#and I can't shut up about narrative techniques

[canary3d-obsessed]

Restless Rewatch: The Untamed, Episode 41 part one

(Masterpost) (Pinboard)  (whole thing on AO3)

Warning! Spoilers for All 50 Episodes!

Empathy

We start off with Wei Wuxian, paper edition, flinging himself onto the surprisingly well-preserved face of Nie Mingjue.

Back in their room, Lan Wangji immediately recognizes that Wei Wuxian is doing empathy, even though it's an advanced technique that Lan Wangji hasn't seen him use before, as far as I can recall. Maybe the wind from nowhere that kicks up as soon as the empathy session starts is an indicator he's been trained to recognize.

Lan Wangji: Where's my fan?

Watercooler Gossip

We head into an extended flashback from Nie Mingjue's memories.

Dead-Nie-Mingjue spends a surprising amount of time thinking about how sexy and imposing he used to be, as well as remembering things he wasn't actually there to witness. The whole sequence is presented in usual close-third-person narrative POV. Maybe when we die, we switch to third-person camera view. *shrug*

Nie Mingjue finishes off a couple of Zombies without wiping his sabre, which would make Aslan very unhappy if we were in Narnia.

Then he glares angrily at his crew of cheerful disciples and their unbloodied swords, for reasons that are unclear. He's an angry guy.

(More behind the cut!)

He says to call the dude who was "the last one to stay guard last time." When they say it's Meng Yao he looks shocked. I don't know why he's shocked because I don't know what he actually means by "the last one to stay guard last time." On Netflix this is translated as the dude who "stayed the latest last time," which I guess means that Meng Yao works harder than everyone else? But apparently the result is that he is required to carry water for the rest of the group, so maybe it means he's a slacker? Without seeing the duty roster I can't really tell what the deal is here.

Next we see Meng Yao walking up with a whole bunch of water bottles on a hill above the CDrama River of Questionable Life Choices, where we have previously seen Wei Wuxian, Wen Kexing, A-Qing, and maybe those Lotus Casebook guys.

He approaches the mouth of a (incredibly beautiful) cave, where he can hear people talking shit about him inside.

Instead of going inside and telling them to shut their collective pie hole, he goes and sits by a tree to have lunch by himself. With…all the water? They should have waited to insult him until AFTER the water delivery. Jeez, these guys are dumb.

While he chows down on his bread, he keeps glancing wistfully at the cave where the dudes are, but somehow fails to notice Nie Mingjue walking up to him until he's 2 feet away.

Nie Mingjue asks why Meng Yao isn't in the cave with the others. Meng Yao makes a face at the cave and Nie Mingjue strides over there, eager for an opportunity to be pissed off about something.

They walk into the cave together and the dudes are STILL talking shit about him. I get that gossip is fun, but there are only 3 things to know about Meng Yao. 1. Mom was a sex worker 2. dad is reknowned creep Jin Guangshan 3. got kicked down the stairs at Jinlintai. That's it.

Anyone who enjoys gossip knows that the conversation would have shifted by now, to one of the following topics: 1. who else's mom is a sex worker? Yours, no yours! 2. the further creep adventures of Jin Guangshan 3. every over-long staircase that anyone in the group has ever heard of, and everyone who either climbed up it or fell down it.

Instead, the conversation has stayed resolutely on the topic of Meng Yao, and Nie Mingjue just stands there with him behind a rock wall, listening while his guys lay out all of the embarrasing detail, along with their big opinions.

One guy says that Meng Yao has accepted his fate and has to run and get water for them, but another guy says he hasn't accepted it, that he's diligent & working hard all the time so he can gain fame and get his father to acknowledge him. This is the only guy who has said anything positive about him, and this is the speech Nie Mingjue decides to interrupt, rather than the speech about how many men Meng Yao's mom has fucked. What the hell, Nie Mingjue? Nie Minjue clearly has no interest in saving Meng Yao embarrassment.

Nie Mingjue yells at everyone and tells Meng Yao that the more that these assholes talk shit about him, the more he has to achieve to make sure there's nothing they can say. Which is…pretty decent advice, sadly.

While Nie Mingjue delivers his lecture, Meng Yao mentally counts up how many guys he's going to be murdering later. Then Nie Mingjue pointedly promotes him to be his deputy General. Meng Yao thanks him formally and apparently sincerely.

Before we jump ahead to what happens next, let's talk about how this scene sets up the relationship between Nie Mingjue and Meng Yao. I think it's a super toxic relationship right from the get-go.

When I first watched this scene it played like a leader seeing the value in his subordinate, defending him from his peers, and elevating him as a reward for his hard work. But I think that's not really what we're seeing. Nie Mingjue's focus throughout this encounter is on the rest of his men; specifically on their unvirtuous behavior and his rage about it. He's using Meng Yao to teach them a lesson, and it seems like he elevates him above them not as a reward for himself, but as a punishment for them.

On the flip side, Meng Yao's lunchtime pity party seems a lot less spontaneous to me, now that I've seen so many other Wuxia & Xianxia dramas, than it did when I first fell into this CDrama rabbit hole. His meek, butthurt reaction to people talking shit about him is inappropriate for a cultivator or any fighter in the Jianghu. It's an entire culture based around fighting and responding to challenges. He definitely doesn't lack courage, so I think his meekness in this situation is crafted for its effect on Nie Mingjue.

Cloud Recesses Revisited

Let's have a flashback of our own, so we can compare this meeting with Meng Yao's first meeting with Lan Xichen, back in Episode 4.

When Meng Yao is presented, some Jiang sect douchebags in the back lay out his whole backstory in loud stage whispers. Lan Qiren quickly silences them -- without losing his temper, notably.

Even though he's a grumpy SOB who doesn't normally hesitate to yell at Wei Wuxian students, he does not embarrass Meng Yao by making a big deal of the situation; not even to say Gossip is Forbidden.

Lan Xichen then steps up and, smooth king that he is, drops the piece of gossip HE has heard about Meng Yao: "I've heard that Clan Leader Nie has a helpful assistant." Then he compliments the elegance of his speech, saying that he matches up to his expectations.

Then he strokes his fingers while he praises the gift he's brought. Then he grabs him and kisses him passionately in front of everyone Ahem. Pardon me.

Where Nie Mingjue's reaction to malicious gossip is to listen to every word of it and then make a big show of criticizing the people speaking, Lan Xichen moves to counteract it with praise, subtly shaming the gossipers in a way that genuinely uplifts Meng Yao. And he does it just because he's a nice guy who finds Meng Yao pleasing, not because he requires anything from him. Whereas Nie Mingjue appears to require quite a lot from Meng Yao.

Nie Mingjue's goal seems to be to improve Meng Yao in a fundamental way; to educate him and sort of force him onto the path of virtue. He also wants to use him to force his men onto the path of virtue...a path he himself does not, actually, walk.

Murder Will Out

Next we jump ahead to Meng Yao shanking the guard captain.

I think Nie Mingjue needs to overhaul his hiring practices because this dude is very easy to stab and perhaps should not be in charge of anything relating to combat. Maybe the "block" button on his game controller broke.

Note that Meng Yao picks up a saber to do this - not a Wen sword, but a Nie saber, which might be a props error, since later Nie Mingjue accuses him of deliberately using a Wen sword to disguise his actions.

We've seen these events before, back in episode 10, but the editing adds some things in the current episode, and removes others. Let's look at the differences.

1. Drunk Guard Captain

The night before this fight, there's a banquet and Meng Yao spends most of it making out with guarding Xue Yang. He does this by checking on him a bunch, which doesn't seem like it should be necessary in a fortress with a proper dungeon, but whatevs.

In Episode 10, we see Meng Yao briefly encounter the drunken, hostile guard captain, who shoulder-checks him and calls him son of a [sex worker], but otherwise we don't see any of their conversation.

In Episode 41, Nie Mingjue's head remembers a longer version of the encounter, with bonus vomiting. The captain tells Meng Yao he saw him talking to someone, asks what he's up to, accuses him of lying, and Meng Yao tells the captain's sidekick to put his drunk ass to bed.

This whole scene is HILARIOUS when you consider that this is Nie Mingjue's mental account of events, which means the Captain must have put everything we see in his report to the boss.

"Well, sir, I was incredibly drunk and vomiting in public near the Lan guest quarters when that twink that you like was seen talking to someone, so I roughed him up a bit and insulted his mother before I went to pass out from drunkenness. I hope you will reprimand him for his bad behavior."

That scene, in Episode 41, ends with Meng Yao all alone, straightening and brushing off his clothes and making his "I'm plotting your death" face.

Nie Mingjue sure does remember a lot of stuff he wasn't actually around to see. Maybe he's filling in gaps with everything he's heard during all the times Meng Yao has stood in front of his head-shelf and gloated out loud about stuff.

2. Wens Attack

In episode 10, Wen Chao and Wen Zhuliu bring some guys to attack the Unclean Realm. Meng Yao goes and stabs the guard captain while Nie Mingjue is in a melee 1-on-1 with Wen Zhuliu, which requires all of his focus and spinning.

Nie Mingjue glances to the side in a moment of respite and sees Meng Yao stabbing the guard captain; he promptly forgets about fighting Wen Zhuliu in order to go shout at Meng Yao.

Meng Yao pulls on a tee shirt that says "commmit to the bit" and proceeds to say "it wasn't me" over and over despite having been caught red-handed.

This distraction enables Wen Zhuliu to almost stab Nie Mingjue, but he's saved by Meng Yao throwing himself in the way of the blade. These people should learn to block with something besides their torsos.

In Episode 41, Nie Mingjue's head has forgotten that Wen Zhuliu was ever there, and doesn't focus on the other Wen dudes right in his eye line. He notices Meng Yao acting a tiny bit squirrely and stops fighting in order to go follow him. Like. Stops fighting to defend his fortress, seat of his power, family home, etc., because he doesn't trust his subordinate.

Did I mention the need to overhaul Nie Clan hiring practices? Also some management training wouldn't be out of place.

Nie Mingjue's head also remembers that Meng Yao smirked evilly while doing the stabbing.

It's cool that he had time to notice this and be shocked and appalled rather than, you know, moving quickly to intercept the blow or otherwise help his captain out.

Side note: Meng Yao doesn't wipe his saber when he's done with it. Aslan is sad now.

3. You're Fired

After the battle is resolved, we go to Nie Mingjue's office. In episode 10 we jump in with Meng Yao groveling on the floor while Nie Mingjue yells at him. In Episode 41, we learn that he's on the floor not because he put himself there, but because Nie Mingjue apparently kicked him and his recent chest wound across the room.

In Episode 10, Meng Yao makes it makes it clear that he killed the guard captain on purpose, and gives a pretty good list of reasons for killing him.

you promoted me to vice general, but he always looked down on me

insulting, beating, and humiliating me

taking credit for my achievements

he let Xue Yang go

Meng Yao says that he could tolerate the first two problems, but he 100% will not tolerate #3. It's not about personal pride, for him, it's about ambition.

There's always gonna be another mountain I'm always gonna wanna make it move Always gonna be an uphill battle Sometimes I'm gonna have to lose Ain't about how fast I get there Ain't about what's waiting on the other side It's the climb

The part about Xue Yang is bullshit, of course, but the rest seem like pretty okay reasons for killing the guy. I mean, in the world of the show, where justice is mostly determined by stabbing.

Nie Mingjue doesn't think pride in your own achievements is a good enough reason, and banishes him.

In Episode 41, Nie Mingjue remembers things differently; this time Meng Yao's justification is:

He let Xue Yang go

He wanted to kill me

He insulted my mother

This time, Nie Mingjue feels like it would be ok to kill the captain in a sudden moment of anger, but if that was how it went down, you wouldn't have an evil smirk on your face. Also, why pretend that Xue Yang did it and why use a Wen Sword? [it was clearly a Nie saber, bruh]

Nie Mingjue thinks he's been planning this for a long time, because the guard captain told him that Meng Yao was colluding with Xue Yang. Nie Mingjue has ALMOST figured out what's going on here, but his anger is making him stupid.

Instead of following through to the logical conclusion that Meng Yao is getting up to some shenanigans with Xue Yang, he focuses on his own hurt feelings, suspecting that Meng Yao was manipulating him from the beginning. Which, of course, he was, but Nie Mingjue was using Meng Yao, too. Red flags all around.

He wonders if Meng Yao would have killed the caveful of bullies if Nie Mingjue hadn't come to help him out. Which is ridiculous since Meng Yao was just sitting and having his lunch when NMJ showed up; if he felt like killing those guys it would be pretty simple to poison the water they were making him carry for them.

Nie Mingjue proceeds to banish Meng Yao not precisely for killing a guy without permission, but for having the wrong priorities and values. So he really shouldn't be surprised when Meng Yao goes to work for Wen Ruohan.

