#but (bar the cucumber lady in whose mind god knows what goes on) you can argue the goal is mostly money-making and not matrimonial or sexua

[lemonhemlock]

The thing about Otto and Alicent having boundaries overstepped by Otto teaching Alicent how to ensnare Viserys - I think people don't grasp the historical and cultural nuances here. Women over history have been coached on how to be attractive to men to get rich husbands or fathers pay for their daughters to go to deportment lessons etc. I think the book Gone With The Wind is a great example of how Scarlett is brainwashed into acting like a sexually attractive vacant vapid child woman by being taught by her mother and Mammy how to get a man. This includes what clothes to wear, how to flatter a man, use a fan etc and Scarlett adds on her own variations as well. It's like an inheritance.

Through a modern lens, ofc this is all wrong, parents shouldn't be teaching their children how to be sexually appealing. But historically there is a huge percentage where this was the norm from the ground up with the working class or lower middle class aping their richer counterparts to ascend the social ladder through marrying their kids off. Not everyone did this but it happened. If we look at The Buccaneers and Bridgerton it's all there. Mothers and fathers and guardians and brothers etc were all imparting to their kids, wards etc how to conduct and present themselves to the best advantage for the families benefit.

I think Otto is doing that here rather than abusing Alicent sexually. As a female and she is young and beautiful, Otto thinks he has a full hand. He sees Alicent as a pawn in his quest for power and when he sees an opening after Aemma dies, he immediately takes the opportunity because who are we kidding there would be other parents who would see a chance to put their daughter on the throne. When we get Aegon and Aemond maybe we romanticise it because they're young adult princes but the girls around them are being groomed to catch their eye whilst the princes are single. It all comes down to power and dynasty and I feel it we interpret by modern standards we lose the nuance.

Tbh I see it evolving into a different level with our influencer culture where TikTik tells us to be that girl etc, it's the parent grooming us to be as sexually appealing to the Internet gaze for advantage. And I see literal parents capitalize on their children by turning them into a product and it's becoming disgusting as they're ambiguously sexualising their toddlers to sate the abhorrent audiences they're attracting in the comments requesting to see the child eat cucumbers and fuck all is being done about it. That makes me so mad. Then we have parents teaching their little girls to be influencers and brainwashing them into doing that tapping their fingernails etc for asmr and to always have cute sound bites or manic smiles at the ready as soon as a camera is on them. We still have our Ottos today.

I do agree on the historical practices of coaching the daughters of the family, so that they become as appealing as possible to potential suitors. I would be wary, though, to ascribe definite time periods or geographical regions to these customs, since I am not an expert in this. I also believe these tended to be more prevalent in upper class / noble circles or in money-making spheres like merchants, bankers and other types of early capitalists, than they would be in working class scenarios.

Certainly, we are all aware, from our 19th century novels at least, of how the education of young ladies was focused on people-pleasing skills and other elements meant to appeal to men: piano-playing, sewing and embroidery (clothes-making might sound frivolous at first, but it was an important practical and economic skill to have in a household), drawing/painting, dancing etc. And the related concept of etiquette classes has certainly permeated through popular culture. So, yes, in a way, these are all related practices to how Otto advances Alicent as a potential wife.

But, I would argue that (and, again, because this is HotD, there is bound to be some focus on the dysfunctional) what Otto does is more of an overstep of boundaries, because he is deliberately shown to instruct Alicent in wearing a dress that is more revealing that what she usually wears and he is actively placing her into scenarios in which she is alone with Viserys. Whereas, "in the past" (broadly speaking), there definitely was a focus on maintaining a maiden's honour and girls would not be paraded in sexy dresses in front of their suitors, nor would they even be allowed to be alone in a room with any man that is not related to them. Otto's tactics here can be construed as rather scandalous. So the sexual aspect here is brought to the surface more than in other, more innocent "tutelage" scenarios.