#and explicitly establishing Buck was Jealous

[bandsanitizer]

if I say tommy as an eddie foil then what

[bucksboobs]

seeing all these posts like ‘omg bucktommys seething because tim can’t even talk about tommy and buck’s relationship without mentioning eddie’ is so confusing like. yeah?? he’s buck’s bff AND tommy’s good friend? and them being together changes the relationship dynamic btwn the three of them?? so why wouldn’t they explore that. and why are we meant to be mad about narrative writing that… makes sense? for the story and characters? lmao

I have not personally seen any seething so that might be projecting but like… they are very good friends with Eddie so Eddie feeling a little left out the same way Buck did makes perfect sense when you’re exploring Eddie’s sense of loneliness, why not touch on that? BuddieTommys making jokes about Eddie feeling left out of their dates since 7x03. As a Media Understander I think it’s important to note that Tim says “that leaves Eddie out in the cold, or well not in the cold but Buck has less free time for Eddie.”

It explicitly framed the very normal phenomenon that having a romantic relationship can mean less time for friends, and that it’s not really Buck’s fault if he has to divide his attentions. This show is very good about making their mains’ conflicts not have a “bad guy” in most situations (even Eddie’s cheating subplot was played as very understandable from his perspective). As a BuckTommy I like that Eddie’s reaction to their relationship isn’t being pushed to the side and there’s a very realistic scenario where he feels jealous in some vague way, whether that’s of not having a monopoly on Buck’s time like he usually does (even when Buck was with Taylor he apparently dragged her to family dinner with Eddie) at a crucial moment in his character arc or in a gay way because he wants Buck romantically, it’s a good form of low stakes conflict that is a natural outgrowth of what’s already been established.

[matan4il]

I wish S2 E5 got more attention, I know it was seasons ago but that was the episode I knew Buddie was endgame. It brought together 4 characters Buck, Eddie, Chim and Maddie and basically outlined their future dealings with each other as couples.

With Maddie, Chim had his dorky pop culture side that clearly made Maddie swoon. And Chim, like how do you not heart eye the adorable JLH. They clicked and you felt it.

With Buddie, its that jaws of life comment that made Eddie think he was the smartest dude in the room. Even when he walks in he just brushes past Maddie looking for plates for food. He has no idea Chim may have developed an interest, but he clearly has none. Then Buck basically assuming if you are talking about a hot guy in a room you clearly mean Eddie right?

Even though women have flown in and out they never loose their vibes in both couples. And it honestly says alot because of course everything Buddie related in the first 4 episodes was awesome, especially episode 4 with Carla. But it was 5 that made me realize OK, they really are gonna make Eddie distinctively different with Buck then anyone else.

Hi Nonnie! Oooh, I love this ask!

So, if we're gonna talk ep 206, which starts with Buck, Chim and Eddie helping Maddie move into her new apartment, then I can tell you I have screamed about it over here, as well as in other meta posts referencing back this dialogue, but I think you're right and I haven't talked about it enough. Because YES. It sets up this ongoing parallel between Madney and Buddie, and you're absolutely right. Not only is it SO telling that when Maddie says, "He's cute!" Buck's mind jumps directly to Eddie (confirming what Maddie said earlier in 204, that Buck has a "boy crush" on him), it's also so meaningful that Eddie is around this gorgeous, smart, funny, kind woman and yet the person he's completely wrapped up in is Buck...

And this ep is, ironically, the one where Taylor is first introduced! So it's explicitly established Buck thinks Eddie is cute before she even shows up. And when she does? That's the ep that gives us peak jealous!Eddie for the first time. Taylor talks to Bobby? Everything's fine. Taylor talks to Buck? Eddie right away struts over all territorial. It can't be just that he thinks Taylor isn't trust-worthy, or he would have come over when she was talking to Bobby, too!

I'll be honest, I didn't know yet during 206 if Buddie will be endgame. But by then, I knew I wanted them to be. I think some of the stuff I wrote about in my 204 meta (the way Buck and Eddie are so connected, and Eddie trusts Buck, letting him into his and Chris' life, the way Buck gives Eddie the perfect help that he wasn't even knowingly asking for) that's what already convinced me that whether they will be or not, they SHOULD be endgame. I still stand by that.

