not so sure Phoenix would have taken it either…without coercion from Maya.

Diego wakes up in August 2018. Mia, scared of losing him again, proposes to him very soon after he wakes up. The two of them marry and Phoenix is the man of honor.

Soon afterwards, Diego joins the Fey & Co. Law Offices as a third lawyer. 

Phoenix, inspired by Diego’s return to law, starts taking cases again, but starts off slow with simple hit-and-run and assault cases. He doesn’t take up the case revolving around the murder at KB security (Diego does), but does take up the murder at Tres Bien which goes much differently than it does in canon. This is because he isn’t as popular in this universe so Furio Tigre can’t impersonate him to get Maggey convicted of murder.

Diego is Phoenix’s aide during the Gramarye trial and tells him to watch out for that forged diary page. With his help, Phoenix is able to avoid being disbarred. However, Zak still disappears after the conclusion of the trial (because why wouldn’t he honestly?) and Phoenix still adopts lil’ Trucy.

As a side note, because AAI and AAI2 require the presence of Edgeworth, the smuggling ring and the Mastermind are never caught for their crimes. Actually come to think of it, the Mastermind actually WOULD be put in jail, but for a murder they never actually committed. 

Turnabout Visitors ends up going differently since it requires Edgeworth to have the room he has in canon. If Jacques was able to get Edgeworth’s room, he might not end up needing to murder Buddy after all. On the other hand, Rhoda would be accused of murdering Akbey, Lauren would be accused of murdering her father, and Kay would be accused of murdering Coachen. I don’t know who would have been accused of murdering Ka-Shi-Nou though.

The fake president is never discovered and SS-5 is never resolved. Blaise, Patricia, and Di-Jun-Huang never face retribution for their crimes.

The UR-1 trial goes a bit differently than it does in canon. Since a Fey & Co. defense attorney may have taken young Simon’s case, it’s possible that they’re able to prove his innocence and demonstrate the existence of a “phantom” killer. He would have still been arrested on tampering with the crime scene but on a lighter sentence due to trying to protect a young Athena. Make no mistake though, Simon totally adopts Athena once he gets out of the slammer. Whether or not she becomes a defense attorney still is up in the air but I think it’s likely. She might get inspired by watching Simon in court and want to face off against him in court.

Because the UR-1 trial goes differently than it does in canon and Phoenix is never disbarred, the dark age of the law never truly starts.

Apollo ends up working for the Fey & Co. Law Offices instead of Kristoph. I’m not sure how exactly AJ would have gone down. I think Kristoph would still have murdered Shadi and Turnabout Corner and Turnabout Serenade may gone down like in canon. Whether or not Kristoph is caught for murdering Shadi…is a different story.

Ema also doesn’t grow up to be a grumpy bear detective but probably is still bitter about not getting her dream job.

For DD, I can see 5-2, 5-3, and 5-DLC going the same just with Simon acting in a different manner since he was never convicted of Metis’ murder and as such, doesn’t have the lingering threat of death hanging over his head. I don’t think that Bobby and Simon knew each other before the latter got convicted so it’s probably a different detective working those cases. Unless the Phantom kills that guy and somehow manages to manipulate Simon into thinking the other detective just simply quit…

The Khu’rain cases in SOJ likely don’t happen because none of the Fey & Co. defense attorneys have any real reason to travel there. 6-2, 6-4, and 6-DLC might still happen but with different lawyers working those cases. 

As for the sibling reveal, well, like in canon, it still hasn’t happened yet. That’s mainly because it’s really not up to any of the lawyers to decide when Lamiroir will let Trucy and Apollo know of their heritage, Although, it might be a bit sooner since Apollo doesn’t go to Khu’rain in this version.

Phoenix never finds out the truth about Dahlia. As a result, he probably stays single for the rest of his life. He almost definitely would have trust issues if he ever got into a relationship again.

Lastly, Morgan receives a call from Mia about Maya’s murder. She decides to use Maya’s death to her advantage and tells Pearl a couple hours later that Mystic Maya had contacted her personally and told her that she never wanted to see her or Pearl ever again. Pearl is inconsolable at first and refuses to believe that her beloved cousin would ever do or say such a thing. However, over time, as Pearl grows older and Maya never returns, she begins to take Morgan’s word for it. Meanwhile, Morgan does her part to ensure that Pearl never finds out the truth and murders anyone who threatens to try. 

