bumbled-bees

[bumbled-bees]

Who gave you the right to decide you can just step in and “heal” people Lily hurt? None of us asked for that. We’re not some broken puzzle you get to put back together so you can feel like the hero or collect good person points. This isn’t about you proving how kind or compassionate you are. It’s about the real damage that was done, and the people who are still dealing with it. You don’t get to rewrite experiences or take control over the healing process because it suits your ego. If you actually cared, you’d listen to what the victims want instead of forcing yourself into a role nobody asked for. It’s exhausting and infuriating to see someone co-opt trauma like that, as if you can just swoop in and fix everything without even understanding the pain or boundaries involved. Don’t pretend this is about healing when it feels like you’re just trying to make yourself look good.

I have taken up the mantle of Lily Orchard, in order to heal all those she hurt 💜

So you're going to force her victims to interact with you for your own ego? Why don't you just "steal" her characters and rehab them in spite of them being inspired by her victims and the things she wants to do with them. That bit of ego mania at least has some people defending it.

[bumbled-bees]

Given Lily's obsession with control & a few other factors (such as tending to handle constructive criticism poorly & her school friends probably having been arranged by the principal & a parent of hers, likely with payment involved), might she have at some point seen the word naïve to be a worse insult than any other word despite her being so (perhaps being the reason she threatened the pregnant shop teacher)?

Well,

I dunno if "naive" is the right word.

Naivete is often associated with being at least a bit endearing. I'd say "willfully ignorant" is a more apt descriptor for Lily.

[bumbled-bees]

did anybody in the patron chat ever wonder why Lily would delete videos? Like I know she wasn't proud of rvi and some of her old in aminutes plagiarized tv tropes, but there are still various glass of waters she was supremely confident in that are just gone bow. Any ideas?

Not that I ever really saw, but she has a tendency to delete things she "doesn't stand by anymore."

But I was only in her server for about 3 months, it's possible someone's asked at some point. And they probably got a snippy reply.

[bumbled-bees]

Using your post about control as a basis. Do you think Lily's obsession is part of the reason why she lacks hindsight to stop while she is ahead? Because anybody else would look at her current crusade against BG3 to spite Crispy as pointless, given Crispy gets more money and views at her expense.

I've posted before about her impulsivity.

But to recap, yeah. She does not think ahead. She never stops to think, "huh, this might bite me in the ass later". She only cares about how she can "win" in the moment. She needs to be the most correct person in the room, so if someone "attacks" her opinions, she becomes hellbent on proving them wrong.

And of course, she would not know foresight if it smacked her in the face. It doesn't matter that she's blatantly contradicting things she's said before. She just needs it to work for her NOW. And she knows her fans won't bother digging into the inconsistencies. She's trained them not to.

And I know nothing about Baldur's Gate personally other than my fiancé likes it but I decided to watch Crispy's video for shits and giggles and it's very funny.

[bumbled-bees]

Considering how LOrch is an unreliable narrator for a variety of reasons & so can only speculate on her based on past behaviors or a few close to her (like Britney, who'd have no reason to lie), what kind of model can you draw up on stuff like why she so hates stuff like nuance, lore & worldbuilding?

At the center of it all is control. Lily likes to feel in control, not just of her community, but of the text itself. She struggles when stories are ambiguous, complex, or leave room for multiple interpretations. Lore and worldbuilding, by their nature, often demand a level of patience, curiosity, and inference. They ask you to engage on the work’s terms, not your own. But Lily’s approach to media is based almost entirely on imposing her framework onto the material, not discovering what’s there, but asserting what she thinks should be there.

This makes traditional “lore” a threat. It can’t be easily bent to her will unless she ignores it, misrepresents it, or flattens it. She doesn’t like that it complicates her talking points. She doesn’t like having to keep track of details that don’t feed directly into a character judgment or moral binary. She wants media to conform, to speak plainly, take clear sides, and provide a platform for her to declare what’s good and bad without much need for further inquiry.

Next is her deep discomfort with ambiguity. Nuance requires you to sit with uncertainty. To hold two conflicting truths in your head at once. To acknowledge when you don’t fully understand something. But Lily hates that, not only because it disrupts the clarity of her messaging, but because it risks undermining her authority. If there’s no definitive answer, then she can’t own the take. She can’t be the smartest person in the room. That’s threatening for someone whose whole persona is built on absolute certainty and rhetorical dominance.

