#Should NOT be legal bc. Well. You know. But morality is more complicated than that or whatever. My brain isn't working)

[trans-leek-cookie]

Remembering a take I saw like. "It's fine to do revenge but when you say 'this is so u can't hurt anyone else' thats cop behavior" and. The entire take sure is Something but uh. Mostly I think it's Fucking Bad

[seraphtrevs]

Possibly controversial take, but I think Kim in BCS is what the writers of Game of Thrones wished they wrote with Dany's arc. A woman who has been shaped by her background to have that strong and kind of merciless sense of justice, who wants to help the poor and downtrodden, but slowly comes to see herself as the only arbiter of right and wrong, and becomes convinced that she gets to punish those who deserve it cruelly.

Only when Game of Thrones did it, it sucked, because D&D hate women and the idea of challenging the status quo

I don't think that's controversial - that's an interesting point! I don't think that the comparison is completely apt (but I don't think that's what you were saying, either) - Dany kills a lot more people and has a lot more power, and the world she lives in demands violence from her and also looks to her as a legal arbiter of justice as a queen. But yes, the arc of a character starting off as genuinely righteous (freeing slaves, etc.) gradually losing sight of what motivated her and instead giving in to more personal vendettas is along the same lines. And of course it goes without saying that Dany's arc instead became an exercise in misogyny as well as completely nonsensical - thank god we have Gilligould instead of D&D. Kim's descent has been really interesting to watch because she genuinely believes in obtaining justice for the underpriveledged. Compare that to Walt's motives for "providing for his family," which is explicitly shown to be insincere very early in the series when he refuses Elliot and Gretchen's help. I think you'd have to do some pretty fancy mental gymnastics to claim that Kim's motives to help the unfortunate are self-serving (but I'm sure people are finding a way - after all, she is a woman and therefore 50x more guilty and 50x less sympathetic than male characters). The point of Kim's arc is that there are no good reasons to take justice into your own hands, even if you think you're being clever about it and it isn't "really" going to hurt anyone. There's never a good reason to hurt other people for your own sense of righteousness, and it can have consequences beyond what you intend. Since I love tragedy and complicated female characters, I'm loving her arc (which again, everyone SAYS female characters should get the chance to be as complicated and morally gray as male characters, but the moment a woman character does anything unsympathetic, she gets punted into the utterly and irredeemably eeeeeeevil/unsympathetic pile immediately, even if her misdeeds aren't on the same scale as the male characters. See also Shiv from Succession). Kim is a morally gray character. Her motives to help the helpless are just; her motives to humiliate Howard are not. Mike also got an innocent bystander murdered in his quest to take justice into his own hands when he went after Hector's truck, unintentionally getting the Good Samaritan who stopped to help the driver killed. Just like Kim, Mike did not intend on getting anyone killed - he was quite pleased with himself that his plan was victimless. He even left Hector's driver alive, although surely he must have known Hector would kill him, which he did. The result of his scam had a body count of two. It has never been controversial to continue to find Mike sympathetic the way it apparently is for Kim. Part of that is we didn't know Mike's victims the way we knew Howard (because if Howard is Kim's victim, then we must also consider the Good Samaritan and Hector's driver as Mike's victims), but just because we didn't know the Good Samaritan doesn't make Mike's actions morally superior to Kim's. It just means we don't find them as upsetting. (That's not even mentioning his murder of Werner, an innocent person, who Mike killed on purpose even though he knew it was wrong, but it's not an apt Kim comparison because she hasn't deliberately pulled the trigger on anyone, at least not yet.)

Sorry that kind of went off the rails lol. Back to your original point - I think that if we ever get more GRRM books, Dany's arc will look more similiar to Kim's, although obviously on a different scale. (My hot take - the ASoIaF books are good even if the show is garbage!)

