#deltarune theorypost

[spiderqueenpc]

Personally I prefer theorizing about specific elements of Deltarune because trying to predict the entire story is an intimidating and likely impossible task... but I must say, I do get a lot of enjoyment out of the theories that try to do it. It's interesting to see how people build on what we have to make their own version of a cohesive and satisfying story for these characters. I don't think any of them will be quite right, but I don't think that makes them a waste of time at all.

[potabo]

Glad to see I'm so popular (haha)

I think the one thing that might be getting overlooked here is that, if we decide that this scene refers to our two possible mages (realsay and noel), then this implies that we actively lose ralsei as a party member later in the game *on the normal route*.

I just think thats a fun thing to think about

That one damn hospital scene

There's something (besides the creepy faceless angel) that has always struck me as a Little Odd about the light world hospital scene in Chapter 2. As you may or may not be aware, in Chapter 2, the hospital has a scene where Noelle and her father, Rudy, are playing the in-game stand-in for Deltarune, Dragon Blazers. Now by the time Kristoph and Susleigh get to the room, the two are about to take on the

(now if "Silver Drake" means anything in particular I'm a bit lost as to what but, again, perfectly possible) From here Rudy makes the perfectly reasonable suggestion

because this is, as we learn... elsewhere, the Ice Palace boss

in response to which she says the following:

Which reads as "the only party member who can use spells such as fireshock (the mage) is no longer with the party," at least by the point which you reach this ice boss.

This is where things become a Little Odd.

So we, having completed the Alternate Route, establish that we are fighting the same boss, the ice palace drake:

this time Rudy asks Noelle what the game plan is, but this in and of itself doesn't seem terribly significant beyond being one of those Slight Differences we all love (perhaps a showcase of how her Boldness going up means she interacts with the world differently)

but then here's the kicker:

Now there's two main takeaways from this, firstly Noelle is still a bit Fucked (understandably) from the whole chain of events leading to this scene

but secondly and, more importantly, this implies that the game Dragon Blazers- the in-universe mirror of Deltarune has changed between routes

More specifically, the mage in this version has not left the party.

Now I think there are two main ways you can read this with regards to Deltarune as a whole:

This means that Noelle returning to the dark world is a Side B exclusive thing (uh oh)

We fight Noelle at some point (also uh oh), Noelle being the Ice Palace boss, and this is some clever wordplay around how having done Side B does not help the situation (Iceshock being ineffective and all that)

But also neither of those seem super likely to me at least, so theres some room to work with here

[desolationlesbian]

knowing there is a new deltarune dev newsletter long before it shows up in my inbox because my dash is wild speculation utdr theoryposting again

[patchwork-crow-writes]

"Okay, no more theoryposts about Deltarune or Ralsei! I'm going to write some fiction! You know, the entire reason I got started in the first place! Let's just sit down and get this done! I'm good at this, how hard can it be...?"

Sincerely, a fanfic author in the Bargaining stage of transitioning into a Deltarune essayist.

[faye-circle]

Okay okay so I’ve been thinking about Kris. And I have many Thoughts.

Deltarune spoilers ahead! I’m on mobile and don’t know how to do “Read More” :/

One of those thoughts started off with the simple fact that Kris does not like hugs. We know this from Asgore in chapter 1. A lot of people think Kris is going to turn out to be evil. I don’t think Kris is evil, I think they’re a little shit but I don’t think they’re evil. Ppl list various reasons such as: They slashed their mom’s tires (allegedly. I wouldn’t put anything past toby at this point.), They opened at least one dark world, and they’re trapping us in places, to name a few. But I mean, they’re already possessed and that spirit is making them do things they don’t want to. At best It’s making them hug people, and they don’t like hugs. At worst it’s making them kill their classmates. So I have to ask, are they evil? How much possession could YOU take before you started doing irrational things like slashing your mother’s tires?

But then you think, “but if Kris was doing it for attention then why did they sneak out to allegedly slash the tires? Why didn’t they do it in full view of their mother?” And you’d be absolutely right. This leads into the question, how do they function without a SOUL anyway? And I propose a solution.

They’re not.

Kris is shown to have obvious difficulty operating without a SOUL but is capable of doing so. But why not operate like that all the time? Probably because they can’t for long. But maybe, just maybe, we’re not the only SOUL here. It’s possible that, for whatever reason, Kris’s SOUL that they naturally would have as a human is simply... broken. So they somehow were given a new one. So now they’ve got a SOUL and a half. This would explain how Kris has enough will/determination to act as The Knight.

Or another, darker hypothesis, Kris is not being possessed by one SOUL, but two. Us, and the other one. Maybe it’s malicious, but I personally hope not. I think it might just be... young. It would explain the difficulty of movement and erratic behavior. It doesn’t understand what’s happening, doesn’t know what it’s doing. It’s just doing what it knows how to do and whenever possible just wants to be left alone. But then it doesn’t know how to be alone or Kris has a louder voice when it’s just the two of them, so it has to pick its poison. It’s also possible that this is flipped, and we’re the young and naive SOUL, and the other one is reeling from the new “addition” and we’re interfering in what it was already doing. This is a shakier hypothesis but it’s a hypothesis.

