#cartersvillerpg

[seblaine-rph]

Frankly, I thought we were over this kind of abhorrent behavior, but I’ve been woken up with a new mess to clean up so here we are. @cartersvillerpg has been condemned for transphobic behavior and a poor response to said transphobic behavior. I would avoid them at all costs, I see members are jumping ship by the dozen, so good on them. This just makes me highly uncomfortable, and the way the admin team responded to this makes me even more uncomfortable. But of course, “that’s stupid” so I should just get over it nd say nothing. Wrong. The admin team can try the pity party routine, but Sebastian Smythe is rock solid and untouchble. If Big Hero 6 didn’t catch me crying, this kind of thing isn’t going to remove my voice or the voices of the trans people this admin team hurt. I’ll be really honest here and say that the biggest reason I’m writing all of this up is because they not only excluded someone for being transgender, but now they’re out here gaslighting, pity partying, and telling everyone to get over it because it’s stupid. This is pitch perfect abusive behavior.

Here’s the rundown:

Someone applied to Cartersville as Kurt Hummel, a trans man. The bio fully explained how Kurt grew up in a small town, not Cartersville, and he came out as trans while his mother was still alive. But after she died, the bullying from town was too much for them so they moved. That was why Kurt was hesitant to come out as gay, because he already knew what it was like. It was also why he was alone in season one and needed to be pushed into socializing, because he was scared. It was explained how his canon facts line up with being trans, including Kurt telling the girls he has his own period. All of this was in the app.

The admins got back to them and said they didn’t see Kurt as trans, accused the player of stealing representation for the poor, underprivileged cis, white men, threw a bunch of excuses out for why they won’t accept a trans character especially a canon character, then restated that he didn’t look trans. 

When told that what they had said was transphobic and that it was transphobic to not accept a character because they’re trans, the admins gaslit the player by saying they never said that, they just won’t accept him because he doesn’t look trans to them. But they never said that. But also, they said it again. 

The player politely tried to explain, got spoken over by two cis women on transgender topics, and then politely said to rescind his app because he was tired of being told that it was “too au” for a character to be transgender. The exact words were, “This is an au rp we know but we just don’t think it’s right to change the canon so much as to make him trans because he doesn’t fit what a trans person is to us as a character.” WHAT DOES THAT EVEN MEAN? It’s too au to be trans? Doesn’t fit as a character if he’s trans? The excuses continued and continued to change until the player gave up because of the rude, transphobic admin team.

The admin team then began to try to smear him, when people got rightfully upset about it, even going so far as to say that “all they wanted was to have an open conversation about it” when the player already tried that in their app and in DMs-- though they should have never had to defend their right to play a trans character. The character should have just been accepted just as easily as any cis character. It’s that simple. It’s transphobic to make trans people jump through hoops just to exist, if those hoops do not exist for cis people. Do you ask every applicant to defend their choice in gender or just the trans ones? That’s transphobic. Treating trans people differently than cis people is transphobic. AND YOU DON’T GET TO FOLLOW ALL OF THIS UP BY TELLING SOMEONE YOU’VE OFFENDED THAT THEY SHOULDN’T BE GETTING OFFENDED! TO SAY THAT THEY SHOULD HAVE JUST TALKED TO YOU WHEN THEY WERE, IN FACT, TRYING TO TALK TO YOU THE WHOLE TIME IS ALMOST EVIL, IT’S SO GASLIGHTY. And a final reminder, there was nothing to explain or argue to you in the first place! This character should have just been accepted as transgender instead of being ridiculed and told “he didn’t have the right look to be trans” and “you don’t want to take away the cis white rep.” The amount of excuses just tells the truth of the matter- they were just that, excuses. 

You don’t bend over backwards so hard to exclude trans characters if you’re not transphobic. This action is transphobic, which isn’t always indicative of a fully transphobic person, but THESE ACTIONS are definitely indicative of a fully transphobic admin team. YIKES.