[joanofarkansass]

Part 33 Meta

Ok watching “Part 33” Law and Order: SVU S20E14 and it’s such a good character study of all the SVU characters. For context the case is when a woman, Annabeth Pearl, kills her abusive husband. The episode is spliced between he team is waiting there to testify for Stone and the case itself and is shot entirely in the courthouse (which is smart move on the writers part it really narrows the scope and sets it apart from a regular episode). The viewers really see the team’s attitudes toward justice, morality, and duty especially how it intersects -- and occasionally interferes -- with their jobs. Spoilers obviously 

Sonny- He’s the most outwardly emotional out of the gang and the audience can see how he really empathizes and cares about justice for Annabeth instead of justice to Annabeth, despite her being the defendant. He argues passionately with Rollins and on the stand adds his own (legal) conjecture to his testimony with Stone, putting doubt on the loving marriage between Annabeth and her husband, directly undermining Stone. Drawing back, Sonny knows that cases don’t end when they leave the squad-room and the victim’s and perpetrator’s futures continue into the courtroom and he takes his moral compass seriously. He’s studying to be a lawyer. In his job as a cop his job is to back up the ADA and land a conviction, but he doesn’t believe she should go to jail (that her killing was justified) so on the stand, sure he tells the truth, but also does whatever he can to get her justice. Though his earnestness is a little self absorbed, it’s genuine and well meant and I think this will serve him so well as a lawyer. It’d be interesting to see in later seasons when he’s a ADA what he will do when he has to persue a case he doesn’t morally agree with.

Liv- her monologue about being in a abusive relationship and the little things that strip away your dignity is heartbreaking (Mariska you deserve an Emmy for this scene btw) (it’s also connected to the abuse she suffered at the hands of Lewis). She cares so much for the victims, it’s her greatest asset, and here it’s confounded by her strong duty to the law. This case is simple. Annabeth, according to the law, deserves to go to jail. She wasn’t in physical danger from her husband (not that anyone can prove at any rate). But Liv also knows that shooting her husband was the right thing to do in order to get out of that situation. Illegal, but right. These parts of her are at war (just like with that donor heart episode and Alex Cabot episodes in S19) and she chooses to tell the truth--to put Annabeth away-- because in the end the rule of law can’t be subverted no matter how immoral it can be

 Rollins. Oh darling, you’ve been through so much shit. Like, lets be real here the entire team has, but you especially. And the unfurling of her backstory, with her father beating her mother and her consequent resentment of her mother for failing to protect her and Rollins is heartbreaking. She was a child and those complicated, complicated emotions distilled in her, to the outside eye’s, in a confusing (illogical) way. She occasionally victim blames and we can see the origins of that tendency here in how her mother, herself a victim, failed to protect her and keep her family together. Is that fair? No. Is what Rollins went through fair? No. And like how what Liv went through with Lewis affected her and her work, what Rollins past affected her work and outlook too. We see it in her advocacy for “innocent until proven guilty” and her belief in the strength of the victims even at the worst point their lives. So yes, she believes in the law. She believes that Annabeth should be in jail. For her, that’s right. *

Stone- it’s easy to see him as the bad guy here, but for me it was a lot more nuanced than that. Part of it is a performance of course, he’s a prosecutor trying to get a conviction (if he wants to win he can’t be playing for the other side), but he does genuinely believe he’s getting justice. Especially as a ADA, he sees the worst of humanity and puts them to justice for it. He takes what the cops give him and make sure it stick that victims get justice. You can’t subvert the law, its the law. In order for anything to get done, there has to be some black and white. Guilty and Innocent. Truth and farce. And no matter how moral it may have been- no matter what Annabeth felt- she still killed her husband in cold blood. And just as her husband should have been accountable for his actions, she has to be accountable for hers. Nuance belongs at sentencing, but she did it. That’s what he’s trying to prove. 

Fin- We love some depth!! Fin can sometimes be treated as a one note character, and I’m glad Ice-T got to stretch his leg this episode. His whole facade “this is just another case to me” is peeled back by Liv and his story about throwing a fighting fish back into the bay was a touching way of showing his true feelings. He doesn’t believe she belongs in prison. But it’s not his place to judge, it’s the law’s. The law may not always be just or kind or even moral, but (on the whole) it’s consistent. It’s fair. And if we subvert it, we face a worse life than if we had one. 

