hidetothink

[hidetothink]

Thank God there are actually funny gays

[hidetothink]

I am capable of Mean. I am bound by Cringe

[hidetothink]

The bf looks Greek with his beard, I will eagerly survive this

[hidetothink]

For all its flaws, I will say arcane2 is that perfect mix of good, bad, under-developed, overused, and Begging for Meaning that I love

All the pieces of something better are there, and the canon is bad enough that I feel zero OCD-guilt over scrapping and revising anything I want in my head

Arcane1 being so good only helps, my hand is forced smh

[hidetothink]

You make a very gopd point with not flattening standards for "gay" when they're not equal, and I forget that too often

But I think the crux of what I'm trying to say doesn't rest on "these are equal standards" so much as "if a studio is willing to do X, and not willing to do Z, I will give credit for X and not Z." But a lot of people ARE giving credit and treating the material as having Z

Let's read Z into it, as we always have to. But make it that? "I love Arcane, I pretend JaVik is canon, wish they'd had a spine" not this "Look at .001 seconds of a frame at 2000x focus and you'll see Viktor is clearly upset here and grieving the loss of his greatest love" like come on :///

We have the standard you outlined, give crumbs and let them read between the lines because ACTUALLY giving a male same-sex couple would hurt ratings, or be hard to sell, or any other reason. But that standard doesn't shift if/when creators get rainbow credit for something only visible by tilting and squinting

So then, when I DO have to accept crumb-tier-gay for the men in a production (that's willing to take the bullet on other potentially "difficult sells"), I'm only giving credit where credit is due. Anything else is credit to viewers reading between lines to get things we want that they won't actually give us in-narrative. WE can get points for that work, but that's not the narrative I've seen, or the narrative of "it's a pretty fair reading that they're gay" (again not to shut anyone down, I'm arguing about a cartoon, I already lost)

It's a fair reading in a world where only vague hints are allowed for a male couple, the world we DO live in, but I hate that world and I'm not playing by those rules. Show me the money, where is the beef? No flood of Twitter engagement and social capital for playing by the same broken rules, as always

JaVik is headcanon and slashfic (as always imo), it's narratively sound with great dynamics and a bittersweet ending, and it's not the canon, which is a shame

I must ask: my gf and I walked away from Arcane with completely different perspectives on Victor as the lone explicitly gay man in the series and on Victor/Jayce as romantic or platonic and their handling in the story. I’m very interested in your thoughts.

Tbh I don't see anything but a deeply meaningful PLATONIC relationship

The show is perfectly willing to have a same sex relationship in the spotlight, so I want to take what I see for what it is, and take meaning from what i DONT see and what arguably isn't there as a result

If they wanted me to take away a gay/bi Viktor and bisexual Jayce, in any meaningful sense, they would show it. We aren't talking about old movies from the 1950's where "a queer reading is needed for clarity." It not even Korra "we can only look at each other as the series ends" times. The creators are on record saying they want to explore male friendship, I think they did

This is, yes, in spite of using "partner" a lot and other signs that COULD let you read it as gay/bi/etc. in a meaningful way. That's fine, do you! For me, it feels like settling to eat up crumbs and try to connect them into something bigger. I'd rather an explicitly platonic story of male friendship than another obscured same sex romance that can only be seen by tilting your head on a full moon

Tldr; if a series is willing to show an explicitly same sex couple, I'm not spending time constructing intricate conspiracies to make two men deeply in lust. They didn't even kiss, no gay points

[hidetothink]

And that reading is valid (kill me), while also being, like you're saying, "reading into it." Because, again, in a series proving itself comfortable with same sex relationships, we don't get that overt or implied treatment for JaVik (including for complex reasons you're saying). We DO get a cohesive and clear platonic treatment imo

If we want male same-sex love, romance, and physical intimacy on screen, I think it undercuts us to look at what COULD have been a sample but wasn't, being treated by a lot of people as legit canon-gaygaygaysogay, while downplaying that it was very coy and buried, if it's there at all

No rainbow points for JaVik, do not pass go, do not collect 200$ rainbow dollars

DO read whatever you'd like into the story, but don't tell me it's there with some kind of intention and legitimacy when that would look so much better and clearer if true. I'm not team "they're not GAY, STOP IT!?!?" Just team "make it gay, or it's not gay, in the year 2024 during a period of unthinkable freedom to do so"

I must ask: my gf and I walked away from Arcane with completely different perspectives on Victor as the lone explicitly gay man in the series and on Victor/Jayce as romantic or platonic and their handling in the story. I’m very interested in your thoughts.