Just a tip, when more than one person is mad, you probably want to look inward. This might “seem stupid to you” as an admin team, but you’ve squashed equal representation and hurt a whole community. So what is really stupid here is the fact that you think you can post about how you’re in the hospital and this is so stupid so wah baby wah, nobody should hold them accountable. You’re gaslighting the people involved and trying to shove the situation under the rug. Oh it’s fine, just forget this because it didn’t even happen that way. We didn’t not accept him because he’s trans we just don’t see him as trans! It’s perfectly okay to make it harder to join an rp if you want to app trans! NO. THAT IS TRANSPHOBIC. 

Even your post defending why you aren’t transphobic on your main is full of transphobic rhetoric! All you had to do was say, “my bad, we didn’t realize that was transphobic. Thank you for educating us and welcome to the rp! We’d love to have a trans character here!”

What I really don’t get is the admin team is now trying to cover their ass by saying he can’t be trans because he isn’t “canonically trans,” but it’s okay to bend the LGBT umbrella to make the admin’s Mercedes bisexual even though she only ever dated men on the show? That’s not canon! LE GASP! But you sure can post the app count update for the character you excluded from your rp to make sure people see that there was interest in your group!

AND LET’S NOT FORGET, THERE ARE OTHER ANONS IN THE TAGS TALKING ABOUT BEING DENIED ACCESS TO RPS IN THE GLEE RPC FOR WANTING TO PLAY TRANS CHARACTERS. SO THIS ISN’T THE FIRST TIME THIS HAS HAPPENED. Why are we excluding trans muses? Why? And was that you too? Have you been denying trans characters this whole time? You can’t seriously NOT see how trans exclusionary it is to exclude trans muses from your rp. You can’t seriously NOT see how trans exclusionary it is to say that anyone that “wants the honor of bringing in a trans character” has to do it a certain way but cis muses can run wild and free. You can’t seriously NOT see how trans exclusionary it is to assume all canon characters are cis and therefore can’t even be played in an au as transgender. YOU LEGIT RUN AN RP THAT’S 100% AU AND BASED AROUND A TOWN THAT NOBODY ON GLEE EVER WENT TO, NONE OF GLEE IS ACTUALLY CANON ANYMORE BECAUSE THE CAST DIDN’T GROW UP TOGETHER BUT IT’S TOO AU FOR A CHARACTER TO BE TRANS? AND YOU’RE NOT TRANSPHOBIC?????????????????

What in the gluten-free, low carb, sugar-free alternate universe is this privileged bullshittery under the cut?: 

Here they are incorrectly assuming someone else’s gender, cis-cesexist and heteronormatively assuming and ruling the law of the land by their assumptions. Here they are also saying that Kurt isn’t the right fit for a trans character, and telling the person that if they want to play a trans character that they have to app as an oc? What? But remember, they never said he didn’t look trans! “Not the right fit as a trans person” is “he doesn’t look trans.”

And here the player is very politely trying to explain himself! Which is what the admin team is now claiming was “all they ever wanted.” Hmmm, I smell fish and I don’t see an ocean. He was even kind enough to explain to them why what they were doing and saying is hurtful. But do they show compassion?

No! Of course not! They lie! “We didn’t say he can’t be trans because he doesn’t look trans” but they just said in DM one that they weren’t accepting him as trans because “they didn’t think he fit the look.” And now that they’ve been called out for it, now they’re saying they know Kurt’s canon gender. I would really like to know when they sat down with the fictional character Kurt Hummel and asked him what genitals he was born with because that’s the only way to really know gender. Anyone can be trans. Anyone can be nonbinary. It is absolutely abhorrently cis-sexist and heteronormative to say this. 

Don’t forget how terrible it is to take away the cis white representation! It’s much more diverse and welcoming to MAKE SURE you protect those cis white roles! There just really aren’t enough of them out there! Protect the fragile ego of the cis whites! 