I also really liked the ending. We don’t see the verdict, just Annabeth’s expression of horror as Liv testifies that she didn’t feel remorse about killing her husband, effectively nailing the lid on her coffin. It’s not ambiguous, the audience knows that she’s going to jail, but it stops that the emotional climax- Liv’s testimony. It doesn’t draw out the inevitable, it leaves the audience pondering the same questions that the team did. Is the law always just? What would you do if it wasn’t? Is it even your place to judge?

Thanks for reading! This was just an emotional reaction from me after watching the episode for the first time and I’d love to hear your reactions.

- Joan

Tagging some people bc I’m really proud of this: @hurricanejjareau, @qvid-pro-qvo, @writefasttalkevenfaster, @crazyshannonigans, @ssaic-jareau

PS: Personally, I’m in Fin’s camp. The law is there for a reason and if we broke it for any injustice it would eventually encroach on personal freedoms. Is it disgusting that he abused Annabeth? Without a doubt. Is it legal? Sadly, yeah. And until the law changes, it’s our duty to follow it. Should it be changed? That is the question. (this is just my opnion btw and I totally get and respect if you disagree)

*Do I believe Rollins should be in therapy? Hells yes. Her perspective is valid and needed as a counter part to Liv and Carisi more emotional ones, but it’s coming from a place that isn’t good. 

[urmomsstuntdouble]

ok not sure how comprehensible this post is gonna be but! regarding the languages discussion, here are my thoughts about the anglo americans. be warned this post is long as fuck, but thank you so much if you do read all of it, and i’d love to hear your thoughts about it as well! 

so i just wanna start with alfred’s name- alfred. i think he may be named after alfred the great of wessex, who may or may not have been the first king of england. he wasn’t technically the king of a unified england that we’d think of it as today- he was the king of wessex, as his title implies, but there was a point at which he was “in charge” or however you want to put it of most of present day southern england. anyway this presents the first of his issues with his identity. he’s permanently tied to britain beyond just his culture and most common language- his name is a reminder of who he “belongs to.” of course most people don’t know that and they just think it’s a little odd that this 19yo miles morales type is called alfred but eh, what are you gonna do. 

then you have the fact that there’s no official language in the US, which makes things a little harder for him. he’s never sure what language he’s supposed to be speaking in, as the human representative of america. he thinks it should be english, seeing as that is the lingua franca, but there’s times when he just doesn’t vibe with english as a language. i mentioned before that he struggles with keeping his (spanish) dialects straight (which @cupofkey summed up as immigrant-kid-syndrome and that’s exactly it), although its not limited to just spanish. he also has a hard time keeping other shit in line, to the extent where his thoughts are a messy jumble of languages, concepts, images, and feelings. this is most evident when he’s nervous, because his accent will get super thick and he’ll start just saying the words that pop into his mind, even if they’re in another language or straight up not words at all. the only peson who can understand him when he’s doing this is canada. both of them are countries of immigrants, although they are different in who immigrated and when, so they dont have the exact same nervous tick language, but it’s close enough that they can communicate well. it’s sort of like a more global version of europanto? might sound something like this to an outside observer, but again, more global (also for the video they dont start talking until 1:17). 

america and canada also have a sort of inextricable bond because of the first nations people. the first tribe that comes to mind are the members of the okanagan national alliance, which straddles the present day border of british columbia and washington state (this is also something america shares with mexico). it’s caused a lot of pain between them personally, and with the okanagan nation. just as the border itself is vague- though the us-canada border is more respected than the okanagan borders- the parts of their identities are also vague. they feel bits and pieces of themselves ebbing and flowing, and matt and fred have gotten into arguments about it because they struggle to define their identities and they just want to be able to explain themselves to themselves. but you know that often winds up causing friction with the okanagan nations, because whatever issues with identity regarding their indigenous people fred and matt are having. they’ve got it worse, only in a sort of..negative image. like whereas fred and matt feel it on the fringes of themselves, making it so they cant tell where they end and other nations begin, the okanagan nations feel themselves being slowly eroded. none of them want each other to suffer, though, because the okanagan people can be americans and canadians and okanagans all at the same time. 

