#He says fully expecting Audrey to reject & upset Zoe

[tumblingxelian]

Heyo, thanks for responding to this one @rachelsshowerthoughts Mood and my sympathies on the sickness angle too ><

Haha, understandable, I have a similar gut reaction whenever Andre's portrayed as like, genuinely caring and just a little confused as opposed to an emotional leech with no morals.

Say hi to Mimi for me XD As a sort of interesting aside, the two main motives behind this were as follows: 1: Someone once noted that they felt Audrey was the "Less terrible" parent by virtue of not going out of her way to inflict herself on Chloe. IE not living with her or acting as a parent, compared to Andre's hands on cluster fuckery. Not that she was 'good' just that she wasn't trying if that makes sense. I found it interesting but also was a bit sus on it cos Audrey does seem to take on the role of mother, when it suits her. Much in the same way Andre would discipline Chloe, when it suited him. Still, it was interesting. 2: Was mostly rooted in the fact I tend to find bad moms in media get it way, way, wat worse than bad dads. & so kind of wanting to balance the scales a bit while not ignoring that, yeah Audrey's a deeply unpleasant person and terrible parent.

I think you are right that there being some degree of growth for Audrey would be good. & I definitely agree that avoiding that growth being tied to her wanting to be a mom or being a mom beyond circumstances works best. Honestly I kind of have Anton Ego vibes:

Obviously via an Audrey filter or three but you get the idea I think?

I agree as well regarding Chloe, I think the main emphasis would be needing to de-couple her sense of self worth from whether Audrey can be her mother. IE, no one no matter how exceptional could have made Audrey mother them because mothering is not in her, she mentors at most. Chloe's not a 'failure' or 'unexceptional' cos Audrey can't find it in herself to be a parent, that was never a possibility.

I also agree that yeah they'd need to work something out in these regards and that it'd be good if they had some kind of relationship provided it was not toxic. Audrey has strong wine aunt vibes and like broad strokes family works. Plus I could see them getting along in a 'de coupled from familial/parental expectations & obligations' sense, provided Audrey chilled out a bit.

Completely agreed on divorcing Andre.

I also think seeking custody would be kind of the big challenge cos Audrey's not been present. Plus, "He encourages her to seek affection from me that he knows I won't give & then takes advantage of her rejection sadness" is not exactly a winning case. Add in that she largely spends her time in America and is willful and aggressive by default and she'd be an intensely unsympathetic figure in such a case.

It occurs to me she might just consider taking Chloe's "Take me to New York momma" idea and running with it. Audrey's idea to largely just send Chloe to the same boarding school as Zoe, but Andre's Akumatization stops that & also wigs her out once she sees a recording of her behavior under his control. Like before this was just about her barely coherent sense of standards, not its personal as he's made himself a threat. Also I wonder if she'd interpret Chloe's "Take me to New York" stuff differently in that context, cos its not like she was suggesting Andre come along.

(Oh my gosh I love that idea, and heck, Gabriel might briefly chill on the Hawk Moth stuff cos Audrey avoids goading Chloe into going out as Queen Bee. But he still had Heroes Day set up so like, he'd 100% fall back into temptation.

Also gods hahaha, I love the idea of her being self aware enough regarding how low she set the bar as a parent and being flabbergasted others managed to limbo under it XD

Low key I am reminded of those "Alt parent pairs" I sent to @princess-of-the-corner & how amusing it was the Audrey pairs tended to be slightly better off, not good but less terrible. Largely by virtue of the fact she doesn't hide how awful she is so if someone went in eyes wide open it could be... Functional? Like still terrible, but not terrible & dysfunctional, just terrible.)

Yeah I can definitely see that being the case, and hey, if we're going by the original trilogy seasons, Jean & Bustier both care about Chloe. Like dumping a full on teenager to raise on them is probably not workable legally, but there's options XD But yeah agreed, I don't think Chloe would want to leave Paris for ever.

So you know how some fics have like "Andre Sugar" in the tags to indicate he'll not be portrayed as the bastard he is in S1/3?

I came up with an alternative type of tag, "Character X Cinnamon" with it basically being:

If this character is so good you are giving them some sin to spice things up. But if they are too evil you are adding a little bit of 'sweetness' without forgetting what they are.

In this context, an Audrey cinnamon fic would be like... she stumbles on a conversation Chloe is having with Andre trying to get comfort & advice on impressing Audrey & the mix of how that interaction looks and what Andre says.

IE stuff that makes it quite clear he's done nothing to disabuse Chloe of the notion Audrey just needs to be impressed to love her when frankly Audrey just does not fucking 'want' to parent & made that clear many times over.

Well it leaves her a little... Off, it feels a little too familiar, and a little too scummy for her to just write it off as Andre's usual neediness and simpering explanations and excuses for anything that creating problems in his life.

Cue, this is just an idea it could go many way, pulling Sabine aside at the fashion show either day 1 or 2 and being like.

