#but im so excited to work harder on improving my art

[bobmckenzie]

I need to learn to draw in TRGB style so I can do that thing where you draw ur s/i into screencaps 🧍‍♀️

[larks-birdhouse]

GENLOSS FOUNDERS CUT THOUGHTS

i want to make it so so clear i don’t want to dunk on genloss. this is my braindump and i LOVED genloss. please support young creators as they grow and improve i beg of thee

im putting this under a cut because i expect it to be long 😭

❤️ - negative

���� - positive

💙 - neutral

💚 once again reminded how much ranboo’s acting has improved since dsmp <3

💚 AND a fantastic reminder of how great the other actors are!!!! all the deaths still hurt and the security officers did SO SO GOOD

💚 i love that hetch is more evil now. hurts even more watching hetch manipulate ran even harder up to his death

💚 ranboo has survivor’s guilt :’[ god him slowly accepting it was his fault (even though it WASNT) broke me

💚❤️ i think redubbing certain parts makes sense, but for some reason it was just really obvious during niki’s intro?? it felt so jarring

💙 ngl i paused the premiere to catch the qr code. in my defence i was about half an hour behind already :’]

❤️ GOD i wish we saw more of the carousel folks. so much time spent on setting up mousetrap, so little on them. is that in of itself a commentary? genuine question i do not know

❤️ also i am so sad we didn’t see more of austin’s “hey what the fuck is happening.” there was plenty of it but i want MORE

❤️💙 and i wish there was a little more time on ethan’s fashion show simply because it is funny

💚 the play on words with austin being the straight man is still fantastic

💚 someone else pointed this out (i’m not sure who i saw it from first but i’ll find them) but hetch near exclusively calling ranboo “hero” is such a good detail. not their name, but their character

💙 i forgot about the charlie stream! but honestly i would fully believe that is something charlie would just Do

❤️ I WANT MORE SNEEGGGGGG WHERE WAS HE

💚 the ART!! the DESIGNS of the devices!! adds so much to the story and i’m so glad they were shared. such fantastic art too!!

❤️ the create-a-creature kinda came out of nowhere, i was so confused and i wish there was a bit more buildup

💙 about hetch saying they aren’t themselves anymore: how many times can the actors get tortured and brainwashed before they stop being themselves? how much of them can be taken and replaced before it stops being them? (theseus’s ranboo)

💚 I LOVED THE SQUIGGLES ANIMATIONS!!!! SO GOOD I NEED TO FIND MORE OF THE CREATOR’S WORK

❤️ i might have missed it so correct me if i’m wrong but i don’t think we had the wide shot of the hero-kill-inator or whatever and i WISH we did because it goes so hard

💚 in terms of ending changes, i loved both endings!! both so good for different reasons, and the “thank you” KILLS ME IM SO SORRY BOO I HOPE YOU CAN JOIN YOUR FRIENDS IN THE CANON AFTERLIFE

💙 actually only hell is canon. maybe heaven just Doesn’t Exist. only suffering

💚❤️ at some points i thought the gore was great and at some points i wanted MORE. all the blood seeping out from under the doors, the room they haven’t “reset” yet, the guts instead of food were all great. but i wanted more of surgery charlie’s suffering to contrast the absurdity and just generally more carnage

❤️ i also wish there was more audio gore with austin & sneeg’s deaths. the wall just kind of Stops with no indication of them being crushed and its not apparently obvious that they died

💚 gen zero preview!!! i’m so excited, wondering who will be brought in for that one

💚 hearing the echos of “just let me die” in the beginning was haunting, fantastic stuff loved it

💚 HOW DID I FORGET THE PHOTOS THAT WAS SO GOOD ARE THOSE REAL BABY RANBOO PHOTOS?? INCREDIBLE

💚 overall i quite enjoyed the founder’s cut! can’t wait to see what comes next and i’m so proud of ranboo!!

💙 what is it with media about content creator self inserts that suffer immensely with little to no comfort that draws me in so? why has this happened so many times??

[yuri-is-online]

Hi, im not one to usually interact with others publicly too much (I’m terrified 😭) but I really liked your theory post on the Flowers of evil. I thought what you wrote was very interesting and has made me want to read Baudelaires works.

You mentioned his life as opposed to his work, which I think is just a very interesting discussion topic in general; how learning of a person life affects our view on their art.

If it’s not a bother, I’m curious to know what your opinion on that is?

Oh hello! Not a bother at all, I was really excited when I saw your tags about wanting to read the Flowers of Evil!!! It made me so happy I wanted to acknowledge them but I was a bit worried I would scare you and got shy myself. Social interaction can be very scary.

I'm a bit confused by your question because I can't tell if you are asking me to expand on what I wrote there or just what my opinion on how learning a person's life story affects our view of things so I will answer a bit of both?

There are a lot of ways to analyze stories. Every high level Literature course I took discouraged analyzing things (especially poems) through the lens of the life of the author. This did not mean that the facts of their life were never discussed, it's just that we as humans have a much harder time of being objective about things when we know a person is the sort we disagree with. When we did talk about the author's personal life it would either be after we had talked about their work or while we were analyzing it together because historical context was needed for certain scenes.

For Baudelaire's work specifically, he is very much the sort of person I don't like. He's an upper class, misogynistic, drug abusing, hedonist who thinks he and he alone understands the way the world works because he is above the system. Like most such individuals the fact that the system is rigged in his favor is not something he considers. You could analyze all of his works from a sort of Marxist class theory lens if you wanted to and it wouldn't be unhelpful or invalid... but that's only one type of analysis. His words are really quite beautiful even if I think he is a silly person, and a class based analysis of the Flowers of Evil wouldn't really tell you anything about how say, the poems are structured, his choice of titles, schema, do the poems rhyme etc. It would tell you a great deal about post-revolutionary France, but it wouldn't be something you should do if you're say, an aspiring poet who wants to improve their craft. Or somebody like me who picked up the book on a whim and wanted to understand the sorts of themes it might be taken from it.

I don't know if I am making sense with anything I said there... another big reason why I think this way is because I was a history major. Good history gives the facts of what happened and doesn't leave anything out because it might be unpalatable. The only real way to do that is to read what everyone has to say all of the time and be honest when an evil or just deeply flawed people create something "good." Quality is not an indicator of morality? Is what I really want to get across to people, don't know if I'm at all successful.

[marimbles]

im not in any of the current fandoms ur into (im no longer as into ml as i used to be, but i like seeing ur tags and u have such a sunny personality so i still follow you) AND OMG UR ART HAS IMPROVED SO MUCH???

i remember you would replicate the ml style but now youve developed ur own style and youve got such a good understanding on lighting and colours, and ur lines are so smooth and just ajdkkdksksk anyways im proud of how far youve come w ur art !!

HELLO?? I’m gonna break down crying this is so nice 😭😭💜💜💜💜 thank you so so much! !

First of all I’m flattered you liked my stuff at all haha let alone that you have stuck around despite not being in the same fandoms anymore 🥺 next of all!! What a kind thing to say!! It means a whole whole lot. I think on my end it’s harder to see improvement, so it’s really encouraging to hear that other people can see it. Like intellectually I know I am always improving, but drawing is still hard and I’m always in the weeds of my own work and don’t really get to step back and see a wider view unless I look at some of my old art and I’m like oh hey! I actually did get better bc this looks worse to me now 😂

yeah I was definitely trying to replicate the ml show style in the beginning! I decided to learn how to draw specifically so I could draw miraculous ladybug fanart HDJDJS and at first that’s all I really knew how to do. When I got into toh I didn’t replicate that style but I did incorporate some elements from it. I think I did the same a little bit w atla, and I’m doing it now w the botw/totk art style too. and I’m sure as I love more things and keep drawing it will keep developing! I am also hugely inspired by other artists and I sometimes try to incorporate the things I admire into my own work. I feel like my art style is just a culmination of all the things I have loved so much I had to create about it. just a big playdough ball with a bunch of colors rolled in, haha

Also you’ve discovered my weakness…i have an Addiction….to THE GLOW. moth behavior. I wouldn’t say I have a great understanding of lighting and colors but I sure do love when they’re happening. So I just try to make them happen and I’m like ohohoho what if it were sunset. get this: rim lighting. perhaps (definitelyhaps) a lens flare. God was so right when He said “Let there be light.”

man sorry I always ramble sm this was just so nice and I got excited haha. “I’m proud of you”…trigger words fr!! This made my day, thank u 💜💜💜

[volskayadottxt]

so yeah my goal rn is basically making as much art as possible. ive been exclusively drawing ow characters bc no matter how much microsoft fucks things up i still love them, still love the world.

for me it's painful because blizzcon was SUCH a high. i met up with friends, made new ones, learned cool things, and i genuinely thought things were looking amazing for the game. i wasnt naive enough to expect no casualties from the merger, but i didnt expect it to result in (what i think will be) basically another huge pivot for the game again. im not sure what ow2 will look like in a year and im not sure how ill feel about it come 2025.

season 9 still looks incredible, despite the knowledge that so many amazing ppl who worked on it were laid off. and im very excited for venture. i suspect future seasons are going to be much drier, though, and are going to pivot harder into competitive play as the focus, which would be fine if i was like... 22. i turn 30 this week lol.

so right now im going to focus on improving my art as much as i can. im actually hoping to get two overwatch zine projects off the ground, we will see how those go. im sad, but these last few weeks have given me the motivation to create my own stories for the characters i love. and frankly itll be exciting to make that!

[scatterpatter]

Mnnngh art vent under the cut

I really miss when art was easy for me. It used to come so, so easy, even though I'd say my art wasn't as good as it is now. Like I'd def say I've improved, but its so much harder to get art out now than it used to be

I look back at the art I used to make and I seriously lament how easy it was. Even if it was just doodles, I could get so many out, I remember back in like 2019 i could often get at least one doodle out a day and it felt great. It was my outlet, my way I connected with others, the way I shared ideas and made stories, and now I feel that outlet has been practically severed and it really, really hurts

Artfight def hurts the worst. I was so excited for this year, so ready to reconnect with a lot of my friends and bond over silly AF attacks, and it was genuine! I didnt have any big plans this month other than just doing my job so I was so happy to do this. July last year was awful, I was in a horrifically abusive situation and that abuse reached its peak last July, I was in a bad bad place. But I've completely cut that abuser from my life and I'm in a much better space, so I really thought this July would be me turning things around

But as soon as I got a lot of attacks, I just- fucking shut down. I kept thinking on how much "make up revenges" I'd have to do and it got to the point where I'd get overwhelmed every time I picked up my tablet. What became "Hehe can't wait to make art for my friends!" Quickly spiralled into "Oh god I need to do so many revenges I cant keep up", and it just made me catatonic and I hate that. And the worst is that I know no one's exepcting me of anything, I dont have to revenge everyone, its all for fun- I know its just this expectation im putting on myself and im the only one disappointed in myself but I just cant stop how catatonic its left me and its really tough to deal with because ive only done 1 attack so far. Ive spent the entirety of July going "shit i need to work on attacks. Its ok ill do it later." And now its July 31 and ive only done one. I set a goal of doing at least ten. I thought ten wouldve been manageable, but I just cant do what I used to do and it really really hurts

And I keep being told that Im having a hard month. That works been stressful and working 40hr a week leaves me with significantly less free time than I had back in college, so of course i have less time/energy for art, but it still hurts because I dont. Feel like work has been that bad. Yeah its been bad but ive dealt with horrific stress before and ive handled it fine. I feel like if I go "its been a rough month" ill be saying that every month. And i dont want that. Im really healing and im getting in better places, I feel like still struggling this much doesnt feel "right". Hell my therapist just told me that i might be in remission or partial remission for my major depressive disorder. Like I have a professional telling me im getting better but I still struggle to do something that came so easily and it hurts really really badly.

Im gonna see what i can do for last minute attacks. Might not be great attacks, but i want to see if i can get something, anything out. It just hurts because i had so many ideas for my friends and I dont know what Ill be able to do for them and I feel horrible. I feel severed from them and from my main outlet of connecting with others.

And i know its just a sign of burnout or art block or mental illness or what the fuck ever. But I feel like ive been making too much progress in myental health to be struggling this hard. I love making art and i love artfight and sharing art with my friends but as soon as I try, I go completely catatonic and its really really hard because i used to be able to do this so easily and i want it to be easy again but I dont know what im doing wrong to still be struggling this hard

Idk bottom text

[gretacatchlove]

Greta Catchlove Intro

BASICS

★ BIRTH DATE / 25 February, 1960 ★ BLOOD STATUS / Muggleborn ★ PRONOUNS & IDENTITY / she/her; cis female ★ FACECLAIM / Sydney Sweeney

ACADEMICS & ROOMING

★ PRIMARY SCHOOL / London School of Witchcraft, class of 1978 ★ ACADEMIC PURSUITS / Wizarding Academy of Dramatic Arts, class of 1980

tw: disordered eating

POINTS OF INTEREST

★ She was only fourteen years old when an aspiring fashion designer discovered her in a small boutique in London while she was shopping with her mother. The designer approached Greta, saying she had the perfect look for her line she’d just finished up and was soon to launch in springtime. She’d never modelled in her life -- but when someone of the industry was telling you, that you had it, that you had the look, it gave you every bit of confidence to go through with it. Now Greta’s been modelling since fourteen, in both the muggle and wizarding world. At just the age of sixteen, she was selected for a contract with Witch Weekly. The magazine often discovered fresh faces and now Greta would be one for the era of the 70′s.

★ Greta walked onto a photoshoot with slightly shorter hair once and was almost immediately fired. It shook her up good. She already knew this world she was in heavily depended on her looks, but when something as simple as a haircut or eating an extra bagel meant receiving harsh scrutiny, she began to pull back. Witch Weekly was already searching for a fresher face, because that’s how the modelling world was constantly evolving. She loved the creativity she was allowed to bring onto each set, but maybe this was no longer the career for her. Her mind was suddenly set onto acting, amazed by the way you could be one person on Monday and someone completely different by Saturday with no shaming. There were stories to be told and Greta wanted to be the voice of them. She had never planned on going to school after primary, but she enrolled into the Wizarding Academy of Dramatic Arts for acting specifically.

★ Based on a steady stream of reviews that came in after every production the WADA put on (and there were a lot...), it was clear... Greta needed to work even harder. Here she was again, facing harsh criticisms. Her acting was mediocre at best, wrote one critic. After pulling back on modelling, was she about to do the same with acting? She has contemplated leaving school more than she’s focused on reading her lines by now. Greta’s stressed.

★ Michael ‘Mickey’ Catchlove’s job was something she’d always admired with a full heart, wide eyes, and lots of curious questions. Mr. Catchlove owned a toy shop in the heart of muggle London called Catch the Wonder, granting wishes of young children all throughout the city. She’d worked there a couple of summers, watching in amazement and even feeling inspired to do something herself. Of course if there was anything she and dad would connect on, it was the child-like spark that still burned bright in both of their adult lives. Soon she began turning the drawings from children into stuffed toys, bringing all of their creations to life. It’s been a work of trial and error, but she hopes to start up her own business in the wizarding world, or better yet, add to her father’s. It will definitely keep her busy between lessons.

TRAITS

✓ warm-hearted; optimistic; open ✗ gullible; lack of backbone; easily flustered

OTHER FUN THAAAANGS

here’s her about! and her pinterest! i apologize for her aesthetic DLFL;SJFKJASF she looks like she shops at claire’s 

b/c she has had many brand deals while being with witchy weekly, she has acquired quite a wardrobe and is often giving away things to friends. so if you’re friends with greta, say HOLLA to some new designer clothes LOL!! she feels very fortunate as she grew up workin’ class/not very fortunate at all

muggleborn! so! there’s ThOsE kinda connections to be made too :eyeemoji:

i was not kiddin’ in the group chat when i said i was makin’ this b tall LDJF;LSJDFJSF holla 5′11 and often wearing some form of heel/wedges. we like to see everything, thank you

does anyone have a single dad? asking for a plot ;LDSJFLAKSDJAF NO GRETA IS NOT TRYIN HOOK UP WITH YOUR FATHERS. it’s for something else okay SDFKJLFJA;LSKDFJ

looooves a good cheese board! can’t wait for this retired model to write a book about cheese in her future LMAO chrissy teigen who????

ADHD queen, like all of us

is also the queen of making friends, so i feel like she knows A LOTTA PEOPLE. she went to london school! so anything stemming from that is great to start with. but literally anyone, yes pls. she probably comes around hogwarts whenever they’re putting on a play or something anyway too!!!

if your characters have any bbs or siblings or cousins or little ones in their lives that have made drawings, let greta bring them to life as stuffed animals as a special gift!!! <3

and of course, hmu to plot connections or anything. she is mah child. my day one marauder baby so im real excited to play this new and improved version of her yay!!!! thanks for reading yall <3

[tangerinegod]

Hello! I am sorry to bother you but I am a senior getting ready for college this year. I am in the US and I wanted to major in the same thing you did, do you have any possible tips for me? I still haven't even looked for colleges that would be best for animation majors so I figured if you were up to giving out any tips/saying any basic ideas if you wanted to/if you had the time to then maybe I'll have a better idea! I apologise for if I sound weird! I'm tried to word it correctly but I can't 😿

hi!! i’m totally down to share my experiences! someone else also had some questions so i’m going to put them all together in this post haha, hopefully this helps! it’ll get pretty long so apologies ahead of time but art school is a lot to think about so i wanna be as helpful as i can around it, its a lot of time and money. I’m gonna put it all under a read more cus it is really really long!

i wanna start off with the fact that I had the privilege of attending school in a financially stable environment, my parents were/are really supportive so w merit scholarship i only came out with around 20-30k in debt and i also had housing support my entire time in school. they were ok with me focusing on academics so i didn’t hold a retail job unless i was out of school like summer/winter break. Ofc though i regularly take commissions/do merch/cons to try and pay for all bills that arent rent cus i did want to be financially independent where it was possible. I also did try and work during the semester but everytime i did my body would deff start to breakdown from the fact that i didnt wanna compromise schoolwork with jobs.. so just read ahead know this experience is from a student who was able to attend focusing only on school work for most of the time!

the biggest thing is knowing art school is not required to become a professional in either freelancing or industry! there are a huuuge amount of online tools and classes these days that provide the exact same education and for cheaper too. i think it depends on what experience you prefer/can handle/want but it’s definitely possible to make art/animation art your living without higher education. the thing that college will for sure give you though is the ability to meet deadlines, work even when you dont want to, and connections with peers+teachers. i think the connections part is invaluable because you’re basically coming out with a network of people you already know and who know you! 

also its good to know if you want to attend/can handle art school! it’s a lot of time and energy and students get burned out really fast. the best piece of advice i got before going was ‘if you draw every single day, even if its for only like 5-10 minutes or a doodle for a whole year you should be fine’ consistency is super key because you’re attending school to draw, and you’ll have to create work for stuff you aren’t excited for at some point or another. burnout is extremely real and the only reason i didn’t experience it was probably because i got super into drawing naruto fanart again inbetween sophomore and junior year! it helped give me something to draw seperated from school which is the only thing i was drawing for since i had entered rip. a heads up id also consider myself a workaholic so i fit in ok with the ‘art school’ environment but it is suuper unhealthy. if you are fantastic at managing your schedule then it’s definitely possible to take care of yourself! freshman year i got 8 hours a sleep a night and only pulled all nighters for some second semester finals at the end. sophomore year + up though i ended up prioritizing hw over sleep and like for sure, definitely shortened my life span. there’s another q down below where i’ll go more into detail but ya, be careful w ur work balance!

another tip especially for animation is knowing for a fact what type of animation you’re looking to go into, and what the school is offering. I didn’t think i’d get into art school at the time so i only applied to two places + decided if i didnt get into either id attend community to get credits out of the way while building portfolio. honestly? i did not do a lot of research LOL but like i did end up having the chance to tour and stuff! just know that each school will have a very different curriculum. The main differences are schools that prioritize 3D (cg animation, cg modeling, ect) and 2D/traditional (hand drawn, ‘oldschool’, digital or traditional based) this is a huge difference so make sure you do research for it! in most cases a 2D/traditional program will also offer 3D since it’s at the forefront of the industry animation wise rn. My school taught 2D but like hand drawn on physical paper 2D, frame by frame. while it was a good experience it’s super outdated because digital tools make it way faster + easier! i’d recommend looking for a program that is digital 2D over traditional 2D. 

if after your senior year covid is still affecting campuses in the US to keep them shut down i’d recommend attending a community college to get credits and then transferring into school. one of the negatives is paying money for gened classes when ur not there for them; if you can get them out of the way sooner and cheaper there is absolutely no negative + you could graduate earlier or use the extra time for better work or to work a job! 

these are all the general tips i think i’d give on like a broad basis of attending or not to think about? let me know if u have more q’s! someone asked q’s im answering below that go more into personal experiences + work culture so heres those:

- how many hours a week do u spend studying, in class, otherwise making art? like how much of ur life does it consume?

I was basically working on art.... 24/7! since i wasnt working a job at the same time i crammed as many credits as possible into my schedule so on avg i did 18 credit semesters (around 6 classes) art classes go for 6 hours and non art go for 3, so i’d spent around 30-35 hours in class a week! hw wise it varied on the class but combined it would be around 35-50 hours a week... im guessing? on average studio classes would have 8-10 hours of hw, maybe 5 for a light week, and gened classes 5 hours w them all combined. or this was probably how things were before junior year? junior+senior year i had thesis + everything else ontop.. i’d spend around 30-40 hours on thesis a week with other classes ontop of that bc my film was super long cus im a dummy! 

- is it hard going to art school n realising that altho u were probably quite talented… so is everyone else? Like. all of a sudden. ur not special and everyone seems as good as u, you know? More generally, how do u deal with comparison?

kinda?? i think instead of the idea of like you vs others it feels more of like a competition at first to be the best. this varies hugely on school culture though; my animation year was really friendly with each other and get along extremely well, so my answer to this is v different than some others who attended different schools. i think that the idea of ‘comparison’ only lasts a portion of the first year because at some point you realize that it’s not a who’s better as much as its a ‘these are my coworkers’ type thing? like healthy competition 100% because we’re all working to improve but i think most of us learned pretty early on that viewing each other as peers going into the same workforce helped a lot. also at some point everyone develops their own style/starts to develop their artistic preferences so there isn’t a way to compare whos 'better’ anymore? i dont think there ever is tbh because style is appealing based off of an individuals preferences. If anything realizing everyone else is also amazing makes you wanna work harder ig? or thats how i felt! it’s inspiring to be surrounded by so many people who create such amazing work. 

- is there a lot of workaholic culture? all nighter culture?

100000% there can be a workaholic and all nighter culture. i know people who avoided it and thats honestly fantastic because i fall super easily into that pit. sometimes i’ll pull all nighters on a personal project just because i really want to finish it... i am definitely considered a workaholic all the way through and its not healthy rip... i’d estimate at the worst i was pulling 2-3 all nighters a week and only 4-5 hours of sleep on the nights i didn’t? that was only for one year tho, after that i was like yeah ok this is really bad for my health in the long run LOL so i tried to cut it down to one all nighter a week and around 5-6 hours of sleep the rest of the week! by senior year my decision to cram in full semesters paid off and i was able to consistently get around 7 hours of sleep a night + no all nighters minus finals since my schedule was lighter despite thesis 😭 while there is that culture i don’t think people view it as like a badge of honor or something to be proud of anymore which is good, we mostly view it as a flaw of the art school system and something that needs to be fixed!!

- are you glad u did it? how did u know it was what u wanted?

i am glad i did it! i’m definitely in a limbo right now of if it was worth both my time, money, and my parents money rip but i think with what i got out of it i definitely wouldn’t be as far skill wise or knowledge wise when it comes to the art industry. i would say it was only worth it for be because i had so much support going in though so i was able to focus so much on improving. if i had only been able to put in part of the effort and not make full use of the resources provided i would honestly have a different answer.. 

i knew it was what i wanted when i realized i really couldn’t see myself pursuing a different profession happily! despite all the bumps and stuff im fully in love with drawing still and feel honored that it’s a field that can provide a living. my second profession choice was to go into culinary school? and third option i think going was into music cus i was also a band kid hehe.  

- how do u cope with ur hobby becoming ur job? how do u deal with art going from something u do for fun to something u do on command constantly?

i think seperating work art from personal art is important! in my case im doubling naruto into being personal work so i have something to fall back onto that isn’t work related. its been a hyperfixation for 12+ years? so drawing it at this point is just like personal art imo. some people have hobbies outside of art and only draw for their job! i think after attending classes for so long the idea of hobby turning into job feels extremely natural? also i enjoy doing it so thats a huge plus! 

sorry this is SO long but i hope i answered your guys’ questions! if you have more just lmk!

[annyaforger]

No worries at all 💜💜 I just hope you had time to rest! So I'm super happy to see the kind of stuff you said about Xicheng - healing, fix-its etc are everything to me! And they both deserve so much! I'm excited to see your rec list but prob won't have much fic reading time for a bit so really no rush! Seclusion fics sound v intriguing - like, to me, Xicheng makes sense as a post-canon slow burn? Like they both need time before they can be vulnerable so seclusion makes sense! xoxo CC 💜💙 (1/5)

And omggg I checked my old ffn account. it’s entirely from like 2008-11 & only 5 pretty short fics. I just kind of wrote… whatever. Like, 1 about a game I barely remember, and also for some movie I’m fairly confident I just skipped through & never fully watched lol. Wild to think all that was that long ago! My sisters & I just did a random twilight marathon! I was never in the online fandom much though. tbh I was more engaged in the superwholock/glee stuff in high school lol! xoxo CC 💜💙 (2/5)

Hmm yeah I have a lot of thoughts about how art vs writing is treated online/in fan spaces but they are not super uh coherent lol But chibis and animated stuff is!! Amazing!! I seriously just put something on my to read list based only on a chibi-ish short animation, & animatics stuff is so fun! Idk I just have a real soft spot for small roundish cute things lol Idk to me, whether or not you share it, it’s still art! I just hope making it makes you happy! xoxo CC 💜💙 (3/5)

Fav character is v hard – I have a soft spot for lxc, but I also love songxiao + a-qing! I also love the sibling dynamics. I’m actually wrapping up a BB right now that I can’t really talk about yet, & have grown v attached to that pov character lol Tbh I think about them more as who’s easier to write? Like, songxiao, lxc, & the juniors come pretty easily to me, but wn, wwx, jgy & nhs are way way harder for w/e reason. No better way to figure them out than to write them though! xoxo CC 💜💙 (5/5)

god i only just got time to rest yesterday and today, sorry it took me forever to get to your CC my angel. FIRST NOTE OF BUSINESS THOUGH! MERRY CHRISTMAS! I HOPE U HAD A BEAUTIFUL LOVELY DAY FULL OF WARMTH HAPPINESS GOOD FOOD AND GOOD COMPANY! late as it may be, again sorry heh. 

now on to the reply, ugh yes, those are all just such good tropes and paired up w xicheng *chefs kiss*  no worries it might take me a while till im fully happy with it and the organization of it all ngl lmao but it’s coming! i do wanna let u know i just made an addition to it last night of a 9chapter fic klldjssd i hope you don’t mind i know you said long fics aren’t too much of ur fancy BUT ITS A GOOD ONE I PROMISE  and yesss xicheng is def a post canon slow burn kind of pairing which a lot of the times it is ;) i love it tbh )): 

that’s so nice though that you have the ability to go and look back at your old work, i do that too and cringe BUT i can see i have improved and come a long way I USED TO WRITE IN FIRST PERSON POV SKDJFS but lol my little sister and i had a twilight marathon during quarantine it was fun times all we did was shit talk the films lmao 

superwholock fandom days seem like a fever dream to me lmfao 

but wow ok u have a wide range i see that’s p cool, AHH good luck with ut BB! whenever its set to make its grand debut! much luck im sure its winderful cause sounds like uve worked really hard!!!

