nusa-jabber

[nusa-jabber]

@lastromanticist That's so interesting! I know Hellenized Palestinians both wrote and even preserved the Bible, but as I put in my second reblog in the post here

It was from Egyptian Jews the Greeks adopted Christianity, not Palestinian (the use of Palestinian isn't ahistorical here, because "Palestine" was in use before the birth of Christ—especially in Egypt, which has the first recorded name of "Palestine" we know of). Egyptians got Christianity from Palestinian Jews/missionaries specifically from Jerusalem, who were trying to spread Christianity... we did not really impress the North Africans though, lol.

I'm wondering if maybe the Greeks in Alexandria did directly attain some form of contact from the Palestinian missionaries, though Egyptian Jews are often credited for Christianity's spread in Greece and Rome. Definitely something to conduct more research on my part 👀. I will say, makes it funnier Palestinians are mainly GREEK Orthodox now, despite being the founders of the religion and maybe having introduced it to the Greeks first.

Hi, sorry if this comes out as a ramble, but your Troy ask made me rewatch the movie (for the umpteenth time, lol), and it brought a lot of old feelings back, both good and bad. The good is how much I adored the Iliad as a child and that's something that still thrives today—since I was a kid, I loved Greek mythology in general, partly because I'm Palestinian/a fellow Eastern Mediterranean, so there is a lot of overlap in our histories, cultures, customs and myths, but the Iliad has always been a favorite. Hektor is my favorite character (and I love him and Andromache), but I also have an immense soft spot for Briseis... and now to get to the bad, rewatching Troy reminded me how a lot of people erase her and her role—and her romance—to Achilles in modern retellings. Now, I'm not going to argue which Achilles ship is the best (especially because that man is a hoe, if we're being honest), I don't care. My problem is the modern erasure of Briseis and the other women in Achilles's life that are romantically entangled with him being reduced to, "He's gay, actually." It reads biphobic if you believe him queer (Patroclus too, who had many named women concubines/slaves), first off, misogynist second. He has a son with his foster "sister," Deidamia, and in some versions even married. In the Iliad especially, Patroclus tells Briseis Achilles will marry her and Achilles himself refers to her as his wife/bride, stopping a whole war when she's taken, and she's even allowed to aid in Patroclus's funeral rights. In some versions, Achilles falls for Polyxena, and tries to make peace with Troy so he can marry her. In the afterlife, Achilles chooses Helen as his wife for some reason. Just... all these women, with complex situations and feelings, are all reduced or erased in modern tellings (and usually for a man/Patroclus), and it makes me want to scream. People use the excuse of, "We don't like the romantic situation they're in," but then claim to "better" it by... erasing or reducing these women and their complex roles and feelings from the story overall? Brieseis, for example, mutually loved Achilles and saw him as a husband... he also killed her first husband and brothers, and you can argue part of her love is out of the need for survival. Yet, she greatly mourned him when he was killed, too. And if exploring this complexity is still not your yum, what about Polyxena? Wouldn't she fit the girlboss archetype of using Achilles' affections to gain his trust, before stabbing him in the back (literally)? Or Deidamia, who's young and left at home, bereft of her husband and son? Heck, try and fill in the gaps how Achilles x Hellen happened, if you must. All these women have an important role in the story, and to Achilles, that could be explored—but people don't because they dismiss what's already there or don't know anything about The Iliad outside modern retellings (mainly The Song of Achilles). So, we get people claiming things that are untrue ("Achilles and Patroclus are exclusively gay!"... in some myths, they're actually relatives/distant cousins, fun fact 😭), and acting like they fixed something by "adding" onto "flat female characters" in a way that reads inauthentic and ignorant to the source material. I get wanting to prop up one's chosen ship, it's just the hypocrisy of promising to be more progressive in one area, but diminishing the progressiveness of another, that kills me. Anyway! Sorry for the rant, I just have a lot of feelings I wanted to share because of the movie and I know you've talked about all this before—it's just something hard to discuss on the internet without people coming down your throat 🥲. Anyhow, justice for Briseis, is my rallying cry, I love her so much, queen made a whole war stop for her and managed to escape from Agamemnon unscathed. Queen who launched a thousand ships to my heart 🫶🏻.

