#because where i'm from... the self shippers will violently attack character shippers :/

[itsmeglycine]

who do you ship together in stardew valley?

I rarely speak about shipping because I'm the chaotic shipper that usually ships everyone with anyone in every fandom... 👉👈 I don't take fictional characters that seriously. Every ship is near equal in my eyes, and I especially prefer bizzare crackships for fun.

From what I've seen, the SDV fandom can be very attached to its characters and there's been a lot of discourse for a cutesy wholesome game like this. 😭 I'm scared of being cancelled brooo...

Stardew Valley has "official" pairings (mutual or one-sided "Love Interests" in the game's NPC Dispositions code), and I enjoy them the most because I feel they reflect the author's intentions and make the most sense.

I do have one oddly specific guilty-pleasure fun pairing:

Both Penny and Harvey secretly crushing on Maru while unaware that the other knows, with Maru completely oblivious to their feelings, and in the end nobody ever confesses anything and they stay friends together forever in ultimate awkwardness.

This. 💀💀💀 My heart has a place for introverts being friend-zoned okay...

And I have to add a few claims just to clear things up:

-Harvey, Maru and Penny are officially in a friend group, just like the band trio. It's in the codes, but less pronounced in lines and behaviors.

-Harvey being aged up was very likely a last-minute decision, and I have some reaching clues that leads to the speculation that he was originally intended to be coded as "Teenager".

-Harvey & Maru is indeed one of the five official (marriage candidates) pairings, back when the game was taking inspirations from Harvest Moon's "Love Rivals" mechanics. They are coded so, and although people like to interpret some specific lines as friendly/platonic(/creepy💀), the author's intention/direction was romantic.

-I don't see the age thing as problematic; it just adds to the crackship vibe and it's so stupid I love it. I have made fanart of those but never posted, for fear of being cancelled.

-Please don't cancel me.

[frankie-bell]

Mika has always been my favourite ever since she stepped in the scene.I have never been vocal about it because the fanbase collectively decided this 18yo scared girl is unforgivable and needs to be assaulted violently to pay for her crimes(?!).I am glad things have changed(somehow)as of late but I wish they never paired Mika with Ginoza.On top of men wishing assault on her now we have Ginoza fangirls going nuclear on her.I think people have such a hard time acknowledging her growth(which is one of the most profound in the series)because she’s being paired with a fandom fave male.There’s like 10 of us Mika fans did we really need the additional hate?This is not to hate on Ginoza of course.He’s good.I would just rather not have his fans on Mika’s case.

I totally get where you're coming from. Although I'm a hardcore GinoMika shipper, I hate how the writers pairing them together has resulted in even more Mika hate (as if my girl hasn't dealt with enough BS from this fandom). I touched on this briefly in my essay, but there's a troubling trend -- particularly in comics and anime -- of female fans vitriolically hating any woman who gets in the way of their yaoi ship or self-insert/OC ship. It's honestly super disturbing and demoralizing, and you see it in every fandom, from Psycho-Pass, to Attack on Titan, to Trigun, to Fullmetal Alchemist, to every American comic book that's ever existed. It doesn't matter how strong, complex, and multi-faceted a female character is; if she has the audacity to either (a) stand up to, disrespect, or disagree with the fandom's male fave or (b) fall in love with him, then she deserves to die a slow, painful death. [Note: I have nothing against self-shipping/OC-shipping, as long as those engaging in it aren't calling their faves' canon or canon-implied love interests "bitches" and wishing death upon them. Seriously, it isn't that hard.]

But you know what? I'm not gonna let those people win. I love Mika, I love Ginoza, and I especially love them together. And no matter how much the haters rage about GinoMika, I'm gonna keep shipping what I love. Toxic fangirls need to learn that you can't eradicate a pairing you don't like by clogging the tags with hate and bullying its fans. No one's saying you have to ship it, but at least have a modicum of respect for those of us who do. And stop couching your anti-feminism as concern for flawed male characters who don't need you to defend them and instead ask yourself why you hate certain traits in women but love them in men.

[the-cat-and-the-birdie]

Are you insinuating that just because this character is a mexican man that he cannot cope with his own trauma in an unhealthy and self-destructive manner?

No, I'm insinuating that having him coping with his trauma in an unhealthy way and then SEXUALIZING it and displaying it as a sexy trait isn't okay. And that's what a lot of the fandom is doing.