ONCE AGAIN MERRY CHRISTMAS LOVE!!! u were definitely a great gift this year u wonderful hooman bean!<3

[becomewings]

Archived Network Event

2020 Secret Bunny Exchange

hai lovely! Im sparkle and I’m going to be your secret bunny. I hope you’re having a good day or night. 🥰 -sparkle ✨💫

Hello Sparkle dear! Thank you for being my secret bunny. I hope you are having a good day/night too and enjoying this wonderful comeback.

I’m enjoying it too! It’s such a good comeback, and I honestly love it. This is like my second comeback with them. -sparkle 💫✨

This is my first comeback, eek! I was not at all prepared for how much I would be waiting on the edge of my seat, but it's been really exciting!

Yes! It's such a good comeback honestly. When did you first get into BTS? What drew you to them? I'm sorry I'm asking for many questions. Lol. -sparkle 💫✨

It's okay, ask away! ^^ I stumbled across BTS by accident...which may indicate just how much I live under a cultural rock. I actually don't usually listen to much pop music. I'm a classically trained composer and video game soundtracks and moody indie/rock are more my jam, but last year I heard the YouTube ad that uses part of DNA and it intrigued me. I didn't know which song it was so I ended up listening through quite a bit before finding it...and fell absolutely in love along the way! So I have a soft spot in my heart for DNA. How about you, Sparkle? What got you into BTS?

So first, I hope you're having a too day/night! It's been a very long and busy one for me. I'm so glad to be off. Alsooo, I've been into Kpop for around 10 years now, so I've always enjoyed and I have a soft spot for 2nd gen kpop groups. When BTS started to get popular I didn't like them at first. But I saw Dope after the FBE channel reacted to them and I'm like okay they seem interesting around 2018. Lol. And I went down the hole, and have been stuck since. Lol. They're amazing. -sparkle 💫✨

Thank you Sparkle, hope you enjoy your evening off! Mine was busy too (we’re prepping for a move, eep) but at least it was productive. Wow, you’ve been into Kpop for a long time! Dope is really catchy (and I love that honky sax haha), I’m not surprised it got you interested and then hooked. :) Do you have a favorite era? Mine is probablyyy Wings, but I love most of Love Yourself too, and HYYH is so wonderfully nostalgic even if I wasn’t a fan then... and I’m a big fan of this new era too

Moving sucks! I'm going to be moving in the next year or so, and I"m not read for it. And yes! I've been into it for so long. But HYYH is one of my favorites as well. I think mine may be LY because that was the era that I started stanning them. I forget which one, but it's the one with idol as their title song. Wings is super amazing, and one of those that I'll always listen to. MOTS is just GOD TIER. Lol. I love it. -sparkle 💫✨

Haha MoTS being god tier is accurate xD Sounds like your move is a little ways off, but I wish you the best of luck when it happens! Ours is on a fairly tight deadline so I really have to hustle this weekend with house preparations (we still need to sell ours). I hope you have a lovely weekend, dear Sparkle! 💫

It is a little ways off, but moving just sucks in general. The packing and unpacking and then trying to get everything ready. Especially in your case. But I hope everything works out for you. And I hope you have a beautiful weekend too. -sparkle 💫✨

Thank you, Sparkle! We made a lot of progress today so I feel a bit better (and extremely tired). When the time comes, I hope you have the opportunity to prepare ahead for your move so it doesn't stress you too much. :) Have a nice start to your week! ✨

Heyyy! It's me sparkle! It's been alright so far, let's how it stays that way. And I'm glad you've made more progress on your move! Hopefully your Monday was good. -sparkle 💫✨

Thank you, Sparkle! There's so much going on in the world right now, close to home and far away... I am trying to stay calm and positive, with varying degrees of success. Please take care of yourself! (And that goes to everyone... I know it is difficult because we all have our own obligations to school, work, family, etc., but please try to prioritize your health and stay safe 💜)

Yes! I hope you’re staying safe. I don’t know what area of the world you live in and I know the virus is hitting others harder than most. We have 8 reported cases here. And it’s a scary to me. I hope you are staying safe. I just said that twice. Lol. Happy Thursday! -sparkle ✨💫

Thank you, you too! I live in the US (California, to be somewhat specific) and so far there have been two confirmed cases in my county. I'm grateful the university I work at is (finally) taking precautionary measures by banning large gatherings and moving classes temporarily online, and that I can continue working unless there is a full campus closure... Trying not to be too anxious about things that are simply out of my control and hoping that things gradually work out and improve. I'm also grateful for the community here, even if I don't know anyone personally, it is nice to come online and see people being reassuring and encouraging to each other from all across the globe.

Music and BTS are a good distraction when needed... Now that their promotional period is done, do you have a favorite moment?

I'll repeat you too, please stay safe dear, you and everyone who happens to read this 💜

I truly wish that my job would take some measures, and they have yet. I work with the general public a lot as a secretary. So it's like seriously having me on edge. I know the schools year have temporally closed down and moving things to online since it was spring break here. As well as the public schools closing for a month. Honestly, I'm not sure if I have a favorite moment honestly. Lol. They were all good moments, but I did quite enjoy watching all the ON performances. What about you?

I truly hope your employer catches on soon and makes accommodations so that you can practice some social distancing and have a safe work environment. We were just informed today that we have to work from home two days next week, on rotation, to keep our department staffed but also reduce the number of people on the floor -- for next week only so far, but I won’t be surprised if it continues past that. I can’t fulfill all of my responsibilities from home, so I’m grateful that they are allowing us to complete online trainings and such in the meantime. I am also so glad it’s Friday. What a week it’s been.

Ahh, I love ON! As a former member of drumline and marching band, I have such a fondness for the drum corps elements they incorporated into the music and background choreography. I was excited for the Official MV version too, so beautiful and thought-provoking! I also looove Black Swan (JIMIN’S DANCING EEK). I haven’t been as excited about something in a long time as when I stayed up late to catch their first performance on James Corden. So while I’ve enjoyed all of the comeback (especially as it’s my first!), that was particularly memorable for me. The surprise MV drop was also lovely 🦢🖤

Sorry, I am really rambly tonight. Please take care and have a good weekend! Hope you can get lots of rest! 💗

It’s been a long couple days! Sorry I haven’t gotten back with you! I’ve been stressed about everything going on, and I do hope that they catch on soon too. I was very excited for this comeback and the art in their videos has been beautiful. Black Swan and Jimin dance break? Quality content honestly. Yes! The surprise MV was great. I prefer this version of Black Swan over the other, but both are good. I hope you had a good weekend! -sparkle 💫✨

Hi again Sparkle, thank you for checking in on me! Please don't apologize for messaging delays, there's no need! We all signed up for this event long before any of this started, so I'm grateful you can spare a little time to chat with me. 💜 I'm working from home for at least the next 3 weeks because my uni is now fully closed... But I'm very grateful I have that opportunity. (As much as sometimes I would just like to go to sleep and wake up when this is all over, hah!)

Please continue to take care of yourself! Hope you find some comfort in music or other personal hobbies!

How are you doing? Last week was so stressful for me. So I am quite happy to be working from home this week. I hope you are staying healthy and happy through all of this! How was your week last week? I hope your weekend was alright? I had a pretty decent one me and a couple close friends had game night, and that was the highlight of my weekend. -sparkle 💫✨

I missed hearing from you, Sparkle! (But totally understand, the world is upside down right now.) I’m sorry you had a stressful week and I hope this one is better for you as you transition to working from home. My days have just fluctuated between quiet/boring and a little stressful (mostly re: house stuff, but that’s out of my control at this point), but I suppose I’m glad it hasn’t been worse than that.

Ooh what are your favorite games?? I’ve been trying to keep up creative side work between writing and blog content, but… I might purchase Animal Crossing soon hehe. Do you have any other hobbies to help distract you from stress/everything that’s going on? Take care dear! 💗

I know! I let time get away from me honestly! I hadn't been meaning too. I miss talking to you! I love all kind of games. I'm not particularly picky, but i do like that Game of LIfe. I've had just about ever version they've made. We played this one called Blockbuster in reference to movies and it was fun because if you know a lot of movies it's somewhat easy but you have to act out some of hte titles. Lol. Animal crossing seems like fun, everyone talks about it. Lol. -sparkle 💫✨ 1/2

I’ve never played it before. I’ve been thinking of getting an Nintendo Switch, but I don’t know how often I would play it. I know that game comes on there. But I heard it’s also an app? I’m not entirely sure. Lol. Also, I’m planning on making you a gif set for the secret bunny exchange! I know you said you love Jimin (my bias wrecker and sweet baby), Kookie, and Tae. And you were right, it’s hard to pick just ONE. Is there any particular one you want to see in a gif set? -sparkle 💫✨ 2/2

Receiving messages from you makes me happy! ^^ I know life is strange right now though so completely understand if you don’t have time. I’ll be patiently waiting!

So you like tabletop games? Sounds fun! I gravitate toward video games more personally, but haven’t had too much time lately to play. There are definitely fun ones to try if you ever get a Switch! There’s Breath of the Wild of course, which I admit I am still holding off on finishing because I don’t want it to be over LOL, some Mario & friends party games if that’s your jam, as well as some really beautiful indie games (Gris for example!). ANYWAY I won’t ramble about that anymore haha. I’m not sure what the app is, if you were referring to Animal Crossing–might be a companion to the game? I saw a tweet referring to using an app for quicker messaging in AC lol, but I haven’t played the game myself yet. 

Aw thank you so much for asking about the gift (and for making it in the future)!! Oh dear you want ME to pick one? If I’m honest, I think Jimin and Tae light up my heart the absolute most (any vmin content gives me life but totally understand if that’s not your thing) but… please don’t ask me to… choose between them HAHA. How about you go with whoever would give you the most joy to gif right now?? I will truly be happy to receive any gift from you, regardless of who is featured. :’)) thank you dear!! 

(Edit: btw who is your bias??)

I love tabletop games, and I play a lot of video games too. So don't get me wrong, I am huge into video games, but I don't play them as often. my boyfriend uses his PS4 all the time. I'm still trying to get through SpiderMan, but that's also because I don't wanna end it. I'm almost finished though. And yes! It's so hard to choose just one honestly, so I get your dilemma. And I can do vmin content! I don't gif them much and I want too. I can't wait to work on something for you! -sparkle 💫✨

Yay!! Sounds like we might have that in common. I have a huge appreciation for video games (and video game soundtracks is one of my favorite ‘genres’ of music, recognizing that they’re incredibly diverse of course), but I spend more time watching videos of other people playing them than playing them myself haha. We have a PS4 too. SpiderMan looked fun but I never tried it! I loved watching my partner play FFXV and Death Stranding. Trying to remember what I’ve actually finished on PS4, it’s been awhile lol... Everybody’s Gone to the Rapture and Rime were beautiful. I started Last Guardian but didn’t get very far before life got too busy. :( Hope I can pick it up again some day! Do you have a favorite PS4 game?

Aww you’re too kind. I’m so excited to see what you create!! And to chat with you off-anon. :) Who is your favorite member to gif?

Yes, I also like watching other people play video games, but it's rare when I do. I always end up getting distract sometimes. I've played SpiderMan, Horizon Zero Dawn, which are my favorites as well as Tomb Raider. I do really like FFXV, but i haven't played it in so long though. I can't wait to talk to you off anon either. I be having to really make sure I press the anon button. adlfkjsl I"m bad at forgetting. And Yoongi is my favorite to gif. -sparkle 💫✨

Oo I forgot I watched some of Horizon Zero Dawn too! Very impressive game. It looks like a lot of fun and I might try to play it myself in the future.. but like you said, it’s easy to get distracted. Life just likes to get in the way huh. Have you seen/heard of Hellblade: Senua’s Sacrifice? Intennnnse. I’m an absolute coward when it comes to horror games (or movies) and somehow my partner tricked me into playing one of the scariest parts because he got too scared HAH. That being said, as much as I love really emotionally intense games, I love soft gentle ones too… especially chill co-ops! (I’m thinking of the one we played most recently, Pode… that was on Switch though.)

Yayy Yoongi! I really do love all of BTS, and while the maknae line ran off with my heart, I have a big soft spot for Yoongi. I was never really drawn to rap/hip-hop except maybe Linkin Park like in middle school am I dating myself until I met Yoongi and just… wow.  ._. He’s so expressive in his delivery, his lyrics are heart-breakingly raw and honest, and he has extraordinary range between his gentlest material and the lines that come at you with a knife. Also I’m so proud of him for continuing to work as a producer and refine those skills on top of his life as an idol. What are your favorite things about Yoongi? If you can even choose haha 💗

Lol I know what you mean, I was really paranoid the first 2 weeks about sending anon messages to my other partners on mobile because the interface was different and I was really suspicious of the term ‘public’ vs ‘private.’ And every time I send the ask for about 5 seconds I question whether or not I clicked anon.

P.S. I should keep my mouth shut but … I have an itty bitty guess of who you may be. I won’t say any more than that and I guess I’ll find out in 2 weeks whether I’m right or wrong haha. xD take care sparkle dear!!

That game was really fun honestly. I still haven't finished. And sameeee! I am not into the horror games. The movies I can do, but the games I'm just too scared to really play them. I tried Resident Evil, and I was like this is a BIG FAT NO. Lol. And I haven't heard of that game though, but it sounds intense by the name of it. I also like soft gentle ones, or the ones were it's not a lot of challenging aspects to it. I really like Spyro. The original and the remake. -sparkle 💫✨ 1/2

Linkin Park is one of my favorite groups. I love them, and miss Chester so much. Also it sounds like we're maybe around the same age because that's when I got into them maybe? And I am so proud of him for everything that he's done. Yoongi originally wasn't my bias at first. I think maybe it was going to be Taehyung, but watching their variety shows made me fall in love with him. Outside of his hard exterior, he's so sweet and loving of the boys. It's so hard to just pick one! -sparkle 💫✨2/2

Okay, so one more. Lol. Because the ask limit is so short! I get paranoid all the time, and i have to like double check to make sure I Press it. alkdjfls NOW i'm curious as to who you think I am! But I do how you have a wonderful weekend. -sparkle 💫✨

Dying over your Resident Evil reaction because... SAME lol. However. I have enjoyed watching some playthroughs of 7 and the remake of 2, which is the closest I will ever come to watching a horror movie again. xD I have really fond memories of playing Spyro at my cousin’s house as a kid, but haven’t tried the remake yet! It looks like fun too. There are too many good games to choose from, not nearly enough time to play lol.

I only really listened to a couple of Linkin Park’s old albums, but I miss Chester too. \: We could be around the same age yeah! I’ll tell you when we’re messaging off-anon. :) 

If I may tell a story, my discovery of BTS went like this: heard a music clip in a YouTube ad of all places (normally skip them lol but I got it a couple times at work and thought hmm this is catchy). Then had to dive into some compilation videos to figure out which heckin song it was (turned out to be DNA). But along the way I found more songs I liked. And then I fell HARD for the Mic Drop MV (again, a little strange for me, because it’s pretty hip-hoppy). Jungkook makes this super intense expression at one moment that made me go oh. hello. So then I slowly learned who the different members were, and since this was me mostly streaming YT in the background at work haha, I had to keep switching tabs to check who was singing. I loved Jungkook’s singing but then also realized that I loved Jimin’s sweet voice too (yes I admit when I was first getting to know them, I could not always tell them apart). And THEN mister baritone Tae with his unique falsetto and delicious low range (I really wish they featured his chest voice more but OH WELL I digress) snagged my attention and ANYWAY long story short that’s how I fell in love with BTS and also the entire maknae line I guess. :’)

Hehehe I’ll tell you after the event ends if I’m right or wrong, don’t worry. It might be almost over, but I hope you had a lovely weekend too! ♥♥♥

Yes, somehow my sister convinced me to get it like she was going to play the game too, and she did not. I ended up exchanging the game because I'm like this is a waste of money. haha. I usually always skipped them too, so I totally understand. Everyone I knew liked but I had stopped listening to kpop for a while after the members of Big Bang went into enlistment (sad sad times). I first heard Dope. The FBE Youtube channel reacted to them, and I'm like OKAY GUYS. 1/3 -sparkle 💫✨

When Jungkook hits that high note I was like COME THROUGH VOCALS. So then naturally I had to go and look a few more videos. This was during around the time they had appeared on the AMAs the first time. And then I listened to I Need U and Save Me (this is one of my favorites). And I was hooked. I went and watched their Ellen interviews, and they're so sweet. I ended up binge watching their variety show and Bon Voyage and I was hooked then. -sparkle 💫✨ 2/3

Run BTS was when I realized that Yoongi was my bias. Because I'll admit that I did not like him at first, but I said that already. And then I just realized how sweet and funny he actually his. And I think he's just shy at times. At least in the beginning, but he's so handsome and his stage presence is like a 360 from him being off stage. If that makes sense. I could go on for house about Yoongi. Lol. -sparkle 💫✨3/3

The high notes in Dope are pretty ridiculous because they’re at the start of the phrase so they get little to no preparation lol. Their vocal abilities are truly impressive... and then they do it all while dancing :’) 

I agree that Yoongi’s stage presence is strikingly different from his real self! Or the self we get to see in their behind-the-scenes content lol. Possibly like a lot of people, I thought he was super intimidating and tough until I saw more of him offstage... and then went awww he’s a big softie who just doesn’t pull his punches when he’s rapping and producing.

Do you have any favorite Run BTS episodes? So far I’ve only watched a handful of the recent ones, but all the random gifs and clips of older content warms my heart or makes me laugh. I’d like to eventually watch them all from the beginning... some day lol. (see all previous mentions of being too busy to do anything fun outside of work haha)

They are ridiculous. I love when they hit high notes in songs. All the boys have such a beautiful range, and I love hearing them. Especially when they do their solo songs. Jimin's solos are normally my favorite because his voice is the type I tend to lean towards a lot His stage presence is so different! Just like Jhope's. It's always so different, but it's them all in a nutshell, if that makes sense. Lol. I was in Chorus for a while, and I liked it begin in a group. -sparkle 💫✨1/2

It's easier being in a group, but I could never do it by myself. And favorite Run episode? Hmmm, there are so many that I love. I prefer some of the older episodes to some of the new ones. I'll have to find them again, but there was one where they were doing like this haunted house type of thing and it had me dying of laughter. They're all so funny though. I'm still trying to catch up with some of the new ones they've been doing. -sparkle 💫✨2/2

The vocal line is so wonderful, but I’ve been increasingly impressed with the rap line’s singing too. I have always liked the beginning of Spring Day and I confess it took me an embarrassingly long time to wonder which one of them was singing, and I was surprised to learn that it’s Namjoon. Also his low line in Louder Than Bombs is wonderful... I don’t even care if it’s probably autotuned a little lolol. And I only recently found out about the song Sea, but Tae’s chest-range melody at the very end.. UGHGHGGH it’s too. good. (DEAR BIGHIT COMPOSERS, MORE BARI PLS.)

I had to sing in choir in grad school and ended up enjoying it way more than I thought I would. (I’m a composer/pianist and I needed ensemble credit.) I’ve always been really self conscious about my voice, and now... I would love to take vocal lessons some day. While I know that no two people will play an instrument exactly the same, it’s kind of magical that you don’t know what the true sound or full potential of your own singing voice will be until you train it. Do you play any instruments? :)

The vocal line is amazing. I love all of their voices for different reasons, and sometimes I'm in the mood for one, and then another time I'm in the mood for another. If that makes sense. I haven't listened to Sea that much, but it is such a beautiful song! And you're right. His chest tone HELLO VOCALS. Lol. I'd love to take vocal lessons one day, but not sure if I ever would. And I don't play any instruments, but I would love to learn guitar one day. Lol. It's a dream of mine. -sparkle 💫✨

Hii Sparkle. I’m sorry it took me a bit to get back to you, but it really makes me happy when I receive your messages! Yess Tae’s chest voice deserves all the shouty caps all the time hehe. I hope you have the opportunity to learn the guitar someday if that’s what your dream is! Everyone starts somewhere... I would love to learn the cello too :)) one day haha. 

Do you have a favorite “underrated” bts song? Just curious! Take care dear, looking forward to finding out who you are soon~

Yay! I'm glad you like hearing from me! I really like talking to you. I don't talk to many people on here sometimes, but then other times I do. So this is nice just to be able to talk with a fellow army. One day I will learn it, I just have to learn how to read music first. Lol. Because I definitely don't know how to. Hmm honestly there are a few that I feel are underrated, that i Iove. Spring Day, Hold Me Tight, and Autumn Leaves. These songs are queens! What about you? -sparkle 💫✨

Music is a lifelong learning process but it’s worth it. :’) I believe in you!! 

SPRING DAY!! 🌸🌸🌸 One of my all-time favorites. I honestly might not have a very good awareness of what is underrated and what isn’t, especially among older songs, but... I love Spring Day, The Truth Untold, Jamais Vu, and most recently Sea... lol hm I’m sensing a trend of bittersweet/melancholy songs. But also House of Cards (it’s just so delightfully WEIRD and dark and different??). On the other end of the spectrum (although not sure if it’s underrated?), Silver Spoon/Baepsae. What a jam. Love to tune out the world with that one at work on one of my walk breaks if I had a frustrating day. And maybe it’s too early to tell from MOTS 7, but I get the impression that I might love Louder Than Bombs way more than the average army. And that’s okay :)

I don’t talk to or know very many people on here yet too, probably because my blog is still relatively new. So I’m very glad to be getting to know you

I loved Spring Day as soon as I heard it. I still listen to it a lot when I'm in the mood for it. It's such a beautiful song. The Truth Untold IS A QUEEN. I love that one too. Jamais Vu, I think I have to be in the mood to listen to it sometimes, but it's growing on me. House of Cards, that one I heard last year sometime and I like that one too. I don't listen to it as much. And Silver Spoon is my go too song honestly on my way to work. Louder Than Bombs is really good. -sparkle 💫✨ 1/2

I listen to that one a lot myself. I think We Are Bulletproof 2.0 maybe one, but I'm not sure either. I absolutely adore that song so much. It's such a beautiful mad song honestly. And also you're right this update is kind of weird, but I don't mind the font so much. -sparkle 💫✨2/2

Yasss I’m glad you like Truth Untold too. It’s too beautiful. I practically cried when I heard for the first time a live performance video (somewhere in Japan) where he sang a higher note in the climax than in the studio recording auuughgghgh my heart. 

We Are Bulletproof pt. 2 took awhile to grow on me but I was happy when it did. I can be a little odd about the order in which I listen to songs, and usually need to listen in album order, but for some reason I really like that one after No More Dream. Also, though it’s hardly underrated, I now know what all the fuss is about Cypher pt. 3. I’ve been gradually purchasing their older albums (kinda out of order) and finally got to Dark & Wild about a month ago haha. I’m listening to all these mad songs now. Been in a weird sad mood for a lot of today tbh and... mad bts is helping a little haha. So is chatting with you!

I’m probably overreacting about the dashboard, but something about that bubbly serif font is irritating haha. And I don’t see this mythical option to revert to the old dashboard that people are talking about in their settings. Boo. I’ll get over it... eventually haha.

The Truth Untold is one of my favorites, and I normally don't like ballads a lot. It takes me a while to get into them, but this one just caught my eye. I'm learning Korean, and it's one of the ones that I can sing along too while reading the lyrics! I am super proud of that accomplishment. When I was going through their albums after I got into them, I skipped the older ones at first. I wasn't sure if I really liked them. -sparkle 💫 1/2

I listen to a select few of them on their darker albums, but a lot of it isn’t really what I like hearing. Although, I think I may revisit the albums again. It’s been a while since I actually listened to them. haha if you go to settings > dashboard you’ll see it there. Just let it load for a second, adn then it pops up. -sparkle 💫✨ 2/2

(Ugh I typed an answer and then tried to drop in a screenshot and everything disappeared. Got it, tumblr. No dropping images. REDO.)

Oo that’s awesome that you’re learning Korean! Are you self-studying? How long have you been studying? I’ve been studying Japanese for several years (very slowly lol). Then a few months ago, thanks to BTS, I was suddenly really interested in learning Korean too. I worked on memorizing hangul for a week and then had a “lol what am I doing” moment when I realized I didn’t know nearly enough Japanese yet to realistically tackle two challenging languages at the same time. So Korean is on hold for now, but I really wish I could just… magically be fluent haha. It would be amazing to understand their lyrics or interviews/conversations on the spot without relying on translations. And English is stupidly difficult, so as much as I appreciate how much effort they’ve put into learning too… as an international fan, I wish I could return that effort too and learn their language so that they don’t feel like they need to learn English. 

Love Yourself: Answer was my first album and I purchased that one specifically because it was a compilation and contained most of the individual songs I already knew I liked from YouTube haha. Then I expanded from there. To be honest, if I had found BTS when they were just getting started, or anytime before HYYH, I probably wouldn’t have connected with their music, sound-wise or thematically. But… they were exactly what I needed when I did finally find them. And now I have immense appreciation for their beginnings and how far they’ve come, even loving some older songs/styles that I never expected to. As I mentioned, I don’t usually listen to pop or rap/hip-hop… like ever haha. But something about them just reached into my heart and I’ll be forever grateful to them.

I tried what you suggested (waiting on the page) and… the text kinda jumped at one point as though something else had loaded, but nothing else displayed. Am I derping around on the wrong page? \:

edit: I see it in the source code, idk why the toggle isn’t displaying for me 🙃

Yes! I am self learning. I have been doing it on and off for like two years, but the last part of last year I've been doing it most often. However with everything that's going on, it's kind of slowed down and I've just been focusing on what's going on in the world right now. I feel the same. I think if I would have found them before, I don't think I would have liked them as much as I do now. I do have an appreciation for their older music even if I don't listen it to it much. 1/3 -sparkle 💫✨

Their first two albums I didn't like as much, but everything from then on I'm pretty sure I am obsessed with when I found them out. Lol. I do remember you say that previously that you don't listen to a lot of that style of music. What do you normally like to listen to? I listen to a lot of everything, so I'm not sure if I have a genre that i really stick too. Although, I think in the beginning i listened to a lot of hiphop/rap and alternative stuff. -sparkle 💫✨ 2/3

Then the older i got the more I got into pop music because I found kpop when I was about 17, and it's been stuck to me ever since. Lol. So I don't know I like a lot of music that makes me feel good and I can dance too or sing along with. I think maybe it depends on my mood. Lol . -sparkle 💫✨3/3

I think that’s awesome that you’re working on learning the language on your own! And I understand the challenges of keeping it up independently, especially in such strange and challenging times... I feel guilty that I stopped my daily kanji studying pretty much as soon as I started working from home. It was initially because I used my commute time to study (I’m in a vanpool) and... definitely lost some motivation once everything started changing. I know I shouldn’t be too hard on myself though for taking a break, and I hope you are not either. I’m hoping to get back into soon and reform some study time habits :)

Yeah it sounds like you’ve been listening to Kpop for a long time! ^^ Aside from my fairly recent BTS obsession, I gravitate toward moodier music in general haha. Evanescence was my instant favorite way back in middle school and... tbh I still listen to their albums sometimes! I tended to like anything indie-ish with piano or rock + orchestra. I loved this European band Within Temptation, their music is like a blend of rock and symphonic orchestra. Nowadays, I love video game music and that’s probably what I listen to the most... Nobuo Uematsu (Final Fantasyyy), who is probably one of my biggest inspirations for pursuing composition, Austin Wintory (Journey, Abzu, etc), and more recently Jessica Curry (everything the Chinese Room studio made lol). The past few days I’ve been streaming the songs from Death Stranding. I admit I don’t tend to have a lot of variety... I’m kind of picky and when I find something I love, I will listen to that obsessively over and over for months on end. Like BTS. xD No regrets haha! But I know I should broaden my horizons too...

