profounddefendorcrusade-blog

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 10)

I find Harry and Larry are so sibling-coded that I can't see them as anything other than brothers

If Koffin-K had adopted Harry and Larry as babies/toddlers/kids they'd have turned out exactly the same, and, if Harry and Larry were biological brothers, nothing about their dynamic would change either (in canon, Koffin-K brought them together, "forcing" them to develop a fraternal relationship, took them in and raised them into the chaotic duo they are today, which is no different from two people being raised since childhood and influenced by a shared parent)

The difference between a brotherly relationship and a friendship is the framing. Susie and Lancer, for example, can act silly with each other, but their fight was deep and both of them came out of it as changed people (not to mention it wasn’t over a father/mother figure’s approval.) During Harry and Larry's biggest fight however, they roughhoused because they both wanted to be "dad’s favorite boy," but forgave each other like nothing ever happened

Martlet explicitly called Chujin her father figure (understanable, he helped her a lot) but Chujin was never fully responsible for her as if she were his daughter. Koffin-K is functionally and essentially Harry and Larry's adoptive father, even if none of them explicitly acknowledge it in-game

This feels like something the Boogiemen would say about Koffin-K if they were self-aware about the nature of their relationship with him (maybe they are, but neither ever said anything)

TS!Underswap is an AU that is based off of Undertale. Toby was never subtle when writing romance, and if you look at Bugerpant’s crush on Flara, his rivalry with Aaxel in regards to it, and the romantic relationship between Dogamy and Dogaressa, the TS!US team isn’t either

In Undertale, we have Undyne and Alphys being clearly romance-coded, then the two Royal Guards whose entire arc was centered around a love confession. Noelle’s crush on Susie is crystal clear too, and Susie will most likely reciprocate given how she is protective of her, thinks about her at random, plus the entire Ferris Wheel scene is clearly framed as a date. We couldn’t make Harry and Larry go on a date

Harry doesn't react at all when Laurice’s name is mentioned. He wasn't jealous, unlike Noelle who snapped after Berdly said he also had a crush on Susie

Larry having a crush on Laurice isn't played off as: "Character A (Larry) says they're into Character B (Laurice), but in reality, their true love is Character C (Harry)" We don't even know WHO Laurice is, and the reason for that is it doesn't matter. This line was put in the game for comedic effect, not to introduce a romantic subplot. Harry and Larry's purpose in the story is to be comedic side characters, and romance would alter that role completely

Harry wasn't jealous that Larry accidentally called Sans and Papyrus 'hot instead of cool,' nor did he blush. He was just confused. Larry was embarrassed because he was unsure of his own joke, not because he wanted to impress Harry, otherwise we'd see him act blushy/awkward. Then the two of them just… move on to a different insult

Neither Harry nor Larry even have a blushing sprite, while the other characters who are connected to a romantic subplot do (except the Royal Guards who wear masks, but we can still see 01 sweating when 02 takes his armor off. When Harry unbuttoned his vest during the Boogie Battle, Larry didn't react at all)

Harry and Larry spent years together yet never developed romantic feelings. When Harry bumps into Larry, he doesn’t blush or become awkward or anything. Larry will casually hold Harry by the tail during one of their team attacks. They are in close proximity to each other almost all the time yet it's never awkward for a second (on the contrary, they are 100% used to each other's presence), have no problem slapping/punching/hitting each other... there's absoutely nothing romantic about these interactions

This was another missed opportunity to say that Harry and Larry are ROMANTICALLY compatible, but instead, they're described as DYNAMICALLY compatible, which basically means they are comically dysfunctional but still work well together (Larry is slow and clumsy, Harry is quick on his feet and "smarter")

If we were to imagine them romantically, Harry and Larry's dependence on each other would turn into co-dependence since they don't have any other friends/family outside of each other and Koffin-K, and their sibling-like arguments (especially Harry often yelling at Larry) would resemble unnecessary/petty fights that are not healthy for a romantic couple but work perfectly for a comedic, brotherly duo

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 9)

Larry (like a hopeful kid) thinks that Koffin-K wants to pleasantly surprise them, and what’s important to note is how it never crossed his mind that they’re getting fired

This one is self-explanatory, but Harry saying "finally" hints that they've been craving Koffin-K's love for ages. Plus, he Larry built the Boogiefloat "during their first days of henchmanery" which suggests they started feeling this way almost right after joining Koffin-K

The way Larry assumes any attention from Koffin-K might be a sign of affection…

Harry only thinks Larry will get in trouble and I think this foreshadows that he wants to be the favorite

He could have just said: "Maybe WE'RE in big trouble"

Koffin-K definitely influenced Harry and Larry and they act childish because they live in an environment where they're allowed to act that way (despite Koffin-K being annoyed/deadpan/maybe mildly punshing them off-screen). We can see Koffin-K's influence if we look at Harry's sprite before vs. after he joined him. He didn't use to be one of the "Boogiemen," that's why there was no need for the current goofy standing & walking sprites

In the flashback, we only see Larry's head. But since he, like Harry, didn't have a real identity before Koffin-K, it's pretty clear we wouldn't have seen his current goofy standing & walking sprites back then either (the only time the two of them don't have this mischevious body language is whenever they're talking)

I imagine Larry's standing sprite used to be like the one in the first picture

Another reason why Harry and Larry got in trouble with Koffin-K (both on-screen and off-screen) might be because they wanted his attention. They kept tumbling down Koffin-K's stairs in perpetuity so that he could hear them from his study (I mentioned this scene before; it isn't in the game, but it fits the three's canon dynamic and was written by the TS!US team) and stole Koffin-K's phone even though they knew they'd get scolded for it. This behavior makes the Boogiemen feel like two immature guys trying to get their dad to notice them

Koffin-K cares for Harry and Larry a lot, but struggles with expressing his emotions. He spent most of his time in his study for years, "avoiding" them. This left Harry and Larry feeling unsure about their place in Koffin-K's life

The way the Boogiemen’s relationship was described in these two comments is in line with how I see them: as two brothers who bicker but love each other in a fraternal way

I decided to read the Villains Fanon wiki, and here are my thoughts about the Koffin Trio:

Harry and Larry were lucky to have gotten themselves a loving (in his own way, when you consider his abandonment issues and personality) father figure, who saw something special in them. Bugerpant wasn't this lucky with Mettacrit

Although Harry and Larry admire Koffin-K, they don't seem to worship/idolize him (I spoke about this in part 6), but they both tried to impress him (so that he would love them, not because he was their ticket to a dream they had)

Just like Koffin-K asked for Harry and Larry's names

When he was homeless, Larry was constantly hungry. Here, he only spent a short time without food, but it still hurt so much that he started to CRY. What's even sadder is how he looks embarassed about needing to eat again

Koffin-K saved him, there's no other way for me to interpret it

Larry even wants Koffin-K to give him treats. This is not only a funny piece of dialogue but it paints Koffin-K as the provider once again

This comment made me think that there’s a parallel between Larry, who’s a Frankenstein’s monster, and the monster from "Frankenstein." The monster wanted Victor’s fatherly love, just like how Larry wanted Koffin-K’s. The only difference between them is that Larry got what he wanted. I no longer doubt that both Larry and Harry have daddy issues. That explains why they kept trying to get Koffin-K's validation even though they thought he didn't appreciate them. They were SO SO grateful for all that he gave them, especially each other

Even though he loves to slack off, Larry wants to be his best for Koffin-K and gets upset when it’s brought up that he might not be doing everything he could to make him happy/show his gratitiude

Back when I compared the Boogiemen to Lancer, I forgot to mention another thing the three have in common, and that's being infantilized

Harry and Larry are childish, child-like and dependent on Koffin-K (there's more to it than being immature/influenced by him though, which I already discussed) but I disagree that they should be compared to toddlers. It really reminds me of how the Deltarune fandom treats Lancer, and it rubs me the wrong way. Harry's street-smart, Larry has moments of insight, and both did their best to fight off Chara in the Ruthless Route, WITHOUT Koffin-K's help. Even though neither predicted that Chara would push Larry off the cliff, they were not helpless babies

Larry is said to be stupid, but he can be insightful, he picked up on Koffin-K's rhyme pretty fast, plays with words in a clever way, is familiar with words like 'real estate company' and 'acronyms,' remembered that he and Harry forgot to do the chores, corrects Koffin-K and says how the festival is already happening, figured out that he and Harry could escape Chara via propeller hats (though he forgot they were out of fuel) and in general can keep up with Harry in regards to both banter and working together

