#antis asking me WHY i ship them as if they'd listen

[fuckitwhenifeelit]

That post telling me to ship Sh*r*r* instead of Namuri because "omfg why not ship a healthy duo how could you" needs to learn the first rule of fandom:

1. Fuck off if you don't like it.

[conundrumoftime]

heavens above

Look: there are a lot of Haladriel Discords and groupchats. I'm in some of them, I'm not in others, there's plenty I don't know about. There is not a Haladriel Discord specifically set up to talk shit about newer fans on Tumblr (or if there is, I don't know about it and I'm not in it). Anyone who tells you that is Making Things Up, and if you've been in fandoms before you may want to have a think about why they'd do that.

Lots of smaller groupchats include safe spaces for people to vent about things that are frustrating them in fandom, without personal attacks or co-ordinated harassment campaigns. And if you don't like any of my Tumblr takes - or my ships or my fic or whatever - I absolutely encourage you to go complain about that in a private groupchat somewhere. (also! I know this happens already! and it's FINE.)

To answer two specific questions though: "Why didn't you speak to Apolo directly?" (I did; see below!), and "why didn't you just block Apolo" (I did, right after that, when Apolo's response made it clear she wasn't interested in listening to a different point of view on this one).

For context to anyone who missed this/can't see it because of blocks, I'll put here the post I was responding to and my response itself, which was also informed by seeing Apolo say previously that there are no Celeborn fans just anti-Haladriels. You are free to judge for yourself which one of these contains the language you are happier with seeing in fandom about other fans.

This is my post from Saturday about how I would like Celeborn to return in TROP;

This is from Apolo's post two days after that, addressed to people who want Celeborn to return in TROP:

and this is my comment:

Not going to comment on it or any of this beyond that.

My messages are open and anyone is free to speak to me or ask questions or whatever they like at any time. Or you can block me for whatever reason, I won't get offended.

[ahungeringknife]

365: March 23

This is like… an anti shipping fic that also makes me laugh so fucking hard thinking about

---

Cat looked over from where they were playing a game of war with Bear and Lizard when the clubhouse door opened and Wolf positively slumped in. She leaned against the door looking absolutely defeated which Cat hadn't seen on her in a long time.

"What's up baby girl?" Cat called. The game was forgotten because if their clan leader was depressed it had to be something.

"I can't like the guy I like," Wolf groaned.

"You like guys again?" Lizard asked sarcastically. Wolf just whined wordlessly.

"What happened?"

"Come away from the door and tell us what happened," Bear said. Cat were surprised when Wolf slouched off the door and climbed into Bear's lap. "Oh. Must be serious," Bear said, adjusting himself so Wolf could lean against him.

"It's so stupid," Wolf complained.

"Why can't you like this boy?" Cat asked.

"Also what boy? I haven't heard you talking about any guys?" Lizard said.

"Is Wolf talking about boys?" Fox called from where she was across the room reading.

"Maybe," Cat called back.

"What's the matter with this boy, Wolfy?" Bear asked her, rubbing her back.

"He's actually a boy," Wolf bemoaned.

"What?"

"Also who is it?" Lizard pressed.

Wolf grimaced. "You're all going to be so mad about it," she sighed.

"Why would we be mad?" Cat asked.

"Because it's Shin Malphur," Ghost said when Wolf couldn't bring herself to say it.

Cat got a wild mad grin on their face. "Wow! You are so right. I am mad," they said.

"Ew," Lizard said.

"Wolfy there are way better guys out there," Bear said.

"I knowww. I know!" Wolf cried. "But I am not going to date him. I can't."

"I don't follow?" Bear asked. Cat had an idea but they weren't about to ruin Wolf's confession.

"So I saw his face for the first time today," Wolf said.

"He ugly?" Lizard asked. "Bet he's ugly."

"Worse," Wolf moaned.

"Don't tell me that string bean is hot. I refuse to believe anyone born in the Dark Ages was hot," Bear said.

"He might be eventually," Ghost said.

"He's like fourteen," she groaned.

"What?" Lizard asked and from the couch Fox also yelled that. She'd been listening.

"He took off his helmet and he's a fucking teenager under there. I knew some Guardians were young but??" She slumped against Bear. "I can't like a fourteen year old looking guy that's fucking weird," she complained.

The table was quiet for a moment. "Wait Shin's actually a kid under his helmet?" Cat asked. They knew he was juvenile and a bratty shit they'd kicked the shit out once or twice when he'd erroneously crossed into their turf with his shitty friends but actually a child???

"Yeah," Ghost said gravely. "He uses some voice changing module on his helmet to sound older. Probably knows no one would take him seriously otherwise."

"I thought he was just weird but nope. Doesn't know how to talk to women or what to do with one because he's a little teenager," Wolf sighed dramatically and slid halfway off Bear's lap until he caught her.