Going back to “Kris’s SOUL is broken” it’s also maybe possible that their SOUL has been split. Maybe their SOUL is equally divided between the light world and the dark world, making them capable of breaking open fountains for whatever reason. I don’t have any evidence for this, but it would at least make a cool AU/fanfic if not correct.

And I don’t think we’re “making” dark fountains. This has to have happened at least once before. Especially since the characters talk as if there’ve been generations in these worlds. And it’s not some weird time fuckery because Ralsei confirms time is the same. Jevil and Spamton were both established adults in the world with a job, met someone, and then slowly descended into madness. So I think they’re being RE-opened.

An unrelated thought that would be interesting to pursue, what if we are how Gaster is testing Kris for a vessel? We seem to simply be cast out into Kris just after what is presumably Gaster does his thing and shows you that he has the power here. Or perhaps, we are Gaster. He was looking in the wrong place for a Vessel. He’s been scouring the dark world for a perfect, familiar vessel, when all he needed, was a human. After all, if a monster can absorb a human SOUL like we saw in Undertale and keep both consciousnesses at least mostly sentient (which Gaster would definitely have tried to research as the royal scientist, and may have seen when the player starts uncovering lore in UT.), why can’t a human do it too? Maybe he can’t will himself a full form yet,

But surely a human has enough will and enough determination for the both of them... right? And surely they won’t mind if he inspects the dark worlds with a fresh pair of eyes. He is a scientist, after all. And maybe as a scientist he believes his duty is to do things that benefit monster and humankind alike, and so naturally his moral compass comes in and says “Hey! You should keep the world in balance because no-one else will!” But, like many of us, perhaps his curiosity gets the best of him as he realizes he too, can SAVE. If nothing else, good AU/fanfic idea.

Deltarune focuses a lot on puppets. And it makes me wonder, since it is presumably Gaster who basically said “I hold the power over who you can and cannot be” in the beginning of chapter one, maybe Kris and Spamton aren’t the only ones. How do we know that we’re even making the choices that don’t matter? It’s entirely possible that Gaster could snap his fingers and boom.

Gone.

[coolfire333]

MAJOR deltarune chapter 2 spoilers below the cut!!! 

But here are my thoughts, I didn’t think to type this up as a live-reaction type thing until late in the game so some of this is typed up as I go but most will probably come after I’ve finished

Ok first off, I love the aesthetics of chapter 2 so much!! The first chapter was really good too (I am a sucker for card game aesthetics what can I say) but the music, the enemies, the atmosphere is just so fantastic in part 2.

Toby (and Temmie since I know she does a lot of the spritework and designing) and whoever else was working on this did such an excellent job

I also got stupidly excited over the fact that the original Starwalker joined our inventory and I about died when they started walking behind us. I love the little icon in the menu and it’s really Pissing me off that they couldn’t join the party for real. Original Starwalker appreciation post :)

ALSO unrelated to this area but guys try to go all the way to the bottom of the yellow car traffic puzzle. It’s hard but there is a Funny there, please trust me it’ll be worth it. 

You have to be careful when timing the lights (I think I stopped the red cars before the yellow) and try not to bump into anything so Kris doesn’t lose their speed when trying to get there.

Speaking of dudes who I love, Spamton is absolutely supreme, I seriously cannot get enough of this guy. I didn’t think to start this post until after I fought him so I don’t have any images but his theme music is awesome.  

I don’t care if he’s super sketchy and questionable I’m giving him all my kromer. Going to become a big shot. Also the menu outside the shop isn’t lying his potions really do poison you inside and outside of battle lol

I’m stuck doing his basement puzzle because I have no spatial awareness so I keep dying to the bullets on the teacup ride back up. I’m nervous because this situation is just reminding me of the Jevil fight, I hope whatever secret miniboss comes out of this has a little mercy on me. 

And I don’t fully remember but I think when you first talk to him about the Knight he mentions a “clown,” does he know Jevil? He seems like the kind of character who knows more about things than he should, much like Jevil or Seam. 

Also interesting is the fact that if you go back to the shopkeepers in the city, Kris seems to say something about Spamton to them and they either deny knowing him or say that they refuse to bring his name up ever again. Hm. Someone who’s done a lot more digging into this game can probably make a good theorypost about him but there’s weird stuff here

Also the Queen is so hilarious. God just look at these portraits, they laugh at you when the song in this room gets to the point where the Queen laughs, and I love that detail :)

I hate to make the homestuck comparison but she reminds me of a cross between Kanaya and Roxy and knowing Toby’s homestuck background I do wonder about that. Also more nice comparison to superstar saga but her theme song kinda gives me Cackletta vibes. She is great :)

Also I thought that maybe based on her design that she was supposed to be Lancer’s mom, like the Spade Queen or something, but Lancer didn’t make any comments to suggest that? It does make me wonder where the remaining queens and jacks are, if there are any. 

