#I have ideas for my alternate story route where the androids get to be involved more

[egg-emperor]

I love the Shadow android concept that was never properly utilized in the games and I find that sad. I can't expect that from IDW either (I like the times they have used them but they never dive in that much because they barely use Eggman either) so I've came up with a lot of ideas for them myself over the years.

Like Eggman really just contained the real Shadow and likely used him to make his tons of android clones of the ultimate life form and they barely used them for anything but that's so cool. I can imagine his mindset was like "my grandfather created just one but look how many I can make haha" even though they're not as powerful as the real deal but hush

It could be a reason why he scoffs and says Shadow is the "so called" ultimate life form and disses his grandfather like that in the TailsTube ep. He thinks he can do better, like it's nothing he can't do too, and maybe if he improves the accuracy of his androids they can be close to Shadow and be mass produced and he could use that to prove he's truly the most brilliant genius scientist lol

[crossdressingdeath]

Just a reminder that if you have time and feel like writing that post you mentioned about how you would rewrite each DBH character’s story given unlimited runtime, it would be very cool to read.

Ah, right. Quick note that I don’t know much about Connor’s machine path or the violent revolution path or any ending to Kara’s story that doesn’t involve successfully getting past the border guard so I will be skimming those parts of the story. Also it’s going to be pretty vague because Details Are Hard. (Also I’m tired so this is probably not going to make a lot of sense or be in any sort of reasonable order.)

Okay, general points first. I feel like the three stories should intersect more, even if only in a “seeing the aftermath of their actions” way; maybe Connor and Hank are sent to investigate Zlatko’s death after Kara and Alice have gone through, for example. You’ve got three protagonists active at the same time and they barely interact! Come on, give us a little conversation. And of course the public opinion system needs to be used a lot more; it only effects two things in the whole game, come on! It doesn’t impact any of the major human characters, and that just feels wrong. I’ll. come back to this in Connor’s section because I feel like it would be best used there (since there really aren’t many humans in the story outside of his parts and the ones who do show up have reasons to side with or against the deviants outside of public opinion), but if nothing else I’d like it to lead to us seeing humans demonstrating/fighting with the deviants. Also I would like to see at least a few examples of androids deviating peacefully, like Connor does; I don’t believe for a second that there weren’t androids who deviated in a place where they were surrounded by people who were with them all the way.

So, first off: Markus. Mostly I’d just want to extend the timeline a bit and add some more Jericho missions, because oh my god you cannot join an organization of people with no weapons or resources of any kind, become their leader, and successfully change society in less than a week. So just... more evidence of Markus slowly winning Jericho over and helping them gather supplies and resources. Show him helping them set up actual supply lines! Rescuing deviants! Winning over allies! Including human ones, because the idea that there isn’t a single human working with Jericho when pretty much every major human character is in fact on the deviants’ side is... dumb. Also, individual missions with North, Simon and Josh; it would be good to spend more time getting to know them, since as it stands it’s... kind of hard to care all that much when they die. I might also add short scenes where we see Connor’s targets arriving in Jericho if they survive, just to add more connection between the stories (and also I like them and wish more had been done with them). And make Simon a love interest (because this is a choice-heavy game and so I should be able to make the choice to play exclusively as gay androids if that’s what I want), and make it easier to avoid having a love interest; let’s not create a situation where entering into a relationship less than a week after gaining emotions is all but mandatory, hm? Also, maybe Markus should meet Kamski one time? As the guy fulfilling Kamski’s deviant-related plans? Come on, one meeting. Maybe clear up Kamski’s motivations just a bit. And, crossing over with Connor’s story, maybe a bit of stuff them both being part of the RK line and how it went from a caregiver android to a detective android. Oh, and change it so that you’re not guaranteed to have fatalities on the violence path, because insisting that only pacifism can possibly end happily when fighting against oppression seems kind of... not great, all things considered. Frankly given the androids’ combat abilities it kind of makes more sense to have unavoidable deaths on the pacifism route, or alternately to have different unavoidable deaths on both routes, but being admittedly a softy I am very happy to have it be possible to have no deaths on either route. I don’t necessarily expect it to be easy to save everyone (it might make sense to add in missions where you make preparations to increase their odds of survival, or do something similar to Simon’s possible death in Stratford Tower where one of other protagonists’ actions has an effect on the sequence of events), but it would be nice to have it be possible.

