#and i don't really think abbey/drew would work much for what i would want it to be esp in that timeline

[milfbrainrot]

i wish i cared about m/m so i had more ship options for this show but alas there are only 3 women and 2 of them are sisters and the other is in a marriage i could never break up

[sister-claire-critical]

Haha omg I forgot about the rocketship baby. I think also a Machina or Shard baby was planned? Hate how they took having to nerf that as a reason to take out everything- not to mention a lot of the weird humor they used as an excuse to take out things is still in there so what the fuck! (Also I liked all the stupid jokes lol I started reading when I was still a kid myself & I'm still that kind of goofy silly whimsical person now.) This comic drew me in on it's original artstyle & concept & while I can see why the art changed with a more serious tone I don't understand why the story had to change so much- the tagline used to be "pregnant nun holy crap", & it was such an effective draw-in (& short-sweet-&-to-the-point in those little sidebar ads Hiveworks used to show) that I feel like there was really no reason to get rid of it- it was like the whole thing the comic was about & advertised on! I also love to think about what could have been had they stuck with that-

I'm not sure how they would have included Gabrielle being an angel especially since Christianity existing in a tangible non-faith-based form never seemed to exist in the story, & Gabby being a sea creature/siren worked so well with what was already established even from the get-go, however her having her own motives instead of being so closely intertwined as a friend & pseudo-relative with Oscar & Catherine would have been great. Maybe she would have wanted to raise whatever Claire gave birth to as payback for having Claire sort of stolen from her. Maybe she would have thought herself a better parent to this baby than Oscar & Catherine. Maybe she could have just wanted a Clementine replacement, to bring Eden back? Literally just playing it straight that Claire would be giving birth to another new child savior. Grimm could have been a nice part of that, as Gabrielle's above-ground agent, especially since early concept art showed Gabrielle possessed by him- her taking Grimm's possession away from Catherine as a way to stay above ground would have been neat. I get that Grimm is a child but his first old appearances acted more adult, him as a former shard child now grown who also has the motive to bring back Eden would have been cool.

I do think some characters just being straight-up-bigoted then changing would have been fine & more realistic, we don't have to love or even like every character & even despite that many people do like characters with those sort of pasts. Olga's characterization seems torn in different directions, same with Marguerite. People can have complicated reasons for things- like maybe Marguerite could have lived in Eden & blamed Claire & Olga could just be a hardass brainwashed by the Helsings but instead with them any turns in behavior seem mostly influenced by the induced forgetfulness. (Also Olga forming a crush on Jackson in the current story as she softens instead of them already having a relationship would have been cute.) Olga already being a Moonwolf is just complicated on top of her innate strength magic & curse she made with Azi about turning into a werewolf- that just falls flat if she's already a barely controlled wolf-creature, why wouldn't she jump on the chance to turn into a wolf-creature that can control how they change at will? Helsings are already cool with magic so long as it progresses their cause.

Also the original way Oscar & Catherine's relationship was implied/seemed to the readers before the retcons- that if they were together in the past they'd maybe had a falling out or weren't allowed to be together due to the church & were raising the twins & Claire separately, would have made Claire & Marie's future relationship a lot less creepy. All the cute or funny moments in the comic with the twins in the abbey & right after wouldn't have had to be changed either, replaced with exposition dumps & dark moments that don't match the bright color scheme (picked for a humorous/upbeat atmosphere) drawn years ago.

If the church wasn't cool with in-dating at least (they don't have to be homophobic, could just be off-bounds because everyone is a nun, like how Claire's pregnancy had her "headed to the pyre" anyways) it also would have made Yolanda's actions more consistent, it doesn't make sense Yolanda allows so much but that she held a witch trial. Yolanda never needed to be Abby's mother but since she is, joining the church could have been motivated by a "been alive so long I feel like I need to be in a role of power to control the world" sort of thing, a more complicated role to a character that otherwise exists to be solely soft & sweet (besides the witch trial which, again, seems ooc with how she is established in the MiMos).

Someone like Magpie who took on the role of raising kids young (& loved the job unlike most people forced to be parents that young) falling in love with somebody who has the potential for that kind of child abuse when Magpie was away would have been interesting. Instead of regressing into permabird he could've just been some weird old hobo who can't stick around due to magic & his past trauma who occasionally shows up in hopes of checking on the kids to make sure Margie hasn't gotten too bad (in fact there's a livewrite where he does meet up as a human & expresses guilt & regret at Margie's behavior while he's not around) & then it could be he maybe got into trouble around the time the comic starts & hasn't been around for awhile to keep an eye on Margie. Instead Marguerite just has something akin to dementia & it's not her fault.

Claire still being pregnant & having some sort of magic pregnancy not bound by time would've both made more sense & been interesting, her character has felt very one-note for most of the comic's history until just very recently, I feel like because her character has also been torn in a few directions by all this confusion. Taking on reader input & being more open to critique would have done this webcomic a whole lot more justice.

🤩 Thank you for sharing! These are all fascinating ideas!