I'm trying not to be so hard on myself, but I know I'll get back into it soon as I set a schedule for myself. Evanescence is amazing, that's all I got to say. I love them so much, so I totally get it. That's interesting though. I love learning about others music interest. It's always so different and diverse from mine. And also, I realized I didn't answer your question about the dash, and for some reason I don't know why it's not showing up. You were in the right place though. -sparkle 💫✨

Yayy glad you like Evanescence! Yes it is amazing and also wonderful that we all have unique tastes. I know I should make a better effort to try out new things, because finding something new that I connect with is amazing (see: BTS hehe).

I'm so excited to meet you next week!! Please take care and enjoy the rest of your weekend 💗

Sometimes it’s harder to really step out the box. So I totally understand, but I’ve always kind of had “weird” taste in different music so I like listening to whatever it is I like! And yes! I can’t to show you what I’m working on. I’m still searching for things for it! Lol. So I hope you like it. Also I hope you have an amazing week! And also a good day! -sparkle ✨💫

I woke up way earlier than planned thanks to this new isolation insomnia, but I was so happy to see your message. 💜 I’m so excited to meet you, but don’t feel like you have to rush on the gift! I know whatever you make will be wonderful. I hope you have a great week too. Do you have any ~weird~ music suggestions? I’ll give them a try!

I totally understand how that is. I hate waking up earlier than I want too because then you don't want to get up out of bed, but then you're too awake to go back to sleep. At least that's how i feel. Hmmm, weird music suggestions? I'm not entire sure. I like Florence and the Machine, FK Twigs (this might be an acquired taste), Panic at the Disco. There's so much I listen too, and my mind is going blank. Lol. -sparkle ✨💫

Yeah, that was my feeling exactly. :( At least I put in a couple extra hours of work, so I’ll get to take a shorter Friday. Or whichever day we try to brave a grocery run.

Thank you, I will check them out! Hehe due to your comment, I am intrigued by FK Twigs. For some reason I couldn’t really get into Panic at the Disco in high school, even though I had friends who loved them, but... I do appreciate that someone made an Emote! at the Location bot on twitter. xD

I hope you are having a good week so far! Tbh mine has been a little gloomy, but... I am really looking forward to meeting you! And finding out if my guess is right haha :’)) Take care dear!

And I loved Panic! They were so good, I still love them or Brendon Urie. Lol. FK Twigs is really good, but I know she's not for everyone. I really enjoy her music honestly. And honestly, I'm just about finished with your gif set. I have to find a few more videos and I'll post it probably tomorrow or later tonight depending on when I finish. And hmm, I don't know I don't think it is, but it shouldn't be long though. however, I'm really curious to know who you think I am. -sparkle ✨💫

EEek I’m so excited!! (Please don’t stay up late just for me though!)

As much as I am terrible at branching out, I do enjoy finding new music I like, so thank you again for the suggestions! I will try to listen with open ears and mind haha. Have you heard of Fleurie? I stumbled across her music when an artist I followed made a piece inspired by some of her lyrics. She might be quite a bit different than the artists you recommended though.

I’m going to feel a little silly if I’m wrong, but I’ll tell you after the reveal so I don’t make a fool of myself early. xD Can I ask you one question – do you know your Myer-Briggs type?

I'll probably go to bed soon. I'm actually in bed. I just got stuck on the tiktok app, and I really shouldn't. I've never heard of her, but I'll have to check her out tomorrow and see what she's about. And yes! I do know my Myers-Briggs type! -sparkle ✨💫

Oops you fell down the internet rabbit hole before bed :) Hope you didn’t stay up too late and got enough rest!

Love and War is the first song I found by Fleurie, and it’s also the title of one of her albums. It’s a little bit older but probably my favorite overall! I love the song Hurts Like Hell. It’s devastating but beautiful.

Have a great day, hope to talk to you more soon! 💜

p.s. I’m INFJ ✨

I did fall down the rabbit hole of the internet. It always happens. Also you should check out Kerli! she's really interesting, and I really like her music. Her music videos are also really nice. Intriguing at most. Lol. And I'm infj too! -sparkle ✨💫

I know the reveal has been made, but I didn’t want to leave this sitting all alone in my inbox.

Thank you, Ash, for taking the time not only to make me a beautiful gift but to talk with me this past month. Thank you for being a light and comfort in these uncertain times. I will miss your little surprise messages, but I hope we keep in touch. Now I will go back to liking your wonderful posts (because I confess I held back once I started to guess who you were, I didn’t want you to be suspicious either HAH). I’ve said it a lot but I really hope you stay safe, healthy, and happy!!  💗✨💫💗

[comicteaparty]

November 9th-November 15th, 2019 Creator Babble Archive

The archive for the Creator Babble chat that occurred from November 9th, 2019 to November 15th, 2019.  The chat focused on the following question:

How do you deal with a lack of engagement from your audience, both emotionally and physically?

IzzyNinjaMaster

Oooo now that's a good question. If my online audience doesn't respond, I personally always show any new page updates to my family and friends and get feedback and comments from them. Really great for support. But sometimes their not available or I don't have anything new to show them. When this happens, I just look to myself for support. I know that doesn't really make sense or sounds kinda cheesy but it's what I do. I get myself pumped up and excited for what I can do next in the story and how awesome it will look all drawn out. And I go from there, I'll start drawing out ideas or writing out new chapters. So just be your own hype man, not just with your comics either but with everything. Great for self esteem.

Sorry went on kind of a rant right there

carcarchu

I prepare myself emotionally to not have any expectations. If you expect nothing and receive something you'll always be happy!

IzzyNinjaMaster

Lol true very true XD

Deo101

I'm not completely sure what this question means by physically, but I just kind of keep making art to move past it. Something that has helped me a TON is to make art that's just for me (like, that I don't post anywhere). I think that if everything is made to be shared, then we get a little too used to trying to find validation with engagement. With comics, specifically, I try to make none of my goals relate to engagement. I only have goals for myself and what i'm producing. If I'm hitting all of my goals, then I feel good about what I'm doing! No one engaging with it is just kind of like "okay!" Another smaller thing that helps me is getting my work done well before I upload it! for some reason just getting a bit of time distance between when something is done and when I post it I dont feel so bad if people don't engage.

Cronaj

I'm fairly lucky that I have a small following on one of the sites I post on, so while some weeks might be slow with feedback or engagement, I'm usually not completely devoid. I also have some very supportive family members who read my comic and often comment or text me after I update. As for what I do personally when I don't have a lot of engagement? I do a lot of self-reflecting, which is probably not the healthiest of practices. I question what I'm doing, trying to figure out what I'm doing wrong and how I could improve. I also try to understand other external factors at play, such as my readers' personal lives, jobs, school, holidays, that might have delayed them from engaging with my work. For example, I know that during November, as we get closer to Thanksgiving, there is going to be a huge drop in readership, because a lot of my younger readers will be preparing for school finals and visiting with family. By knowing this, it helps me cope a lot better. And if all else fails, I vent to my fiance or my little sister. It really does help to have someone to whine at for a bit

khkddn

If I were to get completely zero engagement on something I'd do what I'd always do, message people I know irl like "validate meeeeeeee"

In general I just take a step back from what I've posted and focus on something else. That way I remember webcomics isn't everything, and by the time I check up on things again there might be some sort of audience response.

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

I kept my work hidden for the first few years I was working on it (wanted to iron out any wrinkles before I was comfortable sharing) so in comparison, any engagement afterward - even a tiny amount - is pretty great! And even now, some updates get more traffic than others, for a lot of different reasons. Luck, timing, quality, etc. I always keep in mind that this project is - at its heart - for me and my own enjoyment/fulfillment. And if I’m pleased with where it’s going, that’s a win.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Oof, that question really hit me where it hurts. Over the years I’ve lowered my expectations, because while I used to have an active audience in the ‘00s, I’ve rarely gotten any engagement on my comics in the ‘10s. It’s definitely made me feel depressed and like a ‘failure’ to put heart and soul into my comics and art and get 0 reaction online. I honestly don’t have any way I ‘deal’ with it. I make something, hoping to get some comments > I get no comments > I get depressed about it and feel like my work is garbage. Rinse and repeat several hundred times. I keep going because I just love to create, but it’s like an actor trying to put on a performance and no one shows up to the play. It has gotten better lately and I’ve started getting some engagement for the first time in many years, but I honestly don’t have a good answer for how I handle that emotional reaction to reader silence.

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

Also good to keep in mind that lots of people may read without commenting, and still enjoy it! I did a poll wondering who would be interested in doing guest art, and way more people responded than I expected. It opened my eyes! Sometimes you just can’t tell until you outright ask for feedback

keii4ii

There's definitely a risk to that, though. You ask and still get nothing. Or worse, you ask and get negativity. Asking is a worthy gamble, but it takes courage! Sometimes when we don't have enough courage, we gotta find it elsewhere first, before we can try that gamble...

I lost that gamble one too many times and need more Courage Fund before I can try again, lol

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

True true! It was a gamble I had no real expectations/assumptions about, so I didn’t have much room for disappointment. Even getting one person who says “This is cool!” is enough to fuel me for days. But I know that’s not how it is for everyone. Once you’ve been disappointed once, it can take a while to get the urge to try again. I can’t imagine getting negativity, though... I think THAT would wreck me.

keii4ii

Sometimes I don't even ask and someone just randomly drops negativity off at my doorstep... I need to remember that I have also had wonderfully positive responses, that it wasn't all negative. But it can be hard to remember that on bad days.

Deo101

Yeah, negative comments always seem to be the loudest ones... They can drown out dozens of good ones if they hit you right.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I did develop a pretty thick skin for negativity in art school, which was really fortunate because my comics garnered a lot of negative attention at first. Though thinking back on it, I was making very androgynous and gender non-conforming characters (even though I never stated anywhere that they were queer) in a time when the public attitude towards such things was far less kind than it is today. At the time it was draining to get so many trolls, but unless I was already having emotional difficulties in other areas of my life, I was able to let it roll off.(edited)

keii4ii

The weirdest thing with my negativity is 99% of them come from actual readers who mean well. So I have a hard time dismissing them like 'oh they're just haters.' It's not necessarily harder than dealing with blatant trolls, but it is an entirely different beast.

Deo101

Sometimes I go and reread positive comments when I'm down about things

Yeah I'm not sure that I've had any trolls tbh... Its all readers saying what they think

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Avid readers who give backhanded compliments and ‘well-meaning’ but very subjective critique can definitely be detrimental.

keii4ii

In Korea, I dunno if they're still a thing, but 1-2 decades ago there was this type of theft called slash theft. It's a type of pickpocketing, done on the street while walking by. They bump into you, briefly and lightly, but you don't think much of it because Seoul is a crowded city and you brush against other people all the time. But during that brief bump, they manage to slash open your purse and take all the contents. It's an amazing ninja level skill for sure. I know people who had their stuff stolen that way. Back to the Courage Fund analogy, sometimes a negative comment isn't just a normal theft of your Fund. The comment slashes your purse open, and now your bag can't contain Fund even if you put more and more into it.

It can take a long time and lots of support to sew your purse back.

Deo101

Idk if other places to slash theft, im sure they do, but im pretty sure historically its been a big thing. The term "cutpurse" comes to mind

keii4ii

(:o I didn't know that was a term! The more you know)

Deo101

(some book i read (wasn't great but you know) used the term a lot and i was like "ok wtf is this")

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

That’s a very good analogy for it, and I definitely understand what you mean. I had to take a three year hiatus from one of my comics once after a IRL ‘friend’ ripped the comic apart and called me a terrible writer in less-than-kind words. I had already been going through some very bad things with my health and family and it hurt me far more than it should. It took some encouragement from some very dedicated readers to convince me to pick up the comic again.

Deo101

(so i associate it with pirates now)

That's really terrible lee... Om glad you picked it back uo though!!!

keii4ii

I can super relate to harsh comments hurting way more than they should, when you're already in a bad state. >_<

Deo101

And also it is a really good analogy keiiii

Yeah things just kinda get harder to deal with in general when you're more tired/upset in other areas

keii4ii

The most devastating feedback I've got would have done far less damage if I weren't in a fragile state at the time.

Deo101

Like you can't go be safe elsewhere if everything is a source of stress...

keii4ii

(For all we know those slashers in Korea could be pirates )

Deo101

:o

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Does Korea have pirates? If so, I’m moving to Korea.

(Sorry, we’ve probably gone way off topic for the discussion)

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

I got antsy when someone made a small critique of my lettering (rightfully so, though - lettering is hard and I’m still learning) so a proper heart-stabbing, bad-faith critique might sideline me for a while. Gotta be prepared for that someday

Deo101

Its weird, it really seems to be mostly about how I'm doing elsewhere in life now that im thinking about it. Also being further along in the comic helps cause I've got years of support and "just keep chuggin" under my belt

Like the other day someone critiqued me randomly and called my characters stupid and i was like "dam ok, your comment getting deleted then" but a year or so ago a comment like "I'm sorry im a little confused..." Made me second guess everything for weeks

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

Ohhh Maybe the obviously mean/troll comments are easier to deal with, than feeling you let down a reader who was genuinely trying to understand the story. I would definitely react similarly.

Deo101

Iunno, the big old critique was a normal reader who has left other comments he jusy kinda randomly did it. But yeah I think it can be easier to shrug off things that are CLEARLY antagonistic versus someone being harmlessly confused

Because confusion can mean I'm not being clear enough and need to change things and whatever. Its vague in a way that hits your anxiety

keii4ii

Yeah, when someone is obviously being a jerk, you know it's on them

omg... reader confusion has been the bane of my existence

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I dunno, man, art school just toughened me up to most negative comments. If one person out of five is confused, I don’t take it personally and just explain it to them to clear up confusion. If everyone’s confused I think ‘Hmm, maybe I should retcon in some dialogue to make it more clear’. I guess art school really teaches you to distance yourself from your work and be very objective about it. BUT as I said, I’m not immune when other bad things are going on and it becomes the straw that broke the camel’s back.

Deo101

Though THEN you kinda get like "why am I being a target???" And its very frustrating, at the very least, and it does definitely still hurt... (Wrt trolls)

keii4ii

It's hard to tell who's confused and who isn't sometimes

Deo101

Yeah Lee im in art school right now, but for me its different when I make something to be critiqued versus a passion long term project

If I am asking for critique too, im braced for it in a way I'm mentally prepared for. Im not always braced to have someone be like "its pretty good buuut..."

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Ahh, I can understand that. I guess I’m able to view my passion projects the same way I did my school projects. It took time, that’s for sure. It’s a process of desensitisation, and was something I had to build up over years.

keii4ii

I'm disproportionately sensitive about reader misinterpretations/confusion. I'm 95% sure it's because one bad experience. Someone thought my main story was garbage, but they liked parts of it, so they told me to basically make a different story using those parts. After that, every time a reader didn't recognize the main story (I got a very prominent B plot, so it's kinda understandable that some people mistake it as the A), I got vivid flashbacks of that one bad experience. Every time someone said they liked [this character that The Other Person liked], I got flashbacks. Took me good 2-3 years to get over it.

Deo101

Its also a lil different when it's like.. i wont be changing these pages so unless it's a critique for moving forward its kinda pointless and i cant really apply it

Damn keiiii that's really rough

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yeah, that sucks.

keii4ii

Yeah, it's hard to be motivated when the underlying message is "your first 100 pages are hot garbage, but you can still improve........ even if readers will give up long before they get to the decent 101st page!"

Deo101

RIGHT...

I don't want to have to preface "check out my comic!" Wirh "i promise it gets better..."

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

COUGH That’s exactly why I’m reduxing Eryl’s hot garbage beginning right now COUGH

Also because I’m a masochist and perfectionist.....

keii4ii

I think "it gets better" is fine when it's a reader reccing it. (I remember some of my friends reccing multi-season anime series to each other, going, "it gets better after season 1") But yeah, as the author we can't be the ones saying it.

Deo101

Mhm.

And I'm still hapoy with my old pages. I know I could do them better now but they're perfectly fine and they get the job done so... Idk its just hard when someone is like "wow two years ago you made a mistake, :/"

Like. Yeah, duh... I've spent like a thousand hours on pages theres gonna be some mistakes

keii4ii

It took me a long time to realize that Flaws =/= Problems

Deo101

I'm learning and getting better youre gonna have to bare with me here

Nutty (Court of Roses)

are you kidding i still get crit on stuff i made TEN years ago

Deo101

Mhm

keii4ii

omg

Deo101

Well its not a competition

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Same, Nutty

Nutty (Court of Roses)

True sorry ;;

Deo101

Ur name just changed colors keiiii

You: flaws =/= problems Your name: im ascending

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I think...learning how to like not be bothered by negativity that much is a skill. Super freaked out one time when someone said they didn't know what's going on when reading HotV whoops

(turned out they just had to re-read a bit and it was just webcomics being webcomics)

Deo101

I had a group of readers say they were co fused and one person asked me to explain the last 2 chapters and i was like "holy shit am i being this unclear????"

Its stressful for sure

Nothjng wrong with being concerned with ut

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Keiiii has reached a new plane of existence. The blue is unrefutable proof

Deo101

Its something you're passionate about and you want to be as good as it can be

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Yeah...

Deo101

So any critique, regardless of validity will be something you WANT to consider

Which is fine and theres nothing wronf with taking things to heart like that

But also if youre Happy with it that's all that matters

You gotta be your #1 fan kinda thing

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I'm personally super uh...yeah I am having a hard time dismissing criticism

even if it's in bad faith, haha.

keii4ii

The #1 fan thing sometimes reminds me of that scene from Lilo & Stitch

The scene of Lilo's rag doll. It's been years since I watched it, so memory's a bit fuzzy, but I think all the kids were showing off their dolls, and Lilo wanted to show off hers too

but the other kids didn't like her homemade-looking doll, and it made her sad, almost not like her doll for a moment

but she picks up the doll again afterward

There are days where I relate to that. I never not-love my story and my characters, but sometimes I feel like everyone else has a low opinion of it, you know?

and I'm like lonely Lilo hugging her rag doll in the sad corner

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Yeah I totally get that and...loving what you do first and foremost is really important. I don't think in a medium like webcomics you would be able to keep going

keii4ii

I'll always love my Doll but I do wish this little corner weren't so lonely, kinda thing

Deo101

I feel that keiiii

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Hmm

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

When the ‘critique’ is detrimental it does become a problem. Like that ‘friend’ I was talking about earlier who bashed Eryl to bits. He told me to ‘read some Stephen King’ to learn how to write. I was making a high fantasy story, not a horror story. The writing of a horror author is simply not applicable to building a good fantasy adventure story. That’s when I knew he was full of shit. But the damage had been done, and I lost all motivation for the project for years.

keii4ii

uuugh, I'm so sorry that it happened to you D:

Deo101

Also this story is one that i have dropped and picked up SO many times, and its wildly changed over and over, and so i worry a lot im not making it in its final form, i suppose. I worry i started it too young, and so critique of the older parts hits that anxiety

Wow lee that's terrible...

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Gosh...

Deo101

Also you can't really compare Novel writing to comics imo. The structure can be compared but...

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I think HotV is like a project I've worked on since...2008? And it changed with me and I feel pretty confident that it's in its final stage.

keii4ii

and not every story needs to be a Stephen King story

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

But yeah, you can really not compare writing for novels to writing for comics wth

nah

tbh it's weird (I like King personally) but his stories and also his writing do have flaws too so

what

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I actually do use novels as a source to study how to construct my comics. But! Studying the right genre is important. I’ve the feeling the only books that guy read were Stephen King, so that’s the only kind of story he was familiar with.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

God when I was still developing a picture I did got featured somewhere and someone criticised the way I did knees and linked to the picture of another artist going: Hey draw knees like that

Deo101

Every story will have flaws, its impossible to make one that is perfect. Well. Its impossible to make a story thats perfect for everyone. So alk you can do is try to make a story thats perfect for you!

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Agreed, Deo

keii4ii

^ THAT REMINDS ME

Deo101

Omg

keii4ii

(going back to the original question) With no response, or negative response, one thing that helps me is hearing other people gush about their beloved unpopular stories!

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Hmmm

Deo101

!!!!!! Me too!!!!!!!!!

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I am having this problem and went to ask on twitter what ppl loved about their projects

and that's really uplifting somehow

Deo101

I LOVE reading other comics and just seeing how much passion is in them its like a light

keii4ii

I need to remember that just because someone, or even a lot of someones, thinks a story is trash, doesn't make it the universal truth

Deo101

^^^

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I WILL GUSH ALL DAY BOUT MY BELOVED UNPOPULAR STORIES and once you open that damn I am unstoppable. You will regret it, trust me.

keii4ii

And people gushing about their unpopular favorites is an excellent way of reminding myself

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

hehe

Deo101

I have been very lucky and have had a few incredibly kind people who i can remember fondly when i worry my story isnt reaching people. I Know it has touched a few lives, and if it makes even ONE person happier (even if thay person is me) then im doing my job and its worth all the time and effort.

That was kind of off topic i swear it connected in mt mind

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Absolutely

I feel it's connected

Deo101

Phew

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

bc hmm it's a way to deal with times when there is not much engagement?

Deo101

Aha! There we go yes :)

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I do generally write very off-beat, unpredictable stories because I like reading / watching those kinds of things. A lot of my favourite movies bombed at the box office because they weren’t formulaic, which was what I loved about them.(edited)

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Remind yourself that there is people who enjoy what you do and who are happier bc of it C:

Deo101

Mhm ^^

Also i have my characters on a shirt so i can just wear that and be like "fuck yeah. I have a shirt. It cant be a bad comic if I've got merch babeyyyy"

Which admittedly is a very odd way of dealing with anxiety

But like.... You should get your Characters on a shirt.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

dfhwioufheuf Deo that's cool tho

I made so many like...background designs and posters for HotV and some of those I WANT ON A SHIRT

Oh I think what also helps me is to find a friend and just talk about the comic?

Deo101

The place i use lets you get up to 6 items a month as a sample order and it's severely discounted my shirt was like $15

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I should do that. I have designed some T-shirts but that wasn’t for personal stuff.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

omg

keii4ii

I'm actually in the (long) process of re-learning how to talk about my comic

Deo101

And yeah for sure having people i csn talk with/joke with about my comic helps soooo much

Like the fact that i know these 5 people will get my jokes like this

THAT helps a TON

These people actually are the reason I was confident enough to be able to start after having a bad friend drive me to almost drop the story for good

So having their support is probably one of the biggest things thst helps if no one else engages.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Okay, so on the original subject of ‘How to deal with no feedback’ I do talk about my stories a lot with my two best friends. They are my biggest fans and my sounding boards. They let me go on and on about plot threads in my comics and it’s one of the main reasons I keep going. Even when I get 0 reaction online, I still have two people who I know are reading the comic and think I should keep going.

Deo101

Or like, when my family is being homophobic about my work kinda thing. Friends are good for that...

Yessss lee having people you can talk with about it is SO good

keii4ii

ngl, I'm jelly of those of you who have go-to support friends who are genuinely into your story! That's something I hope to have some day, myself

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I don’t know whether to give a sad react for homophobic family or a happy react for supportive friends

Deo101

Happy react ^^

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Still sorry about your homophobic family tho, but your friends sound awesome

Deo101

Yeah but :> I know I'm doing good work. Again those few people who i know my story has touched.. i know I'm doin good work.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

@keii4ii Just know I’ve been an acid fan of your comics for over 10 years and honestly think they’re some of the best comics I’ve ever read

AVID

NOT ACID(edited)

keii4ii

Hey acid is important too

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

GOD MY PHONE

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

hiodcnioefwe acid

love this

I have one friend who has supported me since 2007 and I can always count on her freaking out about my comics Y_Y

so when I feel especially bad I turn to her

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

My phone is old and the keyboard lags and autocorrects like AAAAARGH(edited)

Deo101

Its okay same here lee

Typo club babeyyyy

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I have to edit almost every comment I make THANKS A LOT PHONE

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

shakes fist at ur phone to be more kind

I can't type on phone at all so...

keii4ii

Yeah, swipe-typing is high level sorcery to me

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

As someone who’s normally a grammar freak it causes me great pain that my texting is a syntactical disaster.

Deo101

I've been doing swipe a bit lately so it doesn't hurt my hands to text (I Tex too much)

keii4ii

This actually makes me wonder

What are some good, safe(ish) ways to reach out to people who may be 1000% willing to become that Support Pillar for your comic?

Deo101

I just straight up start doing it

keii4ii

For all I know they exist. But.. Schrödinger's pillar

Deo101

And gague the reaction

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

As an antisocial gremlin who hides under a rock, I have no idea.

Pakky

never hurts to ask

keii4ii

@Pakky You would be surprised

Deo101

Start sharing art, see if theyre curious, get deeper if they're good with it, kinda thinf

I've got friends who like to see my art but don't really care about my comic, and you kinda just gotta take it case by case

Pakky

mm fair enough, i always try to be supportive of content creators mostly because i would hope for the same in return. theres a lot of bluntness in my industry so if you do well you get praise but if you do poorly, you very well know it :/

keii4ii

Me: "Thank you for supporting my humble comic!" (this wasn't even asking, just thanking) Reader: "Well, your comic isn't that good." Me: "?????????"

Deo101

Wh

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I’ll be honest, on the rare occasion a reader starts trying to get really close to me, my dumb brain freaks out and I put some distance in because I have Issues for days.

Pakky

thats just rude on their part

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

what

holy fuck

keii4ii

I've Been Burned

omg, that question mark react is so appropriate

Deo101

I've chatted with some readers here or there but I don't know if id wanna use them as a support pillar

I kind of have trained myself to think readers as fickle.

If they get sick of my story, theyre allowed to leave

They dont owe me their time or energy and them being here is a gift

So I'll chat and stuff and answer questions but unless someone is my friend i will not lean on them for support.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Honestly it’s happened that I’ve gad readers try to get really close or be my sounding board, and I think they were just trying to be enthusiastic and supportive but my stupid broken brain always panics and goes WARNING STALKER ALERT WARNING ABORT ABORT.

Deo101

Hey better safe than sorry

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

juppp

Deo101

I'll chat but i wont give personal information and im not gonna like, get all into spoiling everything im planning lmao.