Pearl becomes Master as a result in 2021, she doesn’t receive the Master’s Talisman from Misty and is instead given a new one upon courtesy of her mother (I don’t think we ever learn if new Master’s Talismans are made when a person becomes Master. I’m pretty sure they aren’t passed down though). By the time she’s 18, she’s blocked the memory of her cousins out of hatred towards them for leaving the family. Misty never goes out of hiding out of fear that her sister might kill her if she tries to reach out to Pearl. She and Larry are still master and student though.

Pearl does go for training in Khu’rain but it’s unknown if she stays with the Inmees like Maya does in canon.

This at least, is an outline of how it could have gone. Things almost certainly would have been very different if Phoenix had been murdered. He would never have been the lawyer he is today, etc. Maya and Mia probably would be working together to try to put Redd away, so that’s a fun thought for an AU.

[wardencommanderrodimiss]

Okay! Here’s the last of the non-canon outtakes featuring Franziska and Phoenix’s arrest. This one follows that which I linked there. Phoenix and Franziska argued a little more, she stormed out, she and the rest of the family complained about Phoenix, which is where that bit with Diego came from, and then she has an idea. I like the part that gives some more insight into her relationship with Phoenix, as I discussed in the other outtakes post how close they used to be, and I most especially mourn the material of Franziska and Kristoph going head-to-head, but it just cannot fit with the overall arc I wanted.

But there’s actually not any rules, so if I want to post scrapped plot threads, who’s gonna stop me? Nobody that’s who. 

She has never actually been to the office, despite it being one of Phoenix's frequent haunts; come to think of it, she cannot recall ever having gone to the Borscht, either. His physical presence faded from her life and a ghost tried to fill the hole caused by his absence. Traffic is heavy even at this time and she rehearses potential opening statements as she curses at the other cars and the slow crawl they are locked into. It is 4:52 when she pulls into the lot, scrambling from her car; on a Friday, he may have already left by now, leaving the work to the junior partners - though if he has, she is marching back to the detention center and telling his client that along with all of his other vices, he isn't even a dedicated attorney.

Gavin's office is like Grossberg's: much larger than Mia or Phoenix's holes-in-the-walls or even her father's office, hosting more than two attorneys, and the decor is as tacky and indulgent. Her feet sink into the plush carpet and she glances over the polished surface of the waiting room coffee table before she looks around for someone to speak to. There is a desk that looks like it is the reception area, but no one at it. 

[This connecting segment never got written, but here she meets Apollo and asks him if Kristoph is still here because she needs to speak with him. Apollo asks for her name and she gives it as "Franziska Edgeworth" which ends up a brick joke with Apollo much later.]

Despite the fact that the boy - probably not a boy, he can't be that young if he works at a law office, at least 17 - said that Gavin was about to leave, he is sitting at his desk when Franziska enters his office, his hands folded in front of him like he has known to expect her for longer than he has. He can't have expected her. "Do shut the door behind you," he says, gesturing to it.

The office is well-decorated, fancy - more like many of the prosecutors' offices she has seen, nothing like any of the defense attorneys within her own family. She takes her time returning to the door which she left to swing ajar behind her, scanning the bookshelves and the coffee table. The latter holds a decorative paperweight, and the former, bookends, all heavy looking (injuries appear consistent with a strike from a blunt object and given the location of the wounding to the head the attacker appears to be shorter than the victim); on the desk there is a letter opener (stab wound to the throat, though shape of injury does not appear consistent with any kind of knife), but for that she would have to move toward him, away from the door. Better to run, for several reasons: the other attorneys are still in the office and would hear any skirmish taking place within the room, but Gavin would not risk his reputation chasing her down in front of them. She could claim self-defense - she would claim self-defense, she is not her father, she would not strike first - but she is the interloper in this office, and the only witnesses are people who have reason to be sympathetic to Gavin. 

The door clicks closed. "What brings you here, Ms von Karma?" Gavin asks with a smile that could be pleasant if she did not know the true nature of the man. "Or - you didn't happen to change your name, did you?" He leans forward, his head tilting almost imperceptibly, but the light of his desk lamp catches on his glasses and for a moment the flash of the light hides his eyes behind them. 

"No, I didn't," she replies. "However, I thought it best to be discrete, given that it is very much not customary for a prosecutor to show up unannounced at a defense attorney's office."

"And your reason for such is...?" One eyebrow arches. He nods at the chair in front of the desk. "Please, sit down."