My favorite thing about this guy is how self-aware he is in terms of his flaws, but I also think he isn't giving himself enough credit

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 8)

This is how Harry and Larry are described on the TS!UNDERSWAP wiki. If this doesn’t describe siblings, I don’t know what does. They cause mischief together, pick on Chara (who is the third party that they’re jealous of because they think they’re no longer their boss’/dad's favorite), pick on each other, break into a fight over who’s the one most loved by a shared parent figure, slack off, care for each other, and despite everything, one can't imagine life without the other

Harry and Larry were street rats at some point. That’s gotta be where their insecurities come from (aside from the daddy issues) — feeling lesser than average. No wonder they seek validation from Koffin-K, the one who called them perfect, was so proud that he wanted to cry at their minimal "skills," happily hired them on the spot, and gave them absolutely everything they didn't have before

It's sweet how the Boogiemen and Koffin-K tricked Mad House and attacked Chara together. It feels like they were bonding as a family in their own weird way

Even during this "deal," Harry and Larry were a team while Koffin-K did his part alone. Compare that to the one-on-one casual friendship with Chara and the difference is night and day

Harry and Larry didn’t worry about coming home without the crystal. They figured Koffin-K forgot about it, forgot themselves, or didn’t say anything to avoid disappointing him

Another sibling trait is being in each other's presence because you have no other choice. Harry and Larry do enjoy each other’s company (even though they argue), but it is also the only option they have. Either they live together under Koffin-K, or Larry goes back to being homeless, and Harry goes back to his mundane janitor job. Nobody else wanted them/saw potential in them except Koffin-K

The Boogiemen’s humor comes from tumbling down Koffin-K’s stairs, forgetting to do the chores Koffin-K assigned them, stealing Koffin-K’s phone and messing around on it, hiding under Koffin-K’s table, impressing Koffin-K, goofing off on the computer Koffin-K got for them, following Koffin-K’s advice, not going on vacation because of Koffin-K… he’s an integral part of who they became

"Like father, like sons" moments between Koffin-K and one or both of them:

Harry and Larry threw dishes and the dishwasher out of the window in the same way that Koffin-K threw his refrigerator and pipe organ

2. Larry and Koffin-K read books for dummies/dunderheads

3. Koffin-K thinks he shouldn't be babysat, Harry thinks he and Larry act like grown-ups, when in reality, all of them are goofs

4. The way Koffin-K is described on TV Tropes is exactly how I would describe Harry and Larry

5. Koffin-K also wanted to become rich, just like Harry

I used to think Harry was just greedy, but look how genuinely HAPPY he is at the thought that he and Larry will get to share the cash. He wants the money that much because he was barely getting by in the past

6. Harry’s "hehehe" and Larry’s "guhuhuh" remind me of (younger) Koffin-K’s "heh heh heh heh"

7. Harry laughed in a VERY similar way to Koffin-K here

8. Koffin-K and Larry being perceptive and intuitive

9. Same energy

10. Harry being stubborn like Koffin-K

11. All Koffin-K wants is to be noticed and appreciated, just like how the Boogiemen crave his approval

12. Both Harry and Koffin-K called people "brats"

Harry is Koffin-K's mini-me, I swear. Aside from the parallels I mentioned, he's quick-witted like Koffin-K (but more grounded), short-tempered and mischievous. Both pretend not to care but they do (Koffin-K pretends to be an "evil mastermind" while Harry hides his need for Koffin-K's approval by acting angry/sarcastic)

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 7)

Note: In this part, I'll be making comparisons between the Koffin Trio and characters from other pieces of media. I won't spoil the plot of any of them and will only talk about the characters/characters dynamics, but I'll bold the shows/games/movies (that I specifically mention) in blue anyway

Koffin-K calling Harry and Larry perfect gave me the same vibe (though the tone is different) as when Silco from Arcane called Jinx that. He could have simply said: "You’re perfect for my evil plans!" and the sentence wouldn’t have come out this parental

Harry and Larry cheer for Koffin-K during his battle with Chara, and it reminded me of this scene from Helluva Boss between Blitzø and Loona

Blitzø changed Moxxie and Millie's lives by hiring them (just like how Koffin-K changed Harry and Larry's), but they were never utterly dependent on him, he never treated them like his kids, and M&M don’t act like siblings fighting for parental approval. Blitzø used to stalk them, fantasized about having a polysexual relationship with them, and was jealous of M&M’s marriage because he craved love himself. Koffin-K always avoided favoritism between Harry and Larry, tried to make them feel equally important to him, solved their conflict with each other over his affection, and said that they must work on their teamwork

The dynamic between Blitzø, Millie and Moxxie isn't the same type of dynamic that exists between the Koffin Trio, which is why I disagree with those that choose to ship them together as a polyamorous relationship

Koffin-K even parallels Bambi's mother (except that the tone, once again, is different)

Harry, Larry and Koffin-K are also similar to Pipp, Zipp and Queen Haven from MLP: A New Generation. Pipp and Zipp have names that rhyme, just like Harry and Larry, but other parallels are:

The Boogiemen, too, argue, team up and work together all the time, both are jealous of Chara for being the center of their father figure’s attention instead of them, and get scolded by Koffin-K for bickering ("Dat was all Harry's fault!" "And blame Larry, he started it!" "And quit arguing, you two!")

Alpha and Omega is poorly written and I don't recommend it, but these two parallels stood out to me

Flim and Flam (collectively known as Flim and Flam Brothers) from MLP, just like Harry and Larry (collectively known as the Boogiemen), act and talk in sync, have similar comedic names, and wear matching outfits

The Boogiemen are also like Snips and Snails (also from MLP). Their names are similar and comedic; both duos are goofy lackeys/hooligans with a brotherly relationship

Parallels between Harry and Larry and another pair of siblings, Fang and Naser (from Goodbye Volcano High)

Both pairs do chores that their parent/parental figure assigned

Koffin-K wants to bring Harry and Larry together, and so does Fang and Naser’s mother

In The Owl House, Luz referred to Eda’s place as "home," and it's exactly what Larry said about the Keep

Luz sees Eda as a maternal figure and King as her little brother, just like how Harry and Larry are deeply sibling-coded and have a father-son relationship with Koffin-K

Harry and Larry share a bunk bed like other cartoon siblings

Yet another pair of siblings that lived together, shared a room and slept in the same bunk bed are Starlo and Orion from UTY

I imagine Harry and Larry felt like Susie from Deltarune when Ralsei showed her her new room. Maybe they never told him how grateful they were to have all the things they never could because of terrible living conditions, but it does explain why the two stayed loyal, got attached quickly, and built the Boogiefloat so early into their new career

I already talked about all the parallels between the Boogiemen and the Skelebros, but I want to include one more comment from a fan who pointed out that Harry and Larry are supposed to be foils to Sans and Papyrus

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 6)

The two accepted Crossbones’ cash deal and drew a moustache on Koffin-K’s poster. This isn’t a sign of disloyalty; Harry and Larry are like "troublesome" kids who genuinely care about their dad but still poke fun at him, all while trying not to let him down. This can be seen best when Harry and Larry insulted Koffin-K behind his back, and then ran off so they don’t get in trouble (I talked more about this scene before and still hold the same opinion, so I’ll include the excerpt here)

The Boogiemen are not actually afraid of Koffin-K himself; they simply don't want to disappoint him and/or get a mild scolding/punishment, like naughty kids who want to avoid getting in trouble

Harry and Larry are loyal to Koffin-K, but they don't worship him (like minions typically workship their boss), otherwise, they wouldn't have openly asked him to stop throwing comic books in their faces, admitted to his flaws (being stupid and a dumbass), would have made the Boogiefloat only of Koffin-K and not all three of them together and/or would have overdecorated their room with Koffin-K-themed stuff

The only time Koffin-K insulted Harry and Larry without their best interest in mind was when they forgot to bring him with them so that they'd all escape the punishment shack

