#except the nabateans

[butwhatifidothis]

you know what anon, go fuck yourself. my askbox has anon turned off so if you wanna come at me, do it with your name attached to your pathetic whining i'm a trans man. do you wanna know how cap'nfart69 treats being a trans man, narratively? he says ingrid is a trans man because of gender stereotypes, and has her complain about being called "dame" exactly once. but he doesn't refer to her as a man even once, he narratively treats her like a woman because he doesn't actually give a shit about a trans man ingrid headcanon. and why? because he loves edelgrid

he loves edelgrid in part because it's a f/f ship that - according to him - is defiant against heteronormative patriarchical oppression. and this is reinforced by the fact that all the men in cap'nfart's fic (especially the ones that aren't a part of the shit-n-piss force) are treated like demons. he likes ingrid, so why would he actually commit to making her a man? when men are inferior to him?

you know how fucking hurtful that is? according to cap'nfart and his idiot little friends, i'm a cis woman because i don't like stereotypical guy things. i like art, fashion, makeup - things he deems girl things, things he says are part of why ingrid is a trans man in canon, supposedly, because she hates them

and let's NOT start on the whole "kronya taking on monica's appearance and name is totally a transgender allegory, tee hee!" is downright transphobic

so tell me, you fucking coward, should i take this lying down? i think the fuck not. maybe shut the fuck up about calling someone rightfully criticising a bigoted shitfic being just as bad as the fucking bigots

Door's open nonnie

[seirosu]

☆ ¦ difficult person test

Aggressiveness is the tendency to behave rudely and with hostility toward others. Aggressiveness may be doubly hurtful to others if combined with callousness, since the aggressive person may thus be both intimidating and unfeeling in their demeanor.

Grandiosity can be described as having a grandiose sense of self-importance and the thought that one is better than others. People high in grandiosity often tout their abilities and their accomplishments while downplaying the contributions of others. They tend to put themselves on a pedestal and have a sense of entitlement about them.

Dominance is the tendency to put on airs of superiority and talk down to others. Domineering individuals have a strong desire to be seen as leaders and often react with combativeness when they cannot get what they want. They frustrate others by meddling in their affairs and with their attempts to control the decisions of those around them.

[randomnameless]

Lore? What lore? Consistency?

In my Fodlan? Nah.

Saint Indech, one of the Four Saints. He was an extraordinarily shy person.

Turtle : "Hi humans, who wants to get my shiny bow? If you complete and survive my trial, I'll give it to you!"

It is said that he spent most of his life in solitude, unable to open his heart to anyone*.

Turtle : "Hey, it's my totes not niece! I wanted to see you, what's up?"

Flayn : "Turtle and my dad were such besties, I mean, that is what some books say!"

He was, after all, a man who hid himself away at the bottom of a lake.

Turtle : "I'm so bored. I'll crack up a story to lure humans in, and prank them a little!"

You and he are actually alike in more ways than one. You possess Indech's Crest, after all, do you not?

I'm so upset that we never got to play as Leopold or even Ludwig in Nopes, by virtue of sharing Seteth's crest, they must also share some of his personality! We could have learnt that Caspapa bans porn books, or Ludwig writes fables for children!

Just like Ionius, who must love cats, children and songs, and is as timid as the evil lizard lady herself when it come to socialise with people, which is what, surely, the ladies that became his concubines found so charming that they accepted to become his baby mamas!

*my bad, it's a lolcalisation, JP - through google - says he had "difficulty getting along with people and was often alone" (周囲の人と打ち解けるのが不得手で、 よく独りでいたという) - the point still stands, he was getting along quite well with his fellow nabateans and was so "alone" that Nopes tells us he lived in a hamlet, aka, supposedly with other people...

unless nabateans are not people but beasts so they don't count, and which would make a more apt comparison with bernie

Feh :

[slotumn]

I've said before that I like Silver Snow as the bittersweet for Fódlan/outright bitter outcome for Byleth, and because I love making my faves go through it, here are ways I would personally make it Even Worse™

1. The Eagles all side with Edelgard by default.

Most of them have strong familial/financial/political connections to Adrestia, and that doesn't change just because they personally found Edelgard's methods pre-TS unsavory or w/e. Defecting isn't that easy, and defecting after hanging around within Adrestia for 5 years (as most of the Eagles apparently do during SS, according to their bio...?) really isn't easy! You can recruit them back on maps depending on support levels, but by default you start post-TS only with Church members (+AW, maybe)

So yeah already you get Byleth having to fight, and potentially kill, even more of their former students. And if you do manage to recruit some of the students back, it's repeatedly emphasized how bad the risk is for them; they defected from the Imperial army and if Byleth's army loses this war they're 100% getting executed as traitors.

2. You get the battle at Gronder Field, but it's a defend/survive map

Basically the situation is that Byleth's army gets news of the tristate clash at Gronder, and they go there in an attempt to curb the bloodshed. But it doesn't work, and Byleth can only watch as they beat each other to death.

You also get to see in this battle just how badly the war damaged the continent and its people, because the three nations are insanely hateful and bigoted to each other as they fight. People who were former schoolmates are straight up calling each other subhuman beasts who should be exterminated, and it hits Byleth and the player that even after the war is over, that's what you will have to pick the pieces up from.

The "subhuman beasts" rhetoric is also foreshadowing of how the Agarthans may have been involved in stoking the ethnic/national bigotry and tensions— although the lords also bear responsibility for letting all that fester to propel their own goals and/or maintain power.

3. Full flashback/cutscene that actually shows the massacre at Zanado at some point after rescuing Rhea

I think one of the problems around the writing of Rhea/Nabateans in the game is that despite the Zanado massacre being very important to the game's worldbuilding and lore as well as characterization, the way you find out about is very underwhelming. And if I remember correctly you don't even hear it in SS, just VW, as infodump. I think actually showing the event would both make SS stand out from other routes, and do it justice as Byleth's route by connecting everything about how they came to be.

If you put the scene in before Shambhala, hearing the Agarthans call Nabateans subhuman/beast in the flashback also connects the dots from what you heard at Gronder, and further solidifies why Byleth has to go kick Slither ass. They've not only ruined Fódlan society from Zanado massacre to now in their arrogant, selfish pursuit of power, they were in fact directly responsible for the worst things Byleth had to go through.

4. Proper coronation scene for Byleth right before the final battle

Again, if Silver Snow is the Byleth route, I think they should get to have this one. Edelgard gets her coronation scene pre-TS, Dimitri gets his return to Fhirdiad scene, and Claude... okay he's kind of an exception because his coronation would be in Almyra but yeah. This would be good for a couple reasons.

First, coronating Byleth being the last thing Rhea does before she possibly dies is a good way to wrap up her character arc, especially if you get a CG that's a clear parallel to Byleth sitting on the throne in White Clouds. Byleth isn't Sothis, but Byleth has accepted their role to lead Fódlan to a better future as all of them wanted.

Second, it's more emphasis on the bittersweetness, because while Byleth did agree to be king, a large part of why they did is because there is literally no one else suitable left. They killed Edelgard, Hubert, and possibly other Eagles with their own hands. Most of the Lions and Deer died screaming bloody murder at Gronder. Rhea's health is in decline. The war shredded the administrative capabilities and functions of the entire damn continent, and Byleth has to pick up the scraps.

