#actually indigenious

[cyber-cyder]

Fucking looking at a post talking about tumes non violence has successfully helped go against dictatorships and it's like "yes, in fact, non violence has worked because twenty nine years later.."

[sullyfortress]

Hey, what’s your take on the whole: Avatar is kinda insulting to Indigenous people?

Ok this is actually a topic I have been curious about covering for a long time.

Let me start off by saying I am white.

I only the last year or two realised the problematic elements in the Avatar James Cameron franchise. I think whats important to remember is that elements of this movie were inspired by native culture - and really the act of colonizing.

The movie is also I think a take on human nature. Humans have shown that we cannot and do not learn from the mistakes of the past. If we - when we discover another planet with life - I don't doubt we will again act superior and fuck up another world. To me the biggest part of this franchise that I've always loved is the battle between technology and nature.

I have loved the world since I was 10. This was a franchise that I bonded over with my grandpa who is a sci-fi nerd like me.

It's only as I've matured that I've actually connected the dots. That their are people who feel that this franchise has stolen features of their culture. And it has - you cannot deny that the Na'vi are heavily influenced by Native cultures of America. I feel really humbled to learn about my own ignorance and priviledge related to the history of America in particular and how indigenoius people have been effected and are still effected.

I know James Cameron has made some unsavory comments. I don't know all the details, but I know he has said things to upset alot of people.

I have debated several times ending this tumblr and my commissions because of the recent harm and emotions related to the franchise.

I'm not gonna pretend that I know shit, if there is a follower of mine who is indigenious and has more insight into this subject, I welcome the insight. I want to be more educated. At heart I am an artist and I like to make art and I love science fiction and space.

[drdemonprince]

"Americans will NEVER stand talk in front of cops with long guns in the name of others."

dog... i'm not even american and can rattle off a long list of times where that *did* happen. not even just cops, but the actual military. from the 19th century to now. from pre-us civil war abolitionists to unions facing off with the pinkertons and state troops to literal warfare between miners and the military to black civil rights activists to anti-vietnam war protests to kent state to queer liberation to anti-war protests in the bush era to occupy to ferguson to BLM to DAPL/indigenious activists to pro-palestine activists this fucking year.

like... we can argue about efficacy & approach (especially with more recent movements) but the above statement is so patently false, it's laughable.

yep. we have some deep seated cultural issues and the nation state should not exist but the problem isnt some essential rot in the hearts of the people here. even how bad we fuckin are at forming community is systemic, and the product of a lot of intentional work on the part of the cia/doj/large corporations/police etc

[royal-confessions]

“Im so dissapointed in the UK royals. I know their position but still i feel so let down. They were falling over themseleves supportiing Ukraine. Visitng churches meetingand comforting people making flags etc. But Palestine? Noooo. Just one measly statement where they made it very clear they stand with Israel and after that. Crickets. At least meet with the community even once. I suppose they cant say much coz the UK literally created the state of israel. But its such a slap in the face for the diverse community especially muslims in the UK. Like say something anything a tiny word about being on the side of humanity at the very least. But nothing. The situation is very differnct from the beginning. We are all witnessing a genocide and ethnic cleansing of indigenious people of Palestine. And dont get me started about Rishi Sunak and his wifes direct involvement in this genocide of the Palestinian people” - Submitted by Anonymous

“The British Royals (or actually all of Europe’s royals) reaction to Palestine has been embarrassing and shameful compared to their reaction to Ukraine. They had prayer services, they were meeting refugees, building homes for the refugees, offering up their castles, Kate writing letters and sending packages of food, the literal coronation carpet and god knows what else. And yes I understand they have to go with what their government says but my god they can show some sort of support to 30k people dead. Charles could literally say" I send my prayers to those killed in Palestine" If he wanted to be politically neutral he could give his condolences to those killed in Israel too. This also goes to Meghan and Harry who have been radio silent.” - Submitted by Anonymous

[daloy-politsey]

same anon here - im not trying to argue, i just want to make sense of things. genuinely thank you for answering, i want to get rid of this brainrot.

i dont disagree with that definition of indigenous, but im a little confused. if, hypothetically, another country up and decided to colonize the united states *again* - would that then make white USAmericans indigenous? what about the actual indigenous/native americans of the region? similarly, i've seen leftist zionists argue that zionism *is* landback/decolonization of palestine. i think this is bullshit, but when we're working with the theoreticals of "the indigenous are the opporessed, the colonizers are the oppressors" ; if native americans were somehow given sanction by the UN to bomb white USAmericans to dust, would that them make them colonizers? what actions must be taken for someone to be classified as indigenous? what actions would justify stripping someone of being called indigenous? similar to jewishness, we already know that indigeny is not classified by blood quantum - but how do we set a "line" for "how much" someone benefits from colonialism before they are no longer "allowed" to be indigenous?

I would say that if another group came and colonized the US again, that would not make white US Americans indigenous. For example, before the British colonized certain parts of North America, there was the Dutch and the French but the actions of the British didn't make Dutch and French settlers indigenous.

Also, being indigenous isn't just about being oppressed. It's about being oppressed in a specific way. The US is a settler colonial project just like Israel because the point of both of those projects is for one group to supplant the natives.

I'm not sure how to answer the last part of your question. Maybe some of my followers can help?

[stars-and-soda]

Ngl that one post with people arguing about Indigenous rights to live basically is so demoralizing. Like how are you openly admiting to not seeing Indigenious people as inherently worth more than animals? Why is this an actual argument being made? I cannot argue for how we are worth more than a single animal, I cannot even compare myself and my family and community and ancestors and people to animals to argue for us. I cannot. There's no where to go from here because there is no way to explain how putting Indigenous lives under animals isn't leftist or progressive or morally right and nost fucking certianly isn't supportive of Indigenous people. People shouldn't feel comfortable saying that shit. So many ""allies"" still have the sentiment of that old newspaper clip I can't find rn of "x people dead and y Indians", where we're closer to humans than anything else, but not quite people.