"No thank you. I intend to keep this brief." She touches the back of the chair and gives one of the legs a nudge with her foot; solid, heavy, more likely to become a liability to her should she try to pick it up and use as a weapon. "Phoenix Wright."

Gavin's expression does not change from the tiny, closed-lipped smile he has been giving her. Cool under fire in the courtroom; why should he not be outside of it as well? "I do not make it a policy to discuss my cases with the prosecution, Ms von Karma."

"I am not prosecuting this case. What I am is a friend of the defendant’s, and concerned about him, and so have come to check in on how his case is progressing.”

Gavin does not respond right away. Instead he stares at her, as though through her. "Then ask him," he says. "It is not as if the police refuse a prosecutor come to speak with a detainee at any time of day or night. You have left your office early enough that even were you a defense attorney, you would be let in without trouble." The languid smile does not leave his face. "I think one of two things, Ms von Karma: either you have something you wish from me specifically, or you and the accused are not as close of friends as you thought."

Franziska blinks. "Pardon?" The part of her paranoid enough to assess Gavin as a threat is the part of her that keeps her mouth moving; she cannot allow him to know that she suspects him, but he has given her a different opening. "Phoenix and I are not - what, exactly?"

If she plays this right, she can make him hand her an alibi. 

"You can hardly blame him, can you?" Gavin says. "How careful he has to be with his reputation since he was disbarred -- and for forging evidence, at that."

"He did not--"

Gavin holds up a hand. "You don't need to tell me that," he says. "I was, as you recall, the one person in the Bar Association--"

"--who voted in his favor. I am aware."

"But you understand where this places him. Whatever the truth, to the rest of the world, he forged evidence for the sake of personal victory. It hardly helps appearances for someone so accused to spend a great deal of time with a von Karma, now does it?"

For a moment she is struck silent. Phoenix pulled away from all of them, not just her. He closed himself off from everyone; he stopped confiding in Miles even though they live together, he drifted from Mia, Maya complained that he stopped texting. It wasn't just her--

-- Maya could coax him out to lunch when she came home from Kurain, Mia dragged him to get occasional haircuts, Ray saw him at Trucy's magic shows whenever Phoenix went -- Franziska went to Miles' apartment and only ever found him sleeping, she went to the office and saw his daughter more than him, she went weeks at a time without him answering her texts, she got her news of him from everyone in the Edgeworth-Fey grapevine but him, she stooped to texting Larry, she --

-- she wasn't abandoned by her oldest friend in the world because of what her goddamned father had done --

-- was she?

Gavin pushes his glasses up and his face curls in a smile that does not touch his cold eyes. "You never realized?" he asks. "I thought you more observant than that. We all have our blind spots, I suppose."

This morning in the detention center was the first time in years he was so open with her, and he wasn't open. Of everyone he locked his heart away from, it was her most of all. Her oldest friend in the world, who supported her every aspiration, who celebrated her getting her badge before him, who grinned at her for countless trials across the courtroom, setting her adrift as soon as her name became slightly inconvenient because of his own mistake.

She can't take this as an excuse for coming to see Gavin. She can't let this go. "He wouldn't," she says. "He believes in me -- not for a rumor -- nor for what my father did --"

"No? Then let me be frank with you -- I have looked into your court record, quite extensively. For a prosecutor, you have a very even ratio -- except in one particular instance. You have a perfect loss record against your own brother."

"Where are you going with this?" she snarls. She knows the bluffing sort and Gavin is not it -- he sees several moves ahead instead of just the backs of his opponent's cards.

[I unfortunately forget precisely how this line of dialogue would end. He basically implies she's corrupt and has been throwing trials to Miles, and turns it into a threat somehow -- I think he was going to threaten to bring an investigation down on her head. There was also going to be a jab somewhere obliquely referencing Klavier what with Kristoph remarking on Franziska's "remarkable loyalty" to her older brother, enough to hand him victory.

[She would then storm out and go back to the detention center to speak with Phoenix again. She tells him that she went and spoke with Kristoph, and that finally makes Phoenix crack. He has a speech that is something similar to what he says in Acing the Turnabout to Miles about being terrified that Kristoph is going to kill any one of them who investigates too closely. 

[His fear gets to Franziska; we see her paranoid edge earlier with her looking for a weapon when going into Kristoph’s office (which by the way that paragraph is one of my absolute favorites I’ve written), and it returns here She doesn't want to go home alone for fear of walking into her death and she calls up Lana to accompany her home, because Lana knows what it's like to have someone making those threats toward her. She picks Lana up at the office where she works with Mia and Diego and two of them go back to Franziska's apartment, find it fine and empty, but Franziska packs a weekend bag and crashes with Miles for the weekend. She tells him it's to help him and Trucy; this is true, but it is also her being afraid to be on her own, and her afraid to leave then on her own. She doesn't know if Kristoph would target them.]