A good way to visually represent Byleth being the only one left would be having a CG where they're standing alone in their royal robes (Enlightened One outfit) with Aymr, Areadbhar, and Failnaught hung up on the walls. That's the legacy of the three kids they met that fateful day: three weapons that maim and kill, three razed (former) countries, and countless dead.

It also gets even more tragic that the first thing you have to do after becoming king is (possibly) killing Rhea. Like holy shit Byleth genuinely cannot catch a break.

5. Unique post-final battle scene instead of S-support scene if Byleth doesn't choose anyone to S-support

Actually I think this would be good in all routes, not just SS, but again if SS is Byleth's route then I think this would make the narrative the strongest there. Basically, we get to see a cutscene that hints at what Byleth does on their own when everything is over.

It doesn't need to be too explicit about what they get up to— just the hint that, despite everything, time marched on, and despite everything, life continued. Maybe even a book ends thing where they wake up from dreaming about all the events that happened through the game (Awakening-style lmao)

Tl;dr Silver Snow could have gone much harder if it let Byleth be even more miserable

[fantasyinvader]

"it's got to the point where they're misinterpreting the entire franchise as "fight dragons to free humanity" and any game that debunks this gets criticized for being "poorly written"

That's just an oversimplification of the franchise, as since the beginning the games have made it clear dragons are much like humans with there being good dragons and bad dragons. The good dragons follow an Eastern view of them as wise, divine beings who we need to coexist as they're tied to nature itself. Bad dragons follow the mold of Western dragons, and the ironic thing about all of this how Edelgard fits that mold better than Rhea does.

First off, Western dragons are animalistic. They're simply really strong beasts to be felled. With Edelgard, the Japanese text calls her path the animal path, linking it to Buddhism and implying that she isn't acting humanely or based on reason. She's acting on instinct and impulse, and even her ideals of the strong needing to rule over the weak subscribe to the animal realm which is basically law of the jungle. The strong prey on the weak, who live in fear of the strong.

Sometimes dragons need to be slain in order to obtain something. Like a treasure or a maiden. We need to slay Edelgard in order to free Fodlan and rescue Rhea. Whomever slays Edelgard is crowned king.

The whole rescuing maidens was because it was seen as more virtuous than simply seeking a treasure, with the dragon often being presented as a symbol of paganism. At times dragons are flat out demonic, tied to the devil. Not only do we have Edelgard opposing the Church, holding a vastly different set of beliefs from not just it but every FE lord according to heroes, Edelgard is also designed to invoke demons, specifically Baphomet which is a pagan symbol in her final evolutions. Not only that, Edelgard's beliefs came from the Agarthans whose fall would align with Lucifer's from a Christian perspective. Edelgard's weapon even has the settings on mark of the beast on it indicating she's an Antichrist figure of sort.

Greed is often attached to dragons, while the Buddhist symbolism would link it as one of the three flames. Attachment and greed are symbolized by a cock, a bird whereas Edelgard is the lord linked to eagles. Edelgard desires control over all of Fodlan, shaping it as she sees fit since she views it as her right to do so, and even turns herself into a monster, literally a beast unit, to do so.

Eastern dragons are associated with water, Sothis flooded the earth in order to heal the damage caused by the Agarthans while Rhea is an ice dragon going by her attacks. Western dragons are associated with fire, Edelgard is the flame emperor. Owing to this, dragons also have a history across the world of being slain by storm gods.

Edelgard herself may be part dragon, as the game says her family is supposedly descended from Seiros. We're being told Rhea is her ancestor.

The Eastern perspective is about coexisting with the dragons, as they embody nature itself, whereas the West is more about slaying dragons to show mankind's right to rule over the world. Edelgard repeats that mankind's right to rule the world bit. She rejects coexistence while she is trying to kill people who are part of her own family.

And if you think about the parallels of Fodlan to Elibe, what happened to Edelgard invokes Idunn. Edelgard was turned in a demon dragon as part of an effort to win the war, except it was done by the humans against the dragons. They took away her humanity, her soul as it were reducing her to following the animal path but unlike Idunn Edelgard can't be brought back to the light because she's more than just a victim. She's an active accomplice.

Edelgard is symbolically the game's evil dragon, whereas the Nabateans are the divine dragons which also aligns with them being the benevolent devas to the Agarthans being the drunk on their own power asuras.

[latenitewaffles]

Meet Cernunnos, The son of Saint Macuil, as well as Mortala and Begalta! Or as he goes by around humans, Fionn. He's a combat instructor at the Officer's Academy and a Knight of Seiros who typically acts as Rhea's bodyguard. An extroverted and sweet man, Fionn's known for giving people pep talks after being reprimanded by Catherine and taking on more squires than anyone else ever has. He's got the Crest of Cernunnos, and is the only person to have ever had it; in fact, it's barely recorded in history.

Age: ~1700 (Academy/War); Is constantly mistaken as being 18-20 and doesn't correct anyone. Born on the 16th of the Verdant Rain Moon.

Height: 6'3" - 190cm

War Monk

Crest of Cernunnos

Strengths: Faith, Brawling, Axe

Weaknesses: Riding

Close Allies: Seteth, Flayn, Alois

Likes: The Four Saints, helping people, storms

Dislikes: Horses, people sacrificing themselves for him, screaming

More Info Below and Design Notes below! (TW; Mentions of parent death)

Like most Nabateans, Cernunnos lived in Zanado with his parents; Macuil and Begalta, his fathers, and Mortala, his mother. One day, the village was raided by those who would soon be known as the Ten Elites, and many Nabateans were slaughtered. Begalta and Mortala were no exception, killed by Riegan and Fraldarius respectively. Cernunnos was chased down by some bandits and almost killed as well, until he was rescued by Cichol. He was roughly 500 at the time, the Nabatean equivalent of 8 for a human.

Though Seiros had intended on making him a Saint, Macuil loudly objected. After all, the man had just lost his husband and wife; making his son a Saint would just put a larger target on his head, and Macuil didn't want to lose him too. Regardless, Cernunnos still fought in the War of Heroes and quickly became known as a force of nature on the battlefield despite his small stature and (relatively) young age. Humans for the most part had a hard time dealing with the fact that they were being shown up by a child; Macuil took mild pride in it whenever he wasn't worried sick.

Then, after a battle, Cernunnos was getting healed by Cethleann after receiving a particularly nasty injury, they were ambused by the Elite Riegan; Cethleann jumped in front of her younger cousin, taking the hit from Riegan's arrow. Cernunnos went into a rage, transforming into The Stormbringer (his dragon form), and proceeding to rip Riegan to shreds. Despite managing to stabilize Cethleann and constantly being told by his other family that it wasn't his fault, Cernunnos constantly blames himself for what happened and took on a healer role to "make it up to Cethleann".

After the War of Heroes, Cernunnos followed his father to Sreng and stayed there for the coming centuries, developing an incredibly jovial mask to hide the pain he still felt from the War and Zanado. This clashed heavily with Macuil becoming more and more bitter, until it eventually resulted in a falling out where Cernunnos ran away to live at the Monastery in Imperial Year 937, taking on the name Fionn and joining the Knights of Seiros.

Fun Facts and Design Notes!

His Sacred Weapon is called the Fists of Nemea. They have a built-in 3 pointed twisting blade.

He's met many nobles across the 3 countries and has dirt on several people's ancestors

One of the houses he doesn't have dirt on is House Bergliez; One of Caspar's ancestors, Emmeline von Bergliez, was a squire of his.