I'm glad you re-watched it! It's a beloved of many Greeks since the movie is quite epic and makes you understand some of the original's glory. Hector, Andromache and Briseis are some of my fave characters in the movie, and it made me also look out for those characters when they appear in the text.

Btw, I would love to know a Palestinian's pov on our shared traditions and myths, how do you guys learn the Greek myths, what parts of them have had perhaps an affect on your heritage and since when, etc! 😍

Briseis' situation is complicated one because many people won't catch the nuance of her living in a patriarchal society as a war captive and thus developing a strange co-dependence to her captors. In addition, the Homeric Epics are a work changed by time in the Greek society, as people added and altered stuff, so many storylines have been affected by other layers of patriarchal societies. So of course the notion of "slave girl mourning her captor's friend" would seem natural, because they probably don't consider a slave woman's POV. Or perhaps she was in the mourning because she had to be there as a woman "belonging" to the Greeks, and the text does not mention it explicitly because it a given for the era. (I don't recall the whole relevant text sorry)

I am not sure if the average author - judging by what is published in the Anglophone market - can handle the complexity of Briseis and other women in the Trojan war. For Briseis one could go for a romance there but they'd have to depict all of her psychosynthesis properly, so it doesn't come off as "Achilles killed my family but he is hot so I love him". To be fair, it is a challenging task but I am still sad that I haven't heard retellings that do this well. Such a retelling done well would be chef's kiss!

As you said, unfortunately, the writers for now focus on the couple Achilles x Patroclus which, ok, let's accept it since it's a ship and there is some background to it (although those guys are most likely 1) cousins 2) very close to each other like brethren in a way westerners misinterpret). I've enjoyed Song of Achilles and I am surely not against such works, but you are right that the female heroines are reduced to flat characters. A fandom full of women manages to be misogynistic - again. We shouldn't be surprised because misogynistic influences are very strong in our societies still, although many don't see it 😕

[nusa-jabber]

No problem, trust me, it took me a while to reply the first time, no worries, haha 🫶🏻. In reference to Astarte, maybe the name "Ishtar" (her Sumerian/Mesopotamian name) will be more recognizable—Astarte is just her East Mediterranean incarnation and where the Cypriots imported it from, actually!

Cyprus and Cypriots tend to be considered "Middle Eastern" as well, because of our shared history and ancestry (at least for Levantine Arabs, which I'll get to in a sec). Greece and Greeks are technically meant to, as well, but again, new arbitrary "West vs. East" borders were created, as you said!

As for Baal and Zeus, it's actually a common belief I'd definitely explore, since it not only spans the transition of one polytheistic religion to another, but even to Abrahamic where Baal becomes transformed as Satan. Poseidon, funnily enough, comes from North African/Libyan paganism as well (Herodotus was famous for this claim, too). Anat (also widely known for her "Inanna" incarnation) into Athena is actually a prime example of Mediterranean telephone, because through the Phoenicians, we brought her to the Amazigh, who renamed her as Tanit and may have brought her to Greece (or the Phoenicians did). This is a Wiki page, but it summarizes perfectly what I mean and corroborates with legit sources that can be found 😊:

A more reputable source, haha:

Tanit's relation to Anat and Athena can be found with a simple search, as well ☺️—I'm just using Wiki here (again) for the easier summary, haha:

As for North Africans spreading Christianity, here is a site on them and the trinity/Greeks/Romans, here and here. It was from Egyptian Jews the Greeks adopted Christianity, not Palestinian (the use of Palestinian isn't ahistorical here, because "Palestine" was in use before the birth of Christ—especially in Egypt, which has the first recorded name of "Palestine" we know of). Egyptians got Christianity from Palestinian Jews/missionaries specifically from Jerusalem, who were trying to spread Christianity... we did not really impress the North Africans though, lol. Admittedly, my knowledge isn't as extensive on this because North Africa isn't my area of expertise, but some of my North Africans, friends like Sissa and Yasmine, are more informed on the topic! Sissa was actually the one who told me about North African Poseidon, while Yasmine brought my attention to Zeus-Ammon in ancient Egypt, who I feel perfectly sums up how much we in the Mediterraneans like to meddle with each other 😂:

As for this

As for the Trojans their location shows they were probably part of the Hittite empire. I wouldn't consider the Turks at all because they came at least two thousand years later, and the Arabs were not too many in the area yet. But of course, in any case, the Trojans were Anatolian!