Harry and Larry didn't carry Koffin-K because they forgot he was a hat and couldn't follow them, because the Ferris Wheel ride they had gone on was the only thing on their mind, or they thought he'd have everything under control and escape on his own. Koffin-K's reaction is sad: he expected the three of them to bond together (like how he sometimes orders them to get into the washing machine for fun, but really just wants them all to spend time together) by making a "grand escape" but Harry and Larry once again didn't include him. This just confirms that the three of them DO care about each other, but they're not equals. It's always Harry and Larry who do stuff together (like brothers with a "us against the world" mentality), while Koffin-K is their provider/protector/someone who saved them/who mediates their conflicts/scolds them/punishes them... like a dad

And yet, when Crossbones specifically adresses Harry and Larry and asks if they're ready for a night in the shack, Koffin-K will visibly panic and prioritize getting them to "safety" over them saving him. He won't even yell after them that they forgot about him. I can't help but see this as a fatherly reaction

He's a lot angrier when he thinks Harry and Larry might get caught than when the two of them forget him (he uses 3 exclamation marks instead of just 1)

After Koffin-K called them idiots, Larry cried because he thought he had disappointed him and took his words to heart

Harry and Larry love hats, wear hats, see hats when they're knocked out, and at the same time, Koffin-K (who is a hat himself) is their "hat-dad," as I like to call him. Also, all three of them use "hat attacks." The fact that everyone in the Koffin Trio is associated with hats makes them seem even more like a family

Koffin-K and his coat are the exact same color as Harry and Larry’s vests and hats

Harry and Larry depend on each other, not just for company but also for keeping each other alive when Koffin-K isn’t there to protect them. Their interactions in Ruthless feel less like best friends helping each other and more like two brothers that need each other to survive

Harry becomes protective like an older brother when he thinks Larry is hurt or when he's insulted, but has no problem seeing him get knocked down if Chara gets them to start arguing first. It's like he's thinking "Nobody picks on Larry but me, unless he really deserves it!" (this sounds like something an elder sibling would say)

These are the specific moments (not counting the Boogie Battle) where Harry and Larry physically fough/wanted to hit each other (Harry even wanted Larry whacked on the head):

Larry's worried reaction doesn't feel like a friend checking up on a friend, but like a sensitive younger brother who's deeply attached to an older one

Maybe the reason Harry seems more obsessed with winning Koffin-K's approval is that Koffin-K is the only authority figure Harry has, meanwhile Larry is dependent on both Harry and Koffin-K. In other words, Larry always has Harry to rely on as someone who's "in charge," but Harry is the "older sibling" and he only has Koffin-K. So, like a dad, Koffin-K is protective of them both, Harry's protective of Larry like a big brother (although they're able to stand on equal footing when they work together), and Larry's the "little brother"

Harry screams insults and threats at Larry without hesitation like an annoyed older sibling. Best friends will joke around with each other more casually, but this is very much sibling-coded

Even before they were officially introduced, Harry acted as an annoyed older brother towards Larry

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 5)

Harry and Larry ARE like children — they’re easily manipulated by things like free trampolines and free (n)ice cream. Both also have child-like fascination with Koffin-K's hats, and Larry's curiousity about the little things around him (except the rag) implies he spent most or all his life living on the streets

It's heartbreaking to think that they're such hedonists and materialists because of the poor lives they led before Koffin-K: Harry's so much into being rich because he knows what's it like to be poor. Larry's so much into food because he knows what's it like to be starving. Both of them are childish not only because of Koffin-K's influence, but because they finally got the chance to be after years of poverty (Harry) and homelessness (Larry). Koffin-K provides for them now, they don't have to worry about being without money and/or going hungry anymore. But, he gave them each other, too. Before Koffin-K came into their lives, Harry and Larry were like: "I'm a busy fella" and "I've got a dumpsta bag to sleep under" Now it's "we" instead of "I," all thanks to him

I think Harry already enacted the rabbit ears

Harry and Larry actually live by what the "LAUGH, LAUGH, LAUGH" sign that Koffin-K got for them says. When they laugh after hitting each other, they do it exactly three times

The Boogiemen are the only characters that act like Koffin-K is their father figure and like Koffin Keep is their home. Just look at the other people living there:

Even the wiki page says how there are only three inhabitants in the Keep. Koffin-K treats the rest of his servants like accessories that are only there for the aesthetics (and to do their jobs/fulfill his"evil" vision). They have no connection to him

Harry and Larry's interactions with each other consist of:

Avoiding chores like a couple of lazy brothers

2. Throwing dishes (and the dishwasher) they were supposed to wash out of the window

3. Getting lost in the maze

4. Team attacks (and that “the cake is a lie” prank)

5. Trolling Sans and Papyrus online (and everything else they do on their computer)

6. Stealing Koffin-K's Sans Receiver and messing with it

7. Tumbling down the stairs (from an animation that Team Switched did, which matches all three’s canon characterization)

8. Writing "dumbass" on Koffin-K’s golden statue (this scene isn't in the game either, but the golden statue is still there without "dumbass" written on its base, implying Harry and Larry had to scrub it off)

9. Riding on the Crown Jewel

10. Staying buried in the sand and showing Chara how to laze around

11. Spinning around in the washing machine behind Koffin-K’s back

12. Getting inside walls (mentioned in the official Koffin-K Tumblr account)

They're like brothers who live in the same household and love to cause mischief all the time

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 4)

Harry and Larry never filter their words or emotions around each other and the way they argue feels brotherly

Ever since their squabblings began, Koffin-K took it upon himself to (subtly) show them that he cared equally for both of them and encourages Harry and Larry to act as a unit instead of separate individuals (they're treated equally, like siblings)

The way Koffin-K loves both equally is heartwarming. He didn't favor Larry for being stronger (yet slower) or Harry for being smarter (yet more of a hothead). Unconditional parental love right here

Koffin-K chose Harry and Larry and made them feel like they belong somewhere. We don’t get any information about the two's biological families, only about their life with Koffin-K. He's the closest thing they have to a dad, and I can't imagine anyone else in that role. So, if Koffin-K isn't the Boogiemen's father figure, no one is

It sounds like Larry said: "Hey dad, we finished ALL our chores!" There’s also an emphasis on ALL, like he expects Koffin-K's praise

Based on his annoyed look, I think Harry wanted to add: "You have a new favorite lackey now, so why don't assign more chores to them?" or "Who cares what you assign us to do this time? You don’t need us the way we wish you did! We're nothing but lowly servants to you, you don't care about us and just want us to do your biding!"

Harry's words, "Like the lowly servants we are," and his facial expression made me come to the conclusion that he wishes for them to be more than just lowly servants to Koffin-K, consciously or (probably) not

By the end of the sentence he sounds insecure (…?)

Then he straight up looks annoyed and the message is clear

Harry secretly wants to be the favorite, and so does Larry. That's why, when he says "Why, 'cause he likes looking down upon us...?" Harry actually means "looking down upon me." And when Larry says "Hey, boss! We's finished ALL our tasks!" he wants Koffin-K to be proud of him

We don't see any hostility between Harry and Larry until Chara finds their weak spot. I imagine both of them thought to themselves as they did separate duties: "I’m the better henchman, the boss totally prefers ME over HIM!" Then they would forget about these thoughts and team up once again to cause mischief

Koffin-K paused his search for the Crown Jewel because he wanted to check the Boogiefloat out (the float probably used to be in the basement or his study so neither his other minions or the guests would question the found family implications)

He looks so happy and proud

The fact that Koffin-K had either been looking for the Boogiefloat outright or was curious about where it had disappeared to means that it was on his mind

Harry and Larry’s handiwork genuinely touched him, though he tried to hide it with sarcasm

Koffin-K believed in Harry and Larry's skills and creativity. Even if it was unintentional, he probably taught them how to be sneaky and clever, which is why Harry and Larry were able to pull off the festival infiltration

Look at his face when he says that the float couldn’t be refused or thrown out… he’s proud of them and loves the Boogiefloat because he secretly loves being a part of their weird little family

The Boogiefloat is something that ONLY Harry and Larry built; Koffin-K didn't build it with them as a peer would have. This makes it seem even more like the float is a parallel to a children's drawing of themselves and their parent(s)

Koffin-K DOES know why the float is perfect to him (it's because Harry and Larry built it, and they’re his boys.) He emphasizes "BUT," like he wants to say: "The float looks horrible, but I have an emotional attachment to the guys who made it and appreciate the sentiment, so it's perfect to me"

I don't think anyone noticed this, but Harry and Larry apparently made a tiny Koffin-K replica for inside the Keep, and Koffin-K not only kept it but wanted it to be visible to everyone