this also applies with the american border with mexico, seeing as there’s some areas in the southwestern us where spanish is spoken more than english. when he’s down there, freddie finds it easier to communicate than when he’s speaking english. chicano is his language just as much as english is- he just sort of became able to speak it when the west was colonized, and he already knew spanish for business purposes, so there ya go. there are some issues with that though because the spanish in the west is primarily from mexico and central america, whereas the east is more from the caribbean- like how miami has a large cuban minority. so he’s got a weird sort of chicano english too, because it’s no longer “pure” chicano. pure is a very loose term there because there is of course variation within southwestern chicano speakers. angelinos don’t have the same chicano as nuevomexicanos. anyway i think he’d get it mixed up with spanish proper or spanglish a lot because of the similar phonetic rules. i’m not sure about any indigenous tribes who have land that straddles the us-mexico border, but that’s probably not alfred’s biggest worry with That Border. actually no i think he might purposefully talk in an aggressively chicano dialect whenever someone in the government wants to talk to him about the ice concentration camps. like he usually doesn’t try that hard to keep the wrong language out of his mouth but he will go Full Chicano, just to make them uncomfortable and to try to get the point across that he can literally feel the physical pain of the people trapped at the border in those camps. but this also causes some tension with the countries of origins of those people, seeing as they can also feel that pain. there’s quite a lot of discourse between america, mexico, guatemala, honduras, and el salvador about that, because none of them quite know what to do. they argue again about whose pain it is and how they should, as nation personifications, deal with it.

another thing that he struggles with where matt is concerned is with his indigenous languages. the languages of his northernmost people are the most at risk and endangered, and some are actually in the process of dying. he hates that, because as much as he wants to act like he speaks just SCE and quebecois, he doesn’t. he knows all of his people’s languages, and it makes him feel like he’s losing his identity a little bit when his indigenous languages start fading away. the worst part about this is that he doesn’t even always know it’s happening until the fading feeling kicks in, so sometimes he’ll just make a point of going up to the northwestern territories and try to hang out with the oldest inuit people he can find to try and have a chat. and it’s ROUGH communicating at first but when he can get back into it he feels more solid and defined. i think this isn’t unique to him, and that the other countries in the americas do this too, but bc of the way civil rights work in canada, it’s a little different for him. because indigenous canadians are recognized as a certain class of citizen, indigenous canadian governments have a collective legal bargaining power and could theoretically ask for legal protections from the ottowa government for their languages. however, this doesn’t apply to the northwest territories, so that’s why matt goes there specifically to talk to old ass indigenous people. their languages aren’t protected legally in the same way that french and quebecois are, so he sort of takes it upon himself as mr canada to do preserve the languages and history. it’s especially sad when a language dies out forever, because then he’s one of very few people who still speak it and if he wants anyone else to know about it he’d have to teach them. but since the language is dead, there’s no one for him to get help from. the people who once spoke it are gone or use other languages now, and it’s all very weight of the world on his shoulders. i think this makes him very sad, because of the weirdly smug left wing anti-american nature of canadian nationalism. like he understands exactly the sort of pressure freddie is under but also has a cultural pressure to not say anything about it or even offer to help. 