Sorry, I should have clarified! "Arab" is not a (biological) ethnic group now insomuch it's a linguistic and cultural panethnic identity—many "Arabs" are not actually "Arabs," particularly from the Levant and North Africa, we're just Arabized. Actually, as a Palestinian, I technically have more Natufian and Antalion blood than I do Arab 😂 (and Palestine and Syria had some of their own Arab tribes like the Ghassanid, but as you mentioned, they were small in numbers).

"Levantine" is a new English (well, French) term to describe what we call, "Shami" in Arabic, but the English word can include non-Arab countries like Turkey and Cyprus. So when I'm saying, "Levantine Arabs," I'm using it to specify the Levantines from Arab countries—I don't mean actual Arab tribes from the Levant like the Ghassanid. So when I say the Turkish are a mix of East Asians (Turks) and Levantine "Arabs," I'm referring to the Levantine ancestors that make up Levantine Arabs today, which include the Hittites, Anatolians, Phoenicians, Philistines, etc.! We're very mixed, like the Greeks (and, funnily enough, we'd probably have been considered as Greek and/or Roman today, through Hellenization/Latinization, if not for the fall of their empires and rise of the Arab's), and it's thus a shame how NW European countries like to flatten us so they can appropriate our religions, cultures and the like. But my point in first bringing this up was to say that the Turkish today are made up of the ancient Levantines who lived there—those who also made up Levantine "Arab" ancestry—and the Turks who later migrated from East Asia ☺️.

Thanks for answering, as always, and have a Merry Christmas if you're Orthodox! 🫶🏻

Hi, sorry if this comes out as a ramble, but your Troy ask made me rewatch the movie (for the umpteenth time, lol), and it brought a lot of old feelings back, both good and bad. The good is how much I adored the Iliad as a child and that's something that still thrives today—since I was a kid, I loved Greek mythology in general, partly because I'm Palestinian/a fellow Eastern Mediterranean, so there is a lot of overlap in our histories, cultures, customs and myths, but the Iliad has always been a favorite. Hektor is my favorite character (and I love him and Andromache), but I also have an immense soft spot for Briseis... and now to get to the bad, rewatching Troy reminded me how a lot of people erase her and her role—and her romance—to Achilles in modern retellings. Now, I'm not going to argue which Achilles ship is the best (especially because that man is a hoe, if we're being honest), I don't care. My problem is the modern erasure of Briseis and the other women in Achilles's life that are romantically entangled with him being reduced to, "He's gay, actually." It reads biphobic if you believe him queer (Patroclus too, who had many named women concubines/slaves), first off, misogynist second. He has a son with his foster "sister," Deidamia, and in some versions even married. In the Iliad especially, Patroclus tells Briseis Achilles will marry her and Achilles himself refers to her as his wife/bride, stopping a whole war when she's taken, and she's even allowed to aid in Patroclus's funeral rights. In some versions, Achilles falls for Polyxena, and tries to make peace with Troy so he can marry her. In the afterlife, Achilles chooses Helen as his wife for some reason. Just... all these women, with complex situations and feelings, are all reduced or erased in modern tellings (and usually for a man/Patroclus), and it makes me want to scream. People use the excuse of, "We don't like the romantic situation they're in," but then claim to "better" it by... erasing or reducing these women and their complex roles and feelings from the story overall? Brieseis, for example, mutually loved Achilles and saw him as a husband... he also killed her first husband and brothers, and you can argue part of her love is out of the need for survival. Yet, she greatly mourned him when he was killed, too. And if exploring this complexity is still not your yum, what about Polyxena? Wouldn't she fit the girlboss archetype of using Achilles' affections to gain his trust, before stabbing him in the back (literally)? Or Deidamia, who's young and left at home, bereft of her husband and son? Heck, try and fill in the gaps how Achilles x Hellen happened, if you must. All these women have an important role in the story, and to Achilles, that could be explored—but people don't because they dismiss what's already there or don't know anything about The Iliad outside modern retellings (mainly The Song of Achilles). So, we get people claiming things that are untrue ("Achilles and Patroclus are exclusively gay!"... in some myths, they're actually relatives/distant cousins, fun fact 😭), and acting like they fixed something by "adding" onto "flat female characters" in a way that reads inauthentic and ignorant to the source material. I get wanting to prop up one's chosen ship, it's just the hypocrisy of promising to be more progressive in one area, but diminishing the progressiveness of another, that kills me. Anyway! Sorry for the rant, I just have a lot of feelings I wanted to share because of the movie and I know you've talked about all this before—it's just something hard to discuss on the internet without people coming down your throat 🥲. Anyhow, justice for Briseis, is my rallying cry, I love her so much, queen made a whole war stop for her and managed to escape from Agamemnon unscathed. Queen who launched a thousand ships to my heart 🫶🏻.