On to Kara; I mentioned this before, but instead of her story being a cute-but-boring game-long escort mission where you have to protect a small child who is entirely useless I’d give her a story about uncovering how deviancy works and the history of it. Whether it really is just a glitch or something more, what rA9 actually is... all that fun stuff. No idea how that would actually go, but it would be more interesting than just running to Canada. If nothing else we could get more backstory on how the hell Kamski managed to create androids who are so realistic that that they can develop emotions. And if it is just a glitch there can be more discussion on whether or not simulated emotions are as real as actual emotions, because the fact that they brought up the concept of deviant emotions being a simulation and did nothing with it just feels like a massive waste of potential. And I’d add some more ways to live; from what I understand it’s really hard to keep everyone alive unless you maybe possibly condemn a couple and their baby to freeze to death or get killed by a revolution and keep things peaceful in Markus’s story. While I do want more interaction between the stories, I don’t think your choices in one story should automatically lock you out of getting the best ending for one of the other stories (with the obvious exception of the situations where that actually makes sense; can’t get the best ending for Connor and Hank if Markus nukes the city while Hank is in it, for example). At least with Kara; her story is so separate from Markus and Connor’s that it doesn’t make sense for Markus’s actions to lock her out of escaping to Canada! Also, it adds nothing to the story to have Alice turn out to be an android and robs Kara of her close human companion who has a massive impact on her life; yeah, there’s Rose, but she’s in... what, two missions? That’s less than Karl, who has the additional story impact of having been Markus’s father figure for (if memory serves) years before the start of the game, so there’s no dynamic to build; it’s already there. Keep Alice human! It’s a completely pointless twist! ...I recognise that this does mean that Connor can get a young human girl killed by succeeding in stopping a deviant, but it wouldn’t take much to rewrite his run-in with Kara to not involve a chase across a freeway. Again, I’ll come back to this when I get to Connor’s section. But imagine the impact of things like Todd’s abuse and Zlatko’s section if Alice is human; showing that these villains don’t necessarily see androids and humans as different, but in a negative sense this time. Also, I’d like a sort of prologue to her story featuring the incident that got her broken and led to her being repaired at the start of the game.

And of course now we get to Connor, the best boy who deserves the best. I’ll start with the things I said I’d come back to. First, the public opinion system: imagine if Hank’s thoughts on deviants (instead of just changing for no apparent reason beyond a handful of meetings with people who generally kick his ass and then run away or die with at most a bit of conversation) could be altered by public opinion of the deviants’ cause. Even better; by that and his relationship with Connor. Picture a situation where Hank doesn’t trust or like deviants at all due to them running around killing people but still helps them because he wants to help Connor. It would just be very good. Also, since Connor is the only character hanging out exclusively with humans (what with the station full of cops he’s working out of): imagine more missions taking place (or at least starting) in the precinct where Connor can interact with his sort of coworkers and how the conversations with them could change as time passes and public opinion changes. Also again the possibility for a conflict between dislike of deviants and fondness for this particular android, just for fun. And, also just for fun, maybe a bit of character development for Gavin where he’s still a dick (because honestly he’d be less fun if he wasn’t) but if public opinion is high he’ll pretend not to notice Connor sneaking into the evidence locker and fucking around in there for a while when he really definitely isn’t supposed to. Come on, if you’re going to have heroic cops you could at least do something with more than one of them. Also, more Captain Fowler. All we know is that he and Hank are old friends and he’s totally okay with Hank beating the shit out of Perkins; all in all I’d like to know a bit more about him. And with Kara and Alice: the freeway chase works, sure, but I would like the option for Connor to at least try to save Alice; by this point Connor is already showing signs of software instability, if we change it so that Alice is human him putting the mission aside to save a little girl makes sense and gives us a good sense of who he is as a person, and it fits neatly into steadily escalating refusal to complete his mission that eventually reaches full deviancy. If I’m remembering the order right it’s Ortiz’s android (who you can’t let escape), Kara (who you can let go based on Hank’s orders), Rupert (who you can let go to save Hank), the Tracis (who you can let go just because), and then Markus (who you have to deviate to spare); changing it so that you can let Kara go to save a little girl she’s protecting fits the escalation (you could easily argue that Connor has something in his programming about saving human lives, and as one of his earlier missions shows him being specifically trying to save a little girl it makes a great deal of sense that he wants to protect Alice. Also like. Imagine having the option to push Alice out of the way of a car at the cost of Connor’s life. It would be very effective, I think. Also it’s another opportunity to make Hank like you because he would for sure react well to you saving a small child from getting hit by a car.