[jennrypan]

What do you like in the game until dawn and oh yeah this game depiction of indigenious culture is not accurate

Oh there's a list. (And yeah I know but it came out in 2015 I don't expect games back then to be accurate, cuz like I'm pretty sure they did like. The bare minimum of research to get what they needed so eh--)

On to the things I like.

Starting off. THE VISUALS??? THE DESIGNS?? ITS FUCKING BANGER?

Then we have the start? We have the established characters, we get to know them a little, we get to see who Hannah and Beth are as characters before they ya know, get nerfed, the choices they give to make it seem like you can save them?? 10/10

And the other characters??!!?! They are all interesting in their own right! This game gives you time to care about each character, gives you a chance to chance or make relationships with other characters! You see the change, and then it leads to different scenarios!

Also !! The choices they give you ACTUALLY EFFECT THE STORY!! Even the littlest of choices have meaning and just..the games following this one don't have that same vibe, the characters are down right boring and you don't actually care what happens to them?? I mean kinda just cuz you don't wanna get a bad ending but that's it??

Also!!! THIS GAME DIDNT DO THAT STUPID "IT WAS ALL IN THIS ONE GUYS HEAD!" trope. I fucking hate it, it's boring and sucks, Yes Josh was indeed going through a psychotic break but the only thing in his head was the therapist, the wendigos were real, the prank he pulled on them was real! Everything that happened was real,

(Man of Medan and Little Hope did this stupid shit and I'll forever hate them, and also. In those games you had no chance to care about any of these characters, edpecially in Little Hope no reason to care and no matter what you chose the ending doesn't change cuz uh oh they're still dead!)

Just. Until Dawn was the ground work for butterfly affect games and to me it was their absolute best simply because of the characters in it, they all have their purpose, they all have their little chapters and interactions and they're interesting, they're not just complete assholes that you can't wait to kill (..Depending on how you feel about Emily I can go 50/50 I love her but I'm choosing Matt over her 100% and also Mike but I love him sm) I can't make any analyze on the other two games (with the 'werewolf' and the murderer cuz I don't remember much from them. The murderer one was cool though)

Just. UGH I FUCKING LOVE UNTIL DAWN and wish the fandom wasnt damn dead. And I could draw fanart

I also wanna rp BUT PEOPLE ARE DEAD. Just ugh

[ameritt]

Denver Art Museum With snow on the ground and a temperature of 26 degrees fahrenheit / -3 degrees celcius, I decided it was a museum day.

I wasn't sure what to expect from the Denver Art Museum. Eleven floors, spanning early indigenous, European, Latin American, Asia, photography, modern and contemporary art, with the 1970's wing designed by Gio Ponti and the modern wing designed in 2006 by Daniel Libeskind.

The museum was involved in a scandal in 2022- several pieces of art were looted from Southeast Asia and donated to the museum. The museum now addresses the issue of art provenance in multiple places in the museum and repatriated the art.   I was pleasantly surprised by how engaging the staff and the curation was. Modern pieces are juxtaposed with old. European and pop art perspectives (such as Andy Warhol's American Indian and EA Burbank's Chief Blue Horse) contrast with those of indigenious people (Ken Monkman's The Scream) who the curators consulted to create the exhibits. There were curatorial notes aimed at young visitors explaining context and history or even just asking if they could find elements hidden in a painting. I enjoyed talking with some of the guards and docents who actually wanted to talk with visitors about the art.

One of my favorite sections was about how curators select frames (it is rare that paintings are shown with their original frame). They also incorporated video, such as how artist Laura Kishimoto makes her bentwood Yumi Chair in the By Design show. While the modern / contemporary art was the weakest section, some standout pieces included a very dangerously tilted Wheelchair with serrated blade handles by Mona Hatoum and Mark Tansey's monochrome landscape, About, which can be viewed from two sides and hides shows people in various predicaments.

[decadentlightthing-blog]

“He who controls the mind controls the minds of the public.” - Noam Chomsky & Jim Morrison.

Most of us accept the fact that social media shortens our attention span.

But do we really understand the fact that it does not only do that, but much more - affecting our whole way of thinking?

“But it doesnt affect me” Is a commonly cited quote, which might be relevant to many readers of this text too. This is a projection of our everyday consciousness, which is ignorance. Our minds are very selective, and we are very prone to live in a one firmly set of habits. 

And in our day to day life, what are we actually working with, internally? 

If one can really be honest about this, one can observe that Memory is mostly being acted upon for the most part. That’s the main instrument that we are playing with. But there’s a downside to using primarily just memory. As wears out the brain, and gradually, when one gets old, brain gets slower and slower.

Unfortunately this has been taken as some sort of a fundamental truth, like there’s no other way to live, act, and learn. This is a very concerning trait of our Western culture. 

Piling up knowledge into our brains without really facing the fact that our brain has limited capacity, there are inevitable consequences and therefore the fragmentation of the brain will happen. The increasing amount of distractions in society and modern lifestyle takes us away from our true nature which is far beyond the common way of life, with a biased way of thinking and superficial emotional life.

What over indulgence of social media and the noncritical way of internalizing information does to us internally, is that it evades that essential spaciousness needed for the mind.

We don’t seem to realize that “Nothing is something”.

I strongly encourage you to take a step towards a better life and for the next moment when you notice yourself caught in the same behaviour pattern, just stop. When you’re after short term pleasures or constantly amusing yourself with entertainment, take a moment to reflect on your life. 

Another phenomenon of our state of mind is that “ It is not that deep bro “, also known as Postmodernism. This I wont go into into any further in this post.

Going back to what I was saying, it is essential for us to not always try to fill our boredom with something. Fun fact, indigenious people did not have a word for boredom. They were so aligned with nature, and the nature of universe, which is a gift and the alignment to that naturally brings out gratitude to oneself. Indigenious people would be stimulated to just see that the green is grass, wind is blowing, and the sky is blue. And the culture was more about mutual good. Meanwhile in our modern culture mental disorders are becoming more and more complex. 

Where do we go from here?

Order in the mind can only come out of the understanding of disorder.

Looking at ‘what is’, presently operating in the mind, IS in in fact disorder.

Our everyday consciousness, like previously said, is ignorance. 

