#actually now that i think about it its really interesting how in aa5 apollo starts to doubt his trust in people

[celestriix]

thinking about klavier gavin again because i saw someone say that the fact that he's the only prosecutor in the series who wants to find the truth and isn't insanely obsessed with winning like the other prosecutors makes him really boring

and i understand it to some extent when comparing him to other prosecutors but... Klavier Gavin??? BORING????

after playing aa4 i was OBSESSED with klavier gavin and the untouched potential of this guy

he loses his best friend/bandmate, his brother AND his mentor in the span of like a year?? i think??? which is INSANE.

there's something very tragic about klavier, a person who values finding the truth above all else, finding out that two of the people closest to him betrayed his trust and lied to him and used him for their own means AND ARE MURDERERS.

and then his mentor, a person who taught that seeking the truth is what a lawyer should do, gets murdered by a person who believes that winning in trials is the most important thing above all else WHICH IS THE SAME EXACT THING THAT KRISTOPH VALUED AS WELL !!!

this core belief of finding out the truth that klavier has, leads him to finding out about the things that daryan and kristoph did, and even though they are important to him, people he CARES about, he continues to work with apollo to see that justice is served.

and the fact that we don't get to see anything of klavier getting any closure after the events of aa4 makes me insane

we never get to see much of klavier's feelings on what happened or him fully processing the events of aa4 and that one case in aa5 and it makes me soooo upset. i wish he got more than that little cameo in aa5 and that one tiny flashback appearance in aa6.

in an alternate universe, aa4 got a true sequel that fully explored klavier's character, as well as phoenix's, klavier's, AND apollo's relationship with kristoph, and klavier's relationship with phoenix post-aa4, and also a more thought out? (for the lack of a better word) backstory for apollo, and an exploration of the jury system, and a game that ACTUALLY built upon the foundation that aa4 laid out.

and i am forever upset that we are not in that alternate universe.

[wherewolfwasteland]

Apollo justice + some dual destinies (ace attorney spoilers and rant !!!)

I've cleared the game a little while ago and while there was some aspects i liked,overall I was very mixed . First of all I love phoenix and his character change , it makes things interesting and I don't mind that he just goes back to himself later in the game . I also really like ema skye and how despite her talent she didn't make it into the job she wanted , it's realistic and gives her even more character growth . The soundtrack and animations were beautiful as well and the first case was one of my favourite first cases (tied with the first case of trials and tribulations)

Now for the things i didn't like (there's a lot unfortunately)

- apollo justice: first of all I won't be the first or last person to say he was a side character in his OWN GAME but that's not all that I don't like about him . First of all it really annoys me when he points out people's nervous traits every single time. I understood the first time since it was new to the player but everytime after that? Its cringe . I'm sorry but if I were a witness and the defence attorney told me that I was playing with my hands when I was nervous or something , I'd make a conscious effort to stop doing it . Uggghhh so cringe . It makes all of the witnesses look stupid af . Another thing i don't like about him is how little we actually learn about him . I like how he deals with his own trauma (pushing it away) and even in dual destinies going his own path was very interesting. But his inner monologue was very lacking in personality or anything really. Honestly it sucks because I do like him as a base character but the fandom definitely made me like him, and gave him more characterisation then those two games ever did .

Trucy : don't get me wrong , she has her great moments and she's super cute (I do love her overall) but I have some issues as well . First of all I hate the fact they made her super pale , there are no black characters in ace attorney , and even though I understand her not being black , she could have been tanned like her father. I don't wanna hear no "ace attorney is made in Japan so no black people" bullshit. This game isn't very realistic in the slightest so when people use that as an excuse for lack of diversity it annoys me so much ! And one more thing I don't like about trucy is that she is used as a panties joke wayyyyyy tooooo muccchhhhh , I'm sick of the panties !!!! Give it a resttttttttttttt . Ah I do love her lots and lots though . Okay okay moving on .

Klavier : and this is going to piss people offfff i know!! Bur he is just really really boring!! Which is so unfortunate because he had all of the makings to be great . He's in a band (that's awesome!) And he has great charisma and presence. But over the game when though so much happens to him he just brushes it all off, and not in a pushing away his trauma like apollo way either. It's always going to be harder to portray a character the player doesn't get to play since we can't hear his inner monologue (which would have been so cool) but still - I mean his best friend / band mate and his own brother both turn out to be murderers and he literally does not care in the slightest . Don't even get me started on how weird he is in aa5 . Also the fact that he was supposed to be your rival throughout the game and he really wasn't at all made going against him boring too . Don't get me wrong, going into a case I already know I'm winning , but in this game I knew I was winning if you get me . Other then the huge lost potential with him, I do think he is interesting, unfortunately mostly in fanon .