"Your family's mundane. Tell me, does Andre's relationship with Chloe seem normal to you?" "...." "That silence does not fill me with confidence, unless you misunderstood." "I understood you fine, I was just thinking. But no, it does come off a little unseemly." "Dammit all." "Why are you bringing this up so suddenly, did you just notice?" "Obviously, why else would I be bringing it up this moment, use your head." "I can see where Chloe got her charming personality from." "I didn't raise her, if she's like me its... Ugh, because Andre probably wanted her that way, or is that assuming things? I don't know when children start thinking for themselves." ".... You should speak to Madame Bustier, her teacher, she might be of more help." Audrey's head tipped back in a beleaguered groan.

Basically Audrey's still fucking awful but she has like a handful of barely coherent & even contradictory standards for what she deems acceptable. Andre being a raising his daughter to be Audrey's carbon copy but one that 'needs' him & encouraging her to appeal to a woman he knows will reject her happens to tick such a box.

So she's going to have to do something about it, but she A, has zero idea what she's doing, B, fucking HATES doing it and C, is still by and large otherwise the worst (tm)

Like such a story would not end in Audrey being all, "Oh I actually want to be a mother & make up for lost time."

But more like, "I made a stupid decision having a child when I didn't want one & have neither the heart nor capabilities to parent. But I will do the right thing here; I am gonna be real bitter about it though."

This spin on Audrey would sort of rely on taking her abuse as mostly just her being indifferent to Chloe in a "I did not want to be a parent" way and so she treats her like everyone else. IE like shit.

As opposed to her having any other kind of motive or reasons for said behavior or there being more to said abusive behavior than what was seen. Which is very easy to conclude by just watching and musing but isn't like, overtly canon.

I feel like I am making this come off as more lighthearted than intended, but that's more a reflection of Audrey's like... Vibe? Sort of like how everything's more somber and clinical from Gabriel's perspective even if its a crack comedy story.

Audrey's perpetually proud, unsatisfied and irritable with little desire to empathize or wallow in any negative emotions that aren't anger or satisfaction born or breaking something. She might be better-ish at the end of such a story but she'd not do a 180 like Andre's shown to do in such fics.

Part of what would be good for Chloe in it is getting that sense of why her mothers like that, that Audrey being shitty isn't on her, and eventually kind of untethering Audrey from "mom" to just, "A woman". So she can seek out connections with people who can and will actually give her what she needs in a paternal relationship.

So, first, sorry this one took me so long to respond to, I've been sick for a few days, and swinging between "coherent" and "what time is it? Sleep, I guess"!

I do like the idea, and think it’s fairly funny, but . . . I'll be honest, I tried to imagine Audrey doing this and just. My brain was like "Error 404, File not found". I COULD NOT imagine Audrey Bourgeois doing this, or being like this. Like, at all. It would not compute in my head. The only way I could think about this idea working was to try and apply it to a different character, then smack it Audrey's name on it.

(Which, again, I'm currently kind of sick, so it could be that - though my friend Mimi started cackling at the fact someone suggested Audrey being in anyway even REMOTELY decent and I basically bluescreened)

If I was doing this, I think I would have some definite character growth for Audrey. Like you say, she still doesn’t become a "good" person. She doesn’t miraculously want to be a mom, or realize that she really DOES love Chloé. But I'd have her grow a bit as a character, to at the very least, treat everyone a little less shitty. Like, she's still blunt, and kind of a bitch, but she becomes a less toxic person overall. She learns how to communicate with other people, figures out how to . . . . I was going to say, "stop insulting everyone", but maybe "be less insulting" is more believable. She isn’t ever going to be "mom" or even "mom-adjacent", but she learns to stop penalizing Chloé for not living up to her impossible standards. She figures out how to interact at least neutrally with Chloé, who, whether she likes it or not, she's responsible for.

Chloé, meanwhile, yeah, should learn to disconnect "Audrey Bourgeois" from the idea of "Mom", which, I'm not sure about how easy that would be. It's definitely going to suck. But, and I'm not sure about this, I feel like Audrey and Chloé should at least develop a rapport. A comfortable way to interact with each other. Cause, at least until Chloé is eighteen, Audrey is partially responsible for her. I'm not saying Audrey has to be loving mom, or that Chloé needs to be "mini-Audrey", but they do need a healthy way to communicate. I think the end result should be something like "distant aunt". Like, you're family, you'll help each other out if you need it, you'll send a wedding invite, and occasionally update each other, but you aren’t super close, and you don’t talk much.

Though, for any of this, I think Audrey would need to divorce André and take custody of Chloé. Like, she doesn’t particularly CARE about being married to André - it’s a status thing, security, and Audrey can deal with him. But Cholé can't (that's the point of all this) so Audrey would need to get Chloé away from him, make sure he doesn’t have any legal say in Chloé at all. And that would be a hell of a headache for all involved.

(Somehow, during this, Hawk Moth's identity comes out. Audrey is left to question how SHE is somehow being a better parent than Gabriel, because my god, the bar is SO LOW, it is literally an INCH off the ground, yet somehow he isn’t clearing it.)

though, afterward, I can see Audrey setting Chloé up with her own place in Paris, with either a paid live-in bodyguard, or regular check-ins or something. Hell, have her move in with Marinette or something, and Audrey sends an allowance. Like, I don’t see Chloé actually wanting to permanently leave Paris, Audrey doesn’t want to stay (she has work), so they figure out some arrangement that lets her stay in Paris.