—Mod Marie🌸

[greenandhazy]

@barroworrab : The film star also needs Thomas to "take care of him" in all manner of ways, and he promises to reciprocate in kind. https://screenrant.com/downton-abbey-new-era-barrow-story-happy-ending/ It’s from a general audience review and is exactly what we see in the movie. @greenandhazy You might have your own interpretation but I think people are allowed to have a different opinion.

I never said people weren't allowed to have a different opinion? I said I was confused as to how OP drew their conclusions and disagreed with it for specific reasons, which is sort of a thing that happens when people post opinions on a public forum like tumblr. Discussions arise. [edit: and OP reblogged to clarify their statement and it helped me understand better, which I appreciate, and fwiw I'm not going to respond to any more comments directly on this post because I don't want to have a whole long argument in the notifications of someone who posted and responded in good faith.]

I'm confused by your response, too. Guy offers Thomas a reciprocal romantic relationship in which they take care of each other. Why is that not... how all relationships work? People do each other favors when they like each other? Part of Thomas's job will be to make arrangements for Guy, but he'll also be able to make arrangements so that he's comfortable too because... that's how relationships work. They get unhealthy when one or both participants start keeping score and being rigid about favors and using language like "I did this so now you owe me, and you have to repay me by doing X," but in general, people try to meet their partners' needs because they love them, and have a general expectation that their needs will be met in return. and we don't really see Guy and Thomas doing significant favors for each other, so there's not much evidence their relationship will fall into one camp or the other, except their expressed hopes, which are for a mutually beneficial relationship. (And if we had seen Thomas and Richard's relationship progress beyond Day 2, I hope we would have seen Thomas meeting some of his emotional wants and needs, or else it would have been a really unbalanced relationship and I doubt he would have been very happy for very long.)

I'm sorry if I've repeated myself in this response but I'm just really baffled by the concept of "he promises to reciprocate" being a mark AGAINST the ship. even the article you link calls it a "happy ending" so?

<<DA2 Spoilers>>

Been rewatching Thomas and Richard’s scenes from DA1, and a bit of dialogue stuck out to me. Then it all clicked.

After the police station rescue, Thomas says, “I’m not sure I’ve shown enough gratitude for what you did,” and it hit me like a bus. He was expecting Richard to now hold this rescue over him as a way to control him or get favors. He was waiting for Richard to claim this “gratitude.” Looking back over the show, whenever Thomas was close to someone, it was always because that person was using him in some way: the Duke, especially O'Brian—I’m blanking on the others—But whenever anyone did something nice for him, he always thought that kindness was done for the sole purpose of building his debt to that person.

All through his scenes with O'Brian, it was always a, “do this thing for me, and I’ll help you out here, so you can later help me out there.” There was always a tally of who’s done what for who. They would help each other out but only so they could hold that favor over the other’s head. It was a toxic relationship that Thomas always seemed to get the wrong end of. Then into season three with Jimmy, Thomas didn’t even dare ask for Jimmy’s friendship until he had gotten himself beat up for the kid. He was physically beaten for Jimmy and only then did he feel comfortable reaching out for that friendship.

When Thomas met Andy, he kept trying to do favors for him in hopes that he’d get his friendship too. But it was always because Thomas was doing something for Andy. This is literally the only way the poor man knows how to make friends!!  Later with Baxter, he couldn’t understand why she was helping him after he had been so mean to her. It just didn’t register in his little traumatized brain. He pushed her away until he finally had to accept that she was genuinely being kind to him, and that was a behavior people could have towards him.

Jumping back to DA1, Thomas meets this really nice fellow who’s fun to hang out with then bam! now Thomas is in his debt because of the police station thing. The pattern is already laid out in Thomas’s mind: this man only did this so he can get something from Thomas in the future or use him. Thomas is uneasy, knowing Richard is going to hold it over him now, but then he just doesn’t. Thomas is waiting for the, “oh yes, actually I’ll be expecting favors from you in the future, because you are in my debt. I OWN you because I helped you.” But instead, Richard just dismisses the whole thing with his, “we have to stick together, men like us.” It’s so cute seeing Thomas’s mindset go from, “oh no, what do I have to do to be even with him again,” to, “oh, oh wait, he doesn’t want anything in return??? We’re really just two blokes having a conversation??? Have I just made a FRIEND?!” And he needs that. so much.

…

Then I got hit over the head with Thomas’s plot in DA2. Thomas gets whisked off to Hollywood so he can live a free and glamorous life. Sounds great on paper, but looking at the deal he was given, it was just that: a deal… His whole life was filled with relationships built on propositions. Relationships based on,“here, do all this for me then we’ll see about what I can do for you.” It makes me sick. Thomas is right back to where he was before. And he walks right into it, because that’s what he’s been conditioned to expect from friendly people. They always want something from him and every nice little thing they do comes with a price. He’s so used to it, that it doesn’t even stand out to him anymore. This is the environment he knows. Of course he runs right back into it as soon as his heart is broken. Why should he believe in people anymore, or unconditional love?