#and i hate- negan talk about an overrated character

[flippyspoon]

saw somebody say "jeffrey dean morgan was my first lesson in separating the actor from the character" and i was genuinely confused for a sec trying to figure out what they meant because i don't like any of those entities lol.

[lupienne]

do you think negan is a straight up narcissist? love to hear your thoughts on that

(just a note, I’m discussing as usual, Comic Negan. I know a lot of people lump TV/Comic together but I see them as two different characters and personalities so I’m only discussing the one I know the most ;))

Also, this got LONG AS FUCK and I might not know what the shit I’m talking about (I’m not a psychologist. Lol!) but… WHATEVER BRO. Cut for length.

Definitely not. While Negan can be arrogant and patronizing and he definitely thinks he’s hot, I don’t think he’s a narcissist. He might run the Saviors in a way that is narcissistic: ie: ‘We’re entitled to your shit, we’re the Saviors, these people work for us…etc’ but that’s his misguided mistaken way of keeping his people ‘safe’ and not getting bulldozed by other groups. He lost his faith in people and led his people that way, like they had to isolate themselves because everyone was selfish and out for their own groups - are you fucking kidding me with this shit that we can all get along? No. It’s all about keeping ourselves safe and alive - that’s how he saw it. Wrongly saw it, yes, but maybe in the beginning it was like that - and he never grew beyond it. He stayed stuck in the dog-eat-dog mode.

But the Savior’s portrayal aside, is Negan himself a narcissist? Narcissism is a clinical disorder.  Just thinking you’re hot or attractive, having pride in your intelligence, thinking you’re ‘better’ than some other people, or seriously overrating your own sense of humor (too many dick jokes, Neegs. Too many dick jokes ;)) - is not narcissism.

Does he have an exaggerated sense of self importance? No. Does he act like it when he’s leading the Saviors, sure. But when in a group setting like fighting with the militia, he fights alongside and all he wants is a gun to defend himself. In Here’s Negan, he didn’t seem like he thought himself ‘above’ any of the people he traveled with.

Sense of entitlement and requires constant excessive admiration. Like I said, he leads the Saviors as if they’re special. I don’t see him demanding people praise him though (and yeah I know someone will bring up the stupid kneeling thing, but that was once in the comic and that was only when he came back from a trip, plus we don’t know if he orders them to do it or not) But I don’t see him demanding Rick to tell him how sexy he is all the time…. LOL

Be preoccupied with fantasies about success, power, brilliance, beauty or the perfect mate. Nah. Lucille wasn’t perfect nor did he seem to expect her to be. Everyone wants success but Negan’s prime drive in his ‘bad guy’ arcs seemed to just be keeping his people safe and his method was by subjecting other groups. It wasn’t about power really, it was just about keeping them scared enough that they’d keep ‘working’ for him.

Believe they are superior and can only associate with equally special people. Ok, ok, he does seem to want to only associate with Rick ;) I would argue he feels inferior to Rick or Rick is who he admires and wants to be like.

Monopolize conversations and belittle or look down on people they perceive as inferior.

He definitely blabs but we’ve never seen him in many situations were other people are very talkative? Rick never wanted to talk to him. He and Carl’s prison conversations were very casual and not dominated by one side. Same with Lucille, but again, we didn’t see much of them. He looks down on people who he thinks are cowardly/traitorous because he sees that as leading to unnecessary deaths…but I don’t see that as narcissism either. A lot of people look down on people they think are ‘scum.’

Can’t recognize the needs or feelings of others. I do think he’s sometimes childish in this regard, but I don’t think he can’t recognize feelings, in fact, I think he’s actually very good at reading people. He also is a leader of people and acknowledges their need for security, food, and etc.

I’m not going to lie when I say Negan’s ‘lifestyle’ in the apocalypse seems pretty fucking arrogant and narcissist. He’s got the Penthouse, the women, people calling him sir, control over different groups who ‘have to do what he says’ and do I think he let this shit go to his head? Fuck yeah, I do. Fuck yeah, I do believe he comes across as a bratty fuck acting like King. But the thing is - in order to be a narcissist - he’d have to have that same fucking attitude before gaining power and even after he lost it. It’s not a condition that goes away. I don’t think he acted conceited with Lucille, or the gang of guys he traveled with in Here’s Negan, or with Carl when he was in prison or with Rick in Alexandria and certainly not when he was at Lucille’s ‘grave’ or kneeling in front of Maggie.

And of course, one HUGE trait of a narcissist is their inability to deal with criticism, their need to be right all the time and their refusal to admit they’re wrong. They will go great lengths to make something someone else’s fault. And if proven wrong, they will belittle or mock the issue like it’s not big deal or it didn’t matter anyway. They get insulted very easily over what they think are slights. They always want to be perfect and aren’t great with stress or adapting probably because they can’t react ‘perfectly’ in those situations.

And Negan isn’t like that. Several times in the comic, he admits he’s wrong. Not just after the war, but before it. When he brings Carl to Rick on the road, he taunts that he ‘I can’t wait till you see what I’ve done to Carl’. Rick goes into a rage and attacks Negan. Turns out, Negan had ‘done nothing’ to Carl and he fully admits it was his fault for pissing off Rick, and it was on him. After the war of course, he tells Rick and Maggie he was wrong and misguided. He cries to Lucille and says if she’d lived, she wouldn’t have screwed things up like he did. He admits he’s wrong. He takes blame.

He also doesn’t seem to be fazed by insults, either dismissing them or seeming to think he probably deserved it/agreeing with it. You’re an asshole! /  You’re just now figuring that out? He doesn’t fly into a pissy rage. (Now if you insult Lucille on the other hand…)

There’s also a really short scene in AOW where Negan and his people have been trapped inside Sanctuary by Rick luring in a herd of walkers. Negan insists they hold a meeting and they get ‘all the smart fuckers together’. He is admitting and relying on people in his group being smarter and more resourceful than he is to solve this problem.

I think, all in all, Negan can come across as a boastfull, full of himself POS. Maybe it’s his way of coping (ie: Fake it till you make it), or what he thinks people need/want/expect in a leader, or it’s a persona he’s built up and doesn’t think he can drop it. We don’t see a shit ton of his private moments in just casual conversation with people who aren’t kissing his ass/scared of him/or hate his guts. But when I see him by himself, with the group of guys in Here’s Negan, with Lucille, by Lucille’s grave, talking to Rick in Alexandria post-whisperer-war, talking to Carl in the jail cell, talking to Maggie - I think that’s the truer character than the over-the-top Savior leader.