[mllelaurel]

Writing meme I stole from @letterblade

Rules: Go to your works page, expand all the filters, and answer the following questions!

1. What’s your first and second most common work ratings?

…No shit, I currently have exactly ten of each available rating!

2. What’s your most common archive warning? Least common? Do you consider yourself an adventurous writer?

Most common is ‘No Archive Warnings Apply’ (29), followed by ‘Author Chose Not To Use Archive Warnings’ (6). Most actually used archive warning is ‘Major Character Death’ (4). Graphic Violence appeared twice, and Underage once. I have never used the Rape/Non-Con tag. (Themes of sexual abuse do appear in my works periodically, but I tend not to write them graphically, and/or in the case of dubcon I prefer to use the more accurate Dubcon tag.)

I’m not sure what the ‘adventurous writer’ question has to do with warning tags. If a story calls for particular content, I will include it and use the appropriate tag. Otherwise I won’t. 

3. How many fics have you written in each relationship category? Is this more accidental, or do you have preferences?

18 Gen, 13 M/M, 8 F/M, 6 Multi, 4 F/F

My preferences vary widely by fandom, and I’m a huge multishipper. Moreover, what I write in any given fandom depends on what I happen to have ideas for. That said, I wish I defined ‘Multi’ more consistently. Some stories, I used it to mean poly. Others, I used it to signify ‘this story deals with multiple concurrent ships of note.’ The archivist in me cringes a little. 

Also, I should write more femslash. 

4. What are your top 4 fandoms by numbers? Are you still active in any of them, and do you tend to migrate a lot?

Top four are: Ace Attorney (21), Doctor Who (4), Utena (3), Torchwood/Akatsuki no Yona (2 each.) I feel a fair bit of nostalgia for Ace Attorney, though I fandom burnt out on it a long time ago and have had no interest in canon more recent than Dual Destinies. I still think Utena’s a great series, though I’m not really interested in writing much more for it. I genuinely want to catch up on Yona eventually, preferably when the US manga release catches up. (And I still want to finish Reaching Towards!) I’m very interested in watching new Who with the Thirteenth Doctor; no way of knowing how fandom it will catch me til I do. Oh god, Torchwood I’m pretty done with. 

5. What are your top 4 character tags? Does this match how you feel about the characters, or are you puzzled?

My top four character tags are Klavier (14), Apollo (11), Phoenix (7), and Edgeworth/Kristoph (5), all from Ace Attorney. Considering Ace Attorney is my biggest writing output, that’s no surprise, and considering Klavier had a tendency to steal any fic, that’s no surprise either. 

Also, here’s the relationships:

Klavier/Apollo (9), Phoenix/Edgeworth (4), Klavier/Daryan (2), Aura/Metis (2). 

…All four of those are from Ace Attorney, too. More than half of my writing output, baby. More than half of my writing output. It’s also worth knowing that with Klavier/Apollo, I found a popular pairing (so lots of positive reinforcement,) which I actually felt I had something left to say for, as opposed to say Phoenix/Edgeworth, which already had fic for any proverbial season. 

6. What are your top 2 most used additional tags, and your bottom 2? What would happen if you combined all 4 of these into a fic?

Top two: Phoenix Wright Kink Meme (6), Post-Dual Destinies (5). 

Bottom two: D/s (2), Canonical Character Death (2). 

…I’d be writing Athena/Simon for someone on the Ace Attorney Kink Meme? (I never did write much for those two, which is a shame. I meant to write more.) 

7. How many WIPs do you have currently running on AO3? Any you don’t plan on finishing?

Reaching Towards (Akatsuki no Yona) - I really want to finish this one. It’s got two freaking chapters to go! I’ve noticed I run out of steam more when the story is more vignette based than plot driven. 

The Carbon in Our Souls (The Adventure Zone) - I *really* want to finish this one! I just have to remember where I was going with it and get in the mood. See also: vignette-based versus plot-driven. 

And that’s it!

[greentrickster]

justanother--fan

To be completely honest, fanfics really do the character backstory justice. I admit that Miles' redemption arc is just *chef's kiss*, the fandom even gave Franziska much more depth, gave Phoenix his own struggles with poisoning, betrayal, disbarment and sudden fatherhood unlike the game just giving him just one line (Recipe for Turnabout) and in AA4 just made him aloof. Also quality hurt/comfort and found family! The fandom really makes things a lot better!