Soundtrack: The Climb, Alan Cumming version

[jimpagne]

Or you could flip it on its head and say that you are acting like a cultist, stupid solo, or ignorant Army because you are refusing to accept that they are, indeed, together. They literally told us this yesterday in big loud letters to shut up those doubting them after the sightings. I really do not know what more these two have to do to make people like you see it, and it is incredibly disheartening, imagine how they feel. They are more devoted, committed and loving than any straight couple I know of personally, and they show us this time over. If you still chose to ignore it because YOU need to hear it in full from their own mouths, than that is on YOU, and again, makes you no different from the cult. How about you leave those who know, who see, respect and support them alone. Thanks

Someone severely lacks reading comprehension, I see.

Where in my post did I ever discredit their bond? All I said was to NOT ENGAGE WITH NOR SPREAD STALKER CONTENT and to be careful before spreading information because it could be potentially false.

I never said to truly write off eye witness accounts, but to do the rational thing and take them all with a grain of salt. Because do you know what taekookers do? They hear a rumor, run with the rumor, and won't let anyone else tell them otherwise. They ignore any other voice of reason, ignore when people in other spaces try to disprove something or provide better insight. They also consistently ignore what HAS been stated and vetted by saying "what this person said is lying", or "Jungkook and Taehyung can't be open about their relationship because they're being controlled by the company", or blah blah blah, whatever suits their narrative.

Do you want Jikookers to end up like that? Is that what you want? For us to have someone come online and say "I saw Jimin and Jungkook at [location] doing [blank]", having everyone spread and believe it without any HEALTHY doubts or any disclaimers, and then later having it proven to be untrue?

Am I saying majority Jikookers move like that? No. Absolutely not. I am saying that if we continue to endorse this behavior, the slope becomes a lot more slippery.

All I was doing was proposing safer techniques to deal with candid information like this, but you only saw me say "don't be like a cultist" and got triggered.

The fact is: Everything is speculative until directly proven otherwise. Theories are theories until fundamentally proven true. If you cannot recognize that, that's a dangerous way of thinking.

Like I said, at the end of the day Jikook being a couple in and of itself is still speculative. That is the cold, hard truth. That's not saying "they're not real" or "they could never happen", that's simply saying that we must respect the possibility of it not being true, and that we should create a somewhat respectful boundary between us and them before making theories and promoting them as 100% facts.

You can believe that they're real, but it's completely normal to hold doubts about something that hasn't been completely confirmed. One thing that is 100% real and 100% vetted is their mutual love and respect for one another as two people who have been friends for well over a decade. They endured some of the greatest hardships of their lives together, so anyone who says that they hate one another of course is completely delusional.

Though it is true that a lot of the claims that Jikookers make are often proven to be true later on, that doesn't mean that every theory made by a Jikooker by default is true. This is why it's important to be mindful.

If you don't understand that, that's entirely on you. If you want to endorse stalking or dangerous behavior by leaking their locations or their hotels, you go on right ahead. Just letting you know that it's scary and dangerous, and I wonder how you would feel if someone followed you around and constantly compromised your privacy to millions of people to get back at the people who 'doubted them'.

Being right at the expense of someone's personal life or security is not always the best. Spreading unvetted information without a disclaimer on the internet is still dangerous regardless of if you have no ill intent behind it.

Also, surprise suprise, I am a Jikooker. I am just one who tries to be mindful about information and sources before completely believing in it. A lot of Jikookers on my timeline were wary about the sources, not because they were antis or moving like taekookers who were desperate to disprove it, but because it's just the natural thing to be inquisitive about secondhand information.

I hope you reread my post and think a little more critically about it before jumping on me <3

[trash-tzar]

27, 29 and 30 for both your Rooks!

Oh man you have given me a great set of questions to simply Never Shut Up about so prep for some paragraphs

27: What was their life like before the events of Veilguard?

Shayne Mercar was a slave in Ventus, and spent a lot of her childhood getting trained in like Classical Magical Technique and higher level magic theory so she could be the Best Magical Weapon Ever. She really only had her sister Camilia who escaped out to the east (and became my Ingelvar!) When she was 7, and Shayne escaped out west and changed her name from Servilia to Shayne when she was like 15. I like to pretend Dorian scooped her up and helped her to Minrathous on his way back from Skyhold and helped the SD's find her a family (the Mercars) and a cover story (the backstory a Mercar very quickly and over complicatedly explains to Tarquin) Then she busted heads for the Shadow Dragons until Veilguard :)

Lucille de Riva is a Real Genuine De Riva. Her mom was some Orlesian courtier who rolled up to Antiva when Lucy was like? 3ish? And said "hey I don't want this its your problem now" and the king was like "ugh I don't want to pay for another Bastard In Exile and she can't exactly make a choice so. Actually it's Viago's problem now! Off to the Crows!" So Viago raised her for awhile (he was Bad At It godbless) until she started Crow training and she doesn't really. Remember that much from before training. So Viago has decided she's safer thinking she's an Honorary de Riva and she was holding a grudge cause he wouldn't train her but it's just cause he's a softie :)

29: If you could choose a different faction for your Rook, which one would they have joined and why?

Shayne's is interesting because. My first instinct is Mourn Watch. Cause I got really into Nevarra while reading Tevinter Nights and thought about tweaking her backstory so she escaped out there, but I ended up making her a sister to do that since I was so attached to Shayne's og backstory. She probably almost got sold off to the Crows a few times since we know magisters will dump talented but worthless to them slaves on the Crows for Lots Of Money, so I guess the Crows because she's talented but almost completely unmanageable. Made the altus' life as difficult as possible.

Lucille......... Lucy what would u be up to........... maybe the Lords of Fortune? Shes an adrenaline junkie so that might have been her thing if her mom didn't dump her in Antiva. I could also see her getting a little too cocky and ending up getting Blighted and Viago goes "absolutely not you are getting Warden-ed no dying on me" and she conscripts and has to get it together a little. Yeah I think definitely the Warden one she would HATE it but it would be narratively fulfilling.

30: What's your favorite thing about your Rook?

Shayne is an extremely talented and classically well educated mage. She simply chooses to use unrefined raw magic with an orb and dagger stance for fun. She defaults to physical violence and must be coerced into using the fancy shit. If She Went To Hogwarts She Would Use Physical Violence. Also after Dorian helped her get to Minrathous and they got found family-ed their favorite gag is Dorian bringing Shayne important places (both as a magister and the archon) and introducing this scrappy elf woman as his niece. They never offer any explanation the other important people's reaction is too funny.

Lucy is VERY much Viago's sister. They have the same dry humor and judgemental tsk tsk attitude and some crazy emotional constipation. Teia makes fun of them cause when they stand next to each other they have the same stance. The main difference is that Lucille loves causing problems on purpose. Sets fires just cause it'll piss Viago off etc. It's incredibly fortuitous that the demon sharing her boyfriend's body is Spite they get along so well. That's her boyfriend AND her best friend.

[morgana96]

(Okay, I don't mean to drag this out, but there's actually a LOT of other misinformation in yumeijin's claims that contradict what actually happened in-game.)

"Let's ignore the matter of it being a written contrivance that the Endless require more aether than exists on a shard seemingly primed for rejoining."

There's really nothing contrived about it at all. G'raha Tia explains the root of the problem very consisely when the group first arrives in Living Memory: "All men eventually die. If you make Endless of everyone, you will never have enough aether to sustain them. You but prolong the inevitable".

And if anyone would understand the insustainability of keeping disembodied souls corporeal, it would be G'raha. After all, it wasn't Dawntrail that introduced this concept to the narrative. It was Shadowbringers.

When the Scions' souls were accidently brought over to the First, the Crystal Exarch had to use extremely powerful magics to keep their souls from dissipating. But this was a temporary solution used to buy time to develop a means to return their souls to their comatose bodies back on the Source.

Alexandria's Endless were not detatched from still-living bodies: they were memory data collected from corpses in an effort to circumvent the natural process of death.

The Endless are, to put it in biological terms, parasitic entities. The reason why they need so much aether is because they are fully constructed from it and can't replenish it other ways, unlike actual living beings who have physical bodies made up of cells. They can't even maintain corporeal forms without those large amounts of aether. And the more Endless that are created, the more insustainable the parasitic relationship becomes.

"The people in Living Memory aren't shades any more than any sundered is compared to an Ancient."

They ARE shades. And there's one Endless in particular that really solidifies that fact: Otis.

The Otis we befriend in Heritage Found had lived a long life following his transformation. Yet once we get to Living Memory, that Otis isn't there. Endless!Otis has no memory of his life as a machine, taking care of Gulool Ja, or sacrificing himself to protect us and Endless!Sphene.

This is because Endless!Otis was created from memories stored before Otis' transformation: his robotic body wasn't equipped with any sort of regulator, meaning that none of his post-transformation memories were collected.

This moment in the story showcases that the Endless aren't actually the people they're based on, but rather imitations functioning on stored memory data. If memories of events a person experienced aren't collected, the simulated version of them in Living Memory will simply operate as if those events never happened, even though they absolutely did.

"Imagine shutting down a whole ward of people on life support because a handful of them would rather pass on."

The Endless are not on "life support".

Life support is the use of various medical treatments and techniques to counteract organ failure and temporarily postpone organ death. The goal of such treatment is to give the body extra time to potentially recover, and is only meant to keep someone going until their body can keep itself going again.