Thank you, Nonnie! I hope this answer was satisfying? Please feel free to let me know! Hope you have a great day! xoxox

And if you or anyone else is looking for my other ask replies, you can find them using my ask tag. xoxox

[reachgirl]

It’s just that both the last episode and the ‘you’ll see a lot more of Taylor and they’ll be friends and possibly more’ comment has me so... unenthusiastic about 4b. Somehow Eddie and Ana didn’t really bother me until they got Chris involved - maybe it’s crazy after OOC Eddie but I still trust them to care enough about the storyline and character consistency that they wouldn’t introduce Ana to Chris as ‘the girlfriend’ and just have her leave again.. that would be such blatant character assassination for Eddie. It looks more like they wanted to establish them as a new family unit as quickly as possible so that they could start fleshing out Ana as a character outside of just interacting with Eddie in a dating context..

Now she can have the family dynamic hang out scenes that we usually got with buddie - so she’ll slowly become more of a multidimensional character, which would be great in theory, but.. not that great for buddie. They’ll have Chris grow attached to her, and the viewers are supposed to then grow attached to their family unit so Chris doesn’t get hurt.

Meanwhile I genuinely liked Taylor in the episode, and I’d be excited for a male/female friendship for Buck outside of work, but Tim made it pretty clear she’ll become his girlfriend after a lot of will they/won’t they and character development based around both of them. So again.. great in theory, just not the endgame I’m excited to see.

Then Albert’s (love him) coming in as a new sidekick for Buck’s blossoming relationship with Taylor, while Eddie/Ana/Chris are off being a family. I think we’ll get a lot less buddie in 4b, or we may get a storyline of Chris being sad that Buck’s not around as much, and then him and Taylor take him to the zoo or something and it goes great and suddenly Taylor, who’s usually all about the casual sex, is all: 😳. So he’ll be a catalyst for Buck to get serious with her.. obviously this is not based on anything, I could just see them doing this.

Either way, with both Ana and Taylor seemingly here to stay, I can’t really get excited over buddie anymore, because I don’t see that they’d have them both be single for this long, then get into serious relationships that they actually take time to build (which is why the taylor comment is so depressing - we’ll get a real, developed relationship founded on a friendship. that’s not ‘oh he started dating because he was jealous/felt like he had to’) at the same time, just to... break them up and finally make buddie happen.

It always felt to me like S4 would be the make it or break it season - I don’t think they’ll develop buddie if we don’t at least get actual confirmation that either one of them has feelings for the other, or is wondering, or is jealous but doesn’t understand why.. anything explicitly in the right direction without actually taking the story there. Because if we got that, I’d be happy for 3 more seasons of slow burn. But it doesn’t look like we’re getting that. And this was it. This was the moment to give us anything at all. Buck telling his therapist that ‘I think I figured out why Eddie being with Ana bothers me so much..’ before the episode fades to credits. Eddie coming home to find Buck and Chris cuddled up on the couch, looking at them all heart eyes for a while before seemingly catching himself, then texting Ana that they have to talk. Chris telling Eddie that they’re already a family with Buck, while Buck’s over, and both of them sharing a look before awkwardly looking away. Maddie telling Buck that he’ll have the family he wants, and Buck looking all sad before he says ‘Not the one I want. Not in the way I want it.’ - ANYTHING. Even if they’d then gone on to date Taylor and Ana, there’d be a lot of cool ways to do it, and the seed would have been planted for casual viewers as well. Without that, as much as I love the over-analyzing, it’s just that.. over-analyzing. 😭

I’ll shut up now, please please someone convince me to get enthusiastic about them again, because I hate feeling like my hyperfixation’s slipping, it’s the worst feeling.

[agentsokka]

The thing that bothers me most about tlk animation (also a criticism I had of the jungle book) is that the animals don't even look realistic. Then on top of that it, there's no emotion. So for me, the "real lions don't make that face" argument isn't even valid. It already looks like a fake lion, give it some life!