Alright, moving on; I’d like some more assignments with Connor before he joins the DPD and gets partnered with Hank, showing him actually earning the title of deviant hunter? Also that way we aren’t stuck with the conclusion that CyberLife decided to send their prototype out into the world to partner with the police in investigations after one mission, which said prototype may well have failed to complete. And we could show more of Connor struggling with what he’s being ordered to do but having no way of stopping himself due to a complete lack of any interaction with anyone with functioning emotions, except for maybe CyberLife technicians. Actually, I’d also like to see what it’s like for Connor going to CyberLife for repairs and debriefing and such, because I doubt it’s fun. Other than that... well, Connor’s story is pretty good all things considered, but there are a couple tweaks I’d make. Aside from the previously mentioned exploration of what it means that he and Markus are both part of the RK line, I’d maybe cap off the added early story for him by adding him being hesitant about turning in Ortiz’s android if you’ve been pushing for more software instability and only going through with it when it becomes clear that if he doesn’t all he’ll achieve is getting himself caught not doing his job, which wouldn’t be a good look. I feel like the most effective way to do it might be if it’s not under player control; if his software instability is high enough he’ll be uncertain about it, and if he’s not he won’t be. And if he is uncertain you could add some options to the interrogation where he can win trust by telling the android he was scared of what would happen to him if he didn’t turn him in (followed by him immediately insisting that that was just a cunning ploy and in no way true when pressed on the matter if he did it out loud and not through an interface). Also: why wasn’t it Hank who pushed Connor to deviate. You spend Connor’s entire story with Hank! He is Connor’s tie to humanity! Why does Connor deviate in one conversation with a complete stranger and not his dearest friend! I desperately want a situation where Hank learns too much or something and Connor is ordered to shoot him and you can either go through with it (killing Hank) or deviate and shoot whoever gave you the order instead. Also then there could be hugs. And maybe forehead kisses because please. Connor deserves a little smooch honestly. He’s earned it. And then if your relationship with Hank is low enough that he’s already dead at this point you can have the conversation with Markus. Also, I would love an addition to the machine path where if you have a high relationship with Hank you can choose to deviate before fighting him (instead of just walking away despite that preventing Connor from finishing his mission quickly) or to deviate after fighting him when he’s got Hank hanging off the edge of the roof. Think about it; a moment of horrified realisation where Connor’s software is finally pushed to the breaking point by having to choose whether or not he will kill his only friend for the sake of his mission where he’s left desperately asking himself what the hell he’s doing? Like, if nothing else it would hammer home the fact that at this point Connor is choosing to remain a machine (assuming his software instability is high enough) to have to choose it twice even at the cost of Hank’s life. Actually three times, because the initial choice would be before this point. Also going that way it would be possible to play through the machine path up to the fight with Hank and still net Connor’s best ending, which would just be nice I think. Also, more hugs. Hugs are good.

...Okay, that’s all I can think of for now. Also it’s uh. almost 1 AM here and sleep is in fact important. So I’m going to wrap up here; maybe I’ll make some more posts later if I think of anything else.

[egg-emperor]

to combat the hate anon here's a love anon : how DARE you mention you had an alternate ShTH path and not expand upon it in true, beloved julian fashion???

Aaahhh I’ve had this idea for years without sharing it and I seriously didn’t think anyone would want to hear it so this means a lot to me, thank you so much!! I would love to finally talk about it!  

It includes a looot of Eggman, which really goes without saying for me. And of course since it’s about Eggman I naturally have a lot to say!

Like all of the other story beginnings in the game, the first cutscene of Shadow recalling the ARK’s events and the entire scene goes exactly the same. Black Doom appears and he listens to him, running to Westopolis to start his search for the emeralds. But after he collects the first one, the green one, it reminds him of one of the only things that he knows is real for certain.

After his fall in SA2 and being rescued by a robot, he recalls waking up in Eggman’s base, restrained, panicked and confused. The man himself walks in to see that he’s awake and is met with tons of Shadow’s questions. Eggman, being the oh so loveable bastard he is, ignores all of them, is very vague and constantly refers to himself as his ‘master’ and ‘creator’. He puts Shadow to sleep to research him and collect the data to create the clones. This is a chance for him to really dissect his grandfather’s creation. Then he encapsulates Shadow and seals him in the room with Omega. The screen of the capsule was green.

Now remembering this situation, he isn’t so sure if the events on the ARK ever happened. Because of how confused and vulnerable he is, Eggman partially convinces him that none of it was real, with the false knowledge of him being another android. Shadow comes to the conclusion that his memories are of the ‘real Shadow’ that came before him, just like he did in the other android routes.