To be fair, CapCom gives us a lot to work with. To be equally fair, we only ever see Phoenix from an outsider’s perspective in AA4 and, given that he barely knows Apollo and that Apollo was mentored by Kristoph and recommended by Shadi Smith, Phoenix really has very little reason to trust him any farther than he has to, and that even after hiring him Phoenix is coming up on the culmination of seven years’ of work to solve the relevant case, during which he had to ensure his actions never got back to Kristoph in any way, shape, or form. If that man wasn’t holding it together by the skin of his teeth, I will be extremely surprised. Besides, the game isn’t supposed to be about Phoenix - it was supposed to be focused primarily on Apollo. I’ve seen all sorts of suggestions for how AA:AJ messed up and could be improved and various bits and bobs, but there is one very simple solution to it I never really run across, and that is either remove Phoenix from it entirely, or have him in a much more marginal role, where he’s aiding Apollo in solving Apollo’s cases, rather than Apollo getting tangled up in Phoenix’s stuff. I love his relationship with Trucy, and fan writers do a good job with making canon work, but the game came out thirteen years ago. Time to stop grumbling about the problems with it and the other sequel-trilogy games and focus on solutions to them within our own stories at this point.

justanother--fan

Magatama? Wow. That's super cooooool!

Thanks! Though really, just... eBay. Seriously, that’s where I got mine, type in ‘magatama’ in the search bar and scroll around. They might not have one you like right away, but a bit of patience and something’ll probably turn up!

justanother--fan

One's red, other is blue? Definitely rivals. Definitely ship material.

That is one of the laws of the universe! ;D

justanother--fan

We also need the spinoff of Phoenix assisting Miles during the seven year gap. Come on, CapCom!

At this point, I don’t really care what the next truly new AA game is, as long as its good and adds to pre-existing canon in an interesting, enjoyable way.

How did you get into the Ace Attorney and or Narumitsu Rabbit Hole?

From following the webcomic Awkward Zombie (which makes jokes and parodies about various video games) for an extremely long time, the creator of the comic being an AA fan to the point that I got vaguely curious about the pink and blue lawyer-men, and then, in summer 2019, being desperately in need of some ship art for a new fandom, I decided to see what this ‘Ace Attorney’ stuff was all about. So, yeah. I literally came to this fandom planning to silently consume Narumitsu art for awhile and then leave without getting involved.

This is obviously not what happened.

[notmoreflippingelves]

Do you think Kristoph ever regretted what he did?

 My reading of Kristoph is that he was driven more by fear, paranoia, and despair than genuine malice, ambition,envy, or greed. I do believe that he had legitimate reasons behind his actions (i.e. reasons besides seeking fame and/or humiliating Phoenix or Klavier), especially given the supposed tragic backstory he was originally supposed to have. 

With more sympathetic (though hardly excusable) motivations in mind, it makes perfect sense to me that he would experience at least some regret or remorse for what he’s done. Even though he attempts to argue with himself that the ends justified the means and everything else is just unfortunate “collateral damage.” 

Honestly, the biggest indicator to me of a guilty conscience is his defending Phoenix to the bar association. I know people have made the case that that he did it to try to get close to Phoenix to keep an eye on him...but this logic has always fallen flat with me. Canonically, Kristoph is obsessed with his reputation and yet, he publically links himself with a man mired in scandal. The very sort of man he ought to avoid like the plague in order to keep his stellar reputation. And that’s not even getting into the fact, that he took a stranger’s side over his own brother’s...which just makes him look even more morally suspect.

This is the sort of irrational thing that Kristoph should’ve avoided doing at all costs. It makes no logical sense. Which makes me think that it wasn’t logic that was motivating him at all, but rather emotion (primarily guilt, perhaps pity as well).   

My thought is that his feelings of guilt would fluctuate over time and gradually grow more specific and intense (especially post 4-4). 

I’ve mentioned before that I head canon Kristoph and Phoenix having a sort of “yin-yang” impact on each other. During their seven-year relationship “friendship,” Phoenix canonically becomes much more secretive, crafty, and morally ambiguous --likely due to Kristoph’s “bad” influence --while still remaining ultimately “heroic.” Why shouldn’t Kristoph conversely become more compassionate, generous, and morally complex-- primarily due to Phoenix’s “good” influence--while still remaining ultimately “villainous”?