Then there’s a trait that we could call narrative immediacy. Lily heavily favors media that’s declarative and emotionally loud. Subtext bothers her. She wants the text to tell her what it means. And when worldbuilding slows the pace, when backstory doesn’t seem “relevant,” when nuance muddies what would otherwise be a black-and-white conflict, she treats that not as a challenge, but as frustration. As if the story has failed her by not putting everything on the surface.

This leads into what might be the most damning element at play here: as previously discussed, her fundamental lack of curiosity. Lily doesn’t seem interested in learning about things she doesn’t immediately understand. If it doesn’t make intuitive sense to her within the first five minutes, she’ll treat it like a failure of the work, not a gap in her own perspective. This is why she so often misreads media she dislikes. She doesn’t ask questions. She doesn’t investigate. She declares.

In her model of media criticism, complexity isn’t valuable: it’s annoying. It gets in the way of the “point,” and she has already decided what the point should be.

So when a story invites exploration, when it asks the viewer to read between the lines, or consider multiple meanings, or track long-term character shifts across dense timelines, it’s not just boring to Lily. It’s offensive. It resists her framework. It implies that her first impression might not be enough. And that, for someone whose identity is so deeply tied to being “right,” is unacceptable.

[bumbled-bees]

Regarding Lily's latest video

(the one about Return to Ash, NomNomNami's latest release)

While watching this video, I noticed that Lily has omitted some crucial context regarding this game's development. Well, perhaps "omitted" isn't the right word.

"The entire game is about isolation and metaphorical death; in a dev diary, Nami says those themes were heavy on her mind when she wrote up the idea for it in 2022." - CD-Call, "Return to Ash: My Favourite Game of 2025", 20:44 - 20:54

Lily implies that Nami wrote this game as a response to the impact of Covid-19, which could make sense. However, the bulk of the pandemic's effects were felt throughout 2020 and 2021 - Not to downplay the still ongoing effects of Covid-19, but by 2022 the majority of the United States had returned (or was attempting to return to) some sense of normalcy.

So, what was Nami's inspiration? Well...

In January 2022, NomNomNami was accused of grooming and being romantically involved with a 14 year old in 2015, when she herself was 22. By April of 2022, Nami had acknowledged that the fallout of these accusations had cost her her job and likely a significant portion of her fanbase.

"I wrote (Return to Ash) up sometime during 2022, when themes of isolation and (metaphorical) death were heavy on my mind. "

- NomNomNami, Dev Diary: Return to Ash and studio life

This game is inspired by the social isolation Nami experienced as a result of these allegations, allegations of her own predatory behaviour, coming to light.

Pretending that these allegations simply don't exist, as Lily is doing, is not only disingenuous, not only limiting her ability to critique Nami's work honestly, but is actively dangerous behavior. It runs the risk of giving unchecked influence to a person who has harmed minors before, a person who could then use that influence to harm minors again.

But then, Lily wouldn't know anything about that, would she?

[bumbled-bees]

Saw your post about how Lily misunderstands the workforce and inflation.

It reminds me of this post where she tried to compare being a youtuber to ' working in customer service'.

As someone who has worked multiple low-wage customer service roles ( While Lily also once whined about getting paid hundreds of dollars a week for her videos in her videos begging her viewers to feel sorry for her...yeah, poor baby, I guess), I didn't know whether to laugh out loud or gasp in horror. LOL

It's extremely obvious that she's been in her little YouTube bubble for so long that she doesn't understand how the real world works.

It's also

really funny

[bumbled-bees]

What were some of LO's takes that you found to be the most naive?

Her lack of understanding both the workforce and inflation are two that stick out in particular.

She makes it very obvious the second she opens her mouth in both these cases that she doesn't actually know how the real world works.

[bumbled-bees]

Lily's Unsafe Space

Lily presents herself and her online spaces as “safe”, specifically for marginalized people, especially those who are LGBT+, abuse survivors, neurodivergent, or otherwise vulnerable. It’s a cornerstone of her brand and a powerful rhetorical stance. Framing yourself as a safe space immediately casts your critics in the role of threats, and it tells your audience that staying loyal to you is a form of self-preservation.