In Alexandria, an Endless is only created after a person dies permanently. You can't put the disembodied soul memories of a person who's already dead on "life support". They're dead. There's no recovering from that.

~~~

Again, I'm not trying to be a jerk or whatever, yumeijin. But your argument is littered with incorrect information and misconceptions about how the Endless work, and that's important to address.

i have seen people be like "if you think what the dawntrail protagonists do in zone six is valid you have to conceded emet's approach/perspective was valid, what you do is basically what he does" and it's like...nah. it's obviously intentionally very similar ("it's like poetry, it rhymes") but there's some key differences:

emet is disgusted by sundered life, which he sees as inhuman, and longs to return to the unrecoverable past. so he does seven(ish) planet-wide genocides. the endless aren't new life, their ability to grow and learn is specifically in question (at the very least they are fundamentally incapable of taking in new sensory experience of certain forms), they're shades from the unrecoverable past, and you are destroying them in favor of those still alive.

also, we aren't disgusted by them nor do we think anything is fundamentally justified if done to them (everyone pretty much no-sells cahciua "we aren't alive so it doesn't matter if you kill us :)," in fact). we don't have like 12,000 years and the most advanced magic known to anyone alive. we are forced by serious exigency to destroy them due to a political impasse with their leadership's policy re: resource extraction. this tonal difference is in fact extremely important.

the endless themselves seem pretty ambivalent about the whole deal. they're bored or they're wary of the way their world keeps shrinking, and it's very explicitly neither a functioning society by any recognizable human terms nor a paradise.

related to the above, basically every named endless turns to the person most relevant to them (cahciua to erenville, krile's parents to her, namikka to wuk lamat, otis to you) and is like, huh, i really appreciate having this moment of grace at the end of my journey to see that it was all worthwhile and to resolve my lasting regrets, but i understand what you're here to do and yeah, it's probably time for us to go. (does the writing put a finger on the scale by doing this? sure, but the writers also designed and built the scales and everything they're weighing on them, so i find it hard to discredit any one aspect for being the writers' invention.)

finally uh no one in the party has kids with the endless or lives a full human lifetime as one of them lol.

it's important to remember that emet was definitely at least somewhat lying about not seeing the sundered as real people. the fact that he has "lived a thousand thousand of your lives . . . broken bread with you, fought with you, grown ill, grown old, sired children and yes, welcomed death’s sweet embrace" makes everything he did soooooo much crazier than what you do. if i managed to convince an endless to fall in love with me and i had a kid with them and i loved that kid so much that their death threw me into a permanent grief spiral then like. yeah i guess i would have to be like "well hats off to emet, folks." but luckily the game doesn't make you do that.

even if you insist everyone in living memory was a full living person that we killed, you're still weighing like a city of people versus 7+ planet-wide mass murders. you do not under any circumstances got to hand it to him.

living memory absolutely is evocative of everything that happens in shadowbringers. but rather than placing us in emet's shoes, it forces us to relive what we already did, to really fully face up to what we have done by promising to remember emet's culture after destroying any chance of its return. after two games going hard on the hope part of the game's central theme of hope arising from grief, now we're doing grief. we are forced to see the past of our memories not as a cold, ghostly art deco cubus-plagued socratic method hellscape but as the most beautiful technicolor theme park where everyone's happy and no one's sad and there's parades every day and your parents are alive and they love you so much. and then the game's conclusion is, yeah, you were still right to let go. in fact, you were and are morally obliged to let go. the living were and are worth more than the dead. our grief in letting go of them may be immense and turns our world to bleak nothingness for a time, and that is important to recognize, but at the end of the day our most pressing duty is to those we can yet save, not those we have lost.

[baronessedcheese]

The Narrative Art of Nathalie’s Absence

Now with some Miraculous Ladybug spoilers out which diminish the clouds of uncertainty around Nathalie’s absence from the first episodes of Season Four, I would like to celebrate the writing team’s decision to create content I can analyse by taking the time to actually analyse it. Credit should be given where credit is due after all, and I’m offering it with both hands.

Warning: Season Four spoilers up until the sneak peek from Optigami

The key is the power of repetition. Repetition means that a feature (in literature, in music, in visual media and who knows where else) is repeated several times, to emphasize a certain idea. It’s a narrative device used to hammer something into the head of the audience.

Is that too boring? It might be. But how about letting the basics sink in and then turning it around to hit the audience in the face? When used effectively (to build up to a surprise, for example), repetition becomes a wonderful narrative tool. And I think the writers of Miraculous Ladybug had exploited it amazingly.

For a long time, Nathalie was the background character whose role was very repetitive: she had to be where Gabriel was supposed to be, ensuring that Gabriel was there, even if virtually. So her defining characteristic was to hold a tablet which had a video connection with Gabriel.

Using this structure over and over meant that the image of Nathalie holding a tablet (and Gabriel’s fais) inevitably became iconic to her character. So much so, that when Marinette did something similar (holding her phone while on a video call with Adrien) in Anansi, the fandom jokingly compared Marinette to Nathalie. This was the first time (I know of) when the connotations produced by repetition were seen at work.

After the concept made its nest in the audience’s consciousness, a writer can decide how to play with it. In Nathalie’s case, the writers turned away from the good old "usual," diverging form the expectations and creating disturbance by changing what the audience perceived as normal.

This is the narrative power Season Four was playing with up until Optigami (or more likely up until Gabriel Agreste, but we have no way of knowing that). Gabriel was only virtually present during the advertisement’s shooting in Mr. Pigeon 72, and he will be only virtually present in Queen Banana too. But it’s Bob Roth and Adrien who are dealing with the tablet in these two episodes, not Nathalie. This new setup breaks repetition and draws attention to Nathalie’s absence.

To spice up Nathalie’s absence even more, the writers combined it with the fear of the unseen (the fear of those who care about her character of course). The second to last time we have seen Nathalie (in Miracle Queen) she had been very ill, and the last time we have seen her (New York Special) she had been confined to bed. And the last time we have heard of her, she had created a sentimonster which destroyed half of the city. Knowing these facts without seeing the outcome, immediately followed by the show altering a returning element, creates suspense. And when there is suspense, there are questions. Did the transformation in the New York Special strain her? Is she recovering? Is she very sick? Is she in a hospital? Did the coma catch up to her?

And when the suspense is built up, it’s time for the punch to be delivered. And the punch in this case is that it was all a deception. We learn that Nathalie’s genius was the real threat in this season so far (and hopefully will remain to be). She was not truly absent during the first third of Season Four like we thought she was, she just seemed to be. All the while, she was spying on Ladybug’s friends, using every opportunity Shadow Moth gave her. Her glorious reappearance after her suspicious absence is the exact opposite of what the audience was manipulated to believe, and heavy suspense turning into a praise of how badass Nathalie actually is carries the narrative power repetition has.

So if we look at it like this, I think that Nathalie’s lack of screen time was a good decision on the writers' part. Breaking the habit of her carrying the tablet for Gabriel and showing others do it in her stead brought uncertainty, and playing with that must feel awesome. But being on the other end also has its rewards, I guess. I for one felt goosebumps yesterday, when I learned about what Nathalie was up to, because this is how you use repetition effectively. Nicely played, writers of the show! Shame that the Competition of TV Channels ruined the surprise.

[beautifulterriblequeen]

B2:S - Chapter 5

Much of this series will be about the differences and additions in the novel version, and how they contribute to my understanding of story canon. But there will be character appreciation, the odd theory and headcanon, and suchlike as well.

Here be lots of Viren deets, Best Boy Soren deets, some writing/continuity stuff, worldbuilding appreciation and half of a theory, Detective Rayla, Moon Temple geeking, Claudium and dark magic, and more!

Spoilers for Book Two: Sky below.

(I know for darn sure that I wrote up a post for chapter 4, but I can't find it anywhere so I guess Tumblr ate it and I'll have to redo it at some point, but today is not that day)

Viren, my evil dude, my bad guy, coming in clutch with the worldbuilding and backstory again! If you want to know decades of information, you gotta talk to Viren. Or read his scenes, at least. Here, he seems to not sleep much when he has a big problem to analyze his way through. Solutions trump pretty much everything else in this guy's life, and he's had a really hard week with a lot of new and complicated problems. Of course he's getting sleep-deprived trying to find his way through them all.

Harrow put so much trust in Viren when he made him High Mage! He just threw himself extra hard at that Lady Justice blindfold, didn't he? Didn't really want to see what Viren was doing in his magic study, so he left Viren to his devices. And Viren has a lot of devices.

Also, this is fascinating: Viren made the secret passage to his "less official study" in Katolis Castle! And he was inspired to do so by the way his own mentor kept the Puzzle House. What else could a Puzzle House be, except a place with secret passages? Yay! secret headcanon that "the Puzzle House" is just "Katolis Castle" from Kid Viren's perspective tho

So either Viren built all of those passageways, or at least the ones to his dungeon. Which means he has to have, or know where to get, a stash of those glowing blue Moonshadow crystals. Hmmm.

I can't wait to learn more about Kpp'Ar and young Viren, btw. From this description of Viren and all his literal secret ways, it feels like another parallel between Viren and Runaan, with the whole "secretive paths, members only, insider knowledge" type stuff. Only the really cool members of this cult club get to know the secrets, and guess what, kid, you're cool now but you can never tell anyone, okay? Our secret.

Yeahhh, that'll never backfire in any way for either of them.

Kpp'Ar calling puzzles and secrets "man-made magic," though. Yes sir, knowledge is indeed power.

This chapter mentions Runaan by name, from Viren's perspective. Generally that would imply that Viren knows his name, even though assassins do not share their names, and Runaan didn't seem to give his to Viren in the first book. However, there was a scene in book one where the last paragraph switched perspective from Viren to Runaan - a technique that's very common in visual media like movies and shows and gives you that "ohoho they left the room and didn't notice this, but you do!" vibe. Using Runaan's name there in book one, where Viren couldn't see it but readers could, helps them keep track of the assassin's story arc while maintaining Viren's racism.

So in book two, in which Runaan has no onscreen scenes (alas), using his name in a scene that calls back to the events in book one helps us remember what happened in that dungeon cell. It would be a bit muddier to recall the specifics if Viren kept thinking about Runaan as "Elf." So I'm cool with the perspective nudge because it serves a narrative purpose: clarity. But I'm also enjoying the angst of considering that, somehow, Viren learned Runaan's name either during or after the coining spell. Mwa ha ha haaa. (Obligatory "Keep my pretty name outta your mouth" goes here)

Okay, back to Viren's scheming! He took the mirror because it was human-sized in a dragon lair. He knew it didn't really fit there, and that made it interesting, so he stole it. But he realized it was really powerful when Runaan wouldn't tell him squat about it - the assassin's instinct to protect Xadian secrets from human hands meant that Viren was holding a very powerful Xadian secret. And that just made him want it all the more. Ah, Runaan, if only your relationship with lying was, like, the exact opposite of what it is. Nyx could've spun Viren a believable tale in 2 minutes flat.

Also of interest: Viren considers his cursed coins to be a final fate. He expects Runaan to remain in his coin forever. With the Chekhov's coins still extant in the storyline, we can assume that they'll come up again eventually, but Viren has no current plans to do anything with his elf money except carry it around.

It's worth noting that Viren admits that he got impatient when he trapped Runaan in the coin. Runaan's first fate in Katolis was supposed to be death at Soren's hands, but Claudia "saved" him from that. His next fate was to become spell components, but Viren's frustration with his stubbornness "saved" him from that fate, too. So now he's in a coin, where no one can chop him up at all. Yay? No, boo!