I'm glad you re-watched it! It's a beloved of many Greeks since the movie is quite epic and makes you understand some of the original's glory. Hector, Andromache and Briseis are some of my fave characters in the movie, and it made me also look out for those characters when they appear in the text.

Btw, I would love to know a Palestinian's pov on our shared traditions and myths, how do you guys learn the Greek myths, what parts of them have had perhaps an affect on your heritage and since when, etc! 😍

Briseis' situation is complicated one because many people won't catch the nuance of her living in a patriarchal society as a war captive and thus developing a strange co-dependence to her captors. In addition, the Homeric Epics are a work changed by time in the Greek society, as people added and altered stuff, so many storylines have been affected by other layers of patriarchal societies. So of course the notion of "slave girl mourning her captor's friend" would seem natural, because they probably don't consider a slave woman's POV. Or perhaps she was in the mourning because she had to be there as a woman "belonging" to the Greeks, and the text does not mention it explicitly because it a given for the era. (I don't recall the whole relevant text sorry)

I am not sure if the average author - judging by what is published in the Anglophone market - can handle the complexity of Briseis and other women in the Trojan war. For Briseis one could go for a romance there but they'd have to depict all of her psychosynthesis properly, so it doesn't come off as "Achilles killed my family but he is hot so I love him". To be fair, it is a challenging task but I am still sad that I haven't heard retellings that do this well. Such a retelling done well would be chef's kiss!

As you said, unfortunately, the writers for now focus on the couple Achilles x Patroclus which, ok, let's accept it since it's a ship and there is some background to it (although those guys are most likely 1) cousins 2) very close to each other like brethren in a way westerners misinterpret). I've enjoyed Song of Achilles and I am surely not against such works, but you are right that the female heroines are reduced to flat characters. A fandom full of women manages to be misogynistic - again. We shouldn't be surprised because misogynistic influences are very strong in our societies still, although many don't see it 😕

[nusa-jabber]

boy that has half the world swooning over him but falls for the only girl that *seems* to be immune to his charm + girl who was never deemed as lovable or desirable by anyone falls for boy that she thinks she could never have because he could have anyone, but then he makes her see that he only has eyes for her, you will ALWAYS BE LOVED BY ME

[nusa-jabber]

Been wanting to make Belle (2021) fan art since I saw it in theaters months ago. Got a real soft spot for Beauty and the Beast retellings 💗

[nusa-jabber]

Beauty & the Beast

[nusa-jabber]

"Faces in the snow" commission by @dragonfiredevil

ありがとう！

(๑˃ᴗ˂)ﻭ #BELLE

[nusa-jabber]

Elphaba & Fiyero commission done for Anon on Insta.

[nusa-jabber]

The Palestinian Andromeda 

-

There are a few different interpretations of the myth of Andromeda from Greek Mythology ( the princess chained to a rock to be saved by Perseus), the tale references both Palestinian and Ethiopian origins, in some myths describing her father and mother to be the rulers of the Kingdom of Jaffa (Palestine), I wanted to honor both as presenting her as a Palestinian Princess of Ethiopian origin. The myth especially means a lot to me as a Palestinian who’s family was ethnically cleansed from Jaffa in the 1940s, a tale from home. 