If someone asks me a question thats a spoiler ill answer it in private

But bringing raw ideas up for help... I need very specific people for thst.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

The thing is they weren’t even being creepy or trying to get really personal. They were just very friendly and I apparently can’t handle that. ><

Deo101

The friend group i get writing helo on are all writers, and they all understand my vision. They don't write stories like mine, i dont write stories like theirs, and we all fully understand our suggestions may go unfollowed.(edited)

Also whoever put the eye emoji yeah if u have a question straight up dm me and I'll answer.

keii4ii

It's okay, your comfort is important. If you want to be more open, you can work on that. But not everyone has the same comfort level and that's okay too

Deo101

Yes! Its all about what you're comfortable with

But I've personally got a small curated group of writers/artists who all circulate our work between eachother

Which i know is very rare.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Same, Deo...helped me a lot and I also know who to turn to when I'm down about engagement

Deo101

Mhm ^^

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

(also they are all perceived better than me so I believe them if they say sth nice)

Deo101

Omg

That group of people have done SO much for me honestly. Im thinking about them. I love my friends.

Also dont worry its nit all about me they also talk about and we help their work too i wanna be sure thats clesr

keii4ii

I figured it was all mutual! but now that you've said it's not all about you I'm suddenly imagining The Cult of Deo

That is 10000000% wonderful though

Deo101

I walk in and I'm like "y'all check out this new millennium lore" and they all take their hoods off and start scouring it for plotholes

keii4ii

Whilst sitting in a circle (a magic circle to be exact)

Deo101

Of course of course

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Damn, that’s awesome! I only see my friends every few months so I dump a lot of plot on them all at once, and it’s harder for them to give really detailed critique. XD

Deo101

Oh, I do this all online

Irl I sit down with my sister and we talk for 4 hours and Lose our voices LMAO

Cronaj

Good convos literally ALWAYS happen while I'm at work

keii4ii

I'm still here

Cronaj

Good, because it made me sad when you said you didn't have a support pillar

And that readers are fickle (which can be true)

But I don't think you know how much I love your comic

keii4ii

I'm seriously honored! I still fear that maybe people are not seeing the story I'm trying to tell, and are following the comic for some other reasons (which is valid, just not what I'm trying to achieve). But hey, I'll never find out if I don't keep going, right?

kayotics

keiiii, i love your comic and i think it's beautiful in many ways, not just the art

but also, on the topic of lack of engagement... I'm pretty fortunate in that my spouse is always really supportive of my comic, so when I need a little pep talk I can always ask them

sssfrs

I’m trying to collect as much negative feedback as I can so that I’ll know my comics strengths and weaknesses and I’ll be prepared to take criticism as it comes in the future. It is pretty frustrating having no response or fanbase right now but I started my comic pretty recently and theres still time for growth

Glowbat (Aloe)

when you're collecting feedback be mindful that there's a difference between constructive criticism and people being unhelpful and simply telling you they don't like your work

the latter wont do anything but bruise your self confidence(edited)

keii4ii

Yeah, and sometimes even well-meaning critiques can miss the point too, like if it comes from someone who thinks your work should be X, when it is intended to be Y. Easy example: My previous comic was a depressing drama centering around a terminally ill young woman and her doctor, and once someone told me I "needed more fight scenes." It wasn't even an action comic! In that case, the lack of fight scenes was not a weakness. It simply meant the comic wasn't for that person.

DanitheCarutor

On the topic of lack of engagement. My answer is really boring, but I just keep working on my comic regardless of how much/little engagement it gets. I never intended or expected to have an audience to begin with since my comic has sooo many problematic elements in it, whenever I get feedback it's super nice! Always a surprise, like seeing the machine light up when winning $500 on the penny slots! (In a way, getting engagement is kinda like gambling. You post a page and you may or may not win some comments in return... Not equating real people to items to win, of course!) Admittedly, if there is a page I feel would cause reaction but I get nothing, it is a little sad. It's not the end of the world, though! I got a story to tell, and as long as I can still draw I'm content.

kayotics

i relate to that a lot, Dani. I also never intended to make the comic for anyone but me, so the fact that anyone reads it is really exciting to me.

Cronaj

@keii4ii (Potentially off-topic, but is there somewhere to read your other comic(s)? Or are they all in Korean?)

DanitheCarutor

@kayotics Every so often I look at my reader base and think "Man, there are people into this kind of stuff??" It's an almost surreal feeling.

kayotics

Yeah I get it! I wouldn’t say mines too out there but there’s so many other fantasy dnd inspired comics out there that they could read that I’m surprised they even glance at mine.

AntiBunny

How do I deal with it? Usually experience a series of emotions such as "how hard is it to leave one little comment you losers?" Then "Who am I kidding, no one is reading this, I'm creating into a void," and finally pry a few comments from people who know me personally, reassure myself that I create out of a compulsion to tell my stories even if no one's reading, and start the process all over for next week. Not exactly a healthy method I admit.

keii4ii

@kayotics There is only one Toivo out there

@Cronaj aaaa the previous one was in English. But I would not recommend it It's unfinished (though it does have more than 600 pages IIRC) and honestly really rough.

kayotics

@keii4ii true....... one weird wizard boy

Cronaj

Dang... I LOVE medical stories. I'm seriously addicted to them. @keii4ii

keii4ii

I enjoy them too and I appreciate your interest!

Cronaj

scours the internet for the lost records

keii4ii

The site layout is also broken so yeah...

I guess another thing I do is try to comment more on other people's comics, to rec them publicly, etc. Being the change I want. I don't do this as often as I want, but I think/hope even the little bit I do counts.

mathtans

Heh, I'm basically with Cap'n Lee in terms of a cycle. I think part of my issue is I won a fanfic competition in 2004, and it's kind of been downhill since. I've posted regularly to a serial site for over 4 years, accumulating 300 posts, and last month it had 100 total views... there's been 2 comments since March.

On the actual comic side though (not serial) I've relaunched it more than once, and tried to flag the more recent index as a starting point. And yeah, just hold on to the few good comments, like the guy who applauds me for continuing to post even though I only have 10 people following on Tapas.

These days, of course, I'm too darn BUSY to really think much about the lack of engagement. So one solution might be to get married and have a kid. Then you're just happy when you manage to get content out, never mind if anyone remarks on it.(edited)

Mharz

Popping here just to answer the question becos it's interesting. The lack of engagement was a bane in my existence and honestly one of the factors why I had to see a psychiatrist. My doctor told me I have self-esteem issues which leads me to seek validation from strangers. This is the first thing I work on. I have to be confident enough to not break even if nobody likes my stuffs. Which means I have to love myself first. (People prolly see me as vain at this point) Second thing I do is keep a mentality of "nobody has to care. They have things going on as well" which helps me appreciate the small percentage of people who actually took the time to engage, talk, and be friends with me. I also try to put a positive spin on it. "Nobody cares therefore I can make as much noise on my social media as I want and no one will bother criticizing becos nobody cares." If people unfollow, it's on them. It just means they're not really a fan of my work and I shouldn't waste my time. And if my mental illness is too much, then I will disconnect from the online world a bit. Treat myself. Do something fun like gaming and baking and hang out with friends IRL if possible.

Mharz

I sometimes think it's karma on my end becos I'm so vain, I rarely get interested in anything so I'm not really a fan of many stuffs so that is something I accepted as well.

AntiBunny

Perhaps being a webcomic author sort of goes hand in hand with needing validation.

MJ Massey

OH BOY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT A LACK OF ENGAGEMENT?!

over the past week, I got 24 users. Granted, I didn't update, so that's probably why

So this is a four month overview of my website traffic. I hit a high of 184 unique users in August, and after that it plummeted to just barely over 100. And I hadn't really done anything different

I have never really gained a lot of traction with my comics. I'll admit that Black Ball definitely has more appeal than my last comic, so I have slowly been building an audience with it, but it's still been very slow. Sometimes it feels like I have to adhere to some extra set of rules while others can just throw up their comic on Tapas and have instant success. Of course, that's not the case at all

the key is to remember "why am I doing this? isn't it because I love making comics?!"

and to keep on pushing, keep up that hustle, and enjoy the ride. Make great content and it will be rewarding in and of itself

carcarchu

I'm not really sure it's as simple as simply throwing something up on tapas and getting instant success. there's a lot of work that goes behind every comic even if you don't perceive it

MJ Massey

well yes of course, I'm just saying sometimes it SEEMS like that

I'm a marketing professional, so I know there's a lot of stuff that goes on behind the scenes

Glowbat (Aloe)

theres, i think, a lot of factors in certain comics gaining traction faster than others that are mostly out of a creator's control. on mirror sites like webtoons or tapas you have to factor that more attention is given to certain genres and art styles over other because of what that crowd likes. if they're into slice of life romances in anime-esque styles then someone who writes fantasy mysteries in a more western influenced style may not get as much love as they deserve

its tough out there

ive been fairly fortunate to gain a steady bit of followers on tapas but on webtoons my reader engagement and subs are significantly lower

Glowbat (Aloe)

i chalk it up to the type of crowd

MJ Massey

I've been analyzing my audience and my work and have a hypothesis that my work just works better in bulk format. I think 2020 will be a year of transitioning into bulk distro instead of the page at a time format

and see if that helps. As well as some new marketing techniques and getting back into the con circuit

Kabocha

A lack of engagement... This is definitely... a topic. I feel like, sure, one's general marketability in any given platform will definitely make it easier or harder to attract an audience, but on the other hand? It's also worth making sure you kinda figure out what you want out of webcomics. Some people have been working on their projects (or existing within a fandom) for years - decades, even at this point, which can be a big boost to initial readership on a new project! Other people just have the advantage of being able to sit down and advertise, or having someone do that for them. Personally, though. I went in not expecting to get an audience, and for a long time, actively avoided even having a comment section on my site. I just enjoy making comics and creating things - and if it happens to make someone happy, that's awesome. But comics and art aren't the only thing I do in my life that make me happy, and I've found engaging other people directly about things like comic craft and resources to be about 100x more fulfilling than posting comics themselves. (And it is fun, sometimes, to gush about my OCs and how dumb they can be.) But how do I cope with it? Eh, it's honestly not a big deal to me. It feels less stressful in some regards, because the dayjob can get hella hectic, and trying to balance "OH GOD COMICS" with "OH GOD THE SERVERS NEED PATCHED ALL NIGHT TONIGHT" can be.... interesting.

(But oh god, I will admit, having someone come up to me and say, "I read your thing or used your photoshop/csp brushes" can be incredibly motivating. But other days, I have to be my own motivation, so...)

kayotics

Sometimes it’s helpful to keep a list of really nice comments or to write down memories of when someone told you they like your work. This can take a while to gather but if someone says something nice about your work, keeping it somewhere safe for a day you’re feeling bad can help boost that morale

It also helps me sometimes to think about how there’s a TON of people who never comment on things, but they’re probably regularly reading.

MJ Massey

Totally! I was building a landing page for my email subscription, and I was able to go back and find old reviews from my last comic, and it really got me pumped

Kabocha

Yeah! When I worked in a call center, the metrics on calls in -> surveys was something like... At best, you get 10% of your callers leaving surveys. And it's usually because you left an impression (good or bad). Usually the reality was at best, you'd hear back from about 2% of your userbase unless you gave them an incentive them to say something.

Mharz

re tapas and other platforms: I have to agree that certain genres really are more appealing there. I have two comics with different genres that I regularly update and the numbers are literally like night and day. It's a sad truth.

Mharz

I also love getting notifs on tapas when a person is binging my comics and liking every update. It means I got them hooked. :'3(edited)

nice reminder that there ARE people who like my comics.

Kabocha

Well yeah - even in traditional publishing, some genres generally get larger readerships than others (and higher advances) because they're more easily marketed. There's a reason why some publishers will categorize what's basically a fantasy story with romance subplots as a "romance" overall for a relatively unknown author (it's because they're more likely to attract more readers because romance is HUGE)

MJ Massey

true that

and you have to find where you audience lives as well

Kabocha

Yeah... I have some readers who only engage when they come back to catch up, which can be every 6weeks or more. Some only read when a chapter is done being posted, which is about every six months.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Re: Tapas. Yeah, Tapas especially has very particular styles and genres it likes (anime style + romance, especially BL). I posted Children of Shadow there for six months and had 20 total subs before taking it down. A while later I tried posting it on Webtoons and got 60 subs in one week. That level of engagement slowed down considerably almost immediately though, because the prologue episode is in colour and the main series is greyscale - and I discovered the hard way that the majority of Webtoons’ users do not like greyscale (I even got rating-bombed over it). My second comic is doing much better on Webtoons since it’s in digital colour rather than pencil like Children of Shadow. Each platform has its specific interests and it can be a struggle to get noticed if you’re not making something that falls into its normal styles and genres.

Glowbat (Aloe)

both tapas and webtoons really dont push their scifi comics hardly at all. Tapas' top scifi section is littered with discontinued stories (at least theyve abandoned tapas at any rate idk if theyre for sure no longer continued) which means that because i update weekly and sorta fall into a semi-anime inspired style i get some decent traffic from the small demographic who go hunting for a scifi comic

RebelVampire

That's not that surprising, tbh. Even in the realm of novels sci-fi is more of a hunt for where the audience is sometimes.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Scifi is an under-appreciated genre, imo. Unless you’re Star Wars, Star Trek or a Marvel comic, it seems like people don’t talk much about scifi.

It might help boost views if you rework your genre labels on places like Webtoons. Like, have Adventure or Drama as your main genre tag and Scifi as your secondary genre.

Glowbat (Aloe)

actually ever since avas demon went on webtoons ive been getting about 10-15 subs a week there

for a while i had listed aloe as drama first but the results werent fantastic as i think that genre has been flooded over there

keii4ii

I think sci-fi has some very prominent associations with the genre that don't apply to every sci-fi story -- e.g. the first thing a lot of people immediately think of is spaceship explody battles. So if someone sees sci-fi and they're not into spaceship explody battles, they won't read.

Glowbat (Aloe)

i may try adventure though if scifi doesnt pan out

keii4ii

Alternatively, if someone sees sci-fi and they ARE into that... and only that... they will leave once they find out the comic is not about that

Glowbat (Aloe)

thats also a good point

keii4ii

I've had similar difficulties even though fantasy is more widely accepted these days as a more varied mega-genre

People expect X, comic contains only a sprinkling of X and is about Y instead.

Glowbat (Aloe)

in my personal case, i've alienated potential readers i feel sometimes simply by having the cast be primarily lgtbq with an agender lead. but i dont regret that and im happy to have it deter people who arent down for that

RebelVampire

That is definitely true about sci-fi. Film has really biased people as to what fits sci-fi, where in reality sci-fi is a really wide genre. So a lot of stuff never gets a chance cause it confuses people.

Nutty (Court of Roses)

Yooooo i feel that, glowbat. On one hand, I want ppl to know that my comic is a safe read for LGBT, but at the same time I know that announcing it as such will deter others on principle.

The Q - working on WAYFINDERS

I feel the same way. The whole cast of Wayfinders is some form of lgbt+, but we don't actually adress it much, because it's an adventure story moreso than a romance. So it's like.... how do we tell the readers it ain't straight

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Fantasy does seem to get drowned by numbers. Eryl gets about 5 new subs per update and Children of Shadow only gets 1-2, and I think they’re just getting lost in the crowd.

Nutty (Court of Roses)

Two of my characters jokingly told each other their identity through bard puns, plus I keep pushing for gay ships within the story, so I'm pretty overt with my readers about it ahaha.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

@The Q - working on WAYFINDERS I’m having some difficulty with that dilemma, too. Both my comics feature large LGBTQ+ casts but romance isn’t the focus of either. It often feels like there’s no good way to bring it up naturally until the romance threads surface very far into the story, and I’m always worried about homophobes lashing out when they eventually discover the comic is G A Y

Glowbat (Aloe)

in my descriptions i describe the comic as a lgbtq+ themed scifi flat out

keii4ii

Early in HoK, one character embarks on a journey for a personal reason, and the MC tags along. I've semi-recently heard from an American friend that she didn't really get the character's reason. He wanted to take a younger family member away from a bad living situation, but to the friend, the situation didn't seem so bad. After some talking, we realized it was a cultural thing. The situation was very obviously bad to Koreans, but it didn't/doesn't seem like a far departure from the range of normal life in the US, for cultural/societal reasons. I suspect that was a big part of the reason why people kept pegging my comic as a "fun adventure romp" despite the lack of fun adventures (it has elements of adventure, but is not that as a whole). The reason for the journey seemed superficial, like the author (me) just needed an excuse to start the Fun Adventure-Filled Journey. Whereas Korean readers, back when I was publishing it in Korean, immediately understood it was an intensely personal, difficult task that the shy boy decided to accept for the sake of love.

And yeah, LGBTQ+ as a tag/ part of the description seems like a good option to me too!

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

But then I’m also anxious that LGBT folks will think that’s false advertising because the characters’ labels aren’t mentioned until really far into the story (and it’s no where near that point yet). Aaaagh maybe I just overthink everything.

Glowbat (Aloe)

its really interesting to hear the difference in reception HoK gets

keii4ii

Yeah and the setting itself apparently feels different, too! To Koreans, it evokes secondhand nostalgia. But some non-Koreans have told me it feels fantastical and Ripe For Adventures

Glowbat (Aloe)

I feel you Lee- almost none of my chars have mentioned or done anything to illustrate their identities yet

keii4ii

(I also feel the need to mention, there have been non-Korean readers who got what HoK was about. Those readers mean so much to me! But I don't know if they understood that particular detail about Danbi's motivation for the journey early on.)

The Q - working on WAYFINDERS

(I'm gonna put so much lbgt+ love in the background of the story everytime they get to a new city ahahahaha >:) )

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

To me, @keii4ii HoK is very reminiscent of Studio Ghibli films because I get similar whimsical vibes. But Studio Ghibli has always been more about emotional journeys so after a couple chapters I was like ‘Ah, yes, I think this comic is about the characters’ emotional growth’(edited)

Holmeaa - working on WAYFINDERS

(muhahhaa, also just let Sallly flirt with all the ladies in the BG)

Glowbat (Aloe)

yesss flirt with ladies

MJ Massey

I'm worried that my comic is not "gay enough" to warrant the LGBT+ label. The character's sexualities have very little to do with the actual story, and one character is actively hiding their identity

The Q - working on WAYFINDERS

SAME

keii4ii

I'm aro/ace/agender and I don't really feel "LGBTQ+ enough" so I can't really use the LGBTQ+ label for my own comic, even though I know the label isn't exclusively for ownvoices stories.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I admit I’m not sure I ‘got’ Danbi’s motivations on a cultural level, but I felt like the tone being presented in that scene made it pretty clear she was in a bad situation?(edited)

Holmeaa - working on WAYFINDERS

but... we have calculated a total of 1 straight character in our whole comic.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

‘She’ as in the niece, not Danbi. XD(edited)

MJ Massey

that's what it seemed like to me too, or at least that by leaving their village they were going to a better situation

Glowbat (Aloe)

first of all- high fives keii because agender solidarity and second of all if you have chars who identify as either not straight or not cis or both rolled into one then its gay enough to have the lgbtq label

to heck with gate keepers

there are plenty of queer peeps who just want to read stories that casually include people like themselves

but if you dont feel its needed you dont have to either

MJ Massey

I guess there is a certain expectation when you say "I make an LGBTQ+ comic" of how that comic will be, and I don't want to disappoint people or set them up to expect something different

I just figure that all kinds of people exist in the world, so I should include as many different kinds of people as I can in my work

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I probs should just put LGBTQ+ labels in the descriptions and be like ‘this is genre fiction but almost everyone’s queer even though you can’t tell yet’. XD

Nutty (Court of Roses)

I use the term "LGBT-friendly" to indicate that they're present, but might not be the full focus

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I write genre stories because I’m not that into romance-centric stories myself. I want queer heroes in the kinds of stories I like to read without the entire focus being on their sordid love-lives. I just want to read about the hero who slayed a dragon to rescue his prince instead of his princess, lol.

Glowbat (Aloe)

lol im in a similar position where i'd rather see the hero befriend the dragon

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I have plenty of that in my comics, too!

There’s some nice dragons and some very-not-nice ones. XD

Glowbat (Aloe)

(im insufferable in d&d i was a bard who tried to be friends with everything)

eryl is on my lisssst <3

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

This is why I love bards

Glowbat (Aloe)

hehe

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I'm always happy when people mark their stuff as LGBTQ+ if characters are present tbh Y_Y

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Also agreed with everything said above

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

All right, now Imma definitely have to add the LGBTQ+ labels to my comics next time I do website maintenance.

Glowbat (Aloe)

yay!

Nutty (Court of Roses)

Aw ye aw ye

Join the brigade

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yiss

I feel a bit bad bc I rarely read sth that's not clearly marked as LGBTQ+ or where I know the authors are part of the community whoops

But it's mostly the fact that I consumed hetero-focused media my whole life and now I can...choose.....

the dream

Glowbat (Aloe)

heck yes

im way more drawn to stories that are marked lgbtq+

keii4ii

Don't feel bad, because seriously, even if you exclusively read LGBTQ+ marked stories? There ain't enough time in this life to read every good story that fits that bill.

There are too many good stories out there and we do need to choose.

Glowbat (Aloe)

its just nicer because then i can enjoy the story without having to worry that in the middle of it im going to get a rude wake up call from an off colour joke or somethin at my expense

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah that's true

keii4ii

Sometimes we miss out on stuff that we may have fallen in love with, but that's the name of the game, the game of not having enough time

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Webcomics feel a lot safer than other media in that regard atm

Jupp especially if you're also working on your own stories

Glowbat (Aloe)

it sucks thinking theres a bunch of stories out there that im sure id love if only i had the time or mental fortitude to sift through a bunch of others.

keii4ii

(OTL that reminds me... there is one instance of trope use in an early chapter of HoK that falls into that 'off color joke' category. I don't have any excuses for it, just 'I just thoughtlessly parroted a trope that I saw elsewhere.' I regret it and hope to figure out an elegant way to rewrite that one scene.)

Glowbat (Aloe)

i dont have the energy to be burned so often by stories that seem good and then hit me with random transphobic bs or using slurs as jokes

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yeah, as someone who grew up in a time when no one positively portrayed queer folks in mainstream stories (and there was no internet and living out in the boonies made it impossible to discover underground cultures) I love that now I can seek out tonnes of LGBTQ stories and drown myself in the gay every day.

Glowbat (Aloe)

yesss

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

jupp ;;

Glowbat (Aloe)

man if i could give ten year old me printed copy of paranatural and turn to the pages with rj's identity being explained? that kid would have grown up way happier

living in small towns aint great for queer peeps

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Nope it’s not. I was badly repressed until honestly only 3 years ago when I suddenly asked myself why I loved reading about and writing so many gay characters. And then suddenly my whole life made sense.

Glowbat (Aloe)

im so happy for you<3

Glowbat (Aloe)

its a heck of a thing thinking back on things and realizing why you do certain things

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Honestly there were giant clues from when I was still a little kid and I can’t believe it took me so long. XD But I’m digressing from the comic talk, lol.

Glowbat (Aloe)

haha i understand what you mean

i think its why its so important for comics to be inclusive

spare some poor kids the heart ache and confusion

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yes! The internet has created such a boom for indie comics and that huge variety of voices has been so so important.

Glowbat (Aloe)

as much as comics are an art, they're extremely powerful as a vehicle for teaching and generally conveying ideas

FeatherNotes

Can i just say how happy i am that y'all are making LGBTQ+ comics that aren't just romance tho? I'm pretty indifferent and on the ace spectrum for sure, so its so refreshing that we can have a queer cast just being cool and not hurt by identities. I wish i had that as a kid

Also no shade on romance but there's def a lot and lgbtq+ isn't just for that genre

So yes yall are 'gay enough' lol

Glowbat (Aloe)

i agree! queer peeps shouldn't be squared off in romance, which unfortunately i think is a result of people's gross misconceptions

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Admittedly, I use my comics as a vehicle to work through my own issues, so there are scenes planned where the characters have to deal with transphobia or homophobia. But I will always counterbalance that with other scenes that validate the characters’ identities.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Hmhm my story also deals with transphobia and dysphoria bc I'm working through own issues. I don't think that's a bad thing though

generally I think it's pretty ok if the story is not a constant misery train

(even those can be written well, but they are usually not my cup of tea)

Glowbat (Aloe)

i think its perfectly acceptable to use comics as a vehicle for that lee

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeahh tbh

MJ Massey

there's no wrong reason to make comics/create a thing

Glowbat (Aloe)

youre a queer creator and you're working with what you know so why not

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I know focusing on queer suffering has been criticised a lot but I feel there's more nuance to it. Especially if it's a LGBTQ+ person writing about it

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yeah. I’m a miserable emo and I write miserable emo stories, but I try to inject some hope into it, because I think that the majority of humans are good and/or want to be good.

Glowbat (Aloe)

theres this comic called dropout that does a wonderful job exploring the grittier truths of being queer

its a fairly short read but its super good

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Hmmm, I may look that up

Glowbat (Aloe)

i can dm you the link! no pressure to read it tho

twothirty

gosh, i just want to chime in because i really relate to earlier comments around labelling comics. I'm bi, but i don't wear it on my sleeve, and my own comic has like...1 straight character. I feel like there is an expectation for comics labelled as lgbtq+ and i don't want to disappoint people who are really looking for that content to be directly addressed.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Tbh I feel many people are just happy, if there's queer characters doing cool stuff (at least that's how it's for me).

Glowbat (Aloe)

i label my own comic as lgbtq+ and the plot hardly hinges on that being the central theme

just a bunch a gay scientists and robots in space

...i swear its way more interesting that that lol

man i wish i could get more of my comic out faster so i didnt have to worry about spoiling basic things geeze

twothirty

haha im into it! Ahh, well probably a big part of it is my own insecurities, but what are webcomics for if not... for figuring out your own crap (edited)

keii4ii

I feel that X'D

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

juppp...I get the anxiety tho

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Mess of anxiety solidarity.

Glowbat (Aloe)

oof yeah

also hey while we're at it with the queer biz in here:

aro/ace/bi peeps are all gay enough full stop

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

YES

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

jupp

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

As a demi-bi dude I fully endorse that all labels are valid.

And that gatekeeping sucks and helps no one

Glowbat (Aloe)

yeah anyone who makes you feel like you dont belong under the lgbtq+ umbrella isnt doin right by you

and your comics should be allowed to be considered as queer as you want them to be

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Also all gender identities are valid and don’t hinge on having a physical transition. You’re valid as trans whether you change your body or not.

Glowbat (Aloe)

^^^

YES

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

YESS

Glowbat (Aloe)

all our experiences are valid and the comics we make because of those experience are beautiful

Deo101

Oh man I missed a huge convo, but I love y'all and it's wonderful seeing so many kinds of comics out there and seeing people make their own content

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Yo, nothing "gross" about romance, and the reason people flock to it is because romance with same-gender couples and/or trans people has been treated as "deviant disorder that needs to be cured and cleaned up, or at least kept far away from polite society" for so long (and still is, in many places)

All queer stories are valid, queer characters don't need to be in a romantic storyline to count, but please let's discuss that without echoing homophobic rhetoric about queer romance being "gross", yeah?(edited)

MJ Massey

I don't think it was meant gross as in queer romance itself being gross, but more in the finding a general distaste for romance tropes and romance as a genre

but I agree, that we should be careful about implying those sorts of things with our work

keii4ii

Romance as a genre is valid too; the consensus was just that there's a lot of it, and other genres are valid too. That every genre is valid

MJ Massey

true, but people might just feel strong distaste for certain genres from a personal point of preference

it's part of what makes the fabric of human existence so fascinating, we all have different opinions, likes, dislikes, viewpoints...