Avid reader of legends and a big fan of a particular story called "The Shadows of Valentia".

Balthus and Rodrigue both recognize him from their Academy days and are both floored that he looks nearly identical. Catherine does too, but knows his secret.

He considered Sitri his cousin. When she died, he took a long break from the Knights of Seiros.

While both depicted designs are based on the War Monk, the Academy/War design mixes it with Seteth's outfit and the War of Heroes design mixes it with the Sothis Regalia.

His hair is meant to resemble a mix of Chrom and Cloud Strife's hairstyles.

His War of Heroes design puts him at around 600, roughly the equivalent of a human 13 year old. Why did I choose to make Nabatean aging weird? Idk.

The Stormbringer is meant to simultaneously look Wolfish, Birdlike, and Draconic.

The Crest of Cernunnos is associated with the Adjustment Arcana (Alternative Justice Arcana. If you know me you know why) and is known as the "Cloud Dragon Sign".

The Crest of Cernunnos has a slight chance of healing adjacent units the same amount as the target unit.

[deathbirby]

Nabatean Slumber

After several shitposts, we have finally returned to the lore/theory posts! Just as the title says, we are going to be looking at Nabatean slumber. How does it work? What even is it? This post will be more of a theory-post.

Let's unpack!

Death

The first time in the game that we see Nabatean slumber, is when Byleth was blasted off a cliff. They slept for 5 years and woke up to a continent at war.

Here is the thing though. Byleth did go into slumber but it was not like the other Nabateans.

You see, unlike regular Nabateans who go into slumber to heal from near-death experiences, Byleth died,

"So you've managed to make it all the way to the end. For once, it seems the stars were wrong. My reading of the stars predicted that, during the war, you would fall to your death. But that was five years ago. Perhaps the prediction was true for you then somehow." - Magic Wielder

The fall killed them. It makes sense, no mortal would survive that. This is further supported by other lines:

"What have you been doing all this time?" - Edelgard

"I was sleeping" and "I was dead" are both equally valid answers. Byleth was dead, in 'eternal slumber', except they're able to wake up from it. Sounds strange, right?

This seems to be a thing related to the Crest of Flames. Sothis was also dead when Nemesis plundered the Holy Tomb, yet we are told she was slumbering.

And Nemesis was dead and brought back to life:

"Nemesis? That Nemesis? Do you really think the ancient King of Liberation has been brought back to life?" - Claude

"An incredible power that we children cannot hope to match dwells within the blood of the progenitor god. Nemesis obtained that blood, so it would not surprise me if that were the case." - Rhea

What about Edelgard? Her case seems to be unique. The Crest of Flames doesn't work the same way when you have another crest already. Crest cancer is too strong.

Near-death

I stated earlier that regular Nabateans go into slumber to recover from near-death experiences. My reasons for this are some lines in game:

Afterward, it broke my heart to see how much you would need to rest just to survive. - Seteth

Flayn, a Nabatean, went into slumber during the war of heroes to survive. It was a near-death experience.

She even has a few lines for Byleth, depending on how they answer:

Under a rock... How similar we are! As it were, I took my rest in a casket made of stone. - Flayn

She slept in a casket made of stone. That does make it sound like she was dead. Why else would you choose to sleep there? It could be symbolic or my theory is wrong and slumber = death for everyone.

But here is another theory: sleeping in a casket is normal for Nabatean slumber. It could be why Rhea did not want to bury Sitri. Not just because of the cold, dark soil, but because her resting in a casket implies she could come back.

Oh. Well, I suppose one's first long slumber is difficult to recall... - Flayn

FIRST long slumber? Huh, sounds like going into slumber is pretty normal for Nabateans. Not that that's a huge shock. Seteth immediately understands when Byleth tells them they slept for 5 years.

But. man, they must really suck at surviving if they keep getting close to death's door!

Who else do we have left?

Relics

Ah, right. The corpses of the slaughtered Nabateans. Is their current state a "slumber"? They're dead, Rhea tells us that quite clearly.

Why do they twitch then? Why do they sap the life-force of their wielders? Why do they glow when activated, similar to Rhea's "truest" form at the end of SS?

Are the relics aware, somehow? Miklan turns into a black beast, and Maurice suffered a similar fate. Was that the relics trying to return to their original state? Why does it happen more frequently to a non-crested person, then? Do they see crested people as fellow Nabateans, and thus don't want to do a take-over? Does it take longer because they need time to come to the realization that this is a human with Nabatean blood? Or was it just an act of revenge?

The game doesn't give us any concrete answers when it comes to the Relics. All of it is left vague and up to interpretation.

So, what are your thoughts on it?

[gascon-en-exil]

Another FE16 thing: I found your claim that the various combinations of paired endings among the Fargheus OT5 all exist simultaneously as a polycule, and that actually made me SIGNIFICANTLY happier about my own most recent Azure Moon run. I had to sacrifice Dimidue to get Dimitri's solo ending because, as you once mentioned, it is the only ending in ANY FE to mention Democracy in any form. I got it alongside Ashe/Dedue and Sylvain/Felix (Sylvlix has the blessing of game mechanics lmao) (1/2)

(2/3) so the idea that these endings are just permutations of one consistent five person polycule is awesome because it lets me have both my vague gesture toward Democracy AND my Dimidue all at once! I even got the Ingrid/Yuri ending, which is platonic and gives Yuri a pathway into the Polycule through everyone's bestie Ingrid.

I've played FE16 so much that I stopped caring about which outcomes I actually got in-game a long time ago. Pretty much the only exception is that I always made sure to get the Dimidue death scene in CF, not for shipping reasons but because it makes the map easier if you don't have to deal with Crest Beast Dedue. (By contrast, I always kill Claude, Flayn, and Seteth, because fighting/defeating them with specific characters is extra hassle for no practical benefit.) But you're right that that's a nice side effect of how well all those endings line up with each other.

And re: Part 3 of this ask, it's been a long time since I've partaken of any Houses discussion that wasn't centered around fan wank, so it's an unexpected change even if I've since mostly moved on to other games. I can't take credit though for pointing out either the Dimitri solo ending or the implications surrounding the Nabateans though, and for the latter I've seen others - some of them Jewish, or who have Jewish relatives - explore that topic in much more depth than I ever have.

[raxistaicho]

Invading Engage

Who's ready to see Fantasy Invader try to analyze Engage and compare it to Three Houses, now? :D

As I've mentioned before, repetition of his chief bonkers points is a pretty regular occurrence, so more often than not if I were to continue refuting his newer points I'd just be repeating myself, and that'd be tiresome and pointless. Thankfully, we do have a new one!

And it's... uhh... Sombron raised his kids like a meritocracy. Oh boy.

I feel like if you look at Engage, while not mentioning her the game is pretty good to Rhea. As I mentioned before, Byleth's trial theme song uses tracks that associate it with Silver Snow. Song of the Nabateans,

He's referring to Trial of the Academy.

So first, he's referring to the bit going to 0:40 to 1:00

Song of the Nabateans, which is remixed into A Funeral of Flowers, Rhea's boss theme from SS.

Engage wanting to remind us Rhea is the final boss on half of the routes. Checkmate, atheists.

pointing to Byleth's draconic heritage,

...No. It's referencing one of the major pieces of the Three Houses soundtrack. Song of the Nabateans is reused in a lot of pieces. You know, like how Bearer of Hope, which features in Trial of Dawn, first plays during Elincia's most profound moment in Radiant Dawn?