[sage-nebula]

provided you're still taking these [and no one's asked it yet] ace attorney for the five things you'd changed meme? [if that's been asked then fire emblem awakening?]

I’m so sorry! I totally didn’t mean to ignore you. I took a break after a huge batch of these when I first posted the meme because my hands ended up hurting from typing so much, and then I got caught up watching the Switch presentation, and then I sort of … forgot that I had these in my inbox/got distracted every time I remembered. I’m sorry! I’ll go ahead and answer this now, though, so I hope it’s not too late.

As a reminder, this is for the “five things I would change” meme. Others I’ve already answered are:

Pokémon XY&Z AnimeDreamworks DragonsPokémon Sun&Moon GamesHarry PotterGravity FallsBlue ExorcistYu-Gi-OhFire Emblem: Awakening

(Yeah, I copy-pasted the apology from another response, but hey: it applies in both cases.)

And as for Ace Attorney . . .

First and foremost, I would completely remove the Khura’in element from the sixth installment. The Kingdom of Khura’in needs to go, entirely and completely. And for that matter? Playing as Phoenix needs to go, entirely and completely. I can understand it in AA5 since they both wanted to give him his badge back (though it’s ridiculous he lost it in the first place, but whatever), and also because there are periods over the course of the plot in which Athena cannot defend because she has been arrested, and Apollo can’t because he suspects her. We need a lawyer at that point, and so it makes sense that Phoenix would step up. However, there’s no reason to do this in AA6, and no reason to keep billing him in the title of the games. His time to shine is over. His part of the plot is done, unless you want to bring back Kristoph Gavin and tell us what those black psyche-locks are hiding (but more on that in a bit). The fact that we wasted so much time on him in AA6 when we have two other lawyers that we need to know more about/have more time with is ridiculous. I’m so beyond tired of Phoenix Wright. I want more Apollo Justice and Athena Cykes, and that means reworking the sixth game completely.So that said? No more Khura’in. This does mean that I lose my darling daughter Rayfa, but in all honesty that’s a sacrifice I’m willing to make. No Khura’in, no Phoenix acting as a lawyer, no Maya coming back just to be a damsel in distress yet again with nothing significant gained from her appearance. Instead, AA5 needs to take place solely in Los Angeles (/Japan/Japanifornia) once again, and the lawyers need to alternate between Apollo and Athena, both of them serving as the other’s co-counsel at different points. And, more to that point, Athena needs to be treated with respect. She’s still new, but she’s a competent lawyer and she has proven this. Treat her like it.But yeah, the Khura’in cases were godawful and a damned chore to get through. None of that. Chuck that in the garbage bin where it belongs. Worst. 

Apollo and Trucy need to know that they are siblings yesterday. Ideally this would have come out a long time ago, but at the very least it should have come out in AA6, particularly since it was teased with the second case focusing so heavily on the Gramaryes. And to the end, how much more powerful would it have been if Reus had been the final villain of the game, screaming “GRAMARYEEEEE” after it has already been revealed that Apollo himself is a Gramarye? Because as it stands, Reus and everyone else thought he was simply cursing Trucy and his family, even though Apollo was the one who brought him down. If it was revealed that Apollo was a Gramarye as well, that would have been so much more powerful for all of the characters present. As it stands, it was a waste. A waste and a shame.But yeah, Apollo and Trucy need to know. That plot thread needs to be tied up. The fact that we’re going on ten years---an actual decade---of having this dangling is absolute nonsense. There’s no reason for it, particularly since Capcom felt they had time to retcon chunks of Apollo’s history and introduce a ridiculous new country just so they could push a courtroom gimmick, make an excuse for Maya to appear as a damsel yet again, and act like Phoenix still has any relevance to the ongoing narrative. And speaking of dangling plot threads . . .

KRISTOPH. GAVIN’S. BLACK PSYCHE-LOCKS. This is the only remaining business that Phoenix has left unfinished---the only relevance he has beyond being a father and mentor to the current main cast. We need to know what those black psyche-locks are, we need to finish that up. I am concerned at this point that nothing Capcom reveals will be good enough, that any dark secret that Kristoph has buried is going to be underwhelming given that we’ve had a decade to think of possibilities---but I don’t care. I still want to know. They introduced the black psyche-locks in AA4 and refused to let us break them. They created that dangling plot thread. They then explained what black psyche-locks are in AA5. That is the perfect opportunity, then, to let us go back and break them---and yet it was an opportunity wasted. It could have been explored in AA6, particularly if we went back to the true heritage plot thread that was left dangling from AA4 as well, but again, that didn’t happen. So that said, I would make it happen. I don’t know what it is that Kristoph is repressing (I’d have to replay that part of AA4, because to be honest I don’t even remember what triggered the black psyche-locks), but damn, I really want to know.