We see the rest of the kings locked in the basement of the palace (later in Ralsei’s house too), and when looking at Lancer in the overworld inventory it says he’s the jack of spades, so do the other kings have sons? Are there queens too? I’m really curious about this.

Later addition #1: Spamton neo battle?????? He can turn your soul yellow!! New soul mechanics holy crap :0

His earlier theme also reminded me of the songs in undertale associated with the ghosts/dummies, the fact that he has even more callbacks to Mettaton in his later battle is very interesting. This song really reminds of “Ghost Fight” from undertale too. ALSO I can hear the same melody from “The World Revolving” in one section of this song too........REALLY interesting.

Same line as in the Jevil battle too....hmmm :/

Also what is “the power of NEO”? Second time this has been mentioned in the ut/dr series, and iirc Mettaton neo only shows up in a no mercy run? Really really odd stuff happening here

And this is a new game over screen than the usual chapter 2 one! It also says “Please, don’t give up!” after this. I didn’t recognize the text’s voice either...and I feel like the music is slightly different? Not totally sure. If anyone else has thoughts on this let me know. I’m probably gonna be seeing this screen a lot though, Spamton’s hard lol but I still think he’s really cool

OH and after dying a lot (idk how many times lol) it says “Come on, that all you got!? Kris, get up...!” hm, still unsure who this voice is...maybe Ralsei? It’s high pitched but I’m not fully sure it’s high enough to be him speaking

Later addition #2: God that battle was unsettling. “Spamton begs to the audience. Spamton prays to the audience.” is such a haunting line. And the ending...man. Really creeps me out. 

I have the dealmaker glasses now though so that’s pretty sweet. I wore the mannequin with Kris thinking it might do something in battle with him but I still have no idea what it does unless the effect was really subtle. If someone knows what the mannequin does I’d love to hear it. Also I hope we get to see the optional bosses again, I really like Spamton and Jevil...bring them back :(

Later addition #3: WOAH ok sounds like Spamton was making weird deals with Gaster?? Maybe Jevil was too, Spamton does mention a “clown” in his neo fight and he seems pretty upset with the notion that he is a “clown” so maybe Gaster is the one making all sorts of weird alliances with the secret bosses?

Anyway, all the shopkeepers left to gather outside Spamton’s shop in the trash dump and they’re all talking about him, it’s actually sad to hear his backstory...but the last one mentions a phone in Spamton’s room being left off the hook, and when they listened to whoever was on the other end they say “There was nothing but garbage noise.” which is similar to the “It’s nothing but garbage noise.” text that shows up when you try using the phone in the dark world. HMMMMM. 

Later addition #4: 

ROUXLS KAARD!!!!

Also idk if I fully trust Ralsei (we don’t know much about him at all and when chapter 1 came out I read an analysis of him that compared him a lot to early-game Flowey so I’m suspicious of his kindness) but this boat ride was sweet.

Does Ralsei have a little crush on Kris?? I might have been reading into it too much, I’m bad at seeing this kind of thing so idk maybe he just wants to be their friend and feels all sweetly about that but he was very much complimenting Kris a lot and blushing a ton on this boat ride lol

OH MY GOD YES IT’S THE MACHINE TO THRASH MY OWN ASS (almost forgot I made it bi pride edition LOL)

Also actual RK battle heck yeah!!!!

Later addition #5: Berdly has a crush on Susie. Oh my god. I guess that’s kinda cute that he likes her since she was actually genuinely nice to him but oh my god no. I will say that even though I didn’t like Berdly at first, his speech about being the “smart kid” was very emotionally resonant, I really feel for him and Noelle, and he seems like he’s got a good heart. But dude maybe don’t go after Susie (and maybe talk a little less too haha)

Later addition #6:

DUDE this battle music!! This was a really cool battle omg

Ralsei is starting to concern me, idk I’m still kinda suspicious of whatever is going on

Later addition #7: I love how the town now looks omg

They’re all back!!! I love the music vendors :)

Later addition #8: Um so I got to the ending of chapter 2. Hm. I have to think about this for a while. 

But I really enjoyed this game!!! I might boot up another save file so I can fool around with it more, but this was such a blast! :)

[bananonbinary]

i feel like my deltarune theoryposts make it VERY obvious that i listened to tma

[faye-circle]

I wonder if the reason we got slapped into Kris’s body is because Gaster like, Actually Stole/Destroyed the vessel we created for some reason. And we were SUPPOSED to come to life with that vessel. But since we came into being without a vessel, we just kinda attached. I also wonder if Kris knows that the SOUL probably wants Kris to be free as much as they do. I hope so.