this is also why he has the most boring and basic idiolect out of perhaps the entire anglosphere- even arthur has a distinct posh dialect that he uses most of the time. matthew talks like a textbook. a very polite and anxious textbook, but a textbook all the same. and matthew williams actually kind of likes what alfred jones has going on, but canada doesn’t. canada fell into british hands after the end of the 7yr war, which happened to be the war that sparked the american revolution (speaking of which the ages for america and canada make no goddamn sense, ask me about it if you want more detailed thoughts). loyalists fled to canada, and developed a superiority complex around the idea that they weren’t ungrateful. then it was about how they weren’t slave owners- which isn’t entirely true- and in the present day, even in hetalia canon, canadians often define themselves in relation to america. that is, they are better than americans because of xyz political thing. right now, to quote the anime, it’s “our free healthcare and lack of gun crime, eh.” this also poses some difficulties for canada in terms of culture, though, because if that much of their national pride comes from being better than america, what do they have to make a name for themselves? for anglo canadians, that’s a more complicated question. for quebeckers, it’s that the’re not anglo canadians. but quebec is also annoying as fuck and canada actually has nightmares about there being a successful secession movement there, so. i don’t know what the average anglo canadian thinks of quebec seeing as im not an average anglo canadian, but i do know that i hate their accents so now matt does too, although he will respect their right to have their language protected by the ottowa government (because quebec, that’s why). 

anyway i do have one last thought and that’s that nobody will ever really know america or canada like they know each other. they struggle with a lot of the same issues regarding language, but america has just sort of given up. in some ways, matt’s jealous of him, and in others he’s so glad he’s not the united states. but they do understand each other a lot as the anglo americans, and as some of the number one destinations for immigration out of the entire world. so yeah, i dont have any specific strong conclusion ot this post, but would absolutely love to hear your thoughts about languages in the americas! shit’s wack in this neck of the woods my dudes. 

oh actually one last thing. i think america and canada struggle a bit with their identities because they dont fit into any one specific group, linguistically or otherwise. they feel a bit isolated from the rest of the world specifically due to the intensity of the melting pot effect, and even within their own countries sometimes. people will be like oh you’re too white or you’re too black or you’re too dine or too much whatever other culture, so they often feel isolated from that stuff because they are all of those things, and have a deep connection with all of it. anyway they’ll always be there for each other

[dearmyjimin]

i want to say that you should write a fic that you yourself would read. there's no point catering to people's specific preferences, because there's always someone who is going to disagree with how you've done something. as long as everything is properly tagged and isn't problematic (racist/sexist/homophobic/transphobic/includes underage idols) then write how you want to write :) xx

Thank you ;~; I will definitely take note of these because well a fic takes longer time than graphics and you’d certainly not want people to hate your hardwork.. but yup ofc the tags and stuff would be very important since the fandom has minors and we wouldn’t want them to learn the wrong things!

Anonymous said: for your writing thing; I think you could take a look arnd inktaes kind of angst? she’s very good at it 👌

oh!!! ok i’ll take a look, does she write on tumblr or on AO3?

Anonymous said: hi! about your incest question, although fiction is fiction, if its about real people, i really wouldn’t write about incest, because its just disrespectful? Like i wouldn’t want that kind of thing linked to my name, even if its just fanfiction. But thats just my personal opinion - Hope this helps! :D

You’re being very kind about this ^^/ thank you! And yeah another anon was talking about this too, like jimin and his real bro would be gross, but taehyung and jimin written as brothers is still acceptable since they aren’t brothers in real life. I’ll take your opinion into consideration because yeah I have siblings too and i shudder thinking about it as well! So, I get what you mean !!

Anonymous said: oh but i don’t think rape scenes should ever be written in a fic involving real people!!!!!

Ooh!! Okay yup I’ll take note of this!! I’ve not written about that before and I don’t think I would write about it anytime soon… ^^

Anonymous said: i think incest is a really complicated topic ;; i would say it’s not ok if it involves real people and their real siblings, but if it’s fictional characters or two real people just written as brothers for the story it’s more ok. and for stuff like rape, i think if you’re going to write it it needs to be written in a very sensitive way, if that makes any sense… and ofc everything needs to be tagged appropriately

yup i agree, its super complicated and sensitive to talk about ;; yup another anon brought up the same point as you, about real siblings (no, no!) and two real people who aren’t siblings irl (still ok). And yeah no, I doubt I will write stuff about rape tbh I don’t have any fic ideas about it too. Thanks for letting me know how you feel! ^^

Anonymous said: Please don’t :/

Okay ^^;

Anonymous said: Please don’t fucking write something like that, that’s disgusting…

I was just asking around for opinions !!