Edge of Dawn, a song that depicts Byleth and Edelgard's relationship as they end up as enemies and isn't used in it's full version in Flower,

Again, no. Jesus. Edge of Dawn depicts Edelgard's fears for the future and her certainty she'll end up Byleth's enemy.

and Paths that Shall Never Cross, referring to Byleth and Edelgard goin their separate ways.

Paths That Will Never Cross is used for battling any unrecruited character in part 2 - aside from the three house leaders, which includes Edelgard. This song lends more evidence to the notion that Seteth is fated to be Byleth's enemy then that Edelgard is.

This is all associated with a Byleth that's held in the same esteem as Revelations-Corrin and True Ending Roy, in addition to every other past FE lord.

You know what's different between Byleth and Corrin and Roy? Their games have true/golden endings. Byleth's does not.

While the House Leaders do get their bracelet, they don't get much else. No paralogue chapter like the other DLC emblems, nor do they show up in the xenologue. Nothing, just a cutscene where we get them for free.

There's quite a bit of reason to believe that Emblem Edelgard (with Dimitri and Claude) The Emblem of Rivals was a late addition to Engage. Houses and Engage were initially developed side-by-side, and though they had to use Byleth because main character, there was no way to be sure who would or wouldn't be popular from Three Houses. Then it turned out all three lords were well-liked - much to the chagrin of Edelgard haters - so Intsys developed a scheme to throw them all in.

Ironically, not having a map associated to them probably increased their general visibility. I'd bet money that a hell of a lot more people have played around with Emblem Edelgard (with Dimitri and Claude) The Emblem of Rivals than they have the Chrobin duo.

And they do appear in the Xenalogue. Fell Céline carries them in the final map.

Considering how the Cipher card that came with Houses in Japan mentions that it's your story, it's ultimately Engage saying that the game is Byleth's story above all else. Not Claude's, not Dimitri's and not Edelgard's, Byleth's.

... Yes? Byleth is ultimately the avatar of Three Houses, who decides the course of the story.

Fantasy Invader is trying to argue that this means Engage is hinting at Silver Snow being the canon route, except the issue is further down he'll use as evidence the fact that you fight Nemesis in Engage... even though Nemesis is not fought in Silver Snow.

It's funny how self-defeating FI's arguments tend to be. And also sad and aggravating.

Edelgard also says that the three lords protected their worlds, but anyone who has played Houses would see that her route goes in the other direction,

Fixing their world.

working with TWSITD,

Until she turns on them and kills them.

killing/exiling the other lords

Poor Cwaude and Dimitwi. We must not fight for Fodlan's betterment if it means inconveniencing two men :(

and killing Rhea.

Because she lit a city on fire rather than surrender.

What Edelgard did to protect the world is the exact opposite of those routes,

What routes? You didn't mention other routes.

so who really protected the world?

This is just Fantasy Invader being mad again that Edelgard's story is treated as equally valid as any other. Three Houses isn't a story of good vs evil (unless the Agarthans are involved, anyways), it's a story of clashing ideals. And that, honestly, could help to explain why the Agarthans are greatly sidelined in all routes.

Hopes uses Nemesis as the big bad for Fodlan, not Rhea.

And not Edelgard either!

We all know where this next pinheaded argument is going, but I really need to make a post about how self-defeating it is, because it really really is.

Nemesis, who Edelgard makes out to be this champion of humanity,

She never did that.

is the one held to the same level as Loptyr, Grima, Ashera, Duma...

Keep this bit in your head.

Nemesis was the bad guy, Rhea killed a bad guy

Yeah and in KOTOR you kill Malak whether you're Light Revan or Dark Revan, but that doesn't meant Dark Revan isn't a complete monster.

Also, I guess this means then that Duma is a bad guy, responsible for all the problems!

Jeddah finally beating the "caused all the problems" allegations!

and Edelgard killed her while praising the villain.

Again, Edelgard never praised Nemesis, and again, Edelgard killed Rhea because she forced her hand.

Claude's route is the one that tackled the supposed big bad therefore it's the one more in-line with past FE heroes, and by extension Dimitri and Byleth's routes.

Woah, I hope you remembered to stretch before that reach, Invader. Maybe he played a version of Three Houses that I didn't, because I recall a distinct lack of fighting Nemesis in the end of Azure Moon or Silver Snow.

There's a reason people feel that the final fight against Nemesis in Verdant Wind, while undeniably cool, came out of fucking nowhere.

Also, FE tradition involves killing a dragon at the end of the game. Medeus, Duma, Medeus again, Loptous (via his meat puppet, Julius), Iduun, the generic Fire Dragon, Ashnard (riding a dragon), Grima, Garon, Anankos (also via his meat puppet, Takumi in Conquest), Rhea, and Sombron. The only exceptions are Veld in FE5, Fomortis in FE8 (because FE8... is really weird and involved demons when other games didn't), Ashera in FE10, and Edelgard and Nemesis in Houses.

Even how we get Byleth's ring calls back to Silver Snow. Hortensia was an academy student, a princess borne of a concubine,

The comparison to Edelgard is deliberate, he's framing Hortensia as the anti-Edelgard. It doesn't work, as usual.

her father was manipulated by Sombron's forces into doing their work,

mind-controlled, rather, but yeah. Also it's worth noting that Hyacinth probably would have done Sombron's bidding anyways since he worshiped him.

her former classmates defect to the Divine Dragon's side and she does as well in the end

You've got that backwards, dunderhead. Hortensia defects first, then her classmates defect to be at her side - which barely constitutes a defection since they're just following their liege's example.

even if it means fighting against her former country. Compare this to Edelgard, who joins the academy, is a princess borne of a concubine, implications Ionius was a puppet for TWSITD to push Edelgard into stating the war to kill their ancient enemy,

That last part isn't accurate, but Fantasy Invader gonna Fantasy Invader.

her classmates defect in Silver Snow despite fighting against their homeland

Not if they fell during White Clouds, actually. Then they just stay at Edelgard's side, much like Rosado and Goldmary do Hortensia's.

and possibly their own families while Edelgard...continues attacking the rest of the continent using the monsters that were once men TWSITD provided her. Her own version of the Corrupted.

Jesus, if Demonic Beasts in Three Houses were as numerous as late-game Corrupted in Engage, maps would get really fuckin' long.

Anyways, that's another reach. Edelgard has soldiers that are genuinely loyal to her and believe in her vision.

Bonus point is that Hortensia prides herself on being a "cute" girl, while Edelgard's depth comes from her both being a violent conqueror...and a cute girl.

Again, no. Edelgard's contrast the devs spoke up lies between her endearing and her strong-willed sides. "Violent" and "girl" are not a contrast at all, just look at Estelle Bright!

If anything, Hortensia went down the path Edelgard refused to do, hence why she's a hero in the end.

Hortensia's a hero in Invader's eyes because she fought the dragon who established a fake religion with himself at the center of it through which he dominated a country, while Edelgard's a "villain" in Invader's eyes because she fought the dragon who established a fake religion with herself at the center of it through which she dominated a continent. Checks out.

Lumeria being a dragon living at the center of the continent, worshiped as divine? GOOD GUY.

Ah, what an amazing argument. "Lumera is a good divine dragon, therefor Rhea is also good!"

Doesn't matter that she did something to Alear that changed them, it saved Alear's life and not treated as a bad thing.

...Yes, because what Lumera did to Alear was for the express purpose of saving Alear's life, and was done with Alear's implicit permission.