But under scrutiny, this notion of “safety” falls apart. Because what Lily’s offering is not community safety. It’s personal insulation: a tightly curated environment where she never has to be challenged, questioned, or made uncomfortable. Her “safe space” is one where she is emotionally protected at all times, even if that means the people around her are left exposed.

This plays out in tangible, consistent ways. People who voice discomfort or disagreement, even politely, are often met with hostility or dismissal. The boundaries Lily expects from others are not ones she reciprocates. If a fan shares something vulnerable that she doesn’t feel like engaging with, she’ll mock it or shut it down. If someone pushes her on a claim or inconsistency, she’ll pivot into defensiveness, sarcasm, or even public shaming. And she’s been known to retroactively apply rules, or delete messages, or escalate minor social infractions into moral failures, all without warning or explanation.

What this does is condition everyone in her space to self-monitor. People learn to tiptoe. They don’t say what they really think. They overcorrect for tone. They apologize preemptively. They avoid sensitive topics not because those topics are off-limits in principle, but because they can’t predict what mood Lily will be in that day. This is not “safety.” This is the classic cycle of trying to keep the peace around someone unpredictable.

And to be clear: the reason this disconnect is so potent is because Lily does do things that look like care. She’ll validate fans who praise her. She’ll shout out trans people in crisis, or comfort someone after they get dumped, or signal-boost something heartwarming. These gestures of kindness are not necessarily fake, they’re just deeply inconsistent, and highly contingent on whether the person in question is currently “in good standing” with her. The moment someone does something she doesn’t like, that warmth evaporates. The community is not what she protects: control is.

Let’s take an example: someone brings up a sensitive topic in stream chat: something relating to mental health or abuse. On one day, Lily might respond empathetically. On another, she might dismiss it as “trauma dumping.” There are no clear guidelines, no predictable boundaries. The rules shift according to her mood, her tolerance, her level of interest. And once someone falls out of favor even slightly, they’re often treated as if they were never worthy of the community to begin with. It’s public, it’s humiliating, and it sets an example: you are not safe unless you are obedient, silent, or useful.

The result is a space where Lily alone is afforded emotional safety at the expense of everyone else. Fans cannot challenge her when she misrepresents them. Vulnerable people can’t safely set their own boundaries. Community members who are themselves marginalized don’t have the autonomy to express hurt if Lily is the one who caused it. And if they do? They’re treated as backstabbers or stalkers.

This is why people walk away from Lily feeling manipulated or betrayed. It’s not because she never did anything nice for them. It’s because the “safety” she promised was a one-way street. What they thought was mutual care turned out to be a loyalty test. And the moment they failed it, they were framed as dangerous.

At the core of all of this is Lily’s fundamental refusal to be vulnerable in the way that true safe spaces demand. She can be emotionally expressive, even volatile, but she does not tolerate challenge, discomfort, or ambiguity. She does not admit when she’s wrong without immediately undermining that admission. She does not allow others to critique her behavior without branding them as malicious or “parasites.”

So yes, Lily calls her space a safe space. But in practice, it’s a space where safety is only extended to her, and where any expectation of reciprocity is punished. That’s not a community. That’s a hierarchy with a velvet curtain.

[bumbled-bees]

Have you seen the tweet from Lily on blue sky where she said "nobody that hates me has actually seen my videos." Do you think she is just saying that to make up for the fact her channel growth has very much been destroyed?

It's cope, 100%

I was a genuine fan of her content for years, and I hate her now.

Her critics regularly make videos reacting to her content. So yeah, they have seen it.

Again, this is another case of Lily's MO: Make a claim with no facts to support it, and count on your sycophants to take you at your word and not go looking into it themselves.

^ (This is why I had a tendency to get on Lily's nerves by the way lol. I was someone who always needed the full story and didn't go off her word alone, so I was a bit of a problem child for her.)

But yeah her channel growth is basically dead. Her so-called "haters" have seen her content, but looking her up in any capacity will just bring you to Joon's video first. So anyone new she could potentially pull in will most likely just see that and not go further.