The applicant makes a very valid point. The admin team wants to stand up for the rights of the poor, downtrodden cis white to make sure they get their representation because it’s swo twerribwe to “erase a cis white for all the great representation they give to the cis whites” but you’re legitimately erasing a trans person’s narrative here??????????????? That’s how you know they’re just transphobic and don’t want trans characters in their rp, because they put so much effort into fighting it that they even went the erasure route WHILE erasing the opinions and representation of a trans person.

Then you think it’s over, right? Wrong. They still harass the player.

As you can see, they denied an app because the player and character are trans. We didn’t say he couldn’t be trans because he doesn’t look trans, he just doesn’t look trans so he can’t be trans! DUH! Seriously?

[seblaine-rph]

I wanted to say that any apologizing would go to the person, or peoplewe talked too, who felt we offended them. I don't want to do some fake mass apology for sympathy cause that feels fake to me. I'm not gonna sit back and say I fully understand why we can talk to our players about other triggers but doing so for this trigger is frowned upon. As Admins we have to be aware of everything and we are allowed to take time to see if a character is a fit, we have players who are Trans in our group who feel a certain way and we owed it to them to let people voice their opinions. What I'm upset about is how we were accused of wrong doing right off the back with no conversation. This situation is a chance to learn and grow and as someone who has been gas-lit for about 10 years I am offended and kinda triggered you even stated that. But you are allowed your opinions and feelings and I respect that, as I am allowed mine. I would never yell at you for being true to yourself. Hopefully one day people will allow admins the chance to defend their actions before going for the jugular. Unfortunately that is not the case here. I'm not sure what will happen with the group, as I'm not home I can not fully address this. And frankly the stress is not worth it. For those who know me they know what I'm about. And I take that with me. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and concerns they aren't ignored and are being taken to heart and all I wanted was to be able to share mines. Again I apologize for any misspelled words.

Sunshine

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Did you just say that a character being trans is a trigger that you have to talk over? Did you just admit that you excluded a character and had to “see if he would be a fit for your rp” based solely on him being transgender? Of all the things you’ve tried to use to excuse your actions, you’ve said that the app being for a trans character “took you by surprise” and you “had to wrap your head around him being trans.” But you’re not transphobic.

1.) What you did was wrong. There is no "being accused of." What you did was wrong. Stop trying to minimalize your own blame here. That's part of the problem. This was your mistake. Transgender people exist and transgender characters should be as easy and normal to apply for as cis character. You made trans people into a sideshow.

2.) WHAT DO YOU MEAN TALKING ABOUT YOUR TRIGGERS? WOW YOU REALLY ARE TRYING TO DEFLECT? YOU ARE THE TRIGGER, TIGER. YOU. This was never a case of talking about triggers and the fact that you’d even try to say that it was is proof of your gaslighting. This was you denying a character based SOLELY AND ONLY on the fact that he is transgender. YOU ARE THE TRIGGER.

3.) You didn’t ask questions to see if the character would be a good fit, what you did was flat out say WE WON’T ACCEPT YOUR CHARACTER AS A TRANS MAN, HE HAS TO BE CIS BECAUSE THAT IS HOW WE CIS PEOPLE SEE HIM and then get mad for being exposed for it, so you flat out lied about it. The player even tried to explain himself, though he shouldn’t have had to, and you kept telling him that his view as a trans man wasn’t valid because your view as a cis woman said so. People are rightfully upset. Not ONE TIME did you ask anything productive about this trans muse, what you did was outright say no in a million different ways for a million different “reasons.” Stop gaslighting. It won’t work on me.

4.) You’re right about one thing, this is a chance to learn and grow but that chance is for YOU, not the people you hurt. So quit trying to make it out like this is a lesson for anyone but YOU. The one who is refusing to learn any lessons.

Here's the thing though, and I went over this in my blacklist, you absolutely did try to gaslight this player. I know there's an admin TEAM so you might not have sent every DM, but it is excplicitely stated in those DMs that Kurt cannot be played trans because the admin team doesn't see him as transgender. I've seen the player's app, they explained it all quite nicely. It makes perfect sense, I've played Kurt as transgender before too. He is the most popular trans muse on the show, actually, because a lot of trans men identify with him and he does specifically say things canonically on the show that point towards the thought that he might be transgender. He even outright says that he has a period which is a thing that cis men don’t have but trans men do. It means a lot to a lot of people that they got to see that and that they get to headcanon their comfort character as transgender. Canon on the show or au in an rp. 