Eggman is actually physically present in a bunch of these levels because that’s something that the game needed for me. The first is Sky Troops, where he initially shows up with his communicator but directs Shadow to where he is. When the hedgehog enters a room that Eggman is in, the temple reacts to his presence because of the black arms blood in him. 

Eggman takes note of this and boldly confronts him, asking if he’s been involved with their established enemies, hence being able to ‘control’ parts of the ancient building. That’s when Shadow reveals Black Doom had visited him. Shadow wonders why he’d suspect that the aliens were involved with him if he really was his android, but Eggman stays cool and says that Black Doom is just trying to trick him.

Cryptic Castle is another where Eggman meets him long before the Egg Breaker fight, where Cream walks into the castle while Eggman is on his way to fetch the white emerald. She gets in without him noticing and gets trapped behind a door in one of the spires. Amy and Shadow happen to arrive at the same time and she begs him to help her locate Cream. Eggman demands him to help out with the activation of his defenses instead. Shadow eventually obeys and has to leave Cream there. (This isn’t Shadow’s fault, it’s Eggman’s.)

Also deeper into the heart of the castle, Eggman gets to see that some of the walls that he warns will crush you, has actually caught a person. And he’s just like “well, looks like someone got a little too curious about this place and met their demise!” Y’know, because the wall fucking crushed them and he just expects dead intruders. (LMAO IT’S NOT CREAM THOUGH DW, Amy freed her.) 

They still fight over the white emerald because Shadow is having second doubts and keeps thinking about changing his mind in helping Eggman at this point. Shadow almost gets away with the emerald but ultimately stays with Eggman despite his uneasiness because he’s lost and doesn’t know who to trust at all.

What’s different about Iron Jungle in this story, is that this is where Shadow discovers the existence of all the other clones, but the difference is that Eggman had already convinced him that he was artificial long before it. It’s not an abrupt discovery and instead the surprise is of everything piecing together as the ‘truth’ of his existence. That he’s just another copy, easily replaceable and his memories of the ARK aren’t really his own.

I have a lot more planned out for this story, only I haven’t structured it enough to explain them coherently in full yet. Some other ideas include: 

Eggman physically being present in Circus Park and getting Shadow involved with the show

Eggman being in Westopolis himself at one point with a very interesting objective (but not during the actual attacks)

Eggman is also in Mad Matrix beyond the Egg Breaker fight where a LOT of dramatic shit goes down with him, Shadow and Espio. He’s basically physically present in a l o t of the levels and scenes because that’s what I always needed more of in the game XD

There’s also a scene in Glyphic Canyon where Knuckles is desperate for Shadow to realize that he’s being tricked after his past situations with him. But it’s gone too far for Shadow to believe him at this point. A few new levels I came up with are part of it too, one being a cemetery that spans off of Cryptic Castle. I might share more of it as it builds in the future.

There are two different endings to this story depending on what you decide to do. Shadow can either end up being so lost under Eggman’s control that he believes him and joins the empire to collect the emeralds, stop the aliens and GUN and then serve him.

Or Shadow finally snaps out of it when the Commander tells him his story and gets his revenge on the doctor. The ‘canon’ ending to this would be the betrayal, so Eggman isn’t killed but the situation does turn out very badly. Those healing units come in very handy after it.

The GUN Commander is one of my FAVORITE Sonic characters and the BEST character with heterochromia. He has a big involvement in this path too but the reason I’m not sharing any details yet is that I’m still deciding on the part where his involvement becomes a main part of the story. At the moment I’m considering it to be Iron Jungle.

What Eggman does throughout all of this is fucked up as usual but all of his personality design goes unchanged, just like the actual game of course. That’s what I love about them not changing his design in games that got deep and serious, like ShtH and SA2 for example. Eggman as the way he always is + a darker story is constantly proven possible. 

The reason I bring this up is because of 06, I was pissed when they seemed to took away all of his goofiness and changed his design like they believed that it wouldn’t work with for the tone of the game. It’s obvious that the two don’t have to be exclusive. In my path, he’s also balanced in that regard, showing how cold dark while still being the same man that has a couple of tantrums over some of the most ridiculous things in this same story lol

Woaahhh this got way longer than I had meant for it to be but I’m super passionate about ShtH, it’s my second favorite Sonic game after all and I think it had so much potential that I love to explore. One thing’s for sure though, I would definitely like to talk about this more in the future!