She's coping.

[bumbled-bees]

If Lily is so awful you wouldn't have to keep crying about her

I don't know, friendo, I think it makes sense to cry when things are awful!

Losing a job is awful. I'll cry about that.

Being dumped is awful. I'll cry about that.

Lily is awful. I'll cry about that! :)

[bumbled-bees]

Panic when Joon was brought up?

"Panic" may not necessarily be the right word, but if any one of her other critics/victims are mentioned by name (Sai, Ant, Britt etc.) she doesn't mind doing a bit of mudslinging before moving on.

Whenever Joon is brought up around her any discussion of him gets shot down pretty much immediately.

[bumbled-bees]

it’s always really nice to be reminded that lily is still effected by the joon the king video lol

It is, lol.

Especially because she tries so hard to pretend it doesn't bother her. But Joon doesn't have any skeletons in his closet or anything she can really hit him with other than "drama YouTuber" (which isn't even accurate).

But his video on her has over 1M views. Her growth has severely stagnated (if not flat-out died) since it came out.

Mention anyone else critical of her and she'll start mudslinging but any discussion of Joon gets shut down immediately.

Because she doesn't actually have anything to hit him back with.

[bumbled-bees]

Did you see the "debate" stream Lily did last night

If you're talking about the "open discussion stream" from the other day, I popped in and out.

Only noteworthy things were her tendency to cut people off when she didn't care about the topic and her absolute panic when Joon the King was brought up.

[bumbled-bees]

Given that most Lily-crit blogs use a Pokemon as their icon, have you considered using one yourself?

I'm not too big into Pokemon tbh

I played Pokemon X? on my 2DS when I was a teenager and that's my only firsthand experience.

Just never really got into it

[bumbled-bees]

Did you ever do game nights on Lilys discord? She doesn't seem like a good loser

I played Monopoly online with her and a couple of others once.

She went bankrupt like 2 rounds in.

[bumbled-bees]

Ah, I see the Lily defense squad is starting to find you. Best of luck, I've seen their work with other critics and they're quite the nasty bunch.

Anyway, I have a question if you're down to answer stuff about Lily's fans (fans as in a generic blob of sorts, not specific people). Why are they so adamant about not listening to Lily at all?

For all her lies about people attacking her or refusing to respect her boundaries I will agree with Lily on this much: fans just do not listen to her when she tells them to stop interacting with "stalkers." She's said numerous times to stop asking about y'all (Lilly critics), stop keeping up with y'all, and especially to stop interacting with y'all. But as shown by those two recent asks, they just keep doing it. It feels like an obsession of sorts, so desperate to be useful or praised by the object of their admiration that they will actively disrespect Lily's wishes like this for the slim chance of succeeding in their goal.

No worries, was bound to happen eventually. What can you do.

Anyway, this is one of those rare spots where Lily’s instincts aren’t entirely off, even if the way she frames it is often self-serving or hypocritical. She has repeatedly told her fanbase not to engage with critics, not to ask her about them, and not to go poking around in places she’s told them to ignore. And yet, they keep doing it. Not just passively watching: they insert themselves, start drama, and then bring it back to her like they expect a cookie for it.

Her fans often want to perform loyalty: not just believe her, not just agree with her, but show her that they’re on her side. And since she has made such a public enemy out of her critics, some fans internalize the idea that harassing or “monitoring” those critics is a form of devotion. They want to feel useful to her, important, even protective. So they jump into arguments, lurk in places they were told to stay away from, and drag that information back as though they’ve done her a favor.

It’s a parasocial feedback loop: Lily signals who the “enemy” is, and her fans, conditioned by years of that environment, take it upon themselves to go to war for her.

Of course, Lily doesn’t always help this situation. She plants the seeds of hostility, and even if she tells her fans to back off later, the antagonism is already there. She’s created an environment where obsession with “stalkers” or critics is baked into the culture, then acts surprised or victimized when fans run with that paranoia and take it too far.

But to your point: yes. There’s a kind of desperation in those fan behaviors: to be seen, to be useful, to win favor. It’s not just about Lily. It’s about how they see themselves in relation to her: protector, confidant, favorite.