Koffin-K may not have raised Harry and Larry since childhood or wanted sons when he chose them as his henchmen, but they all became a found family anyway

This implies that Harry and Larry have been under Koffin-K's care for years

The Koffin Trio was 100% created to resemble a goofy boss with his two goofy henchmen, but I'm still wondering if all this found family stuff was intentional. I honestly can't tell. The nature of the other relationships in this game is explicitly shown to us: 1) Aaxel and Bugerpant have a crush on Flara and there's a rivalry between them for her romantic affection; 2) Chara and Asgore are father and child in a found family sense; 3) Dogamy and Dogaressa are dating; 4) Muffet is Papyrus' friend; 5) Sans and Papyrus are brothers; 6) Larry has a crush on someone named Laurice; 7) Koffin-K and Crossbones/Sans are each other's "arch-nemesis," but in reality they're just playing around; 8) Chara is the first person Koffin-K was vulnerable in front of, wanted around as a friend/mentee and saw as his equal

Then we have Harry and Larry, who are referred to as Koffin-K's (top) henchmen and minions and it just… doesn't match with what we're shown their dynamic is like. We're also told Harry and Larry are best f(r)iends, but they act like brothers and are treated as such by Koffin-K

Larry referred to Koffin Keep as home, and it reminded me of how Starlo also thought of Wild East as Clover's home. Larry could have meant a specific room in the castle (or his and Harry's shack/room/Spooky Servant's Station), but those are still a part of the Keep and Koffin-K's property, thus Koffin Keep as a whole is their home

When Ed took Clover back "home," as Starlo said, he just took them to the Wild East and not a specific place there. I feel like that's what's happening here too: Larry's saying they left the phone somewhere in Koffin Keep

Harry and Larry get in trouble with Koffin-K. He definitely yells at them and scolds them, but they might also get punished with extra chores, no free snacks, or he forbids them from spinning around in the washing machine for a week (once again, dad stuff. The way he scolds them is fatherly, too)

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 3)

I imagine that Koffin-K came up with the goofy idea (he's the kind of guy who gets weird ideas on the spot) for Harry and Larry to get propellers for their hats so they could be "proper lackeys." (Edit: This is probably canon, because we see Koffin-K use propeller hats during his battle with Chara) The two didn't use to be goofballs in the past, which we can see based on their behavior and body language in the flashback. Harry was focused on his work, while Larry was confused and directionless. Both seemed wary of Koffin-K at first, but became a lot more confident after joining him; he gave them an identity as the "Boogiemen" (Koffin-K didn't nickname any other lackey), and a purpose (to be his top henchmen)

Koffin-K's line "You two wanna be stuck mopping floors forever?!" might mean that both were janitors, but I feel like it was directed at Harry while mocking Larry for not having a job. Since there’s no mention of him having a janitor job too instead of just a dumpster bag, Larry and Harry probably didn’t know each other. That would explain why Koffin-K immediately grouped them together based on their rhyming names and the "screening process" (It kinda feels like Koffin-K only gave them a "screening process" so it wouldn’t be obvious that he’d have hired them even without them doing anything because he liked them right away) rather than pre-existing teamwork. If Harry and Larry already had a pre-existing friendship, the game would have at least implied it. We don't even know when or where they all met, or how Koffin-K picked up on their rhyming names, but I won't overthink it because it doesn't really matter. What was actually important to show is how Harry and Larry used to live in poor conditions before Koffin-K took them in and provided them with stable housing, a job where they're allowed to act like the kids they never got the chance to be, food, purpose, direction, identity... Koffin-K gave them emotional validation, he protects them, teaches them about teamwork and "putting hustle into slacking" and even believed that they had successfully infiltrated the festival

If we keep attacking Harry and Larry, they will simply be incapacitated, but Koffin-K steps in and looks furious anyway. He’s there to make sure they don't actually get hurt, but in Ruthless, they’re all on their own :(

When Koffin-K notices the Boogiemen are in no condition to be bossed around, he immediately stops yelling and manipulates them instead (he does this often, like a single parent trying to deal with chronically mischievous and *sometimes* disobedient kids). This is subtle, but it shows that he cares about Harry and Larry’s well-being and will control his temper for their sake

This was a very parental "I know how to outsmart my kids" move

Koffin-K looks sad when he mentions how Harry and Larry sometimes decide to spin in the washing machine without him having to order them, but in reality, he wanted to bond with the two in his own, wacky way, and they didn't *need* him to have fun. Koffin-K lets that disappointment go when he realizes Harry and Larry enjoying themselves is more important than feeling included himself

Harry’s sure Koffin-K will save them, and both yell for him and only him, like kids who need their dad to come to the rescue

There's a parallel between the Boogiemen yelling for Koffin-K, and Axis trying to call Chujin (who is his creator and father figure)

The three "children" are waiting for their "fathers" (who will never come) to rescue them

Harry and Larry copied two of Koffin-K's attacks (Edit: It's actually three. They all use the same "propeller hat" attack)

Harry accidently called Koffin-K ‘ma.’ I’m not sure if that was supposed to imply that he subconsciously sees him as a parent, or if it was a clue that he used to have a mom once (I still headcanon Harry as a mama's boy, that she taught him how to embroider and that he grew up either without a father or with an absent one)

Harry and Larry treat Koffin-K as their main authority figure. It sounds like Larry is saying "You can't tell us what to do, you ain't our dad!"

The Boogiemen look like kids who got in trouble and are now nervous about getting yelled at

There is a lack of equality/camaraderie in the trio's dynamic, although they obviously care about each other. That's another reason why I think their relationship resembles a father and sons rather than two younger brothers with an older sibling (who's exasperated with their antics)

Koffin-K doesn’t come off as Harry and Larry’s uncle or mentor either. An uncle would be more of a casual figure, someone they don't see every day/depend on for everything. A mentor teaches skills, just like Koffin-K does with Chara when it comes to mischief; he takes full responsibility for Harry and Larry, though

Koffin-K never insulted Harry and Larry out of malice or hatred. He called them imbeciles because he was angry that they didn't see he cared for both of them equally, affectionately called them idiots (together) to reassure them, and called them idiots again when he thought they might get caught and end up in the punishment shack for the night

While Koffin-K did call Harry and Larry inept, he never called them useless. There’s a difference

In other words, Koffin-K sees The Boogiemen as idiots with potential, which they are

Harry and Larry building the Boogiefloat featuring all three of them (with Koffin-K in the center, like he's the "head of the family"/dad) early on in their henchman days is an equivalent to children drawing themselves with their family (the "Harry and Larry built this within their first days of henchmenry" comment from Koffin-K confirms they got attached to him pretty fast, probably because they realized he gave them a second chance at life)

This is literally what it is, only in the form of a parade float (Harry and Larry see the three of them as a family, consciously or not)

Koffin-K is so happy to have told Chara about how he met his boys

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Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 2)

Harry and Larry parallel Sans and Papyrus (brothers)

Both pairs live together, spend almost all their time together, share a computer/arcade game machine and have online trolling sessions with each other

Papyrus yells at Sans just like Harry yells at Larry

These two scenes are ODDLY similar

Harry lost Larry in the Ruthless route, Papyrus (as he thought) lost Sans, and both of them trembled from sadness/pain thinking about them being dead

The Boogiemen even parallel OG Sans and Papyrus - Papyrus and Harry made a detailed-looking depiction of themselves, while Sans and Larry were more lazy

Sans and Papyrus and the Boogiemen remind me of Sonic & Tails and Scratch & Grounder (both duos are brothers) from Aosth. Sonic and Tails are the 'good guy brothers' like Sans and Papyrus, while Scratch and Grounder are the 'bad guy brothers' like Harry and Larry

Harry and Larry parallel Scratch and Grounder. Harry and Scratch are both gray and lanky, and are the angrier and bossier ones, while Larry and Grounder are green and round, and the ones that are slower and clumsier. There are other similarities, though:

Both pairs are the lackeys of a boss (Koffin-K and Robotnik) who is also their father figure, and there’s a sibling rivalry between them

Just like how Larry tried to imitate Harry's sneer (which is a very "younger sibling" thing to do), Grounder (the little brother) tried to imitate Scratch's laugh

Just like Scratch and Grounder, Harry and Larry are seen as a single entity/inseparable duo. They also mimic their bosses/father figures