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

tbh I love romance stories but the thing that disheartens me is that the queer stories people take most serious are romances

keii4ii

The pigeonholing

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Can you elaborate on that Keiiii?

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Those are the stories that get repressed and erased the most, is the thing, so it takes more effort to get them produced and shared, and that makes people extra-happy

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I don’t think anyone said romance stories were gross?

Just that it’s not necessarily our jam.

keii4ii

Oh, I meant that's what people are doing when people start exclusively associating a very diverse experience/ group of people with ONE thing, to a point where the people in that group are not allowed to be anything other than That One Thing

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I was reacting to "queer peeps shouldn't be squared off in romance, which unfortunately i think is a result of people's gross misconceptions"

keii4ii

and it's a really unfair, inaccurate restriction

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Ahhhh

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

OH okay, thank you for elaborating, Keiiii. I couldn't really associate anything with the term at first!

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Misconceptions are the reason queer people have been excluded from most romance for so long

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I think in that case it was more about people's misconception of queer identities being inherintly sexual and/or romantic though?

and not about queer romance being gross

DanitheCarutor

Huh, I thought 'gross' in that context was more akin to 'outlandish' or 'exaggerated', but I could be misunderstanding.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I think it means more that a lot of people fetishise queer relationships when there’s only representation in romance.

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Associating "queer people being sexual and/or romantic" with "gross" is still hella dicey

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

the misconception is what's gross, not the queer people or their romance?

Glowbat (Aloe)

re: gross misconceptions :Oh! i think i said that Erin- i don't think i did a great job of explaining my thoughts on that. on sites like tapas and webtoons its fairly common for gay couples to be exploited for an audience thats less interested in representation than fetishization(edited)

MJ Massey

yes I think there was some lamenting that it could be difficult to show queer characters without an element of romance to make their identities apparent?

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I don’t think they meant gross as in disgusting but gross as in ‘far off the mark’

MJ Massey

because some people wanted to have queer characters but not focus on a romantic plot

@Glowbat (Aloe) I know what you are talking about I think

Deo101

Yeah, though I'd like to add on as someone who is writing LGBT romance, I get lumped in with fetishization content a lot and that is very frustrating for me, too

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

And it does take a lot of digging to find respectful representation in romance instead of stories made by and for straight people that use bad stereotypes to fetishise queer relationships.

Not that all romance by and for straight people does this.

But it’s a problem in the genre

Deo101

I work very hard to portray healthy loving relationships and people lump me in to their hatred of romance in general or categorize my work as bl or discount it for having that. It gets fetishized or dismissed an awful lot and that's very frustrating for me to see happening

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

If you want to talk specifically about something you feel is stereotypical or fetishizing, I wouldn't object to that, it's the broad swipes at all romance that become a problem

Glowbat (Aloe)

agreed

queer romance is very important to represent

i dont think anyone here would imply otherwise

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

And, hey, sometimes queer writers/readers also enjoy a romance that's unrealistic or trashy or silly or melodramatic, I don't want to dismiss "all romance that wouldn't represent a healthy and respectful relationship IRL" either

Glowbat (Aloe)

very true

Deo101

Yeah, not what I was trying to say.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Idk if anyone was saying that tbh

Glowbat (Aloe)

i think our initial conversation though boiled down to that we were happy to see stories with queer people being allowed to just be people doing things that didnt focus on romance

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I'm personally very glad that we are getting a wider variety of queer romance now

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

What we were discussing earlier is more that it’s important to portray queer protagonists in all kinds of genres, instead of only romance. Which doesn’t mean romance isn’t also a valid genre.

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Sure, and part of my discomfort is that queer characters have already been "allowed" to do non-romantic things in mainstream media for a long time -- it's being "allowed" to have an explicit romance that's new and different

keii4ii

^ I don't know about that. It probably depends on where you are, both IRL and part of the internet?

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I never saw a queer character that wasn’t either tragic, a deviant, or the butt of a joke in media until the late ‘O0s(edited)

MJ Massey

both views are valid--it's good to both want explicit queer romance and to also just want to see queer people doing a wide range of things

DanitheCarutor

@Glowbat (Aloe) Yeah, to parrot what you said. I just chalked the convo up to seeing queer characters expand into different genres, and being happy that queer fiction is starting to be known for more than just romance.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

There was no positive representation in any genre in the media I had access to for most of my life(edited)

Deo101

It helps with the normalization of stories like that, but I also think it makes homophobes be "more comfortable" with gay stories sometimes in a way that bothers me

I have had someone say that my story is the only bl they can stand so I'm sensitive about this subject though

Cause there's a lot to unpack there

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

The "if there has to be a queer romance, at least make it awful and tragic" trope was absolutely true in my area too

yikes, I can see being sensitive about that

Deo101

Like me writing something that primarily isn't romance and just has a romance b plot is making homophobes and fetishizing people read my work and that's frustrating for me in a way I can't articulate. I'm very happy within the LGBT+ community to have these works be made but among the straight people I know it's uncomfortable when they start saying things like "oh yay finally some gay stuff that isn't romance" kind of thing

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah that makes sense

Deo101

From other gay people I get it, it makes sense and I'm the same way! Especially with the oversaturation of bl

DanitheCarutor

@Deo101 Gah I got a comment like that before, it was a weird situation because not only was it unnecessary but... TGtaHR isn't even a romance...

Thinking about it, that's actually kinda worrying.

Deo101

But it's important to remember that the LGBT+ community is a bubble and though it's safe to explore all sorts of stories here, it's not safe outside of our bubble

Or, not necessarily safe

Like a homophobe reading a gay story with an unhealthy dynamic could just bolster their bad opinions about gay people even if it's exploring it in a healthy way

I have a hard time explaining what I'm thinking and I really hope this all makes sense

keii4ii

I get you

Glowbat (Aloe)

(i get what youre saying deo <3 )

Deo101

And its not something we can really change but I think it's important to remember with regards to society at large and how our stories are percieved outside the community

Phew lol

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I get what you're saying, although in that case, the homophobe was probably going to think that no matter what, and if it wasn't the story they'd find some other "evidence"

Deo101

Yeah absolutely

And I think it's important to remember that when talking about exploring stories that have unhealthy Dynamics and things other than romance and whatnot. I don't want those things to become safe for cishets to exploit basically

Like "oh great now I don't need to write them kissing so I can access BOTH the LGBT and everyone else!"

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Ah, you mean like "the author says they're gay, so that counts as representation and LGBT people should buy this, even though there's never anything explicitly gay in the story"

right?

Deo101

Yeah

Deo101

Which again within the community I get and it's important to explore things like that for sure

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I think the important difference is, writers within the community are going to do something to indicate the queer identity, even when it's not "having an on-screen romance"

And that's something that, say, your average JKR doesn't bother doing

Deo101

Again I have a hard time explaining myself and I might be tripping over my words a bit here

Yeah that's true as well

I trust LGBT people to be navigating stories with an inherent nuance

For the most part

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

That, or (I think people were talking about this upthread) we don't advertise a story as "look at all this representation!" while the characters' identities haven't come up in the comic yet

Deo101

Yeah I know I didn't say my story was LGBT til I had the married couple kiss cause I was worried people would think I was gaybaiting

I know I'm not but it feels wrong to me like I'm trying to rally up readers kinda thing...

But also if you know you're planning to do it I feel like you can say it'll be there

I just have anxiety LOL

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

No, I get you. Even if it's definitely going to happen in the future of the comic, it'll disappoint readers if you rally them up for something that isn't there yet

That would happen with anything, not just queer identities

Deo101

Yeah I also don't tag my pages or whatever for disability if a character isn't disabled on the page

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Like if it was "read my comic for cool space battles!" when you had only posted the 5 pages of setup with characters having a chill talk in a field

sssfrs

I think what bothers me about lbgtq focused romance stories is that they’re often centered on how ~scandalous~ the relationship is and how the characters have to overcome personal biases or homophobia/transphobia as the central struggle

Deo101

I don't want the wrong audience. I mean I also could probably slap bl on my cover and I feel like I'd get a lot more readers but they're not the readers I want

sssfrs

Or at least I dont enjoy reading stories like that

Deo101

Yeah that frustrates me too, personally

But some people like seeing that overcoming idk

sssfrs

My comic has at least 2 visible prominent gay relationships but its not about romance at all

I guess thats personal preference(edited)

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I think a lot of the time you also know what intentions the person behind telling a story like that has? I have a straight aquaintaince writing BL and it's totally clear that she thinks the whole ordeal is kinda cute and endearing when it's pretty...harsh for actual queer people

Deo101

Mines got 5 and it is about romance cause I absolutely love romance and I love love, but I am overly frustrated with romance as a genre. Which is why I write my own

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I think that goes back to the "talk about a specific trope that bothers you, don't treat it like the whole genre" thing I was saying

Deo101

Yeah I think there's a lot of nuance to it that cishet people largely don't have

sssfrs

I feel like it makes the romance into a statement about how society is bad and its not interesting or groundbreaking to represent that bigotry in your media without adding something new

Deo101

I'm frustrated with the often unhealthy Dynamics and the frequency with which homophobia and transphobia are shown.

I live in a homophobic household I don't want it in my romance cause it hurts to see

But, I don't think it's bad to tackle those issues it's just hard for me personally

sssfrs

I like pairing up side characters but only 2 pairs are going to have an Arc. so far....

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I...feel for many cishet authors it's also a good excuse to not have the characters get together right away without actually thinking about why they would not for other reasons (like personality based). So there's a lot of "I'm not gay!!!" type of thing

Also totally understandable Deo :C

Deo101

Yeah absolutely.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

It’s also valid, as a queer author, though, to show characters that do have to overcome their ‘gay panic’ when they first realise they’re gay. It’s something a lot of us have gone through, but it’s important to show the comfort you finally feel in yourself when you come out the other end if it.

sssfrs

Why should fiction include all the shitty parts of real life

Deo101

I think straight people see LGBT authors tackle these issues and go "oh so I can too!!!"

And yeah this is why I'm largely drawn to sci-fi and fantasy, I get to entirely remove all the things that hurt me about reality. Dude can just use a cane and everyone is like dope

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Because sometimes fiction helps us process all the shitty parts of real life. Both happy stories that take away shit and gritty stories that acknowledge shit are valid and important

Deo101

Ppl can just be trans and it's fine

I agree they're all important

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

(I think I'm just super bitter bc here I've seen cis and straight women get awards for their queer romance stories which just hmm)

Deo101

^

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I agree it's a super nuanced topic

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

...I feel like you've also gotta make some allowance for bad writing. Like, maybe someone's not getting a lot of nuance in their story because their skills aren't sharp enough to handle it yet.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Agreed, Erin!

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

And one of the ways they'll get good enough to write better stories is by working out issues through writing the worse stories.

sssfrs

My main character is a butch lesbian gnc completely androgynous person and no one is ever going to say anything nasty to her about it

Deo101

I feel you sssfrs lol(edited)

Deo101

I thirst for gentle, nice LGBT stories. I just crave them

Nutty (Court of Roses)

I feel that. As I build Prismal and decided to include lgbt folks in it, my first thought about it was "would there be any reason for them to be hated in this society? No? Then why would I include that theme?"

Deo101

And yes it's important to delve into the harsher realities and I think it's good to use fiction to explore and work through those themes, definitely, but personally no thx

sssfrs

I like where ppl are just all expected to be pan or bisexual by default

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

heh, I literally have 2 comics and one of them is "real world where characters struggle with realistic prejudices" while the other is "fantasy world with 0% homophobia/transphobia."

Something for everyone!

sssfrs

Nice

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I’m too goddamn miserable to write such nice stories, lol. But writing gritty stories where my characters go through hell helps me process the stuff I go through in my life. But I love reading those nice stories where we can forget racism and queerphobia exist.(edited)

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

hehe...I've decided to go into some queerphobia in my next comic only bc I want to...explore historical queer spaces and the kind of space does not make sense in a world that's 100% accepting

Deo101

Yeah it's just all about that nuance babeyy

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeahhh

Deo101

I think that's also why we see so much more LGBT content of all kinds in indie media

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Absolutely

Less gatekeeping, less opportunity for homophobes to shut it down

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

No big boss complaining it’s not ‘marketable’ to be inclusive

Deo101

And I worry that mainstream stuff will be like "ohoho, so that means I can do it too" *stumbles and sets gay people back 10 years in the eyes of the general public *

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

YEEEEEEAH there’s that

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I think the mainstream is going slow enough that that's far from my biggest worry

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

But change never happens smoothly

Sometimes it goes up and down before society evolves into a better mindset

Deo101

Well yeah ofc, but even on a smaller scale of bad people reading good works it is kinda happening I feel like

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

So there’s gonna be periods of shit before being queer is faithfully represented in the mainstream

Deo101

Yeah for sure

It helps normalize things but it also can do it in an unhealthy way and it's frustrating

As in people going "yes let's include gay romance *it's just bl tropes *"

And things like that

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I think the best way to counter that is by producing & supporting more stories of all kinds -- the more complex and multifaceted a view people get, the better

Deo101

Yeah

From people who are handling those stories well, too ^^^

Which is subjective of course I know that

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Also, something nobody's mentioned that I think should come up...a lot of times you don't know who's straight/cis and who's not. Like, if it's Famous Mainstream Author JKR, you can be pretty sure, but with small-scale indie creators, how much can you tell the difference between "straight/cis artist who thinks BL tropes are how all real gay relationships work" versus "gay/bi/trans/etc artist who understands IRL fine, but it's fun and self-indulgent for them to write those tropes"?

Especially since the artist could be actively in the closet. Or could still be on their own journey of self-discovery and not know they aren't straight and/or cis yet. All the more so since indie creators are more likely to be younger than well-established mainstream standards.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I don’t know about you guys, but it’s always BLATANTLY obvious to me by how they’re writing.

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

How did you confirm it? Did you ask them?

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Call it intuition

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I don't think it's always confirmable tho :C

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Granted, sometimes a person writes with enough nuance that I can tell they're queer, but how do you tell a straight writer from an awkward/inexperienced/clunky queer writer?

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I know a lot of authors thinking they were cishet and later on realizing they were not

and some of them wrote a lot of "yikes"

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

There’s writing patterns and use of tropes that signal whether the person is actually respectful if the queer community or not

Deo101

Also just cause you're working through things doesn't mean it's a healthy exploration that is good for the community at large

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Even if they’re queer and self-indulging, there’s a lot of tells both in the comics and in their commentary

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

tbh I think some tropes are fair to criticise no matter if the author is queer or not but there are also queer authors writing disrespectful tropes

it's not sth that I see a lot, but I've seen it

Deo101

^ yeah this

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

All questions of their writing aside, there are definitely queer people who don't respect the community IRL, either...

Deo101

Like it's not good to write glorifying rape fic of pedophilia no matter who you are or how it's helping you work through things. I mean you can write it but then to share it is something else entirely

Not saying those are common things but they're pretty very much "bad" things

And actually glorifying rape is something I do see much more than I would have expected

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

And that’s problematic, too. When you’re part of a community but not respectful of it, that’s just as bad as a straight person being homophobic. Sometimes the worst homophobia cones from within the community, but that doesn’t make it okay or healthy.

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

If you share a dark story behind accurate warnings and labels, then it can reach other people who are working through something by reading it, and be avoided by people who don't.

Deo101

Yeah there's a lot of lateral agression within the community

Okay but glorification of it isn't a healthy way to work through those things it's not a dark story

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I'm not saying homophobia from within the community is okay or healthy, I'm just saying it doesn't have to indicate that the person is straight/cis.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I have a lot of dark themes in my comics. There is rape, but it is never shown on panel and never never glorified. I think it’s a subject that’s important to talk about, but I find it extremely disturbing how much it’s romanticised in fiction.

Deo101

^^^

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah...

DanitheCarutor

Huh, this convo reminds me of an article a friend sent me from someone's Patreon. https://www.patreon.com/posts/25994657 It talks about creation policing, and problematic fiction. You all proooobably won't agree with it given the direction of discussion (which all points of view are totally valid), but this whole subject is super interesting.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

All right, true, you can’t always know if an author is queer or not. I should have been more specific in whether an author has a healthy view of the LGBTQ community or not.

Deo101

So you might not be able to tell if someone is gay by their writing, but there are certain trends that gay people do not generally fall into that MOSTLY indicate someone is straight, though there's no way to know for sure.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

THAT is always obvious to me.

Deo101

And like def there are bi women who fetishize gay men, and there is transphobia and biohobia and everything within the community

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

If they’re being homophobic or just don’t ‘understand’ the queer community, I mean

Deo101

Etc etc, so even if you can't tell whether a harmful representation is written by someone who is LGBT it's a harmful representation regardless

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

^^^^This

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Yeah. I'm always very hesistant on how to address things like this

Deo101

Me too esp since I have such a hard time saying what I mean

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I'm not saying it's impossible to write harmful representation, but "this is harmful!" gets used as a cudgel against any representation, so often that I'm wary of talking about it as a vaguely-defined blanket category.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

It’s hard to articulate things clearly when in fast-paced chats like this

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah, haha

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

At least it's good for leveling people up, huh?

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

eifhiuef pfft

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Lol. ‘You levelled up talking about homophobia!’

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

(I feel we're all respectful and try to explain ourselves and give others the chance to do so too)

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

At least it's good for something??

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

(so that's good haha)

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yes. Talks like this are super important to help see each others views on tricky subjects

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Yeah, I feel like we're making good-faith attempts to understand each other, which...is not something you always get in internet discussions

To put it very very mildly

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

We all have our own stories and unique perspectives, and that’s important to share both in the fiction we write and in discussions with each other

DanitheCarutor

@Phin (Heirs of the Veil) The subject is pretty sticky. On one hand artists should be allowed to create whatever they like, on the other if that work can perpetuate harm for a certain community should it be allowed? There is a lot of this going around right now where people want sanitization in media, and what works of art are and are not allowed to exist. Not saying it's bad, but it is fascinating. I'm not fully getting into the convo because I'm honestly super neutral.

kayotics

I’m definitely watching the convo play out, it’s interesting to see a chat like this develop

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

yeah I'm taking notes this is not my area of expertise, and it's all good stuff to keep in mind

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I'm okay discussing & criticizing specific examples (which is probably why I keep bringing up Dumbledore...), but I don't like being critical of broad categories, because they can be so ambiguous & easily misused.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

@DanitheCarutor I think it is very hard to differentiate between people who want difficult subjects to be explored (which is valid) and people who don't want to be called out for certain kinks for example and a lot of the times stuff like "purity policing" gets used to shut legit criticism up. On the other hand there are a lot of examples of callout culture gone wild and honestly ??? Idk anymore.

Deo101

Its very frustrating

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

But I'm also at a point where I'm getting super tired of constant discourse so

Deo101

Yeah I've literally had to block words like "ace" cause it's just so often discourse from either side and I'm just so tired of it

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Plus there’s always going to be stories that help one person work through things but that are very toxic and upsetting to someone else. Just like there’s people who are toxic to one person and important to someone else.(edited)

Deo101

I've also blocked LGBT and "feminism" kinda things

I JUST see cats and memes now thank you

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Lee: absolutely, which is why accurate labels are important

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Eyyyy, it's my turn!

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yes

kayotics

I think it’s important to curate your online experience, and sometimes NOT curating your experience leads to purity policing

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

HMM

kayotics

But yes tagging is really important!!!

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I think there is the creation of a lot of anxiety in what and what you can't tell in stories

Deo101

Tags are super important but also when someone doesn't think or realize they're doing something harmful they might not tag it

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Warning labels all around are always a good idea

Deo101

Like if someone is being a homophobe just cause etheyre homophobic they're not gonna tag that

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

True

Deo101

Why tag it's glorifying abuse if they think it's hot or reality and don't realize that's bad

Etc etc

kayotics

There’s definitely a lot of creator anxiety lately, I’ve had a lot of friends come to me with anxieties about not wanting to start a project they love because they’re afraid of who might attack them online

Deo101

^^^ I've been scared about this

kayotics

Me too, honestly

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Same honestly

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

There’s always the issue if ‘should harmful ideas be given a platform’ vs ‘stifling voices you just don’t want to hear’ it’s a fine line.

Deo101

I once got all in a tizzy cause I was like "oh my god my planet of women is asking a man for help"

Yeah cause some free speech silences other's

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

Same

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

And sometimes you get people thinking "if I label this with a warning that it contains Bad Content, the internet police will come after me," so they don't use warnings for that reason, and then it's just bad times all around

Deo101

Yeah.

And also there are things no one thinks to warn about, like some very specific triggers

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah...

Deo101

Its just all around a very difficult to navigate space

DanitheCarutor

@Phin (Heirs of the Veil) Right? People do that with anything, if it's not the "purity police" excuse it's "my style", or "I'm friends with -insert minority here-!" I don't bother with the arguments anymore since I've been pushed into them enough, I'm more into seeing opinion on general art policing, or what is and isn't allowed to exist in art. Sorry, I'm being slow at typing again.

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Heck, if we're talking about actual psychological triggers, most of them are going to be super-specific

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I have a trigger for fungal growth on bodies now bc I have 3 people who either have probs with plants growiing on bodies OR funghi lol

Deo101

Ya I have a "someone watching someone else sleep" trigger which people use a surprising amount

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

...wait, Phin, now you have a trigger, or now you use a warning for it?

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

@DanitheCarutor srsly don't worry about it, haha. It's a nuanced topic and I think generalizing is pretty bad when it comes to what you can and can't portray

I use a warning for it, sorry Erin, wasn't clear

I had multiple people approach me so I warn in update posts and should probs also do it on the website

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

no worries, just wanted to be sure

kayotics

I do have an extreme phobia of needles and you’d be surprised how many news sites use active needle shots for vaccination stories

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

GOD I KNOW

I am not afraid of them but like once they are near skin

I don't wanna see...these shots

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I have a deathly phobia of vomiting and there are NEVER warning labels for it.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah I think most people don't regard it and sometimes it's hard to get everything...

a friend of mine, Eli, creates a very gory comic and they put all their warnings on their update post images

and I kinda wanna try to be similarly mindful?

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

(I’m okay if it’s in a comic and off-panel or the gross part is not shown but the sound and sight are crippling for me and shows and movies just SHOW it all the time)

kayotics

That’s true. Not a vomit fan.

DanitheCarutor

Ah I've thought about using page by page TWs, and I tried it out with one page, but with the amount of triggering thing in my comic I decided on a general warning. (since almost every page would get a warning) A few of my readers also said they preferred not to see them due to possible spoilers.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Hmm...I have a list of possible triggers in my about section

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I probably should start doing that bc my comics get very bloody

kayotics

I know I’ll have a scene eventually that I’ll want to have a warning on, but I’m not sure how to warn for it without spoiling?

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I installed a spoilertext plugin on one of my comics for that! Now I can put specific warnings at the front of a storyline, and readers who don't have triggers & don't want spoilers can leave them hidden.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

OHH that's a cool idea

DanitheCarutor

Yeah, mine is like a general pop-up that you have to click on to proceed to the comic.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I’m going to have to look at that plugin. Potential spoilers are the only reason I don’t have really detailed warnings on my comics

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Here's the one I use: https://wordpress.org/plugins/inline-spoilers/

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Yeah I'll look into it too. It seems super useful.

Heck thanks Erin!

DanitheCarutor

I don't know how you could make a warning without spoilers, @kayotics! I mean, you might have to if you want to do a page specific one.(edited)

Sorry, my cat sent the message for me.

kayotics

I was thinking a page specific one for the upcoming scene.

So I’m glad that doesn’t seem weird

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I'd say super-general warnings are mostly not spoilers. A movie will say "contains graphic violence", and that doesn't tell you who's being violent, or why, or how it's resolved.

DanitheCarutor

^^^

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah, I think that's not a spoiler, especially if the comic was already violent

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yeah. I have warnings for things like ‘graphic violence, blood and gore, nudity, etc. But some chapters or pages probably warrant more detailed TWs.

Deo101

Yeah I'm gonna put in my a/n for a few updates before like "hey there are some spooky scenes comin' up!'

kayotics

I wouldn’t say my comic is already violent, so it’s more applicable for this one scene

Deo101

And yeah things like "watching someone sleep" is gonna be at least somewhat of a spoiler...

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

hmhm

DanitheCarutor

@kayotics I think it really just depends on the person too. Some readers like page by page TWs, and don't see them as spoilers, others are the opposite. Your readers might appreciate a warning more than mine since your comic isn't overall super graphic.(edited)

Gah I can not type today!

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I put "this will get bloody" before some of the vampire storylines, not spoiler-cut -- because it's not a given, but shouldn't exactly be a surprise, either.

Deo101

I also do not mind spoilers whatsoever and I WILL spoil to anyone who asks as I've said many times, but I know not everyone is like me and spoilers are a big deal to many people

"i don't mind spoilers" i love them and they make me enjoy things more for many reasons

DanitheCarutor

Ah same! I'd love to just spill everything!

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

(Deo high five bc same)

Deo101

My people

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

tbh spoilers got me interested in many comics and I actively spoil myself

like getting into new comics and reading the updates before jumping to the beginning haha

kayotics

I’m very much the opposite

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I don't want to spoil anything, I want to keep people guessing! But sometimes you gotta.

Deo101

Yes. I get incredibly stressed about whether or not things will work out and spoilers relieve that. Even if it doesn't work out like at least I know

I get so so sooo stressed about it

kayotics

Whenever people tell me spoilers I actively like content less

DanitheCarutor

I don't mind them myself. My mom absolutely hates them, and used to make me spoil every movie if I saw it before her, so I'm pretty alright with it.