Kristoph: I mean I really really liked him as a villain I did ! But it was all too soon. This man had no real motive at the end of the day and he was gone before I even cared enough about him. He was apollos mentor and klaviers brother and he could have been given so much hype before the twist but no , first case and I'm over him . I don't even care he forged the evidence at that point . I knew he was evil. Also they should have made him go all out ! Like kidnap trucy at the end ! Go completely nuts !!! Especially since he has those 5 black locks , he could have been one of the greats .

Others : now there was other small things I liked and didn't like , overall I am happy that I played the game , I like the added characters despite their flaws and I like how they expanded their powers and stuff . I know some people don't like the fantasy elements but I like them a lot . I think it can add fun gameplay and stuff so yeah!!

Lastly here is somethings I would have done to change and improve the story (this is my opinion . I'm a meer fan with no writing experience so take this with a grain of salt)

Firstly I would have had kristoph be apollos mentor throughout the game until the last case . This way we grow attached to him as apollo but also it would give klavier someone to bounce off of . If he was going to be nice to apollo maybe he could have disliked his brother and been mean to him in the court (kristoph being mean back of course ) or they could have had that strange love hate siblings rivalry going on . It would give us a chance to really get more out of klavier. Kristoph (him manipulating apollo making us even madder at the end when we figured it out) and apollo , finding it hard to trust phoenix at first and growing to trust him later in dual destinies (until the last case where he departs the agency and yeah we all know what happens) . It could have been such great insightful character development.

Like imagine , this mentor has been by your side the whole game , helping you win ! Boosting you up (to make his brother look bad but you don't know that. Oh and also to be a better attorney than wright in a way , I like the idea of him hating phoenix and wanting to best him (so giving him the forged evidence) just not in the way it was done. I want him to really hate phoenix for phoenix and not because some guy chose phoenix over him once) anyways. This guy, you grow to trust him , even defend him against his brother even though the brother is being sweet to you, no way would your mentor be awful ! He's definitely lying . (He's not lying) and yeah the final case, he kills trucys father or he could even kill trucys father at the first case and produces forged evidence so that he gets off free !! Could be interesting and would have no effect on apollo since kristoph would be the one to forge it . Anyways either way . He kills trucys dad, forges wrights evidence , maybe even forges his own . He kills another person and also gets desperate as he realises that phoenix is onto him (he's kinda desperate but also thinks phoenix can't really get him since he's barred) , he kidnaps trucy because she has been too close to his crimes and then as apollo you are trying to solve the murder, find trucys kidnapper and discover the culprit behind the forgery all along . You slowly piece together that it was your mentor who had lied and manipulated you (apollo) this whole time and you can't believe it . (Heck klavier can't even believe it ! He knew his brother was awful but he never would suspect that ) kristoph is sent to prison , trucy is saved , phoenix is dropped of his forgery allegations , the person who got a guilty from the first case is set free ( if they decided to have kristoph produces forged evidence then) and apollo and klavier sit down. Get a drink maybe some food . And they bond over their shared trauma and hurt . Leading them to be best friends in aa5

Other thoughts :

The gameplay was great in apollo justice (not so much in dual destinies tbh) so I definitely would have kept that the same with less flashbacks , telling me what to do too much and the whole apollo telling people their nervous traits .

Next the story of trucy and apollos parents (mother especially ) was very very very very messy . Idk how to fix that jdjskskskx also it's just gone after this ?? Phoenix doesn't tell them and their mother also doesn't care about them ?? Also also another thing I want to mention ! I wish trucy didn't have the same power as apollo . I know his is stronger because of the bracelet but still . It cheapens his abilities because they aren't special at all . Like I feel that pearl and maya , even though had similar abilities were both useful in their own way but in apollos case sometimes it really seems as if trucy is better than him at his own ability idk . I would have definitely made it so she didn't have that ability.