It's funny how Harry and Larry are "Boogiemen" and Scratch and Grounder are "Badniks" – both pairs have a collective name

We also have: 1) Sonic, who is the arch-nemesis of Robotnik, like Sans is to Koffin-K 2) two villains, Robotnik and Koffin-K (Koffin-K obviously isn't a real villain, but he pretends to be one) with a pair of incompetent minions (Scratch & Grounder and Harry & Larry) who act like brothers and have sibling rivalry over their boss/father figure’s favoritism 3) Papyrus and Tails, Sans and Sonic's younger brothers who help them defeat the bad guy’s minions

People have compared Harry and Larry to Scratch and Grounder many times before

There's also a comparison between Harry and Larry and the Skunk Bros (Rough the Skunk and Tumble the Skunk from Sonic) in the comments above (yet another pair of brothers the Boogiemen are compared to)

Harry and Larry are similar to Lancer, while Koffin-K is similar to Rouxls Kaard, and those two have a dad-son relationship. RK and Koffin-K are egocentrical, incompetent at what they do, quirky, dramatic, theatrical and both endeared and annoyed by Lancer/the Boogiemen. At the same time, Harry and Larry are silly, mischievous, childish and seem shallow but really aren't, just like Lancer (Lancer was abused by his father his whole life and never had a real friend, Harry and Larry lived in poverty and homelessness before Koffin-K hired them). Vs. Susie and TS!US's Ruthless route are also heartbreaking because of these supposed "comic reliefs." The Boogiemen, like Lancer, have goofy standing and moving sprites and are influnced and taken care of by their father figures

Koffin-K complains about Harry and Larry’s laziness, in a similar way that Rouxls Kaard complains about Lancer’s (these three have a teenager mentality when it comes to slacking off). Koffin-K’s comment read to me as: "Good grief, it’s like I’m raising a third lazy son."

It's unclear if 'paying for' in this context implies that Koffin-K actually pays Harry and Larry even though they're huge slackers (they probably spend that money on ice cream, or something related to their tile-matching games), but he definitely pays for them living on his property, the electric bill so that they can use their shared phone and computer, new plates every time Harry and Larry throw dishes out of the windows and any damage that they cause in general while they're goofing off (if he notices), and because Koffin-K pays the chefs working in the castle, Harry and Larry have meals to eat every day. It's also implied that he provided the Boogiemen with the material to build the Spooky Servant's Station (did Koffin-K name it a Spooky Servant's Station because Harry and Larry were his first and only 'spooky servants' before Chara came around? It feels like another term of endearment, just like Harry and Larry being his 'attractions.' If it is, the rest of his minions don't count as his "spooky servants," since Koffin-K doesn't have a bond with them) and got them their bunk bed, shared phone and computer, 'LAUGH LAUGH LAUGH' sign, maybe even the spare hats and shovel (Lancer also has a shovel)

Koffin-K, like RK, is inconsiderate of others, but he IS surprisingly caring towards the Boogiemen. He fired his previous painter for trying to capture his good side and kicked a homeless man out of his basement (it's ironic how Larry was once homeless, too), but no matter how much trouble Harry and Larry cause, Koffin-K never even thinks of getting rid of them/firing them, and neither do they think he'd ever kick them out. Koffin-K cares about Harry and Larry's well-being and is invested in them. That's not to say other people aren't important to him as well (his bats, Chara, even Crossbones), but he doesn't seem to have a parent-child dynamic with anyone else (this is especially apparent when you remember that the Boogiemen are the only characters more childish than Koffin-K)

Some see Koffin-K as Chara's father figure, and while I do think it would be sweet if they stayed in Koffin Keep, (Harry and Larry even gave me 'big brother' vibes while in Chara's presence), I feel like Koffin-K acts like an older, peer-like friend/mentor/fun uncle to Chara rather than a father figure. They do definitely seem to view him as a role model, though; we can even get them to wear Koffin-K's old robes

Koffin-K is the only parental figure the Boogiemen have, but he didn’t know how to be their friend too. He formed a friendship with Chara because they understood Koffin-K’s loneliness and Koffin-K felt their loneliness right back (that memory…) Harry and Larry weren't lonely because they had each other ever since they started their careeer as henchmen, but Koffin-K never had anyone who he could call his equal before Chara (I love their friendsip so much). Chara saw right through Koffin-K and how lonely he is because they felt alone too; they looked up to/admired him for being brave enough to be himself, were the reason why he decided to turn over a new leaf and the first person he saw as his equal. Koffin-K wanted the two of them to pull pranks together, laughed WITH Chara and not AT them, and had no one to have fun WITH before (aside from Crossbones, but they were "enemies" and not on the same side)

Koffin-K and Chara being on similar wavelengths is what gives depth to their dynamic, so turning it into a parent-child dynamic would either minimize or remove that core aspect of their relationship, imo. Even the way Koffin-K addresses them feels either peer-like, or like he's their quirky, caring mentor/uncle. The thing about Harry and Larry is that they consistently act like Koffin-K's dependants, never his equals (the three of them are family, but Koffin-K sought company in Chara because he wanted to spend time with someone who'd be his equal)

Chara feels like Koffin-K's equal, but Asgore's dependant, which is why I see Asgore and Chara as a father and child (I also want goat dad to have a kid to raise; he's been through a lot)

In Boogiemen, there is a Thrash Machine leitmotif (which is Lancer's motif in another key), and a It's Pronounced Rules leitmotif. In other words, we have Lancer and RK's leitmotifs in this track, just like the Boogiemen and Koffin-K's leitmotifs. Coincidence? I think NOT!

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Koffin-K and The Boogiemen's Family Dynamic (Pt. 1)

Note: I got back into TS!US and still adore The Koffin Trio, so I decided to expand on my previous points and list all the reasons why I think their relationship is that of a father and sons, and why Harry and Larry always seemed sibling-coded to me. I've got a lot of things to go over, so this "series" will have several parts. And like the last time, if you don't want to read about the Koffin Trio and/or Harry and Larry in a familial light/if you think you might get triggered, it's best to ignore my takes

The Boogiemen's entire arc is about learning that they're equally valuable in Koffin-K's eyes despite their shortcomings, and it screams good dad™ who loves his sons the same, no matter how foolish they are. His speech might have been a "tough love" approach, but it genuinely comforted the two (and made them cry tears of joy). Intentional or not, the framing makes Koffin-K look like a dad solving sibling rivalry (there’s no way Harry and Larry didn’t have daddy issues before Koffin-K told them they're equally valuable to him — they felt unappreciated for years despite Koffin-K’s subtle affection and STILL kept trying to please him)

Harry and Larry didn't fight for a promotion or a higher paycheck, which would have been the case if they were simply Koffin-K's employees. They love to slack off and don't do their job for its own sake (even Flowey admits how boring the chores are) — it was all because they wanted to earn their boss’ affection and make him happy and proud so that he would appreciate, trust and like them. EVERYTHING about the Harry and Larry boss fight screams brothers™, from their back-and-forth bickering, to them hitting each other, to tumbling down the stairs and out of the castle as they’re beating each other up. They even apologized to each other and made up right away like nothing ever happened, even though this was their biggest argument yet. That's incredibly sibling-coded

Harry and Larry's boss fight is framed as sibling rivalry for parental affection/attention/validation. Behind all the comedy, their core conflict reads as "Who does dad love more?" They both desparately wanted to be the favorite lackey/favorite "child" and it's implied that Koffin-K picked up on it. Even before the events of the game, he had been trying to let Harry and Larry know he cared equally about both of them without breaking the "villain" persona (Koffin-K is one of those flawed father figures that are actually trying their best)

If a character avoids favoritism between two other characters, that's a straight up parental move

Harry and Larry were jealous of Chara because they thought Koffin-K had replaced them and that they were no longer his top henchmen/favorite boys

Neither was happy to see Chara even after the fight

The moment when Harry and Larry forgot to do their servant duties was framed as "When you forgot to do the chores your mom/dad asked you to do"

Harry and Larry do chores for Koffin-K as a part of their job, but it feels like they do household tasks assigned by a parent

We won't see a laughing sprite of any other lackey except Harry and Larry if we run into them during the "Scooby Doo door chase" prank. It's just the two of them who will laugh the way Koffin-K does, meaning that the Boogiemen are the only ones who are influenced by him

Speaking of being influenced by him, Koffin-K’s leitmotif is present in both Boogiemen and Let’s Boogie

Koffin-K mentions how he can only remember up to three rooms in the Keep, yet he can remember EXACTLY how his first meeting with Harry and Larry went — they are clearly important to him, even if he isn't aware of it (the Boogiemen are also the first ones on his mind when Chara encounters him for the second time in the Ruthless route)

It warms my heart that he remembers Harry and Larry better than anything in Koffin Keep, which he invested so much in

As selfish and greedy as he was before his redemption, Koffin-K always remembered things about the Boogiemen because he was interested in them and cared enough to notice Larry’s fascination with small, everyday things, how Harry knows to embroider (a "feminine" skill that Koffin-K never judges him for having; on the contrary, he looks happy as he mentions it), the way his hat collection fascinates them, how they take turns spinning around in the washing machine when they think he's not looking...