"I'd say that's rough but at least you'll be forced to get better taste in men," Cat said.

"But I liked him," Wolf whined. "I still kinda do but that's not going to happen now uggggh."

"There are other men out there, Wolf," Lizard said.

"I know. I'm just mad the one I was flirting with is a fucking child," and she made an appropriate gagging noise to show her dislike.

"I'm surprised he never grew himself up," Cat said thoughtfully. Wolf looked at them. "What? You think I started out all gray? Also I know Ghost changed how you looked." When Cat had met Wolf she'd had move curves and a bigger chest but other the years Ghost had smoothed those out because Wolf didn't like being viewed as a sexual object by people she didn't know.

"It is Malphur. From everything I know about the... heh, kid, he's a self important idiot," Bear said. "Also he's not Risen. He might be stupid enough to not think like that."

"Even still. He's fourteen," Lizard said.

"I could never, knowing he's fourteen. He should have just kept his stupid helmet on," Wolf complained.

"Feel better having cried about it?" Cat asked.

"Yeah," she whined and Bear hugged her.

"You'll find a real man for yourself, baby girl, don't worry about it," Cat assured her. "You want to play war with us?"

"No," she whined but just stayed on Bear's lap. "I just want hugs and will watch."

Bear chuckled. "Lucky for you I am excellent at that," Bear said and hugged her some more. Cat was glad Wolf was just a bit pouty and went back to the game with Bear and Lizard.

--

I think it's semi confirmed Shin is actually like... a child Guardian. Idk if Bungie walked that back but GOD it's so funny to think about because that explains SO MUCH about his behavior. Dude's perpetually stuck at the start of puberty. I'd be a little shit who starts cults too if I was 14 for 300+ years XD

[kakusu-shipping]

danganronpa proshipper? Hi Hi Hello!

Do you want to share some general Kazuichi hcs since he's your favorite?

(also we share a bunch of ships! If you want a problematic ear to talk about any of the common DR ships, give me an @!)

Hello hello hello!!! I am both a Proshipper and a Selfshipper!!! Welcome welcome to my blog!!! PLEASE if you have thoughts on ships come talk at me about them because I never have anything in my head about anything ever and love to listen

Soda headcanons Soda headcanons um....

Do I have any?? jdgfdjgdf I mean I guess kinda maybe but nothing's hard set in stone for me ever and I'm very wishy washy when it comes to my favorite little guys.

He's definitely Transgender, but I could never land on a witch way you feel me? He could be FtM or She could be MtF. I have good use of brain storage for both and am shaking them violently about it. Genderfluid? Bigender? Also good choices. I have no idea what's happening in this guy's pants and I don't think I ever will. It be like that. I love He/She pronouns for her though.

You know what he IS though?? Pansexual. Does HE know that?? No. My man still thinks "No Homo" and "Bro that's Gay" are funny he's not ready to face that he likes boys. I'm not sure he ever will be. That will not stop him from kissing them on the mouth though.

The combination ADHD/Autism in her brain is unrelenting. I doubt she's been diagnosed, probably has some internalized ablism about it just from her dad, she'll get over it though. Eventually.

Oooh Age Regressor Soda is one of my big things and I am taking this moment to talk about it because I've been bottling up my Age Regressor headcanons for years listen look look listen!!! Little Kazuichi, the kind of little guy who will put everything in his mouth and if someone isn't holding her at all time she will cry. I headcanon him to regress around Kindergarten age, 5 or 6, but because she's not very independent everyone on the island will treat him younger, 3-4. Her main Carer is Fuyuhiko and Imposter, he also tends to cling around Sonia, who tells her ghost stories and ends up scaring him. She use to be very Anti-Gundham even in Little form but then he met the Four Dark Devas and has sense lightened up on him.

I think Soda, Chihiro, and Miu would be a really fun Trio in a Normal School Life AU, they're start a robotics club together I could see Byakuya putting the Togami funding behind. Do they build Kiibo together or is Kiibo also just a regular guy in this AU? Unclear but I know they'd be really annoying to him. ("You shouldn't want to fuck a robot just because they're a robot!!")

I don't know why but I'm really obsessed with the idea of him and Miu being Brother/Sister, or maybe even just cousins? Miu being really weird about Incest around him, and him being completely creeped out by it is incredibly funny to me. Miu would be older than him by a year or two.

Aaaah that's about all I can think of off the top of my head at 3 in the morning. Thankyou for asking!!

[reflections-in-a-critical-eye]

I'm starting to think that angst and misery is what some people are actually looking for in their fandom experience. Why else would you invent a narrative to whine and complain about? Solo stans, conspiracy shippers, and antis all seem to have that in common. There have been so many funny and sweet clips going around, literally something for everyone. Still there are people sifting through all of it to find something to be upset/hateful about.