He can display his trauma in unhealthy ways. But if you never take the time out to explore WHY in your fic, and instead write his anger as a sexy thing to take out on the reader in bed.

I am not promoting the characterisations of miguel as a sexist, misogynistic, ‘macho man’ pouring with toxic masculinity.

I do not mean this as rude in any way but I do not read your stuff so I wouldn't know. I'm assuming if you took the time out to think about his character this much and reply, that's true. But being completely transparent, I am haven't read your work, so none of this is a pointed attack at you or any of the prompts you've writen in the past.

This is simply my perspective on why people should be able to critize the portrayal of ficitonal characters in media.

first and foremost, I would like to reinstate what was written in my original post. this is a fictional character for a fictional franchise.

Going back to this - It doesn't matter. AT ALL that they're fictional.

When a character in a show, like a black person, is shown being violent and uneducated and in a gang - it affects the way the audience sees the character AND real black people.

That's why movies like Black Panther are important, because movies and the representation of fictional characters reflects and effects the real world.

And thus the way we as a community interpret them, and talk about them is a reflection of the real world as well.

what I think that most people fail to realise is that there is a clear distinction between aggressive and toxic masculinity aggressive. what I have seen from most miguel o’hara fics ( and I have read a decent amount of them ) is that his rage is often depicted as the former. rarely have I actually seen miguel depicted in a sexism lighting ( as most people that like him have daddy issues and quite like princess treatment ). am I saying that those fics don’t exist? of course not.

I think here might be the part with the most potential for misunderstanding, and I wanna elaborate on it more before replying more, because I really don't want us to have a conversation where we're arguing against points the other isn't making, yknow?

What i mean sexist portrayals I mean: (and I'm genuinely sorry if these prompts are examples may appear in your work)

His continued over-possessiveness and jealousy in fics - as well the yandere genre (Machismo Pride)

-That usually end in him dragging the reader away for sex (Sexual Prowess)

The three genres that usually animalize him:

-The more-than-average amount of breeding kink (non-biological) for him

-The more-than-average amount of pheromone kink (biological) for him

-I see a GOOD handful of dubious consent as well

Fics where hes a professor manipulating a student

Fics where the reader straight up asks to stop and he doesn't

Fics where he's openly mentioning that he knows he's messing with or hurting the reader and he doesn't care.

That's not writing a 'guy who takes out his trauma in anger', in these cases I'm talking about, I mean these types.

Fics where he's openly hurting his partner and it's portrayed in a sexual manner.

Types that are using Miguel's trauma and anger as an excuse to sexualize behavior. And... that's fine. That's what fanfiction is for in a sense. Like that's just....probably isn't in character

To Preface: And I'm not Anti-Shipper. I'm not a Pro-Shipper either and I've been VERY vocal about this before.

But in short: I couldn't care less what people write and like. I don't care. I don't judge you. It's fandom have at it - I've been on Tumblr a while. I get it.

Breeding kink is always gonna exist. Dubious consent is always gonna exist.

But I pulled most if not all of these examples from scrolling less than 5 minutes in the Miguel Smut Tag. (on desktop granted) Like maybe a solid 4/10 posts were of stuff like this at least.

And like.... I'm not saying these things shouldn't exist. Or that the people who write it are bad, or that it shouldn't be read.

I get it. I read it too sometimes. And people are talented. The prompts are good and I mean that.

The smut is GOOD. That's not my issue.

The reason I responded the way I did, was because of your tag.

YOU said before 'UNLESS it's harmful' which made me think that you wouldn't support it if it was. But it is.

Which is fine if you believe that. The fics that I'm talking about above are harmful because they link to Machismo stereotypes. So I told you that. In case you'd want to know.

Now, you're saying that the narrative isn't a moral reflection and it's fine to write harmful stereotypes because it's not a reflection of the writer or character.

Which is fine if you believe that. But.....that's the opposite of what you were saying before. Is it not?

Regardless.

I think when we as a community can see and identity and oversaturation of smut in a character - and a certain type of smut that it says something about the way people see that character and we should ask why.

That's my hill. That's my main point.

Going to:

and to combat your first statement. most people write miguel with pheremone smut because of his spliced dna that literally makes him half-spider.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Peter Parker and Cindy Moon were also attracted via pheromone.

"Because of their connection, Cindy and Peter are attracted to each other. They often don't understand if they are physically into each other or if the spider shenanigans within them are acting up. The comics sometimes describe their attraction as primal, almost animalistic, as if they needed to "mate" with each other."