Deo101

Yeah ik many people are that way

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah I also think that's fair

DanitheCarutor

Also spoilers don't affect me either since it's not the content that means anything, but how it's used. Imo

kayotics

Usually for me it’s like. “Ok you spoiled a major character death/reveal, that’s not fun for me anymore”

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

OH yeah Kay! Tbh

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

If there's a big twist, I want to be unspoiled the first time I watch/read/etc the thing. If it's handled well, I can always rewatch it again with the knowledge.

kayotics

Because then I don’t get to experience that anymore

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

that's sth that can also ruin a story for me

kinda didn't get into the current season of CritRoll bc of such a spoiler

with comics it's kinda like...I see them on twitter, read along a few updates and then jump to the beginning so there I don't mind spoilers at all

it's more scoping out if the story's for me

Deo101

Oh man I sometimes only get into things because of spoilers LOL I know I'm weird with this but genuinely I love spoilers so much they make me comfortable with what I'm watching. I love rewatching things cause I know how it goes down and I'm not stressed by it

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I sometimes have troubles to deal with...raw emotions towards media so spoilers help me with that too

like preparing myself for it to hurt

(not always tho)

Deo101

Right yeah for sure

Even if I know it won't work out I KNOW and I don't put energy into getting my hopes up

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I hate spoilers, personally. I love going into stories completely blind or with just the bare-bones ‘genre, overall theme’ because I LOVE being shocked and surprised and have plot-twists thrown at me, so that’s what I do with my own comics(edited)

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah that's also fair. Right now my brain's not in the mood for that so I gotta play it save hehe

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I still don't like saying "here's what the Beings are" in ads or sales pitches for BICP, even though the page where it was revealed is several years old by now

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

But everyone likes different things so there’s nothing wrong with giving spoilers for your own stories if people want them(edited)

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah it depends honestly and that's pretty okay.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Everyone’s different and everyone’s valid

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I don't spoil my own story, except with artworks and mostly it's without context or cryptic enough that it's not...a real spoiler

yeah!

in that regard, it's just a huge matter of taste

twothirty

i also jump into webcomics, read them backgrounds for a bit then realized im actually into it and read it properly haha

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

hahaha yes

If I get invested without context I know it's good lol

Deo101

I don't spoil on public platforms cause I know people don't wanna necessarily see that (unless it's in an ama but I try to avoid spoilers still) but in private? I'll spill whatever tf u want like

I have and I will again!!!! Lmao

I know no one is gonna write it like me and also it's p linear so the only spoilers people really ask are Character things not plot things, anyways

So I'm not worried about theft im not doing anything super wild or original lol

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

all my favorite panels I've done are all the most spoilery ones, so... whether I share them or not, I lose

Deo101

Aw man

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

SAME

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

nooo

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

but it makes sense! I put all my effort into those moments where the story twists and turns

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Some of my fave panels or pages are when big reveals or plot twists happened

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

and it shows

so meh, I'll live

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

So I can’t share them to people who haven’t read my comic yet XD

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

luckily they don't make a ton of sense out of context, but... as soon as people start reading they might be like OHHH I know what's coming now

but it got them reading so shrug

I guess all mileage varies

Deo101

I feel like even the way I talk about my comic spoils it LMAO whoops

I'm made out of spoilers I can t hold them all in very clumsy

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

haha

I feel the same a lot

(But I also just wanna scream 24/7 about my stories whoopsie)

Deo101

I once had readers asking me to sum up a chapter caus ethey were confused and I just waited til someone else did it cause I was worried I'd spoil Something in trying to sun it up

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Linear stories are good too, though! Just reading a satisfying, well-written story is great; there doesn’t really NEED to be twist and turns for it to be food.

Deo101

Who doesn't wanna scream all the time and their stories hahahahha

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

GOOD

NOT FOOD

GAH

Deo101

Millennium is yummy yummy yum

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

...for the in-universe version of spoilers, I just had a moment of "hang on, this scene could've been way more dramatic if this one character hadn't already been given a certain reveal last chapter"

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

good food, agreed

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Normally I get away with not having a long buffer prepped ahead of time, but for once I wish I could still change this

Nutty (Court of Roses)

i spoil a lot about my characters more than i do the plot lol

i mean except their backstories sometimes

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Oh :C sometimes it's like this, Erin. Reasons buffers are good, but when do you have the time....

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I've tried putting this one on hiatus to prep a buffer, but it turns out I need the deadlines and the regular feedback to push me through making the pages...

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

oh I see. Understandable though...the only time I create real buffer is when I finish a book for print and have a deadline there.

(I wanna try to actually...get better though, since I wanna start a second comic project)

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I mean, sometimes if there's a process that works for you, you gotta just go with it and not waste energy fighting it. Even if it's not the Best or Most Professional way.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

yeah that's true. It's just frustrating when you compare the work you get done in these phases vs. every other time.

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

Clearly the solution is to split it up into smaller books, so you have more print deadlines!

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

haha, that might be!

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I need buffers or I get super stressed. Unfortunately I also find them difficult to keep up.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Buffers are very hard to keep up. I'm running out of mine next week, whoops

But I've already started working on new pages

Erin Ptah (BICP | Leif & Thorn)

I have...a half-finished, past-deadline page open in another window right now, lol

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I haven’t been able to draw for about a month, so one comic’s buffer is getting low and the other’s going to either miss this week or be late.

And I’m stressing about it. -_-

sssfrs

I’m so excited for my story to progress. I’m tempted to talk about it but when I am I think that nothing I say casually will be as impactful as just letting the story actually play out

Desnik

I deal with lack of engagement by throwing my ideas (or myself) at people. I learned that keeping secret twists as spoilers was inhibiting my growth as a writer, so instead I talk through my plots with my writing group and I often walk away with much better ideas to write

We're a kidlit/MG/YA group and I'm writing in a similar fashion, so we usually don't have to warn each other about anything we're writing, which is its own kind of freedom

if I can get the content to be good enough, and land in front of someone who'll help me take it further, then the engagement will follow

keii4ii

(This the right place?)

Deo101

Speaking of a lack of engagement, i feel like my engagement rates are incredibly low. I get a good bit, i get comments on every page and im very happy with that, but it's odd that i dont get more given my amount of readers and I wonder if some comics just aren't the kind of story people feel a need to say anything about, or what?

I think so?

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

My engagement rates are... almost nonexistent.

keii4ii

I TOTALLY GET THAT DOUBT

When my anxiety is bad, it gets... really bad. "Maybe my story isn't worth commenting/ there is nothing to talk about it." I know that's just anxiety, so I try my best to not listen to that voice.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Although I think my audience is just not there? My page-views are pretty low, too, so maybe I just don’t have enough readers to comment (outside of you awesome SF perps)

PEEPS NOT PERPS

MY GOD THIS PHONE

keii4ii

Yeah, my views are fairly low too, considering the sub count I have on platforms

Come on, phone. We're not criminals. (Probably. )

Deo101

Yeah, its just weird when i have like. 1000 readers on tapas and get 0 comments i guess? I do kinda feel like my comic is very.... Its very linear its character driven and people can onky say "aw cute ^^" so much so idk what they would say

Like its legit .1%

keii4ii

hides the bloody knife

Deo101

ITS IN THE FLOWER POT!!!

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I was getting about 1k daily views right after I joined SF but now it’s back down to about 100 a day, so shrugs

keii4ii

Views though, it's natural they spike like that even if you retain 100% of the people who checked out your comic!

because typically, people only go through the old pages once

so they give you more views upon first visit

Deo101

^^^

keii4ii

But I 100% understand the worry of "why do people check out my comic and decide not to read it... is there something wrong with my work"

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

On webtoons I think I have relatively good engagement for Eryl considering my low sub number. I have about 350-some subs and get an average of 1-2 unique comments per page, though that number goes up when a character dies. (edited)

That’s true! They do get kinda ‘falsely’ inflated when people binge-read archives

Deo101

Most comments i ever got is when I said "tell me your pet names"

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Lmao, I should try that

Deo101

And then outside of that when luzio and sage do something cute is the most I get like, organically just frim my content

Amas are second most comments which are again, me starting the discussion

Maybe alk my authors comments should be like "tell me about your fave color" that'll inflate my stats

keii4ii

One person told me they don't comment because everything seems so obvious, and they don't wanna be captain obvious. Which I can respect. But I don't think everything is that obvious if the most common comment I get is "I'm lost"

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Hmmmm

Deo101

Hahahahhahahahah

Like "NO PLEASE SHARE THESE THINGS"

keii4ii

IKR

Deo101

Help everyone else out!!!

keii4ii

There is a term in Korean comment section culture

"Konan" (from Detective Konan)

It's a term for commenters who explain obtuse stuff for other readers

Sometimes you'll even see comments like "Hurry up, Konans! I'm too tired to think! Spoonfeed me what happened in this update!"

Deo101

Me reading every comic ever

keii4ii

I NEED A KONAN IN MY COMMENT SECTION

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Honestly I wish western readers did that, but they either get attacked for being ‘Captain Obvious’ or people scream SPOILER!!!! at them

Deo101

I really wish people woukd expkain for me too because then i know some people get it, but ALSO i dont want to explain things i didn't show, accidentally.

snuffysam

one thing i've found that helps with engagement is making sure to include something on the page for people to talk about, no matter how relevant it is. like a while back i had a (in my opinion) fairly boring scene where it's basically "where do we gotta go" "i'm not telling" "please" "ok you gotta go here" so to give readers something to talk about i had one of the characters take a hotdog out of a pokeball and eat it.

keii4ii

There was also this incredibly, incredibly obtuse comic. It had a fascinating hook but then became almost impossible to follow. You'd see comments like "so this is the Forbidden Realm that even Konans cannot enter."

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Hahaha

Deo101

I try to make every page have something, i usually have 3 goals i want a page to accomplish but it's not very... Fun i guess? Its just kibda like "yes this happened"

keii4ii

It's also kinda sad when you DO put something important to you, and nobody says anything (or worse, says "so when is it gonna get interesting???")

Deo101

Yeah...

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

So once I spun this theory on a comic by picking it up from context clues. And I was like ‘Hey guys, what if X character is the dragon???’ and everyone was like ‘WELL DUH IT’S IN THE HOVER TEXT.’ I read comics on mobile where hover text doesn’t always work, and after getting sneered at for something ‘everyone knew already’ I was put off of ever being a Konan type again.

Deo101

:(

I never read the hover text unless its by accident I just dont think t

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yeah. And it wasn’t obvious from reading without the hover text so I was really proud of myself for figuring it out. But it just goes to show how rude commenters can scare away well-intentioned ones.(edited)

keii4ii

aaaugh D:

snuffysam

tbh i'm not sure why an author would put something important in the hover text where mobile readers can't see it. or tbh in blogs, side stories, etc. if it's important to understanding the main story, it should be in the comic.

Deo101

Yeah that's what im thinking... Hover text should be for puns

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

It was revealed later that chapter in the main comic, but apparently it wasn’t a ‘secret’ like I thought it was.

keii4ii

Bleeeh, sorry that happened to you. >_< This is why we can't have nice things

Where is the nearest Konans R Us, I want to order one for each of our comics.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yeah... I’m very socially anxious / awkward so I’ve been scared away from quite a few comment sections. I still read the comics and buy them if they go to print, but a negative commenting experience usually discourages me from ever participating in the discussion.

keii4ii

100% understandable

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Which is why I feel it’s super important for the creators to moderate their comments (or hire a good moderator if they don’t have the time). A lot of comment sections get toxic if the author is lax about fostering a positive discussion environment.

Deo101

That makes me feel much better about the times ive asked people to cut Something out or deleted comments.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I appreciate that effort very much.

Deo101

I worry that its "disengenuous" or something and if someone has a negative opinion I don't want to be like "nope you're ONLY allowed to be nice to me!!!" But it's not good, i don't think, to let people feel safe being mean In my comments.

keii4ii

Yeah, there is being critical, and there is being mean

Deo101

So I rarely do it but I have and I don't feel any guilt over the times i have

Right

keii4ii

Sometimes a comment can tread the fine line between the two and it's really annoying that it's not Obviously, Blatantly Mean

Deo101

Yeah hahahahahhaha

keii4ii

But I try to remember that I too have walked that line unintentionally and obliviously, back when I was younger

Deo101

Right. I have too

I was like "oh man I am so smart and im about ti IMPART MY KNOWLEDGE ON YOU!!!" *Is a jerk *

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

That one comic I was talking about earlier: the author had a hard time keeping up with moderating and eventually took comments off the main site. It was 100% not her fault and she was herself getting emotionally distressed from the amount of negativity in the comments. Especially since the comic itself is really thoughtful and has a lot of messages of acceptance.

Deo101

:(

keii4ii

>_<

Deo101

Uhh but yeah! Does .1% feel like about what y'all get as far as comments:readers goes?

.1-.2

I feel like i have no actual gague for this lol

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

It varies from comic to comic (for no quantifiable reason, usually) but that is about right. 99% of readers are lurkers.

Deo101

Dope, I was worried I had like super low numbers when talking with some people and it got me worried about my content

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Plus subs don’t necessarily translate to active readers. A lot of people just never clean out their library after they stop reading something / subbed it to read later and never got around to it or left the site entirely.

Deo101

But I've also just got a lot of anxiety about what im producing and how it's percieved in general

Yeah ik

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I can see people binging my archives from my stats but maybe 1 in 100 or less leaves any comments.

snuffysam

on average, each subscriber to my comic has posted about 45 comments total (which is like 0.07 comments per subscriber per page) if someone clicks on a page (subscriber or not), there is a 0.5% chance of that person leaving a comment.

Deo101

See for me its like. 1 in 1000 leaves a comment...

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

(It’s okay I get anxiety over it, too)

Deo101

Yeah i was gonna say uhhh whats it called

Shoot i lost mt train of thought.

Right. I feel like the longer a comic goes on tbe less frequently people engage

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Yeah, I’ve noticed that in my comics, too.

Deo101

Like less readers will have made it to the end, more will be inactive, etc

snuffysam

i've found that my active commenters take a jump in early march (i.e. right after the comic's anniversary), and any time a book ends (since, i guess people like seeing how all the stuff that's happened in the book culminates)

Deo101

Oh that's an interesting note

snuffysam

i suppose that's some other advice on increasing engagement - give a reason for even caught-up readers to leave comments. one thing i've been doing is redrawing old pages and releasing the redraws on anniversaries, which gives reason for people to re-read.

and for end of book stuff, i suppose people are more willing to predict how something is going to end when it's close to ending

Deo101

Hmmmm

I'm taking notes

twothirty

seeking validation through comments is my downfall, because i just dont seem to write a comic that has the type of readership who is into that. What helped was just looking at google analytics and being like "oh right, of course people read this, its clearly here in this data" haha.

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

twothirty, same. It's kinda hard to get out of that mindset.

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Raises hand I need constant reader validation and get depressed easily when there isn’t. It’s not healthy, but it’s really hard to break out of that mindset.

Deo101

Im not seeking validation through comments, but when i have thousands of readers and get only like 5 it does make me look twice and start wondering if there's something I'm doing wrong.

And yeah it's hard to break out of the mindset

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Me constantly atm haha

Deo101

Especially if you've bee. Hurt in the past and you feel like people secretly hate your work because... In the oast they have

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

I wonder if it's actually...a change in how people interact with media nowadays?

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Oh yeah, definitely, Deo. I got so much negative feedback when I first started posting webcomics and it still sticks with me today.

Deo101

Yeah I've been lucky where people have been mostly nice to me or otherwise just indifferent which makes it so I don't have a super negative experience that my anxieties latch onto

And its STILL hard

Because words of affirmation is my love language lol

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Partly I think it was because I was creating a lot of gender-nonconforming characters in an era when that wasn’t well-accepted in Western comics (reminder that I was surrounded by a veeeery conservative environment at the time), and partly because my skills were just not what they are now. There were a lot of nasty comments from both strangers and people I knew, and it was really tough to work through. I think if I hadn’t had the Tomgeeks forum to hang out in, I probably would have given up.

(For you young’uns, Tomgeeks was a webcomic list site and we had a really tight group in the forums. A lot of that old crowd are now in Spider Forest).

Kabocha

(Sorry, saw the tomgeeks mention! I remember aspiring to be in that group one day, but I was a lil' too much of a noob back in the day.) A lot of media is kind of... Sometimes you need to put a call to action to be like, "HEY LEAVE A COMMENT!" or something - else, they forget in a lot of cases, but ofc that's no guarantee.

keii4ii

Re: people being less willing to engage the longer a comic has been going on, that is definitely a thing

I think it's called archive burn or something

and I feel it too sometimes, as a reader. I feel like I'm not "allowed" to start reading a comic unless I can find a big enough chunk of free time to finish the archive in one session

It's 100% irrational but... it is a thing

I've found that I don't experience it IRL, with physical books. The end of each volume is a really good stopping place

snuffysam

then i suppose a problem is that webcomics don't really have stopping points you can physically see like physical books like when you're reading a book series, you know where one book ends, but when you read a comic you don't really unless you check how many pages each chapter has

and even then it's hard to keep that in mind when it isn't physical

mariah (rainy day dreams)

I definitely understand that feel. It's kept me from doing a lot of the book club comics because I'm like "I got ten pages in, but that's not enough to comment" T_T

snuffysam

maybe someone could program a widget for comic sites that works similarly to the page indicators in ebooks. like "you're 40% of the way through the chapter, and at your current reading speed you have 10 minutes left"

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Comic Rocket!

mariah (rainy day dreams)

Does Archive Binge also have a feature like that?

I feel like they might... I don't use those kind of readers so I'm not super familiar with them.

snuffysam

archive binge lists what page you're on and how many pages the comic has, but there's no reading speed thing no

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I don't know. I'm technically on Archive binge, but didn't get any subs there so I didn't look into it past creating my listing. I don't use those services myself because I like a nice long archive to work through, but I know that comic Rocket shows you how much of an archive you've read.

snuffysam

also, the thing i'm talking about would be for chapters as well as the whole comic. because if there is a big archive, people like to know how long they have before a good stopping point

mariah (rainy day dreams)

I'm on Archive Binge. I don't think I have any subs either but definitely get traffic regularly as if I did. How even does internet work ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

snuffysam

i guess recently updated?

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I usually check out the archive page of a comic to get a good idea of chapter length, myself. So I know if I'm in for 10 pages chapters or 100 page chapters. Plus, idk, I have no problem stopping anywhere and picking it up again later, but I may be a pretty atypical reader.

Lmao, I have no idea how the internet works. I was one of the first people to list on Archive Binge and I have never gotten a single click from it. I get a steady number from Comic Rocket, though.

keii4ii

I wonder if it'd be worth experimenting with chapter numbers? Like, re-number existing chapters like "Season 2, chapter 2 of 15" instead of "chapter 20" ?

Deo101

^ thats a good idea

seeing "chapter 20" makes me as a reader go like, oh god, theres so many,,

snuffysam

^ that's one of the major reasons i label things "book X chapter Y" instead of just counting up chapters forever though adding "out of" is an interesting addition...

keii4ii

I'm nearing the end of season/ book/ whatever 2. I should give this a try

Cronaj

Lol, my books are going to be 3 chapters long each, so I don't think it would make much sense for me XD

keii4ii

Yeah, my chapters are short but numerous, so this might have a different effect than comics with longer but fewer chapters

Deo101

I'd be afraid of saying "out of" cause... well, i dont know how many heheh...

it all gets wacky when it comes time to actually make the thing

snuffysam

i mean, could add 'em retroactively as each "season" finishes

Deo101

oh thats true!

keii4ii

I would probably do "Chapter x out of [REDACTED]" (not that but something similar) when I start posting book 3

Cronaj

Yeah, my chapters are around 35-50 pages, so they're pretty long'

snuffysam

listing how many chapters are in book 3 would kinda spoil a twist lol, so i'll probably only do it retroactively

same lol

and some are 80 pages

book 3's going to have one 120 page chapter which is wild

Cronaj

I was thinking about printing 4-5 chapter books, make it more like a manga-length

keii4ii

You know, some comics (Korean comics do this a lot) do like... Chapter 10: Happy Day, followed by Chapter 11: Happy Day (2), followed by Chapter 12: Happy Day (3)

Cronaj

but full color printing is expensive

keii4ii

Dividing what might have been a single chapter into digestible chunks

snuffysam

i've split "arcs" into multiple chapters before, but unfortunately there aren't really any solid split areas in the chapter in question

Cronaj

and I doubt anybody wants to shell out $25+ on a 200 page comic

This is of course, a consideration for the future, as I don't even have the first chapter finished yet, but ya know

Come next year, I'll have some big decisions to make

@keii4ii Is that a webtoon thing? I've noticed that webtoons have shortish chapters

snuffysam

webtoons an entire chapter is posted at once

keii4ii

It's a Korean thing, which means Webtoons gets some of it

Cronaj

I mean, technically I post my comic in scrolling format, so I consider it a webtoon, but it's definitely drawn for print

@snuffysam, I mean the length of the chapters. The chapters (or episodes) are usually somewhere between 50-100 panels long, which is anywhere between 10-20 pages of a traditional comic

keii4ii

(Tangent, but as a Korean speaker I'm very weirded out by the word "webtoon" in English contexts. Over there every webcomic regardless of format is called a webtoon; I guess it's like anime/manga in Japanese? That in Japan, every animated show is anime, and every cartoon thingie is manga?)

Cronaj

Yeah, that makes sense

In the english speaking world, originally there were comics and webcomics, with little difference between except that one was posted online

but when Korean webtoons entered the English-speaking market, the naming conventions changed

The major difference being the prevalence of scrolling-format webtoons, which made people think that the difference between webtoons and webcomics is the format

but really, it's just a naming thing

You can call a comic a manga, and people expect a black and white comic in a specific style, but really, it's just a comic in Japanese

keii4ii

Yeah

Deo101

I usually just say "scroll style comic" or "page format comic" because im putting pages up on webtoons so it feels... weird to me

keii4ii

That too

IT'S A PICTURE STORY THINGIE WITH SPEECH BALLOONS

Deo101

hahahaha

Cronaj

In the end we are all just children XD

kayotics

this is really late, but i've been getting a lot more comments on my main site lately and I have no idea what I did to encourage that.

Deo101

people caught on

kayotics

That's probably all it is, but it's really surprising that my main site is the one getting more comments, since I wouldn't say it's necessarily a well built comment system? It's the native CMS comment system, and I require the first comment to be moderated

keii4ii

Does this mean I can claim I started reading Ingress before it got famous 8)

kayotics

yes

BUT, I'd say that the estimation of 1% of readers (or whatever the number was) is still accurate.

Deo101

.1% ish

kayotics

I have the most eyes on my comic over on Tapas, and while I do get a handful of comments there, it still equates to less than 1% of the total people subscribed. I'm sure there's a lot of reasons for that (like subscribers who aren't regular readers, people who quit the app, etc), but even the ratio of views to comments is pretty low.

Deo101

yeah I've been noticing that too

I have the most eyes on webtoons but I still have like. a good chunk on tapas and I think those are just more... casual sites

kayotics

yeah absolutely

Deo101

like on comicFury I have way higher engagement rates and i think that's pretty typical cause most of that audience there is also creators

kayotics

I'm sure there's some people who are pretty dedicated on Tapas, but I'd guess that there's more dedicated readers on my self-hosted site, just because they have to specifically seek out the content.

Deo101

^that makes a lot of sense to me

I know a lot of people who follow me on tapas are following 100+ other comics

and i know for SURE I wouldnt be able to take the time/effort to comment on like 10+ comics a day, assuming theyre even keeping up with all thsoe

wow yeah I just checked my list this person has over 6,000 comics theyre subscribed to, and a few have over 500

just on the first page of my readers(edited)

sooooo yeah it makes sense why engagement would be low if people are regularly reading that mant...

keii4ii

I actually rambled about this on twitter recently!

Deo101

and also makes me feel a little bit less bad when people are confused hahahahaha

keii4ii

How I thought I'd get a very small readership who are into what I'm making, but I ended up getting that very small readership PLUS a huge number of people who are just casually reading it

That first expectation was mostly based on my experience with my previous webcomic, but things were different back then. Big platforms weren't a thing, so casual readers were less common.

Deo101

yeah that's really neat

since I've only been making millennium for like... a little over 2 years and it's my first comic, I kinda just started with like 5 mirrors and was like "alright well, lets see how this goes I guess"

I had only ever read one webcomic before i literally have no idea how or why i got so convinced into making a comic

but since I was like 12 years old I was like "hm... I am going to make a comic i think." I just never did any research or tried til recently

or read any. I dont know how this happened

keii4ii

Casual readers vastly outnumbering the dedicated ones used to make me feel like I was doing something wrong, but I think that's just how the times are.

Deo101

Yeah :/ it's hard NOT to notice and feel like you're doing something wrong though.

when its like "okay i have 7,000 subs and got 5 comments" it's like ??? what am i doing WRONG

even though... its nothing wrong

it just be that way

hard to match those two ideas up though

almost went to continue this thought in an entirely different channel.

I think there is also something to be said for people not wanting to repeat a comment

like "oh someone already said what I thought so I'll just give it a thumbs up"

keii4ii

That's what upvoting is for!!!

Deo101

yup!

keii4ii

though, tfw highest voted comments are like "I have no idea wtf is going on lol"

Deo101

YEAH.

also do you ever comment on your own pages?

like not replying to people

keii4ii

I think I did once or twice, back when I actualy had relevant info and didn't have enough room in author's notes or something

Deo101

I've done it a few times, but it's usually kind of to ask questions where I can get replies

keii4ii

I have also seen a pro Korean creator post "first" on their own comic because they were tired of seeing so many of those

Deo101

I did that once LMAO

it's funny when people comment on my comic "FIRST!!!" cause i'm like. dude i get like 10 comments it's not that special to be first

but i'm happy theyre there and theyre excited its kinda cute i guess

keii4ii

Yeah, it's harmless

Deo101

and it's also nice to have people think that they have to race to be first

even though they don't

so it's kind of a nice comment to get even if it's not commenting on my work at all

keii4ii

It's kinda like hitting the like/heart button, just with more HURRY POINTS

Deo101

yeah hehe

oh i do 100% like all my own pages though

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I actually get the most commenters on Webtoons but I’m (fairly?) sure I have more readers on my website.

Deo101

on webtoons, I don't do it on tapas cause you can see i did it LOL

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I think I only ever got one First! comment and that was the only comment on that page.

keii4ii

Hey no shame in being your own #1 fan

Deo101

the one time I said "first!" was cause it had no comments on it for like a year and a hal

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Oh no, I don’t like my own pages. For some weird reason I feel like it’s cheating.

Deo101

and hell YEAH! I'm my number one fan so much that i'm making a dang comic for how much I like these characters ;D

keii4ii

I don't feel bad about liking my own pages, but I rarely do it because I wait a bit before even looking at the post

Deo101

inflate your own stats its cool. all the cool kids are doing it

keii4ii

And by the time I look at it, I forget about liking

Deo101

I only do it on webtoons cause I have to manually post there anyways

so i post and its like "heres the page!" and im like :) good job me :)

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I might start doing it. XD I get an average of 5-10 likes per page so why not.(edited)

Deo101

I also rate myself 10* or whatever the max is wherever I can

keii4ii

Yeah, and TBH one like isn't gonna give you an unfair advantage anyway

Deo101

^

keii4ii

If you're making a dozen alt accounts to give yourself more likes, now that's a bit questionable

Deo101

yeah that would be not so good

but you're a real account who likes your work so why not!

keii4ii

Yeah!

Deo101

I also honestly kinda like to sub to my own stuff and like my pages partially to make sure it's all working right

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I should probably rate myself 10* bc both my comics got ratings-bombed at one point for really dumb reasons.

Deo101

like to see when the page goes up and everything

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

The ratings have slowly crawled back up a ways, but it’s always disheartening when people attack my comics for stupid things.

keii4ii

Oh, to go back to an earlier point about asking questions to readers to encourage commenting, I might straight up ask next week if my comic is making any sense.

Deo101

ohhhhh man i dont like swingin at that hive lol

keii4ii

I'll have to word it well because I do not want it to be a pity party

Deo101

but i mean it might encourage the people who do get it to go "yup!"

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I do straight up ask every now and then. Sometimes I’ll get a pity comment when I do and sometimes it’s still crickets.

Deo101

also I feel really lucky that I havent had anyone be like, mean to my about my work.

I feel like trolls have really gone down in popularity

keii4ii

like even right now I feel like nobody's getting it (except maybe <10 people) so..... I don't think the answers could make me feel worse

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I meant I straight up ask for comments, ugh, I misread Keiiii’s post.