What Rhea did to Byleth might've initially been for the express purpose of saving Byleth's life - we only have Rhea's word, the word of a liar as evidence - but what she continues to do by the year 1180 is to erase Byleth's personality and replace her with Sothis.

Lumera would have never ever done that to Alear. Because Rhea is a deconstruction of the series theme of divine dragons being good, and Lumera is not.

Lumera - at least to the best of our knowledge - didn't craft worship of the Divine Dragons the way Rhea concocted the Church of Seiros and the worship of her dead mother (whom she supposedly speaks to). Lumera doesn't live above humanity the way Rhea does, nor does Alear. She didn't create teachings or rules to control humanity the way Rhea did.

Being the Divine Dragon in Elyos appears to be a life of service to the people, going to them and protecting them. Being the Archbishop of the Church of Seiros means living in luxury and safety in Garreg Mach while the rest of Fodlan burns. Just look at how blithely unaware Flayn was about how bad the rest of Fodlan was before the time skip in Silver Snow.

Rhea is a deconstruction of everything a divine dragon is supposed to be in this series, but Edelgard's haters just never got the memo.

Naga was reclusive, living apart from humanity except in times of peril to protect them. Tiki is humble and just wants friends, even into adulthood. Duma and Mila set themselves up as gods because they were prideful, and were banished by Naga for their pride. Naga wanted the dragons to set aside from their pride and live as and among humans to avoid madness.

But Rhea doesn't live with humanity; she lives over them.

Compare Rhea's bedroom with Alear's:

Alear doesn't even get a pillow, guys! That's how you know they sacrificed for their friends: they gave their pillow away so Sommie could have two. Because Sommie gets everything.

Alear's hair changing color is also seen as a good thing, with it returning to it's natural red is the bad ending.

It's like Fantasy Invader's brain just stops at "their appearance changed" when discussing Byleth after chapter 11, and not what it means that it changed, or what it would mean if those changes were allowed to deepen, as Rhea wished they would.

It would mean Byleth's death as a person.

Meritocracy isn't so good when people are tossed away for not serving their master well enough, people without merit being labelled as defects.

Oh my fucking god. "Sombron treated his minions like it was a meritocracy!" Somehow, Fantasy Invader's concocted an even more headass take than, "Edelgard is a social darwinist!"

At least if Edelgard genuinely was a social darwinist, as her haters have tricked themselves into believing, she would reward her successful minions.

Sombron doesn't do this.

Take Hyacinth: he succeeded as Sombron wished, returning him to the world and restoring his powers, and with barely any help from Veyle or the Four Hounds, no less. Hyacinth's reward? Om nom.

There is no measure of loyalty or success good enough for Sombron. As Past Alear says themselves,

If I lose to you, [The Corrupted] will kill me. No… No, they will kill me, in time, no matter what.

Past Alear knows very well that the only reward Sombron offers his loyal minions is inevitable suffering and death. This is not a meritocracy, this is a horrific autocracy.

Doesn't really surprise me Houses discourse hasn't died down after Engage, Engage made Edelgard look like shit. Especially compared to Hortensia.

Houses discourse hasn't died down after Engage because there's nothing to talk about with Engage. Engage has such a nothing plot with black and white morality, simple characters, and basic motivations that the most heated that Engage discussion ever got was over something as ridiculous as whether or not it's incest if Alear bangs the fell Xenalogue twins. Engage is that bare-bones, so of course the fanbase just stuck with the game where there's actually something to discuss.

So uhh, yeah, Engage doesn't support FI's anti-Edelgard take as well as they think they do.

In fact, the Fell Xenalogue supports it. the FX portrays one rogue dragon, when completely bereft of anything to stop them, destroying an entire world. The FX portrays the countries as falling into ruin if their royals were worse people, because really who's gonna stop them, they're the monarchs of absolute monarchies.

[butwhatifidothis]

Talking from a fe3h discourse perspective I get hating Rhea, as a Rhea lover. To a lesser extent I GUESS I get Seteth. But Flayn??????? She's just vibing and eating fish??? She has NOTHING to do with Rhea's decisions? Like at that point you're (not you op, general you) just looking for issues. To be clear if you hate her because of her personality or whatever sure, to each their own. But hating her because "church bad" feels really stupid to me. That's like a rhea/church fan hating the black eagles on principal because they're part of edelgard's house or because they don't hate edelgard.

When you realize they ascribe to this kind of mentality

it starts to make a lot more sense. Yeah, if two members of a race being bad if enough for you to ascribe malice and evil to every single member of said race, it's pretty easy to also say that the very blood of that race is evil and having it course through your veins makes you evil.

Which they've been saying for a while now!

Yes, you are in fact seeing a ~year-and-a-half old screenshot of them saying the exact same racist garbage they're saying now.

Also, just. This fucker keeps repeating this stupid fucking point about Nemesis and frankly it pisses me off.

Two years. From as early as two days ago (as of July 11th 2024) to as far back as two fucking years, they've been repeating "Nemesis couldn't have been THAT BAD you guys, because the people he's been tyrannically ruling over for over a century and who didn't know the full extent of his actions which include the genocide he committed believed in the lie about him being a liberator! A supposed liberator of a group of people these oppressed ignorant civilians would have had literally no contact with whatsoever given Nemesis has been ruling for over a century! Meaning any human alive during the actual reign of the Nabateans would have been fucking dead by the time Nemesis was killed, meaning any alive during Nemesis' reign had no way of knowing how that rule actually was! This lie was so imprinted into the people's conscious that Rhea couldn't erase it, so it has to be true and not a lie anymore!"

Literally saying that Nemesis was right to do what he did because he said he was and the people who had no choice but to believe him believed he was. Like I said, they are so fucking desperate to defend this genocider and to degrade the Nabateans as an entire race to be biologically inclined towards evil, and have been desperate to do this for years.

Here are a couple more choice words Shandale has said!

"He didn't genocide them because he WANTED to, he did it because he HAD to! If he didn't, anyone he brought with him to genocide the Nabateans would have been killed!"

Oh, but silly me! What I am talking about?

It wasn't a genocide! It was getting rid of oppressor and conquerors! Those oppressors and conquerors, you know, just so happening to be the entirety of the Nabatean race.

Which, hm! Guess what nonnie!

Explicitly includes Flayn! Someone who literally never did anything to anyone! Oh, except be willing to kill followers... who are a direct threat to others and are desecrating her mother's grave. Oh, but who cares about silly little nitpicks like that, she's willing to kill her followers!! ...Oh wait, there's only reference to Cichol in that paralogue? Cethleann isn't even mentioned once anywhere in the paralogue? Like literally anywhere? Bah! Who cares! Flayn is evil, just like all the other Nabateans! Let's """"""""joke"""""""" about killing her over and over and over and over and over again!

Teehee isn't it so funny guys! They're killing Flayn, haha, soooo funny! Ignore how they think Flayn's race in its entirety needs to be killed and how they lie about what Flayn's done to paint her as evil, they're just jokingly killing Flayn and joking about how fun they find the idea of killing this member of a race they clearly hate over and over keekeekee!!! This race isn't real guys you're not allowed to find this disturbing plus they're just joking anyway hahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!

(there's actually more of these "jokes". Like way more of them. Just, lettin' everybody know)

And, oh, wow!