We get one last line about Runaan before Viren shifts gears: he makes a point of noting for us that Runaan's shackles are still locked shut. However much of Runaan made it into that coin - body, soul, hair care products - he was magicked there, pulled right out of his restraints.

The creepy black liquid that Viren pours right into his eyes is the last of a powerful potion he got from Kpp'Ar, and its recipe is ancient! Humans used it back in the age of Elarion to see through the illusions of the world. And we get a delightfully creepy bit of description about the preparation of this serum, which makes it abundantly clear that it's a Moon magic-based concoction, harvested from eyeless vipers on a moonless night, with the threat of irrevocable madness ("madness" by whose definition, though) if it's done wrong-

Hang on. Hold up. This is a Plato's Cave reference. OH MY GOD.

No no I'm fine, this is brilliant. Sorry, sorry, I couldn't figure why there was so much description for a potion prep that Viren didn't even have to perform himself. But now I get it. I see the light. HA. I should make a separate post for this, it's amazing.

Anyway, for reference, the humans who used this serum were called the Oracles of Ophidia, and Ophidia is a taxonomy group that includes all modern snakes. Can you say "creepy ancient snake rites"? I can! Woo!

Viren activates the serum with a spell, but apparently he's never done it before. He's not sure if it's supposed to be hot and bubbly, and he worries that it's been tainted by moonlight.

Oh, I do hope so.

The magic potion hurts, a lot. Viren will do just about anything, to himself or anyone, to do what he believes is necessary. He just risked madness and blindness to find out what this mirror does! Viren. Can you just. Take a nap or something. Have a Snickers.

This chapter gives us a fun clue that I don't remember from the show: when Viren's vision clears and he can see, his reflection has white pupils and the room reflected in the mirror has inverted colors. You know where else has inverted colors?

You know who else got white pupils for a hot second?

Okay, now it makes sense! Viren and Lujanne were both seeing into the realm beyond life and death. Him with his moon magic potion, and her with her moon powers on a full moon night at the Moon Nexus. Which is Very Interesting! Is it a direct hint about Aaravos's location, or just a separate cool detail? Orrr, does it look like a direct hint because Aaravos is actually trapped in the world beyond life and death, but it's actually separate and we'll see something about white pupils again later on?

Viren really does have self-esteem issues, we all picked up on it with his rant at his reflection. He throws a fit when he catches himself wondering if he's actually worthless. In the book version of his tantrum, he shoves the mirror and hurls a candelabra instead of flipping a table. He didn't need to shove the mirror to set the fire, but it's in here. Foreshadowing that perhaps, if push comes to shove, Viren will choose himself over Aaravos? Giving Aaravos time to peek through and see that the coast is clear?

Soren, my boyyyyy. He has a rough night at the Moon Nexus because two sides of him are fighting with each other. He struggles to understand Callum's friendship with Rayla, and he also fantasizes about chopping off Rayla's head. One of these is a pretty ordinary thing to do. The other is Soren's internalization of what he needs to do to gain his father's approval. If he brought his dad a chopped off elf head every week, he'd probably feel a lot more confident because Viren would praise him a lot more.

Okay, okay, omg, is it just me, or does the "Moonshadow Madness" story, as it's told in the book, seem like Soren just doesn't know what a monsterfucker is? He thinks an elf bite puts humans under a spell. But vampires are sexy, and some people want them to do more to them than just bite them. A passionate kiss under the moonlight could look very bitey, especially if one of the participants has horns and you're already culturally trained to hate them. No yeah, I'm already headcanoning an actual human-elf kiss that got misunderstood by an observer long ago.

it's Lujanne isn't it, we all know, because what is a love spell but a sweet soft illusion, I mean how else does she get supplies for her Caldera, I ask you, and also Corvus was totally sent to investigate once and he told Soren at camp what he saw

And then back to magefam angst: Soren pretending that his sister's nose-tapping is stupid, even though he actually thinks it's cool, just because their dad thinks it's stupid. Viren, istg. Let your kids like harmless things. It's so cute that Soren taps his nose back at her, though! Like they have their own sibling code. I hope we get to see the nose tap again, especially now that they've chosen different sides. It could mean so much, that they're not too far apart yet.

Rayla knows what buttery pancakes smell like. I love this. Do Moonshadow elves have butter and pancakes, does Rayla eat a stack of eight giant pancakes in the morning? Orrrr it is just illusion food? I don't care, let Rayla have pancakes! Everyone loves pancakes. Pancakes will save the world. this message brought to you by the fact that I can't eat pancakes rn, send help

I love that Rayla is both sus of the pancakes and hungry, and that combines into a very motivated "I will get to the bottom of this" attitude. She kind of goes into Poirot Mode when she inserts herself into Soren and Ellis's conversation about Ava, explaining about the wolf's illusion leg and segueing into her claim that the pancakes taste sus. Claudia confirms she used dark magic, and Rayla is furious. It's different than the show's version in that it puts Rayla in detective mode, as the only Moonshadow elf in the scene, and boy does she take that role seriously. Also, she doesn't actually swallow the dark magic pancake bite. It ends up on the ground just like Lujanne's grubs from that earlier meal. These poor kids are so nutrient-starved. You guys gotta eat!!

Rayla's determination and prejudices and the fact that she super knows Harrow is dead all dovetail to make her try repeatedly to persuade Callum that Soren and Claudia are Not To Be Trusted. It's nice that the book keeps taking the time to point out that Rayla is Well Intentioned But Flawed, just like Callum and pretty much every other character in the show. No one is Right All The Time, no one Knows More Than Everyone Else.

Callum loving the sound of Claudia's unique voice is so wholesome. When you like someone, it only makes sense that you like all the things about them that they can't change - like the sound of Claudia's voice. Her choices with dark magic, not so much!

Claudia seems to have the same concerns Soren does about Callum's relationship with Rayla, but she comes out and asks him. The inherent possession implied in "your elf" is interesting, though. Elves are not people to Claudia. They're enemies who can be disassembled for the magic inside them. So maybe more like robots than living beings, if she knew what a robot was. Maybe she heard Soren's "Moonshadow Madness" story and realized he totally missed the kissing implications - but she didn't, and now she's genuinely worried that Rayla could kiss Callum under a full moon and enchant him to do her will. Good thing it's only a half moon, then!

Okay, Callum nervously making a puppet hand and then not knowing what to do with his hands and freaking out about itching and moving and pointy elbows is such a ND mood. The sudden stress of knowing that someone else is noticing your existence and maybe you're Not Existing Right, amirite? Ugh, poor Callum.

The Moon Temple! Omg it's so pretty in the description! Made to be beautiful and useful, full of knowledge but also allowing light and life inside (butterflies and vines). Lujanne, when can I move in, please? Also, it's all the more angsty because Lujanne is the only one who gets to see this beautiful place, but it has lots of chairs and shelves and tables, and it was meant to be used by lots of people. :(((

Claudia knows some of the runes on the walls. She isn't in a hurry to copy the rest of them down or anything, either. Her spellwriting is very precise, and she's a skilled mage. Her father would have made sure she was aware of the dangers of drawing sloppy runes, as much as he made her aware of the dangers of doing dark magic wrong. And the whole point of dark magic is that it's easier to learn than primal magic. Claudia supports her dad and their shared knowledge and life path. She's not gonna go nuts over an elf library she can't translate.

Side note: Between Claudia knowing some Moon runes and Viren building a secret passageway and a dungeon and lighting it with the same blue crystals that Lujanne and Ethari use for light--and Claudia exclaiming that she loves ruins--I wonder once more if there are really Moonshadow ruins somewhere in Katolis, which Viren has found and looted. Father-daughter relic hunting trip, maybe while Soren is away at camp? Omgsh that would be so wild!

Callum out here having a Viren moment with his "I feel powerless unless I've got magic that lets me help" vibes. God. I love their complicated mirroring. One of the hard differences between them is that Callum is very sure dark magic is bad because you have to kill stuff and take its power to cast spells, and he doesn't want to be a person who kills and takes like that. The line he walks to be nice to Claudia on their tour of the Cursed Caldera because he likes her, while telling her that he doesn't want to do her magic, like, ever, is so fine that it might as well be a shifting shadow on the ground. It's a very fitting conversation to be having during the half moon, with its tricks and little white lies.

Callum being out of the castle and his comfort zone, having to deal with the fact that the Claudia he loves is not quite the Claudia who's chasing him down across the kingdom, but of the two of them, he's the only one with a problem with this.

They say that if you really want to get to know someone, you should spend time with them outside their comfort zone - in heavy traffic, with a small baby, taking care of a new pet, trying a new skill, following unfamiliar directions, etc. While the castle is familiar territory for them both, Callum's never really found his comfort zone yet, while Claudia is pretty comfortable with her growing skill set. The creepy part starts to kick in when Callum begins to realize that Claudia's comfort zone encompasses a whole bunch of stuff that seems like it should make her uncomfortable... but it doesn't. But that'll be for a future chapter!

[punkscowardschampions]

Janis & Jimmy

Janis: I know we said no more plans Janis: but hear me out Jimmy: Go on Janis: I'm sick of my fam being on my back Janis: and they've only ramped it up since the whole joyride, which didn't even happen so Janis: 💡 Jimmy: What? Janis: It's a bit weird but reckon you can handle it, it won't take much Janis: 'cos obvs they think you're so 😎 you've just gotta come and be 😇 at 'em for a sec so they calm down Janis: like I said, their concern does not ever last long but I can't hack this bullshit, my sister's at it now as well Jimmy: I ain't going to church but if it ain't that Janis: Church nan ain't white nan, you're fine Janis: unless you hit her up too Jimmy: Is she as fit as your white nan 'cause then I might do Janis: questions like this are why you're in the bad books Jimmy: I weren't planning to bend her over a pew, you're alright Jimmy: I can fake  😇 Janis: Can you not be so disgusting please Janis: heavy dose of the good 📔 asap Jimmy: You gonna give me a smack with it? Janis: You'd obvs like it so no Janis: focus, boy Jimmy: 💔 Jimmy: So business like today, you Jimmy: there an actual plan then or what? Janis: Um yes Janis: got your listening 👂s on now? Jimmy: crack on and we'll see Janis: not rocket science, like Janis: just got to come over and not sneak in, actually acknowledge my parents exist for once Janis: no fucker else is here, even Gracie is gone so I'll want to die slightly less Jimmy: I'll bring my homework, ain't started owt yet & there's a art project that you're the perfect muse for Janis: Good thinking Janis: you know, be yourself, they ain't thick but show them that there's definitely no 💀pact going on here Janis: just 🤓💕 Jimmy: I get it, no using our blood as paint Jimmy: 👍 Janis: 💔 Janis: no one more than me, trust Jimmy: I'll 💀💀💀 you first chance I get baby Janis: 🤤🤤🤤 Janis: just get through dinner Janis: what do you like, anyway Jimmy: When? Janis: oh, tonight Janis: if you can? Jimmy: I don't have any white robes, like Jimmy: What else do 😇 wear? Janis: as discussed, burning cross is fine Janis: not to wear just to show your true colours, whitey Janis: 🤔 idk Jimmy: You have to kill me yourself, Jules, the death pact ain't between me, your dad and his shotgun Janis: Not likely Janis: total hippie pacifist loser Janis: gives you an idea of the dresscode but I won't be able to pretend I'm 😍 Janis: can only act so much Jimmy: So 😎 but in yellow or some shit? Jimmy: 👌 Janis: maybe you should ask Mia Janis: queen of fashion Jimmy: Hang on then Janis: 😏 Jimmy: She's typing Janis: edge of my seat Janis: she's so witty Jimmy: #same Jimmy: 👀🍿 Janis: 😂 Janis: must be buzzing Janis: not getting any #content from gracie rn Jimmy: I'm gonna need you to skim read this back to me, I don't do essays in the hols Janis: so chatty, her Janis: RBF would never give it away Jimmy: [sends whatever the hell Mia has] Jimmy: what colour is the new black? Janis: awh, she misses us too Janis: very helpful, basically, ditch the 😎 and your usual is fine Jimmy: 👍 Janis: you actually alright with this, yeah Jimmy: Do you want me to kick off to prove I'm obvs still 😎 and you're alright to still fancy me? Janis: shut up Janis: it's just idk Janis: bit serious Janis: but they will not leave me alone it's ridiculous Jimmy: Don't ask them if I can 💍 