[nusa-jabber]

white women are always like “more strong kickass female leads!” and when i say i want to see a black female love interest who is allowed to be girly and fall in love they give me weird looks and say that i’m supporting gender stereotypes and heteronormativity but what a lot of white women don’t get is that black women we’ve had hundreds of years of having our femininity ripped from us, of being deemed unworthy of male (especially non-black male) attention. black women in media are never allowed to be the “cute” ones or the love interest, we’ve always been the “strong kickass street smart woman” trope that white women want so badly. so basically if a black girl says she wants to see another black girl fulfill the role of “love interest” there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that and it isn’t a hindrance to feminism

[nusa-jabber]

Fiyeraba is like, “What if Prince Charming fell for the evil witch instead of the virtuous princess?” and I love them for that.

[nusa-jabber]

Fiyero:

[nusa-jabber]

Saint Barbara’s day or Eid il-Burbara is celebrated in Syria, Lebanon, Jordan and Palestine among Arab Christians annually on December 4, in a feast day similar to that of North American Halloween. Although the children enjoy candies and other sweets on this day, the traditional food for the occasion is Burbara, a bowl of boiled barley, pomegranate seeds, raisins, anise and sugar offered to masquerading children. The general belief among Lebanese Christians is that Saint Barbara disguised herself in numerous characters to elude the Romans who were persecuting her.

Fr. Firas Aridah, pastor of St. Joseph’s, Jifna, is blessing the children’s treats.

[nusa-jabber]

what is biden’s plan to reverse the damage that the song of achilles has done to tumblr’s perception of the iliad

[nusa-jabber]

@wordsmithic Hi! Sorry for the belated reply, lot of things were happening on my end, so it took me a while to reply. First, thank you for the kind and thoughtful response, my thoughts are exact on the complexity of Briseis and Achilles, as well as the historical context they come from—it's what makes them so interesting to me, and why I wish people invested more in their relationship and exploring it. And yes, the inner misogyny is what really kills me by the end of the day, because... why. As to Palestine's connection to Greece: We're both part of the Eastern Mediterranean and Greece has directly taken myths and gods from us or fused yours with ours when you guys conquered us (and we both conquered and mixed myths with North African, haha)—the Levant was directly part of the Roman/Byzantine Empire, as well, and still has Greek and Roman ruins for it. Actually, despite Palestine being the founder of Christianity (which North Africans then brought to the Greeks and Romans—this is a common theme of dissemination between our cultures, lol) are mainly Greek Orthodox (some Catholic or a flavor of it) because of the Greek and Roman Empires. Some famous examples of Greek mythological figures who are originally Palestinian include Aphrodite (Astarte), Zeus (Baal), Athena (Anat), Adonis (Adon, technically Lebanese/Syrian too—fun fact, there is a famous Syrian poet who uses the name of Adonis because of this), and more. You still see their Cana`an roots in Greek myths through different ways, too, like how Aphrodite is the goddess who came from the other side of the Mediterranean/sea foam (her animal being a dove is also indicative to her Palestinian roots: doves still have symbolic importance in Palestine today); how anemones, from her and Adonis's love story, still have relevance to Palestine today (going as far to be informally called, "The Palestinian Poppy"), because they represent love and the martyrdom of the native people who have witnessed injustices on our soil, such as Jesus Christ (who—from an atheistic POV—may have been inspired by Adon's story); how Zeus sleeps around because his Cana`an counterpart is the god of storms AND fertility (the Greeks just left that out when adopting him, lol); how Athena is Zeus's favorite because, as Anat, she is the wife of Baal and fights to bring him back from the underworld, everyone else be damned; how Athena is the founder of olive trees, which originate from Palestine and still hold cultural significance to the point we have the oldest olive tree in the world; etc. Greek myths, themselves, also directly acknowledge the roots of other Levantine characters like Dido from Tunisia, who was Phoenician; Europa, who would be Lebanese today and where the name "Europe" came; Aphrodite and Adonis's daughter, Beroe, also Lebanese, and where Lebanon's capital, "Beirut" got its name—Adonis's River (also known as Abraham/Ibrahim's River) still bleeds, yearly, in Lebanon:

Andromeda is also half-Palestinian, specifically from Jaffa, through her mother, the rocks where she was tied still here:

