#feanor didn't lisp

[undercat-overdog]

Another day, another three bad language takes.

I think that has to do in part with how it's seen as important, even necessary, to care or "know" about the conlangs and to have opinions on them. ("Know" is in quotes because lbr, there's a lot of wildly incorrect, uninformed, and plain stupid misunderstandings and incorrect information out there.) Like you're seen as a better fan, or more respectable fan, if you talk about it.

That shouldn't be the case! You can be a huge fan, a knowledgeable fan, a well-versed fan, and not know or care about the conlangs. Unfortunately it is the case that fandom rewards bad takes about linguistics over no takes about them and so the bad takes spread.

If you want to opine about the sociolinguistics and politics around language, please read at least the Shibboleth of Feanor and after that Quendi and Eldar. And read them, not a summary you see on tumblr. (I can give more detailed recommendations if anyone's interested, but the Shib will get you what fandom goes on about and Quendi and Eldar great info about different elven group names and divisions).

If my opinion means anything (and it doesn't), you have my permission to not give a fuck about Quenya. But if you do, at least go off the actual text and not tumblr?

Edit: this was a bit intemperate but truly not aimed at any one person, rather the fandom as a whole. Which is arguably more intemperate, but I cannot count how many times I have seen takes that fundamentally misunderstand not just the conlangs, including their historical development, but the way language and languages work.

[eri-pl]

Silm reread 0: the letter to Milton Waldman

(which includes some Tolkien's thoughts +a recap of the whole Silm)

After the FA, a quick break (yet another) for the foreword of the book (at least in my edition this letter is there as the foreword)

So we get into authorial intent. Which is (for me) somewhat less important than what's in the book proper and how I read it. Don't treat all that is said here as "I claim it to be canon", it's just what Tolkien wrote in one letter in 1951. Please remember that as we go along.

A lot of talk about myths and fairy tales and that we don't talk about Bruno religion in them, not directly. For reasons that I still can't fully grasp, but also instinctively it seems to make sense, but also I am insecure with talking about relogion, so…

Anyway, Tolkien does not like machines. Yes, I know, but still, I don't really get him. I don't see what's wrong with tools, even automated tools. Also: oh how the Professor would hate generative AIs.

Fefe gets a lot of criticism: He was greedy, his sons were greedy, this is why the Elves had fallen. also, terrible, bad Oath.

Also, Oath explained: it is against anyone who claims a Silmarill or rights to it. So, no, touching it is etc fine as long as you intend to give it to Feanorians ASAP. Nice to know. Also, the oath is about hatered and revenge against abovementioned people, no mention of reclaiming the Silmarils in the explanation of it.

Yes, the idea of Dadgor Dagoradh is Ragnarok-inspired, of course it is but it's nice to see it in writing.

"Beren wins, Lúthien helps." OK I get it why you need this optics, sir (because Beren is less powerful), and I think I can see at least two reasons why you can't genderswap them, but still, I am a little unhappy with this.

Elwing owns the Silmaril, not Earendil (as we were wondering). Also, Elwing jumps into the sea to save the Silmaril, but I'm not sure whether to read it as "because she wants to save the jewel" or "because the story / "Fate" / Ulmo needs the gem saved so she gets a weird impulse and she follows it". And yes, they reach Valinor thanks to the power of the Silmaril.

M&M steal the Silmarils "enslaved" by the Oath. Huh. May be the translation. And they die. If Tolkien kept this version, a whole fanfic genre would not arise. ;D Seriously, "Maglor gets some kind of resolution" is a big genre, maybe the biggest genre of gen Silm fics.

Speaking of "facts we don't like"; the returning Elves live on Tol Eressea. Only.

Sauron in SA starts with beautiful motivation and slowly falls.

The Ruling Ring could be mastered by someone powerful and heroic, but of course it would still not be a good idea. But Sauron wuld be defeated (and replaced by a new Dark Lord).

The Numenoreans learned Quenya during the War of Wrath, from their allies. So, they speak Vanyarin Quenya, ith the "ty" read as "ch" XD Because, let me remind you prom previous reread part, the Noldor did not participate in the war. (But don't worry, iirc this means that they do have the Lisp)

Tolkien never mentions Morgoth's name (neither of them), which is … I get him, but it does stand out. Also, this is the man who didn't want to use a cup with the Ring Verse on it, because it was too evil, he used it only as an ashtray. Sauron is, however, mentioned by name a lot.

Also, I do have some other quirks, so probably shouldn't laugh at the Professor. Like: I would need a good reason to read the Oath of Feanor [prose version] out loud. Everyone has things they attach weight to, I guess.

Ar-Pharazon was a real danger to Valinor, (because the Ainur would not fight him, I think? but why? they fought against Men during the War of Wrath? Or did the Maiar fight only against uMaiar and mosters?) he could wreck it. Huh.

But also, the Valar did get power and permission to deal with it, So they made the world round themselves, thanks to the extra permissions? Or did they only put the Numenoreans under the mountains? Unclear.

Aman moves to the Unseen World, I don't like this version, I don't think it works, I think that in some places with the Valar, with Valinor, tolkien wants to have things both ways (just like the Elves making the Rings of Power did). He wants to make it both vaguely religious and mythological and it's jarring at moments… IDK, maybe it's just me.

Wait, it's spelled Gil-galad? With a small g in the second word? TIL.