What you did was automatically stomp on that as a cis person. You didn't do any of what you said you did. You didn't open a dialogue up with the player to ask what they thought and to explain themselves, which they should have never had to do in the first place. What happened was, the admin team DMed this player to tell him that they didn't see the character as trans so he couldn't be trans. What was said was that "he isn't canonically trans so he can't be trans." What was said was, we two cis women, have decided what can and can't be trans. You never asked anyone to explain, you rejected outright immediately. And the player still tried to explain themselves and explain why you had hurt them and what you did instead of taking his words to heart was to tell him he's wrong and once again... you weren't accepting his character as a transgender character. He had to play him as cis if he wanted to play him and that is transphobic.

I would like to know... what was the point in denying a character for being trans? What did you gain out of telling someone they can’t apply as a character if they want to apply trans? What besides transphobia would make you say you don’t want to accept a trans character? You can’t even hide behind the “canon” lie because your rp is 100% au! But someone being transgender is “too au????” And you’re not transphobic? HA! Even what you said in your responses to this is transphobic, you do not need to “wrap your head around” someone being trans! That’s an easy lesson to learn, just oh shit wow I didn’t realize, sorry about that now I know better. Anyone can be trans, cool, education.

This situation could have been as easy as you just accepting the application, because as you stated yourself here you have trans people in your rp so you should want to bring a trans character to the dash to give them representation even more. But instead, you said no outright. What could have happened when the player explained himself was, you could have said oh my gosh my bad... I'm not trans and I didn't realize that you are trans and I don't want to speak over you so because I love trans rights and stan the trans players in my game right now... I'd love to accept your trans muse and please, tell me more about why this is acceptable because I don't get it as cis woman. Instead, he was continuously told no in offensive ways and then you guys attacked him for being upset, accused him of sending anons even though he clearly said all he had to say right to your face, and then gaslit him and the entire community with your post denying everything you did and saying everyone should give it up because it's stupid and you're in a pitiable situation. That's not how this works. Accountability is step one. This should have never happened, that is the end of the story. It should never be harder for a trans character to be accepted than a cis one.

Let me put it this way: You get an app for a black character. Whether he's canonically black or not isn't the point. Your first response is !!!! omg is this realistic for him to be black??? Should I let him in if he's black?????? Should I tell the player to make him white if they want to be let in??????????? I don't think this character FITS THE BLACK PEOPLE VIBE?????? He can't be black because I just don't see it, he doesn't look black to me and he doesn't act black and honestly it's important to get that white representation out there anyway so just re-apply with him as a white person and you can get in. Otherwise, you'll have to play an OC if you want to play a black person. Because we just don't see anyone else fitting the black look. That's what you did, just replace it with transgender. You’re saying someone doesn’t look LGBT to you so they can’t be played as LGBT in your rp. There is no "black look" or fitting the black look just as there is no "looking trans" or fitting the trans look, just like there is no “looking gay or bi” or fitting the gay look. And if there was, it wouldn’t be defined by you, a cis woman. Anyone can be trans at any time. Period, end, point blank. And you were told that, but instead of taking it to heart or asking someone else about it... you offended someone and you can't just wah wah it away because you're in a bad place or because you think it's stupid. I know you've been hurt by admins in rps before, I know that meant something to you. So this should mean something to you too, and not for YOUR perspective. You should feel sorry as an admin that your admin team and your rp hurt the trans community in the glee rpc. Instead of pity partying and telling people it's stupid to be upset, you should be trying to learn better. And I've provided plenty of info for that, so did the player you denied for being trans.