Koffin-K may not understand Harry and Larry’s online arguments, passion for tile-matching games, and making presentation slides about their UNDERNET history, but he never judges them or tries to stop them from having these hobbies. Instead, he tells Chara that they should just "leave them to it" (there's also something fatherly about Koffin-K being familiar with Harry and Larry's search history and overall computer schenanigans. He just observes them while they're too "busy" to notice him)

Koffin-K seems to have been the one to replace the Boogiemen’s Tab key (he cared enough to notice and fix it in his own weird way)

Harry and Larry could have fixed it themselves, but I think it's more likely that it was Koffin-K — he's associated with bats after all (also, I love the joke here)

Koffin-K called Harry and Larry his attractions; that sounds like a term of endearment, especially because the emphasis was on the word "MY." He treats them as an extension of himself, like a proud parent boasting about their kids. Harry and Larry look so happy, too

Koffin-K couldn’t have been referring to the other lackeys as well, because he immediately turned to the Boogiemen with a happy/proud expression as he was saying this line (and it's established that he doesn't care about any of the other minions)

In these scenes, Larry looks like a kid admitting to his dad that he's done something he shouldn't have (and Harry is acting like 'The Snitch' type of a sibling)

The first two lines make Harry and Larry sound like brothers blaming each other during an argument and the last one makes Koffin-K sound like a dad trying to manage them

Harry and Larry and Koffin-K's introductions parallel. Even the color of their names is the same

It's a 'like father, like sons' moment

Larry internalized and remembered exactly what Koffin-K taught them and both he and Harry put his advice into action. They look up to him so much

After Koffin-K dissmisses everyone except Chara, instead of heading out like everyone else, Harry and Larry will stay behind and turn their heads left and right like they’re looking for him, so that he’d tell them exactly what to do and/or because they're curious about where he went. The Boogiemen are attached to their boss and enjoy being around him (we can also see this based on how they'll run around him when he wants them to run away)

Just like how Koffin-K and Crossbones can easily trick Harry and Larry with free trampoline access and free ice cream, Koffin-K is gullible too (like father, like sons once again)

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So, I decided to draw a little something for my AU where Koffin-K adopted Harry and Larry as babies, since I still love their found family dynamic sm

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I like to think that it was Clover's death, besides Chara's, that was hurting Flowey so much.

I like to think that, at the end of the day, Flowey wished that he could see Clover again, just like he wished he could see his adopted sibling.

I like to think that Flowey cared about Clover as much as his soulless self could.

...especially when you remember the very last word he had said to Clover. If someone like Flowey genuinely calls you friend, you must have done something right.

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

based on this

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A Second Long Rant About The Koffin Trio

Note: I decided to write about these three again (mostly about the genocide route) because I didn't cover everything I wanted to in my previous take, and you guys seemed to like it (I'm glad you enjoyed it as well, @beethovenus!), so here we go. If you haven't already, please read my previous ts!us post, since this is an addition to that.

Let's just say that the writers really outdid themselves when it comes to the genocide route, especially in regards to Harry and Larry. Never before did a video game leave me feeling so emotionally broken. The battle between the Boogiemen and Chara proves that comedic relief characters CAN and SHOULD be put in serious situations. It gives them much-needed depth.

At the beginning, Harry and Larry didn't take Chara seriously and only managed to make it out of the encounter alive because Crossbones/Sans intervened (which just goes to show how reckless both of them are) they're like annoying but loveable little kids i swear

It's this trait of theirs that led them to their downfall later on. I guess you could say that their appearance was meant to 'lighten the mood' of the otherwise dark genocide route, but it only made things worse for them in the long run. I remember reading a comment on YouTube once, and it mentioned how the Boogiemen resemble horror movie characters who die first due to their carelessness. And aside from the fact that they were not the first monsters to get killed by Chara, I agree 100%

Neither one of them believed that a human was even in the Underground, let alone a serious threat... that is, until they tried picking on Chara ↓

...which obviously didn't end well ↓

When they realized that they really WERE in danger, both visibly began to panic; neither one of them even tried to pretend to be fearless ↓

I've got to say that I love the contradictory traits the Boogiemen share: fearless but fearful, fun-loving but seeking safety, reckless but cautious.

Imo, as much as they like to goof off, they want someplace to come back to even more. Koffin-K is the one who makes the keep a place where they feel like they belong; a place that gives them comfort. KK's presence is what reassures them that they're taken care of. He's the one who makes Koffin Keep home.

In the present moment, Harry and Larry can afford to act goofy and careless because they're convinced that, no matter what happens, Koffin will always be there to save them, provide for them, and keep them safe in general.

There's a difference between who Harry & Larry were before and after they got hired (they seemed to have become more mischevious, more open to goofing off, and even more ambitious and confident).

I find it interesting that both of them were anxious/sceptical about working for Koffin when he first met them:

The two weren't attached to Koffin-K at all at the time. They didn't become loyal right off the bat; It took them (a short) time to warm up to him. And now that they are attached, I'm pretty confident that they're never leaving his side

The thing about Harry is that he used to rely on this one low-wage job and probably thought: "If I take the risk and come to regret becoming this weird guy's lackey, or if he fires me, I might never be able to come back to my safe job again and I'll be left with nothing. I'm not even qualified for anything other than menial chores!" yeah I headcanon that both him and Larry dropped out of high school at like 16 and never went to college in the first place I'm also really curious if Harry used to be attached to his previous boss (who he never mentioned) like he is to Koffin-K now, but I doubt it since he DID accept Koffin's job offer the very next day.

And Larry didn't want to risk anything either, even though he pretty much had nothing to lose. Even if he used to have a job as a janitor (if this is the case, I imagine his thought process was the exact same as Harry's), he still lacked a home. It's depressing to think about how Larry apparently wanted to continue his poor-quality life because he didn't believe anything different or better was out there. Or, he had no idea what having a better life even felt like. Maybe he thought he'd be WORSE OFF as Koffin-K's employee and/or that he'd fire him at some point. I just made myself sad, I love these guys a lot and empathize so much I feel like both of them believe they're not good enough and it hurts

Anyway, back to the genocide route.

After they're rescued, Flowey says:

Already setting up the fact that they'll either be an easy and/or optional battle. Nice.

Then we see Harry and Larry straight up putting themselves in danger to please Koffin-K:

Like, guys, I'm sure he would have understood if you hadn't obeyed his order this time. but they CAN'T let him down; they refuse After all, a mass murderer was on the loose

And once again, we're given a choice whether or not to fight them:

And finally, if we follow them... we get to this scene.

Oh god. THIS scene. Where do I even start?

Alright, time for some retrospect.

So, the two dummies have no way to escape and are forced to fight (with their very last conversation being AN UNRESOLVED ARGUMENT), Larry is ruthlessly pushed off the cliff (is this why it's called the ruthless route? Because if so, it fits perfectly), Harry screams his name and falls to his knees, completely dejected, and doesn't even attempt to run or fight, waiting to join Larry in death.

This moment hurts. This text especially. "Quick on his feet" but not quick enough; Larry's name is no longer next to his

No matter how much they annoy each other, the care is clear as day. That's another reason why I think of them as brothers. Harry is pretty fearful, right? And yet he'd rather turn to dust than live a life without Larry.

Sometimes I wonder how the scene would have played out if Harry had been given given the choice to either flee, stay and fight, or let us finish him off.

Ok, the third option would remain unchangeable, and the second would definitely result in his death whether or not he put up a fight, but the first one...