I do want to see original trilogy characters again, but I want to see them incorporated in ways that are new and show that they’ve actually grown as people over the past ten (now!) years. This was done well with Ema, in that we see her as a homicide detective and then as a forensics investigator like she always dreamed. We see that she grew up, that she’s doing different things with her life, that she has changed as a person. This was done less well with characters like Pearl and Maya, who act almost the exact same as they did in the original trilogy with very minor design differences, almost as if Capcom was afraid to change them too much. In my opinion, this was done to their detriment. The most glaring example of this was in the DLC case for AA5, in which Pearl---who is a seventeen-year-old junior/senior in high school---saying “for-en-sick-ing” as if she’s still an eight/nine-year-old who doesn’t understand the word. That’s horrible. Pearl was shown to have grown up in some ways, but in others she acted as if she still had the intelligence and mentality of a small child, which is rather insulting to her character (especially since she was always supposed to be quite bright). Maya was a little better, but not by much. Often times she still acted so immature that moments in which she was supposed to be ~mature and wise~ (such as that moment with Rayfa that they flashbacked to 9882348309232 times as if to hammer home, “LOOK SHE’S ALL MATURE AND STUFF NOW!!!!!11!”) felt out of place and out of character. She simply didn’t grow enough to sell it. And if that’s how they’re going to treat OT characters, then I’d rather not see them in the present day games.So that said? While I do want to see them, I want to see growth and change. The next time I see Gumshoe, I want to see that he is actually Chief of Police, happily married to Maggey Byrde with some kids of his own. The next time I see Lana, I want to see that she did her time in prison and is either head detective down at the precinct, or---if her record prevents her from serving on the force again---is acting as a consultant for the police force. The next time I see Kay, I want to see her as a prosecutor, and so on and so forth. I want to see these characters having grown as people, having changed while still being recognizably themselves. This shouldn’t be beyond Capcom. They did it with Ema and Edgeworth, so I don’t see why they can’t do it with the other characters as well.

Lastly, I would make Phoenix and Edgeworth in a committed relationship at the least by the time AA5 rolls around, and probably engaged by the time AA6 does. Not only would it be amazing confirmation that Phoenix is bisexual (and having more bi visibility is always a good thing), and not only would it be a concrete reminder that Edgeworth is canonically not interested in women (and no, it’s not that he’s just ~married to his job~, but that’s a rant for another day), but it would also be a fantastic culmination of all the relationship development we’ve seen between them over the years. It would also be fantastic representation of a relationship that is, and has always been, on equal terms both in terms of dynamic in the workplace and in how they treat one another. I would love for it to actually be canon, particularly since it’s not as if a whole lot would have to change. Trucy calling Edgeworth “Papa” (in contrast to how Phoenix is her daddy), and a couple lines of banter about an upcoming wedding between them is all it would take. (Which is also fantastic representation, because it shows that, hey, they’re people in a relationship just like anyone else! LGBTQA people are just people, how shocking.) So yeah, I would definitely make that a thing, and it would be great. 

[loregoddess]