There is a difference between being an admin that makes a mistake and genuinely moves towards improvement and this. Even now, all you have to do to make this right is to move towards trying to learn that lesson you’re so adamant that someone, somewhere needs to learn. Even if you don’t learn the lesson, showing that you’re trying to understand instead of proving that you’re trying to minimalize is everything. I expected better from you because I’ve helped you before and you were fine to go off to me about your experiences and how you felt excluded and how you felt like the admins needed to be exposed so other people felt safe in the glee rpc but now that the shoe is on the other foot...

[seblaine-rph]

i have previous experience (on more than one occasion) with one of the admins at cartersville and she has never once actually interacted with my trans/nonbinary characters and it didn't even occur to me until all of this came out. actions speaks louder than words, babes.

I really hope they're taking these anons to heart, I'm sure they're reading them. Excluding transgender people sucks. They should have been excited to see something new, someone diverse in their inbox. Instead, they used him as a tool to show the interest in the rp while sending him DMs to tell him he wouldn't be accepted unless he made his character cis and his app was kept up on the count even after he asked for it to be removed because he was uncomfortable with their rp. I've had more than one person come to tell me that their transgender characters have only been used as tools for one of the admin team in other rps. They should be excited to play in rps with diverse characters, and knowing how many transgender players are in the glee rpc -knowing they claim to have transgender players in their rp- and knowing that their motto is supposed to be inclusivity, you'd really think they'd be more inclusive.

You can tell that they know this is a big issue to a lot of people based on the post they made and deleted trying to absolve themselves with gaslighting and emotional manipulation. They wouldn't bother with all of that if they didn't get that this is big. Step one, accomplished. Realization. Now we wait for step two, accountability and change.

It sucks that you went through that, and I'm sorry that my posts had to be the ones to make you come to that realization. You're not the only one who went through that and I know it has to suck to realize that someone was completely avoiding your transgender muses. It happens much too much and much too often.

[seblaine-rph]

Again, I don't go here, but I'd also like to point out in that post by that RPG, it drips of emotional manipulation used to deflect blame. That's an abuse tactic. The "I'm in the freaking hospital" so how dare you hold me accountable for my actions is not a good look, regardless of whether it's true or not. That's classic emotional manipulation, and if OP has really been "gaslit for 10 years", they need to do some mental unpacking, because the abuse they've suffered is now abuse they're dishing out, and they need to seek professional help for that. It's not uncommon for victims of abuse to become abusers.

So if OP reads this, please seek help for that.

I wasn't sure about posting something so pointed, but it is true that anyone that has suffered through abuse of any kind - especially for something as huge as ten years - needs to get some help. If you or someone you know has been through something that traumatic, it's okay to reach out and get help. I don't mean this mockingly, or even just to her in specific. It's just the truth.

The manipulation within this whole ordeal from that side of the fence is alarming, for sure. I mean, they legitimately said that being offended by their transphobia was just a waste of time so we should stop because cancel culture is stupid. They legitimately lied through their teeth about multiple actions that they didn’t make and they lied about what other people said only to be exposed by the screenshots and revoke their “I won’t apologize” apology. I'm going to hope that the fact that they removed their "I won't apologize because it'd be fake" apology for mispelling things is a sign that they're trying to educate themselves and learn from this and hope it isn't an attempt to brush this under the rug until it goes away. Because I hope it won't go away. Nobody should ever be told that they can't join an rp because their muse is transgender. And nobody should be told that someone else just doesn't look trans, or that they're not sure if the character being trans makes them a good fit for the rp. Are we harvesting sex organs in the rp or what? Why is that so important? What does any character specifically need to be born with any specific genitals for? Does someone have a certain craving that only a $5 footlong will satisfy? What do they mean by “we’re not sure if he’d be a good fit for the rp if he’s transgender?” Inquiring minds want to know. None of this makes any sense and it was so easy to fix right from the beginning. It's a shame.