There are at least 6 grand illusions that are inherited from the very beginning of our childhood, and are encouraged by educational system. 

1) The illusion of thought 2) The illusion of self 3) The illusion of knowledge 4) The illusion of time 5) The illusion of control 6) The illusion of fear.

Look up: Self-enquiry

It is also to mention, that division inevitably brings about conflict. Very dangerous way of thinking is that there’s one truth, that my side is the good side, and others are bad. This is just one trait of the habits of War, and all the ugliness in the world made by man.

Last words,

althought I might paint a very gloomy picture of our way of living, I see the radical honesty of that fact as essential. And it does not end there, this is perhaps the more important part. Once we really delve into this ‘living’ we call, we can start to go beyond it. A one single moment, an insight can bring about radical change in oneself. Maintaining this positive change within oneself, implies constant awareness of unawareness. Being present when our negative impulses kick in, we’re there in the moment and in that we have all the power to act rationally, sanely, and not to go along with it.

[ohsalome]

Previous anon : sorry I didn’t write clearly. I was asking about the views of indigenious people on the invasion of Ukraine and if it was different from Russians given that they are the ones being most deployed / planned to be deployed by the Russian government

Okay, but keep in mind that I'm writing from an ukrainian POV, which would be very different from someone who actually lives there.

They do harrass us less on the internet; but based on the interviews with the captured soldiers, they are just as brainwashed into kremlin propaganda as the "slavic" russians, meaning they do believe that we are baby-eating nazis puppeteered by the USA.

Most indigenious people we've heard from are those who volounteered into joining the army, so I can't really say if their beliefs are representative of the general population. My educated guess would be yes, since the "depressive regions", where those people live, generally get less varied information and are more prone to being brainwashed by the propaganda. Alcoholism and drug addiction are also huge problems, especially among the veterans, and lead to further degradation of the personality.

Earning money from war is one of the biggest, if not the biggest, factor of joining the invasion. From this perspective, it makes no difference for them where to go - Syria, Ukraine, Mali, whatever.

But now that their chances of dying have become significantly higher than the chances to bring back home a plasma TV, they aren't as eager to go to Ukraine.

To hear more of their perspective directly, I can suggest you watch a Youtube channel of Volodymyr Zolkin, who regularly publishes interviews with russian POWs, including the indigenous ones. Here is a link to the playlist with english subtitles.

If you're feeling in a mood to play around with automatic subtitles, you can look up Чатрулетка in youtube. It is a relatively popular genre in ukrainian yt, where streamers match in videochat with random people from russia and talk about war with them. Usually this results with encountering very unhinged folk and a lot of screaming/swearing. So, just pop "чатрулетка" + "буряты"/"дагестанцы"/[whatever nation you want to hear from] in the yt search bar

And, as always, I welcome people adding their perspective to this, because, once again, I'm ukrainian, I don't even go there

[zwoelffarben]

I regret to inform you that the boy scout of america sign is enfact three fingers of the right hand with the arm held out at a right angle (source: I'm an eagle scout, but also I'm double checking google images of other eagle scouts' courts of honor wherein that pomp is dialed in 100% correct, because I don't trust the verimilisitude of my memory).

Not gonna post some guy's court of honor photos, definitely not posting mine, but here's illustrations of the scout sign (which is seporate from the scout salute, still three fingers but touching the forehead instead of the right angle arm thing).

You may be confusing it with the cub scout sign which is two fingers spread apart and salute (two fingers together at the forehead) or since scouting is an international movement, your national scouting org might have a slightly different sign and salute; but the comic artist is correct about the BSA's scout sign being three fingers and a ninety degree arm.

THAT SAID,

The BSA has a long history of changes to the uniform, especially wit regard to the shoulder loopies, neckercheif, troop colors and so on being in constant negociation, and this as far as I'm aware, this combination of colors has never existed, and it really showcases that the comic artist has a very shallow understanding of the history of boy scouts vis-a-vis the uniform because the historically correct comic looks more like this:

All of that said,

While boy scouts, (specifically boy scouts of america) perports itself to be a progressive organization, that's mostly a bunch of outward facing propaganda to my experience of the organiztion as a fundementally christo-conservative organization. As such the reactionary sentiment in the comic is something you'd hear with in the organzation itse and I'd not be surprised if the artist were a fellow eagle scout who's not autistic about the scout uniform's history (though I would be disappointed and ashamed by association).

During my 15 years in the scouting program (including 5 years as a cub scout, and two years as an adult) gay people were not allowed to participate in the organzation at any level because the BSA had a massive problem with CSA and was using gay people as a scapegoat and a ban on gay people's particapation in the organzation as an alternative to addressing the actual fucking problem for eleven of those years, and only allowed gay youth to be openly gay in the program when I was about to age out (and therefore not benefit from the rules change, required to stay in the closet as queer (because cishet people don't see different flavors of queer as distinct) to continue my particapation in the program as an adult).

I was also told point blank during my atheist phase that, "If you're asked about your religion by your eagle board, lie. Scouting is fundementally a religious organization and there will never be an atheist eagle scout."

Also also, there's the whole thing where BSA is big into appropriation of indigenious cultural markers, and has a major colonialist bend to their 'care for nature' mindset while not supporting major native political goals like landback because BSA was one of the largest private land owners in the US before the whole damages for CSA cause them to declare bankruptcy at a national level (don't know if they still hold the title or not)

So, if boy scouting in america is getting more progressive, good for it; I haven't been paying enough attention 'cause I don't care enough to keep up, and I don't plan on having kids to put through scouting.

But the comic's sentiment is very much in line with my experiences in the boy scout, and I can imagine my recently late scout master posting this exact comic on facebook thinking it says something bad about scouting's trajectory.

great

[yamayuandadu]

Arahsamnum 2021: Simut

As I said yesterday, associations between gods and celestial bodies in Mesopotamian literature were often much less direct than one would expect. Simut is yet another good example. I need to preface the actual entry with an important clarification about Simut: contrary to early assumptions in scholarship, he was not an underworld god in his own right. He was associated with Nergal, yes, but this was rooted in shared character as warrior gods and association with the same celestial body rather than on full overlap of functions. In Mesopotamian sources, Simut pretty much outright -was- Mars - his name can be found with either the divine determinative (DINGIR) or the astral one denoting a celestial body (MUL) prefacing it. Where did he come from, though, and what was he like? Read on to find out.