voltron and ace attorney

Okay…this ended up being way longer than I thought it would so…

VoltronOkay, so I know Voltron is an ongoing show, and we were given hardly any info the first season considering all things, so instead of “change” it’s more what I’d like to see from the series…1. We need backstories for the paladins. Like, I know stuff about Pidge and a handful of stuff about Shiro, but the others? Nada. I want to know why they were in the military-nasa-college-place.2. STOP HAVING HUNK BE JUST THE GUY WHO LIKES FOOD. Like honestly, he’s a character, and a very good character, and everything about him shouldn’t be food. Give us more non-food-related characterisation for him, because there was some in the first season and it was gold, and there needs to be more. Also there is so much potential for conveying messages of body positivity with Hunk, like it’s established that he’s a nice and considerate guy, there is so much potential for him.3. Allura is a good and strong woman, but I see this trend with strong women needing to Suffer™ in order to prove their strength. Like…she lost her home planet, was put in sleep-stasis for 10,000 years, and was still probably dealing with the grief and loss of that, and then on top of it the writers killed her AI father and kidnapped her briefly, like…give her a break so she can work through the complex emotions and pain of everything that’s already happened.4. Don’t kill Shiro. I mean, I don’t want anyone to die, but do not kill Shiro. And I’m not saying this because he’s one of my favourite characters, I’ve seen so many people talk about how important Shiro is to them because of how his PTSD is handled, because he’s canonically Japanese, because he is not the typical hero media has been force-feeding us forever. If he dies, then he becomes another example of “writers kill off minority character again” and that can be easily avoided by like, not killing characters off.5. The Galra need work. They’re just generic villains right now, just bad guys who want to take over the universe for reasons unknown. I want them to be more complex though, like…did Zarkon have to rise to power on the Galra home planet and seize it for himself? Was there opposition to him? Was he basically a tyrant on his planet who took control through force, expanding that beyond the planet to the universe at large? If there is a resistance within the Galra Empire, then can we learn more about them–how large are they, how much influence do they have, do they have enough sway to remain undercover but keep certain sectors of the universe “safer” than others controlled by Zarkon loyalists? If there is no large resistance group, or even more individuals past the mysterious dude at the end of season one, then does Zarkon have a vast network of loyalists who kill off any resistance? Like, there is a lot of potential to make the Galra a more complex enemy that they currently are, but right now they’re kinda one-dimensional “victory or death, let’s take over the universe” villains.

Ace AttorneySo…I know some people are really unhappy with x, y, or z about the games, but I truly don’t have that many issues with them. So again, not all of these will be changes.1. Okay, I will start off with one of the things that upset me in SoJ. And that was the matriarchal society of Khu’rain. Or rather, lack thereof. Now, it might just be that as a writer, I’ve spent a lot of time thinking about matriarchies and how countries run by a matriarchal culture would look, and I won’t get into that. But Khu’rain was not a well-written matriarchy at all. Like, having a queen and a major female religious figure is good and all, but that was…the extent of the “this is a matriarchy where women are held in higher respect and regard to men”. Literally, everything else was not a matriarchy. So either they needed to hire a writer who actually knows how to write matriarchies, or they could change some things around, which brings me to…2. Nahyuta. Don’t get me wrong, he wasn’t a poorly written character per se, but again, this is not a man who grew up in a matriarchy. There are two things that would have made him a stronger character: One, the easy fix, make him a woman. Some of his early concept art shows he was suppose to be a woman, and honestly if he was then the writers would have been able to keep him as frustratingly arrogant and condescending as he was, because it would have made sense for a lady prosecutor to act as he does in canon, if he was a woman. Hell, if the writers wanted to be really ambitions, make him non-binary, as that could have possibly worked into the matriarchal and religious themes as well. Two, the fix that would have required an actual understanding of how social constructs affect how people act, and how matriarchal influences would be vastly different from patriarchal ones–entirely rewrite his character. Write him to be a man who truly grew up in a matriarchal society, who truly has a deep level of respect for women because of the culture he grew up in teaching him that women were to be respected. This would have changed how he treats Athena entirely, and would have changed other aspects throughout the game. I’m not entirely sure what else would change because I haven’t sat down and thoroughly analysed Khu’rain’s religion and how it affects the society and how this, paired with an actual matriarchy, would affect the country’s culture and social constructs, and thus the people living in that culture, but like, it would change quite a few things. Or, y’know, the writer’s could’ve made Nahyuta a woman, and everything would have made a bit more sense for his characterisation.3. Backstories, backstories for the Gavins. AA4 left so many unanswered questions, so many loose ends. And some of these mysteries have only deepened with small hints in the following games. Why does Phoenix never talk about Mia directly or by name? What was Kristoph’s motive for killing Shadi Smith? How the hell is Klavier dealing with being betrayed by his best friend and bandmate, having his brother thrown in jail, and his mentor die all within a year’s span? What exactly was his relationship like with Kristoph? Actually, I just want more info on Klavier in general, like…please.4. While I’d love to see some of the old characters–Kay, Franziska, Gumshoe, Sebastian, etc.–if they’re brought back, they need to be brought back in a way that makes sense and doesn’t feel forced. Likewise, the preexisting characters can be developed further–as I said above, there’s a lot of potential for good characterisation, but it needs to get a chance to come out into the light. There’s some other characterisation stuff that irks me, but I’ll rant at you about that once you get to certain points in SoJ.5. Apollo and Trucy need to learn the Truth™ please.