**ANGST WARNING**

Koffin-K would find Harry in his and Larry's house, curled up on their (now only his) bunk bed, sobbing uncontrollably and blaming himself over and over again. Then he'd hold him and they'd cry together. Koffin would regret not being more transparent with his care for his henchmen, and now that he was only left with one, he'd swear to be the best boss and father he could be.

It would take a while, but eventually Harry would stop crying himself to sleep every night, he'd go back to his mischievous self, he'd pull pranks and laugh and have fun because that's what Larry would have wanted.

Koffin and Harry's relationship would strengthen over time (sooner rather than later) and they'd become a true family. But every day, for the rest of his life, Koffin-K would wish that he had told Larry how much he loved him before he died. Harry would wish that, too.

But there was no way to turn back the clock, and the only thing they could do was hope that, wherever Larry was, he'd somehow know.

...he did.

I don't even want to image what would have happend if the roles had been reversed. Let's just say that Larry would have been absolutely shattered if Harry had gotten pushed off a cliff/died first. Based on his reaction if you beat Harry up during their fight in the neutral route, I don't even think he'd ever be able to move on from the pain of losing his brother best friend (or it would be SUPER hard).

Speaking of these scenes, Harry's first reaction was to get furious, Larry's was to burst into tears. What they have in common though was that they showed care for each other sigh... image limit strikes again

Larry also picked up on the purity of Chara's soul (or lack thereof) and it triggered Chara

It reminds me of how Ceroba picked up on the number of monsters Clover had killed

Long story short, I love how both Harry and Larry have their own quirks and personality. They're not just interesting as a duo, but separately, too. It's sometimes hard to remind yourself how, just because two people are a team, that doesn't mean they don't/can't exist as individuals.

I'm really curious to see Koffin-K's reaction to these two's deaths. REALLY REALLY curious.

I think that he'd completely break down (before that he'd be in denial) upon realizing that his idiots are actually gone forever and were killed by someone Koffin thought would make a good servant. Still, for some reason, I doubt he would become so enraged that he could avenge them by killing Chara.

Regardless of his reaction, he'd definitely miss them a lot.

When everyone was gone, Harry and Larry were the first on his mind i feel like they're his biggest headache but also the two monsters he loves most, in his own unique way

Random thoughts as a bonus bc why not:

I swear, it seemed like they wanted to say "You're talking to THE COUNT'S lackeys!" and "You ain't the dad of us to tell us what to do!" Also, Harry looks scared/nervous/unsure/ af. These guys really are both cowardly and impulsive

Istg, they act like (man)children with Koffin being their strict but goofy dad mom who makes them do chores when they'd rather laze around (I know it's part of their job and everything but the way they talk about their duties gives me this vibe)

...yeah, just KK acting like an annoyed dad, nothing new to see here

Remember how, in the last post I wrote, I said that Harry and Larry are materialistic (for a good reason)? Yeah, they're so materialistic that they'd even "betray" their boss for some cash (unrelated, but I love this game's humor)

These two have a dog's loyalty, but even their house looks like a doghouse (or maybe it's just tiny compared to the keep). Speaking of the keep...

Interesting that, whoever wrote on this wiki, didn't include the other workers almost like it's just the three of them that are a family while the others are just there for the easy money

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

A Long Rant About The Koffin Trio

Note: So, this is my first (really) long post about this fangame, and to be honest, I was debating whether or not to even publish it. I still decided to do it since not a lot of folks talk about ts!underswap, and I wanted to give my two cents regarding my three favorite characters.

More important note: If you think it's gonna trigger you to read about Harry/Larry and Harry/Larry/KK as a found family, better click off this post. Maybe it's my inner aroace speaking, but I personally don't see the romantic appeal at all. Good for you if you do! I'm not trying to invalidate anyone's opinion; diversity is great after all :)

For those of you who are still here, I will start off by saying this:

Harry and Larry depend on Count Koffin-K for so much. I'm tempted to say EVERYTHING.

He genuinely feels like their father figure. I mean, this sentient fedora gave them a job while they were both living lives that were... bad.

He isn't cruel when they do something stupid and instead just looks deadpan. Sure, Koffin-K's not a perfect boss; he yells at the two of them and insults them (dude really needs to work on his temper), but I found it sweet how both Harry and Larry felt safe enough to tell him the truth here, which to me counts for something (pun intended) ↓

He even pranks them sometimes ↓

Koffin may not be perfect (he's gotta keep up the "evil" persona) but at least he 1) tries to give Harry and Larry a hint that he cares for them (has them both secretly do his laundry without them telling each other) 2) actually admits that he cares for them both equally (in his own way) 3) attempts to solve their disagreement despite him not gaining anything out of it

How they met is also interesting to me.

Based on their backstory, Harry and Larry were clearly hesitant to work for Koffin, but when they actually started the job the next day, I imagine that their conversation went something like this (either during the first day or at some point early on in their career):

H: "Larry, he could be like the dad we never had and provide for us and we could have all da money that we never did, see?"

L: "Huhuhu, yeah! Don't forgets da food!"

...and that's how the parade float came to be. I think Koffin secretly appreciates they made it, even though he says how he wanted the thing "as far away as possible" right after saying this line ↓

He also makes this face later on at the festival when he sees the float again cause it reminds him that the three of them are a family despite Harry and Larry getting on his nerves half the time but I can't include the screenshot bc of the picture limit

Heck, the two even built their house outside the keep, which to me suggests that they don’t ever plan on leaving Koffin.

Harry does mention his mother, and we learn that he's into embroidery (both making me think he's a a 'mama's boy'; maybe she taught him how to embroider)...

...but even on the ts!us wiki, the only relationship dynamic the two have is with Koffin-K himself.

Weirdly enough, we only know that Harry has a mom, but not a dad

Even though he was definitely unaware of this, Koffin liked Harry and Larry FOR BEING THEMSELVES. This is really important to me.

He saw something in them that others did not, even if it was initally just "your names rhyme and you give me the 'goofy henchmen' vibe." He sees them both as useful for what he needs them for. It may not be much, but it's exactly what Koffin's looking for.

In other words:

THE WAY HARRY AND LARRY ARE IS ENOUGH FOR COUNT KOFFIN-K. I mean, why look at resumes of competent potential employees when you can hire two idiots who are just as goofy as you

Exactly why Harry and Larry are so loyal to Koffin-K is unknown, but based on my interpretation, it has to do with 1) them desperately needing a father figure/someone to rely on 2) Koffin giving Harry and Larry a home, food, money, and a job that also allows them to slack off and finally enjoy life, and 3) him making them feel needed. Maybe not appreciated, even though he subtly tried to, but definitely needed. Serving under him became their purpose.

In other words, I think they're so loyal because Koffin "chose" them, even if he did that subconsciously.

Harry got the chance to be more than just a janitor. Imo, he was hesitant to work for Koffin at first because he was afraid that he would lose the only sense of security he had. I think he lived with his mom at the time, considering his low-wage job This explains why he wants to be rich (to make up for all the things he couldn't afford).

It also explains why Larry loves food so much (he literally slept under a dumpster bag and if he was both homeless AND unemployed, it would mean that he had to either be a beggar or eat from the trash. Either way, eating good food was out of the question.

It's also possible that Larry had a janitor job just like Harry (but unlike him, nowhere to live). I say that he might have been a janitor, since Koffin mentions how they could both do better than mopping floors forever, but maybe it was just an assumption on Koffin's side.

Whatever the case, their lives sucked.

There was also this one moment I wanna talk about, where Larry called Koffin-K stupid, and Harry pretty much agreed. So I asked myself why they reacted this way.

Maybe because it was easier to convince themselves that they didn't care about their boss than deal with the fact that he (maybe) always saw them as nothing but 'lowly servants'.

Seriously, Harry said out loud what they both wanted most of all. And that something was for Koffin-K to value them. This was more important to them than money and food COMBINED, considering their entire arc was about learning that Koffin needed them both equally

Maybe they were worried about getting fired, but I honestly don't think Koffin ever wanted to do that to them, no matter how many times they messed up.

Maybe they didn't want to be honest and admit to Koffin that he's a total dumbass so they wouldn't get in trouble with him. I mean, they did want to gain his validation/appreciation/approval/love, so it makes sense that they would do anything to get and remain in his good books.

I think the third scenario is the most likely one, tbh.