This includes Indech and Macuil! Nabateans who cut off all contact with humanity after they had helped kill the genocider of their race. Macuil isn't even in Fodlan anymore, he's in the middle of a Sreng desert, but, nope! They helped kill Nemesis, meaning they are also completely evil :)

Funny how every single Nabatean who stood up against the human who killed them all is deemed irrevocably evil no matter what, but the human Agarthans are just poor little victims who deserved more nuance and sympathy even after they literally murder children. But we're the mean ones for pointing all of this out as bad tho

[randomnameless]

The idea that SS says the Church needs to be rehabilitated in Rhea's ending is entirely on the translation. The Japanese text says that "Meanwhile, Rhea, who survived, returned to her duties as archbishop after she recovered her strength, and she aligned herself with the unified kingdom, working to rebuild the church and help people suffering from war damage." And while I've mentioned Claude's endings with Flayn before regarding Wind, the endings mention that the new order/society of Fodlan is built by the heroes who saved Fodlan which would include the CoS.

Pat really hated Rhea it seems if he does that to her ending. Her rebuilding the CoS? That's not good, she needs to make them atone. But then again, he also tried to make it so that Edelgard had similar ideals to Claude when the game ultimately says otherwise.

Oh I know, I've read your posts about this lol

TBH, while Pat is to blame for the Pat'd script, the Church, as in Rhea's church, is always depicted as needing/being reformed : it wasn't in SS's ending proper, but in Rhea's own S Support where she blames herself for, well, everything that happened but also confesses she used her position as the Archbishop for her personal plan to see her mother again...

And yet, if we look at her actions - and the ones that can be tied to her "rez Sothis plan", bar maybe making Sitri a priest/nun, what did she meant by the "took advantage of my position of the Archbishop"/"used my position as the Archbishop" to see her mother again?

In this S-support, Rhea herself considers her CoS/her lead of the CoS might be to blame for Supreme Leader's war and gives "empty" criticisms to her actions : emtpy as in, well, the game doesn't bother telling/showing what were those "occasions" where Rhea explicitely used her position as the Archbishop to make her wish come true.

Maybe if we pull our hair a bit, we can say the "Billy sitting on the chair" ceremony? That was made to "bring back" Sothis and she asked Billy to do that as their boss and the Archbishop of the CoS?

In a nutshell, it's less "the church needs to be reformed" in SS, but more "Rhea acknowledges she did BaD things (which are?) and used the CoS through her position as the Archbishop to do so (receipt not found?)" so with Billy and in the epilogue, obviously she doesn't do those "BaD" things anymore and their work is miraculous.

As for Claude, while he does "fall in love" with Flayn who is working in the Church with her Father - and this ending obviously cannot be triggered if Claude ends with Billy - Claude's very own words in his Billy S-support, imo, cannot be ignored, while Billy will take Rhea's role as the one people will rely on, he wants Billy to create a Fodlan with "new values" that won't exclude people for being different... implying Fodlan had such values before the War, CoS included - when we know, even in FE16, that this is bullshit!

So while Claude can end up with Flayn despite her being a member of the Church, she's a member of the post-VW Church that is "reformed/different" from the old church, because in VW, the Church has "new values that don't exclude people for being different".

So back to the original post

Compare with Houses, who always removes Nabateans/Rhea of the picture (except in SS’s S support) and brings “reforms” to the CoS - because it needed some, even if we will never know what they are or why those reforms were needed.

SS's reforms are less "reforms" and more "Rhea reckons she did BaD things so will stop doing them now".

The icing on the cake takes the form of Seteth'n'Flayn's paired ending, let it be in the lolcalised or even in the OG (Googled though!) script :

While Flayn disappeared soon after the war, Seteth stayed at the monastery and worked to restore the authority of the Church of Seiros. Doing away with his old strictness, he adopted a tolerant stance toward all, and encouraged his followers to do the same. When he was satisfied that the message was received, he vanished from the monastery.

In the lolcalised version, Seteth adopts a tolerant stance toward all (which he didn't have before?? Source?) and asked his followers to do the same (which he never did before either???) and apparently, when he was satisfied because his message not to be, uh, asshats was received, he finally left the monastery.

Because obviously, under the old CoS, when he was leading investigations against the Western Church and called names by those same people because his creed and followers are "too tolerant", he, uh, wasn't "adopting a tolerant stance toward all and encouraging his followers to do the same".

In the JP version :

フレンは戦後まもなく姿を消したが、セテス はその後も大司教補佐として大修道院に留ま り、教団の権威回復に努めた。かつての厳格 さは鳴りを潜め、何事においても寛大な措置 を取るよう運営方針を転換。時代に即した教 義の改革を妥協なく推し進め、信徒に混乱の ないことを見届けてから大修道院を去った

Google'd it gives some :

Flayn disappeared shortly after the war, but Seteth remained at the abbey as an assistant archbishop and worked to restore the authority of the order. His former strictness has subsided, and he has changed his management policy to take more lenient measures in all matters. He uncompromisingly promoted doctrinal reform in line with the times, and after seeing that there was no confusion among the faithful, he left the abbey.

So, sure, there's no fuckery about "a tolerant stance" because the JP script is more coherent with, well, the general script, it's more like Seteth finally stopped being so strict and became a tidbit more lenient.

And yet...

What are those "doctrinal reforms in line with the times"???

How did he change the CoS' doctrine, sure, it was to be "in line with the times", but what was changed?

This ending basically tells us - something Seteth also says in Nopes' expedition lines or in his Tea time lines? - that he doesn't agree with the doctrine (whatever it is he doesn't agree with) and since Seteth is a playable character who can be supported, his PoV is obviously biased as in, for the player, Seteth is the kind guy so if he says the CoS' doctrine needs reformation, he won't reform it to put some "might makes right" rule, but obviously reform it for the better.

What is that "better doctrine"?

This ending can be obtained in all routes where Nabateans aren't hunted to make a world "for humanity", even in SS where Rhea'n'Billy work together to make Fodlan prosperous and miraculous so... in all routes, the Church is reformed.

Houses wise : the Church is always reformed/needs reformation/did BaD things we never saw -> which serves to make it more "shady" and pretend to have "earl grey", because if the Church always needs reformation, then Supreme Leader targeting it isn't completely unjustified and nonsensical, right?

But when Nopes drops FE16's framing a little bit and we see, maybe for 15 seconds, the CoS do stuff... well, even if Seteth mentions "not agreeing with all tenets", from what we see and hear about the CoS, his doubts don't have the same weight since, hey, we witness the "help other if they need it" tenets, "don't impose the CoS' values on people who aren't from Fodlan" tenet, "we will repay our debts" tenet, etc etc.

Is this the part of the doctrine Seteth disagrees with? This doctrine needs reformation?

Tl;Dr : Church BaD which is why Supreme Leader's war isn't completely nonsensical and why the self insert of this opus can rightfully become God and run the show better than anyone who was there before, but we will never show us what this "BaD" entail, we just are told about it.

In turn, this creates Earl Grey and the "morally grey masterpiece uwu" reputation this game has - Agarthans have no place in this Earl Grey masterpiece, that's why some people try to come up with reasons or justifications to explain why they aren't that worse than the faction the game uses a piñata despite showing us all the "not BaD" things they do.

[lumeha]

Like. I need everyone to understand how low-key feral I am over Thales and Nemesis as toxic old men yaoi. Not even just for the joke, even if I'm saying it jokingly.

Thales sees Nemesis as nothing more than a feral beast, a thief, something lesser than him that he can direct as he wishes.