In origin, Simut was an Elamite god, much like already discussed Inshushinak. The meaning of his name to my knowledge isn’t known, but evidently it’s not a borrowing from Sumerian or Akkadian. His epithets give us a pretty good idea of how the Elamites perceived him: he was known as “the god of Elam,” “herald of the gods” and “mighty one, herald of the gods.” According to Wouter Henkelman, some caution is advised as “herald” is not necessarily the optimal translation of the Elamite term used in these titles, and it might designate some other type of official, perhaps military in nature. While Nergal and Simut shared an association with Mars, they weren’t the only gods to be associated with it - for example, one myth appears to compare the medicine goddess Nintinugga and the prison goddess Manungal to Mars, perhaps to indicate their ability to navigate the underworld. In Simut’s case there is no indication that his astral aspect meant a link the underworld, though, and not all attestations of the corresponding planet in Mesopotamian texts are underworld-related - for instance, it could also be an omen of war, or simply “the Elam star” or “the strange star.” Simut wasn’t the only elamite god to make a career in foreign lands as a personification of an astral body - Pinikir, the “Elamite Ishtar,” seemingly was perceived as a distinct goddess embodying the planet Venus by the Hurrians, and she appears in such a role in at least one copy of the Weidner god list. She is generally outside the scope of not only this article but the entire series, but I nonetheless recommend this article by Gary Beckman about her. In many Elamite sources Simut seems to be associated with the imported Akkadian goddess Manzat, the rainbow. It’s commonly assumed they were spouses, though there seems to be no direct statement on the matter in any sources I’m aware of other than multiple shared temples, and such a belief was likely limited to Elam as in Mesopotamian sources Manzat is either unmarried (god list An-Anum) or the wife of the judge god Ishtaran. For some scholarly discussion of Manzat see this article by W. G. Lambert, you may also remember that I covered her in detail a few months ago. Simut’s popularity was remarkable in his homeland: he appears frequently in personal names in all periods of Elamite history, and even in some Mesopotamian ones, perhaps due to the Elamite influence evident in sources from the early 2nd millennium BCE. He even gets a handful of mentions in early Persian sources. It’s worth noting that while early 20th century authors such as Walther Hinz (avoid his publications; for decades they were the only in depth works on Elam but this is thankfully changing) found it preposterous that Persians had anything but disdain for Elamites (see the “further reading” section for details), the primary sources from the reign of earliest Persian emperors paint a very different image. Elamites, the indigenious population of the area which came to be known as Persia, while somewhat small in number, are attested in various strata of society, and even formed a part of the official administration - possibly in part repurposing preexisting Elamite structures. Meanwhile, Elamite gods, especially the kingship god Humban, retained some degree of popularity at least for the first few decades. In the so-called Persepolis fortification archive there are mentions of both priests with Persian names in texts documenting festivals of Elamite gods and vice versa. Of course, the traces of Elamite culture eventually vanished, and it’s hard to imagine that later more dogmatic Zoroastrianism would have room for Inshushinak, Humban or Pinikir, but at least very early on it was possible for Ahura Mazda to coexist with them.

Further reading:

Humban and Auramazdā: royal gods in a Persian landscape by W. F. M. Henkelman

Šimut  (Reallexikon der Assyriologie entry) by W. F. M. Henkelman

The Other Gods Who Are by W. F. M. Henkelman

[ebenenoir]

The “indigenous person” (ID) has several accounts. They have never posted or discussed anything about indigenous people on their own account, yet are asking P and SM to post about if? ID has referred to themselves as Irish more anything anything else and even some of their profiles don’t even list “indigenous.”

Secondly, the ID is a screenwriter/graphic producer/costumer. They post about winning awards and such. (And the. They complain about SM is self promoting?) anyway, the ID is in film. They’ve written screenplay. They live in LA. They have been harassing Pedro about “working with him.” Then the ID went after SM in order to get to Pedro. This all came from someone who is very close to Pedro and watches social media for him. Another connection I have, has suggested that this ID person is the one who began physically stalking him during the lockdown, but couldn’t figure who they were. The connection was made today, which is why they were blocked. All you have to do is google search the ID’s name and there’s several red flags out there. It’s very easy to find all three of their Instagram accounts and see that they haven’t posted anything about indigenous people in anyway. Which has many fans questioning the validity of the IDs accusations of “calmly commenting” and getting blocked. Since the gossip blogs ran with the ID’s story, the ID person kept feeding you all lies. You should be looking into these claiming before falsely accusing Pedro of wrongdoing. You have no idea how limited and private he has to be because of people like this. The exact reason why he’s not posting on social media anymore. He’s protecting himself and his loved ones. Help protect him instead of spreading lies someone fed you. Do a little research first before posting. He has several stalkers physically tracking and even watching him. In some ways, he’s scared. So please try to protect him better from people like this.

Let's start from the beginning. As I said yesterday, the anon has always been very open about their life with me. From the first day they expressed theif disagreement with SM, they told me straight out that they were a White passing Indigenious. I don't remember them mentioning Irish because we talk about a lot of things. This morning I tried to reread our very long conversations and thdy mentioned a trip to Ireland. Knowing that I know a little bit more about her family, you're not even close to knowing about their origins but never mind. I'd like to know what makes you think they talk more about being Irish than Indigenous? According to them, they talk about both in their interviews?