I GET IT, KEIIII

I LOVE UR BABIES

Deo101

oh man, I could never just ask for comments. if I'm feeling really down I usually send it to my friends like "can i have smth nice please" I just get really anxious asking people for things

not that asking is necessarily bad I just, as a person could never do that

also keiiii I havent read it yet but it's on my list cause the way you talk about your work and what I do know of it... seems like it would really jive right with me

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I usually do it along the lines of: ‘If you enjoy this comic, don’t forget to leave a comment! Getting feedback motivates me to keep drawing!’

Deo101

oh okay thats not so bad

oh my god how are the eyes moving

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

I’m shameless, you can say it

Deo101

I have too much shame probably

keii4ii

It is my anxiety moving the eyeballs

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

Give me sone of your shame, it’ll even us out

Deo101

please take it

keii4ii

(anxiety with Nitro powers)

Deo101

NOOO dont be anxious im gonna love it

god that eyes shaking emoji is so great

keii4ii

ikr!

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

So fun fact- my real face eyes do that

keii4ii

I think Tatsumaki wants to see you do it

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

It’s called nystagmus and it’s super trippy if you’ve never seen it before!

keii4ii

OH, I knew someone with that condition!

I never noticed anything about their eyes (only heard about them having the condition from talking), because I never met them while wearing my glasses X'D;;

Cap’n Lee (Flowerlark Studios)

My eyes just RANDOMLY do it a lot and it really freaks people out XD

Desnik

I've found that comments don't matter too much, but getting a boost from someone with a big following does

and the only comments I take seriously are from people I trust, although I get it: chasing the internet numbers is fun

snuffysam

what do you mean by "comments don't matter" you mean, like, in terms of garnering popularity?

Desnik

yeah, and as validation they can be a bit fluffy too

my perspective changed when I started printing out my work as zines and got people to buy them irl, it was very eye-opening

very few people commented on them online but in person I've found out they're not bad? And one of them got me a lettering job

keii4ii

Eh, I think it's okay to have different goals. To some people, good comments mean the world, and that's totally valid to want that.

Desnik

I know, just stating my pov

keii4ii

I mean that to some people, a good comment is not just an "internet number."

Desnik

fair enough

I believe I allowed for 'good comments' as being from someone I trust

keii4ii

Me, I treasure insightful comments from anyone who's invested in my story. To each their own

FeatherNotes

I have a book that I write them down to give me a lil boost to morale when I need it! i def appreciate the time it took for someone to write something thoughtful

keii4ii

Yeah!

Capitania do Azar

Oh comments are like.. What I like the most! (not all comments are the same tho). The reason I put my story out there is so I can share it and discuss it with people and the fact that a few take some time off their day to actively tell me what they think it's what keeps me moving

eli [a winged tale]

I really enjoy comments too. I always respond to my Instagram ones but not the comic ones mostly because of platform difficulties

Glowbat (Aloe)

I love reading through all the comments- they really motivate me when I'm having a low point and need a pick me up to get goin on pages. I just wish I was better at knowing how to respond instead of just liking the comment and hoping they recieve my telepathic brainwaves of gratitude

Phin (Heirs of the Veil)

Replying to comments is very hard and I always have the anxiety of "ruining" it haha ;; whatever it is (the person's enjoyment of my work?? who knows)

Glowbat (Aloe)

I feel that- part of me is always nervous I'm gonna say somethin to off put them or smthn.

Though I do try my best to curate comment sections if things are looking like they're gonna get rowdy

keii4ii

YEAH, and/or sometimes you're like "this comment is Awesome and deserves an Equally Awesome reply... HOW DO I DO THAT" and get stuck in a loop

Glowbat (Aloe)

yesss exactly that

I'm not that clever and I require lots of time to come up with anything I'm confident in lol

and by the time I have something cool to say back its been like a week

keii4ii

I made a Discord icon to express my internal response in a visual form to such Awesome comments, but I can only use those on Discord

This one:

Glowbat (Aloe)

Hehe

cuteee

and also a mood

keii4ii

Sparkling tears of happiness

Capitania do Azar

I believe them

Cronaj

Man... I will admit, I barely respond to comments

And that probably sounds terrible

But I honestly don't have time to respond to every comment

As well as the anxiety of not know what to say

It does depend on platform tho

keii4ii

I mean, as a reader I don't expect a reply if my comment is like "ooo nice!"

Cronaj

Generally, I respond more readily to comments on Tapas than on Webtoons, because I only have like 2 commenters at most on Tapas

And usually it's readers who ALWAYS comment, so I almost feel like they deserve a response, even if it's just a smiley face or a "thank you"

keii4ii

But if I've written a long ass essay comment, it would be nice to have some kind of engagement with that. Don't get me wrong, the creator doesn't owe me a reply but it's like... should I ever do this again with this comic. Or is my reply-writing time better spent on another comic

Cronaj

True

keii4ii

I def respect that not every creator has time to read all of the comments, regardless of how many comments they typically get

Cronaj

On Webtoons, I have way more engagement, but most of it is thirst for my characters or talking about the art style

keii4ii

and that not every creator may even aim to get comments

Cronaj

So I don't usually know how to respond to stuff like that

keii4ii

But if that is the case........ I would rather know before committing myself to multiple essay-length comments

Yeah, that is understandable!

Cronaj

I read every comment, but I don't want to respond to all of them

keii4ii

I'm 100% cool with "thicc" comments on my MC's butt or on my tiger dude's legs, but I can't necessarily think of productive replies to those

Cronaj

The only comments I respond to on Webtoons are either a) incredibly funny, b) meaningful and noticing more than the art, or c) a genuine question

Like if someone asks about my update schedule

Or if someone wants to know which programs I use

I had one comment about how good my grammar in the dialogue/thoughts is, and I felt so honored that someone else noticed

Usually I get comments about the art (which is also nice), but I prefer comments about the story or subtleties

keii4ii

It's the best thing when people notice the things that you put a lot of thought and love into

Cronaj

For several years in high school, I played around with the idea of getting a writing degree, so grammar and literary language have a special place in my heart

sssfrs

I respond to every single comment... I get one comment a month pretty much though

When friends or readers say nice things about my comic on any platform I save a screenshot and read them if I start to feel like nobody likes what I’m making

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

I do the exact same

FeatherNotes

Its a good practice when things are kind of slow! Or just for that lip morale boost too

[goodnightkisseu]

Hwang Minhyun - Taste

Genre: Fluff

“When We Met” Series: [Minhyun][Jihoon][Jaehwan][Guanlin][Daehwi][Jinyoung][Jisung][Woojin][Seongwu][Sungwoon][Daniel]

Note: Hi everyone! I’m back with another series and this time, it’s a particularly special one because it’s a series that will be counting down to Wanna One’s 1st Anniversary! I’m calling it “When We Met” because it’ll be a series of scenarios, using Wanna One’s individual debut teasers as starting points for how you meet! 

This is also a series in collaboration with @nothingwithoutwannaone​! She will be writing her own versions of how you meet and I will link them in each post ^^

Anyway, Minhyun is up first! I hope that you all enjoy!

nothingwithoutwannaone​‘s version ---> [x]

- goodnightkisseu’s admin <3

“Ah, this is so exciting. I can’t believe we’re doing a pictorial for a real celebrity!” one of the interns said, the two girls chatting amongst themselves as your team entered the familiar studio. It was one of the many buildings that the food and cooking magazine that you worked for owned. Whenever there would be a special pictorial with a celebrity or a really well-known chef, the kitchen would be retro-fitted for the needs of that person. Today it had a simpler look, a little European but cozy and full of earthy tones. This didn’t happen often, of course. The magazine was very niche and most of the time you and the others were just setting up for a simple food pictorials, no people involved. So when a chef or a celebrity did want to be pictured, everyone always got a little excited.

“Girls, I know that this is all very exciting, but do remember that you’re here to work,” your director teased, and the two interns gave her a quick nod before running off to set up the lighting and to get the rest of the equipment ready.

“They have so much energy,” you said envying your young coworkers ability to just jump right into work. You had been working as a photographer now for about three years. Though you still enjoyed everything that you did, you knew that there were definitely times when you lacked that energy. Maybe they could teach you how they did it.

Your director giggled as she looked over at you. “You know, I remember when you were all excited to meet your first celebrity too,” she pointed out.

“Oh I know you do,” you shot back. “I was even harder to control than these two, wasn’t I,” you said with a giggle, your director not giving you an answer, though her walking off to check on the interns told you volumes. Whoops.

Though, all joking aside, you understood being excited about meeting a celebrity for the first time. It was definitely an experience, particularly meeting someone that would be called a celebrity chef. The group was small, but everyone had such interesting and diverse experiences of how they got there, no two stories were identical. You had met your fair share now, and wow, were you blown away each time someone told you their story about how they went from one thing to one of the most well-known chefs in the country.

Today’s chef also had an interesting story of his own. Hwang Minhyun was dubbed as the overnight celebrity of the celebrity chef world. His popularity had come fast, but that didn’t mean that he didn’t deserve it. From what you had heard, not having talked to him yet, was that he was trained in the culinary arts, but working at a restaurant just wasn’t for him. Instead he worked a normal day job, and when he got home at night, he would prepare extravagant dishes to keep his abilities up to par.

At some point he started to share his culinary work online and this was what got people’s attention. They were drawn in by the beautiful pictures that he took, taking into account the ambiance needed for the dish, and hell, as a photographer that did this for a living, even you were impressed. People then started asking him to give them cooking tips and even asked for those quick videos on how to make particular dishes. It started off as something small, but in no time, Minhyun was already doing full on cooking tutorials. The popularity he gained was fast and he became an internet sensation in less than a year.

A couple months ago, a management agency had reached out to him and asked if he wanted to sign a deal with them, where they could manage his career, and really get him known. It seemed like it was appealing to the young male because he quit his day job and started down his path as a celebrity chef. Today’s pictorial was to be his introduction to the world. He had done an interview separate from the photoshoot and you and the rest of the team were here to take all the pretty pictures that would fill the pages of his interview.

The sudden whispers from your coworkers were enough to pull you from your thoughts, where you had been aimlessly running through the different shots that you wanted to get that day. Your eyes wandered over to where the voices were coming from, but, if you were being honest, you weren’t ready to come face to face with such a sight. Your eyes instantly landed on Minhyun as he greeted the other staff members on his way in, and for the first time in a while, you were in absolute awe. You knew that Minhyun was an extremely good looking individual. When you had been doing your research on him to help set up the pictorial, you had seen his pictures. You just didn’t expect him to have that aura in person though, the type of aura that left you star-struck. You were so stunned you didn’t realize you were staring until his eyes fell on you and you quickly looked away and down at your camera, trying to hide you embarrassment.

“We’ll try not to be invasive as you cook, of course, but sometimes it’ll be a bit unavoidable if we want to get certain shots for the magazine. I’ll do my best to direct the staff so that we don’t hinder you too much. We want this all to feel natural to you as well,” the director explained as she walked with Minhyun and his manager over to you. “Ah, and I also want to introduce you to our photographer. She’ll be responsible for making you look good today,” she teased, and that was when you knew… she had caught you staring at Minhyun. What was your life right now…

Still, you quickly pushed that to the back of your mind and introduced yourself, a gentle smile gracing your lips. Minhyun returned the smile before he spoke. “Please take good care of me today,” he said kindly, and you gave him a small nod before his manager ushered him off to go change before he set up the kitchen the way he needed it…

========

The photoshoot went without a hitch, overall. The atmosphere remained light while you all worked, the staff watching Minhyun in admiration as he worked, and Minhyun seemingly having fun creating some of his favorite dishes. It was a little awkward at first, of course. With you in the kitchen with him, camera in hand, there were a couple of awkward moments where you would go in to take a picture but he needed to move to get some spices. There was a lot of apologies flowing from the both of you, but once the two of you figured it out, he was courteous to you as he worked. He’d let you know when he needed to get to the sink or if he needed something that you may be standing in front of. You always felt like you were in the way – because you honestly were – but you wanted to get nice pictures of him that would really show his personality. He was kind and genuine and you really wanted that to show in the pictures.

You were going through the pictures with the director and his manager, trying to cut out the ones that felt unnecessary or that didn’t capture the atmosphere very well, when you realized that you were missing a couple of shots. “Please keep going through these,” you said as you picked up your other camera. “I think I need a few more pictures of the food itself. I’ll be right back,” you explained, before running off towards the kitchen.

Busying yourself with getting your camera set properly, you entered the kitchen without noticing that someone was still there. When you finally looked up, you saw Minhyun, with a Polaroid camera out, his face full of concentration as he tried to take some pictures of his own. Honestly, it was kind of cute.

That was when an idea struck you. Pulling up your camera, you knelt down ever so slightly to get a nice shot of Minhyun, just as he was about to take a picture. As you looked over the quick picture you had just snapped, you couldn’t help but smile. Considering how impromptu it was, you thought that it captured him the best out of all of the pictures you had taken that day. It would be the perfect picture for the beginning of the article. It felt like it showcase him, and how he started down this road.

Slowly approached him, you let him know that you were there, and he quickly turned to greet you, your eyes catching a glimpse of the three or four Polaroids that were lying on the counter. A small smile formed on your lips as you proceeded to take some pictures of your own. When you were satisfied that you had enough shots, you gently pulled away from your camera and looked up at Minhyun. “You take really nice pictures,” you complimented.

Minhyun looked at you with wide eyes, not expecting such a compliment, and honestly, he got a little shy as his eyes looked down at the pictures he had taken. “Ah, they’re alright, but they’re definitely not as nice as the professional pictures that photographers like you take,” he said, throwing the compliment right back.

“I think you could take better pictures than me in no time with a little practice. Can I show you?” you offered, and he quickly nodded, eager to learn some techniques that would help to make his food photography look even better.

You spent the next half an hour or so teaching Minhyun about some small things that could easily improve his pictures, such as the angle or the lighting, or even depth of field. As you ran him through each different idea, he was comprehending it all rather quickly. You were impressed. He was a good listener.

As you were about to show him another technique, you heard your director calling for you… and that was when you realized that everyone, except for you, had already packed up and ready to leave. “I’ll be right there,” you told her. “I guess I lost track of time. Ah, but that means I’ve kept you around for quite a bit too. Sorry about that,” you apologized.

“No need to apologize. It’s really fine. I was really enjoying the lesson. I learned a lot,” he said with a smile to show his gratitude. An idea seemed to strike Minhyun at that moment. “Before you leave, do you think you could give me one of your business cards?” he asked.

You quickly nodded, reaching into your bag and pulling out a small case, which you opened to take out a light blue card, handing it over to Minhyun. “I’d love to work with you again. I hope we’ll be able to make it happen.”

“Me too,” he replied, taking a look at the card as you turned to leave. “But, do you think I could see you before that? I’d really like to take you out to dinner, maybe get to know you better?”

You froze in your spot even as you heard your director calling for you. You could feel the heat rising in your cheeks as your brain processed what Minhyun had just said. Was he… was he asking you out? “Excuse me?”

Your reaction having not been what he had expected, Minhyun’s confidence faltered a bit. “I-I mean… not to be too forward, but I’ve enjoyed your company today and I thought we could go out and have some fun. I’d understand if you weren’t interested tho…” he said slowly, his confidence wavering.

Deciding to put him out of his misery, you gave him a smile. “I’d actually like that a lot, Minhyun,” you admitted, your cheeks a radiant shade of pink. He seemed in higher spirits after hearing your words, and before you could say much else, you heard the familiar voice of your director calling you and you knew you had to leave. “See you again soon!” you said before running out after your team, a giant smile plastered on your lips…

[megatraven]

ok ik u guys are like probably rlly tired of me talking about how i’ve improved w/ my art this year

but im just so excited i can’t help it

i’ll put it under a cut this time tho lol

idk man, I’m just. I keep looking through my old shit and seeing how much I’ve improved this year just inspires me to work even harder? It makes me feel like I haven’t wasted my time and I’m just. Super happy.

I’m slowly gaining a better understanding of the human body and how it interacts with things around it and that’s something I’ve wanted for so long.

God i just.... sometimes I feel really down about my art but right now I’m really excited and I’m wanting to do more and this is the most I’ve been excited about doing art in awhile. Feels good, man.

[oovitus]

How to answer the most common nutrition questions like a boss: A cheat sheet for helping anyone hone their eating habits.

If you love nutrition, health, and fitness — or you’re already a professional in one of these fields — you probably get a LOT of diet- and nutrition-related questions from friends, family, clients, and/or patients. 

That’s why we created this cheat sheet, with evidence-based, easy-to-understand answers to the most common questions, all of which are covered in our newly updated Precision Nutrition Level 1 Certification program.

++++

If you’re a health and fitness professional, no doubt you get a ton of diet- and nutrition-related questions.

Heck, even if you’re just really passionate about health and fitness, you’re probably getting questions all the time.

Coming up with the right answers can be difficult, because:

The right answer depends on who the asker is. Young athlete? Middle-aged man? Sixty-something woman? Whether you’re actively coaching, or you just have a diverse social network, the questions will run the gamut.

There are so many facets of nutrition. Macronutrients, micronutrients, supplements, pesticides, GMOs… where do you start?

There’s a TON of confusion about nutrition “truths.” Is red wine saving your life, or killing you? What about red meat? Eggs? And how ’bout that new plant-based diet?

The truth is, there is no one-size-fits-all answer to any nutrition question.

However, if you build a strong foundation of nutrition knowledge, you can:

learn how to accurately determine each person’s individual needs,

understand how targeted nutrition can support their goals, and

get better results for them, confidently and reliably.

With this article, you’ll start to build that foundation.

Here we’ll cover:

what’s really behind the most common nutrition questions,

why each person’s unique physiology matters,

how each person’s situation can help determine your response,

how to handle diet trends (Paleo, carb-phobia, etc.), and

how you can incorporate this knowledge… starting today.

Of course, this “cheat sheet” is just a start. There’s so much more you can learn.

That’s why devote the entire first unit of our newly updated Precision Nutrition Level 1 Certification — 300 pages, 8 chapters, 8 comprehensive video lectures — to the most crucial elements of nutrition science.

That includes the most up-to-date findings in cell physiology, digestion, energy transfer, nutrient biochemistry, and more.

And, in case you’re wondering, the other 300 pages, 9 chapters, and 9 video lectures are devoted to the art of nutrition coaching.

That includes the most up-to-date findings in change psychology and the latest things we’ve learned having coached over 100,000 clients.

So…

If you want to learn, we’re here to teach.

If you feel excited and inspired by what you learn today, and you’d like to learn more about the program, please put your name on our Precision Nutrition Level 1 Certification presale list below.

We’re excited and inspired too.

We recently updated the program with the latest research, and enhanced it with a new workbook/study guide, over 35 new client assessment forms and questionnaires, and 17 brand-new animated videos.

The program opens up on Wednesday, April 3rd.

Since we only take a limited number of students, and the program sells out every time, we recommend adding your name to our presale list below. When you do, you get the chance to sign up 24 hours before everyone else. Even better, you’ll save up to 33% off the general price of the program.

Double win.

For now, let’s get started with some of the most common nutrition questions, including:

Question #1: “I’m new to this whole nutrition thing. Where do I start?” Question #2: “What’s the best diet to follow?” Question #3: “Is counting calories important for weight loss?” Question #4: “Should I avoid carbs?” Question #5: “Should I avoid grains?” Question #6: “What (and when) should I eat around my workouts?” Question #7: Should I drink less alcohol? Question #8: “Does the Paleo Diet live up to the hype?” Question #9: Should I do a detox or juice cleanse? Question #10: “Do sleep habits and stress really affect nutrition?” Question #11: How should I eat to get six-pack abs?”

Question #1 “I’m new to this whole nutrition thing. Where do I start?”

Answer: Let’s start by eliminating nutritional deficiencies.

This one is always interesting, because no one ever wants to believe they have nutritional deficiencies.

People might not want to hear it at first, but nutrition beginners don’t need a major diet overhaul on day one. They don’t need to “go Paleo” or “eliminate sugar.”

As their coach, your first step should be to open newbie clients’ eyes to the fact that they probably have one or more nutritional deficiencies (seriously — more than 80 percent of the population has at least one).

Until nutritional deficiencies are removed, the body simply won’t function properly — and that makes any health or fitness goal a lot harder.

So, to eliminate deficiencies, your first order of business is to help the person find workable strategies for rounding out the diet, so they get:

a bit more protein,

ample vitamins and minerals,

sufficient healthy fats, and

more water.

Tell them that you’re going to help them establish optimal eating habits one step at a time. Then talk through some strategies: Find out which of the nutritional areas listed above will be most challenging for them (for example, some of the beginners we work with don’t know how to cook meat). That’s the problem you’re going to help them solve first.

Once nutritional deficiencies are addressed, you can start to focus on things like food quality and portions.

What to say when the person seems impatient? Explain: “This process isn’t slow; it’s systematic. It focuses on the things that are in your way right now. Once they’re eliminated, progress happens fast.”

READ MORE:

The 3 steps I teach trainers and health coaches to fix any diet problem.

How to fix a broken diet. [Infographic]

What to do when you don’t like vegetables. [Article + infographic]

Question #2 “What’s the best diet to follow?”

Answer: There is no “best diet.”

As you emerge as a health, fitness, and nutrition expert, everyone’s going to want to know: Which dietary “camp” do you belong to?

The best coaches maintain a neutral position on this. If you can, strive to be a nutritional agnostic: someone who doesn’t subscribe to any one dietary philosophy.

Why? All dietary protocols have their pros and cons. What works best for one person won’t work best for another. Also: A diet that has worked best for someone in the past won’t necessarily be what works best for them moving forward.

Tell your client or patient that you’re going to help them find the approach to eating that works best for them right now, whether it be Paleo or vegan, high-carb or low-carb, tight budget or unlimited funds — or some blend of all of these.

The truth is, the human body is amazingly adaptable to a vast array of diets, so the best diet is the one that:

matches the person’s unique physiology,

includes foods they enjoy enough to follow consistently, and

is realistic for them in terms of life logistics and budget.

Indeed, you can make people lean, strong, and healthy on a plant-based or a meat-based diet. You can help improve their health with organic, free-range foods and with conventional foods. They can lose weight on a low food budget or an unlimited one.

It just takes a little know-how and a system for using the best practices across all diets.

READ MORE:

Paleo, vegan, intermittent fasting: Here’s how to choose the best diet for you.

Question #3 “Is counting calories important for weight loss?”

Answer: For many people, calorie counting may be more of a hassle than it’s worth. The good news: There is a better way.

Weight management is a simple equation: Eat more than you burn, and you gain weight. Eat less and you lose weight.

But the physiology behind “calories in, calories out” is actually much more complex and dynamic than most people realize. Plus, it’s imprecise; we estimate that there’s typically an error of up to 25 percent on the ‘calories in’ side, and on the ‘calories out’ side.

Beyond that, counting calories is an external system (outside of your body). In essence, people who count calories are less likely to see lasting results because they’re outsourcing appetite awareness to the food-label gods. To really win at portion control, coach your clients or patients on tuning into their internal hunger signals.

For these reasons, and more, we tell our clients that for most people, counting calories is a lot of work for very little benefit.

(Interestingly, most clients become elated when they realize they can get the body transformation they want without ever counting calories again.)

Instead of calorie counting, we recommend a hand-measure system for portion sizes. Here how it works:

Your palm determines your protein portions.

Your fist determines your veggie portions.

Your cupped hand determines your carb portions.

Your thumb determines your fat portions.

This system counts your calories for you, and gets your macronutrients lined up too, without having to do any annoying food-label math.

Plus, your hands are portable — they go wherever you go, making portion-sizing very convenient. In addition, your hands are generally scaled to your size — the bigger you are, the bigger your hands, so the more food you need and the more food you get.

Clients typically get the hang of this system within a week of learning it; then we help them monitor results and tweak as needed.

READ MORE:

Forget calorie counting: Try this calorie control guide for men and women [Article + infographic].

Can eating too little actually damage your metabolism?

The surprising problem with calorie counting. Part 1: ‘Calories in’ and Part 2: ‘Calories out’ [Infographics]

All about eating slowly (for appetite awareness).

Question #4 “Should I avoid carbs?”

Answer: No; but let’s make sure you’re getting the right kind of carbs.

Ask almost anyone what they need to do to lose a few pounds, and they’ll probably say: “Cut back on carbs.” As a professional in a health/fitness field, you’ve probably heard it dozens of times.

However, most folks would do best eating a moderate amount of quality carbs—whole grains (when tolerated), fruit, potatoes, sweet potatoes, beans and legumes, etc. (We emphasize moderate, of course).

For men, this usually means about 1-2 cupped handfuls per meal. And women, about 1 cupped handful per meal.

Of course, the needs of each individual may differ, based on their size, activity level, goals, and genetics.

But, bottom line, carbs are not inherently fattening, especially whole food sources. And getting adequate carbs can help most clients exercise harder and recover better, optimizing progress.

Yep, this is a controversial position to take. But it works. And while avoiding carbs may facilitate rapid weight loss initially, we’ve found that it’s not practical (or necessary) for long-term success for most people.

READ MORE:

Carb controversy: Why low-carb diets have got it all wrong.

The ketogenic diet: Does it live up to the hype?

Question #5 “Should I avoid grains?”

Answer: No; most people trying to stay lean do best with a reasonable amount of whole grains.

Grain discussions are really trendy right now, as many people have suggested they’re dietary enemy #1 and should be completely eliminated. This is hot news as, just ten years ago, they were supposedly one of the healthiest foods on the planet.

From our perspective, grains aren’t as evil as they’ve been made out to be by the Paleo and Whole30 camps. At the same time, they aren’t the superfood vegans and macrobiotic eaters suggest either.

Bottom line: While you don’t need to eat grains, unless you have celiac disease or a FODMAP intolerance, there is absolutely no need to avoid them. (And even in those two scenarios, it’s only specific grains you need to worry about).

Most people follow a better, more health-promoting diet if they’re allowed grains in reasonable amounts, along with a wide array of other non-grain carb sources like fruit, potatoes, sweet potatoes, beans, lentils, etc.

Remember, it’s the ability to follow a diet consistently over time that provides the greatest results, regardless of what that diet is. And unless you’re intolerant, there’s no good reason to totally exclude certain foods, especially foods you enjoy.

READ MORE:

Settling the great grain debate: Can wheat and other grains fit into a healthy—and sane—diet?

Question #6: “What (and when) should I eat around my workouts?”

Answer: It depends on your goals. Let’s talk about those… then we can come up with specific recommendations for you.

If you train athletes, this is a really common question. But lots of non-athletes are curious too.

Contrary to popular media, most folks are best served by eating good quality whole foods in reasonable amounts, without having to focus on specific workout nutrition products or protocols.

So you can advise non-athlete level clients to eat a normal, balanced meal 1-2 hours before and after exercise. This will provide adequate protein and carbs to both fuel the workout and maximize recovery/adaption.

However, if you coach advanced, hard-training clients or athletes, tell them you’re going to help with their unique workout-nutrition needs.

Endurance athletes, bodybuilders, or those looking to maximize muscle gain could add a protein and carbohydrate drink during their workout. We usually recommend about 15 g of protein and 30-45 g of carbohydrate per hour of exercise.

Physique competitors, as well as people trying to maximize fat loss, could add essential amino acids (or branched chain amino acids) during their workout. We usually recommend 5-15 g of EAA (or BCAA) per hour of exercise.