I want a Thales who holds Nemesis' chin and treats him like a barely trained hound, a vicious dog who has received the most precious and disgusting treat ever in the form of Sothis' corpse.

I want Thales to fucking feed him her corpse himself and hover over the Agarthan working on the Sword of the Creator and sneering in disgust but at the same time being fucking glad to see this feral beast of a man holding her spine and slashing through people as if they were butter.

I want a Nemesis who knows that he is where he is because this wretched man has taken him and given him power and while he treats him as nothing more than dirt beneath his boot, he laughs at the face of his underlings who might have wanted what he has given to Nemesis, and he knows that he is nothing more than a vicious dog to this man and yet

I just want Nemesis coming back from Zanado, covered in Nabatean blood, and Thales sneering at him and wiping his face and digging his nails into his skin but still taking the time to force him to get his wounds healed and relishing into those splotches of Nabatean blood, without knowing they both created the one who is going to defeat them at the end of the road

(I want Thales, fucking Thales, to sometimes haunt the catacombs of Shamballah and looking at the kept alive corpses of Nemesis and the Elite and kind of wishing he could have that dog again, not out of love, but out of something akin to the vaguest sense of knowing that when Nemesis was alive was the closest the Agarthans got to victory, and it is bitter and it tastes like blood and an almost defeat and there is nothing to be done except try again and fail again and again and again)

[treemotan]

Anyways still been knocking around the idea of a Three Houses/Awakening AU. More specifically, the idea of the cast's future offspring coming back to the past to ideally prevent some form of calamity. Possibly even averting or at least heavily changing the war and its circumstances, based on the potentially world-ending threat.

Still trying to work out what the threat exactly is, but I find myself inspired by Grima's origins in SoV as essentially a homunculus gone way whack. Especially since Sothis and the Nabateans are essentially the 3H world's answer to the Divine Dragons (and Manaketes) seen in other games in the series. Plus, we know an Agarthan successfully created an opposing entity to Sothis in at least one timeline in the form of Arval, though obviously this would be much larger in scale.

Anyways while cooking that, I did also put in a little thought to how the future kids would work mechanically and I'm developing their characters a bit. If it were an actual game, they'd be tied to their fathers with their mother being variable amongst the fathers' paired ending options (plus Shez, because I'm including them with a slightly altered backstory); the big exceptions here being Edelgard and Byleth, who have future offspring regardless. Probably keeping paternal options with set kids limited to Academy students + Ashen Wolves and Cyrus.

I also like the idea of said kids' hair and eye colors being some color blend of the parents. It may not be how genetics work but I feel like it's a nice way to guarantee resemblance to both. I may have been messing around with this on my phone's art program.

[sheikahwarriork]

Aww thanks you!! Now I can follow you too, because I'm sorry I tend to be really shy when I use anon ^^"

- Reincarnation AU? I can't wait to see how you're going to deal with the concept :] And it's lovely you included Mercedes/Byleth and Ashe/Dedue friendship. Also, ohhh Angst! I admit I looove hurt/comfort-

- You're right, I've never heard of it ( and I know ship like Kronya/Ignatz! ), but it could be so interesting :0 The enemy to lover, the whole confrontation between Nabateans and Agarthans, and their very particular situation- Also very funny, I'm sure they would bicker a lot :] Also, what do you like about Flayn and Shez? And I've heard of Marianne/Ashe before but it's definitely a rarepair, though a really sweet one. Very uderstandable with Dimileth, respect for sticking with your OTP!!

- I've never heard of Annette with Marianne and Bernadetta! I admit I really love developing platonic relationship and this one sounds so nice :] And to be honest I was kinda excepting the Faerghus four x)

- The Black Eagles girls!! ( With Shamir and Thyrus- ) I'm really happy to hear you like them!

- That's good because I love LGBT headcanons >:] Asexual spectrum Byleth is the finest, especially demi! 

To be fair there's not a single Blue Lions that doesn't have homoromantic subtext in some way- Dedue with Dimitri and Ashe, Annette with Mercedes, all the coding with Ingrid, and I don't think I even need to mention anything for Felix because his ending are some of the most obvious in the whole game. Sylvain is not even just in subtext anymore!! 

As for Sothis there's no way she care about gender anyway- And transfem Arval :0 I really like the story behind the headcanon!

And I'd love to share my thoughts and headcanons!! Though to warnw you I'm very invested in them and I tend to rant :') I have a lot too, is there any specific subject you like?

yayy new friend :3 btw sorry for the late reply, i was busy and then got sick these past days cwc

- yes i have few rarepairs but theyre very weird i know xD i like to think sothisxarval would tease each other all the time, also enemies to lovers!! about flayn and shez, i dont have much ships with shez bc i see them much more as aroace, but flayn's supports with f!shez are very funny and i like to think how seteth would react when hearing the two are dating! his brain first goes "thank the goddess my little daughter sister is not dating an ugly and insolent man" then he realizes flayn is getting laid anyway. eheh

- about annette with marianne and bernie: the idea was born when i first wrote the modern!au, because even if the blue lions are my fav characters, i wanted bernadetta and marianne to be there too since i love them so much!! so in my modern!au, they are all in the gardening club at school, and annie became friends with them bc theyre both shy but also sweet, and annette thought "i want to be friends with them!! they deserve to be happy so i want to see them smile!!!!" (in my au, mercedes and annette havent met yet at the beginning of the story). this is how the "chaotic singer becoming friend with depressed sweetheart and anxious writer" idea was born xD

but enough with my rambling lmao, it's your turn now! 👀 (as you said to me, feel free to respond whenever you can and to whatever you want! also do you prefer my questions to be in your inbox? if so i'll re-write them as an ask to you!)

1) i imagine edelgard is your favourite lord, but which route do you prefer the most?

2) your fav house and characters?

3) what are your OTPs in the game? and rarepairs?

4) i'd like to hear your LGTBQ+ headcanons too!

5) what is your favourite map in the game? and the best class?

6) best track in the game in your opinion?

(i'm having so much fun, thank you!!! <3)

[fantasyinvader]

Considering how Hopes says the Shadow Realm works and how it restored Edelgard's mind in Azure Gleam, this would mean Sothis remembering everything in Houses when she's there is a result of being there. If Sitri was simply Sothis, the new form giving her amnesia like what happens in reincarnation, this would also mean that Sothis also saw Byleth as the child they gave birth to there. The child they once gave their life for, and proceed to do so again. Byleth's Enlightened One/Nirvana state isn't just them fusing with the goddess, it's a symbol of a mother's love in a game that focuses so heavily dads. Byleth is the result of both Jeralt and Sothis, Jeralt giving them their martial skills while carrying on the teachings of Sothis unless Byleth rejects Sothis and ends up losing the state by shattering her heart as the Japanese puts it.

Though, this also comes with it's own issues. Sothis only saves Rhea if Byleth is very close to Rhea, otherwise Rhea dies. The fact that Jeralt's death in Hopes, when Sothis has supposedly has her memories, causes Sothis to try and take over Byleth's body to enact revenge for the death of her lover. It would mean that Relics are pseudo-bodies meant to trap the souls of Nabateans, but it could be fixed by Sothis if she takes them back into their care. It raises the question of what's the deal with Flayn having her mother's Crest Stone and Sothis initially thinking Flayn is just a new body for her. It also means Sothis is willing to help kill Rhea in Hopes, despite Rhea's death breaking her heart in Houses, though this means Shez has to go against their Agarthan nature which seems out of character considering they're meant to be an Asura in their own right. Is she seeing Rhea's death as a temp thing, like putting her in time-out? Considering the titles she gives her supposed children, does she see them as actual people she created with Byleth being the exception due to actually giving birth to them?