you ✔ Jimmy: or 💀💀💀 you ✔✔ Janis: about the gist Janis: dickhead Janis: don't need to like you that much Janis: then you'll never escape 'em either Jimmy: It's nowt I can't handle Jimmy: have had a girlfriend before, like Jimmy: she had parents an' all, even with the northern life expectancy at about 51 Janis: I'm sure they were normal people though Janis: #normalfornorthern Jimmy: 😂 Jimmy: Yeah I were just begging them to take me in Jimmy: thing were she was begging her dad's best mate to take her out Janis: 😬 Janis: would've made mealtimes a bit awks Jimmy: It did do when they were playing footsie under the table Jimmy: but he's got them well and truly under now so it all came right in the end Janis: Gross Janis: we've got a similar story but defs one to avoid Janis: touchy subject, literally Jimmy: 🤐 about that on the night, gotcha girl Janis: 👍 Janis: weren't me though, 'fore you ask Jimmy: weren't about to Jimmy: there's some shit I'm better off not knowing, I reckon Janis: not very #goals Janis: meant to be dying to know everything about me Jimmy: then I'd have to return the favour Jimmy: you're alright Janis: my thoughts exactly Jimmy: 💕 Janis: can get back to whatever shit you were up to then Jimmy: ☕🎨 Janis: wouldn't have been impressive if I'd guessed then Janis: good to know Jimmy: least you've got a clue Jimmy: they've got me teaching the new lass Jimmy: 🙄 Janis: trusts you again, at least Janis: gutted though Jimmy: no other dickhead'll do it Jimmy: she nearly melted Pete's beautiful face off Janis: 😱 Janis: why weren't she sacked on the spot Janis: can't be risking their best asset like that Jimmy: She's the manager's goddaughter or some bollocks Janis: shameless nepotism and all Janis: scandal Jimmy: You were right though, no doubt he's my #ultimatewingman Jimmy: me and her, all this steam Janis: nothing as romantic as minor scalds Janis: 🙄 Jimmy: when you've seen a lass' milk frothing technique Janis: mhmm Janis: when that technique leaves half the staff needed to raid the first aid box Jimmy: #livingdangerously Jimmy: 😎🚬 Janis: you're so dumb Jimmy: 💔 ow Jimmy: worst burn of all that were Janis: Not my finest I'm aware but not on the clock Jimmy: what are you doing then, rich girl? Jimmy: if it ain't making fancy food for tonight, I'll be well offended Janis: and take away the only use my father has? Janis: I would never Janis: doing fuck all, if it suits your #poorlittlerichgirl narrative Jimmy: So come here Jimmy: Don't have to be 😇 at the CG Janis: you're busy Jimmy: I'm 💀💀💀 Janis: you're 🎓 Jimmy: Do you want me to survive til tonight or not? Janis: I mean if you died in a tragic steam related accident, they'll just be trying to comfort me so yeah Janis: probs Jimmy: Alright, dickhead Jimmy: I'll let her ⚰👻 me Jimmy: You only had the one job for fuck's sake Jimmy: 👋😘 Janis: Don't be a twat Janis: let her do it and you'll end up a 🥕 Jimmy: What? can't 👂 you being a twat over the sound of my 😱😱😱 Jimmy: it ain't quite death throes but she's getting somewhere Janis: go die quietly Janis: we ain't friends no more and I won't miss you Jimmy: with all them 🎻🎻 playing, how can I? Janis: seriously Jimmy: It's their livelihood this orchestra, the lads take it well seriously Janis: such a windup Jimmy: you Janis: how am I Janis: 🃏 Jimmy: soz, can't come to the phone 'cause I'm 💀💀💀 Jimmy: I'll miss you even though you don't me Janis: stop being so basic and I might Jimmy: bit rude Jimmy: I'm in work and that's my job description near enough in full Janis: and they all 💕 it Jimmy: You jealous? Janis: why would I be Jimmy: that ain't an answer Janis: you're one to talk, boy Jimmy: Why am I? Janis: 'cos you always do that Jimmy: what are you on about, Jennifer? Janis: 🙄 Janis: you, div Janis: always answer questions with a question Jimmy: Bollocks Janis: Er yeah you do Janis: not gonna make it up Jimmy: I answer loads of questions Janis: yeah Janis: sure, I don't ask you loads so Jimmy: 🙄 Janis: ugh Janis: be nice Jimmy: you Janis: I am Janis: you're trying to make me jealous for some reason Jimmy: Why would I do that? Janis: You tell me Jimmy: you tell me, you're the one who reckons I'm doing it Janis: you're the one that keeps chatting about the new girl Jimmy: I ain't said nowt about her Janis: if you hadn't, I wouldn't know she existed Jimmy: if you don't wanna know what I'm up to, say that Janis: you can tell me without taking the piss Jimmy: No I can't, she's that shit Janis: Bummer Jimmy: Are you gonna stop being a dickhead now or what? Janis: Probably not Janis: genetic Janis: and I've got a lifelong streak going so Jimmy: 👍 Jimmy: in a bit then Janis: that's rude Janis: don't act like you didn't know Jimmy: had my 🤞 you were faking it, like Jimmy: 💔 Janis: too bad Jimmy: 🎻🎻 Janis: bye Janis: arsehole Jimmy: now that's rude Janis: I got the hint Janis: no need for pleasantries Jimmy: 🥇🧠 you Jimmy: grabbing hints I ain't even putting about Jimmy: no need for you to be in a right mard more like Janis: you've been pretty clear Janis: even without answering questions Janis: forget it,  like Jimmy: clear about what? that I wanna see you, yeah Jimmy: I get that your parents are on your case but I ain't done nowt but said I'll help Janis: no Janis: never mind Janis: I need to get out of this house Jimmy: So come here Jimmy: like I said Janis: I'm clearly in a bad mood, like you said Jimmy: and what? Janis: you don't need that Jimmy: Bollocks Jimmy: I always need you Janis: say it again Jimmy: I need you all the fucking time, alright? Janis: yeah Janis: definitely alright Janis: more than Jimmy: then just Janis: I am Jimmy: Are you? Jimmy: 'cause I Janis: the bus ain't here but yeah Janis: I really wanna see you Janis: know it ain't been any time really but Jimmy: You need to move in with your fit nan, girl Jimmy: living in the middle of nowt ain't working Jimmy: I'll go have a word Janis: you did not hit it off as well as you're reckoning, babe Janis: soz Jimmy: actually 💔 Jimmy: no salt needed for this caramel with all them 😭 of mine Janis: 😏 Janis: know how you feel Janis: being the favourite had its perks, namely that spare room Janis: no more Jimmy: I don't how that feels but being no fuckers fave has its perks an' all Jimmy: namely I don't give a damn if Ian don't want you in my room Janis: come on, you're definitely the boy's fave Janis: not like its Ian Jimmy: It's Grace Jimmy: he's too young to know better obvs Janis: how she likes 'em Janis: where she is atm, so my other sister can swan about being the ultimate rich girl Jimmy: You're gonna have to stay, if only to win our kid round Jimmy: I just ain't having it Janis: tryna pit me against her ain't the best idea to get me to do anything, FYI Janis: but luckily I wanna anyway Jimmy: I ain't saying that, I'm saying do it for me Jimmy: and I'll do owt for you Janis: a lot to promise Jimmy: only if you're asking for a lot off me Janis: d'ya trust me then Jimmy: Should I? Janis: I don't know Janis: probably not, track record would say Jimmy: There a but coming? Janis: I want you to Jimmy: There you are then Janis: I will try Janis: no promises though Jimmy: no need for any Jimmy: got my own track record, going round in my head, talking shit Janis: yeah Janis: s'alright Janis: just promise to 💔 in an interesting, inventive way at least Janis: and I won't cheat on you Jimmy: you'll be a 🥇 muse til the end Jimmy: make it easy that Janis: you're welcome Jimmy: 💕 Janis: won't let on I ain't got a 🖤 to break Jimmy: you mean you can't 'cause it'd be fake Janis: you reckon Jimmy: I've 👂 it in there, babe Janis: must've been your own Janis: long since 💀👑 remember Jimmy: Yours is faster Jimmy: such an athlete you Janis: alright Janis: since you've been cute about it Jimmy: You feeling alright? Janis: ha ha Janis: I can relent, tah Jimmy: I was expecting a challenge Jimmy: ready to take my pulse an' all there I were Janis: anything but actual work with you Jimmy: 😏 Janis: didn't admit it was fast 'cos of you or anything so I still win Jimmy: you didn't deny it were Jimmy: go on Janis: not the point Janis: shh Jimmy: say it then Janis: why Jimmy: you reckon it's true, why not? Janis: because 😳 Janis: is why Jimmy: You're so Jimmy: when you 😳 Janis: are you taking the piss Janis: it's your fault so Jimmy: I'm not Janis: good Janis: don't, like Janis: 'cos I Jimmy: I'm not, like Jimmy: you're just really Jimmy: it Jimmy: 💀💀💀s me Janis: I just want you Janis: a lot Jimmy: it's alright Janis: I'm glad 😏 Jimmy: be 💔 if you weren't Janis: trying to tell you how much I am here Jimmy: go on Janis: I'm no poet Janis: or 🔥 sext writer Janis: but I think about you too much Janis: and I'd rather be with you than doing fuck all else Jimmy: What do you think? Janis: about you? Jimmy: Yeah Janis: Just like Janis: everything Janis: the way you look and sound Janis: when I touch you Janis: how you feel Janis: how it feels when you touch me Jimmy: It feels different with you too Jimmy: than I thought it would Jimmy: and it's been before Jimmy: I get it Janis: yeah Janis: a bit Jimmy: 🤏 Janis: it's different Jimmy: I don't wanna call you a ❄ right now Jimmy: but you are different Jimmy: you make me feel Janis: I ain't ever before Janis: felt, like Jimmy: no 🖤 you, I heard Janis: No I mean Janis: idk Jimmy: go on, I'll still get my head through the door when you get here Jimmy: promise Janis: I ain't had a boyfriend 'cos it was just Janis: nothing Janis: guess they were all just shit, yeah Jimmy: Getting with people you ain't seeing again is a bit Jimmy: the chemistry's there or it ain't Jimmy: you don't really have chance to say owt unless you're the dickhead giving out ratings after Janis: doubt it would've phased him Janis: head bigger than yours Jimmy: that's your type then Janis: shut up Janis: I ain't got a type Jimmy: You just gave yourself away there, girl Janis: I reckon it's a series of unfortunate events Janis: actually Jimmy: 💔🎻💔 Janis: ugh Jimmy: that were for me not you Jimmy: 🥇 boyfriend and still 😭😭 Jimmy: can't win with you Janis: you do Janis: that's the whole point Jimmy: beat out knobhead with a bigger head 🏆💪 Jimmy: get it engraved on the 🏆 Janis: go on then Janis: add the time you gave him mad evils Jimmy: Hang on Jimmy: I've had the pleasure an' all Janis: mhmm Janis: lucky you Jimmy: nowt's coming to mind Jimmy: his head ain't that big after all 💔 for you Janis: you were probably wasted Jimmy: Alright, pisshead, now I know you're taking the piss Janis: wanna admit you weren't Jimmy: you've seen me wasted once, there were scotch and buses involved Jimmy: only the one bellend and I'm related to him Jimmy: OMG is Ian your ex 😱😱😱 Janis: 😂 Janis: yeah Janis: you guessed it, very bitter about it Jimmy: that explains feeling nowt Jimmy: he can't get it up, why he's fuming all the time Janis: that explains that too Janis: sadly not how I remember it so Janis: insulting you'd suggest such a thing Jimmy: keep them memories to yourself, tah Janis: rude Janis: you talk about your ex Jimmy: she's a mum but she ain't yours Janis: pst Janis: it ain't actually Ian Jimmy: sounds like what you'd say if it were, that Jimmy: and no need to list every lad on the back of my 🏆 like Janis: fuck off Jimmy: bit rude Janis: rude you're calling me a slag Jimmy: never said that Jimmy: you said they were all shit Jimmy: that's more than the one you reckon I've met Janis: only the one in brazil Janis: very unlikely you've bumped into him Jimmy: #plottwist Janis: 😱 Jimmy: I'm just trying to say Jimmy: whatever you did before I got here or before we were a real #goals couple Jimmy: you don't need to tell me Jimmy: I'm not gonna make it weird Janis: just say you don't want to Janis: it's fine Jimmy: that's not Janis: Whatever Jimmy: Shut up, no Jimmy: I haven't done owt Janis: then drop it Jimmy: stop fighting with me Jimmy: I like you so much Jimmy: that's all I were trying to get at Janis: well I was just trying to Janis: it don't matter Janis: it's alright Jimmy: I'm sorry, I'll shut up Janis: you don't have to be sorry Jimmy: 🤐 me Janis: but I wanna talk to you Janis: know I'm shit at it Jimmy: I'm the one who keeps putting my foot in it today Janis: nah Janis: you're good Janis: at all of it Jimmy: Bollocks, I'm crap Janis: no you ain't Janis: I'm the one who don't get it Jimmy: what? Janis: 🖤 remember Jimmy: yeah but that was before Jimmy: mine weren't 💕 and 🌹 either Jimmy: we're in this together Janis: I Janis: I'm trying Jimmy: 🥇 you Jimmy: I mean it Janis: tah Jimmy: 💕 Jimmy: we can just Janis: yeah? Jimmy: it's alright with me Jimmy: more than Jimmy: how things are going Janis: good Janis: just tell me Janis: I feel like Janis: starting shit fake just makes it even more confusing Jimmy: Not a top 💡 Jimmy: I get it, alright Jimmy: I weren't expecting owt like this to come from it Jimmy: I weren't gonna let it Janis: yeah, obviously, like Janis: not as if I'm saying you knew from the off or anything Janis: or like if you had just sent me an unsolicited dick pic or something then this would all be so easy Jimmy: obvs that would have worked an' all Jimmy: been ages for me, chatting lasses up though Janis: I get it Janis: when you look like that you don't need to Jimmy: 1. 