Anonymous said: Hmm, I think fanfiction with incest/incestuous themes is okay, as long as the characters are not blood relatives in real life and the proper warnings are given. For example, I think it would be okay to write about vmin in an incestuous relationship, but it would not be okay, at all, to write about a bts member (or whoever) in an incestuous relationship with their blood relative in real life.

Yup someone else said the same thing as you, which seems to be the general consensus. Thanks for letting me know!!! ^^

Anonymous said: I think the (my) problem with incest is that I always want a happy ending in fic (and stories in general) but I don’t want brothers to end up together, so that clashes, you know? And yeah, rape should totally not be a thing, at least not portrayed in a good light!

Oh yeah… I doubt fics with incestuous themes will have a happy ending, it’s more like portraying a character undergoing that huge emotional turmoil of thinking about something so wrong and immoral…. and yup rape shouldn’t never be portrayed in a good light ;~;

Anonymous said: If they’re just step-siblings, only bound by their parent’s marriage/relationship, then it’s not incest. So, the step-siblings could have a relationship if they want, but it’s not going to be pleasant or “cute” in my book.

Yup that’s kinda true, like if character A was introduced/adopted at a young age and has absolutely no blood-relation to character B, maybe it will be more acceptable i guess? But another anon was saying how its still weird because they have step-siblings they grew up with, so i’m still trying to get more opinions from ARMYs ^^;;

Anonymous said:  (I’m “since it’s fiction” anon) What I mean is that I think it’s ok to occur in fiction but not in a way where it can be misinterpreted as something ideal/desireable because incest is prohibited in so many countries and it can also lead to genetic disorders if were to get pregnant and if it’s with someone before or during puberty it actually counts as sexual assault towards children which is one of the most damaging traumas for kids to experience, so no thank you and no no for young people 2read

Yup ok, agreed! incest cannot be glamourised as something ideal and desirable and the author must be responsible to craft the story in a way that still frowns upon this. And yup I get the the prohibition and the genetic disorders part and yeah :/ we wouldn’t children and minors to think its ok. Got it, i’ll take note of your opinion!! Thanks for letting me know!

Anonymous said: like i don’t think it’s appropriate or morally right to write about minors in a sexual manner especially if they’re real people. like a lot of people write about jungkook before he was legal and even when he became legal it was almost like people were waiting for that so they could write smut about him. another would be r*pe but I also understand that there are ways to write r*pe without glamorizing the act.

Oh my .. yikes… :O yeah especially when the fandom is growing and we have young people with us, we need to be extremely careful ;;

Anonymous said: Mmmm incest is abusive and traumatizing to people esp when it happens to kids so to write it in a fic you’d have to be super careful if ur gonna make it angst or just.. not write it at all lmao bc most incest fics I feel like just romanticize it and make it gross. Why would someone want to write about such a topic

Hmmm if I guess people write it between, let’s say, two BTS members, the author perhaps just wants to write about forbidden love because yeah we all know such love isn’t possible. But I’m not too sure though.. it’s just a guess on my part. From the opinions given I think it’s more like people are sorta ok if the two characters are not brothers in real life.

Anonymous said: Does a threesome with two brothers/sisters count as incest? 🤔

For me, I will classify it as incest! 

Anonymous said: I would read it if it was stepbrothers, but blood related might be a bit too out of the social norms for me 😬

Okay ^^ noted!! 

Anonymous said: (i hope its not too late to tell u this??? lol) as long as you dont encourage themes like rape, incest, etc and dont write about real people in such situations i guess its fine

Hmm nope it’s not too late to tell me this :) And yeah nope i was just thinking about the idea of writing it in a fic and was just wondering how people would feel about it! Yup other anons were saying that writing about real people is a big no no and it shouldn’t be encouraged, which i agree too!