Besides, even if they're pale or whatever, they're still Indigenious. So they're allowed to criticize any writer who write about their community. You completely missed the point. They never asked Pedro anything. Since SM talks about indigenous and uses them for his writing inspiration, the fan asked to him amplify indigenous voices by giving them a tribute, sharing useful links so people can learn and stop posting real tragic events with captions of his book and book editor like he did lately. I know about the anon's job because they told me everything by explaining what they and , mentioning their collaborators. They actually showed me an email the day they were announced a finalist for a film competition. That was weeks ago I googled their name anyway, they have multiple pages with their name, interviews and even an imdb page. Is it naive of me to think it would be very stupid of them to stalk and harass Pedro with their professional name? I would like to know what evidence you have that lead to them harassing Pedro to work with him? I read an interview where they mentioned that she would like to write for several series including The Mandalorian. Is that what you're referring to? I am genuinely asking. I take accusations of stalking very seriously. I hope you realize that these are serious accusations because the act is immoral and illegal.  I have no problem admitting when I'm wrong. I don't know if you are the same person or 3 different Anons. Last night I asked for proof but nothing was given to me. Now I ask you again to bring me proof by dm, anon, submit m. I remain open to discussion. If you want to remain anonymous, I will keep it anonymous for you. I will say this though. The anon didn't live in LA during the lockdown. They have lived elsewhere in California with their family. This was reported by in an interview available on Google'. Anyway , they have already showed me a picture of a dinner with their family a few weeks ago.

There is big difference between sharing suspicious about the Pedro blocking the anon on ig and accusing them of stalking and harrasing him. That's why I am asking for proofs. Until we get an answer from those anons, I suggest we close the subject.

[namorthesubmariner]

Let me preface this by saying that this response is not an attack on you, but a more general response to the many times I've seen these fandom opinions over my years as a Namor fan, and I personally do not care about the NamorSue ship at all. As a Namor fan, this sucks for many reasons, but rather than just leave it there I will explain why:

It’s weird to imagine since Namor is very different from his comic counterpart. He's actually not. At all. Comic!Namor's people were a indigenious racially ambiguous fictional sea people before they were made into Atlanteans, the original creator didn't want them to be from Atlantis when he first created them. Mcu!Namor is very solidly based on the early interpretation of the character. But instead of it being a racially ambiguous native people, they gave them a real world mesoamerican background. Read "Namor was never White to begin with" in which I explain to fans why Comic!Namor has always been coded as a biracial man. The only people who think Namor is different from comics to movie is the people who never actually know the character or base their knowledge of him on the ReedSueNamor drama in F4/other comics, when in his own comics he has a very different consistent characterization that isn't changed the instant Susan appears.

Tenoch's portrayal of Namor is exactly like his comic counterpart save for a major difference: His Talokanil people actually love Namor, the comic Atlanteans despise him for being a "half breed" so comic!Namor only had Lady Dorma, Namora, and his mother Princess Fen, treat him kindly. Everything else about Tenoch!Namor is literally ripped out of the comics, A warrior poet king who does art and wages war to protect his people? Namor in the comics does this, he creates art, he is a protector of his people, his very name in Atlantean means "Avenging Son" which his mother gave him. He is meant to grow up, be the protector and avenging son of his people. Namor is son of Talokan, as he is the son of Atlantis. It's literally the same character on screen as is in the comics, except as I said, we are now in an era where we don't have to be ambiguous about Namor's origins. The real world translation works so much better and allows the character to be seen for what he's always been. Other than that, other notable similarities: Namor's dark humor to Shuri is the same as his dry/dark humor in the comics. Namor putting his people before himself, his own body on the line, namor doing everything he can to protect his people/their lives. Namor being a princely figure etc. It's the same character and frankly anyone who says it's not, is wrong. The characterization of Namor on screen is the most accurate adaptation of any comic character I've ever seen.

So how would this work? Because right now, I’m just imagining Namor saying, “I hate all colonizers!” before he sees Susan Storm. He then says, “I hate all colonizers…but she’s alright with me!”

On a more serious note, if the writers are willing to dig deep and make this work, I can picture a storyline in which Namor and Sue are forced to spend time together. Maybe Sue is taken to Talokan because Johnny got captured by Namor’s people, so she’s there to negotiate his release. Namor then starts talking about how much he hates the surface world and so on and so forth. But through his interactions with Sue, he slowly starts to soften his perspective since he’s won over by Sue’s kindness and empathy. And, obviously, he thinks she’s gorgeous because she’s Vanessa Kirby. Basically…Beauty and the Beast (but Beast isn’t cursed). Yes, let's get serious: Susan being taken to Talokan because Johnny was captured is literally beat for beat: Shuri demands to be taken to Talokan because Riri was captured. It's literally the same. Why would we ever need to repeat that in service to a subpar ship? Yes, I do call NamorSue subpar, it's actually a horrid ship for Namor's character, it's done nothing to aid his character because he is just used as a tool for ReedSue: A brief explainer on the ReedSueNamor drama is linked here and I will be releasing a longer meta piece on that subject in the future. Another thing to note here: Susan was never the one who shows namor a different path/changes Namor's mind about humanity. It was Betty Dean.

I am actually very tired of fans erasing Betty Dean and her importance in the comics to Namor over Susan. Betty was Namor's actual first surface friend, his actual first love interest, a character who was among the very early women in comics who had her own agency and was not tied down to a romance. Sue's compassion to Namor is literally shown as "Hey maybe you three (the rest of the F4) shouldn't fight against 1 person, 3:1, because it's unfair." She recognizes that Namor was a tormented person, and thinks he deserves better, she had a slight crush on him once and it was over. Betty Dean is the actual person who talks to Namor, who tells him "not all human are bad" Susan never does this. Again, brief explainer: Betty Dean was a undercover cop working in New York when Namor starts making trouble in town, she is called in to try and capture/stop him. She pretends to drown when she sees him and Namor upon seeing her says "you are too pretty to die, even though you are an american" he saves her only for her to put a gun to his head, Namor thinks to use Betty against her people but before that goes any further war is upon them. Namor goes off to fight, and comes back after, where Betty talks to Namor about his hatred for humanity and asks him to join in their fight in the war against the Nazis, yes, Namor was the first comic character to be featured fighting Nazis. Namor talks to her about the harm her people have done, and in the end takes her words under consideration, returns home to speak to his tribe elders (his grandfather, Emperor Tha-Korr) and goes to join in the war to help Betty. It's Betty who reaches out to Namor, who tries to talk with him, who becomes his life long friend, and yes I do mean until she's an old woman. She and Namor lost touch for several decades but she reappears in the comics as an old woman, who is still Namor's friend and she even becomes the adopted mother to his cousin, Nita. (Namora's daughter)