😳 Jimmy: 2. I didn't wanna Janis: you had other shit Janis: not the be all end all Jimmy: feeling nowt ❌ for me Jimmy: weren't gonna happen Jimmy: unless I 👻⚰ Janis: being dead makes everything easier Jimmy: that's where I fucked up most Jimmy: just makes you fitter and more mysterious Jimmy: don't need to tell you 🧛 girl Janis: you're too nice Janis: have to really commit to being a dead cunt, like Jimmy: 😂 Janis: 💀 serious Janis: even gracie can see it Jimmy: that I'm too nice or that you ain't? Janis: both but latter goes without saying Jimmy: that's what I were thinking Jimmy: but the former is only for tips Janis: alright Jimmy: at least fake believe me, Joanne Janis: not what a cunt would do Jimmy: you're not a cunt to me Jimmy: only a massive dickhead Janis: give me time Jimmy: not for that Janis: 💕 Janis: like I said, I'm trying Jimmy: if you weren't, I wouldn't be Jimmy: like I said, it's never felt like Jimmy: I've not Janis: just like the first time yeah Jimmy: no Jimmy: thank fuck Janis: was your ex your first gf Jimmy: and only Jimmy: til now Janis: really Jimmy: you're surprised? Janis: I'd have guessed at least a couple Jimmy: we were together ages Jimmy: not actually in my 40s Janis: makes sense Jimmy: did at the time, she was a mate first Jimmy: about for everything Jimmy: I didn't have to explain how much of a headcase my dad were Jimmy: or that my mum Janis: s'nice Janis: easy Janis: my idea of hell for me but there's logic to it Jimmy: It weren't though Jimmy: she might've been nice and easy but not to me Jimmy: every other lad in the north Janis: why'd you stay with her for ages then Jimmy: Does it matter? Janis: maybe Jimmy: Why? Janis: 'cos if you're just a glutton for punishment then I should probably go Jimmy: Do you wanna go? Janis: no Janis: but I should if you're just trying to get hurt Jimmy: might've been then Jimmy: that's not this Janis: okay Jimmy: we were just doing what we saw our parents do Jimmy: like maybe if we could make it work it meant they just weren't giving it a decent enough go Jimmy: then I could turn around to them and say crack on Jimmy: fuck it up differently tah Janis: you and everyone else Janis: only reason the species is still going Janis: got to be arrogant enough to reckon you can right all their wrongs Jimmy: I weren't gonna raise a kid she had with her dad's mate to prove owt though Jimmy: so that were the end of that Janis: done better than all the blokes in my fam then Jimmy: 🥇 me, my dear Janis: 🤡 them Jimmy: then my plan were to just crack on with any lasses who were up for it Jimmy: but turns out I weren't Jimmy: 🎻😭💔 Janis: you really couldn't fake it? Janis: taking your oscar back tbh Jimmy: if you don't know by now that I weren't faking nowt with you, take all your own 🏆🏆🏆🏆 back Janis: I Janis: I fucked with it all too Janis: which was annoying because you were such a dickhead Jimmy: Oi Jimmy: you're the dickhead Janis: you were though Janis: even if you've shown your true 😇 ways Jimmy: couldn't have you falling for me, Juliet Jimmy: with every other lass already 😍😍😍 Janis: oh please Janis: you were not concerned about that, mr big ego Jimmy: 😱 Janis: don't act like I gave you any indication I was that bitch Jimmy: you said you were into it, how do you reckon you weren't giving me them? Janis: into it don't = 😍 at you does it Jimmy: Alright 🤤 then Janis: 😏 Janis: didn't deny that idiot Jimmy: would if you could Janis: no I wouldn't Jimmy: just to be awkward you would Janis: 😒 Janis: you want awkward Janis: k Jimmy: I want you Jimmy: I can sort your mood out Janis: bold Jimmy: and true an' all Jimmy: Deny that Janis: just making more work for yourself rn Janis: shh Jimmy: I ain't scared of it, rich girl Jimmy: I'll show you Janis: don't be so Jimmy: what? Janis: everything Janis: distracting Jimmy: you Janis: it's all you Janis: I feel mental Jimmy: keep that between us Jimmy: challenge's been accepted, you gotta give me a chance to win your parents round Janis: all about the heroics of rescuing me Janis: I know Jimmy: Nah, fed up of lasses in distress, me Jimmy: have a go at helping me Jimmy: if and when you fancy it Janis: easy Jimmy: so 💪 you Janis: obvs Janis: and you're so damn helpable Jimmy: you're a bit nice Jimmy: I won't say owt to anyone though Janis: no one would believe you, baby Jimmy: I could prove it but I don't want you to stop Janis: you just Janis: deserve it Jimmy: that your plan now? Jimmy: 💀💀💀 without touching or looking at me Jimmy: just niceness Janis: ain't that the phrase Janis: still need to see you though don't take that from me Jimmy: I dunno can't think of owt else but you Jimmy: being here Janis: I'm not sorry Jimmy: might be when you hear how fast my 💓 is Janis: nah, saving you, remember Janis: you're safe with me, like Jimmy: yeah so shit at this you Jimmy: nowt close to the right words them Janis: I'm trying, you know that Janis: wanna have something right for once Jimmy: Baby Jimmy: you do loads right Janis: maybe Janis: plenty wrong too though Jimmy: sounds and feels fake to me, that Janis: I'm alright with you thinking it is Jimmy: get alright with how 🥇 you are Janis: be alright with how much I like you Jimmy: I am Janis: Good Janis: it'd be really hard to stop now so Jimmy: don't then Janis: tell me you don't want me to Jimmy: [voice memo cos extra and never does any work clearly] Janis: okay Janis: a bit 😍 Janis: maybe Jimmy: 🤏 Janis: that's what I'll tell this bus driver anyway Janis: 👀 to the front Jimmy: oh he wants to see something? hang on Jimmy: [😒 selfie] Jimmy: crack on, dickhead, my missus could walk here faster Janis: 😂 Janis: putting that as my phone background Jimmy: 💕 Jimmy: Give me a new one then Janis: [looking whatever kind of cute she would be tbh] Jimmy: Oi Janis: ? Janis: weren't flipping you off or anything Jimmy: where's my warning? Jimmy: I just dropped a flat white Janis: victimless crime Janis: drink it hard if you're gonna, people Janis: and if that's how you react to a 📸 better meet me outside Jimmy: it's alright, I blamed the new girl Jimmy: send me a video and we might get her the sack Janis: I'll get on it then Jimmy: 👍 Janis: hate her already Jimmy: me too Janis: nice save Jimmy: come on, babe Jimmy: don't like any dickhead but you Janis: 💕 Janis: but see how you excluded Pete and the 👴👵 by saying dickheads so Janis: 💔 Jimmy: I'm only human, soz Jimmy: reminds me though Jimmy: he's got #band drama Jimmy: if you really wanna be a hero 🎤 Janis: 😱 Janis: how's he gonna make it big at this rate Jimmy: with you as the voice and face #duh Janis: you wanna live that groupie fantasy and have the whole band or? Jimmy: 1. I'll be the 📷 Jimmy: 2. just you and him Jimmy: 3. I'll tell him you'll audition then Janis: 1. obvs Janis: 2. double obvs, can't all be the #face Janis: 3. lol no Jimmy: 4. 💔 Janis: you will be when he's 😬 at my voice Jimmy: don't call my bf stupid Jimmy: he knows 🤩🤩🤩 when he sees and hears it Janis: I would never Janis: love him too, thanks Jimmy: #loveyourself too then tah Janis: stop being a dork Jimmy: 😱 Janis: come on, I wanna talk about you, not me Jimmy: I'll 🤐 Janis: you can Janis: it's fun to make you loud Jimmy: how much longer are you gonna be stuck on the bus? Janis: too long Janis: I'm really Jimmy: tell me Janis: I'm just Janis: I need to be alone with you already Jimmy: you should've let me let the new girl melt my face off Jimmy: we could've been alone in the back of an ambulance Janis: famously not, don't let you just piss about back there Janis: and I can get us alone without involving any bimbos Janis: or ruining your beautiful face Jimmy: must give less of a shit up north 'cause I swear I have Jimmy: might've been more out of it than the memory suggests Janis: pisshead Jimmy: so sweet you Janis: soz Jimmy: I get it, it's hard for you being a lightweight Jimmy: especially when I'm so 💪🏆 Janis: far as I remember it, I've looked after you, not the other way 'round Jimmy: leave it out Janis: just saying Jimmy: that was one time Jimmy: and if you wanna get stuck into Ian's supply after a party I'll do it for you Janis: I can look after myself Janis: 💪🏆 Jimmy: me an' all Janis: 'course Jimmy: I can Janis: No, I know Janis: not taking the piss Jimmy: 👍 Janis: I didn't mean to Jimmy: forget about it Janis: but actually Jimmy: I said forget about it Janis: told you I'm shit don't let it ruin it Jimmy: It's not you, is it? Janis: what Jimmy: what that night turned into, me and him Jimmy: you weren't meant to be involved Janis: you don't have to explain that Janis: I really weren't trying to take the piss, I don't reckon it's funny Janis: but none of my business either Jimmy: yeah but that's just it, I do 'cause it weren't a one off Janis: your dad's a cunt Janis: I know that much Jimmy: to me 'cause I Jimmy: just to me like that Janis: I'm glad it's not the kids Janis: really glad Janis: but you know I'm not gonna like Janis: tell Janis: not that I want that for you or anything Janis: but I'm not stupid, I know that wouldn't help fuck all Jimmy: I'd never let him Jimmy: not to them Janis: I know Janis: you look after them really well Jimmy: I couldn't do nowt when it was my mum but she started as much shit as him Jimmy: they were both just Janis: Not what they should be Janis: or where Janis: yeah Jimmy: it kept getting worse Janis: 'then your mum left? Jimmy: it couldn't go on like that Jimmy: something had to change Jimmy: it did Janis: but instead of fixing it's just Janis: a different kind of fucked Jimmy: 'course Janis: That's shit Janis: you deserve not fucked up, not saying I can give you that or anything useful but for the record Jimmy: life is Janis: yeah Janis: got no evidence to the contrary Jimmy: you know when you're a kid and you hid under the blankets, that's still me Jimmy: 😎 or 📷 instead Janis: at least you stay put Janis: braver than running Janis: my speciality then and now Jimmy: 1. where am I gonna go? Back to my mum or my ex ain't options Jimmy: 2. Cass and Bobby need me where they are Janis: 1. anywhere they ain't Janis: 2. that's the problem Jimmy: There's no bravery in nowt I do Jimmy: at least you're doing something Janis: I'd be doing something if I stayed gone Jimmy: Why haven't you? Janis: It's harder than you'd think Janis: There's some things you gotta do that I ain't ready to yet, I guess Janis: it's like killing yourself, yeah Janis: everyone reckons this shits the easy way out, but you blow your brains out or suck dick for a place to stay Janis: you know, just 'cos it's not brave don't mean it ain't hard to give into Jimmy: Yeah Janis: my sister did it Janis: properly Jimmy: she never came back? Janis: in the end Janis: at first she was the same though Janis: worse, she'd always be coming back just to see us and stuff, I don't do that, I just run out of places I can be too Jimmy: You can be with me Janis: You underestimate how little I can be with them Janis: thanks, still though Jimmy: You heard me Jimmy: You can stay Janis: you mean it, don't you Jimmy: I don't want you to leave Janis: I don't want you to either Janis: I don't mean here but Janis: me Jimmy: If I leave this town, I won't leave you Jimmy: he can only make me do the one Janis: Jimmy Janis: I'm glad I met you, even if it's because life is shit and Jimmy: I'm glad too, even if that's the only thing I've got to be glad for Jimmy: and it's closer to Easter Jimmy: and we ain't American Janis: alright shut up Janis: words are your thing, not mine Jimmy: they're a bit your thing Jimmy: I like talking to you Jimmy: and I work in retail so I don't like talking to anyone Janis: means a lot Janis: truly Jimmy: should do Jimmy: ask my ex, never communicate me Janis: that was the problem Janis: not the baby daddy drama Jimmy: she wouldn't have fucked him if I could string together a sentence, obvs Janis: he better be so daddy or what's she doing Janis: not that she asked me to judge her life and choices but here I am Jimmy: he's not Jimmy: but at least she never went for Ian Jimmy: as step mums go, not my top pick Janis: not as hot a concept as porn would have you believe, like Jimmy: he likes his missus a bit older, give him that Janis: got to have something going for him Janis: not enough but you know Jimmy: you'd fucking have to be legal drinking age for a date with him an' all Jimmy: imagine the #bants Jimmy: a few under the table snakebites ain't cutting through that Janis: 🤢 Janis: I refuse to think about a first date scenario altogether, nevermind an @iantaylor8 first date Jimmy: Fuck me, you've never done one Jimmy: right Jimmy: I'm taking you Jimmy: and we ain't leaving before every cliche is ✔ Janis: 😂 if only you'd known this when it was #sofakesoextra Jimmy: I know you better now Jimmy: you're gonna hate this, baby Janis: 🤤 Janis: that's what does it for me Jimmy: no 🤤 on the 1st date Janis: bit of 😋 then? Jimmy: we'll see Janis: playing it 😎 Janis: very apt Jimmy: can you do tomorrow? Janis: Why not Janis: if you're the perfect 😇 tonight Janis: free as a bird Jimmy: 👍 Jimmy: Alright, I'll pick you up at 8 Janis: is that all the info I get? Jimmy: from my own door 'cause you're staying Janis: that makes me Jimmy: 😱😱😱 WHAT ARE YOU GONNA WEAR THOUGH Jimmy: I don't have a date outfit for you here Jimmy: oh no Janis: 🤞 Grace has gone 👻 'cos that was frightening Jimmy: where does your sister live? might need Grace's suitcase Janis: don't take the piss Jimmy: this is serious omg Janis: if you don't stop Jimmy: BABE Jimmy: how are you not freaking out? Jimmy: it's our 1st date Janis: I hate you Janis: #triggering me Jimmy: I'm soz Janis: felt that Janis: 🖕 Jimmy: baby, I'm so sorry Janis: well you should hide 'cos finally off that fucking bus Jimmy: You said I'm safe with you Jimmy: can't make me unsafe now Janis: let's see if I can stay mad at you, boy Jimmy: Challenge accepted, girl Janis: don't bring your new mate Jimmy: who? Janis: 👍 Jimmy: 😘 Janis: [comes at him] Jimmy: [outside or inside?] Janis: [a point lmao, let you decide where he is, she ain't gonna have much chill either way] Jimmy: [lets say he was waiting outside so he don't get sacked cos likewise] Janis: [let 'em have a moment] Jimmy: [a really extra moment cos emotions are running high] Janis: [truly, so much revealed] Jimmy: [it makes me die, what's it been days? weeks? boy ain't gonna have no secrets left] Janis: [when you just wanna talk] Jimmy: [she ain't the samaritans calm down please] Janis: [we know she wanna too it fine] Jimmy: [oooh can we say his shift is over so they can go shopping for date clothes and be cute nerds] Janis: [um yes] Jimmy: [yaaas just imagine she's expecting him to go back in and he does but to get his jacket like surprise] Janis: [so confusion but then #onboard for the #bants of it all] Jimmy: [not even telling her where they are going just like follow me lol don't get lost bab but then it's obvs] Janis: [when you get to just have fun for once, also changing room shenanigans are always the one] Janis: [and can actually get a 🔥 lewk] Jimmy: [literally if you don't get kicked out of at least one changing room for saucy behaviour and another shop for a playfight who are you tbh] Janis: [truly, remember you got a date with her 'rents tonight though, gotta try