#‘forced comformity thats whats killing the kids’

[pinkeoni]

Wonder if the end goal for the Mind Flayer/Vecna is similar to Seele in End of Evangelion… cause every life form to become one and eliminate any individuality

[aemiron-main-backup]

you are SO RIGHT THATS EXACTLY WHAT IT IS!! YES YES YES!!! THOSE ARE SUCH GOOD POINTS!!  Like IMO if S4 is about anti-conformity, about how ‘forced conformity is killing the kids,” about rejecting conformity, (which is it about that),  then s3 is about pro-conformity, it’s about trying to conform because you feel like you have to, but also being forced to embrace conformity regardless of whether you want to or not/regardless of whether youre trying to embrace conformity or not (this is why Will is impacted the way that he is in s3, which is differently than Mike- it’s because Will is somebody who doesn’t want to embrace conformity, isn’t initially trying to embrace conformity, but is being forced to, Mike is somebody who is trying to embrace conformity, is trying to conform. Mike is trying so hard to conform that he ends up seeming even weirder as a result (just like in lenora in s4!), he ends up becoming this charicature of conformity/straightness which ironically being that charicature makes him stick out as ‘weird’ even more. 

And then we see mike starting to get away from that and embrace anti-comformity in s4!  Conformity in s3 is represented by the monsters themselves- the fleshy version of the mindflayer literally takes individual, unique people, and turns them into sludge and makes them become part of one large homogenous beast. It’s an absolute allegory for conformity. The flesh mindflayer isn’t just about puberty: it’s also about conformity. The flesh mindflayer is the epitome of forced conformity and it’s LITERALLY KILLING THE KIDS. This also is why that netflix tweet about Mike looking at the womens’ underwear vs looking at the mindflayer the same way is so interesting to me, because by that logic and via mike’s very very similar reaction to the two, we can see that women/attraction to women represents conformity to him.  

Like, it’s not just that growing up represents conformity, even though that’s part of it: they didn’t show us an office job or a life without games/dnd or a nuclear family as a representation of conformity for mike. They showed us womens’ underwear. They made that tie of women to conformity for Mike. They didn’t show us both men and women. They didn’t have a mens underwear section where mike has the same reaction that he has to the womens’ underwear (which is the same one as he has to the mindflayer), it’s not just about a fear of romance or of growing up or of relationships. Imo, it’s explicitly tied to his sexuality, and like we see in s4, his active attraction to men/gayness is tied to anti-conformity. 

They have the sauna scene as sort of a parallel to the womens’ underwear scene, but mike’s reactions in those two scenes is TOTALLY different (which again im gonna talk abt in the analysis as to why that’s the case) and so mike’s reaction to the sauna is NOT the same as his reaction to the womens’ underwear/to the mindflayer because mike’s reaction to the sauna isn’t meant to tie men to conformity for Mike in the same way that his reaction to the womens’ underwear IS meant to tie women/attraction to women to conformity/the mindflayer. 

Which is even more interesting in the context of how, like im going to talk about in my analysis, Mike’s sexuality and gayness has always been framed relative to attraction to women. Mike and Will’s sexualities have the same outcome (being gay and interested in men but not in women), but they’re presented and framed differently. Will’s is framed as an active attraction to men, and while Mike experiences the same active attraction to men, he a.) struggles with it more and b.) his sexuality is framed as a LACK of attraction to women, rather than an active attraction to men, due to the ways in which heteronormativity and internalized homophobia impact Mike compared to Will.  Like Will doesn’t have a scene where he has the same reaction to womens’ underwear as he does to the mindflayer, despite Will being the one who’s confirmed gay, netflix didn’t make that tweet about Will.

Because Will doesn’t struggle with heteronormativity, internalized homophobia, and his sexuality in the same way that mike does. I’m NOT saying that will doesn’t struggle in those regards, i’m saying that it’s a different way than how mike struggles because of the differences in their characters and upbringing. Will’s reaction at the sauna scene AND some other production/writing choices about the sauna scene are different from Mike’s. 

And so, in s4, Mike’s not only a.) not TRYING to embrace conformity as much anymore but also is b.) starting to actively embrace ANTI CONFORMITY, which ties into something regarding his sexuality that I’m going to talk about in s4, because the portrayal of Mike’s sexuality is starting to move away from being framed as a lack of attraction to women, and more TOWARDS being framed in the same way as will’s (an active attraction to men), indicating that Mike is beginning to reject those heteronormative pressures AND overcome his internalized homophobia, even if he isn’t 100% there yet and is also having to deal with the pressure of inching towards experiencing external homophobia. 

AHHHH THANK YOU!!! I cannot wait to finish the analysis, it’s taking a long time because a.) there is a LOT to go through, b.) figuring out how to structure it so that my points come across clearly is absolutely kicking my ass but i think im gonna go with doing a season by season/episode by episode analysis in relation to my main points and then circle back at the end and list out my main points and show how the analysis i’ve done proves those points. it feels slightly redundant but i’d rather be redundant than miss smthn/not have a point come across, yknow?? 

god doing the gay mike analysis, it’s REALLY interesting to see the difference in how gayness is portrayed for will versus for Mike and how ESPECIALLY in season 3, we can see the internalized homophobia for mike, like it’s In The Show, not just the heteronormativity + its impact on mike because while that IS there, the internalized homophobia is also there + is portrayed alongside it as mike realizes more about his sexuality.