Tbh I don't see anything but a deeply meaningful PLATONIC relationship

The show is perfectly willing to have a same sex relationship in the spotlight, so I want to take what I see for what it is, and take meaning from what i DONT see and what arguably isn't there as a result

If they wanted me to take away a gay/bi Viktor and bisexual Jayce, in any meaningful sense, they would show it. We aren't talking about old movies from the 1950's where "a queer reading is needed for clarity." It not even Korra "we can only look at each other as the series ends" times. The creators are on record saying they want to explore male friendship, I think they did

This is, yes, in spite of using "partner" a lot and other signs that COULD let you read it as gay/bi/etc. in a meaningful way. That's fine, do you! For me, it feels like settling to eat up crumbs and try to connect them into something bigger. I'd rather an explicitly platonic story of male friendship than another obscured same sex romance that can only be seen by tilting your head on a full moon

Tldr; if a series is willing to show an explicitly same sex couple, I'm not spending time constructing intricate conspiracies to make two men deeply in lust. They didn't even kiss, no gay points

[hidetothink]

To ensure clarity: "are" and "should" are very different #teamwtfiseventhenameofthispairing

I must ask: my gf and I walked away from Arcane with completely different perspectives on Victor as the lone explicitly gay man in the series and on Victor/Jayce as romantic or platonic and their handling in the story. I’m very interested in your thoughts.

Tbh I don't see anything but a deeply meaningful PLATONIC relationship

The show is perfectly willing to have a same sex relationship in the spotlight, so I want to take what I see for what it is, and take meaning from what i DONT see and what arguably isn't there as a result

If they wanted me to take away a gay/bi Viktor and bisexual Jayce, in any meaningful sense, they would show it. We aren't talking about old movies from the 1950's where "a queer reading is needed for clarity." It not even Korra "we can only look at each other as the series ends" times. The creators are on record saying they want to explore male friendship, I think they did

This is, yes, in spite of using "partner" a lot and other signs that COULD let you read it as gay/bi/etc. in a meaningful way. That's fine, do you! For me, it feels like settling to eat up crumbs and try to connect them into something bigger. I'd rather an explicitly platonic story of male friendship than another obscured same sex romance that can only be seen by tilting your head on a full moon

Tldr; if a series is willing to show an explicitly same sex couple, I'm not spending time constructing intricate conspiracies to make two men deeply in lust. They didn't even kiss, no gay points

[hidetothink]

I've endangerfied you all

[hidetothink]

"Nothing matters but knowing nothing matters!"

Holding back Wicked posting for YOUR safety

[hidetothink]

🫂 ❤️

(gettin the vibe you need a hug today friend)

No no, I only just saw the movie yesterday and I'm being cringe

We are safe lolol

[hidetothink]

POSERS, POSERS AND LIARS

NONE OF YOU KNOW ABOUT THE SEX CLUB, THE ACTUAL THROUPLE, THE GOUT

NONE OF YOU HAD WHAT WE HAD

[hidetothink]

Sometimes someone isn’t ready to see the bright side. Sometimes they need to sit with the shadow first. So be a friend and sit with them. Make the darkness beautiful.” ― Victoria Erickson

[hidetothink]

My least deranged actual take on the movie is that I really liked the costume design and balance between fantastic and semi-real-world-mundane. I also liked the GNC characters and costuming (tho it feels just in the background), even if I imagine it was done for reasons I find reductive and stupid (gender shit = good & sex-nonconformity = terf genocide talk)

I like Oz as somewhat Dr. Seuss adjacent, with everyone color-themed and just slightly strange, including the mashup words like "braverism" and "rejoice-afy." It's a separate dimension, it would have weird tho nearly recognizable words and clothing styles. Good choices

I also really loved both main actresses regardless of irl silliness with actors being unrelatable and detached from reality. This is the first Elphaba I've liked outside the OG cast

[hidetothink]

"And Goodness knows we know what Goodness is! Goodness knows the Wicked die alone"

Holding back Wicked posting for YOUR safety

[hidetothink]

You're 19, you just possibly threw away everything you've worked for, your best friend tells you "you're making this about yourself" while your other best friend is so glad you can just apologize so "everything goes back to normal"

And you're blasting No One Mourns the Wicked

Gay, gay gay gay GAY GAY GAY!!!!!!

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK

Holding back Wicked posting for YOUR safety

[hidetothink]

How about YOU get asked to apologize after calling out a speaker who compared homosexuality to pedophilia and then losing all your friends while being removed from your school and getting branded as the crazy gay who went off the rails in college and left the church

YOU LIVE THAT WHILE LISTENING TO THE WICKED OST FOR THE FIRST TIME AND BE NORMAL ABOUT THIS MOVIE

Holding back Wicked posting for YOUR safety