[seblaine-rph]

Re: Cartersville, they had a nonbinary Dani (proving they apparently DON'T have issues making canons trans) and the character of the main admin, on at least one occasion used feminine coded language where it wasn't particularly necessary. Heard (from the player) that Dani was then misgendered ooc when the player dropped them. Personally, once upon another time, the admin had ship-like chemistry with a nonbinary muse of mine but immediately dropped the rp when their cis male, not even love interest (seemed more like a plot device than a possible ship) left the rp. The admin has a tendency to ignore everyone in rps outside of her character's love interest and despite playing a bisexual character, has essentially brushed off any possible non-cis male love interests even when no male love interest was present, at least in the rps I have been in with her.

This is another terrible experience had at @cartersvillerpg. I've said all that can be said as an outsider at this point, but I've never silenced the voices of people in the community and I won't stop now. Anything sent in and everything I have in my inbox already will still be posted, just with less from me as the peanut gallery. My final thought on this, until I have something new to say, is that it's clear there is a problem that has been experienced by many.

[seblaine-rph]

I would like to add that the admin that reached out to you has been in an rp with me for months and hasn't ever replied to any of my trans characters. I just looked at her blog and she replied to one trans man once and another twice, he called her beautiful in his first reply so she replied to that. Both were during a popularity contest and both were dropped and neither were reached out to again. Out of months of posts on her blog, in an rp that has a bunch of trans muses, she has three total replies to trans muses and is bubbling with a cis white male love interest.

This isn't the only person that's come to chat with me about trans exclusion from the admins of @cartersvillerpg on the dashes of other rps. I don't see any transgender characters on their masterlist either, now that I'm looking. It sounds like those three replies were those trans character being used as props. But they're not transphobic.

[seblaine-rph]

i'm still in that group, only long enough to see how they address this, and they're lying. they keep trying to defend themselves by saying that they needed to bring it up with the group, which is wrong to do but also a lie because they never brought it up with us. it's an outright lie, just like everything else they've said so far has been proven to be an outright lie. they're trying to cover up their transphobia and hope it just goes away, but this group 'was made to be inclusive' because one of the admins was tired of being excluded from other groups so I hope it doesn't get brushed under the rug. you can't preach inclusivity and use it to get yourself started and then exclude anyone that isn't like you. i'm really disappointed in how this is being handled, especially knowing the admin's own experiences. and still, no attempt to take responsibility or accountability, even though a bunch of people have shown they're upset by this. we're just told to stop wasting our time because cancel culture is stupid and the admins should be pitied.

But they're not transphobic.

[seblaine-rph]

I have a question about canon characters as trans. What about the FC choice? Should a canon character's FC change if they're trans?

Here's the thing, Tiger, and I know this is going to shock you, but transgender people like finding representation wherever they can. If someone told me that they felt like a character was transgender canonically and they didn't want to have to change the fc because they wanted to be able to play the character as 100% canon and 100% trans, I would let them. There are many reasons for that, but the bottom line is that nobody should have to alter canon to "make someone trans" because honestly the whole cast of characters could be trans. You don't know. Hollywood doesn't cast trans characters appropriately because they suck, so what you're doing is oppressing an already oppressed group by telling a trans person that they aren't allowed to headcanon that a canon character is trans. What you're saying is that ultimately, that character has to change to be trans. That character needs a whole new face in order to be trans. But that's poppycock. And transphobic and trans-exclusionary.

I play Sebastian as trans all of the time and I never change his fc because it gives me great pride and joy to think of our resident sex shark as a trans man in exactly the way he is portrayed on the show. I shouldn't have to change anything about Sebastian to make him trans, making him trans isn't changing anything about him. We do not know for sure that he is cis, that is a heteronormative, cis-sexist assumption. I might think differently if there were more trans fcs out there with resources, but I don't think so. This is rp, trans people exist, it should NEVER be a big deal to allow someone to play a trans character. Canon or otherwise.

If it's harder to get into your rp as a trans character than a cis character, you're transphobic. If you're automatically assuming someone is cis (character or not) and adamantly refusing to accept that someone could say they're trans, you're transphobic. If you think you can judge what someone's gender specific is (trans vs cis) based on looking at them, you're transphobic. If you have to "ask your group first" before accepting a trans character, you're transphobic.