Okay okay I'm rambling at this point ,I really am but ugh so many thoughts in my adhd brain that won't shut up (so I'm sorry if this is messy) but yeah I do want to say again I do love these characters and stuff so no hate :3 (thank you )

So yes this rant was all over the place but I hope for the most part it was legible ! Please comment below because I'd love to talk more about this but for now, rant over :D

[dreamsy990]

You reblorbed the "Chose Violence" ask game post & now I must return the favour:

1 12 14 21

Don't feel pressured to answer all of them - it's all in good fun!

~athena-appreciation-page

ALRIGHTY (so sorry this took so long to get around to)

1: the character everyone gets wrong

alright im setting aside my default knee-jerk response of pHOENIX WRIGHT because im literally only referring to his relationship with apollo and i talk too much about that anyways. so i present to you: LARRY BUTZ!!!

i think he was pretty good in the first game, and AMAZING in the anime. like, all his scenes are so fun. hell, even in the movie, he's a fucking HIGHLIGHT!!!! i think the fandom (and the later games, to a lesser extent) kind of does him dirty by portraying him as, idk, terminally straight but in a really bad way? im too tired to think of the word im looking for.

12: the unpopular character that you actually like and why more people should like them

i like lucas miller hm i mean. i like most characters. i see a lot of hate for sunny from wof. like, people think shes annoying and kind of useless? but idk, i like her!! she reminds me a bit of athena, i think? in terms of personality, not story.

i get that people are frustrated that she doesn't do much for the first 4 books, but she's trying to be useful. iirc she has a similar arc to maya at the end of aa1 where she feels useless so she starts doing extreme things to help out and ends up being the reason the main cast succeeds. i love that for her!! also, she's pretty fun as a side character in the second arc. so, sunny probably.

14: that one thing you see in fics all the time

dadnix (specifically relating to apollo). i have SO MANY ISSUES WITH DADNIX!!!!! you CANNOT tell me that apollo would consider this man a father. hell, even assuming apollo would think of a parental figure positively (which, based on his story, he has no reason to have ANY positive association with fathers specifically), phoenix???? their relationship doesn't read like that at ALL. apollo is notably distant with phoenix. nick is SHOCKED to hear apollo isn't always serious.

the only canon scene i can think of that reads like dadnix is probably when the agency is in danger in magical turnabout, when apollo has what reads like a panic attack, and nick comforts him. that's the ONLY SCENE. i just. i want them to have a conversation i think. i dont see their dynamic like that i suppose. its fine? i just. hngh.

21: part of canon you think is overhyped

i was gonna say apollos backstory but uh. actually i think its very interesting. um. i cant think of anything actually. so a part of canon i think is UNDERHYPED is the gap between aa4 and aa5!! like, some shit CLEARLY happened there!!!!! phoenix and apollo had to have a conversation between aa4 and aa5 based on how their relationship is different (change in writers be damned) and that's one of my favorite things in aa so. yeah!!

okay actually. i can think of a non-ace attorney answer. pre-starblaster in taz. i just dont really care all that much about what happened before the hunger? like i don't mind it, its pretty interesting, but its probably the LEAST interesting thing in taz.

[earthdeep]

ok this is really starting to get on ludicrous levels but... can we quit with the aa5 hate a bit? like srsly? y’all are gettin waaaaay too aggressive abt ppl liking this game. half the time it’s shit over nothing! it’s not like ppl are out here praising this as a masterpiece of writing. srsly the only times I’ve seen what y’all are insisting stans are doing is for aa4 (usually guessing at what was intended for future sequels that actually continued on from it) and shipping (especially narumitsu shippers? some of u are REALLY invested in subtext like wow). 99% of the praise I’ve seen for aa5 is for the characters. which is more than fair! in case u forgot, aa5 introduced us to the entire blackquill/cykes group, in all their lovable glory! and fleshed out the universe with the wonder that is lawyer highschool (which, listen, if ur accepting 13 year olds are allowed to prosecute, this isn’t actually incompatible with the depths this fictional justice system will sink) that also managed to connect parts of aai2 into the timeline as well! ffs apollo’s single friend only exists in canon bc of aa5!