And while I know Greeks and Turkish have a tense relationship, The Iliad itself features the indigenous people of the Levant as the Trojans: Troy is in modern Turkey, in which the Turkish today are a mix of Turkic East Asians and (now) Arab Levantines, who are also made up of groups who were once considered "Greek," like the Philistines with Palestinians, Anatolians with Turkish and Syrians, etc. King Midas also comes from this area, as does Tyrian Purple that marked Roman royalty (purple itself is from the Levant/Lebanon specifically). Hermes is also credited to have birthed Arabs, though his son Arabos, in Greek mythology and—expanding the Arab bracket to include North Africa, we have North African characters in Greek myths like Medusa, Calypso, Circe (where I suspect the North African witch stereotype may come from), Poseidon, etc. Heck, as I mentioned before, the North Africans were the ones to bring Christianity to Greece and Rome at one point, with their own editions, like the Trinity. Basically, my point is, Palestinians and other Levantines know and interact with Greek mythology because it's also our history—we call each other cousins because we very much are. We're geographically, biologically, historically and culturally linked—one of the Levantines most famous queen is Zenobia and the proverb of "sail the seven seas" is directly related to us as the Mediterranean/overall region:

Our histories are pretty circular too, since we'd keep conquering and influencing it each other, whether it be through the Roman Empire, the Ottomans, Andalusian (and North Africans with the Maltans, who Calypso is also suspected to be from totally not a coincidence), etc. Us in the Mediterranean were just always up in each other's businesses, being an annoying, nosy family, lol. I've said this before in another post, but it's genuinely impossible to study one Mediterranean culture, religion and history without knowing the other, because we all influenced and borrowed from each other at some point (our languages itself root from the Phoenician Alphabet, which was the first alphabet). These modern divisions are just that: New, and meant to divide us as East vs. West, white vs. colored, etc. For a long time, Greece was considered part of the "East," and for good reason. Anyhow, sorry for the spam! I'm just really passionate about this aspect because a lot of Levantine and North African influence and characters in Greek culture and stories unfortunately get erased because of these new divisions that separate us. That said, we also have people like my cousin and husband, who are a Palestinian-Greek pair and you genuinely could not tell the difference of who's from where 😂. Two of my main characters from one of my scripts is also a Palestinian-Greek pair because of this history (I'm a huge ancient and modern Mediterranean geek), so it's something I just love to talk about.

Hi, sorry if this comes out as a ramble, but your Troy ask made me rewatch the movie (for the umpteenth time, lol), and it brought a lot of old feelings back, both good and bad. The good is how much I adored the Iliad as a child and that's something that still thrives today—since I was a kid, I loved Greek mythology in general, partly because I'm Palestinian/a fellow Eastern Mediterranean, so there is a lot of overlap in our histories, cultures, customs and myths, but the Iliad has always been a favorite. Hektor is my favorite character (and I love him and Andromache), but I also have an immense soft spot for Briseis... and now to get to the bad, rewatching Troy reminded me how a lot of people erase her and her role—and her romance—to Achilles in modern retellings. Now, I'm not going to argue which Achilles ship is the best (especially because that man is a hoe, if we're being honest), I don't care. My problem is the modern erasure of Briseis and the other women in Achilles's life that are romantically entangled with him being reduced to, "He's gay, actually." It reads biphobic if you believe him queer (Patroclus too, who had many named women concubines/slaves), first off, misogynist second. He has a son with his foster "sister," Deidamia, and in some versions even married. In the Iliad especially, Patroclus tells Briseis Achilles will marry her and Achilles himself refers to her as his wife/bride, stopping a whole war when she's taken, and she's even allowed to aid in Patroclus's funeral rights. In some versions, Achilles falls for Polyxena, and tries to make peace with Troy so he can marry her. In the afterlife, Achilles chooses Helen as his wife for some reason. Just... all these women, with complex situations and feelings, are all reduced or erased in modern tellings (and usually for a man/Patroclus), and it makes me want to scream. People use the excuse of, "We don't like the romantic situation they're in," but then claim to "better" it by... erasing or reducing these women and their complex roles and feelings from the story overall? Brieseis, for example, mutually loved Achilles and saw him as a husband... he also killed her first husband and brothers, and you can argue part of her love is out of the need for survival. Yet, she greatly mourned him when he was killed, too. And if exploring this complexity is still not your yum, what about Polyxena? Wouldn't she fit the girlboss archetype of using Achilles' affections to gain his trust, before stabbing him in the back (literally)? Or Deidamia, who's young and left at home, bereft of her husband and son? Heck, try and fill in the gaps how Achilles x Hellen happened, if you must. All these women have an important role in the story, and to Achilles, that could be explored—but people don't because they dismiss what's already there or don't know anything about The Iliad outside modern retellings (mainly The Song of Achilles). So, we get people claiming things that are untrue ("Achilles and Patroclus are exclusively gay!"... in some myths, they're actually relatives/distant cousins, fun fact 😭), and acting like they fixed something by "adding" onto "flat female characters" in a way that reads inauthentic and ignorant to the source material. I get wanting to prop up one's chosen ship, it's just the hypocrisy of promising to be more progressive in one area, but diminishing the progressiveness of another, that kills me. Anyway! Sorry for the rant, I just have a lot of feelings I wanted to share because of the movie and I know you've talked about all this before—it's just something hard to discuss on the internet without people coming down your throat 🥲. Anyhow, justice for Briseis, is my rallying cry, I love her so much, queen made a whole war stop for her and managed to escape from Agamemnon unscathed. Queen who launched a thousand ships to my heart 🫶🏻.