In the end, rather than having one stock answer here, you need to be clear about who you’re working with.

READ MORE:

Best workout nutrition strategies: A useful guide for what to eat before, during, and after exercise.

Workout nutrition illustrated. [Infographic]

Question #7 Should I drink less alcohol?

Answer: If optimal health and fitness is your priority, consider reevaluating your drinking habits.

People may balk at that answer initially, but once you lay out the facts and make it clear that you’re not telling them not to drink, their ears will open.

There’s a lot of confusion about whether drinking is good for you or not. That’s mainly because the news media likes to play up new studies revealing the possible cardiovascular benefits of alcohol.

But the truth is, no one really knows who will benefit from light to moderate alcohol consumption. Meanwhile, any level of drinking (even “moderate”) comes with health risks that should be considered.

Heavy drinking — more than 7 drinks a week for women and more than 14 per week for men — increases the risk for a long list of health problems involving the heart, brain, immunity, hormones, liver, and metabolism.

But even light to moderate drinking can affect sleep, appetite, and decision making — which absolutely can have a negative impact on your clients’ health and fitness goals.

Still, drinking is an undeniable part of culture, and when enjoyed reasonably it can be delicious and fun.

Tell your clients or patients that you’re going to help them sort out their priorities to determine the best level of drinking for them. Then encourage them to track their drinking habits — and how their drinking habits make them feel physically and psychologically — for a couple weeks.

Most drinkers consume a lot more alcohol than they think, and when they stop to evaluate, many decide on their own that it would feel better to cut back.

READ MORE:

Would I be healthier if I quit drinking? My quest to understand the real trade-offs of alcohol consumption.

Question #8 “Does the Paleo Diet live up to the hype?”

Answer: Mostly, yes. But not for the reasons you think.

The Paleo Diet is one of the most popular nutrition approaches in the world right now. There’s no doubt that it works for many people. However, the reason it works has little to do with the story the Paleo proponents tell (evolutionary adaptation, inflammation, etc.).

Here’s the deal. Paleo does work for a lot of people because it emphasizes mostly whole-food sources of lean protein, vegetables, fruits, and healthy fats.

However, while Paleo is starting to incorporate more high-quality carbs, grass-fed dairy, red wine, and other things that used to be “off limits” — the diet can still be too restrictive for some folks.

In the end, Paleo likely gets more right than wrong. And if people want to follow it, you can help them do it in a sane, reasonable, sustainable manner.

But for most, it’s unnecessary to follow such a strict dietary ideology. You can take the good from the Paleo approach and get rid of the silly dogma.

READ MORE:

The Paleo problem: Examining the pros and cons of the Paleo diet.

Question #9 Should I do a detox or juice cleanse?

Answer: Probably not; most popular detox diets don’t remove toxins or lead to fat loss.

Lots of people are worried about the effect of modern lifestyle factors like poor nutrition, sleep deprivation, stress, and environmental pollutants on their health.

So you probably get a fair number of questions about detox diets and juice cleanses, which have come into vogue as an efficient way to (supposedly) lose weight and rid the body of impurities.

But detox diets don’t clean out toxins or help you lose body fat. In fact, detox diets can work against these goals by bypassing the body’s natural detoxification systems and creating a feast-or-famine cycle of eating.

Among many problems, detoxes and cleanses often:

are protein deficient,

are extremely low in energy,

cause unhealthy blood-sugar swings,

cause GI tract dysfunction, and

lead to a yoyo of restrictive eating and overcompensation.

If doing a juice cleanse or detox diet helps a person get ready to make further helpful and sustainable changes in their life, OK. Just coach them through a cautious and monitored protocol.

However, we prefer helping them build life-long skills and incorporate daily practices to improve their health, performance, and body composition without extreme (and unsustainable) things like detoxes and cleanses.

READ MORE:

Are detox diets good for you? How a 3-day juice cleanse landed this dietitian in the ER.

Question #10 “Do sleep habits and stress really affect nutrition?”

Answer: Yes, but those effects vary from person to person, as do the best sleep and stress management strategies.

Sleep is just as important as nutrition and exercise when it comes to improving your health, performance, and body composition.

Clients and patients should be coached through:

creating a sleep routine, including having a regular schedule,

limiting alcohol and caffeine, especially in the afternoon/evening,

choosing de-stressing activities before bed,

setting an appropriate room temperature for sleep,

making the room dark,

keeping the room quiet, and

waking up appropriately, with light exposure and soft noise.

As for stress, it’s all about finding the sweet spot. Too much stress, or the wrong kind, can harm our health. Yet stress can also be a positive force in our lives, keeping us focused, alert, and at the top of our game.

It all depends on what kind of stress it is, how prepared we are to meet it — and how we view it.

Since stress affects the mind, body, and behavior in many ways, everyone experiences stress differently. Each of us has a unique “recovery zone,” whether that’s physical or psychological, and our recovery zone depends on several factors.

It is critical to teach people strategies and skills to view and handle their own stress load appropriately. The following can increase stress tolerance or diminish stress load:

meditation or yoga

outdoor time

snuggling a pet

listening to relaxing music

deep breathing

drinking green tea

READ MORE:

Hacking sleep: Engineering a high quality, restful night [Article + infographic]

Good stress, bad stress: Finding your sweet spot. [Article + infographic]

Question #11 How should I eat to get six-pack abs?”

Answer: First let’s explore whether a six pack is worth the trade-offs.

To answer this one, you first have to know if six-pack abs are really what your client wants. (And if they’re prepared to do what it takes.)

Getting ripped abs is a much bigger undertaking than most people realize. There are definite benefits to getting that lean (<10 percent for most men, and <20 percent for most women), but there are real trade-offs too.

Alcohol, processed foods, and desserts all need to be severely limited if you’re trying to lose fat and show off a washboard stomach. Social situations often become difficult. Other interests and hobbies may need to decrease.

However, if clients really want to get a six-pack in the healthiest possible way, they’ll need to follow these principles 90-95 percent of the time:

eat protein and vegetables at every meal,

include healthy fats at most meals,

eat a small amount of carbs post-workout only,

limit carbs at all other meals,

exercise intensely 4-5 times per week, and

get at least 8 hours of sleep each night.

Armed with this information, you can have an honest conversation about whether your clients want the six-pack badly enough. (Or if they’d settle for moderately lean and healthy without giving up some of the other things they enjoy).

READ MORE:

The cost of getting lean: Is it really worth the trade-off?

Here’s the cost of getting lean. [Infographic]

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In the end, yes, it’ll take some time to master these answers on the fly with a wide variety of people, but the only way to get started is to dive right in.

Remember: While you’re expected to know all the answers, you can’t be expected to know everything about every single person.

So use the answers in this cheat sheet as a starting point (I recommend that you do the deeper reading first), and then learn more with strategic questions about their particular needs and goals.

In the end, being the go-to coach for nutrition questions is about — yes — knowing the facts. But it’s also about meeting people where they’re at and garnering experience while you make the journey together.

If you’re a coach, or you want to be…

Learning how to coach clients, patients, friends, or family members through healthy eating and lifestyle changes — including how to manage energy balance — is both an art and a science.

If you’d like to learn more about both, consider the Precision Nutrition Level 1 Certification. The next group kicks off shortly.

What’s it all about?

The Precision Nutrition Level 1 Certification is the world’s most respected nutrition education program. It gives you the knowledge, systems, and tools you need to really understand how food influences a person’s health and fitness. Plus the ability to turn that knowledge into a thriving coaching practice.

Developed over 15 years, and proven with over 100,000 clients and patients, the Level 1 curriculum stands alone as the authority on the science of nutrition and the art of coaching.

Whether you’re already mid-career, or just starting out, the Level 1 Certification is your springboard to a deeper understanding of nutrition, the authority to coach it, and the ability to turn what you know into results.

[Of course, if you’re already a student or graduate of the Level 1 Certification, check out our Level 2 Certification Master Class. It’s an exclusive, year-long mentorship designed for elite professionals looking to master the art of coaching and be part of the top 1% of health and fitness coaches in the world.]

Interested? Add your name to the presale list. You’ll save up to 33% and secure your spot 24 hours before everyone else.

We’ll be opening up spots in our next Precision Nutrition Level 1 Certification on Wednesday, April 3rd, 2019.

If you want to find out more, we’ve set up the following presale list, which gives you two advantages.

Pay less than everyone else. We like to reward people who are eager to boost their credentials and are ready to commit to getting the education they need. So we’re offering a discount of up to 33% off the general price when you sign up for the presale list.

Sign up 24 hours before the general public and increase your chances of getting a spot. We only open the certification program twice per year. Due to high demand, spots in the program are limited and have historically sold out in a matter of hours. But when you sign up for the presale list, we’ll give you the opportunity to register a full 24 hours before anyone else.

If you’re ready for a deeper understanding of nutrition, the authority to coach it, and the ability to turn what you know into results… this is your chance to see what the world’s top professional nutrition coaching system can do for you.

The post How to answer the most common nutrition questions like a boss: A cheat sheet for helping anyone hone their eating habits. appeared first on Precision Nutrition.

How to answer the most common nutrition questions like a boss: A cheat sheet for helping anyone hone their eating habits. published first on https://storeseapharmacy.tumblr.com

[viralhottopics]

RIP Wii U: Nintendo’s glorious, quirky failure

Nintendo has ceased production of Wii U less than five years after its launch. What went wrong, and what will be its legacy?

In late January it was announced that Nintendo had ceased production of the Wii U console. The follow-up machine to the hugely successful Wii had sold fewer than 15m units worldwide since its launch in 2012. PlayStation 4 sold more in a year. Wii sold more than 100m in its lifetime.

What happened? How did Nintendo, one of the oldest and most respected companies in the video game industry, get it so wrong? And did anything good come out of the Wii U era? How will the machine be remembered, if at all?

Certainly, some believe the console was cursed from the start right from the first announcement at the 2011 E3 video game conference in Los Angeles. Before that, Nintendo had made vague references to Project Cafe, a new piece of hardware deep in development at the companys famed R&D labs, but the nature of the device was unclear. The E3 presentation was supposed to be the big reveal.

Then, there it was at the Nintendo press conference, in front of the whole games industry. Wii U. Reggie-Fils-Aim, head of Nintendo America, gave an obtuse introduction and showed the unique GamePad controller, with its built-in display. After this, came a showreel of gaming moments, then nothing. The crowd whooped, but when the lights went down, a few expressed confusion: was the Wii U GamePad an extension to the original Wii? Was it an entirely new console? That evening, in an interview with the Evening Standard, the late Nintendo president Satoru Iwata stated: Because we put so much emphasis on the controller, there appeared to be some misunderstanding.

The PS4 and Xbox One, high-powered machines arrived and changed the gaming landscape. Composite: Xbox One S v PS 4 Pro v PS4 Slim v Project Scorpio

A masterpiece of understatement. In some ways, that misunderstanding never went away. Even when it became clear that Wii U was a whole new console, with a unique motion-sensitive screen pad, consumers were nonplussed. There had been rumours that, with its custom AMD 7 series graphics chipset and IBM multicore central processor, the machine would be more powerful than the PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360 especially as it was arriving years after those machines debuted. But before the launch, developers were already whispering to news sources that this was not the case driving the second-screen would eat up the graphics processing power and the CPU wasnt that special. It was all academic anyway: barely a year later, PlayStation 4 and Xbox One arrived to completely change the technological landscape.

But Nintendo wasnt competing with PlayStation and Xbox, and never really had. Instead, it needed to convert the tens of millions of Wii owners whod rarely bought consoles before; whod been seduced by the Wii Remote controller and the immediate, social experience it promised. Those people were now quietly migrating to other platforms: smartphones, tablets, set-top boxes … Thats who the Wii U was aimed at.

In the months following E3, it was at least picking up interest from the development community. I had done work on the N64, Gameboy, GameCube and Wii and I still maintain they were my favourite systems to work on, so when the WiiU was announced it had me excited, says Byron Atkinson-Jones of Xiotex Studios I wanted to see how far we could go in game design terms with the two screen setup. Were we going to get new game paradigms like we did with the Wii and its controllers?

However, even before the launch, the games media was complaining about a lack of compelling first-party content. The machine would arrive with only two major Nintendo titles, the mini-game collection Nintendo Land, and New Super Mario Bros U, a decent side-scrolling platformer, but by no means a major Mario title with with little involvement from Miyamoto. There were intriguing moments: Nintendo Land has the clever asymmetrical multiplayer action of Luigis Ghost Mansion and the boisterous arena-battler Animal Crossing: Sweet Day. But there was also nothing as immediately compelling as Wii Sports or Wii Play nothing that completely crystallised the idea of the GamePad.

Veteran developer Rhodri Broadbent once worked for Q-Games in Japan, and met Shigeru Miyamoto while making Star Fox Command. He felt there should still have been a role for the Wii Remote in the new era. The fact that Wii U did not come bundled with a Wii Remote was really disappointing to me, he says. I felt that the identity of the Wii Remote was worth continuing, and that combining the jump to HD visuals with the jump to HD motion control of the Wii Remote Plus would have been a smart play. In terms of marketing, the Wii Remote was iconic from the get-go, whereas the GamePad sadly didnt really get to find its identity in either software, nor marketing. There were some truly excellent, best-in-class games released for Wii U, but very few of them gave life or character to the GamePad.

The GamePad, as a unique selling point, was also a unique curse, an albatross around the neck of the whole project. Designers struggled over its multifaceted nature: should they support it as a standalone screen, a second-screen for the TV, or as a device to allow asymmetrical multiplayer experiences (the player with the GamePad is able to have a different experiences to others using Wii Remotes). It was a tough business proposition too. Games publishers like to be able to transition their projects freely between different machines most modern game engines are platform agnostic making this process easier. But Wii Us controller demanded a different approach, so including the console on multiplatform projects was complicated and expensive even if they were just going to use the GamePad as a mini-map, which many did.

Of the third-party games available at launch, most were quick conversions of familiar PlayStation and Xbox titles: Call of Duty, Batman, Fifa… few of these exploited the GamePad feature-set in truly innovative ways. The best was perhaps ZombiU, a fascinating survival horror title with a neat permadeath mechanic, set in a post-apocalyptic London that made inspired use of the GamePad as both an environment scanner and a cellphone. With its tense, gory action, it also brilliantly subverted expectations of a Nintendo launch title. But it wasnt enough.

The problem is, mainstream game development is all about confidence. Console manufacturers have to be certain that third-party publishers will support the device; third-party publishers have to be sure that consumers will buy it, and draw confidence from first-party titles; and consumers wont commit until they know there will be great titles from both first- and third-party studios. Its a vicious circle of reliance, and it often all depends on that launch week. Nintendo just didnt come up with the goods to inspire consumers, and because of this, the likes of Activision, Electronic Arts and Ubisoft were all backing off right from the outset.

Meanwhile, Nintendo was trying to make things easier for independent developers, noticing the huge influx of excellent indie titles on the Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3. After the success of the 3DS eShop in attracting experimental games, the company set out to improve its digital store for the home console experience. However, its legacy was not good. On the Wii, support for smaller studios was patchy: the submissions process was, according to some studios, extremely lengthy, and there were sales thresholds that made it risky to commit to offbeat projects. Even after these problems had been addressed, Wii U had no support for the important multi-platform games engine Unity until much later in the consoles lifespan, strangling its potential with the indie community.

[The Wii U dev kit] was clunky and far more difficult to setup than its predecessors, says Atkinson-Jones. I remember opening the box it came in and there was a warning saying it was very easy to brick the machine so getting it setup was a terrifying prospect. Id love to say I got further than this but the reality is that even though Nintendo had signed So Hungry to appear on WiiU, Unity would not actually be ready for another year its because of this my other game Blast Em! came about and thankfully that game has kept my studio running. Once you got past all the problems of setup and getting a working build of Unity, it was just that much harder than doing any kind of cross platform work – the big difference being the two displays of course.

Nintendos Wii and revolutionary remote. Photograph: Andrew Parsons/PA

So the Wii U had a lot to contend with: a poorly conceived debut, a unique selling point that was difficult to describe, and a hesitant development community unwilling to commit resources to a quirky machine. But it did provide moments of genuine brilliance. The defining first-party titles Super Mario 3D World, Mario Kart 8, Super Smash Bros, Splatoon and Pikmin 3 may not have been top tier Nintendo originals (theres no Miyamoto Mario, no new Zelda), but they were excellent games, filled with interesting ideas and classic moments of design genius.

Pikmin 3 is one of the greatest games I have ever played on any system, says Broadbent. Its mission mode is so tightly balanced, with so many tricks and techniques to optimise battles, find new routes and shave seconds off your time that I can and often did replay the same mission for entire days without noticing that the my weekend had disappeared. Im a big fan of the oft-overlooked, but to my mind never bettered, New Super Mario Bros U, especially the challenge modes. And keeping with Mario, Super Mario Makers musical, whimsical user interface is a masterclass in hiding complexity and infusing character into menus the way the sound effects harmonise with the background music as you place objects on the screen is endlessly charming to me.

There were beautiful third-party games too, sparsely spread out though the machines lifespan perhaps, but certainly there. Cult Japanese studio PlatinumGames, best known for its demanding brawlers, was an unexpected hero producing two masterpieces for the machine: the extravagant Bayonetta 2, and the kookie super hero puzzler, Wonderful 101. Warner Bros brought us the excellent Armored edition of Batman Arkham City, but also the ludicrously overlooked Lego City Undercover, a hilarious Grand Theft Auto pastiche, which is now rightfully being remade for current consoles.

More importantly however, there were indie developers who truly embraced the idiosyncracies of the system and its development environment. We enjoy letting the quirks of specific hardware inspire new ideas and features here, so from a design point of view, Wii U was a lot of fun, says Broadbent. Gyros, a camera, a touch screen there was a lot there to use. For Scram Kitty, I had the idea of making the titular cat appear as a sort of sports commentator on the TV while the player focused on the GamePad action, and although in the end that element didnt turn out to be an essential feature of the game, it was a great source of personality for the game, and one which kept throwing up new ideas throughout development.

Highlights included DrinkBox Studios crazed platformer Guacamelee!: Super Turbo Championship Edition, the lovely retro platformer Shantae and the Pirates Curse, and the intriguing puzzler Art of Balance. Most were multiplatform, but lots used the Wii U capabilities in interesting ways. A key example was the engrossing Affordable Space Adventures from Danish developer KnapNok Games. In this interstellar puzzle game, the GamePad was used to monitor and interact with your crafts primary systems, including engines, anti-gravity controls and scanner, providing a great Star Trek bridge experience.

There were also thoughtful conversions of iOS titles, including Dakko Dakkos translation of the spooky narrative adventure Year Walk. We took a much more all-in approach to the machines feature set, combining the gyros, touch screen, separate displays, and even subtly altering the audio between the gamepad and the TV, to create very satisfying controls and puzzles, says Broadbent. The end result feels uniquely suited to Wii U.

Its also worth remembering Nintendos unique attempts to create friendly online communities around the Wii U. The Miiverse is a family-friendly social network in which players can chat about what theyre playing, draw and share pictures, and seek gaming advice, all within a safe, charming environment populated with customised Mii characters. It was a much more warm, human approach to networked play than Xbox Live or PlayStation Network and, as Jennifer Schneidereit, co-creator of luscious historical adventure Tengami discovered, it allowed unique relationships between developers and players:

It was possible to post to Tengamis Miiverse from within the game, to show level progress or ask other players for help, she says. As a developer I was able to interact with people in Tengamis Miiverse and help with puzzles, answer their questions and listen to their feedback. Because Miiverse posts are not only textual, players can also hand draw and incorporate stamps, it was a real delight to watch players using our stamps to create artwork of their own.

Wii U had a difficult start, with a difficult idea in a difficult era. The E3 presentation blurred what the machine actually was, and the GamePad was never an easy proposition to market unlike the Wii Remote that people could see was fun, just from the adverts. Meanwhile, with Xbox and PlayStation continuing their graphics arms race, and competition coming in from smartphones and tablets, the gaming audience seemed to be stratifying into two groups: the sorts of players who bought consoles and high-end PCs, and the sorts whod quite as happily play Candy Crush Saga for free on their phones. The idea of a console as the central focus of a party or family event, which had peaked between 2005 and 2010 with both the Wii and the rise of music games like Guitar Hero, had drifted out of favour.

Nintendos Shigeru Miyamoto. Photograph: Evan Agostini/Invision/AP

Now here comes the Nintendo Switch, a regeneration of the Wii U concept where the GamePad effectively becomes the console, with its own built-in controllers. If anything, it is a more flagrant attempt to seduce casual players away from their phones, while tapping into the family living-room appeal of the original Wii. Broadbent sees Switch as a reconnection with that machine: Im very happy that the joy-cons have so many little tricks in them, and encouraged to see games like ARMS push forward higher-fidelity motion controls right out the gate. But Im mostly happy that Switchs identity as a home console thats not tied to your TV is being communicated so clearly.

Communication, it seems, is key. The Wii did its own communicating: you just watched people playing Tennis or Bowling and you knew it was fun. Nothing Nintendo has done with its hardware since then has been quite so alluring. But to write off Wii U as a creative failure would be a gross disservice. The GamePad actualised a lot of vague entertainment industry hype about the second screen, and lots of games truly illustrated the magic of the concept. And lets not forget that Wii U also saw Nintendos entry into the toys to life market with its Amiibo characters little figurines that could be placed on the screen to interact with games. They sold over 40m of those.

In years to come, people will pick up the console second-hand, with a few games Super Mario 3D World, Bayonetta 2, Mario Kart 8 and theyll realise what it was that Nintendo had in mind, theyll understand the appeal of the hardware. Much too late, of course.

Read more: http://bit.ly/2jEPKjf

from RIP Wii U: Nintendo’s glorious, quirky failure

[comicteaparty]

September 28th-October 4th, 2019 Creator Babble Archive

The archive for the Creator Babble chat that occurred from September 28th, 2019 to October 4th, 2019.  The chat focused on the following question:

What is a part of your comic you don’t particular like right now, and how are you trying to improve it?

Kay Rose

Something in my current comic that I dont like is how my characters look inconsistent, to fix it, when im back drawing hopefully next week, I'd like to change my webtoon release time to every other week So i can spend more time making sure theyre on model, and not hurt myself again trying to get 15-20 panels done in a week like a scrub

Ash🦀

I came from a novel-writing background. Although I wanted to write for comics, of course I had to learn about the fundamentals of writing at all, but that made me too dependent on words, so... I think in the beginning, there was simply too much dialogue. I didn’t let the characters breathe because I felt I had to give people at least a rundown of the world, foreshadow future events, all the things. I wish I’d taken more time to let the characters breathe and let the art speak for itself. As I edit the second chapter, I’m taking out whatever isn’t necessary, and focusing more on the marriage of art and words, letting them work with each other. I also dislike that it took me this long to get from the “it’s almost finished” stage to the “it’s finished” stage, solely my fault. I guess I can’t say much more since it technically isn’t out yet, but the pages are all there and everything’s finished, and I’m sure I’ll learn way more about the process as I keep going.

LadyLazuli (Phantomarine)

1) Fast pacing. People have told me it’s not a problem at all, and it’s actually good to have a webcomic that doesn’t drag - but I do feel somewhat restrained by my self-inflicted chapter page count. Sometimes I have to squish some things together in (what I feel is) an awkward way. But maybe it’s just me wanting to show more??

2) Lettering! Lettering is not my forte. Typography itself was always a problem for me to get right in graphic design classes. One of the few critical messages I’ve gotten on Phantomarine is about the wide-set lettering, and it’s stuck with me. I kinda want to fix it up in the future, or hire a proper letterer. Or... hand-letter! I dunno, it’s just bothered me ever since it was pointed out...

Urbanjawdust

@Ash🦀 that is AWESOME. more power to ya!!!

DaemonDan (The Demon Archives)

Heh, the main thing I don't like right now is that I'm on hiatus XD But the biggest artistic issue I'd been having recently was my previous artist wasn't very consistent with character appearances, especially the women/girl characters. Now that I've hired a new artist, the first thing I paid him to do was to make character sheets of them, with the hope that this will let us be consistent going forward.

Deo101 (Millennium)

I think for me it's also gonna have to be fast pacing. I get so excited about moving on, and so afraid of dragging things out, that I tend to forget to linger where it's needed. Since it's been pointed out to me, I've been working on adding an extra page or 2 to really wrap up my scenes... but it's definitely a problem in my past pages.

Urbanjawdust

Does anyone struggle deciding how many pages to post per update?

I'm debuting a new series and am struggling to decide how many pages the first episode should be

Deo101 (Millennium)

Hmmm...... Personally, if I'm uploading more than one, I like to get it to a point of "kind of a little bit of a cliffhanger" every time

instead of a particular amount of pages

Kay Rose

I upload on webtoon, so I count by panels.

snuffysam

depends what kind of comic it is, how much you get onto a page, etc. like if a page doesn't have anything interesting on it, it should probably have more on it or the update should include a second page. or like if you have a comedy comic, you shouldn't cut off the page in the middle of a joke.

DaemonDan (The Demon Archives)

Also where you post it. On my own site, i post 1 page at a time. On Tapastic, I'll post a few pages per update.

AntiBunny

Probably the slow meandering pace at which the story is told. 13 years and I still haven't gotten to the point I planned. Mostly because I want fully realized characters, and they need to go through a lot to get there.

Erin/Leif & Thorn on Kickstarter

Tapas & Webtoon seem to be optimized for taller updates, but with a regular site I'd post one page/strip at a time. People who want to read in batches can still bookmark it (or add it to ComicRocket, etc) and only check in every few update.

Most of my CR bookmarks, I wait until the comic has at least 10 unread updates before catching up.

(exceptions are mostly things like xkcd where there's not continuity to keep track of)

...also, seconding the "my least favorite thing is that it's on hiatus" for But I'm A Cat Person. Combined with "my least favorite thing is that it's not finished". (One more chapter! Just the one!)

sssfrs

I honestly really like the direction "Joe Is Dead" is going right now but there are areas I could definitely improve. I need to figure out how to strike a balance between perfectionism and speed, so that I don't take too long to put out pages but so that I can still put out high quality work. I'm also trying to work harder on characterizing characters, making their responses more individual to who they are and the kind of things they think about. When I first started writing I was putting in a lot of lines that were helpful to move the scenes along but the characters didn't have so much personal motivation to say them. I've been editing my writing over several times in an effort to really streamline the dialogue. You can read Joe Is Dead on Tapas: https://tapas.io/series/JoeIsDead(edited)

DaeofthePast

While I'm not too fond of the colors I used in the first episode of Dating Not-So Simulation, I have to remind myself that the duller colors serve a purpose. It works for symbolizing Morgan's emotional state at the beginning of the story and it'll get more colorful as the comic goes on.

Desnik

What I don't like about http://ask-a-warlock.tumblr.com/ is that it's been a couple of years working on it and it's STILL not done!!(edited)

The Q - working on WAYFINDERS

Pacing is my biggest issue right now. The story is so huge, so I can't linger. But also a comic needs time and space to breathe. I'm trying to let the scripts flow in a natural way, but I'm nervous to see how it's going to work once we get to thumbnails!

Holmeaa - working on WAYFINDERS

it is going to work GREAT!

The Q - working on WAYFINDERS

Haha, well in that case... I'm excited!