Kind of reminds me of listening to sad songs specifically to make myself cry. When I was younger my parents would always ask "why would you listen to something that upsets you??" But I was already in a state of emotional upheaval when I sought out my big sad playlist.

I'm pretty sure these stans just want a reason to be upset or to say nasty things online. If BTS disappeared, they'd probably descend onto something else.

I do agree with your arguments, but I think angst and misery are the result, not the reason for why the fandom is reacting that way. As to how I see it, having certain expectations and then feeling dissatisfied if those expectations aren't met, is the root of all problems. Because it gets to the point of demanding more. I don't think this happens initially, when someone gets into BTS. But the more time they spend in the fandom, or more precisely, in subsections of it, they manage to create in their head an image of what BTS as a group are, how a member is being treated, who is friends with whom, and so on. And it starts from there. And it's a consequence of herd mentality as well. Ideas get more and more implemented in someone's head when a group of people are saying the same thing. So yeah, for example, if I'm a Yoongi solo (this is just for explaining, I have no idea what they're saying and how Yoongi is shown in Memories 2021), I can find something to complain, depending on what expectations I have. Perhaps all I want is to see Yoongi being worshipped by everyone around him and out of 9h, at least 8 should be dedicated to him. As for conspiracy shippers, there is no point in explaining. They live in a fantasy world that is doing a lot of harm to them as well and no matter what, they will always be miserable.

People have demands, expectations and when they don't get what they want, they act the same way they do when they write mean comments for a fanfic when they don't like the direction of the storyline. They use excuses, such as a member being mistreated, a ship being ignored, when in fact this is only about them and what they want.

[whumpbby]

whumpbby 😭 commiserate with meeee. Idk if you've seen this post that's kind of blowing up about how fandoms are racist in general because they always focus on white characters and ships over the POC ones and to be real, it's not that I disagree. I do agree, very much so, though I think the issue is way more nuanced. But I figure hey it's still a relevant post and I go to reblog and then I realise it's written by a goddamn anti 😭😭😭 now I have hIVES gdi the op is in the notes screeching at people for being kylo ren fans and telling them to die and I'm just So Over This, we can't have anything nice

The worst part is that this post got onto my dash from the blog writingwithcolour who gives really good and multi-cultural advice on writing POC and while I see why they'd reblog it, my automatic EWW UGH reaction to finding an anti's post unfiltered on my dash is now putting serious sus on that blog :((( I'm just here to whine at you dats all but yeah antis are ruining so many good things about Fandom I can't even feel good about a relevant post anymore

*commiserating*

I feel ya, the fandom that is supposed to be the place of fun and unwinding being overridden with self-congratulory bullshit is a pet peeve of mine too. 

It is hard to find a balance between ‘ yeah, these issues exist’ and a ‘no, I am not here for that’ and not end up on this or that pitchfork, because we seem to be living in the time and social sphere where daring not to be concerned about the current issue of the week for even one second of the day marks one as a degenerate/racist/sexist/take your pick. It’s the wart marking the witch. And you are expected to prove your creed constantly, to preform to someone’s satisfaction until they deem to absolve you. 

If she floats, she’s a witch. If she drowns, she’s not, but well, the point is moot.  

It’s tiring, god, it’s exhausting - when already so many things are exhausting in the real life we have outside of these fandom spaces. And it gets doubly exhausting once you realise that - it doesn’t matter. None of it matters. No graph showing how many poc characters are NOT being shipped, no list of authors who ship ‘problematic’ ships, not one anon message trying to shame someone into not doing something - NONE OF IT MATTERS. 

NONE. Not one grain of good has come out of it. 

People see a problem and get invested and sometimes the problem is real and needs solution - and very often we are so small and have no resources and we can’t help in any realistic way. So, brain comes up with ways of helping us feel less shitty about out own helplessness and we invest ourselves so deeply into them, because what else can we do? That post, that blog, that call to arms, that callout, that anon message - we are doping something! We are helping! 

We are doing something, right? Right??? 

It’s so hard to admit that not one child was saved by the witch hunt on Ao3, not one minor was saved form grooming by attacking fanfic writers on whatever platform, not one person was saved form abuse by attacking trans people, not one person was helped by the war on the “Q-word”, not one goddamn soul was helped by the anti-bullshit. All it results in is misery and pain and harassment, but hey, at least someone is reacting! - and, hey, these are ‘effects’, right? And we’re after ‘effects’ because at least we are doing something if it has effects, right??  

These movements, these tactics, these people - they are nothing else than kids stomping their feet in their respective kiddy pools and thinking the waves they create change the currents of the real ocean. They imagine they are stopping a tsunami hitting some foreign land when all they do is splash on the people who just want to wet their feet in the same pool. 