"Beauty and the Beast but the beast isnt cursed" like, I don't want to say this but I will say this: That's racist, that is reducing Tenoch!Namor to a beast, a man of color being in that role when he's already faced so much fucking racism from fans? No. I say this as a fan who has devoured every type of Beauty and the Beast story since I was a kid, it's actually one of my most favorite dynamics in writing. I do not want that for Namor, ever. Because he's never a beast, he is a Noble Prince/King of a people who lost everything, their homes, their lives, to colonizers, whether they be Spanish Colonizers or White American Colonizers like in the comics. He's a Protector of this people and the Seas. He has his own romances that actually matter to his character and lore, and the women aren't treated as objects to lust over. He had 3 long term love interests in all his 80 some years of comics that are constantly being ignored so people can prop up NamorSue. Namor was married twice. He was widowed twice. In addition to Betty Dean, there's also Lady Dorma, Namor's first wife, and Marrina Smallwood, Namor's second wife. On another note: I just realized that this would be a love triangle in which two Latino men are fighting over a white woman. Make of that what you will.

I will make of this what I will: It's also racist. This entire thing plays on Namor being the "Aggressive Latino Lover" to Reed being the "wholesome husband" and yes the Sexually Aggressive Man of Color perusing a white woman is literally what NamorSue is in the comics, that's how it's written, no one wanted to see it because Namor had white passing skin, but when you read it it's there. Not to mention that no one ever brings up the fact that all throughout the years of Namor being used as a tool for ReedSue drama, it's hurt his character to the point where Fanon depicts him as hopelessly obsessively in love/lust with Susan, when she is never a major factor in any of his comics. I always tell fans that Namor in his own comics is different that Namor being written for F4 drama with ReedSue because writers are literally never letting that drama die, it makes marvel money, regardless if it's been overdone, regardless if its been explored in many different AUs, regardless if there was never anything there other than bad writing. NamorSue has always been to the determent of Namor's characterization in service to ReedSue.

Also as a final sidenote: If people actually read the comics they would know that Namor 1. gave his blessing for ReedSue getting married/gave them gifts 2. Helped ReedSue get back together twice when their marriage was on the rocks 3. Namor was raped by a shapeshifter wearing Sue's face, and Susan stops Namor from killing Llyra (woman who murdered dorma and namor's father and raped him), like why would anyone still think after all this that just because writers have 1 note for Namor in F4 comics which is "namor makes a pass at susan because she is so beautiful, and so white, and so beautiful" that NamorSue is a good ship or something that should be explored when it's been done to literal death in the comics.

Anyways, I do wish fans would actually take the time to understand the widely spread Fanon about Namor is wrong, and that we do not need to ever see ReedSueNamor drama in the movies or even the comics. I will actually put a plea out here to fans to please stop and think about this before promoting it. Like I do not care if people want to ship stuff on their own, I won't go into those ship spaces, but I do want people to understand that many fans keep repeating the same takes over and over again and it's wrong.

As a Namor fan: Keep that shit NamorSue ship out of the movies forever, he doesn't need that. He is a great character on his own and Susan does deserve to constantly be reduced to a sexual object 2 men fight over, as Marvel's leading lady of comics she deserves much better.

Okay, here’s a thought. If the next Fantastic Four movie attempts to do the Namor-Sue-Reed love triangle, how would that even work? For convenience sake, let’s say the F4 ended up in the MCU after discovering multiversal travel. And when they land on MCU Earth, they encounter Namor.

It’s weird to imagine since Namor is very different from his comic counterpart. His focus is primarily on fighting the surface world/colonizers since he’s still scarred from how the Spanish treated his people. And the MCU’s version of his name is now supposed to be “El Niño sin Amor”, the boy without love. See the dilemma? You’re taking someone who’s supposed to be without love and putting him in a love triangle lol.

(Before I get any comments, I know they didn’t mean romantic love. I’m just saying, it’s kinda funny that the character without love is now in a storyline all about love)

So how would this work? Because right now, I’m just imagining Namor saying, “I hate all colonizers!” before he sees Susan Storm. He then says, “I hate all colonizers…but she’s alright with me!”

On a more serious note, if the writers are willing to dig deep and make this work, I can picture a storyline in which Namor and Sue are forced to spend time together. Maybe Sue is taken to Talokan because Johnny got captured by Namor’s people, so she’s there to negotiate his release. Namor then starts talking about how much he hates the surface world and so on and so forth. But through his interactions with Sue, he slowly starts to soften his perspective since he’s won over by Sue’s kindness and empathy. And, obviously, he thinks she’s gorgeous because she’s Vanessa Kirby. Basically…Beauty and the Beast (but Beast isn’t cursed).

And then, Namor being Namor, he demands that Sue leave Reed Richards and stay with him in Talokan. If not, something something I’ll defeat your husband in mortal combat for your hand in marriage blah blah blah. And then Reed’s gotta fight Namor, Sue makes it a point that she chose Reed, Namor is too stubborn to take the hint, and so on and so forth.

(Side note: I just realized that this would be a love triangle in which two Latino men are fighting over a white woman. Make of that what you will.)

[dakotacrisis]

Transferred (6)

Awkwardness, advice, and even more awkwardness. (The word awkward now doesn’t even sound real. You’re welcome for this awkward description.)

---

“Quinn, do you know when that essay for history is due?” Marinette walked into class with Nanette and Quinn.

“Um,” They checked their arms, “Thursday?”

“You need to get a planner or something.” Marinette sighed.

“I’ve been barking up that tree for three years.” Nanette rolled her eyes.

“I have a system.” Quinn scoffed.

“Writing everything on your arms is not a productive system.” Marinette argued.

“Says you!”

“Quinn, darling, as someone who meticulously keeps an organized and color coded planner/calendar in my room this ‘system’ of yours gives me anxiety. For all that is sweet and holy, buy an actual planner. Download an app on your phone. Something!” Marinette begged.