on some 'good boy' clothes (but ain't no one tryna make you buy them fr)] Jimmy: [just do it for the lols boy] Janis: [get on the bus to hell lads] Jimmy: [see how many old ladies you can offend] Janis: [heheheh gotta try and get it out of your system if you've gotta be good, obvs] Jimmy: [there's your excuse not that you need one] Janis: [truly, we all know you're doing the bare minimum later lol] Jimmy: [she should teach him more signing though cos cute] Janis: [a parent pleaser for sure, should also take a selfie with cali 'cos loling imagining it and then the relevant peeps, grace and mia tbh, can see] Jimmy: [omg yes mia would be fuming cos cali ain't here for her bye] Janis: [said as if she's graces' gf and they're being shady lmao] Jimmy: [thank god we didn't go that far] Janis: [no one needs that in their life] Jimmy: [especially Grace, I'm mean enough] Jimmy: [there should be a bus photoshoot cos he'd have his camera for homework and imagine how annoying] Janis: [big tut energy] Jimmy: [exactly then you can make out til they tut themselves to death] Janis: [soz you're bitter and can't remember being young and in love ladies] Jimmy: [one of them should say something judgey in irish cos always a thing that they think young peeps don't speak it] Janis: [when you usually pretend you can't speak it but you can and you say something sassy back] Jimmy: ? Janis: she's just asking for your number Janis: but I told her to back off soz Jimmy: 💔 Jimmy: but lipstick on dentures is my top turn on Jimmy: fuck's sake babe Janis: you can 🤞 she's on the bus back 'cos won't be joining you with that attitude Jimmy: [😏] Jimmy: if you loved me you'd accommodate my kinks Jimmy: and ask to borrow her 💄 Janis: [turns away from him dramatically, but does actually ask, let us assume the lady is a moody hoe and is like no bitch though] Jimmy: [gives her a look like well? even though he knows the answer] Janis: [shrugs] Janis: your girlfriends a real bitch Jimmy: I am seducing someone else right in front of her Jimmy: what kind of dickhead Janis: then she's no third if she's gonna get all jealous Janis: have to stick with Pete Janis: what a shame, bye Doris Jimmy: 💔👵🎻👋 Janis: if you loved me you'd text him Jimmy: [does] Jimmy: you've got an audition next week Jimmy: 👍 Janis: [just looking at him like bitch you better not lmao] Jimmy: [shows her the text loling cos obvs he has not it'd just be a work question or whatever] Janis: [shoves him but is too loling] Janis: he's the one auditioning tah Janis: don't put it like that though, don't sound very nice Jimmy: [when you're 😏 but inside you're 😒] Janis: [just laying your head on his shoulder 'cos truly the longest bus ride] Jimmy: [playing with her hair as per because can never stop yourself] Janis: soz Jimmy: why? Janis: making you do this Janis: defs an IOU Jimmy: [shrugs and snuggles her more] Janis: you'll get it when it's happening Janis: [shrugs back] Jimmy: gotta start my homework some time Janis: what you gotta do Jimmy: 📷 and 🎨 you Janis: your teacher is gonna be sick of my face Jimmy: needs to give us less bollocks prompts then Jimmy: you're what interests me Janis: 😏 Janis: [but really 😳] Jimmy: and what's more significant than an IRL Romeo and Juliet obvs Jimmy: she should give me more marks for the nod to english coursework Janis: sure she will Jimmy: [another shrug but wrapping his arms around her then] Janis: ['you're good' in his ear from the snug] Jimmy: [when you're too white to 😳 and it not be obvs so you have to kiss her for distraction like close your eyes rn thanks] Janis: [not gonna say no, avert your gaze bus grandmas] Jimmy: [also stop the ILY curse for a bit so] Janis: [least they'll only take up one seat now instead of two 'cos defs getting on his lap, welcome everyone lol] Jimmy: [imagine taking that seat though oh hey] Janis: [just like 'scuse me thirdwheeling these teens] Jimmy: [it's a bad idea on many levels not least how turned on they are gonna be by the time they get to cali's but that's why I won't stop them lol] Janis: [have fun dealing with that or not] Jimmy: [mhmm] Janis: ['maybe we just stay on the bus'] Jimmy: [we all know whatever he wants to say it's just gonna be a shameless sound like always] Janis: [😏 'not a no' and kissing him harder like she cares about being quiet sure] Jimmy: [being extra as if to say do you want me to say no I don't think so] Janis: [just smiling into that kiss] Jimmy: [pausing to breathe and 😍 at her casually] Janis: [covering his eyes with her hands like don't look at me like that] Jimmy: [just loling] Janis: [pouting and hiding on his chest] Jimmy: [pouty lip kiss thing strikes again] Janis: stop being cute Jimmy: ['you' saying it out loud for the eye contact] Janis: [makes a noise 'cos don't know what else to do #overwhelmed] Jimmy: [kissing her neck but really soft cos lovebites aren't 😇] Janis: ['you're really gonna-'] Jimmy: ['what?' in her ear when he's kissed his way there] Janis: [shakes her head like nope, can't talk now bye] Jimmy: [doing whatever he can to make her say something/make a sound obvs keep looking away bus peeps] Janis: [saying 'shit!' just a bit too loud for these nosy ladies] Jimmy: they're gonna smack you with a shopping bag Janis: and when I get arrested for granny bashing, it'll be entirely your fault Jimmy: 😇 me Janis: no Janis: definitely not Janis: I think you just broke like, 4 seperate laws Jimmy: only 4? 💔 Jimmy: how many more stops is it? Janis: not a challenge, babe Janis: [looking out the window like ?! then 😒] Jimmy: could be if you come here Janis: ['we've already missed our stop so' collecting all their shit like] Jimmy: ['we had better just stay on here then' but helping] Janis: [just bitching like why didn't the driver say, I get off at the same stop everyday etc etc] Jimmy: [probably keep your mouth shut boy especially about how she wanted him to mind his business when she was on her way to you] Janis: [getting off this bus in a disgrace/huff] Jimmy: [🚬 guys you won't have chance when you get there] Janis: [try not to die in all the ways] Jimmy: [I'm loling cos he's carrying a plant] Janis: [lmao oh the effort to get left alone so you can get into more trouble again god bless] Jimmy: [just doing smoke rings like pay attention to me] Janis: [such a grumpy face] Jimmy: [putting the plant down so he can pick her up for a sec like don't be sad] Janis: ['I don't even wanna go and now we're gonna be late'] Jimmy: ['fashionably though' because remember all those lewks they tried on good times] Janis: [🙄 'you're not helpful' and picking up the plant like let's ride] Jimmy: [pouty face but on you go] Janis: [just smoke 'til you calm down a bit, babe, showing she is by slowing her pace so she's not running off] Jimmy: [nobody wants to do this its fine, bet Cali aren't buzzing at the prospect rn either] Janis: [probably not if they think he's some crackhead who tells her to steal cars lmao rude leave ur judgment at the door] Jimmy: [exactly] Janis: 💕 Janis: soz Jimmy: [holds his hand out like hold it please] Janis: [does] Jimmy: [swings it as they are walking] Janis: [😏 but more 😍 than smug 'always in babysitter mode, you' and nudges him gently] Jimmy: ['keep that between us, tah' cos he's not tryna babysit Gus or Diego lol or any of the cats] Janis: [mimes 🤐 'none of us are little enough, you're safe'] Jimmy: [shrugs cos Cass isn't either but hey ho] Janis: ['more feral than the cats, like, you'd miss yours so fast'] Jimmy: ['might do the dog' hilarious Jimothy we all know you don't hate Twix] Janis: [shakes head 'you play so hard to get'] Jimmy: [gives her a LOOK 'but I don't have to, since we're already late' pulls her into him using their linked hands, don't squash the plant boy] Janis: [a LOOK right back but close up 'cos now you are 'not meant to be being cool, remember'] Jimmy: [just staring at her really saucily like well then you'll have to do it for me] Janis: [looking at his lips like #distracted 'can't kick the habit, like'] Jimmy: [#same on both counts 'me either' just leaning in so much without actually kissing her] Janis: [making a noise of frustration like come on 'we could always be more fashionable'] Jimmy: [looking her up and down 'you couldn't be more... and back up to her face 'you're so...'] Janis: [taking his hands and putting 'em where he was looking] Jimmy: [finally kissing her so intensely because you're the most alone you've been all day] Janis: [make the most of how middle of nowhere it is for once] Jimmy: [a mood and a moment] Janis: [breaking off sporadically to tell him how hot he is, how much you want him etc etc, everything but ILY] Jimmy: [we all know we aren't getting actual words out of him rn except her name sometimes so pop off sis] Janis: [oh you two] Jimmy: [what a day and you're not even there yet] Janis: [lmao, thank god you're just going over for dinner, not like out out 'cos you're getting later by the minute here] Jimmy: [not to mention what you're gonna end up looking like after this] Janis: [her hair always be looking wild 'cos of you boy, such a giveaway] Jimmy: [that scalding tea there boo] Janis: [how to stop you, always fun lololololololol] Jimmy: [lets be nice and not haha just be late af] Janis: [you saucy onion] Jimmy: [it's been a minute since the changing rooms and yolo] Janis: [only 15 once henny] Jimmy: [only felt like this once too so they deserve it] Janis: [the lurve is so real truly she does not know what to do] Jimmy: [god bless] Janis: [how did we do the ily last time] Jimmy: [basically she got drunk and said it cos it was when he challenged her to outdrink him but he didn't say it back then cos couldn't and she was like don't forget I said it though but then he said it as they were falling asleep that night] Janis: [we've done so much] Jimmy: [hence we did to decide if we're keeping any of it cos rn none of that's happened] Jimmy: [*need] Janis: [it's all still here at least we can mix and match whatever we wanna baby] Jimmy: [yep] Janis: [for now, finish ya business and get gone] Jimmy: [honestly hurry up] Janis: [that's not what she said] Jimmy: [oh boo you funny fish] Janis: [hheeheheh but get ready for the awks lads] Jimmy: [oh lord he doesn't know what he's getting into here] Janis: [when you hate your parents, being so fake nice tonight henny] Jimmy: [cali will be shook] Janis: 👍 Jimmy: you alright? Janis: take the compliment Janis: doing well Jimmy: 🥇 us Janis: just like old times Janis: all this acting Jimmy: just like old times Jimmy: you talking bollocks Janis: charming Janis: its called conversation Janis: my wit is sparkling Jimmy: is it? Janis: you x2 ing that or gonna specify Jimmy: you heard Jimmy: and that weren't an answer Janis: yes to both, obviously Janis: why are you being rude Janis: just 'cos you can't to them? Jimmy: I'm not Janis: doubting my wit is rude Janis: tah Jimmy: show me it then Janis: Jimothy! Janis: shocked AND appalled Jimmy: 😂 Jimmy: that's not the one, babe Jimmy: Jamie got closer Janis: Don't remind me Janis: miss him Jimmy: 💔 Jimmy: ouch Jimmy: after everything I did for you out there in the middle of nowt Janis: really Janis: you're gonna remind me of that right now Jimmy: you should miss me Janis: I can't miss you more than I already do Jimmy: challenge accepted, Juliet Janis: [looking at him over the table like what you gon' do] Janis: ? Jimmy: [eye contact ftw] Jimmy: 😇 me Jimmy: [but under the table he's being a 😈] Janis: I hate you so much Janis: [when you're suddenly so focused on your meal like nothing to see here] Jimmy: how much? Janis: [shifts down in her seat/closer to what he's doing like 'that much'] Jimmy: [goes harder because of course] Janis: You're so Jimmy: go on Jimmy: I'm what? Janis: you're really really Jimmy: [stops like tell me] Janis: [imagine the grumpy face, cali like ?] Janis: hey Jimmy: ? Janis: now I really don't like you Jimmy: [just eating like 😏] Janis: [footsie like pay attention to me] Jimmy: [a look because he can't resist and we know it] Janis: [going from 😒 to 😏] Jimmy: [when Cali are talking to you and you have to pretend you're listening, thank god for all that practice he's had at customer service Janis: [lmao that fake smile taking you so far rn] Jimmy: [also v proud of him for eating whatever the food is because lbr its not gonna be what he's used to] Janis: [right, she would've told caleb not to do anything weird af but still] Jimmy: [and he hasn't thrown anything at her which is his fave thing to do] Janis: [imagine] Janis: so Janis: what's your verdict Jimmy: needs 🍅 sauce, obvs Janis: 😂 Janis: meant my parents, but if you hate 'em, start there Janis: he'll 😢 Jimmy: they're alright Janis: 🤔 Jimmy: I dunno Jimmy: weird but I'm used to you, like Jimmy: weirdest girl about Janis: piss off Janis: nothing like either of 'em Jimmy: never said you were Janis: better not Jimmy: come on Jimmy: that northern, not that thick Janis: didn't say you were Janis: you just like being mean to me Jimmy: don't sound like me, that Janis: must be thinking of Jamie then Janis: which one are you again? Jimmy: I were gonna say we can still be mates then 💔 Jimmy: there's my answer Janis: ah Janis: my good pal Jim Janis: I remember Jimmy: 👍 Janis: [squeezing his hand] Jimmy: [draws a heart on her with his fingertip because he always used to do that and I've not] Janis: [when that makes you 😳 more than anything else] Jimmy: [writes 'you' in it cos close to ily as we can get rn] Janis: [when you have to excuse yourself for a hot sec] Jimmy: [when you're like oh shit shouldn't have done that cos you think you scared her away] Janis: won't leave you with them too long Janis: brb actually Jimmy: 👌 Janis: 💔 it'd be too 😈 and obvious for you to come find me rn Jimmy: I could fake choking to 💀💀💀 Jimmy: or 🤢🤢🤢 Janis: you're so committed to your role Janis: it's impressive Janis: but I want more time than that'd give us so Janis: [coming back don't be gone forever] Jimmy: [just staring at her shamelessly soz the in-laws] Janis: [sitting next to him instead of opposite 'cos an abudance of chairs to choose from deal lads] Jimmy: [kiss her cheek cos that's 😇] Janis: [is 😊 but whispers 'I miss you' whilst she's there] Jimmy: [tucking a strand of hair behind