#But like. I kind of dgaf that much anymore. Aside from the mishandling of that which is meant to be publicized.

[mourningobject]

re: your post saying you have nuanced takes on proshipping; what nuance is there to not wanting csem/abuse/incest/etc written for entertainment and fandom without tact. "dislike both sides of the argument" perhaps it's my black and white autism thinking but genuinely what is there to dislike about not wanting twitter users to romanticize various forms of abuse. i am asking this not as some random hate anon but as someone who is considering whether or not to break mutual; i do not want anyone who can even slightly be okay with abuse for entertainment around me; and therefore am asking clarification.

Putting this under a cut because I don't want a biggie made out of it. TLDR; I dislike pro-shippers as people and think they are disgusting scum, but dislike anti as a label due to the rampant hypocrisy and occasional lack of nuance regarding if and how to portray sensitive content in art, as well as the performative behaviour & the lack of curating of their online spaces.

I've learnt to stop caring so much about what other people do even if the content they create makes me sick to my stomach. I do not agree with creating such content without tact or for the sake of making their dicks hard. But I just won't interact, I'll block. I also don't see how this material can be considered "abuse for entertainment"... unless you're talking about the abuse within the content.

But I understand your concern. You don't want someone perverse to be by your side. To elaborate on what I meant, the problem isn't with the concept of someone simply disliking seeing such things, that's more than fine. I just don't either as a Label, fundamentally.

Antis are more often than not performative and reactionary online (particularly the ones fixated on the subject, or with uncovering others as secretly being evil and such to the point of sending others retrospring asks like "Uuum, why do you follow [so and so]" and not even giving the @ for the person to block them and assuming the worst of them to the point it comes off as fake advocacy on their behalf. Especially when I myself follow artists who create questionable content once in a blue moon, but if it isn't their entire catalogue does that make me evil? These people aren't and will never be my friends. This is something that happened a lot on twitter, especially a few months ago. I understand the fear of being close to someone who's morals don't align with yours, but if you genuinely have concerns you may as well dm them instead of making a spectacle out of it), especially when most of them turn around and indulge in content that borders on the same, or even downright degeneracy on the side, as well as comparing it to genuine real world abuse or feeling it important to mention in cases that are totally unrelated where a person has committed actual crimes which is like, well, both can matter, but is now the time? I'd say it only counts in cases like that of Lily Orchard, where what she portrayed in her works was a reflection of her disgusting self and abuse she'd committed in real life. I don't believe in fiction not affecting reality because that is a redundant way to view art, as well as due to how art can reflect the creator's subconscious views, or normalize things to them, and they'll repeat again and again, "it's just fiction!" as if that makes it any better that they get off on the things they do. But these people will exist no matter what and so will the content they create, so antis should learn to actually curate their online spaces rather than getting into useless discourse, particularly teenagers who won't be able to change the minds of degenerate adults, or make a big deal about it publicly to show how they have the moral high-ground. Not to mention, countless antis I've seen are hypocrites who end up being revealed to believe this doesn't matter at all in the real world, or are friends with people who engage with pro ship content, but will harass others for it...? It's the rampant double standards that I don't like. Plus, a lot of media that antis love has elements that would be considered "pro ship" like nitro chiral games, and targets those audiences specifically, but they are surprised when the people it is made for interact with it. Of course I believe one can engage in media with disgusting things while being critical, though; I am an Ensemble Stars fan. There is shota-bait and incest all over the source material. That doesn't make me inherently sick because I'm not there for that, I understand that.

Also, most antis dislike these concepts being portrayed in media altogether, which is something I disagree with. If handled well these are experiences that deserve to be shared to others. Many victims have internalized so many horrific thoughts that they can't help but handle it imperfectly—that's something they have to deal with in therapy, though, why should I be the one to try to open their eyes as if it won't push them deeper into the hole they're in? You know?

There's also the thin line between "dark content" and "proship material". Who has the right to define this? (Obviously CSEM being inherently immoral is a given). That's all, mostly. There's more I've thought about before but I'm forgetting right now. I think both sides are worthy of critique and simply find most self-identified antis annoying, not nearly in a way that is as egregious as their counterpart, to be fair. I'm too busy simply being a Normal Person who also shakes his head in disdain when I see things like that. Even though I have mental problems regarding this sort of thing. I'm not saying to "not be sensitive", but to "not be stupid".

I think pro-shippers should stay away from antis because they are mostly children and victims themselves at that, and antis should stay away from pro-shippers because they are disgusting adults who will never be saved or changed by their protests.

My questions in this post are rhetorical even though I suppose I'm open to discussion and further elaboration but I think it's more than enough to show where I stand and whether you want to stay as my mutual or not. But that's essentially why I don't self-identify with either. Also, this could have used a dm, but I'm happy to explain my views. I’d at least appreciate an anonymous final verdict, though!