I'm glad you re-watched it! It's a beloved of many Greeks since the movie is quite epic and makes you understand some of the original's glory. Hector, Andromache and Briseis are some of my fave characters in the movie, and it made me also look out for those characters when they appear in the text.

Btw, I would love to know a Palestinian's pov on our shared traditions and myths, how do you guys learn the Greek myths, what parts of them have had perhaps an affect on your heritage and since when, etc! 😍

Briseis' situation is complicated one because many people won't catch the nuance of her living in a patriarchal society as a war captive and thus developing a strange co-dependence to her captors. In addition, the Homeric Epics are a work changed by time in the Greek society, as people added and altered stuff, so many storylines have been affected by other layers of patriarchal societies. So of course the notion of "slave girl mourning her captor's friend" would seem natural, because they probably don't consider a slave woman's POV. Or perhaps she was in the mourning because she had to be there as a woman "belonging" to the Greeks, and the text does not mention it explicitly because it a given for the era. (I don't recall the whole relevant text sorry)

I am not sure if the average author - judging by what is published in the Anglophone market - can handle the complexity of Briseis and other women in the Trojan war. For Briseis one could go for a romance there but they'd have to depict all of her psychosynthesis properly, so it doesn't come off as "Achilles killed my family but he is hot so I love him". To be fair, it is a challenging task but I am still sad that I haven't heard retellings that do this well. Such a retelling done well would be chef's kiss!

As you said, unfortunately, the writers for now focus on the couple Achilles x Patroclus which, ok, let's accept it since it's a ship and there is some background to it (although those guys are most likely 1) cousins 2) very close to each other like brethren in a way westerners misinterpret). I've enjoyed Song of Achilles and I am surely not against such works, but you are right that the female heroines are reduced to flat characters. A fandom full of women manages to be misogynistic - again. We shouldn't be surprised because misogynistic influences are very strong in our societies still, although many don't see it 😕

[nusa-jabber]

Snow and Merlin as Aphrodite and Adonis, in a much less messed up version of the myth

[nusa-jabber]

If you say "Mediterranean" but exclude the Levant and North Africa then I hate you

[nusa-jabber]

They Do Not Exist (1974) by Mustafa Abu Ali (watch)

from PalestineCinema.com:

Salvaged from the ruins of Beirut after 1982, Abu Ali's early film has only recently been made available. Shooting under extraordinary conditions, the director, who worked with Godard on his Ici et Ailleurs (Here and Elsewhere), and founded the PLO's film division, covers conditions in Lebanon's refugee camps, the effects of Israeli bombardments, and the lives of guerrillas in training camps. They Do Not Exist is a stylistically unique work which demonstrates the intersection between the political and the aesthetic. Now recognised as a cornerstone in the development of Palestinian cinema, the film only received its Palestine premiere in 2003, when a group of Palestinian artists "smuggled" the director to a makeshift cinema in his hometown of Jerusalem (into which Israel bars his entry). Abu Ali, who saw his film for the first time in 20 years at this clandestine event noted: "We used to say 'Art for the Struggle', now it's 'Struggle for the Art'"