Marinette really liked Quinn, they were smart and fun and had an encyclopedic knowledge on everything having to do with conspiracy theories and cryptids. Marinette hadn’t even heard of the giant snail like creature, Lou Carcolh, until they mentioned it once while hanging out at Marinette’s house. Like them as much as she did, their organization was zero. She’s seen their locker, their bookbag, she could only imagine the neat-freak meltdown she’d experience if she ever set foot in Quinn’s room.

“Nah, this is easier.” Quinn shrugged as they took their seat.

“Quinn...no…”

“Good morning,” Kagami approached their table. Ever since Marinette had talked to her that first day the two were getting along better. Kagami was even starting to branch out more to her classmates. “Did you all have a nice weekend?”

“Morning, Kagami,” Nanette smiled back at her, “I had a great weekend. I even got to meet Marinette’s boyfriend, Adrien.”

Kagami’s pleasant expression faltered and the temperature in the room dropped ten degrees.

“Nani,” Marinette pinched Nanette’s arm forcefully, “I told you he’s not my boyfriend.”

“The way he was looking at you though and how much you talk about him--”

“Shh!” Marinette clamped a hand over her mouth, “We are just friends. He doesn’t see me that way at all.”

Kagami muttered something under her breath that Marinette didn’t catch. Probably cursing the fact that Marinette liked Adrien too. Every time Adrien got brought up, in even the tiniest of moments, things between Kagami and Marinette soured. An unspoken rivalry for the blonde’s affections tensing the air without saying a word.

Class started and Marinette went back to her seat. She risked a glance at Kagami and sighed. She really was a nice girl when you get past her hard outer shell. They even seemed to have quite a lot in common when they got right down to it. A little too much in one case. And that is what drove them apart every time.

Adrien.

A crush on a boy isn’t what should split what would otherwise be a pair of close friends, should it?

“Alright students,” Mr. Babineaux started handing out papers, “To finish out our study of Utopia, we are going to be doing a pairs project. You and your partner will create your own utopian island. You have complete creative control but there are a few points that everyone must hit. 1: Draw a map of your utopia. 2: List the laws and regulations of your utopia. Lastly, write a small essay on the values the indigenious people of your island hold and why, minimum two pages. If you want to add other things like culture, holidays, or what have you then that is more than welcome. You have the rest of class to find your partner and start your project. This will be due next Wednesday where you will present your utopia to the class. Have at it.”

Immediately everyone started pairing off. Marinette stretched her head to look at Nanette and Quinn but they were already huddled together making rough sketches of their island. Looking around the only available person seemed to be Kagami.

“So…” Marinette smiled at her, hoping to diffuse some of the tension, “Want to be partners?”

“That sounds nice.” Kagami stated matter of factly.

Oh boy.

They started by outlining the core laws their island would function under and then moved onto what the punishment for breaking the laws may entail. Kagami seemed to have a much harsher form of punishment then Marinette had in mind. Marinette was able to talk her down out of anything lethal. Although she may have let slide the liars have their tongues cut out rule for reasons…

The bell rang and everyone started packing up for their next class.

“I was thinking, I don’t know what your schedule is like but maybe we can figure out a day to get together and keep working on the project. I’m not too worried about the map but I think we would need more time than class allows to hash out the culture and values of our island.” Marinette explained as she and Kagami packed their things.

“I’ll let you know when I’m free. With tournament season coming up my mother has arranged for me to spend more time practicing my fencing.” Kagami said, “I’ll probably barely see anyone outside of Mr. D’Argencourt, mother, and Adrien.”

And there was the tension again.

“Right, you have my number so you just let me know. We’ll figure something out.” Marinette smiled through the awkwardness.

After school let out Marinette opened her phone and pulled up her contacts. She wanted to talk to someone about this whole Kagami and Adrien situation. Nanette and Quinn are great but they don’t have the whole story and Marinette was not in the mood to explain everything. She sure as heck couldn’t talk to Adrien about it. Aurore didn’t really know Kagami. Wayhem can’t keep a secret to save his life. Chloe was a hard no for many reasons and not just because she went AWOL.

She stared for a long minute at Alya’s name. She would understand what Marinette was going through. At the very least she’d be able to give her some advice.

Marinette put her phone away with a sigh. “Why such a long face?” Tikki whispered, popping her little head out of Marinette’s purse.

“I want to be friends with Kagami cause she’s really nice and we can get along but every time Adrien gets mentioned things go south. We don’t say anything but I can feel it. It’s like there is a string between Kagami and I that frays a little more when Adrien is mentioned. I want to say something but I feel like doing so would just make things worse. What if I say something wrong and we end up arguing? I don’t want to fight what could be a good friend over a love triangle.”

“I feel like not saying anything could do more harm then ignoring it altogether.”

“I know but what if--”

A loud crash from down the road halted Marinette’s reply. A dozen or so people were running away as more crashes crept closer to where she was. An akuma no doubt.

Marinette ducked into an alleyway. This Kagami situation would have to wait. “Tikki, transform me!”

Marinette lunged onto the roof of the nearest building and searched for the source of the destruction.

“BAH!” A giant baby waddled around the corner, “BAH!”

“Seriously? Hawkmoth akumatized August again?” She sighed. At least she knew how to deal with this akuma already. Not as easy as taking down Mr. Pigeon but at least she didn’t have to worry about Chat’s allergies.

“I’m guessing someone’s pretty cranky about being woken up from their nap.”

Speak of the devil.

“Hey Chat Noir,” Marinette greeted her partner, “It’s been a while.”

“Too long, my lady,” he grinned back at her, “While I did enjoy the break from akumas I did miss our moments together.”

“Which ones? Where I throw you at akumas or when you leap into the line of fire yourself?”

“Yes.”

“Let’s just get junior here pacified before dinner. I think giant babies would take a lot more than a bottle to keep them happy.”

“True.”

Marinette scanned over the akuma. What was his problem today? He wasn’t chewing on anything so it wasn’t teething. He was rubbing his eyes a lot. Maybe he really was grumpy from waking up or just too tired to realize that sleeping would rid him of his grumpy mood.