and u can say everything’s clumsily implemented all u like. but, uh, in case u hadn’t noticed, aa5 isn’t the first time it’s gone weird. have u seen t&t lately? dahlia and godot were soooo clumsily integrated. I’ve ranted on godot’s mary sue qualities before, but ugh. both have the same problem of “oh by the way did I ever mention that INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT ex of mine who is totally irrelevant btw haha oh wow they’re suddenly relevant how about that”. fucking jfa has the same issue with franziska aka “woah now there’s ANOTHER von karma? and she’s even MORE challenging than the last one?!” srsly let’s not pretend her sudden arrival made sense for a prodigy who is also next of kin to the most infamous prosecutor around. nick not knowing who manfred was was clumsy too. what I’m getting at is that the aa series does not in fact have the smoothest writing, to the point where nick and later apollo appear to live under rocks in order to lose out on what should be common knowledge in their situation. srsly apollo how did u never notice that there’s some frontman in a rock group pushed by the literal police who looks scarily like ur boss, has the same last name as ur boss, said band is literally called the GAVINners. like christ I’m not into music but I at least recognise the names of 1d members. in all honesty I am so glad athena did not end up like those two pebble-dwellers and had actually p good reasons for either not knowing shit (hello l’belle and his private company) or keeping quiet (hello the entire space station situation). athena is good at this. 

and u know the biggest plus that kinda ties into the character situation? NO STOCK FUCKING PERVERT CHARACTERS. WE ALL HATE THEM. BUT CAN WE NOT OVERLOOK THE FACT AA4 HAD TWO. BOTH STICKLER AND HOTTI/HICKFIELD BOTH APPEARED IN THE SAME CASE. BOTH INVOLVING A FIFTEEN YEAR OLD GIRL. I HAVE THE SCRIPT. DO NOT FUCKING TEST ME.

there’s other stuff I’ve seen too specifically abt the satire that started the series. yes, gyakuten saiban was created to satirise the unbalanced nature and unbelievably high prosecution rates of the japanese courts. gyakuten saiban 4 was written in reaction to the real life introduction of the jury. (srsly if u have time, go on a research trip. there’s a lot of interesting stuff surrounding the background of the series.) but, forgive me if I’m missing something, what the FUCK were 2 and 3 satirising? as far as I’m aware, takumi was asked to continue the series bc ppl liked it. and it made capcom money. takumi eventually got totally sick of it and left the main series but please don’t act like this is something new from capcom. not everything in the series is pure political commentary. some of it is just regular stories. this is true for almost any satirical series ever. it doesn’t make them unenjoyable. besides y’all are content to shit on soj anyway for being a cheesy take on of a corrupt government system so maybe u just don’t care and just have a hate on for anything tangentially related to aa5.

and on whether it’s unenjoyable? nah man aa5 is fun. monstrous turnabout was a bit slow I reckon, but everything else moved at a nice pace, had fun characters, had those good good friendship moments. it was a bit wobbly in places, but we sat through turnabout serenade and turnabout succession! would u like my list of plot holes in serenade alone? bc I have one. I had to make one to break down the damn thing enough to write an au version of it. and with aa5 and the phantom? apparently that’s largely on the localisation team deciding western audiences wouldn’t accept ‘yokai’ as the answer and then just... not... putting anything else in? literally could’ve been solved with one word being swapped out or jinxie mentioning said yokai in one of her lists which... yeah that one’s on the game. idk maybe in the distant future when the games are all remastered for the new new new nintendo 3dsi that’ll be fixed too. or maybe the miracle never happen. who knows.

like probably the only other thing I can’t argue with on criticism is the art style. yeah, I’m not keen on fuse’s faces. nuri suffers with a certain level of same face too, but (as shown in dgs) the other parts of his design are pretty and managed to shine through in 3d. but the colours are way better come soj now the main team is getting into the swing of it, and anyone who doesn’t think khura’in is pretty as hell can fight me.

but srsly there are actually a lot of good points to aa5. it is not the antichrist. personally it is far from my favourite game (with my own fave as aa4 bc dem characters tho... barring the perverts) but many of its flaws are not new to the series. and while it has lost potential in various parts such as several important characters being dead on arrival, let’s not forget it left behind some especially nasty parts of the series and appears to be CONTINUING to leave those behind. mmm just look at that lack of literal canon pedophiles we’re supposed to feel sorry for... sorry every time I remember aa3 I like it less and less. which is a shame, bc young!mia is still the most relatable protag ever.

anyway, let’s not become the dicks who shat on anyone who liked aa4 back in the day, yeah?