Might be a nitpick, but notice how Harry and Larry are walking next to each other here, but Koffin-K's at the back, just sorta... isolated, like he's not their equal? This is why I'd rather see him as their father figure than an older brother. The way I look at it, the oldest sibling is usually in charge, yeah, but there's still a level of closeness and familiarity between the siblings, whereas Harry and Larry hardly know anything about Koffin-K, ESPECIALLY how lonely he really is. Koffin's the one who gave them a purpose, became their boss, and as a result, they began looking up to him. In contrast, the two spend 24/7 together, bicker, and are practically inseparable, like brothers

Larry also explains how Koffin-K doesn't like leaving his study, but clearly neither Harry nor Larry reflected on why that is and just assumed it's because Koffin's 'stupid.' This reaction kinda rubbed me the wrong way at first, but then I remembered both of these dudes are street rats who don't know any better.

Look, I know the Boogiemen were supposed to fit this common "goofy villain's sidekicks" trope, but both of them clearly grew up in poor conditions, have daddy issues (imo), and feel worthless/useless.

That's why they want Koffin-K's attention so badly.

They need a father figure to reassure them that they're useful, important, and loved.

All this makes them three-dimensional and relatable, just like most UT/DR/UTY characters. It feels like everyone in these games goes through some kind of deep arc, and I feel like this is supposed to be the Boogiemen's

Sure, Harry and Larry are funny at first glance, and they're great at being comic reliefs, but at their core, they are misguided guys who come from poverty/homelessness. I kinda wish the feisty four from uty had more going for them just so I could psychoanalyze them all

Even though it's probably been a few years since they joined Koffin, at least some part of Harry and Larry doesn't seem to believe that they can finally enjoy themselves, even if it means doing hooligan stuff and boring chores. That's why they're 'superficial' and goof off and will grab any opportunity to act childish and materialistic.

A typical case of age regression

What lies beyond the surface is incredibly sad to me.

Now, this is sort of like a bonus section bc I want to explain WHY exactly I see Harry & Larry as brothers, and WHY I think they see Koffin as a dad again, maybe it's bc I'm aroace and I see family relationships everywhere, but the stuff below REALLY REALLY reminds me of these types of dynamics:

They threw insults at each other and had a literal fistfight over which one of them Koffin appreciated/liked more

They cried HARD (of joy) when Koffin told them they're both equally useful and useless, so they no longer had to be at each other's throats. He also said how he recognized that they're passionate about being his lackeys, even if their teamwork needed, well, work

I think it's sweet how they built the float 'within their first days of henchmenry,' according to KK. They could have easily NOT included him, but had apparently warmed up to him pretty soon

Harry wanted to call Koffin to save them + I love how he's CERTAIN he'll do it

Both yelled for Koffin (reminds me of Axis calling out for Chujin for some reason)

Larry called Koffin Keep their home (could have easily said that they left it at the keep...reminds me of the times Starlo called The Wild East Clover's home I really need to stop with the uty parallels)

They cheered for him (and got hit in the face with books)

They get in trouble with him

They apparently copied two of his attacks these 3 are so similar except that Koffin is a more 'head in the clouds' kind of goofy while Harry & Larry are more grounded... but still goofy

And this line... "And quit arguing, you two!" sounded so parental, istg

I forgot to mention some stuff:

After Koffin tells everyone to go to the festival, Harry and Larry quickly look left and right, like they're wondering where he is and/or what to do now that he isn't there. Poor guys really are dependent on him and like to be in his presence

They talked about Koffin a LOT throughout this game. Their conversations are either about 1) Koffin and what they're gonna do to please him, 2) Them bickering, or 3) Some shenanigans they get themselves into. Larry even remembers how Koffin-K always says: "If you're slacking, put some hustle into it"

Koffin doesn't treat any other lackey the way he does Harry and Larry, and none of the other lackeys seek his admiration like the two do

Harry and Larry were both jealous af of Chara for getting all the attention (right after they got into Koffin's study Harry said "Now whaddya need us in here for, see?" and I immediately thought that he wanted to add "you have a new favorite child lacky now so why don't assign more chores TO THEM")

Like I'm not sure if they were meant to come across to us players as a family but for some reason that's how they came across to me since day 1

The actual reason why I see them in this light is not just bc I love found family (even tho I do. a lot), but bc I feel like it would give Harry & Larry more depth than a romance between any of them

[profounddefendorcrusade-blog]

Let's see what Clover did (yeah i had to play the whole game again):

Decided to find out what happened to the five missing children and bring them home to the surface

Complimented Froggit

Comforted Flier

Distracted Penilla from drawing so she could take a break

Left the exact amount of money on the lemonade stand despite there being no attendance to take it

Gave Sweet Corn a hug

Helped Rorrim fulfill his purpose (make others not criticize how they look)

Respected Decibat's need for silence

Joined Crispy Scroll's excited yelling over anime so he wouldn't feel lonely

Complimented Micro Froggit

Played count the dust with the dust bunny monster

Didn't disturb Decibat while he was asleep

Even when helpless and wrongfully attacked, decided to befriend Dalv, thus causing him to give up on his lonely lifestyle and start making friends

Because the monsters in the Ruins finally got to go outside, all this happened: 1) Sweet Corn got to open a free hugs booth 2) Penilla got to draw things outside of the Ruins, see the big corn cob picture she made for Dalv, and realize that she and Dalv ARE friends 3) Crispy Scroll got to go to the dump and find more anime tapes 4) Flier could learn new dance moves and (maybe) buy a beach house 5) Rorrim could go on adventures

Took their time to get to know Dalv and explore his house

Didn't invade Pops' privacy and waved at him before closing the wardrobe

Danced with Frostermit and got it out of its shell (literally and metaphorically)

Put Insomnitot to sleep

Ended up buying Mo's poor quality products because they knew he was struggling financially x1

Patiently explained the dangers of an open fire to Know Cone

Believed that the remnants of the snowman were full of potential for new life

Played a game with the Shufflers and became their friend

Got the Honeydew Resort band to play that furry monster's favorite song

Found one monster's mitten

Got another monster a coffee and matches so they wouldn't freeze

Found a map for the lost tourists

Freed Slurpy from the pole

Spent time chatting with the Honeydew Resort shopkeeper and learned more about Dalv, who ended up fulfilling his dream of having an organ concert in the end credits

Got Trihecta to split up and literally and metaphorically get off each other's backs so all three could be who they wanted to be individually

Begrudgingly insulted Martlet so they could spare her

Forgave Martlet for fighting them and trusted her to keep them safe

Gave Martlet the highest scores on her questionnaire

Pat Dunebud

Ended up buying Mo's poor quality products because they knew he was struggling financially x2

Made Cactony feel love for the first time

Fixed the elevator in the mines

Helped Bowll put his guard down and discover his true self

Found the mine worker's hat, causing him to get a promotion in the end credits

Did their best to dance with El Bailador despite being bad at it

Sat next to Kanako's friend on the swing

Told Violetta she had nothing to fear

Forgave Martlet for abandoning them

Saw potential in the sapling to grow into something beautiful

Hung out with Starlo and the Feisty Five despite the gang kidnapping them

Was worried about what was bothering Ceroba while she was checking out Starlo's movies that Kanako used to watch with him

Proved to Blackjack that humans can be good

Didn't attack the FF even though they unfairly ganged up on them

Even though they were unfairly attacked by Starlo, they surrendered to him

Didn't make fun of Starlo's true face

Didn't get upset with Martlet for yet again abandoning them

Cleaned Jandroid

Helped Goosic produce music that's actually pleasant to listen to

Ended up buying Mo's poor quality products because they knew he was struggling financially x3

Calmed Guardener down to the point she stopped attacking them and Ceroba

Helped Telly-Vis work together

Calmed Ceroba down while she was yelling at the Steamworks robot

Spared Axis, knowing that he was the last thing left of Chujin, and trusted Ceroba with her plan

Overall took their time to talk to everyone they met so they could understand their situation

Changed Martlet's entire perspective on humans

Tried to understand the deeper reason as to why Ceroba was doing what she was doing, hugged her and forgave her

Decided not to hide underground and willingly sacrificed their SOUL for monsterkind even after being hurt, attacked, and killed so many times (also during the 100+ runs)

Knew the sacrifice might mean nothing but went along with their decision anyway and put faith in whoever would come after them

Waited for their friends to leave before they died, in a lot of pain

Before that reassured Ceroba they'd be okay so she'd be at least a bit comforted

Delivered true JUSTICE