her ear like just being helpful and 😇 don't mind me] Janis: [so 😍 hurry this meal along tah bring out the dessert lol] Jimmy: [oh and does the thing where you pull the chair in to get her close to the table but also pulling her chair closer to his at the same time] Janis: [issa must, as close to sitting on him without actually] Jimmy: [and just like I'll casually leave my hand on your leg what a coincidence] Janis: [makes a 😋 noise like she's really enjoying this dessert but we all know] Jimmy: [is clock watching hardcore like when can we leave lol] Janis: [least you can just do the bare minimum here, hang in there kids] Jimmy: I miss you too Janis: you can show me Janis: when I'm showing you how grateful I am Jimmy: [just biting your lip like this is fine yep] Janis: [😏 then signing something at Diego who is presumably there chilling] Jimmy: ? Janis: [cue cali asking him about his art homework 'cos she was asking if they can use the space/his lights and shit] Janis: escape plan activated Jimmy: now I really like you Janis: show me that too Janis: not just a 🥇 muse tah Jimmy: or a 🥇 face Jimmy: 🧠🏆 you Janis: careful Janis: my head might not fit through the door Jimmy: I'll carry you through 👰 style Jimmy: about to ask if I can 💍 you obvs Janis: you don't reckon that's 😈 nah Janis: not the 40s up in here Jimmy: what can be more 😇 than the sanctity of them vows before god 🙏💕 Jimmy: when in 🍀 do as the paddys do Janis: you're really turning me off here Janis: 😏 Janis: god can watch but he don't need to get involved Jimmy: [does something to turn her on like am I though] Jimmy: found our 3rd then 🙌🎊 Janis: he was in our 💕 all along Janis: and please tell them we need to go now Jimmy: [does like oh we have to get started because we can't miss our bus home/get back too late etc] Janis: [does the thing where you make glasses with your fingers to 🤓 at him as they're walk/running out] Jimmy: [nudges her like oi] Janis: [kisses him so hard when they're barely out of sight like wait] Jimmy: [doing that walking but still kissing thing but kissing so hard that they just knock into a wall/door casually so obvs just gonna push her up against it and kiss for a bit] Janis: [lmao Pablo needs to walk past bye] Jimmy: [10000% yes] Jimmy: [wasn't even there for dinner but appears right then haha] Janis: [this fam comes and goes as they please no consideration lol] Jimmy: [true facts poor Caleb food is his love language Pablo how dare you] Janis: [also you're his chef child, probs out spending all your money doing who knows what] Jimmy: [those debts don't just appear overnight so yeah] Janis: [fun and games honey] Jimmy: [this fam 💔 me] Janis: [honestly, like way to prove everyone right guys] Jimmy: [fuming about it as if we didn't do this lol] Janis: [at least you two are enjoying yourself rn] Jimmy: [speaking of is there anything else we wanna do here?] Janis: [we probably know the vibe, see if we can find HW pics]

[rhysintherain]

Jumping right into episode 3 like an absolute fool:

Malta

Did you just start the episode trying to tell me archaeologists don't believe civilisations can be lost? Are you fucking kidding me? Lost civilisations are like the top recruiting tool for archaeology programs.

He's just such a smug little asshole...

His argument here seems to be that the agrarian societies on Gozo couldn't have built a megalithic structure out of huge, labor-intensive giant stones without building... What, a PRACTICE megalithic structure first? Therefore wasting all that stone and energy? Like they wouldn't have repurposed any building that didn't work out once they got the techniques down? You're probably standing in the practice, it probably got rebuilt over and over until it became what's there now.

"I certainly don't believe is ACTUAL giants" coward. All the fun quacks believe in actual giants.

It's entirely possible that Ggantija was built before the first evidence of people there. We can't rule that out. But we also can't prove it, and as long as we can't prove when it was built and when the earliest people were there, it doesn't matter one bit if it COULD be older. Nothing matters unless you can prove it.

His timeline for sea levels seems off. I think he's showing sea levels for the last glacial maximum (20ish KYA) but he's labelling it at 14 KYA?

The Malta neanderthal teeth were published, you can find that with an easy Google search. You can also find that there's no cultural evidence of Neanderthals on the islands. There's no reason a handful of Neanderthals couldn't have made it there, but there's no evidence they stuck around, either.

Is his "ancient civilisation" neanderthal? If not, why does it matter when there's no other evidence of them being there long-term?

Sea level, in any area, isn't stable. It doesn't rise continuously from the LGM to now. Even if his "cart ruts" are made by humans, they can't be dated and they could be much more recent and still be present underwater (see also: whole sections of sunken cities in Egypt. We know those aren't from the ice age, but they're still underwater today)

Mnajdra

You can give all the significance you want to ancient structures lined up to the sun, but you're forgetting we didn't have much in the way of artificial light back then. The best way to light your structure was to use the sun on significant dates to give the best light.

11 KYA is still not the LGM. Sorry Graham, you're about 9 thousand years off your own timeline.

I'm not going to reread Egyptian mythology to double check, but he seems to be confusing Osiris with a lot of the things actually attributed to other gods. Pretty sure agriculture was more Ra's thing? And writing was definitely Thoth. He's oversimplifying things to fit his narrative again.

Final thoughts:

The timeline is horribly off here. He's not even going by his own rules.

Pretty sure you can go anywhere in the world and find some temples pointing in random directions. If you checked them against every visible star in the sky you could probably even do the star timeline thing with them.

Once again, he's convinced ancient humans were underachieving losers who would need someone "advanced" to teach them to build nice things. It's kinda rude.

This is why I spent months reading truly agonising papers about the rise and fall of sea levels, isostatic depression and uplift, century by century sea level measurements, and analysis of lake core sediments. He clearly didn't, or he'd know it's not a straight -line gradient.

If there was any evidence of the civilisation he's talking about we would be all over it. We throw parties when a new human species is found. We tell all our friends when the earliest dates for humans in the Americas get pushed back. We love this shit. We also went to school to interpret this sort of evidence, and know what counts as reliable. Trust me, if this stuff was real, we would never shut up about it.

Okay, y'all know I can't resist a hack having a go at archaeology.

So I'm gonna watch Ancient Apocalypse so I'm prepared to rant about everything that's wrong with it when somebody inevitably tries to talk to me about it.

So here we go.

What's wrong with Ancient Apocalypse, episode by episode:

Episode 1

Gunung Padang

7200 year-old cultural layer is 4 meters doen, but the basalt column architecture is on the surface.

These are not the same culture! The more recent (2300 ish BP) culture built the basalt structures on top of the older settlement.

This guy is intentionally misrepresenting the nature of the site and ignoring the first rule of archaeology.

At the lowest levels they tested they're not even proving people lived there, just that they could carbon date a hill.

Chances are, this was a hill, people lived on it for several thousand years, and in the last 2-3 thousand they built it up into the structure we can now see the ruins of.

It's a cool site, but not disproving the archaeological record. If people 7200+ years ago built the structures, why are they on the surface while the cultural layer for these people is 4 meters down? That's not how stratigraphy works.

Nan Madol

Very different architecture than Gunung Padang. They stacked basalt columns like Lincoln logs while Gunung Padang stacked them all in the same direction.

The underwater footage here is laughably bad. Are those even structures? They're much narrower than the ones on land.

Those pillars could be natural, there's no way to tell without scraping some of the muck off and taking a closer look.

Even if they are constructed, they could have been used for breakwaters or piers. There's no proof whatsoever that these were built on land and then submerged.

Nobody is claiming that flood myths can't be remembered stories from the ice age. That isn't something archaeologists reject.

The real question is why he thinks they needed to have a vast, advanced civilisation to remember stories, when we've demonstrated again and again that stories hold a huge amount of cultural and historical memory.

And some final thoughts:

He doesn't seem to think humans are capable of very much? Why is "advanced civilisation" required for humans to have constructed megalithic sites or tell stories?

The research at Gunung Padang is extremely controversial. In a quick google I found a bunch of stuff about how the president at the time was throwing them a lot of funding to "prove" that it was the oldest pyramid in the world and put Java on the map. The dude who did the coring work seems to be pretty unpopular with reputable archaeologists.

Love the way the host goes "archaeologists don't seem to like me!?!" While also yelling "I can't believe you people are so dumb! You never even looked here!" About fairly well-studied archaeological sites.

He doesn't understand the most basic principles of archaeology. For instance, stratigraphy.

"archaeologists won't talk about flood mythologies!" That's right I noticed that in the ENTIRE CLASS we spent talking about flood mythologies in our northwest archaeology course. Spot on.

[hamliet]

As expected Mutsuki is much more interesting when he interacts with the other Quinxes rather than when the focus is on his obsession for Sasaki and his relationship with Aura. Abt his confrontation with Urie I think BOTH tried to hide behind the CCG ideology. Not only Urie's, but Mutsuki's first words are abt how all of that was crazy bcs doves and ghouls can't fight together which is a very CCGish thing to say and smtg in the past would have appealed to U (let's think abt U's comment to cont.

Saiko's thoughts on ghouls' not being so bad for example). Here M obviously doesn't care abt the CCG or ghouls, but only abt lashing out and tries to communicate with U wit ha Language they once shared. u refuses M's words and keeps the discourse on that same level, talking abt missions and duties, instead of switching it on a more personal plan which is the heart of the matter. M's anger to U's replies speeches a lot abt how much he actually cares. Also, it's important to saw that when U said c

that everyone should have died he didn't really mean it since when he hurt M by mistake he looked horrified and guilty, so it's not a stretch to imagien M doesn't truly mean it as well now. Also U's words back then expressed a high level of self-loathing and feeling powerless hidden behind all the rage and we know M despises himself as well. In all of this I am getting really irritated by Saiko not bcs of her, but bcs of her lack of an arc and her being an appendix of other characters cont.

I like your theory of her becoming more important after M's situation is solved and if Shirazu comes back. Still, even with Shirazu Urie has had more buildup than her (with his promise of him getting his body back and with the large space his reaction to Shirazu's Death was given compared to Saiko's as well as him being the one shown to think abt Shirazu lately), but I hope she gets some damn introspection and an objective which is only her own. Pretty happy of the fight btw 2nd gen too!

Thank you for sharing your thoughts! I agree about Mutsuki and Urie being very CCG in their thinking--which is again why I think they need to get out of the conflict. 

Yes, exactly. How you lay our Mutsuki’s motives here is precisely the case: Mutsuki is lashing out through language they’ve shared, because he doesn’t know how to say the truth (will lie again). And Urie chooses to keep his mouth shut and address the surface issue rather than address the deeper problem. And back to Mutsuki, I do understand why that hurt to hear and I don’t want to invalidate the punch in the gut that delivered because I felt it too (ow), but also, I really, truly don’t think there’s even a remote narrative chance Mutsuki was telling the truth/that Ishida wants us to believe it’s the truth. Mutsuki’s flaw is lying. To overcome his flaw, he would have to tell the truth. Does he look like he’s overcoming his flaw? Then he’s lying, according to story. 

I’m also irritated with Saiko at this point, not because of anything she’s done, but because of her role in the story. I’m at the point where I don’t want her to show up again until she gets an arc. I can’t take more disappointment or her just continuing to orbit around Urie and be his accessory, which is what she has been lately. (I’m exaggerating in my frustration; don’t kill me, hyperbole is my favorite technique. I love her. But I’m also frustrated because it’s easy to root for someone who never struggles, but. Ugh.)

I also agree about Shirazu. His arc and Urie’s were tied together since chapter one, but of the original Qs, the first person Saiko’s arc was tied to was his as well. (Her and Urie’s relationship was never focused on at all until after he died--really not until the Rushima fight, which is awfully late in the game--generally characters who are supposed to be important to each other are shown as important/challenging each other early on in their arcs.) 

#Give Saiko An Arc 2018, does anyone want to join my campaign? Lol. Because like I said, Saiko has all the necessary components--flaws and strengths--to be a favorite character of mine and I need her to just struggle so I can talk about her all day. Because I would. Lol.