Hopes really did a number on Sothis with it's devs wanting to portray her as the terrifying monster the Agarthans saw her as.

[kyogre-blue]

CF, let's go!

Immediately more amusing than SS by virtue of the fact that I care about the enemy units. Yes, Rhea looks so cool, Flayn is so cool, Catherine yeeeeeah. Very nice, I'm very happy.

Jokes aside, CF is looking very interesting from the perspective of speculating about 3H's production process.

From what I recall of the interviews, it seems they added CF comparatively late, due to simping reasons. That's interesting in itself, because Edelgard was given a lot of focus in development, given stuff like the early drafts of her also being able to Divine Pulse. But I guess it was only later in that they realized that, yeah, giving her a route would be cool and probably the most unique thing they could do.

Anyway, given its weird development, CF has a lot of strangeness about it. It's the shortest route by a good margin (VW and AM have 10 chapter each, SS has 9 due to Gronder being cut, but CF has only 6). There is only one actually unique map, I believe (Tailtean), but the chapters are reshuffled in completely different order from VW-SS-AM having basically the exact same progression. At the same time, is a very obvious lack of pre-rendered cutscenes and even in-engine scenes to some extent.

So the impression I get is that it was added late, so they couldn't produce certain assets like cutscenes or more than six chapters, but at the same time, they had a lot more passion for it, since they created a unique progression and honestly Edelgard has been emoting more in one scene than the entire Academy phase.

My dudes.... perhaps you should have started from the villain route and just gone full in, instead of the limp-wristed SS stuff, which supposedly was written first out of everything.

Live blogging notes:

I like how Edelgard is in her school uniform during the pre-battle scene in the Holy Tomb, but is then in the Flame Emperor outfit post-battle. Girl took the time to change, I see. It's not really a huge deal, but it's so lacking in attention to detail, sigh.

Man, furious antagonist Rhea is so cool. Very nice.

The Immaculate One is just a still here, where it was always a cinematic in the other routes.

"The monsters that have controlled Fodlan in secret for far too long" Edelgard again attributing things the Agarthans have done to the Nabateans.

We book it. Only respect for Rhea.

Hum... all the BE students escape with us to one of the Imperial army's provisional camps. Except Flayn, obviously. The students give a mix of reasons why they're siding with Edelgard, and they're fine. Kinda mild, but whatever. The music really gets me. Cute bubbly track while everyone is like "well, I wasn't thinking and just ran" or "I have political reasons" and then it switches to Edelgard's imperial march theme, and man. It's really something.

Yeah, Edelgard's anti-Church pitch is kinda... lol. Given that her own henchmen was like "steal all the bones! desecrate those graves! kill everyone!"

"[The Church's] control over the lords of the Kingdom and the Alliance is nearly absolute" L M A O

This is hilarious. Admittedly already more fun than SS.

Edelgard admits to being well aware of how much chaos and destruction she is bringing about based on just her own will. She knows she is the cause of countless deaths. But she still says she wants to bring down the church.

Except, of course, the Church hasn't done anything to her lol Edelgard's manifesto will expose "the foul practices of the nobles from the Kingdom and Alliance" like what tho

Byleth is going to lead a special "Black Eagle Strike Force"

oh ho.... we're exploring a non-monastery area! very nice

Quickly noting: We skip the entire last month of Academy Phase, going from 2/29 for the Holy Tomb directly to 3/30 for the pre-assault camp.

Edelgard B: takes place in her monastery bedroom, which is funny at this juncture. She talks about how she'd like a day to just idle away and eat sweets, and also how without Byleth she would have become a harsh leader with a heart of ice (ok, sure) and how everyone else always treated her as an untouchable princess or emperor, didn't look her in the eye, etc. Ferdinand does not exist, I guess. It's very staple as a concept, but the details aren't really in place for this. At best, you can say this hinges more on her own perceptions -- she never respected anyone else until Byleth enough to let them approach her as anything except pawns and vassals. Self-imposed trials and all that.

Roundup of the kids: Ingrid wants to try to persuade her father to join Edelgard but thinks he probably won't, Caspar's father is leading the "western units" and he'd have had to fight him if he stayed at the monastery, Linhardt calls out that the biggest nobles in the empire stripped Edie's dad of his powers but are now supporting her to smoothly take the throne (weird!), Ferdie acknowledges that his father is greedy and arrogant but feels that he did a lot of work for the empire only to now be disgraced (stripped of his rank and under house arrest), Bernie has less thoughts in her head than Caspar, Felix has like two lines lol, Leonie is just directly with Byleth and no one else, Ashe emphasizes that he can't trust the Church after Lonato and Christophe, Sylvain is kind of mess, thinking of his father, Dimitri, how he might die in the fighting, etc.

Hubert says it's not up to Edelgard to bring the students to our cause, which is... kinda wild. Why is it not up to her. Based on the rest of the dialogue, he means the recruited students from other houses, but uuuh given 3H quality, I expect he says this even if you haven't recruited, and also the phrasing is very vague to begin with.

Garreg Mach has never been attacked, so no one really knows how well it can stand against assault. Edelgard is confident in our power "from a mathematical standpoint."

Ladislava leads Edelgard's personal guard. There's also Randolph von Bergliez. His mother married into Caspar's family but this was after his birth. Unclear if this means he's from a previous relationship of hers, or if he wasn't legitimized despite being from a Bergliez fling. That explains one random battle line I got from him when attacking as Caspar on SS.

There's a couple stray comments from NPCs about Rhea turning into a beast (which happened down in the Holy Tomb where only a few people were, so... curious an NPC knows) and about not entirely believing Edelgard but supporting her for now.

Overall battle plan for the assault: Edelgard (+Byleth) leads an elite force that strikes as close to the monastery as possible, planning to draw attention of the elite Knights and Rhea's ire. Meanwhile, the main forces that marched in from the capital will surround and "annihilate" the remaining areas.

Another still of the Immaculate One after the battle, no CG. The entire scene is just one still, headshots of models talking and some filter to show that "the castle" is "crumbling." And that's it, wow.

Without Rhea fighting Thales and trying to save Byleth, she's well enough to flee to Faerghus. Nice!

Dimitri is King <3

Claude "strategically stirs up conflict between Leicester lords in an effort to maintain neutrality" lmao

Sothis is cool with you even after the Edelgard simping shenanigans, I guess.

The Imperial Army is holding the monastery, which is different from the other routes.

Edelgard emotes?? At the reunion with Byleth. WOW

Another still, no cutscene.

Edelgard's dialogue here... has almost the exact same beats as Claude's which is a bit funny.

Recap again that Dimitri is King and supporting the Church, Claude is being neutral, though Edelgard makes it clear this is a negative. His leadership "has thrown the Alliance into chaos."

OK, so Edelgard directly says we're going to eliminate the Church, the Kingdom and the Allaince. We're out to get them all, and the first target is Claude because Riegan has been standing against the Empire. To secure a route for imperial troops into the Alliance, we'll take out the big bridge first. At the same time, we'll take out Judith and since her territory is on the border with the Kingdom, getting her out of the way will be useful too.