Listen. A story. 

In my town there's this guy who will randomly appear in the market square and shout about God and Salvation and how everyone sucks. This recent Christmas he positioned himself right opposite of the charity orchestra and was a nuisance to anyone who wanted to stop for a moment and listen to them playing Christmas carols - to have in this depressing and cold, and busy end of a crap year we have all survived, a moment of respite, of Christmas cheer, a crumb of relief. Usually the orchestra is surrounded by people and kids throwing coins into their box, by folk recording on their phones, etc. No, this this year no one could enjoy a moment of peace, because a nutcase behind tried to overshout the orchestra, so people kept walking, intimidated and annoyed. 

Out of frustration and, I admit, curiosity, I walked up to him and asked why won’t he move over to let the orchestra play - what I got was more shouting. Because listening to Christmas carols was hypocritical without the sprinkling of despair over the state of humanity and Our Sins. 

He wouldn’t engage, he wouldn't speak to me like a person - I was standing two feet form the guy and he was yelling at the top of his lungs so everyone heard him. I was raised Catholic in one of the most Catholic damn countries in Europe, I know what God is about. But, you see, it didn’t matter to the guy, what mattered was that he needed to be heard yelling. This was his attempt at converting people - by yelling in their faces. He was doing something and feeling better for it! 

This  guy was the anti-movement in a real, compact, one-dude pill. Any anti-movement you can think of that picks a flag and then starts to screech in its shadow, because it makes them feel better about themselves. 

As for Kylo...

The hilarious hate towards Kylo fucking Ren of all people? Towards people who ship him? All that misplaced anger at the crappy treatment of the poc actors by Disney and predominantly male ‘fans’ of Star Wars?? Let that sink in - white dudes with money made decisions, white dudes on the internet ganged up on an actress - but nah, dude, the women who write fanfic are the culprit!  We can’t gang up on Disney and we are too afraid of the dudes on Reddit and 4chan, but these girls writing Reylo porn are there and accessible and not scary and not male! We can take them on!  

How is it not hilarious? How?? This level of misdirection and confusion, being so intimidated by the insurmountable task of being angry at a corporation that makes their merch (that they are still buying, because hey, a fan is a fan, who doesn’t want a baby Yoda t-shirt?) that all they can do is to spin around and bite the ankles of the person standing behind them? How is this not hilariously morally bankrupt and so pitifully, tragically human? 

Let the block button become your shield, another good blog will come, don't regret blocking ones you are not sure about. You’re here to relax, you don’t deserve this kind of stress. They will keep screeching, but you keep walking, friend, the orchestra is still there playing your tune, enjoy it. 

[defyinggravity-elsa-rp]

((Yeah, women can swoon over Gaston, but god forbid we like Hans.

I've also experienced a lot of shitty treatment, both online and in real life, for liking Hans and shipping Helsa. I've had people tell me all the things listed above. (Thr arguments are the exact same. I hear for shipping Reylo and loving Kylo Ren.) Had a whole thread of people on one lady's page tell me all about the battered women who liked men like Hans and how delusional and toxic Hans fans were. (The woman was in her 70s, apparently, and still getting online to harass people over fictional characters.) I went to Katsucon back in February, and I'd see other Frozen cosplayers and start taking to them (I was dressed like Elsa), and they'd make comments about me and "my girlfriend, Honeymaren," and as soon as I told them I shipped Helsa, they'd give me a dirty look and stop talking to me. Only one Elsamaren shipper heard me out and listened to me talk about how bad the Hans fans get treated, and she was actually very supportive. She was like, "Wow, I had no idea, I'm so sorry," and she was great. I wish more Frozen fans who don't like Hans were like her.

It's honestly bizarre, not just how much fans bash Hans and those of us who like him, but how much Disney does it too. Jen Lee still won't even address why he was left out of the movie. I've asked a couple animators on social media why he didn't return, and they actually didn't know- they worked on the damn movie and Jen didn't tell them anything. Jen Lee and Chris Buck are the biggest antis of them all, and they don't realize how much harm it causes.))

*Other Elsa fandom besides Helsa* : "Oh My God! Imagine "this" being a villain and have to fight with Elsa and they ended up fell in love. Ohhh!!!! Slowburn. That's so badass and romantic!

Me : Oh, you mean like Elsa and Hans?

Them : What?

Me : Helsa?

Them : Oh my god. That's so toxic! I'm just so into this healty shipping, okay.

Me : But you said about villain trope.

Them : Eh.... Yeaaaahhh..... But not that villain, duh!

Me : .....

Them : .....

Me : Okay...... Hypocrite.

[fuckitwhenifeelit]

side-eyeing self insert accusations from antis like, what did you think was the point of fanfiction? 😒

yeah i think they're hot fuck off 😒

is this a moral dilemma? no. 😒