“We need to get him to fall asleep.” She told Chat Noir, “Help me lure him somewhere with room enough to lay down. I have an idea.”

“On it.” Chat Noir jumped closer, “Hey! Over here! Wanna play with a kitty? Gotta catch me first!”

The pair went running as a sleepy August waddled after them.

Marinette knew that she should focus on the akuma but her thoughts about Kagami wouldn’t leave her be. “Chat, can I ask you something?”

“Anything,” he shrugged as they ran, “Finally gonna ask me on a date?”

“Not so lucky, minou,” she rolled her eyes, “You see, there’s this person I’ve started making friends with but she likes the same guy as me. I still want to be friends with her but the topic always brings up a cloud of awkwardness because of this boy. Any advice?”

“I have two options.”

“What’s the first one?”

“Talk to her. If the both of you want to be friends but this subject of a shared crush makes things uncomfortable then you need to address it. You don’t have to bow out of your crush so the other isn’t awkward but keep pursuing this mystery boy without letting it harm your friendship. If you truly are on good terms then a little rivalry is fine as long as you don’t delve into underhanded tactics like sabotage.”

“And what was option two?”

“Ditch mystery boy and go out to the movies with me?” he asked with a hopeful but joking smile.

“I think I’ll stick with option one. Thanks though.”

They got to the football field arena and circled around August. He wouldn’t cause anymore damage here.

“What’s the plan?” Chat Noir asked.

“We got him here, now we need to get him to sleep. Let me see what I got,” She thrust her yo-yo into the sky, “Lucky Charm!”

A CD dropped into her hands.

“A track of lullabies? Helpful.” Chat Noir shrugged.

“But not enough. No. We need back up.” Marinette sighed. “Someone who can cast a calming illusion.”

“Rena Rouge?”

“Yup,” Marinette grasped her yo-yo tighter, “I’ll be right back. You keep August entertained.”

She sped as fast as she could to Master Fu’s. He was unperturbed by her sudden appearance as was the case nowadays. “Marinette, in need of an ally today?”

“Yes, I need the Fox Miraculous.” She took the necklace out of the box.

“Is something the matter, Marinette?” Fu asked.

“Sorta, I know who I should give it to but I don’t want to. But I also could use someone who already know what to do.” she contemplated briefly giving the necklace to Chloe but with her under the radar dealings of late she wasn’t sure where to even find her. That really only left one option.

“Grudges are only a form of self-punishment. Remember that, Marinette.” Fu told her, “Do not let your emotions stand in the way of the common good.”

“You’re right.” She looked to Tikki to make sure she was recharged, “Let’s get going. I don’t know how much longer Chat can keep a giant toddler in one place.”

After transforming back into Ladybug, Marinette sped as fast as she could to Alya’s house. She hesitated at the window before shaking the contempt from her mind. Ladybug isn’t mad at Rena Rouge.

She knocked on the window startling Alya off her bed. Quickly she ran to the door and thrust it open. “Ladybug? What’s up?”

Marinette held out the box with necklace. “I need Rena Rouge for a quick mission.”

“Oh, right,” Alya took the box but didn’t open it.

“Problem?”

“No, I just…” She looked back at her bed where her laptop sat with what looked like fifteen or more tabs opened, “I was doing some research. But duty calls!”

She transformed into Rena and the pair went vaulting back across the rooftops to the arena. Chat unfortunately had been caught by August and was turning a sickly green shade from being waved around in the toddler’s hand.

“Cast an illusion of a giant mobile to help him fall asleep. I have some tunes to put on.” Marinette ran towards the commentator box and popped the CD into the arena stereo system. A minute later a giant mobile appeared over the field spinning plush ladybugs, black cats, foxes and turtles on strings.

August stopped playing with Chat Noir and focused on the mobile. Combined with the soothing music he was yawning and soon curled up on the grass for a nap. Chat wiggled his arm free and cataclysmed the bracelet where the akuma was. After that Marinette went out to catch it and thrust the CD into the sky to right all the damage August had caused this time.

The sleeping toddler was taken back to his mother by Chat while Marinette collected the necklace from Alya. “Thanks for letting me help out today.” she said.

“We needed you.”

“I’m sure you could have figured something out without me. Truth be told, I haven’t felt very heroic lately.” Alya twiddled her thumbs. The beeping of Marinette’s earrings told her she needed to get out of there fast.

“Wait!” Alya stopped her, “Can I ask you something?”

“I’m kinda in a hurry--”

“Are you friends with a girl named Lila Rossi?”

The question took her aback. “No. Outside of when she was akumatized and a less than flattering confrontation when she tried to use me as a pick-up line I have never interacted with her. Why?”

“Nothing...research...it’s not important. See you later, Ladybug.” Alya ran from the arena to return home.

Marinette’s transformation wore off and Tikki landed on her shoulder. “Are you okay? Seeing Alya again must have been strange.”

“Yeah, kinda,” Marinette reached into her bag and pulled out another cookie for her kwami. “Let’s head home after we return the Miraculous. I’m too emotionally worn out to contemplate further human interaction.”

The walk home Marinette checked her messages. She had a text from Kagami telling her what times she could work on their project. They set a meeting time for Friday after school to work. With Chat’s advice still ringing in her ears Marinette made a mental note to talk to Kagami so they could get on the same page about their feelings regarding Adrien. Not today though. The rest of today was going to be fruit tarts and video game therapy.

---

(1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (7)

[sereniv]

Does anyone have evidence that actual vegans have attacked indigenous practices? Not PETA aligned, not dieters, not new vegans- people who go by the vegan society definition.

Because I've been vegan for 7 years, soon to be 8 and I havnt once seen an actual vegan do this.

Legit question bc people always say they come across these vegans and its like do you though? Are they actually vegans or people who are simply plant based? Or people who aren't even plant based but simply racist?

To tell if someone is actually vegan you have to go through their history and see their actual stances and definition they go by.

Because indigeny aligns with veganism. it doesn't make sense to exclude it so that's why I'm suspicious