Honestly, exactly. Like that post has gotten nearly 15k notes worth of folks either agreeing or criticizing and I’m just. Tired. Of arguments like that.

The thing about Lion King is that it’s a very human story told with animals – which makes sense, lots of stories have done popular retellings of classic stories with animals. But with such a human story and human emotions at work, you need to relate them on your characters, like how Disney’s B-Team fabulously accomplished in 1994. You can’t tell a human story without humanizing the animal characters just a bit.

Take Bambi as a counterexample of what would be a GOOD film to remake in this style. When you get down to it, it’s basically a story about animals in nature. You don’t need too many expressions, you don’t need any dialogue whatsoever. It’d be ballsy and hard to execute, but Bambi would be such a better adaptation in this realistic style because it basically is a story about animals being animals. People already anthropomorphize animals in situations – you could get an audience balling because we the audience understands a Human just killed Bambi’s mom and you see this confused little fawn just, looking around, alone, lost. Simple, basic emotions are all you need to convey what the animal’s thinking without dialogue in this kind of setting. The human imagination can do the rest to fill in what would basically be a nature documentary.

Lion King, on the other hand, is telling an epic story of a jealous brother usurping the king and wreaking chaos throughout the kingdom – which IS a kingdom where all animals defer to their ruler, the lions – and the son needing to accept responsibility and come back to fight his uncle. You don’t get stories like that in nature. The Great Prince is a Thing in Bambi, but it’s more of a title than anything substantial, and you could get everything across without needing to explicitly state that beyond maybe some limited, basic narration. Lion King features too complex and established a narrative to really Work well this way.

It doesn’t help that the movie itself appears to be relying on the audience’s memory of the original film to convey emotion. The trailer is literally scene-for-scene reenactments of pivotal moments in the OG film – and of course, that’s not always a bad thing, it’s to pique your interest. But when it’s directly comparing itself to the original film on purpose, the audience can’t help but remember the stark contrast. I’m going to be making a gifset soon that just shows the clips side-by-side and let it speak for itself.

I think the most frustrating thing I find about this situation is people is saying I’m degrading the animators’ work and like, no, my beef has always been with the Disney execs who think realism is the hottest way to make $$$. You don’t get to be an animator of that caliber without knowing about character animation. The CGI is gorgeous, but that’s it – it’s realistic animals sans character animations to convey human emotion. I don’t believe they did that without direction – I believe Disney forced them to comply as employees. They believe realism is IN, they believe nostalgia is PROFITABLE, and that THAT’S the way to make the most bucks. 

The current Disney CEO is Bob Iger, for god’s sake, and you know who is mentor was? Michael Eisner, who famously penned: 

“The pursuit of making money is the only reason to make movies. We have no obligation to make history. We have no obligation to make art. We have no obligation to make a statement. Our obligation is to make money, and to make money, it may be important to make history. To make money, it may be important to make art, or some significant statement. To make money, it may be important to win the Academy Award, for it might mean another ten million dollars at the box office. Our only objective may be to make money, but in order to make money, we must always make entertaining movies. And if we make entertaining movies, at times we will make history, art, a statement, or all three.”

A good analytical video towards these remakes. Iger understands how to profitably repackage popular animated films, giving just enough change (often addressing criticisms lobbed at OG films) and keeping just enough the same – even if they’re soulless adaptations that can’t hold a candle to the original spirit. 

The most valid complaints I’ve seen of this trailer are FROM actual artists and animators who understand what it means to animate characters and convey these emotions. They’re the ones most frustrated because they have the industry knowledge to recognize the problem. This isn’t people who don’t understand what they’re talking about, they recognize that animators are being directed to limit character animation in favor of realism.

Listen, man. I only complain because I love Lion King. If this were Aladdin I would not give a rat’s ass – I haven’t been shitting on Will Smith genie because I cannot bring myself to care about it, even if it’s objectively ridiculous. I wanted to like this remake, because it’s literally the ONLY Disney remake I’ve shown limited interest in whatsoever. I don’t mind changes to the film – by all means, go ahead, there’s so much you can play around with. But something as integral as character animation is a little bad to miss out on.