[Source]

That's not just a Miguel thing. That's canonically a possibility for every Spider-person and it's been that way for a while.

So why does the fandom only take advantage of it when it's Miguel? And why is it so weird to ask that question?

I've seen pheromone!Hobie but nowhere near to the saturation of breeding or dubious content for Peter - who canonically has had pheromone attraction - compared to Miguel who hasn't.

this has nothing to do with his race. this has everything to do with how actual spiders act in the wild. the man has fangs and claws, is that also a harmful stereotype? or do you let that one slide? 

It's not about his race.

It's about the movie's intentional misdirection. I don't blame people for seeing Miguel this way. The same way the movie wants you to think Hobie is a fake punk, the movie wants you to think Miguel is an asshole.

Nobody is racist for thinking that.

I just think they should look again.

My entire point: The movie is intentionally misdirecting the audience to believe a specific narrative about Miguel and we as an audience should do the writers justice and look into that sometime because I believe there is deeper depth to his character.

Nobody is racist. Smut isn't bad. We just need to do a little more looking at our boy miguel.

If these behaviors are how actual spiders act - which it is - the we should see the saturation of breeding kink in EVERY spider-person circle, but we don't.

Sure, I'll let it slide. But I won't let us NOT question why at least??

if you want to talk about out of character -

yeah I do that's why I'm here

I would highly suggest doing your research on his archetype and quirk that differentiates him from other spider-people. he is half spider.

If...that's the case wouldn't Spider-people be more prone to it than him?? Wouldn't that be like suppperrr common on campus with so many Spider-people in one area. Why is this just a huge blindspot in fanon??? When it could be a huge opportunity??

I don't know..But I do think it's weird we see it way more with him. Like...I think there's a cause there.

miguel going ‘feral’ is quite literally a canonical thing that is associated with his powers. not his race.

Having pheromones is quite literally a canonical thing associated with everyones Spider-powers too.

And..people think he's feral not because of his race but because of an intentional misdirection by the writers.

I think it is incredibly conceited that you can proclaim that your characterisation of miguel o’hara is the gospel truth and claim that others writing him in an aggressive manner is ‘ooc’. Last time I checked, none of us are the originator of miguel o’hara. 

I am a person on the internet. I barely even exist to you. You do not have to believe anything I say because I cannot do literally anything to you.

BUT I'M STILL GON TALK AND YOU CAN'T STOP ME!!

Analysis is what fandom is here for!!

But at the end of the day - You can see Miguel however the hell you want.

And people are allowed to have an opinion on that SO LONG AS THEY mind their business, don't get angry, don't send hate, and are respectful.

We're allowed to have discussions in fandom. They're good.

LETS question why we write him the way we do. LETS question his motives more. LETS look deeper into the movie

I don't see what's offensive about that.

I don't see whats offensive about the audience going 'Can we get something else?'

Once again, don't know you. Don't know your content. This isn't a shot at your work if you write breeding content or dubious content, I genuinely wish your work the best.

I just think a larger conversation needs to happen around the intentional misdirection in Miguel's arc and if that misdirection doesn't fit your narrative ignore it but don't be mad when people figure out that you're ignoring part of the narrative. Of course theyre gonna point it out.

IT FINE TO WRITE OOC.

As a fanfiction writer myself: Some people are going to think your character is OOC. Sometimes, you're gonna write a character OOC. THAT'S FINE.

You gotta get comfortable with that. I'm sorry but that's something that I had to get over. There's nothing wrong with it

But there's actual intentions the writers want us to garner.

These are fictional characters - writen with the intention to tell us a story.

SOME INTERPERTATIONS ARE CLOSER TO THE WRITERS' INTENT THAN THE OTHERS. ALL TAKES ARE VALID. BUT SOME ARE SUPPORTED BY EVIDENCE AND OTHERS ARENT.

That's just it.

In my eyes.

Take it as the gospel truth lol (IM JOKING)

#Justice4MildMiguel

have a nice day. bye

˚◞❀˳ I like healthy miguel, I like unhealthy miguel. I like soft miguel, I like rageful miguel. I like stressed miguel who's weighed down by his work, I like miguel who enjoys what he does. I like grey miguel, I like misunderstood miguel. I like miguel who's actually quite chill, I like miguel who's still getting over his past demons. I like fluffy, angsty, smutty and dark miguel.

all of these characterisations are valid because this is a fictional character.

stop telling people how to write him, and other characters for that matter.